Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[KMDP]

I really can't see Roy being better than Chrom for the same reasons I can't see Lucina being better than Marth. The most spacing any character can get, the better they are, if that spacing is rewarded with actual good damage, knockback and frame data, then you are better than one that doesn't get rewarded for it. Sure, spacing isn't everything but when your moveset is the same except for the fact 80% of your hitbox is useless, you won't beat the guy who can kill you from the same distance you can hit them with a noodle stick.

Don't underestimate just how bad Chrom's recovery is compared to Roy's.

Regardless, people are probably way overestimating the tier difference between Roy and Chrom. Chrom just has the huge disadvantage of "if he leaves the stage he's probably dead", but the big advantage of not having to get right up close to his opponent to deal high damage.

That being said, I'm no expert on the subject, though Roy does seem very fast (which is what he needs to do what he wants to do) in this game.

 

[praline]

mario deserves more reps actually. more than pokemon does

anyone bothered by there being ten pokemon in the roster? no, just me?

Pokemon deserves all the reps it has. They're literally the second best selling video game series.

 

[Zinith]

Lets see if we can sing a little...


Colors weave into a spire of flame~

I feel your presence among us...
Even though you were trying to hide...
Can you hear the RUMBLEEEEEE?
Can you hear the RUMBLEEEEEE that's calling?~

 

[Graizen]

If they put Agumon as a DLC i imagine they should put some Spirits with him.
The evolution funcionality would work well!

 

[KMDP]

Lets see if we can sing a little...


Colors weave into a spire of flame~

♪♫♪ First you draw a circle ♫♪♫
♫♪♫ Then you dot the eyes ♪♫♪
♪♫♪ Add a great big smile. ♫♪♫
♫♪♫ And presto, it's Kirby! ♪♫♪
POYO!​

 

[Deleted member]

Lets see if we can sing a little...


Colors weave into a spire of flame~

Distant sparks call to a past still unnamed
Bear this torch against the cold of the night
FIGHTING GOLD
jibun no uchi wo shinjita mono dake ga

 

[Luigifan18]

Lets see if we can sing a little...


Colors weave into a spire of flame~

Distant sparks call to a past still unnamed~

 

[Cosmic77]

I really can't see Roy being better than Chrom for the same reasons I can't see Lucina being better than Marth. The most spacing any character can get, the better they are, if that spacing is rewarded with actual good damage, knockback and frame data, then you are better than one that doesn't get rewarded for it. Sure, spacing isn't everything but when your moveset is the same except for the fact 80% of your hitbox is useless, you won't beat the guy who can kill you from the same distance you can hit them with a noodle stick.

Chrom's hitboxes are more useful than Roy's, no argument there, but his horizontal recovery is almost nonexistent. Seriously, his recovery is really bad, and the attack itself isn't nearly as useful as Roy's.

Roy was already really susceptible to gimping, and that hurt him a lot. Gimping Chrom at a high percent is almost a guaranteed KO.

 

[Deleted member]

Hey everyone! I'm really touched that you guys are all being so supportive...
How about we talk about Gunvolt for a bit? He's another character that I want in, and he actually has a chance!

 

[KMDP]

Chrom's hitboxes are more useful than Roy's, no argument there, but his horizontal recovery is almost nonexistent. Seriously, his recovery is really bad, and the attack itself isn't nearly as useful as Roy's.

Roy was already really susceptible to gimping, and that hurt him a lot. Gimping Chrom at a high percent is almost a guaranteed KO.

I think people have said that they might have made Roy's hitboxes slightly better as well? Though I don't know if that's true or just me Mandela Effecting myself.

I suppose "Slightly better" in this case would mean "more lenient".

 

[Raxxel]

Lets see if we can sing a little...


Colors weave into a spire of flame~

SOME

 

[osby]

I won't take any tier list before it's at least one year into the game's lifespan. Remember Marth and Lucina were bottom tiers in the last game?

 

[Jeck]

So I just went down the internet rabbit hole today and learned that some crocodiles gallop when they need to move quickly, so I just had to compare it to K.Rool's run cycle in Smash Ultimate.

It's hard to see because it's going so fast, but K.Rool's run has him alternate steps between his left and right feet (hands?) as opposed to the croc in the gif who moves both at the same time. Since he unfortunately doesn't seem to gallop himself, but then I also read that only small crocodiles actually gallop, so it makes sense. But then, out of curiosity, I decided I needed to see if I could rind a gif of a larger Crocodile running in a non-galloping manner. I couldn't find any, but instead I managed to find this.

Of course I'd come full circle.

Also, today I learned that you can usually see the teeth on both a crocodile's upper and lower jaws while their mouths are shut, while with an alligator, you can generally only see the teeth on their upper jaw since it is larger. However, when K.Rool's mouth is shut you can only see his upper teeth, like a gator.

His snout is still narrow and Croc shaped so I'll give it a pass, but don't pretend I'm going to just ignore the unscientific anatomy of your anthropomorphic cartoon characters, Nintendo!

Yeah I know, I'm a massive nerd.

Well done. This is the kind of investigative journalism the world could use more of.

 

[Zinith]

I won't take any tier list before it's at least one year into the game's lifespan. Remember Marth and Lucina were bottom tiers in the last game?

Well that's because those two got a TON of buffs in patches...

 

[Deleted member]

Chrom's hitboxes are more useful than Roy's, no argument there, but his horizontal recovery is almost nonexistent. Seriously, his recovery is really bad, and the attack itself isn't nearly as useful as Roy's.

Roy was already really susceptible to gimping, and that hurt him a lot. Gimping Chrom at a high percent is almost a guaranteed KO.

I think people overestimate how bad his recovery is and I don't think it'll affect his gameplan as much as some believe it will.

 

[Deleted member]

Distant sparks call to a past still unnamed~

Bear this torch against the cold of the night~!

 

[osby]

Lets see if we can sing a little...


Colors weave into a spire of flame~

Fear's awake, anger beats loud, face reality
Never beat charity
The enemy you're fighting covers all society
(Damn right)
Mommy's not here, gotta fight
(All night) ~


...what? Everything is better with rap.

 

[Cristaran]

Hey everyone! I'm really touched that you guys are all being so supportive...
How about we talk about Gunvolt for a bit? He's another character that I want in, and he actually has a chance!

He would actually be quite nice, i mean, he fits perfectly in my opinion, even tho i never really played gunvolt...

SOME

goddamnit BODY ONCE TOLD ME

 

[Deleted member]

He would actually be quite a nice fit, i mean, he fits perfectly in my opinion, even tho i never really played gunvolt...

You totally should! I've only played the demo, but it's amazing!

 

[KMDP]

I won't take any tier list before it's at least one year into the game's lifespan. Remember Marth and Lucina were bottom tiers in the last game?

SHULK HAS POTENTIAL! BOWSER IS TOP TIER!

I'm wondering just how wrong some of these tier predictions are this time.

I think people overestimate how bad his recovery is and I don't think it'll affect his gameplan as much as some believe it will.

It really depends on how easy Chrom is to get off-stage.

If getting Chrom off the stage is difficult, then his terribad recovery will be a non-issue, if he's easy to get off the stage, then it'll be a big problem for him.

It'll be really funny if Little Mac, the character actually intended to have a bad air-game, has an easier time getting back on stage than Chrom.

 

[Deleted member]

I won't take any tier list before it's at least one year into the game's lifespan. Remember Marth and Lucina were bottom tiers in the last game?

All I know is that top tier is probably going to be a newcomer, since Melee is the only game not to follow that rule.
Please don't let Fox be top tier again

 

[osby]

Well that's because those two got a TON of buffs in patches...

Exactly. Patches can still change the game.

Also, unpopular opinion, but I don't think a 70+ character roster will have a convincing tier list.

All I know is that top tier is probably going to be a newcomer, since Melee is the only game not to follow that rule.
Please don't let Fox be top tier again

Please, he makes my head hurt

 

[Zinith]

I keep saying they are sleeping on my boi

 

[Deleted member]

Lets see if we can sing a little...


Colors weave into a spire of flame~

ARE YOU TALKING TO ME?
ARE YOU TALKING TO ME?!
NO WAY PUNK!

 

[Deleted member]

I won't take any tier list before it's at least one year into the game's lifespan. Remember Marth and Lucina were bottom tiers in the last game?

That was because they only rised after getting a ****ton of buffs. That Jab 50/50 is still ridiculous and I'm sad it seems to be gone in Ultimate from what I heard.

He would actually be quite nice, i mean, he fits perfectly in my opinion, even tho i never really played gunvolt...



goddamnit BODY ONCE TOLD ME

Gunvolt the game is bad tbh, combat is really boring and it's basically "shoot then burst" which is no different from Mighty No.9's "shoot then dash" in feel.
However, Gunvolt the character has a really kickass design and his moveset would be really cool so I'd love him in Smash.
I love him as a character but I really couldn't care less about his game.

 

[Cosmic77]

I think people have said that they might have made Roy's hitboxes slightly better as well? Though I don't know if that's true or just me Mandela Effecting myself.

I suppose "Slightly better" in this case would mean "more lenient".

The hitboxes are better and more likely to land, but his fall speed and recovery are still an issue.

I could see him being upper mid-tier at best, but he ain't coming anywhere close to Corrin and Marth.

I won't take any tier list before it's at least one year into the game's lifespan. Remember Marth and Lucina were bottom tiers in the last game?

Remember when Roy was first released and he was considered top tier, only to drop down to bottom tier a few months later after receiving virtually no nerfs?

I think people overestimate how bad his recovery is and I don't think it'll affect his gameplan as much as some believe it will.

I've seen it in action, and it ain't pretty. Competitive players could do far better than the casuals I've been seeing, but Chrom doesn't have many options aside from that one move - a move that isn't that good to begin with.

I honestly think his recovery could be worse than Dr. Mario and Little Mac's at this point, and that's saying something.

 

[osby]

That was because they only rised after getting a ****ton of buffs. That Jab 50/50 is still ridiculous and I'm sad it seems to be gone in Ultimate from what I heard.

...but that's what I was talking about, everyone acts like patches won't be a thing.

 

[MainJPW]

Guys about GameXplain last video about the DLC and their choices, they selected Tails in one of their pick for a suggestion for a DLC Character, then they were talking about Classic Tails whilst listening to their Youtube video I suddenly got in mind that TAILS GOT AN ARMY OF FLICKIES BIRDS, In their Super State, the Flickies' innate abilities far surpasses their normal ones, making them strong enough to smash Badniks with a single strike. In addition to retaining their flight capabilities, the Flickies also gain virtual invulnerability. So I can Imagine Tails become invicible during his Final Smash and the Flickies will do the jobs to Knock out any opponent who come at sight. Heck he can even combine that with the summon of Tornado Mecha and blast a laser.

I'm actually surprise to think of Tails in a Badass way lol

Considering that Final Smashes are quick and to the point in Ultimate this probably wouldn’t be an idealistic Final Smash. I imagined that Tails’s Final Smash would just be similar to the Star Fox trio where he summons the Tornado-1 (also Tornado 03; it combines the design of Tornado 1 and 2 from SA1 and X-shape transformation from Tornado 2 with the upgrades from the Cyclone from SA2) that he uses from Unleashed and Generations:

Spoiler: Until Lost World

Lost World uses a new model closer to the original Tornado.

However, the Tornado-1 makes a cameo in Mario & Sonic at the Sochi 2014 Olympic Winter Games so whatever.

Transforming into the X-shape for greater speed:

And finally firing off the homing missiles.

This type of Final Smash makes sense in canon if you consider that in Heroes it’s shown that Tails can just leave the Tornado whenever he wants, suggesting that it’s in autopilot until he needs it again.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

mario deserves more reps actually. more than pokemon does

anyone bothered by there being ten pokemon in the roster? no, just me?

Pokemon is the biggest media franchise in the world...
Imo, Pokemon doesn't have enough
With over 800 possible characters... there is so much potential for Pokemon when it comes to Smash bros

 

[Jetsurge]

All I know is that top tier is probably going to be a newcomer, since Melee is the only game not to follow that rule.
Please don't let Fox be top tier again

Just wait for dlc Steve will break the game with his building brown bricks attack

 

[NapoleonDos]

Bayonetta isn't really that sexual in Smash. Never mind Lara Croft wouldn't be in the first place, that's not an argument, since Smash can always tone characters down.

As for guns... Love is Blue and Scarborough Fair, as others said before, don't even look much like real guns. For Lara Croft, it might be an issue, since hers are supposed to be realistic to a degree.

I don't know if you've played Bayonetta as a game series, but they look directly like teal guns and bullets. It's exactly how they feel to me in smash as well.

 

[Deleted member]

The hitboxes are better and more likely to land, but his fall speed and recovery are still an issue.

I could see him being upper mid-tier at best, but he ain't coming anywhere close to Corrin and Marth.



Remember when Roy was first released and he was considered top tier, only to drop down to bottom tier a few months later after receiving virtually no nerfs?



I've seen it in action, and it ain't pretty. Competitive players could do far better than the casuals I've been seeing, but Chrom doesn't have many options aside from that one move - a move that isn't that good to begin with.

I honestly think his recovery could be worse than Dr. Mario and Little Mac's at this point, and that's saying something.

All demos have to deal with default controls and no practice(hell, no one is even making use of dash tilts). What works and doesn't work is still on the table otherwise there wouldn't be so many disagreements on certain characters.

...but that's what I was talking about, everyone acts like patches won't be a thing.

Theorising about patches is looking way too far into the future

 

[Bionichute]

Lets see if we can sing a little...


Colors weave into a spire of flame~

You count the medals, one, two and three, life goes on, anything goes coming up OOO

 

[FalcoXP]

Good morning y'all.

Howdy?

 

[Bionichute]

Pokemon is the biggest media franchise in the world...
Imo, Pokemon doesn't have enough
With over 800 possible characters... there is so much potential for Pokemon when it comes to Smash bros

i say this as a guy who loved pokemon most of his life

pokemon sucks

 

[osby]

I don't know if you've played Bayonetta as a game series, but they look directly like teal guns and bullets. It's exactly how they feel to me in smash as well.

They are inspired from Mauser C96 and Derringer, but it doesn't change they are heavily stylized, to the point nobody feel the need of changing their design in order to preserve the age rating.

pokemon sucks

Is this what's the opposite of constructive feedback looks like?

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

pokemon sucks

That's just your subjective opinion...

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Considering that Final Smashes are quick and to the point in Ultimate this probably wouldn’t be an idealistic Final Smash. I imagined that Tails’s Final Smash would just be similar to the Star Fox trio where he summons the Tornado-1 (also Tornado 03; it combines the design of Tornado 1 and 2 from SA1 and X-shape transformation from Tornado 2 with the upgrades from the Cyclone from SA2) that he uses from Unleashed and Generations:

Spoiler: Until Lost World

Lost World uses a new model closer to the original Tornado.

However, the Tornado-1 makes a cameo in Mario & Sonic at the Sochi 2014 Olympic Winter Games so whatever.

Transforming into the X-shape for greater speed:

And finally firing off the homing missiles.

This type of Final Smash makes sense in canon if you consider that in Heroes it’s shown that Tails can just leave the Tornado whenever he wants, suggesting that it’s in autopilot until he needs it again.

This just makes me sad that Tails is not in...again. We have all of the pieces in play to finally make that EGM hoax come true, except the little fox himself.



Everyone has a different character for “I think they deserve a slot in Smash most,” and he’s mine. And now Shadow and Knux are both assists, but the 0G partner is just a spirit...

So, Sakurai, how about DLC echoes dropped randomly? I’d take Tails as a Sonic echo. Would fit with a Sonic 2 moveset (he didn’t fly freely as playable there), and then just change up some anims. You could make it work, I’m sure...

 

[Zinith]

Good morning y'all.

Howdy?

Howdy...

 

[FalcoXP]

i say this as a guy who loved pokemon most of his life

pokemon sucks

Been there.

Was a pokemon fanboy, but didnt enjoy Gen 7 at all.

Let's Go will be the first time I dont buy a main Pokemon game.

I think Pokemon it's not for me anymore.

But still, I have little hope on Gen. 8