Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

DLC is inevitable, but I think if Sakurai was to ever do three "seasons" of DLC characters, we'd have 3 in a bunch with a stage at most - I think they're going to handle it the same was as smash wii u personally, they raked in unbelievable money and I guarentee they intend to do it again

Also, if Star Allies' Dream Friends pacing is any indication, Season DLC is not something that's suited for them anyways.

 

[KMDP]

(a season pass with 8 characters? really?)

A Season Pass can last a long time.

Games like Dragon Ball FighterZ have 8 characters in their Season Passes all the time, it's not that unreasonable.

To further back up my point, guess how many characters are in Smash 4's season pass?
8 is only one more than 7.

 

[Deleted member]

I'm all for having minecraft content in smash. A stage. trophies, and assist, whatever.
I just don't like the idea of steve as a playable fighter simply because i feel he has no personality.
He's a regularly created character that doesn't really have any facial expressions and moves way too stiffly for my taste.
And knowing how good Sakurai is at portraying characters as close to their original appearance, i doubt they'll give Steve a face like those in minecraft story mode or more flexible movements because the stiffness and block aesthetic is a huge part of minecraft.
So yeah my reasons for not wanting him are completely aesthetic and that's ok.

I agree.

I would be dissapointed if we got Steve but not a Minecraft stage.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

That seems like an awful lot of characters to develop for. That depends if Sakurai's development team is smaller come time for the DLC.

Remember that he only finished Mewtwo, Ryu, Roy, and Lucas in a span of 8 months. 2 unique characters and 2 semi-clones.

Not to mention 3 of them were returning veterans.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

Cloud in Smash 4
Noctis in Tekken 7
2B in SC 6

What the **** Square? Why are you so kind for now?

They've seen how much dough cloud gave them in smash 4...

 

[Fred Herbert]

I truly want to believe that this leak is real.

If the ballot was created secretly for Ultimate, these character choices fit the ballot perfectly.

Chorus Kids were actually very popular during Sm4sh DLC hype because they got scrapped.

Banjo was considered for Melee, and has been a request for years (With Microsoft interest).

Shadow and Isaac have dedicated fans who have requested them for years, even scoring high on fan ballots. And do I even have to explain Geno? One out of the three "Holy Trinity" characters who hasn't been revealed?

Mach Rider was planned for Melee, but Sakurai couldn't get him to work just right, and is such a Sakurai pick.

Ken is also practically in, being the original echo fighter and all.

Things like the music theory, and the perfect 13x6 alignment just make sense as well. As for Incineroar, he is most likely early DLC, or leak bait.

Another thing I learned is that even though these characters leaked, they will still have amazing trailers. Just look at Shulk, Duck Hunt, and Bowser Jr.'s trailers. Sure we knew what they were, but they were still amazing nonetheless.

If this turns out fake. It's going to go down as one of the biggest fake leaks of all time. I'm just happy that Pichu made it back in after almost 20 years, but I'm still hoping that Geno will make it into base roster.

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

>echoes don't count as newcomers

are you referring to Dark Pit and Lucina? No, they DO after Daisy was announced to be peach's new echo. Same thing that goes for Richter, Chorm, and Dark Samus.

I think a precedent can be set though as Daisy also came with the caveat that characters of her type would be considered "Echo Fighters", Echo Fighters originated as alternate skins being turned into full on characters by tweaking certain things, and introducing the ability to have Echo Fighters be collapsible on the select screen. I think it's perfectly fair to say that even the Smash team are treating Echo Fighters differently than uniques.

EDIT: Also, as an aside, compare the reveals of Daisy, D.Samus, or Chrom with the reveal of even a Semi-Clone like Isabelle. D.Pitt, Lucina, and Richter got more cinematic appearances, but always accompanied by a unique. Whether they are "real" newcomers isn't something I think Nintendo considers, but they certainly don't treat uniques and echos equally

 

[Fenn]

I'm all for having minecraft content in smash. A stage. trophies, and assist, whatever.
I just don't like the idea of steve as a playable fighter simply because i feel he has no personality.
He's a regularly created character that doesn't really have any facial expressions and moves way too stiffly for my taste.
And knowing how good Sakurai is at portraying characters as close to their original appearance, i doubt they'll give Steve a face like those in minecraft story mode or more flexible movements because the stiffness and block aesthetic is a huge part of minecraft.
So yeah my reasons for not wanting him are completely aesthetic and that's ok.

I've not thought about it that way, and that makes more sense. I do believe that he will be in the game in some manner, even if it's just an assist trophy.

 

[Wambo]

If memes are enough to shoot down a character, then hoo boy do a lot of character got to leave.

I'm fine with not liking Steve, but if memes are your only reason, then you should probably have issues with nearly every character on the roster. Also, if we're gonna use "iconic" as meaning something for Smash characters, Steve has a huge leg-up on Banjo when you consider something being iconic to someone is subjective and relative to what someone has grown up with. There are plenty of people like myself that weren't around during Banjo's heyday, but were around for MC. If I'm being honest, I personally want Steve more than Banjo. I grew up with MC and still play and enjoy it to this day. Banjo is cool, but I don't really have any huge attachment to him personally.

However, this is my own opinion and preferences, nothing objective. I'll be happy for Banjo fans if they get him, but I don't think it's fair to say any character is objectively "better" than another for subjective reasons.

I stated my other arguments to the guy I was replying to there, it's not just about memes.

And I said "character that's getting memed the **** out of right now", as in currently. Visualize Steve getting rapid-fired by the word "MEME" right now. People do not want him in this game.

Now don't get me wrong, some do.

But there will be memes if he got in. And I don't mean good ones like "the Grinch leaked Smash, ecks dee".

 

[Confirmation]

Millions of children love Minecraft.

Steve is assuredly beloved. Arguably more than most of the roster.

Minecraft is beloved. Over the many years I've played Minecraft, I've never heard any phrase close to "I like Steve"

 

[-crump-]

I never played Code Name Steam, and honestly no interest in doing so, but if one those characters got in for some weird reason I’d be all for it because I’d love to see more series get recognition in Smash, even if they’re average.

...Av-

Average?!? I’ll have you know Codename: S.T.E.A.M is an excellent, above average action strategy game, and one of the most underrated titles in the 3DS library, if not Nintendo’s library as a whole! It’s a fantastically wacky game with a lot of difficulty and a lot of heart. You’ll rue the day you dared call —-

-Uh, ahem.. Yeah, Codename: S.T.E.A.M should totally get representation. I loved that game.


Please play it it’s good I swear

 

[Deleted member]

It has been a while since I posted here helping with the ESRB leak from Smash 3DS. Hi everybody

So here's something you can try with the background if you have photoshop, and understand what happens to the image because of the low quality and artifacts caused by the recording.

Let's compare the clean background with the leaked background. Look at the spots marked in red, which are (at least to me) the most suspicious spots in the image.

View attachment 172360

Now, let's apply a filter to the clean background: Filter > Noise > Median.

See what happens to the waterfalls if I increase the value of the filter:
View attachment 172363

The waterfall from the right tends to dissapear, just like in the leaked image.

And this is what happens to the castle area:

View attachment 172364

Doesn't it look a lot more like the leaked image? I just played with the "median" filter in photoshop, that's all. You can try!

So, yeah... My point is that we have been look at the same exact background all the time, but it has been severely modified because of quality and artifacts stuff. Don't forget we are looking at the screenshot of a video in motion of a draft print.

(If you want the same result, apply Median 19 for the waterfalls and Median 28 for the castle area).

This is actually some solid evidence protecting this theory.

The Grinch does not mess around.

Millions of children love Minecraft.

Steve is assuredly beloved. Arguably more than most of the roster.

I can not wait for a Fortnite character in Smash. /s

I actually legit want Steve in Smash, because I am a Minecraft fan.

I at least want Minecraft content if no Steve.

Also, if any of my wants get disconfirmed or whatever, I do not care. I will enjoy Ultimate.

 

[Chrollo.]

I stated my other arguments to the guy I was replying to there, it's not just about memes.

And I said "character that's getting memed the **** out of right now", as in currently. Visualize Steve getting rapid-fired by the word "MEME" right now. People do not want him in this game.

Now don't get me wrong, some do.

But there will be memes if he got in. And I don't mean good ones like "the Grinch leaked Smash, ecks dee".

I mean, the same argument can literally apply to Shadow, and this is coming from a HUGE Shadow fan.

 

[Wambo]

Millions of children love Minecraft.

Steve is assuredly beloved. Arguably more than most of the roster.

Steve also has no character at all to him, yet Cutie thinks he's more interesting than Banjo.

Characters > One grunty boi

 

[lightdrago]

Minecraft is beloved. Over the many years I've played Minecraft, I've never heard any phrase close to "I like Steve"

I like Steve.

There, now you have.

I am also those who would rather have Steve in Smash because Minecraft is a game I rather like, though I can't understand why we can't have both Steve and Banjo in one game.

 

[Pazzo.]

...Av-

Average?!? I’ll have you know Codename: S.T.E.A.M is an excellent, above average action strategy game, and one of the most underrated titles in the 3DS library, if not Nintendo’s library as a whole! It’s a fantastically wacky game with a lot of difficulty and a lot of heart. You’ll rue the day you dared call —-

Uh, ahem.. Yeah, Codename: S.T.E.A.M should totally get representation. I loved that game.


Please play it it’s good I swear

Any game that might give us Abe Lincoln in Smash is a game I like.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

You're totally overlooking the main part of my argument and you know it. The Steve thing was just a gag and a small personal wish.

Someone's touchy today, eh?


>Asks what main part of argument was, literally says what it was it in second sentence
First of all, nice start

People say Zelda is bad now? Man, **** that Breath of the Wild game then for winning all those awards.

"This line of thinking is boring." A lot of people would disagree with you.

>Boring character choices
Sassy bear and bird that work together, and badass puppet warrior from the stars are boring? And square block man who says "OOMPH" isn't? I can't even take you seriously anymore, bruh

You're saying I'm overlooking it when I addressed it. Learn what words mean. Just because I summarize you post while mentioning what I argued doesn't mean I overlooked it

Not talking about my opinions, just that every Zelda game since OoT is hotly debated among Zelda fans

A lot of people are boring, I agree

I like how you're deducting this despite not having shown my opinion on Steve and arguing that my opinion that these characters are boring isn't right because of you're opinion. I don't care about Minecraft but it's hate is just overblown like anything popular with kids, I myself used to do this with multiple 'popular with kids' games before I grew up. It's not my fault I'm not going "OH WOW SO COOL CHARACTERS FROM A SYSTEM I NEVER OWNED AND A DEAD FRANCHISE WHICH I HAVE ZERO INTEREST ERMAHGERD SO GUD" or "HOLY **** A CHARACTER WHO IS ONLY POPULAR BECAUSE OF ONE SONG WHO CONTRIBUTES **** ALL THROUGH THE STORY IN A GAME THAT I DIDN'T PLAY GROWING UP CAUSE IT TOOK THE WII FOR NINTENDO OF EUROPE TO RELEASE THIS AND HE DOESN'T EVEN GET A CHARACTER ARC? THANK YOU DADDY SAKURAI "

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

I stated my other arguments to the guy I was replying to there, it's not just about memes.

And I said "character that's getting memed the **** out of right now", as in currently. Visualize Steve getting rapid-fired by the word "MEME" right now. People do not want him in this game.

Wrong!
believe it or not, people still want him...
memes don't mean anything...

 

[beans]

Okay, 2B in Soul Calibur makes me think Geno is a bit more possible.
Maybe Square got possessed by the spirit of giving?

 

[Deleted member]

I stated my other arguments to the guy I was replying to there, it's not just about memes.

And I said "character that's getting memed the **** out of right now", as in currently. Visualize Steve getting rapid-fired by the word "MEME" right now. People do not want him in this game.

Now don't get me wrong, some do.

But there will be memes if he got in. And I don't mean good ones like "the Grinch leaked Smash, ecks dee".

Please show me hard numbers and data that proves that the majority don't want him, 'cause I've seen plenty that do. What's popular to say on this site and other Smash speculation bubbles =/= the consensus when you consider the actual size of the fandom and how many people outside forums buy these games.

There are going to be memes no matter who is in. Don't even get me started about what weird stuff people are gonna do to whoever's fighter #69. Why on earth should that matter?

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

Expand Dong would make Donkey Kong a meme. Hotel Mario would make Mario and Luigi memes. "Ridley is too big" would make Ridley a meme.

Memes are an awful reason to discard a character because what defines as a meme is so broad and different people have different definitions of memes.

 

[Opossum]

Hey, mobile user here. That argument is full of crap; massive text walls about things we went over two days ago are more a hindrance than memes.

This thread has literally become people complaining about having only the Grinch leak to talk about and people angry that people post stuff other than the Grinch leak in here.

Tell that to my iPad that has browser crashes after opening certain pages.

 

[Yoshisaurus Rex]

I’ll probably get some flack for this but I do feel Steve would serve better as an assist or a stage hazard. If he does turn out to be a playable character then I hope he’s dlc so there isn’t the inevitability of unlocking him in the base game.

It’s not like I hate Minecraft and I know of it’s popularity and sales but I personally think there are more deserving characters.

 

[KMDP]

I truly want to believe that this leak is real.

If the ballot was created secretly for Ultimate, these character choices fit the ballot perfectly.

Chorus Kids were actually very popular during Sm4sh DLC hype because they got scrapped.

Banjo was considered for Melee, and has been a request for years (With Microsoft interest).

Shadow and Isaac have dedicated fans who have requested them for years, even scoring high on fan ballots. And do I even have to explain Geno? One out of the three "Holy Trinity" characters who hasn't been revealed?

Mach Rider was planned for Melee, but Sakurai couldn't get him to work just right, and is such a Sakurai pick.

Ken is also practically in, being the original echo fighter and all.

Things like the music theory, and the perfect 13x6 alignment just make sense as well. As for Incineroar, he is most likely early DLC, or leak bait.

Another thing I learned is that even though these characters leaked, they will still have amazing trailers. Just look at Shulk, Duck Hunt, and Bowser Jr.'s trailers. Sure we knew what they were, but they were still amazing nonetheless.

If this turns out fake. It's going to go down as one of the biggest fake leaks of all time. I'm just happy that Pichu made it back in after almost 20 years, but I'm still hoping that Geno will make it into base roster.

An excellent post.

Welcome to the boards.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

It’s not like I hate Minecraft and I know of it’s popularity and sales but I personally think there are more deserving characters.

What? the second best selling game of all time not deserving enough for you?

 

[Weeman]

"HOLY **** A CHARACTER WHO IS ONLY POPULAR BECAUSE OF ONE SONG WHO CONTRIBUTES **** ALL THROUGH THE STORY IN A GAME THAT I DIDN'T PLAY GROWING UP CAUSE IT TOOK THE WII FOR NINTENDO OF EUROPE TO RELEASE THIS AND HE DOESN'T EVEN GET A CHARACTER ARC? THANK YOU DADDY SAKURAI "

lol who does this refer to?

 

[Wambo]

I mean, the same argument can literally apply to Shadow, and this is coming from a HUGE Shadow fan.

See, Shadow is strangely actually getting quite a lot of love right now, and people from all communities embrace his edginess, even from me. And I used to think "edgehog with gun" was the cringiest thing in the world, but there are greater abominations existing currently.

The memes are hilarious and it's fun to laugh at him, yes, but you actually kind of like him still when you're done laughing.

Steve is at a... "Chuck-E Cheese" level...
And I'm not just saying that because a lot of kids like him

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Steve also has no character at all to him, yet Cutie thinks he's more interesting than Banjo.

Characters > One grunty boi

Yeah, a character with potential for a terraformer moveset is a lot more interesting to me than Character I Can't Find Anything I Like And Have No Interest In His Franchise

 

[Deathcarter]

...Av-

Average?!? I’ll have you know Codename: S.T.E.A.M is an excellent, above average action strategy game, and one of the most underrated titles in the 3DS library, if not Nintendo’s library as a whole! It’s a fantastically wacky game with a lot of difficulty and a lot of heart. You’ll rue the day you dared call —-

-Uh, ahem.. Yeah, Codename: S.T.E.A.M should totally get representation. I loved that game.


Please play it it’s good I swear

I'd love to call S.T.E.A.M above average but the enemy reinforcements appearing before their turn starts combined with the lack of a fast-forward option in the first few months after release just knocks the game down too much in my view. Would still recommend for Nintendo strategy fans.

 

[CantGetRidOfTheRidley]

On that topic, can Quote qualify? His game has been rereleased on Ninty consoles since the Wii, to the point that Sony and Microsoft still didn't get any ports on their consoles,

Quote would probably be stretching it, plus he has his own fighting game now right? I am glad he's grown over the years, he does deserve that.

No offense but this line of thinking is boring. Besides, Minecraft is a Microsoft IP Nintendo gladly promotes and they even advertised that fans of one of the companies can play with the other, that's pretty significant

Nintendo promotes a lot of big name IPs. In the N64 era they heavily promoted their Star Wars but no one really associates Star Wars with Nintendo.

On that note this isn't exactly what you mean by boring, but it's a topic some people say that I'd love to go into, I see a lot of people saying it's boring for Nintendo to add b-list obscure Nintendo characters to the roster and that utterly baffles me. Smash is a great opportunity to introduce a wide audience to these characters and breath new life into them. Without Smash, Mother would mostly be forgotten in the west, Fire Emblem wouldn't be what it is today (especially in the west), Captain Falcon would not be the character he is today and F-Zero would also probably be seen as a far more niche franchise than it is now, and we would've never gotten Kid Icarus Uprising. Nintendo has a huge library of interesting characters that could be revived, given a second chance at life, and introduced to a new generation. The possiblity to see a character given new life after so many years and given an exciting moveset to me is incredibly exciting. That's one of the reasons I'm excited Mach Rider is in, a character who rides a bike in Smash Bros is such a novel concept, I can't wait to see how it's executed.

Also I think it's a lot more boring to want the most well known Top 50 sellers over everyone else. It kills the identity Smash has as a Nintendo game and makes every roster "alright who sold the most games since the last one and are popular now?" The PS All Stars roster is close to that, and that roster is pretty "ehhh"

Besides that, Minecraft has been on Nintendo for a while now and there is a Minecraft-themed 3DS. Not a lot of 3rd party franchises actually get themed consoles/handhelds to begin with. That's huge too. So yeah, it's Nintendo-related anyway.

It's been 3 years and Minecraft already has a deep history with Nintendo
-The Creeper Nintendo 3DS
-Minecraft being on every modern Nintendo System
-The Super Mario mash-up pack.
-Nintendo publishing Minecraft in Japan

The Minecraft 3DS sounds exciting until you realize that Nintendo makes a LOT of specialized third party handhelds. There's a Hello Kitty Game Boy Color. Hello Kitty is not a deep part of Nintendo history. Same with the mario crossover to a lesser extent, Nintendo has done little tie ins like that before, with Soul Caliber and NBA Street. I would be surprised if anyone even remembered those these days. I'm sorry, but I don't see ports to Nintendo consoles as a deep history. A lot of series have ports of Nintendo consoles, but no one would really say they're Nintendo series.

If they're big enough, you gotta acknowledge the new guys as well, and Minecraft is extremely huge.

When did it become a thing that successful third parties are entitled to be in Smash? No, Nintendo does NOT have to acknowledge Minecraft. Smash Bros isn't some right that any franchise gets to have entry to if they demand it hard enough. They're not obligated to do that, that's silly. I've noticed this reasoning pop up a lot lately and it's so silly and I don't get why it's popped up.

Also I love being accused of being a 80s/90s kid when one of my most wanted newcomers is Chibi-Robo, lel.

 

[Deleted member]

What if they do like packs at a time for DLC, each with a stage, some music, a character and maybe an echo, and maybe some items

Xenoblade Pack: Rex/Pyra and/or Elma, an XcX OR an Xc2 stage

Golden Sun pack (if the leak is somehow fake): Isaac, IDK anything about Golden Sun but that maybe that Felix dude could be an echo of Isaac, and that lighthouse thing as a stage

Minecraft pack (ew but if Banjo is in I'm fairly sure Steve is to come, inevitably): Steve with an Alex echo, and a generic Minecraft stage

Pokemon pack: Incineroar and/or a gen 8 Pokemon, a gen 8 stage

Zelda pack: Skull Kid with Hilda as a Zelda echo, Hyrule Field stage with Guardian stage hazards

You guys get the point

 

[Wambo]

What? the second best selling game of all time not deserving enough for you?

(This has been sitting in my folder for a few days, I honestly just really wanted to use it for something)

 

[Yoshisaurus Rex]

What? the second best selling game of all time not deserving enough for you?

Sales and relevancy don’t exactly mean much in Smash (points to )

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

See, Shadow is strangely actually getting quite a lot of love right now, and people from all communities embrace his edginess, even from me. And I used to think "edgehog with gun" was the cringiest thing in the world to me.

The memes are hilarious and it's fun to laugh at him, yes, but you actually kind of like him still when you're done laughing.

Steve is at a... "Chuck-E Cheese" level...
And I'm not just saying that because a lot of kids like him

Steve is nothing compared to Freddy Fazbear...

Look, If you are gonna be on this thread only to hate on Steve, I'd recommend you get out now...

 

[Heracr055]

Millions of children love Minecraft.

Steve is assuredly beloved. Arguably more than most of the roster.

Steve himself is not loved; Minecraft is loved. Steve is the silent shell through which players get to experience the block world in first person. You never actually see him except when you are managing your inventory. No cutscenes, no personality, no other way to view or resonate with the character. In fact, here's a fine example of what I mean just posted:

I actually legit want Steve in Smash, because I am a Minecraft fan.

And there's no way that he is "more beloved" than the majority of the roster for that reason. Minecraft itself can go toe to toe with quite a few of these franchises, but not Steven versus those respective characters.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Quote would probably be stretching it, plus he has his own fighting game now right? I am glad he's grown over the years, he does deserve that.

Technically he has to share that game with most of the other big names in the indie community, but yes, it's something that ought to be well-earned.

 

[vigneault.charles]

Here's all the big hidden parts who have been wrong so far. Probably more to come if Artsy continue the banners crop out

• Orange: Dedede hide the 3rd rock, the only one missing.
• Black: Zelda and Cloud hidding the spot. The only thing visible is the tip of the left crystal over Cloud knee. Artsy said he don't see it but I think we can see one blue crystal in the leaked picture. So he reproduce the only visible crystal and left the other (Again getting everything right except what's hidden)
• Red: Hidden by boswer the whole time. He get the iceberg shown on the left of lucario on some banners and miss completely the island who is hidden. Again get every details right except the one hidden.

Bonus: The missing island is in the in game battlefield. Why would Nintendo change the art that much since E3 that it lost an "In Game" island. I don't think this island have been added for E3 only. The battlefield just look more empty with less accuracy with the real in game battlefield without it.

https://i.imgur.com/93d3wdR.jpg

 

[CosmicQuark]

Okay, I've tried to avoid getting into this conversation (for obvious reason)...

The only characters that should be in Smash is whatever the **** Sakurai wants.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

View attachment 172650
(This has been sitting in my folder for a few days, I honestly just really wanted to use it for something)

It's still a big argument if you ask me...
You aren't even disproving it...

 

[KingofKoopas]

Wait I'm lost... almost literally considering i followed a like on the 2b video i posted to some dead end nothing doing nowhere board in the middle of a ghost town.. Does 2b being in another fighting game and anything that might be as a result of that have anything to do with smash or doesnt it? because the replies are still all here it seems rather inconsistant :/