Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

The Luigi's mansion stage is consideres a Mario stage right? God I wish Sakurai would just call them all Mario characters and stages instead of being inconsistent. The Smash fanbase would cry for 4 minutes and then be fine.

Yeah, that's right.

Though I am fine with categorizing, otherwise would get the shaft even harder than usual.

 

[Deleted member]

It seems like people don't want to give the Yoshi series any legitimacy. And no, Yoshi wasn't separated because "they wanted to slim the Mario numbers down." It was separated because Sakurai felt that the way Yoshi plays in Smash is better represented by his own series rather than the main Mario ones. This "muh Mario sub-series" mentality has to die in a fire.

Oh, and the Yoshi games are MASSIVELY tonally different if you played them...

I'm surprised anyone would regard the Yoshi games as anything BUT a sub-series/spinoff-series. I'd go as far as say that they belong in the same category as the Wario games as well, and both are incredible in their own right (though I do miss the Wario Land games a lot).

That said, to refer to some later posts than the above quoted, I am also surprised that Yoshi is regarded as "discount Mario", because let's be honest, nothing could be further from the truth. It might not always be the case, but when a Yoshi game nails what makes a Yoshi game great (Yoshi's Island 1, Yarn Yoshi, Yoshi's Story(perhaps, I never played it to completion, but other people love it)), it at the very least parallels the best that 2D Mario has to offer.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

I'm surprised anyone would regard the Yoshi games as anything BUT a sub-series/spinoff-series. I'd go as far as say that they belong in the same category as the Wario games as well, and both are incredible in their own right (though I do miss the Wario Land games a lot).

That said, to refer to some later posts than the above quoted, I am also surprised that Yoshi is regarded as "discount Mario", because let's be honest, nothing could be further from the truth. It might not always be the case, but when a Yoshi game nails what makes a Yoshi game great (Yoshi's Island 1, Yarn Yoshi, Yoshi's Story(perhaps, I never played it to completion, but other people love it)), it at the very least parallels the best that 2D Mario has to offer.

I blame the devs for using the baby versions of other Mario characters for three games straight before they finally got the hint.

Also, smug Isabelle's great, where's that from?

 

[CosmicQuark]

Are there any characters that if they get in you'll be set for life? (or at least one Smash cycle)

Honestly if I can get Rex/Pyra/Mythra in DLC for Ultimate or even just Elma I will be set. I don't think we need 3 reps from Xenoblade. (even though I would love it lol) unless the next XC comes out before the next Smash and is absurdly popular. I'll still push for Rex in the next game if just Elma gets into Ultimate but I won't be upset at all if he doesn't get in

It's the reason I'm so passionate about Banjo & Kazooie--playing Smash 64 after having played Banjo-Kazooie, they felt right for the game. At the time I wasn't thinking in terms of sequels or new characters. It was only when the sequels came that I felt Banjo & Kazooie as being "missing" from Smash. To me, they complete the puzzle.

(I made this after King K Rool's reveal--only shared it on the B&K thread, as I didn't want it to be misconstrued as no other characters mattering--the purpose instead was to visualize how I felt about them, and because I can never resist a stupid pun)

So, after that, I'd be set for life in terms of Smash. There are other characters I'd like, mainly Crash given his iconic status in platformers. But I don't consider him "missing" as I don't associate him with Nintendo or with Smash in the same way I do with Banjo & Kazooie.

 

[Zinith]

I blame the devs for using the baby versions of other Mario characters for three games straight before they finally got the hint.

By "devs," you mean Artoon/Arcest before they went under (gee I wonder why), right?

 

[Pyra]

The Luigi's mansion stage is consideres a Mario stage right? God I wish Sakurai would just call them all Mario characters and stages instead of being inconsistent. The Smash fanbase would cry for 4 minutes and then be fine.

I mean, I get it. It'd be weird for the second Mario not to be considered a Mario character.
Yoshi and Wario should definitely be separated imo

I kinda wish they both got more characters because of it. But Super Happy Tree and the like are most certainly not a Mario stage imo. Neither is any Warioware stage.
I can see the argument for Yoshi's stages for sure, I just personally think this is the right categorization

But I reeeaaaallly wish it wasn't just stages (and Kat & Ana for Wario's assist trophy)
I need like... a Mona fighter and a Jimmy T. assist (or the other way around). I'd accept Baby Bowser as a fighter... somehow.

In any case, kinda makes me want Mario RPG characters (and not just SMRPG) get a Star or something as their logo

Disclaimer: It's very early and I'm basically just randomly vomiting thoughts sorry if some of this ends up coming across badly

 

[Darkfur]

Are there any characters that if they get in you'll be set for life? (or at least one Smash cycle)

For me it is Geno, no doubt. I have been pulling for Geno since I joined here, and thats been a long long while. When Geno finally gets in. (Yes Im speaking in certainty born of hope) it will be like a chapter of my life has finally reached fruition.

 

[Deleted member]

By "devs," you mean Artoon/Arcest before they went under (gee I wonder why), right?

I'll be honest about this, Yoshi's Island 2 and Yoshi's New Island were goshdarn horrendous and I'm glad we moved away from them. Former felt slow and clunky, latter felt like they didn't even care when making it.

Also, smug Isabelle's great, where's that from?

I drew it myself.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

By "devs," you mean Artoon/Arcest before they went under (gee I wonder why), right?

Not just them, but also whoever made Touch & Go. Though from what I understand the Yoshi games generally all share the same producer.

Yet the strangest thing is, Arzest's first Yoshi game (Topsy-Turvy) DIDN'T have the babies...

>Topsy-Turvy is mediocre too
It's official, those clowns never did ANYTHING right...

 

[Pyra]

For me it is Geno, no doubt. I have been pulling for Geno since I joined here, and thats been a long long while. When Geno finally gets in. (Yes Im speaking in certainty born of hope) it will be like a chapter of my life has finally reached fruition.

I'm with you in solidarity bud

Honestly I really want a fighter that represents one of the Mario RPG games in general (Geno is at the top of that list ofc, with Paper Mario a second)

Mario & Luigi as a partner character to represent those games would also be interesting but I know people would be ultra mad about that for like a week

 

[Zinith]

I'll be honest about this, Yoshi's Island 2 and Yoshi's New Island were goshdarn horrendous and I'm glad we moved away from them. Former felt slow and clunky, latter felt like they didn't even care when making it.


I drew it myself.

My biggest fear is that even though Good Feel is building up Yoshi's franchise, the damage has been done...

 

[AlphaSSB]

Are there any characters that if they get in you'll be set for life? (or at least one Smash cycle)

Another Star Fox character would make my day. There's so much more that the series has to offer, and its a shame it hasn't been fully realized. There's material in Star Fox Adventures, Star Fox: Assault, Star Fox Zero, and Star Fox Guard that could all be pulled from to create a moveset. Fox, Falco, and Wolf don't really pull from anything.

Krystal as an Assist Trophy is something I'm grateful for, and she's been done very well, but I really wish she would've been playable. Though if she made it as playable, I'd certainly hope she'd have an alternative to her Adventures attire. Smashified and SSF2 both have made great outfits for her.

Slippy has the widest range of material to pull from. You got Star Fox: Assault, Star Fox Zero, and Star Fox Guard to build a unique moveset from. Not to mention that a character like Slippy gives creative freedom with new gadgets he could use.

Leon would be more of an original creation, like that of the rest of the cast, but could still pull from Star Fox: Assault for a moveset. Plus, he'd be fitting, as both Fox and Falco would have their rivals.

Not to mention that James could easily work as a Fox clone, or Peppy as a Slippy clone if you tweaked their skeletons a bit to match.

 

[Venus of the Desert Bloom]

I got my bros Ridley and K Rool plus my lovely Dark Samus. Brawl brought Toon Link and Wolf into my life. Smash 4 brought Mega Man, Cloud, and Ryu so I’m doing really good.

However, if I had to give one more character who would complete the series for me, it would be a toss up between the following three:

1. Elma: awesome double sword and double gun moveset with a stage to boot and stereo-thumping cliche JRPG music.
2. Banjo and Kazooie: Truly the last charadters I consider as being legendary within Smash speculation. I’m astonished they have gotten so much support in light of thier situation.
3. Scorpion: I want to see how MK would be incorporated in Smash. Scorpion would be a great character to play as (Air Throw anyone)? And Kirby shouting “get over here” would be legit.

 

[Pyra]

My biggest fear is that even though Good Feel is building up Yoshi's franchise, the damage has been done...

The newest game has repiqued my interest in Yoshi's games that was previously pretty much just reserved for the first Yoshi's Island.

 

[Paperchampion23]

For me it is Geno, no doubt. I have been pulling for Geno since I joined here, and thats been a long long while. When Geno finally gets in. (Yes Im speaking in certainty born of hope) it will be like a chapter of my life has finally reached fruition.

Same, it's Geno/Isaac/Banjo for me, whom are among the final classic "greats" people have been requesting for 15 years. Just want them in so ultimate will feel ultimate for those fanbases.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

My biggest fear is that even though Good Feel is building up Yoshi's franchise, the damage has been done...

I'm sure Yoshi's torn reputation will be mended soon enough, since Good-Feel's consistently good enough (and it's even proven they're not just doing Yoshi right now, since a Epic Yarn remake is coming).

That aside, I wouldn't mind if King Boo had the Luigi's Mansion branding upon being playable, the guy doesn't need to be tied to Mario's hip.

 

[ZephyrZ]

My first Mario game was New Super Mario Brothers Wii, and I remember playing it for the first time and thinking, "man, I'd love it if I could just ride on Yoshi for the entire game". Imagine how I felt when the 3DS ambassador program introduced me to Yoshi's Island for free several years later. Now that I'm actually good at platforming I'm more interested in difficult games like DKC, but I'll definitely be keeping an eye on Yoshi's Crafted world to see if it's worth picking up anyway. Anyway, point is I wouldn't mind more Yoshi content, especially if it comes from Woolly World or the original Yoshi's Island.

As to whether I consider it its own series or not, I ask why does it even matter that much? As long as a new Yoshi character brings more variety to the roster, I don't see why it's an issue if they'd be "over-repping" the Mario series or not. We fans tend to hold "representation" as the holy standard for which all characters should be considered or scrapped when there's far more to each character's inclusion then just that. While I'm not a huge Kamek supporter, I do think he has to potential to make an interesting fighter with a little creativity and think that people who like him should feel free to support him or any other Yoshi character they might want regardless of how "well-repped" Mario is.

Although if you must know my opinion, I consider Yoshi both a Mario rep and a Yoshi rep. He clearly represents his own series through his moveset and unique symbol (obviously), but he's still Mario's iconic partner. I don't see why it has to be just one or the other. I feel the same way about DK to a lesser extent, since he's still Mario's iconic rival and has been associated with the plumber long before he became his own thing. Heck, maybe we'll even see K.Rool in the next Mario Kart (although if we couldn't even get Diddy in MK8 I wouldn't get too excited about it).

 

[Graizen]

Hey people, something strange is happening here
https://twitter.com/akfamilyhomeak/status/1054700256124796930?s=19

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

Are there any characters that if they get in you'll be set for life? (or at least one Smash cycle)

Honestly if I can get Rex/Pyra/Mythra in DLC for Ultimate or even just Elma I will be set. I don't think we need 3 reps from Xenoblade. (even though I would love it lol) unless the next XC comes out before the next Smash and is absurdly popular. I'll still push for Rex in the next game if just Elma gets into Ultimate but I won't be upset at all if he doesn't get in

Hmmm... Assuming you're pretty new here, you probably don't know about my obsession with Rhythm Heaven (You would've found out soon enough anyway)... Easily one of the most underrated and overlooked Nintendo series. So it's kind of a no brainier that if any Rhythm Heaven character gets in, I will be completely satisfied and fine with any roster addition afterwards... I'm still holding out hope that since one was planned for Smash 4 but cut, that they could actually get in this time...

 

[Pyra]

We're gonna get Conker and Banjo in as Diddy Kong Racing reps and hear Sakurai's booming laugh echo across the skies for the next decade.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

We're gonna get Conker and Banjo in as Diddy Kong Racing reps and hear Sakurai's booming laugh echo across the skies for the next decade.

You mean like this?

 

[Deleted member]

We're gonna get Conker and Banjo in as Diddy Kong Racing reps and hear Sakurai's booming laugh echo across the skies for the next decade.

Best timeline? Worst timeline? You decide

 

[Graizen]

Hey people, something strange is happening here
https://twitter.com/akfamilyhomeak/status/1054700256124796930?s=19

 

[Robertman2]

I forgot New Island was a thing. I think everyone forgot about it.

Also boycotting Crafted World s8nce it isn't Yoshi's Flipping Island

 

[Ring-a-Sheep]

We're gonna get Conker and Banjo in as Diddy Kong Racing reps and hear Sakurai's booming laugh echo across the skies for the next decade.

Its young conker and nuts & bolts banjo

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

Hey people, something strange is happening here
https://twitter.com/akfamilyhomeak/status/1054700256124796930?s=19

Pretty sure it's called a joke...

 

[Deleted member]

Literally one of the easiest fakes to make

 

[Zinith]

I forgot New Island was a thing. I think everyone forgot about it.

Also boycotting Crafted World s8nce it isn't Yoshi's Flipping Island

I kinda HAVE to remember New Island because it's the source of probably Yoshi's best new potential Final Smash...

 

[Pyra]

Hey people, something strange is happening here
https://twitter.com/akfamilyhomeak/status/1054700256124796930?s=19

He's just joking, it's a static image.

Its young conker and nuts & bolts banjo

I'm gonna pretend you didn't remind me of Young Conker.
And while I probably would have liked Nuts and Bolts if it wasn't a Banjo game, ... no yeah, they were pretty ugly in that too.

So yes, absolutely, put them in Smash.

 

[Dyllybirdy]

Damn, on the new poll at the top of the page, only 6 people voted for Isabelle.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

I forgot New Island was a thing. I think everyone forgot about it.

They forgot it for good reasons too,
like this abomination on the ears

 

[Pyra]

Damn, on the new poll at the top of the page, only 6 people voted for Isabelle.

I'm happy for her because it's more than Simon and she can't disappoint me cause she's a good puppy

They forgot it for good reasons too,
like this abomination on the ears

There's nothing wrong with that you cowards

 

[Dyllybirdy]

I'm happy for her because it's more than Simon and she can't disappoint me cause she's a good puppy


There's nothing wrong with that you cowards

I guess... but, she does really deserve more, but, I'll move on...

 

[Robertman2]

They forgot it for good reasons too,
like this abomination on the ears

Reminds me of this masterpiece:

 

[StormC]

lol @ Richter having more votes than Simon.

 

[Pyra]

I guess... but, she does really deserve more, but, I'll move on...

I agree.

If it's any consolation, she would have been my third pick behind Inkling and K. Rool...

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

lol @ Richter having more votes than Simon.

Well, he is cooler (at least in my opinion)... He's also probably easier on the eyes for some people compared to Connan the Vampire Hunter

 

[Deleted member]

My biggest fear is that even though Good Feel is building up Yoshi's franchise, the damage has been done...

I kinda doubt it, especially considering how much people talk about that Craft Yoshi game coming for the Switch, and usually in a positive light.
The yarn game probably didn't do that great because it was on a very unpopular console, and the association with it probably also hurt it's 3DS port sales later down the line.
But with the Switch I can see the next one doing very well. Not that I'm interested myself, but I kinda expect it.

 

[Turtlar]

Are there any characters that if they get in you'll be set for life? (or at least one Smash cycle)

Honestly if I can get Rex/Pyra/Mythra in DLC for Ultimate or even just Elma I will be set. I don't think we need 3 reps from Xenoblade. (even though I would love it lol) unless the next XC comes out before the next Smash and is absurdly popular. I'll still push for Rex in the next game if just Elma gets into Ultimate but I won't be upset at all if he doesn't get in

For me, it would have to be Geno and Banjo, along with Dixie as a semi-clone, ala Isabelle. It would finally give DK the representation it deserves, so that I could finally stop complaining about it and Metroid being under-repped.

Geno and Mega Man were my most wanted in Brawl, and Banjo would finally see Rare get its due, all these years later.

 

[Deleted member]

He's also probably easier on the eyes for some people compared to Connan the Vampire Hunter

The only reason my younger brother didn’t want Simon in was that he didn’t like either of the two designs they were most likely to use. I’m just glad we didn’t get Chronicles Simon. I prefer Conan.