Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[osby]

And for purely characters I'd like a...
Capcom Fighter Pack
Contains Dante, Morrigan, Chun Li and Bass

Finally, quality content I want to see.

Plus, Alfonzo can take the place of Bass in Mega Man's final smash.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Finally, quality content I want to see.

Plus, Alfonzo can take the place of Bass in Mega Man's final smash.

...Gonna be completely honest, I forgot they added Proto-Man and Bass there. So add idk, Vile

 

[Shadowwolflink]

Oh God. That makes sense if you think about the collaboration between Nintendo and Pixar in Wreck It Ralph. Not that i buy this leak at all, but Mickey had some pretty good games back then. That would be groundbreaking, a non-exclusive video game character entering smash could change everything about the series. But i still think Sora would be more suitable and this leak is fake as ****.

Wreck-It Ralph is made by Disney Animation Studios, not Pixar.

 

[Idon]

Ahem...

Spoiler

...You know, Dark Samus' official other name?

I hope no one has forgotten Dark Samus is Metroid Prime, the namesake of the sub-series. Therefore, Dark Samus can still be referred to as Metroid Prime or perhaps even Prime by itself.

I was tryna tiptoe around that without actually mentioning it...

But y'know what in hindsight, Sakurai doesn't even give a **** about spoilers so **** it, yeah they could've called Dark Samus that instead too.

 

[osby]

I was tryna tiptoe around that without actually mentioning it...

But y'know what in hindsight, Sakurai doesn't even give a **** about spoilers so **** it, yeah they could've called Dark Samus that instead too.

I mean, they also could've call Pittoo. I think they're trying to use official or most well known names.

Who calls as

Spoiler

Metroid Prime?

 

[Scicky]

He's not 'leaving stuff out'.

Vergeben isn't a 'nice' person if you've ever seen him outside of his initial leak posts, he 'wants' the glory of being 'the one who leaked'.

He has nothing to gain by leaving out a character, because that could bite him in the *** in the long run when he claims "I'm the one who leaked Ultimate's roster" for street cred later down the line when he leaks another game's contents.

The only character he's claimed to have known about but not say anything was Richter, and that's because he didn't know if Richter was an assist.

Yeah I've seen him be a **** to people outside of his leak posts, funny stuff, but you have a point lol. Still, the fact that he didn't say anything about K. Rool means for one reason or another he could be leaving info out or more likely, doesn't have all the information. Both of those options means that even if he's correct in saying that Ken, Incineroar and some form of Minecraft + added Square representation are in the game, there could very easily be more characters coming that we haven't yet heard about.

 

[DevaAshera]

You know, if there is a N64 classic, I hope there is a N64 Mother 3 in it too.

Mother 3 N64 version has been scrapped but it is possible to bring it back, similar to Star Fox 2.

The difference here is that EarthBound 64/Mother 64 was never finished, Star Fox 2 was and just wasn't released due to the impending release of the Nintendo 64 and the very similar Star Fox 64 being in development.
EarthBound 64 was cancelled due to the development team not understanding how to program in 3D and having several difficulties keeping it from being made, so I doubt Nintendo would take the time to try and finish the game when it was nowhere near finished in the first place.

It was an unreleased Zelda game, which was originally supposed to be released on the N64 DD.

Zelda Gaiden, eventually turned into Majora's Mask.

You're thinking of Ura Zelda, which was going to be the N64DD Expansion for for Ocarina of Time that was meant to feature several additions and changes (also the game Nintendo tried to pass Master Quest off as..but based on what Ura Zelda was said to be, Master Quest is not it). We never got any actual screenshots from it that I can tell though.

Zelda Gaiden was just the codename/work in progress name for Majora's Mask, it literally means Zelda: Another Story. They used it as a placeholder akin to Ocarina of Time just being known as Zelda 64, they even shown beta screenshots from Majora's Mask before it had its name in Nintendo Power with the caption 'Zelda Gaiden'.

That said, Ura Zelda & Zelda Gaiden/Majora's Mask are linked. Gaiden/Majora's Mask began development because Aonuma didn't want to make Ura Zelda, finding it boring since he was, as he put it, just making Ocarina of Time again (which is what it was, I guess). In response, Miyamoto said if his team could make a brand new Zelda game in one year, they didn't have to make Ura Zelda.

As such, I don't believe there really is an Ura Zelda, outside of very, very early builds of the game that might exist somewhere.

 

[N3ON]

Here, let's do a mental excercise.

Think of Metroid. Think of the essense of Metroid. What you like about the worlds, the music. Everything!

Think of the characters.

are probably the first few you think of. probably shows up if you go a little further.


Now think of DK.

jump out for sure. follows close behind.

How about Zelda?
all jump to mind immediately with being lumped in there (due to being the same people).

Pokemon?
all instantly come to mind, with showing up later and maybe by association.

Let's try Mario!









How many characters did you think of before eventually coming to Geno?

Geno's problem isn't a lack of interest or potential. It's that he's essentially a historical footnote in a series with a pantheon of regularly used and beloved characters.

He's overshadowed by several characters in his own series to the point where people can easily be hardcore Mario fans, and never know who Geno is. This is something never had to deal with. If you were a DK or Metroid fan, you at least knew who those two were. Can you honestly say the same for Geno?

Geno's still got a shot, sure. But I'm honestly skeptical of his chances. He's truly unlike the majority of characters in Smash and doesn't have developmental shenanigans to sneak on by like .

I'll be honest with you, if it weren't for Smash, Greninja wouldn't be in even like my top 25 for Pokemon. He wasn't my starter and I don't watch the anime. I think the majority of people out there would have their lists be a lot of Gen 1, legendaries, and starters they used.

I doubt many people would stick Incineroar in that company either, unless they chose him as their starter. And even then I don't think that elevates him above all the starters chosen in the past.

But to your point, yeah, Geno is an unimportant character all things considered. However that hasn't stopped Sakurai from wanting to include him in Smash, or going to the effort of acquiring his rights from the vice grip of those miserly SE clowns. If it weren't for that, I'd agree with you, but I think he's in an interesting situation now.

 

[NintendoKnight]

I was tryna tiptoe around that without actually mentioning it...

But y'know what in hindsight, Sakurai doesn't even give a **** about spoilers so **** it, yeah they could've called Dark Samus that instead too.

I mean, they also could've call Pittoo. I think they're trying to use official or most well known names.

Who calls as

Spoiler

Metroid Prime?

I don't know if anyone has made the direct connection here (if they have, I haven't seen anyone mention it) but...

...honestly, this crap writes itself.

Dark Samus is Metroid Prime, but debuted in the sequel with the subtitle "Echoes."

Therefore, Dark Samus was an Echo Fighter long before Ultimate was even a concept.

 

[Diem]

I don't know if anyone has made the direct connection here (if they have, I haven't seen anyone mention it) but...

...honestly, this crap writes itself.

Dark Samus is Metroid Prime, but debuted in the sequel with the subtitle "Echoes."

Therefore, Dark Samus was an Echo Fighter long before Ultimate was even a concept.

I wondered if the whole Echo Fighter/Echoes thing might have had something do with Dark Samus's inclusion since before she was confirmed, but I looked it up, and in Japan, Echo Fighters are called "Dash Fighters" for some reason. So unless Sakurai is aware of the localization team's change to "echo," and that was somehow planned since the beginning in December 2015, I doubt it had any bearing on Dark Samus's inclusion. It'd be awesome if we could say it did, but right now it doesn't seem likely.

 

[StormC]

I don't think Geno is much more egregious than Sheik. Sheik just happens to also be Zelda and was added hot off of Ocarina Of Time's success.

Obviously Geno is still an outlier and will change Smash speculation forever if he's in. But yeah, Sakurai wants him.

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

The only reason Greninja instantly comes to mind when I think of Pokémon is because of his appearance in Smash.

Outside of the context of Smash a lot of first gen Pokémon come to mind before Greninja.

 

[N3ON]

I don't even think Geno's inclusion would shake things up that much. His inclusion would be based on massive popularity. Massive popularity has gotten characters in before, it's just that relatively obscure, unimportant characters don't typically manage to become massively popular.

If anything it'd be a testament to factors we already knew were influential.

 

[osby]

I wondered if the whole Echo Fighter/Echoes thing might have had something do with Dark Samus's inclusion since before she was confirmed, but I looked it up, and in Japan, Echo Fighters are called "Dash Fighters" for some reason. So unless Sakurai is aware of the localization team's change to "echo," and that was somehow planned since the beginning in December 2015, I doubt it had any bearing on Dark Samus's inclusion. It'd be awesome if we could say it did, but right now it doesn't seem likely.

' symbol is used to indicate something that is derived, at least in the context Sakurai used it.

Like how Japanese version calls the title "Special", instead of "Ultimate", it's a less cool but a more direct name.

 

[StormC]

I don't even think Geno's inclusion would shake things up that much. His inclusion would be based on massive popularity. Massive popularity has gotten characters in before, it's just that relatively obscure, unimportant characters don't typically manage to become massively popular.

If anything it'd be a testament to factors we already knew were influential.

I think Geno's inclusion might incentivize Skull Kid supporters/Zelda fans in general in a big way, if it indicates that otherwise irrelevant one-off characters can get into Smash. It's not easy to replicate popularity like that though; Geno's popularity comes from a strange grab bag of factors, there isn't one thing you can point at, unlike other characters.

 

[bobadz]

Yeah I've seen him be a **** to people outside of his leak posts, funny stuff, but you have a point lol. Still, the fact that he didn't say anything about K. Rool means for one reason or another he could be leaving info out or more likely, doesn't have all the information. Both of those options means that even if he's correct in saying that Ken, Incineroar and some form of Minecraft + added Square representation are in the game, there could very easily be more characters coming that we haven't yet heard about.

Your right but, it’s far more likely he didn’t know about k.rool. He didn’t Know about “everyone is here”. Considering his very shaky reputation as a leaker plus his online behavior him getting everything right is important to him. If he’s wrong on Ken, Inceneroar, or the the SE character nobody will take him seriously.

 

[osby]

I think Geno's inclusion might incentivize Skull Kid supporters/Zelda fans in general in a big way, if it indicates that otherwise irrelevant one-off characters can get into Smash. It's not easy to replicate popularity like that though; Geno's popularity comes from a strange grab bag of factors, there isn't one thing you can point at, unlike other characters.

I think Skull Kid might gain a surge in requests if there is no Zelda newcomers in the base roster. Like, K.Rool was popular among Smash fans, but demand for him really exploded after people realized Donkey Kong has less squares in the CSS than Kid Icarus.

 

[StormC]

I think Skull Kid might gain a surge in requests if there is no Zelda newcomers in the base roster. Like, K.Rool was popular among Smash fans, but demand for him really exploded after people realized Donkey Kong has less squares in the CSS than Kid Icarus.

I assume Skull Kid will be who Zelda fans rally behind, yeah. For years people argued between him, Midna, Ghirahim and others... but I think the loz18 business made Skull Kid the #1 for Zelda fans. I just wonder if they can keep the momentum going for years and years like other characters; trust me when I say it's a marathon, not a sprint.

Also here's where I plug Ganon as the Zelda newcomer.

Wake up, sheeple!

 

[osby]

I assume Skull Kid will be who Zelda fans rally behind, yeah. For years people argued between him, Midna, Ghirahim and others... but I think the loz18 business made Skull Kid the #1 for Zelda fans. I just wonder if they can keep the momentum going for years and years like other characters; trust me when I say it's a marathon, not a sprint.

Also here's where I plug Ganon as the Zelda newcomer.

Wake up, sheeple!

Another version of Ganon?

Nice, then we only need one more Zelda and Ganon to balance representation, exactly what Zelda fans want!

 

[Shroob]

All I'm saying is that the calm before the storm once we get the date for the Direct, isn't going to be calm at all.


People are going to be flipping the **** out over box and Vergeben until the Direct's over.

 

[StormC]

Another version of Ganon?

Nice, then we only need one more Zelda and Ganon to balance representation, exactly what Zelda fans want!

Three Links, three Zeldas, three Ganons... Triforce... it's like poetry, it rhymes.

Toon Ganondorf would be legit fire, though. I guess you could throw in Tetra too.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I think Geno's inclusion might incentivize Skull Kid supporters/Zelda fans in general in a big way, if it indicates that otherwise irrelevant one-off characters can get into Smash. It's not easy to replicate popularity like that though; Geno's popularity comes from a strange grab bag of factors, there isn't one thing you can point at, unlike other characters.

I mean, doesn't every character incentivize any character? "SNAKE? HOLY **** WE CAN HABE THIRD PARTY CHARACTERS!" is the biggest one that comes to mind. Plus, people upset about not getting a character they wanted get more motivated when this happens too

 

[N3ON]

I think Geno's inclusion might incentivize Skull Kid supporters/Zelda fans in general in a big way, if it indicates that otherwise irrelevant one-off characters can get into Smash. It's not easy to replicate popularity like that though; Geno's popularity comes from a strange grab bag of factors, there isn't one thing you can point at, unlike other characters.

I think loz has done more for Skull Kid than Geno ever will tbh. If Geno happened without loz, Skull Kid would have a lot of in-series competition. Now people will gun for him above the others.

But it's true that Geno will set some actual precedent if he's included, though I don't think people beforehand disbelieved that enough popularity would get any ("realizable") candidate included, no matter how obscure. I mean that's sort of self-evident by Geno's fanbase itself.

Even still, I don't foresee too many other largely irrelevant characters reaching the level of Geno, or even Skull Kid. The latter of whom had a very Chorus Men-esque situation btw, not one predicated on organic groundswell like Geno.

 

[Deleted member]

I assume Skull Kid will be who Zelda fans rally behind, yeah. For years people argued between him, Midna, Ghirahim and others... but I think the loz18 business made Skull Kid the #1 for Zelda fans. I just wonder if they can keep the momentum going for years and years like other characters; trust me when I say it's a marathon, not a sprint.

Also here's where I plug Ganon as the Zelda newcomer.

Wake up, sheeple!

I've always thought of Tingle as the most likely Zelda newcomer, as he's appeared fairly frequently throughout the franchise, and even got his own spin-off games.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

All I'm saying is that the calm before the storm once we get the date for the Direct, isn't going to be calm at all.


People are going to be flipping the **** out over box and Vergeben until the Direct's over.

As a person who can apparently look in the future, stop being right, it's making me upset

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

So are Bandana Dee, Isaac, Geno, and Banjo our new Elite 4?

With Waluigi as the champion?

 

[Shroob]

Aren't you all going to love it?


Up to two, to god forbid, four days of non-stop Vergeben and Box debates, but these'll be MUCH worse than normal due to this being the final Smash Direct, so everyone's hopes, dreams, and utter desperation will be on the line for this, making everyone THAT much more toxic than normal.



FUN TIMES AHEAD MI FRIENDOS.

 

[marth_t90]

the actual way this thread never stops is beautiful

 

[osby]

So are Bandana Dee, Isaac, Geno, and Banjo our new Elite 4?

With Waluigi as the champion?

Waluigi is Guzma

 

[Zinith]

the actual way this thread never stops is beautiful

People have tried to stop it...

To no avail

 

[marth_t90]

for th record my dream challenger approachin wud b raziel. he'd be perfeccct

(tryin to insert images and keep getting the red cross thing, help?)

 

[Shroob]

I-****ing-magine if the day before the Direct is supposed to air, SOMETHING major happens again, be it a music **** up, or we get an updated version of THE BOX which only shows Isabelle and an unconfirmed newcomer on the side we can see....


Oh the chaos that will be had......

 

[Cutie Gwen]

the actual way this thread never stops is beautiful

The mods may try, but even they know the power of ****posts can't be stopped, be they from impatient people waiting for news we don't have or people who dance in the flames

 

[osby]

I-****ing-magine if the day before the Direct is supposed to air, SOMETHING major happens again, be it a music **** up, or we get an updated version of THE BOX which only shows Isabelle and an unconfirmed newcomer on the side we can see....


Oh the chaos that will be had......

It's the third time in fifteen minutes you've talked about this. Not that there's a way direct won't end up in flames but it's almost like you want it to happen.

I'm joking.

 

[bobadz]

All I'm saying is that the calm before the storm once we get the date for the Direct, isn't going to be calm at all.


People are going to be flipping the **** out over box and Vergeben until the Direct's over.

Pretty sure people will do that after the direct also.

 

[Ring-a-Sheep]

Aren't you all going to love it?


Up to two, to god forbid, four days of non-stop Vergeben and Box debates, but these'll be MUCH worse than normal due to this being the final Smash Direct, so everyone's hopes, dreams, and utter desperation will be on the line for this, making everyone THAT much more toxic than normal.



FUN TIMES AHEAD MI FRIENDOS.

There's nothing we can do except pray for this thread, though...im not sure even divine intervention could help us at this point.

 

[StormC]

It's the third time in fifteen minutes you've talked about this. Not that there's a way direct won't end up in flames but it's almost like you want it to happen.

I know I do.

 

[Shroob]

It's the third time in fifteen minutes you've talked about this. Not that there's a way direct won't end up in flames but it's almost like you want it to happen.

I'm joking.

I think I've grown soo tired of this cycle that I've become as follows:

 

[StormC]

I'm bored of Smash speculation now but at least I'd rather be bored than anxiously hoping for my most wanted characters to get in.

I mean I'm still hoping for Banjo but I've more or less made peace with him probably being DLC if he's in at all. And he's just a bonus at this point.

I genuinely feel bad for the ballot candidates whose fans got their hopes up after the K. Rool announcement. If K. Rool is the only ballot newcomer in the base game (something I'm not sure is going to happen), then that would be sorta anticlimactic.

Everyone Is Here seems to be the main contribution of the ballot.

 

[Jetsurge]

I genuinely feel bad for the ballot candidates whose fans got their hopes up after the K. Rool announcement. If K. Rool is the only ballot newcomer in the base game (something I'm not sure is going to happen), then that would be sorta anticlimactic.

Geno is probably in as well but I think King K. Rool is the only super popular high-ranking ballot character in the game.