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Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

Almost one month has passed since release. In retrospect....

  • This is by far the best Smash ever. Like, I don't even know how they will top this.

  • Pretty freakin' good; I have a few qualms over things like internet play, balancing issues, etc.

  • It's ok, but [insert Smash game here] is better.

  • I'd rather play Parcheesi.


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Fatmanonice

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Everyone Is Here for Marvel Vs Capcom? That's 101 characters... Capcom ain't no Sakurai. Marvel Vs Capcom 2 was a balancing train wreck at 56, can't imagine nearly double that. Capcom is also notorious at hardcore phoning it in if things get too difficult too, nevermind the modern convenience of patches (which they typically bork too).
 

Knight Dude

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The saddest dropped characters for MVC3 were Blade, for being to similar to Dante apparently. And Cloak and Dagger, who would've functioned like a JoJo character from Heritage of the Future. Doc Ock was also dropped, due to his Robot Arms being difficult to animate. But honestly, after they made Shuma in MVC3, and Venom/Jedah in MVCI, some of those other characters seem more plausible in theory.

Those Marvel 4 rumors sound really cool and sick. Which means it isn't happening.

EDIT: MVC probably isn't doing "EVERYONE IS HERE". At best, the supposed cut characters for MVCI, Like Green Goblin and Lady, and a ton of MVC3 characters being added back, Like the X-Men, Trish and Vergil would make more sense.

If those guys who also got cut from MVC3 made it in, Blade and Cloak & Dagger would also be great.
 
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D

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Because MVC:I provides a foundation that can be touched up enough to become MVC4.

Remember Arcade Edition? Despite the mixed reception for SF5 they've put in work to make it good again. I can see this happening with Marvel.
Street Fighter V is a different case where all people wanted was just more consistent updates. Marvel VS. Capcom Infinite is a WAY more harsher case, where people wanted to see updates to SFV and to see things fixed all across the board in MVCI. The roster, graphics, animations - not to mention the extremely bad publicity it got, I assure you that Capcom would like to stay as far away from this game as possible.

Hell, I'll bet this right now. If Marvel VS. Capcom Infinite is getting a huge update, we won't get Geno in Smash. That's how much I'm willing to bet.

I mean, when has ANY rumor to come out of Marvel been true? And I don't mean like "Phoenix Wright is coming to Marvel 3," I mean like, genuine pre-production rumors? 100% of the time they have been always wrong.
 

KMDP

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I really dont get nintendos logic, they did an inverse marketing with this game.

Went all out on the E3, one direct then totally slowed down...like theres no need to market or keep the hype train, i just cant understand it.

Why not make something more modern, like keeping update on relevant content and more constant? And even so, the creator coming and saying straightforward they will slow down...

It boggles my mind, feels like they know smash is gonna sell a ****on despite whatever they announce, all the latest fg ive seen they totally had a campaign where 2 months ish before release they were absolutely jam announcing everything while in smash it feels the total opposite like they went all out and just wanted it to settle.

Even tho, ive always expected no info on october and just one direct in november, i find it so old fashioned and not hype.
Smash is big enough that the momentum built up through E3 and the August direct will likely carry it until close to release; even if the marketing department do nothing, journalistic venues (like, for example, Gamexplain) and gaming channels/theorists (e.g. Alpharad, RelaxAlax, Billybae10K Billybae10K and the like) will keep it in the public eye (outlets like Etika rely on new content to make reactions).

Also, don't forget that Smash Ultimate is being marketed in the real world, showing up at Gaming Tournaments and Conventions.

That being said, huge series like Smash are the only Video Game franchises that this strategy can work for. Low amounts of marketing have killed lesser games (e.g. Golden Sun Dark Dawn).
 

Luigi The President

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Street Fighter V is a different case where all people wanted was just more consistent updates. Marvel VS. Capcom Infinite is a WAY more harsher case, where people wanted to see updates to SFV and to see things fixed all across the board in MVCI. The roster, graphics, animations - not to mention the extremely bad publicity it got, I assure you that Capcom would like to stay as far away from this game as possible.

Hell, I'll bet this right now. If Marvel VS. Capcom Infinite is getting a huge update, we won't get Geno in Smash. That's how much I'm willing to bet.

I mean, when has ANY rumor to come out of Marvel been true? And I don't mean like "Phoenix Wright is coming to Marvel 3," I mean like, genuine pre-production rumors? 100% of the time they have been always wrong.
No, people wanted way more than consistent updates. They wanted better balancing, more characters they already loved; just like MVCI.
I'm not trying to say I feel the update is likely but I'm also not going to rule it out.
 

KingofKoopas

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Who the **** is Madrox

I mean we do NOT need bone claw Wolverine back. And that would be like 60 characters to add
i think if MVC2 was made nowadays theyd add Wolverine and Old Man Logan as the second version. That woulda sorta maybe been different?
 

Idon

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MvC4 better have Nero so I can make the Dante, Vergil, Nero team I've always wanted. I call it "Custody Battle."
 

Dcas

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Sakurai's comment about slowing down also mentioned that they might have been a little to hasty, so this "inverse marketing" could just have been poor planning on their part. That said, we still don't know what "Spirits" mode is going to be like. There could still be a chance for it to be a huge enough deal to take up most of a direct all on its own.

Then there's simply the fact that Sakurai hates leaks. Perhaps he assumes that, by releasing everything early, there's less time for it to all get leaked.

It sounds like that indeed, they had huge hype characters and now that we are so close to reveal, there are only about 2 characters who will totally destroy the hype meters (sora, chrono and those characters). And yes, we are missing lots of info but all our evidence is pointing out that theres literally spirits, 4 characters and thats it. Those missing characters we probably know who will they be, maybe theres ONE major surprise or wtf character no one expected still.

Something really weird as well is, we have been seeing the same build of the demo for almost 5 months, they could at least release a newer demo or fights between characters something like what they did for snake vs Krool but instead we keep getting radio silence. So weird.
 
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Luigi The President

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It sounds like that indeed, they had huge hype characters and now that we are so close to reveal, there are only about 2 characters who will totally destroy the hype meters (sora, chrono and those characters). And yes, we are missing lots of info but all our evidence is pointing out that theres literally spirits, 4 characters and thats it. Those missing characters we probably know who will they be, maybe theres ONE major surprise or wtf character no one expected still.

Something really weird as well is, we have been seeing the same build of the demo for almost 5 months, they could at least release a newer demo or fights between characters something like what they did for snake vs Krool but instead we keep getting radio silence. So weird.
"Sora and Chrono"....chief called this ain't it
 

drag0nscythe

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It sounds like that indeed, they had huge hype characters and now that we are so close to reveal, there are only about 2 characters who will totally destroy the hype meters (sora, chrono and those characters). And yes, we are missing lots of info but all our evidence is pointing out that theres literally spirits, 4 characters and thats it. Those missing characters we probably know who will they be, maybe theres ONE major surprise or wtf character no one expected still.

Something really weird as well is, we have been seeing the same build of the demo for almost 5 months, they could at least release a newer demo or fights between characters something like what they did for snake vs Krool but instead we keep getting radio silence. So weird.
Spirits, 2 more characters and promises of lots of dlc

That is about it.
But given we have ridley and k rool, that is all we need.
 

osby

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MvC4 better have Nero so I can make the Dante, Vergil, Nero team I've always wanted. I call it "Custody Battle."
If Capcom wants to level up from MVC3, they need to put all DMC4 characters into the game: Dante, Vergil, Trish, Lady, Nero. All of them. or they could act rational
 
D

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No, people wanted way more than consistent updates. They wanted better balancing, more characters they already loved; just like MVCI.
I'm not trying to say I feel the update is likely but I'm also not going to rule it out.
Big oof, I meant to say that when I said "consistent updates" and worded it as broad as humanly possible lmao

But at the end of the day, if we're getting anything Marvel related, it's going to be Marvel VS. Capcom 4 for next gen consoles. I recommend watching Max's vid about the whole situation. I really do agree with him in saying that they should go for the "EVERYONE IS HERE!" route, because that'll at least be the first step into getting back into the good graces of the public masses.

Trust me, I'd like to believe Vergeben, especially after he/they got Dark Samus, Chrom and Isabelle right so far in the Smash sides of things, because I want to see Marvel get out of this hellhole, but rebranding ain't gonna save this game.

 
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KingofKoopas

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MvC4 better have Nero so I can make the Dante, Vergil, Nero team I've always wanted. I call it "Custody Battle."
Personall aside from the return of Doom and the Xmen Characters id be amazed if they added

From Marvel:

Carnage
Any or all the Fantastic Four
Silver Surfer
Green Goblin

Capcom:

Asura
Axl (may as well since Zero and X are there)
Was Leon Kennedy in MVC yet?

Edit: Forgot the most important one
Cody_Travers_(Street_Fighter_V).png
 
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Knight Dude

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Street Fighter V is a different case where all people wanted was just more consistent updates. Marvel VS. Capcom Infinite is a WAY more harsher case, where people wanted to see updates to SFV and to see things fixed all across the board in MVCI. The roster, graphics, animations - not to mention the extremely bad publicity it got, I assure you that Capcom would like to stay as far away from this game as possible.

Hell, I'll bet this right now. If Marvel VS. Capcom Infinite is getting a huge update, we won't get Geno in Smash. That's how much I'm willing to bet.

I mean, when has ANY rumor to come out of Marvel been true? And I don't mean like "Phoenix Wright is coming to Marvel 3," I mean like, genuine pre-production rumors? 100% of the time they have been always wrong.
I doubt MVCI is getting updated to MVC4, but what does Geno have to do with it? You should've bet on Ken or something.

That said, Verg's Marvel info, and info based on any game that isn't Smash seems flimsy at best.

MvC4 better have Nero so I can make the Dante, Vergil, Nero team I've always wanted. I call it "Custody Battle."
I just want to have a team of Spider-Man characters damn it. Spider-Man, Green Goblin AND Venom? That'd be sick. Call it "Spider-Man and His Amazing Enemies." And that's not getting into Cloak and Dagger or maybe Punisher. Also a full Mega Man and X-Men team would be cool to see again after a good while.
 
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drag0nscythe

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I dont mind being a buzz kill, but marvel vs capcom is not smash ultimate.
(And side note donte is the one that would be in mvc4).
Back to smash.

We will have events again. I want one where you fight all the kirby hats.

And dlc events.
 
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kylexv

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Just for fun, here is the distribution of characters by gender in Ultimate:

Male: :ultmario::ultdk::ultlink::ultyoshi::ultkirby::ultfox::ultluigi::ultness::ultfalcon::ultbowser::ultdoc::ultfalco::ultmarth::ultyounglink::ultganondorf::ultroy::ultchrom::ultgnw::ultmetaknight::ultpit::ultdarkpit::ultwario::ultsnake::ultike::ultdiddy::ultlucas::ultsonic::ultkingdedede::ultolimar::ulttoonlink::ultwolf::ultmegaman::ultlittlemac::ultpacman::ultshulk::ultbowserjr::ultduckhunt::ultryu::ultken::ultcloud::ultridley::ultsimon::ultrichter::ultkrool:

Female: :ultsamus::ultpeach::ultdaisy::ultsheik::ultzelda::ultlucina::ultzss::ultrosalina::ultpalutena::ultbayonetta::ultisabelle:

Both Genders: :ultpikachu::ulticeclimbers::ultpokemontrainer::ultvillager::ultwiifittrainer::ultmiifighters::ultrobin::ultcorrin::ultinkling:

Gender Unknown: :ultjigglypuff::ultpichu::ultlucario::ultgreninja::ultincineroar::ultpiranha:

Genderless: :ultdarksamus::ultmewtwo::ultrob:
 
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Dcas

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Smash is big enough that the momentum built up through E3 and the August direct will likely carry it until close to release; even if the marketing department do nothing, journalistic venues (like, for example, Gamexplain) and gaming channels/theorists (e.g. Alpharad, RelaxAlax, Billybae10K Billybae10K and the like) will keep it in the public eye (outlets like Etika rely on new content to make reactions).

Also, don't forget that Smash Ultimate is being marketed in the real world, showing up at Gaming Tournaments and Conventions.

That being said, huge series like Smash are the only Video Game franchises that this strategy can work for. Low amounts of marketing have killed lesser games (e.g. Golden Sun Dark Dawn).
Yeah, thats the point they can only pull this because smash will sell millions even if they dont market it. Plus the marketing on the real world is giving the demo which is the same from almost 5 months ago. They could have released footage of newcomers fighting ala snake vs krool or stuff like that, filling the gap with small content of previously shown info would have done wonders.

But oh well, nintendo being nintendo.
 
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D

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I doubt MVCI is getting updated to MVC4, but what does Geno have to do with it? You should've bet on Ken or something.

That said, Verg's Marvel info, and info based on any game that isn't Smash seems flimsy at best.
You gotta bet the big bucks, chief. :cool:
Here's how Capcom should save Mahvel:

3-v-3
X-Men
UMVC3 artstyle
"EVERYONE IS HERE!"

Boom, Marvel VS. Capcom 4.
 

Robertman2

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I dont mind being a buzz kill, but marvel vs capcom is not smash ultimate.
(And side note donte is the one that would be in mvc4).
Back to smash.

We will have events again. I want one where tou fight all yhe kirby hats.

And dlc events.
Why would Donte be in Mahvel 4? If anything, it'd be old man Dante
 

Graizen

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I have a question for you guys, me and my friend talked about this today...

Do you guys think the mention of "Ash" in the Greninja Blog, means we may have more Anime related things in Smash now?
 

Knight Dude

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I dont mind being a buzz kill, but marvel vs capcom is not smash ultimate.
(And side note donte is the one that would be in mvc4).
Back to smash.

We will have events again. I want one where you fight all the kirby hats.

And dlc events.
Events seem like a given, since they don't require a ton of new resources(compared to Adventure/Subspace), and have been in every game, barring the 3DS version, but Smash 4 on Wii U had so I say it counts.
 

drag0nscythe

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Just for fun, here is the distribution of characters by gender in Ultimate:

Male: :ultmario::ultdk::ultlink::ultyoshi::ultkirby::ultfox::ultluigi::ultness::ultfalcon::ultbowser::ultdoc::ultfalco::ultmarth::ultyounglink::ultganondorf::ultroy::ultchrom::ultgnw::ultmetaknight::ultpit::ultdarkpit::ultwario::ultsnake::ultike::ultdiddy::ultlucas::ultsonic::ultkingdedede::ultolimar::ulttoonlink::ultwolf::ultmegaman::ultlittlemac::ultpacman::ultshulk::ultbowserjr::ultduckhunt::ultryu::ultcloud::ultridley::ultsimon::ultrichter::ultkrool:

Female: :ultsamus::ultpeach::ultdaisy::ultsheik::ultzelda::ultlucina::ultzss::ultrosalina::ultpalutena::ultbayonetta::ultisabelle:

Both Genders: :ultpikachu::ulticeclimbers::ultpokemontrainer::ultvillager::ultwiifittrainer::ultmiifighters::ultrobin:ultcorrin::ultinkling:

Gender Unknown: :ultjigglypuff::ultpichu::ultlucario::ultgreninja:

Genderless: :ultdarksamus::ultmewtwo::ultrob:
It is good to see the female count rise. For dlc, i want to see more female characters. Would be nice.

And goemon. Him to.

Is duck huntreally male?
 
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Knight Dude

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I have a question for you guys, me and my friend talked about this today...

Do you guys think the mention of "Ash" in the Greninja Blog, means we may have more Anime related things in Smash now?
It likely doesn't mean much as Ash Greninja did exist in games. And even if it did debut in the anime, it's Pokemon, a series that started out as a game, let alone being owned by Nintendo. Misty and Oak's trophies in Melee were based on their anime designs not their game designs. AND a ton of Pokemon use their anime voices, but not their game cries.
 

KingofKoopas

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It is good to see the female count rise. For dlc, i want to see more female characters. Would be nice.

And goemon. Him to.

Is duck huntreally male?
It would appear the duck is at least.. Seems to be a Mallard.
Male Mallards have colorful head plumage and singular colored bodies whereas females are brown and spotted all over.
 

drag0nscythe

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It likely doesn't mean much as Ash Greninja did exist in games. And even if it did debut in the anime, it's Pokemon, a series that started out as a game, let alone being owned by Nintendo. Misty and Oak's trophies in Melee were based on their anime designs not their game designs. AND a ton of Pokemon use their anime voices, but not their game cries.
Some of those cries are the sound of nightmares.

I hooe for pokemon anime trophies. One of team rocket would be nice. and always mewtwos armor.
 
D

Deleted member

Guest
"EVERYONE IS HERE" for Marvel would result in god-awful balancing with over 100 characters
If Sakurai can balance - to a certain extent - 80 characters, and Square Enix OF ALL COMPANIES balances 200 characters in Tobal 2, Capcom should really go for the Smash Ultimate route and just bite the pillow to save a ****ton of face. Especially after saying that "characters are just functions", and they've been lambasted for that ever since. Like, how dumb do you have to be to say that, as a developer for the game? That's like saying "King K. Rool is really only just a function for Smash," like get the **** out of here lmao
 

ErenJager

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I doubt MVCI is getting updated to MVC4, but what does Geno have to do with it? You should've bet on Ken or something.

That said, Verg's Marvel info, and info based on any game that isn't Smash seems flimsy at best.



I just want to have a team of Spider-Man characters damn it. Spider-Man, Green Goblin AND Venom? That'd be sick. Call it "Spider-Man and His Amazing Enemies." And that's not getting into Cloak and Dagger or maybe Punisher. Also a full Mega Man and X-Men team would be cool to see again after a good while.
Best Spider-Man characters would be
Lizard, Venom, Carnage, Black cat
 

MoonlitIllusion

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Just for fun, here is the distribution of characters by gender in Ultimate:

Male: :ultmario::ultdk::ultlink::ultyoshi::ultkirby::ultfox::ultluigi::ultness::ultfalcon::ultbowser::ultdoc::ultfalco::ultmarth::ultyounglink::ultganondorf::ultroy::ultchrom::ultgnw::ultmetaknight::ultpit::ultdarkpit::ultwario::ultsnake::ultike::ultdiddy::ultlucas::ultsonic::ultkingdedede::ultolimar::ulttoonlink::ultwolf::ultmegaman::ultlittlemac::ultpacman::ultshulk::ultbowserjr::ultduckhunt::ultryu::ultcloud::ultridley::ultsimon::ultrichter::ultkrool:

Female: :ultsamus::ultpeach::ultdaisy::ultsheik::ultzelda::ultlucina::ultzss::ultrosalina::ultpalutena::ultbayonetta::ultisabelle:

Both Genders: :ultpikachu::ulticeclimbers::ultpokemontrainer::ultvillager::ultwiifittrainer::ultmiifighters::ultrobin:ultcorrin::ultinkling:

Gender Unknown: :ultjigglypuff::ultpichu::ultlucario::ultgreninja:

Genderless: :ultdarksamus::ultmewtwo::ultrob:
I'd love to see more female characters tbh, Dixie, Elma, Impa, Krystal (dlc?), Medusa, Jeanne, Tetra, Lara, Chun-Li, Celica, white haired axe girl from the new FE. There's quite a few great options.
 
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Luigi The President

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If Sakurai can balance - to a certain extent - 80 characters, and Square Enix OF ALL COMPANIES balances 200 characters in Tobal 2, Capcom should really go for the Smash Ultimate route and just bite the pillow to save a ****ton of face. Especially after saying that "characters are just functions", and they've been lambasted for that ever since. Like, how dumb do you have to be to say that, as a developer for the game? That's like saying "King K. Rool is really only just a function for Smash," like get the **** out of here lmao
Tobal 2 came out in 1997 when people didn't really care about any sort of balance in fighting games. There were also many less components for a given character in Tobal 2.
80 characters, including Echoes, semi-clones and all that isn't all that much in comparison to at least 100 unique characters.
 

CosmicQuark

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*Walks back into the Smash forums* *Looks around and sees Marvel vs Capcom everywhere* Did I take a wrong turn?

I guess we're so starved for information about this game, makes sense to talk about others in the meantime. :p

On Smash: CoroCoro, yay or nay? Seems like all of the ones rumored by Verge could potentially come without a stage. Yet, it's been about a month without a correction, and I can't see them going this long with what's potentially false advertising. If it were true, I'd expect them to be silent. I vote yay.
 

Ramen Tengoku

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Marvel Vs Capcom 4 won't be truly amazing until they finally add Squirrel Girl
Then again, she may be a bit op,
We're talking about a character who managed to beat Thanos without breaking a sweat
 
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drag0nscythe

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Speaking if square, a dlc character i would like ia kain from legacy of kain. But he would be more suited for mortal kombat.
 

Idon

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Everyone is Here for Mahvel would be stupid as hell considering they shoved half the SF2 cast into the earlier entries. Aint nobody wants to see those resources wasted on goddamn DHALSIM of all characters.
 
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