Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Knight Dude]

So I have a question. Between ,:ultrobin,and , which one would you keep in Smash?

Ike. I use him a fair bit.

Though to be clear, I would throw most other FE characters into the trash if it also meant keeping Robin too.

 

[Deleted member]

Spoiler

How's this now?

>Sonic is still in

Ｇａｒｂａｇｅ

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

What I don’t understand is what the appeal of a Smash reboot would be for a wider audience.

While i’ve always moved to the newest game, i’m going to have to have an extremely compelling reason to leave Ultimate behind for a future Smash game that has fewer characters, stages, and mode options, and that doesn’t allow me to play as non-Nintendo characters like Cloud and Snake. You can’t just take that stuff away without consequence.

This topic comes up every once in awhile, and despite everybody saying, “a reboot is inevitable!” I disagree. That doesn’t mean I think the next Smash will be MUGEN levels of content, but I think this game will be kept alive through DLC for an extended period of time, and the next Smash game won’t be out for a long, long time.

Basically, I don’t think it makes sense to reboot Smash in the way people suggest. Yeah, there’s a lot in the game currently. That’s why people love the games, because of the vast amount of different characters you can play as. To take that away and remove nearly half of all the characters you’ve been able to play as previously?

No thanks! I’ll just play this Smash game that has over 70 characters and gameplay that has advanced techniques of its own over a game that gives me roughly half the value for the same price.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

On the AT issue, I'm on the stance that it IS possible to upgrade them, but the staff won't feel like doing it anyway and prefer to focus elsewhere.

Monkey’s paw wish: We get a Captain Falcon character action game, but it’s only PUBLISHED by Platinum. The game development is outsourced to Ninja Theory.

I can deal with this, I hear NT is good with stories that aren't DmC's.

 

[TheKnight]

The lack of non-Kanto Pokémon is bleh.

That, and Pokemon only having 2 reps.

 

[TheCJBrine]

If Pikmin 4 would finally release, I think Olimar could make it into a Smash Bros. reboot.

 

[Deleted member]

Spoiler

How's this now?

I like it. I think it does a good job of representing Nintendo's biggest series with at least one character, while also keeping some of the core fan favorites for the larger series.

EDIT: Oh, I didn't notice Samus was gone at first. I'd definitely keep her and Ridley, TBH.
DOUBLE EDIT: I'd probably exchange Chrom for another Pokemon as well.

 

[praline]

Spoiler

How's this now?

Assuming you just forgot Samus it’s good except Pokemon not having 4 like Mario makes no sense, it’s the second biggest series there’s no way it would have less than Kirby, Fire Emblem and Zelda.

 

[RandomAce]

Wait, what? What did Verg say for people in Isaac's thread to have a meltdown over him? Did he de-confirm him or anything?
Sorry if I sound like a jerk here, but I don't want to bother reading that thread after that part about "Vergeben used autistic as an insult, he's Satan now!".

I think he talked about how doesn’t visit GameFAQs anymore because they keep throwing stuff at him recently.

But I think the thing that got people angry was when he said that the Smash community is a denial driven community and that people who do think that Incineroar is in are in denial.

I mean A) It’s GameFAQs lol. And B) It came off to some people thinking that he was angry for people not believing in him.

That’s basically the gist of it. That’s all Vergeben said recently.

 

[Nemuresu]

Lol no. Hell, pretty sure he defended Isaac and Golden Sun

It's mostly what you said.

Decided to look for the comment that angered them so much:

Okay, what the hell? The comment is mean-spirited, yes, but what does this has to do with Isaac at all?
Then again, maybe I shouldn't have too many expectations from the same fanbase that harassed him over a Pokémon song being uploaded to the site and started to grasp at an old leak that he himself debunked before the game was even announced to call him a fraud.

Sometimes I'd like to think Smash communities have gotten much better now that they don't abuse the word "salt" to gather attention with toxicity, but then stuff like this happens and I retract that idea.

Spoiler

Smashboards' fine though. I don't have any complaints about this site.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

I can't see Sakurai cutting out Palutena. She's one of his babies.

is a different story though.

He wouldn’t cut Dark Pit either...as he is also one of his babies

Spoiler

How's this now?

needs / and ...also and replace with both ultlucina:...and add ...and also

 

[KingofPhantoms]

I see tons of people saying that a reboot is a direction the series could go in, and many of them saying that it very likely will happen if production of new Smash games continue after Ultimate's release.

Sometime ago I stopped and actually thought about this: what exactly does "reboot" mean, here? What are some of you actually envisioning for a reboot of Smash? What does that mean to you?

Smash is just a fighter game that only occasionally gives a you a clear story. Heck, aside from the fact that we don't know if Ultimate has a story mode of it's own or not, Brawl is the only game that had any kind of actual story going on. The rest of it primarily amounts to "Nintendo and other video game characters come to life from trophies or toys and beat the crap out of each other across each other's worlds as part of a fighting competition or just for pure fun". There's not much to "reboot" in that regard.

As it is now, I personally don't see why some kind of "reboot" is necessary. It'll probably be many years from now if Ultimate is a serious hit, which I think it will be, but even so, they could just as easily give us a new a game with different and new content much later down the road, just like they have with every previous entry in the series. We always get new content, some content gets changed, and we lose some past content as well. Unless you want to change Smash's whole gimmick or it's iconic gameplay entirely, for whatever reason, what is a reboot actually going to do to it? What do you have in mind for it? How will it be any different from just making another follow-up to the last game? Even if something about it is very different (Say, maybe a much more minimalistic roster) is there any reason to refer to it as a "reboot" instead of just referring to it as another new entry in the series?

I don't know, maybe some of you can change my mind. I just don't see what they'd have to gain from "rebooting" Smash, nor do I know what folks are actually thinking a reboot of Smash will be like.

 

[ThatOneAnon]

I think he talked about how doesn’t visit GameFAQs anymore because they keep throwing stuff at him.

But I think the thing that got people angry was when he said that the Smash community is a denial driven community and that people who didn’t think Incineroar was in are in denial.

I mean A) It’s GameFAQs lol. And B) It came off as him thinking that he was angry for people not believing in him.

I mean, he’s 100% correct.

 

[Opossum]

Just saying, I don't see these guys ever leaving under any circumstances.

(at least one of :ultrobin)
(in some form)

Like, those are the ones I'd say are in even if it's the smallest reboot of just these guys. Granted I'd hate it if Smash were to ever get to that point, especially since this worst case scenario doesn't even have third parties.

 

[NineS]

I don't get it why WOULDNT sephiroth be likely in smash. Cloud is in, and Square loves throwing him in as fanservice in everything. Kingdom Hearts, Dissidia featured him prominently.. Then there was the whole advent children movie being made just for an excuse to have Cloud and Sephiroth duke it out in the silver screen, why wouldnt square want nintendo to make it so the two settle it in smash?

Spoiler

How's this now?

This seems fine to me. I'd imagine we could see 3rd party characters down the line as DLC if it did ever happen.
Though, I would add in the echoes of the characters we already have, seeing as echoes are far easier to make, and from what Sakurai has said, don't really "take up slots". So, with that being said, I would likely expect Roy to be thrown back in, since Chrom is mostly based off of Roy, and Dark Pit and Dark Samus back in too. . . Unless they were to become something other than echoes, in which case, keep them out.

Also, Jigglypuff.

 

[LetterO]

Spoiler

How's this now?

Lack of Metroid and Megaman as well as having Chrom and Isabelle instead of Robin and Villager are my biggest gripes with this.

 

[Deleted member]

I don't get the appeal of theorising on a "Smash reboot". Actually, I din't get the appeal of theorising anything related to cuts in general. Is it fun? No. Is it necessary? Does it add anything to speculation? Also no.

 

[amazonevan19]

Well the post was indeed Greninja, though I still think the leak is fake af. 8 characters (including echoes) left? Not counting DLC? Yeah no. I kinda wish it was real but guessing Greninja was the most obvious guess in the world for anyone who did even a scintilla of homework.

 

[Diem]

What I don’t understand is what the appeal of a Smash reboot would be for a wider audience.

While i’ve always moves to the newest game, i’m going to have to have an extremely compelling reason to leave a future Smash game that has fewer characters, stages, and mode options, and that doesn’t allow me to play as non-Nintendo characters like Cloud and Snake. You can’t just take that stuff away without consequence.

This topic comes up every once in awhile, and despite everybody saying, “a reboot is inevitable!” I disagree. That doesn’t mean I think the next Smash will be MUGEN levels of content, but I think this game will be kept alive through DLC for an extended period of time, and the next Smash game won’t be out for a long, long time.

Basically, I don’t think it makes sense to reboot Smash in the way people suggest. Yeah, there’s a lot in the game currently. That’s why people love the games, because of the vast amount of different characters you can play as. To take that away and remove nearly half of all the characters you’ve been able to play as previously?

No thanks! I’ll just play this Smash game that has over 70 characters and gameplay that has advanced techniques of its own over a game that gives me roughly half the value for the same price.

Sakurai said that, in the decision to choose what direction to go for this Smash game, it was either bring back all the characters, or cut the roster down to about 1/3 the size and focus on more new characters and revamped gameplay:

We had a choice between completely overhauling the game systems and feel, or working off of what we had established in the last game. We ended up going with the latter. If we went with the former, we might have ended up with only a third of the fighters we have now. Had we gone down that route, surely some fans would have complained and said, “I preferred the way it was last time.” We’ll have to face that decision again someday, but I decided that now was not that time.

So it sounds like a reboot is in the cards anyways. Sakurai just made the wise decision to seize the opportunity to make Ultimate and make it the final Smash game in the "classic" series.

I agree, though, that whatever next game they make is going to have to try really hard to live up to Ultimate. Because it'll probably be just a barebones veteran cast with a 10-20 newcomers I probably won't care about nearly as much as I do for Dark Samus and Ridley. Ridley at least has a shot at being in future games due to his legacy, but Dark Samus is probably never coming back. It's a miracle she's here for Ultimate in the first place.

I have a feeling that Ultimate is going to live on like Melee does due to its cast and content alone.

 

[Pazzo.]

Sakurai is trending towards more characters, he'd probably see a reboot as a step backwards.

 

[Potato_]

What I don’t understand is what the appeal of a Smash reboot would be for a wider audience.

While i’ve always moved to the newest game, i’m going to have to have an extremely compelling reason to leave Ultimate behind for a future Smash game that has fewer characters, stages, and mode options, and that doesn’t allow me to play as non-Nintendo characters like Cloud and Snake. You can’t just take that stuff away without consequence.

This topic comes up every once in awhile, and despite everybody saying, “a reboot is inevitable!” I disagree. That doesn’t mean I think the next Smash will be MUGEN levels of content, but I think this game will be kept alive through DLC for an extended period of time, and the next Smash game won’t be out for a long, long time.

Basically, I don’t think it makes sense to reboot Smash in the way people suggest. Yeah, there’s a lot in the game currently. That’s why people love the games, because of the vast amount of different characters you can play as. To take that away and remove nearly half of all the characters you’ve been able to play as previously?

No thanks! I’ll just play this Smash game that has over 70 characters and gameplay that has advanced techniques of its own over a game that gives me roughly half the value for the same price.

I've raised this point in the past and come to a similar conclusion. Even Sakurai's comments on a future game suggest that he himself has no idea on what they'll do in the future. It's this reason in particular that makes me confident in a long DLC plan for Ultimate.

If they do plan on a reboot in the far future, I'd imagine there'd have to be some sort of change big enough to warrant the move over. Perhaps this would be to the series' core mechanics, which would make it different enough to feel like a brand new experience without fans feeling like they're "missing out on characters".

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Assuming you just forgot Samus it’s good except Pokemon not having 4 like Mario makes no sense, it’s the second biggest series there’s no way it would have less than Kirby, Fire Emblem and Zelda.

I had forgotten about them. I'm getting back to work on it. Let me try again.

Spoiler

:ultrobin

Decided to throw five more in for the heck of it.

 

[Deleted member]

I don't get the appeal of theorising on a "Smash reboot". Actually, I din't get the appeal of theorising anything related to cuts in general. Is it fun? No. Is it necessary? Does it add anything to speculation? Also no.

I think it's an interesting what if, but to each their own, I suppose. I'm not really seriously thinking about the next Smash anyway, as it probably won't come for a long, LONG time. Like, maybe even a decade long.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Lack of Metroid and Megaman as well as having Chrom and Isabelle instead of Robin and Villager are my biggest gripes with this.

Well tbf...Isabelle is better

Well the post was indeed Greninja, though I still think the leak is fake af. 8 characters (including echoes) left? Not counting DLC? Yeah no. I kinda wish it was real but guessing Greninja was the most obvious guess in the world for anyone who did even a scintilla of homework.

How and Why was Greninja being today’s post obvious?

 

[LetterO]

Well tbf...Isabelle is better

How and Why was Greninja being today’s post obvious?

Isabelle's only been in one main game vs Villager being the character you play as

Also Greninja was obvious due to today being the anniversary of X and Y.

 

[Deleted member]

Decided to look for the comment that angered them so much:

Okay, what the hell? The comment is mean-spirited, yes, but what does this has to do with Isaac at all?
Then again, maybe I shouldn't have too many expectations from the same fanbase that harassed him over a Pokémon song being uploaded to the site and started to grasp at an old leak that he himself debunked before the game was even announced to call him a fraud.

Sometimes I'd like to think Smash communities have gotten much better now that they don't abuse the word "salt" to gather attention with toxicity, but then stuff like this happens and I retract that idea.

Spoiler

Smashboards' fine though. I don't have any complaints about this site.

I've said this in the Isaac thread, but this seems like a more fitting area to post this, too.

Vergeben should've expected this. This is Smash, the reach of this franchise is unbelievably astronomical. Legit, this is just the Captain Zack / Lima EVO Grand Finals situation but continuing far longer than it any should. Does he have a right to be mad? Of course. Did he go about it the completely wrong way and should've worded things much better? Yes and yes. There really isn't any arguing about this, it's common ****ing sense. Just like when Zack flipped off the crowd, it's HIS decision to continue going onto GameFAQs (which, I don't know why people do in the first place), it's HIS decision for "leaking" information, and it was HIS decision to act this way.

At the end of the day, really only an anonymous 4chan user, Nintendo themselves and Loz18 leaked stuff about Smash Ultimate, y'all should direct your grievances over to those guys.

 

[Opossum]

Lack of Metroid and Megaman as well as having Chrom and Isabelle instead of Robin and Villager are my biggest gripes with this.

I mean, I don't think it would ever come down to it, but if they HAD to choose to keep only one of Villager/Isabelle, I'm 100% sure they'd keep Isabelle.

You keep the Pikachu over the Pokémon Trainer.

 

[Pazzo.]

Sakurai said that, in the decision to choose what direction to go for this Smash game, it was either bring back all the characters, or cut the roster down to about 1/3 the size and focus on more new characters and revamped gameplay:



So it sounds like a reboot is in the cards anyways. Sakurai just made the wise decision to seize the opportunity to make Ultimate and make it the final Smash game in the "classic" series.

I agree, though, that whatever next game they make is going to have to try really hard to live up to Ultimate. Because it'll probably be just a barebones veteran cast with a 10-20 newcomers I probably won't care about nearly as much as I do for Dark Samus and Ridley. Ridley at least has a shot at being in future games due to his legacy, but Dark Samus is probably never coming back. It's a miracle she's here for Ultimate in the first place.

I have a feeling that Ultimate is going to live on like Melee does due to its cast and content alone.

And here it is. Sakurai knows to cut that much is to regress and may have to eventually do it.

Honestly why not just port Ultimate with a few more characters/stages each time? Why cut the roster down when we only care about characters?

 

[ThatOneAnon]

I don't get the appeal of theorising on a "Smash reboot". Actually, I din't get the appeal of theorising anything related to cuts in general. Is it fun? No. Is it necessary? Does it add anything to speculation? Also no.

It’s because that if there is a new Smash game, there’ll be cuts, and that people seem to legitimately think a reboot is the only logical direction for the series to go. Nobody WANTS that to happen, but they think it will.
You of all people should know this, seeing as how much you talk about the box theory. It’s the same thing as that, simply a way to temper people’s expectations. Just that this is doing that way, way ahead of time.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Who I'm hoping for bosses from all the respective franchises featured so far.

Super Mario Bros.: King Boo
Donkey Kong: Tiki Tong
The Legend of Zelda: Majora
Metroid: Kanden, Noxus, Spire, Sylux, Trace and Weavel (You fight them all at once)
Yoshi: N/A
Kirby: Marx
StarFox: General Scales w/ King RedEye
Pokemon: Giratina or Necomaza
EarthBound: Giygas
F-Zero: Deathborn
Ice Climbers: N/A
Fire Emblem: Black Knight
Game & Watch: N/A
Kid Icarus: Hades
WarioWare: N/A
Metal Gear Solid: Metal Gear REX
Sonic: Dr. Eggman
Pikmin: N/A
R.O.B.: N/A
Animal Crossing: N/A
Mega Man: N/A
Wii Fit: N/A
Punch-Out!!: N/A
Mii: N/A
Pac-Man: N/A
Xenoblade Chronicles: Metal Face
Duck Hunt: N/A
Street Fighter: N/A
Final Fantasy VII: Sephiroth
Bayonetta: N/A
Splatoon: N/A

 

[Mellowy Yellow]

New leak not showing off a character, but a trophy from the game: http://boards.4chan.org/v/thread/434898047

 

[Deleted member]

Robin. He's the most unique and I like him the best. Ike comes very close though. It's a really tough call between the two of them.

Corrin's counter pisses me off.

Ike first, because I love big swords and his play style. Landing any attack feels so satisfying.

Corrin second, because he's a bloody dragon-human hybrid thing (I don't know the lore) which is so bad ***.

Robin third, because I don't care for the design or the moveset or how slow they move.

Honestly if Smash got rebooted there's a good chance Ultimate will be my last Smash game. Series loyalty only goes so far.


Absolutely Ike. You don't just cut Fire Emblem's most popular character, even if he isn't my personal favorite.

I'd probably keep too. Either him or . I don't like either him or :ultrobin, so when it comes to choosing between the two avatar characters, I pick because I think he has the better moveset.

Well looks like I have some work to do with my reboot roster.

Don't feel bad. Besides, whatever you come up, it's bound to be leauges more accepted than whatever I come up with .

 

[Opossum]

Vergeben should've expected this.

That's victim blaming though.

 

[Deleted member]

Lack of Metroid and Megaman as well as having Chrom and Isabelle instead of Robin and Villager are my biggest gripes with this.

If I had to choose between the two, I'd definitely go with Isabelle. She has a lot more personality thanks to not being an avatar character and is practically the new mascot of the AC series, but to each their own. I like Villager too, it's just that I think Isabelle makes a better face to represent the series. Plus, she's really, really cute and I would hate to ever see her get cut.

 

[Zinith]

Who I'm hoping for bosses from all the respective franchises featured so far.

Super Mario Bros.: King Boo
Donkey Kong: Tiki Tong
The Legend of Zelda: Majora
Metroid: Kanden, Noxus, Spire, Sylux, Trace and Weavel (You fight them all at once)
Yoshi: N/A
Kirby: Marx
StarFox: General Scales w/ King RedEye
Pokemon: Giratina or Necomaza
EarthBound: Giygas
F-Zero: Deathborn
Ice Climbers: N/A
Fire Emblem: Black Knight
Game & Watch: N/A
Kid Icarus: Hades
WarioWare: N/A
Metal Gear Solid: Metal Gear REX
Sonic: Dr. Eggman
Pikmin: N/A
R.O.B.: N/A
Animal Crossing: N/A
Mega Man: N/A
Wii Fit: N/A
Punch-Out!!: N/A
Mii: N/A
Pac-Man: N/A
Xenoblade Chronicles: Metal Face
Duck Hunt: N/A
Street Fighter: N/A
Final Fantasy VII: Sephiroth
Bayonetta: N/A
Splatoon: N/A

You don't have any from Yoshi's series, despite boss battles being one of the highlights?

 

[Dcas]

Look at this nonsense:

Decided to look for the comment that angered them so much:

Okay, what the hell? The comment is mean-spirited, yes, but what does this has to do with Isaac at all?
Then again, maybe I shouldn't have too many expectations from the same fanbase that harassed him over a Pokémon song being uploaded to the site and started to grasp at an old leak that he himself debunked before the game was even announced to call him a fraud.

Sometimes I'd like to think Smash communities have gotten much better now that they don't abuse the word "salt" to gather attention with toxicity, but then stuff like this happens and I retract that idea.

Spoiler

Smashboards' fine though. I don't have any complaints about this site.

He has a super valid point tho. I wonder whats the average age of people within this community is (i really hope is people between 15-20), i cant fathom how some people think in here.

 

[NineS]

New leak not showing off a character, but a trophy from the game: http://boards.4chan.org/v/thread/434898047

For those who are too lazy to see the image or don't know how to:

I think it's fake. It looks less like a render or 3D model and more like really well done fanart.

 

[Glaciacott]

Since that rather rude Vergeben comment got brought up, I have a question for people here.

Would you say that vergeben leaking content has made this Smash cycle better or worse?

I know for me sometimes I feel ok about knowing and not getting overhyped and then disappointed. But other times I can't help but think about how much excitement dies down and how some surprises just won't exist anymore.
Like, I remember how huge a deal it was when Mewtwo was expect, and instead it was Greninja. That was such a golden moment in the Smash 4 hype train, especially since we eventually still got Mewtwo. Now Incineroar doesn't quite get that because Vergeben decided to procedurally shoot down Decidueye, Lycanroc and Mimikyu and then pulled the trigger on Incineroar happening. Now his trailer is going to be just a "oh, it's incineroar" situation.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

You don't have any from Yoshi's series, despite boss battles being one of the highlights?

Don't kill me for this but there's really none I really want from the Yoshi series. *Runs*

 

[LetterO]

I mean, I don't think it would ever come down to it, but if they HAD to choose to keep only one of Villager/Isabelle, I'm 100% sure they'd keep Isabelle.

You keep the Pikachu over the Pokémon Trainer.

Pikachu's been the mascot of the series since the very first game.

Isabelle's only been in one main game and 2-3 spinoffs. Isabelle's currently an icon of AC, yes, but I doubt they'd add her over the main character. Otherwise they would've added her in Smash 4 over Villager.