Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Crooked Crow]

I mean if you think wrestling tigers who can set themselves on fire are wack...
Oh wait! that's the coolest thing ever!

Blacephalon for Smash please.

 

[Luigi The President]

I feel 3 uniques and 2-3 Echoes isn't too impossible.

Incineroar, Steve, the SE rep, alongside Ken, Shadow, and maybe Dixie.

Don't know why this is so implausible to some.

 

[TyrantLizardKing]

Ah that Shantae amiibo is just a mockup, a shame cause I’d totally buy it. Need to play more Shantae games, the only one I have is Pirate’s Curse on Wii U. Haven’t gotten too far but I’ve really enjoyed what I’ve played.

I’m expecting her to be an Assist Trophy honestly.

 

[Cosmic77]

I mean if you think wrestling tigers who can set themselves on fire are wack...
Oh wait! that's the coolest thing ever!

Spoiler

But not as cool as the Cheeto Puff doggo that can control rocks.

...But seriously, Incineroar is cool, but I'd love him a whole lot more if he wasn't a starter. Kinda burnt out on starters, no pun intented.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

*Looks at avatar*
I’ve barely discuss them here. There’s a lot of things that support them for being the possible newcomers. I know that Vergeben is why they haven’t been discussed that much here anymore (and why only 1 character is discussed at this point), but with the things I (and some others) have gathered about them, I think there’s a lot going in their favor that still makes them likely.

Yeah, I remember rooting for them and Mimikyu because Incineroar seemed unlikely and I didn't want Decidueye as the Gen 7 Rep.
But with Tony the Tiger looking much more likely, I kinda shrugged off Lycanroc, because I really didn't need him anymore. But yeah, they're still pretty likely

Incineroar is such a wack choice for Smash.

Come back when he gets revealed, then we'll talk.

 

[AreJay25]

How good was Pac-Man's utilt in Smash 4 anyway? Was it an important combo move or something that we should all be mourning the loss of, or is that nerf to it's range just a minor setback that won't really make an impact in the grand scheme of things?

I don't play Pac-Man so I wouldn't know.

It's mainly used for Hydrant setups. It wasn't that great otherwise.

 

[Noipoi]

Spoiler

But not as cool as the Cheeto Puff doggo that can control rocks.

...But seriously, Incineroar is cool, but I'd love him a whole lot more if he wasn't a starter Kinda burnt out on starters, no pun intented.

That's understandable. Starters are created from the ground up to be overly marketed so I can see why some people get sick of them.
But Incineroar is so cool to me I don't even care that he's a starter. It actually makes it better, because he was my starter.
But again, that's just me.

 

[Deleted member]

I don't get it. I lived through the entirety of the Smash 4 cycle without even cheking the daily things, and just looking at the character reveals,, and I felt completely fine. But with this game I just have a huge need for news, even though the wait time is much, much shorter.

That's exactly why it feels harder. It's like watching cookies bake in the oven: You know it's only going to take a little bit of time, but the longer you stare at them, the more minutes start feeling like hours.

 

[Knight Dude]

If we do get a new Pokemon, Incineroar or Buzzwole are the only choices that matter. Ghost Owl too, but he was "confirmed"(if you can call a leaker saying they aren't in as such) not on the roster.

 

[Crooked Crow]

Yeah, I remember rooting for them and Mimikyu because Incineroar seemed unlikely and I didn't want Decidueye as the Gen 7 Rep.
But with Tony the Tiger looking much more likely, I kinda shrugged off Lycanroc, because I really didn't need him anymore. But yeah, they're still pretty likely

Come back when he gets revealed, then we'll talk.

Haha, enjoy your boring grappler character.

 

[Noipoi]

Haha, enjoy your boring grappler character.

I will, thank you!

 

[Crooked Crow]

I will, thank you!

No problem, fanboy.

 

[fiddlefaddle199x]

I genuinely feel that the remaining base roster will only consist of some combination of these characters:

Geno OR Sora (Geno more likely) - 99% chance
Incineroar - 99% chance
Ken - 99% chance

Shadow - 80% chance

Skull Kid - 60% chance

Banjo OR Steve (Steve more likely) - 50% chance

Isaac - 40% chance

Bandanna Waddle Dee - 30% chance
Dixie - 30% chance
Fire Emblem rep - 30% chance

Rhythm Heaven rep - 20% chance
Xenoblade rep - 20% chance
Rayman - 20% chance



I also feel that at MOST we'll get 4 newcomers and 2 echoes (or 3 and 3) - but I think 4 or 5 characters total feels more likely.

 

[Deleted member]

I will, thank you!

I have a feeling I'm gonna eat some crow for the smack I talked about Incineroar earlier this year. Thing's gonna probably be as goofy and fun as K. Rool is with a sick moveset.

 

[Luigi The President]

No problem, fanboy.

How dare this idiot enjoy a character he wants in the game despite seeing them be put down often. Such a fanboy.

 

[P.Kat]

We need to start a Pac-Man main conservation project.

*Sings In the Arms of an Angel* For just a dollar a day, you can give new hope to Pac mains.

I mean if you think wrestling tigers who can set themselves on fire are wack...
Oh wait! that's the coolest thing ever!

If only Incineroar was a nimble cruiserweight then I'd definitely be more than interested in it, it'd have my attention. I know it's too soon to tell if it's a heavyweight, but with that body? I It just screams slow powerful character, which sadly just doesn't fit my fighting style. T_T

 

[Deleted member]

How dare this idiot enjoy a character he wants in the game despite seeing them be put down often. Such a fanboy.

Didn't you know? People aren't allowed to like things.

Unless they're things I like. Then it's cool.

 

[Noipoi]

I have a feeling I'm gonna eat some crow for the smack I talked about Incineroar earlier this year. Thing's gonna probably be as goofy and fun as K. Rool is with a sick moveset.

That's what i'm thinking will happen.
A lot of Pokemon fans weren't cool with Incineroar until they saw him in action, then they warmed up to him.
I think it'll be the same here.

 

[Graizen]

People go and say: "Agumon is not the best representative from Digimon, put Renamon! Shes great and have alot of Moveset possibilities!"

I imagine if Smash Bros were to be created Today, people would not want Pikachu and instead would want Lucario, Zoroark and alot other Pokes instead of Pikachu.

Some guys don't realy understand how to represent a franchise in a game, at all.

 

[Will]

Haha, enjoy your boring grappler character.

>character
>boring


I don't know how the hell you come to that conclusion if you don't even know what their moveset would be like. The real "boring" characters are clones because they don't have anything new.
That's implying he's in, after all.

 

[Deleted member]

How dare this idiot enjoy a character he wants in the game despite seeing them be put down often. Such a fanboy.

I think we should be concerned with the fact that he's getting too much fuel with all this salt and hate.

 

[Zinith]

People go and say: "Agumon is not the best representative from Digimon, put Renamon! Shes great and have alot of Moveset possibilities!"

I imagine if Smash Bros were to be created Today, people would not want Pikachu and instead would want Lucario, Zoroark and alot other Pokes instead of Pikachu.

Some guys don't realy understand how to represent a franchise in a game, at all.

Um, I've never heard anyone bring up Renamon ever. Is this something from the Agumon thread or something?

 

[Heracr055]

...then they warmed up to him

Go to your room and think about what you did

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

That's understandable. Starters are created from the ground up to be overly marketed so I can see why some people get sick of them.
But Incineroar is so cool to me I don't even care that he's a starter. It actually makes it better, because he was my starter.
But again, that's just me.

It's not just you.
I chose Litten as well, because I love cats andI always wanted a cat starter. Let's just say I hated all of the attention that Rowlet and Decidueye got. I'm a little surprised that Incineroar seems to be the Gen 7 Rep, but I couldn't be happier with any other SM Pokemon.

Also, this isn't the first time this happened for me. I chose Froakie in XY and I never thought that Greninja would have been in Smash 4. Let's just say I was freaking out that day.

Haha, enjoy your boring grappler character.

Are you telling me that hitting people with flaming tables is boring to you?
To each his own, I guess.

 

[Deleted member]

Go to your room and think about what you did

Now now, no need to give him heat over it. :V

 

[Crooked Crow]

How dare this idiot enjoy a character he wants in the game despite seeing them be put down often. Such a fanboy.

Are you mind readers? You'll find out in 2 months regardless. You're just that bored? What's the point? Should I be giving you likes? Speculation is pointless.

 

[Deleted member]

That's what i'm thinking will happen.
A lot of Pokemon fans weren't cool with Incineroar until they saw him in action, then they warmed up to him.
I think it'll be the same here.

Admittedly, most of my salt was caused by being a little tired of Starters at the time and wanting something different for Pokemon, but I admit that was pretty shallow lol. I think Incineroar will be great, I just need to see it in action.

 

[Hydrualic Hydra]

Man, I see should have saved my 'opinions suck' reaction image for somebody else.

 

[lightdrago]

Incineroar gets leaked, people crap on him, people crap on his fans, I feel like I'm feeling a weird sense of deja vu.

Oh right, the Pokemon Sun/Moon speculation period.

 

[Luigi The President]

Are you mind readers? You'll find out in 2 months regardless. You're just that bored? What's the point? Should I be giving you likes? Speculation is pointless.

I don't know why you're suddenly hitting me with the nihilism mix-up when my point was literally just that you don't need to call Noi a fanboy for bringing up his excitement over a character we see put down basically every day in this thread??

But go off I guess, not sure why you're suddenly bringing up "well actually speculation is pointless and you're just bored lol" in response to me implying you shouldn't put people down for enjoying Incineroar?

 

[Graizen]

Um, I've never heard anyone bring up Renamon ever. Is this something from the Agumon thread or something?

It goes like this:
People start talking about Agumon in Smash. On Reddit, Forums, Facebook, Twitter, etc...

Some guys apear with opinions: "No , put Veemon" , "Guilmon is the best for Smash!" , "Put Renamon"

They don't realy understand what the Word "Mascot" means.

 

[RouffWestie]

Haha, enjoy your boring grappler character.

Roses are red
Orchids are pink

 

[Knight Dude]

People go and say: "Agumon is not the best representative from Digimon, put Renamon! Shes great and have alot of Moveset possibilities!"

I imagine if Smash Bros were to be created Today, people would not want Pikachu and instead would want Lucario, Zoroark and alot other Pokes instead of Pikachu.

Some guys don't realy understand how to represent a franchise in a game, at all.

I don't really see people mention Digimon much at all for Smash. I can think of a couple of people aside from you, but most say Agumon.

I would agree that any of them that aren't Agumon or something in his line would be weird though. Maybe Gabumon, but that's still taking Charizard or Blastoise before Pikachu.

 

[Freduardo]

Pokémon in completely subjective terms of likelihood as new characters:

7) A non Buzzwole Ultra beast - UB’s are new.
6) Meowth - Just was a main antagonist in a game, has had long running fan support, and was previously considered
5) Eevee - Just had a game where he was oppposite pikachu. That’s big
4) Buzzwole - UB’s are new. He’s iconic.
3) Tapu Koko - I just feel we’re sleeping on this legendary fighting kickin chicken.
2) Decidueye - Only dismissed because of leakers. Was the top shot before that.
1) Incineroar - New fighting type of wrestling, has too much leak buzz to ignore.

 

[Will]

Speculation is pointless.

And...?
Better than doing nothing at all.

 

[Lynn Eslie]

Even if it's more than a Direct, i think 7 is a bit much. I'd stick with 5 max.



So... to get some discussions started:
what is a character that's not being talked about that much in speculation, you think has a pretty good chance of making it in?

At the risk of starting to sound like a broken record, I feel that KOS-MOS's chances are substantially higher than many people give credit... Of course, making a claim like that with no data to support it would feel to me as though I were doing you all a disservice. Be that as it may, I've compiled a fair bit of speculation fuel in the hopes it may be enough to see her fire lit.

Spoiler: Lynn's KOS-MOS Write-Up

KOS-MOS is a character whose original appearance was in Monolith Soft's flagship game, "Xenosaga Episode I: Der Wille zur Macht" published by Namco. Since this time, she has been established as a mascot of sorts for both companies, making cameo and crossover appearances many times across several platforms.

As for Nintendo platforms -which are most relevant to this particular argument- KOS-MOS has appeared in

-"Xenosaga Episodes I&II" for Nintendo DS (2006)​

-"Super Robot Taisen OG Saga: Endless Frontier" for Nintendo DS (2008)​

-"Project X Zone" for Nintendo 3DS (2012)​

-"Project X Zone 2" for Nintendo 3DS (2015)​

-"Xenoblade Chronicles 2" for Nintendo Switch (2017)​

It is perhaps also noteworthy that both Fiora from Xenoblade Chronicles and Elma from Xenoblade Chronicles X take inspiration from Xenosaga's gynoid savior.

To get into more circumstantial points. Bandai-Namco trademarked "Also Sprach Zerathusdra" in the US 2 months prior to the official announcement for Super Smash Bros. Ultimate at E3. This suggests Bandai-Namco has plans for Xenosaga Episode III moving forward, and implies intent on their part to utilize that trademark in some fashion, such as with a remake, or perhaps a digital port to the Switch.

Regardless, it illustrates Bandai-Namco believes Xenosaga is and/or will soon be quite marketable. To lend further credence to that sentiment, a scale figure for KOS-MOS Re: was announced on July 28th of this year.

​

For reference, the only Xenoblade Chronicles 2 figure to be commissioned prior to KOS-MOS Re: was a coordinated pair for Pyra & Mythra, meaning Xenosaga's gynoid heroine was chosen over fan favorites like Nia and Morag, despite the limited nature of her appearance. Also, as a bit of food for thought: It is not unlikely the KOS-MOS scale figure will be completed and made available right around Smash Ultimate's release date, given production periods.

As for the design itself, it is probable the overall goal for the design was to bring KOS-MOS into the modern day, and to do so in as near to an official capacity as could be achieved without another installment in the Xenosaga series. To accomplish this, Kunihiko Tanaka (KOS-MOS's original designer) was called in. He later provided an article on the process for inclusion in "Production Notes." Two pieces of note being the core idea to display KOS-MOS as "The Symbol of Xenosaga" as well as the Re: in KOS-MOS Re: standing for "refrain", or the idea of being "born again."

It is also potentially of note that KOS-MOS, as a cameo, has been supported with further content in Patch 1.5.1 and Patch 1.5.2. She also received special character art with the release of Torna the Golden Country.

[Disclaimer: This is Purely my own Speculation]​

While those points may mean little in isolation, taken in unison suggests intention. I personally find it worth highlighting that completely re-designing KOS-MOS solely to include her in Xenoblade Chronicles 2 was entirely unnecessary. Neither V1 nor V4 would have appeared out of place within XC2's aesthetics, and any alterations to her design would need be cleared by Namco at every turn. That is to say, Monolith would diverted what many would consider an excess of resources, all for a cameo. This, in addition to the scale figure mentioned prior, alludes toward KOS-MOS Re: being put forth as a definitive design moving forward, so we should expect to see more of it in the future.

(Also, specifically in regards to Smash Brothers, it is not unlikely that KOS-MOS had been suggested by both Namco and Monolith before, but that V4 was turned down for being too risque for Sakurai's tastes. This re-imagining of her is far more in line with Nintendo's philosophies.)

It is fairly long, but if you're curious -even if only in the hopes of picking apart and rebutting it- feedback would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Deleted member]

I feel 3 uniques and 2-3 Echoes isn't too impossible.

Incineroar, Steve, the SE rep, alongside Ken, Shadow, and maybe Dixie.

Don't know why this is so implausible to some.

Perfectly balanced.

 

[Luigi The President]

It goes like this:
People start talking about Agumon in Smash. On Reddit, Forums, Facebook, Twitter, etc...

Some guys apear with opinions: "No , put Veemon" , "Guilmon is the best for Smash!" , "Put Renamon"

They don't realy understand what the Word "Mascot" means.

Not gonna lie you are literally the only reason I know any of these characters names

 

[Deleted member]

Methinks Crooked Crow be baitin'. Let's agree to disagree, and look at this cute picture of Callie instead:

Spoiler

 

[Deleted member]

It goes like this:
People start talking about Agumon in Smash. On Reddit, Forums, Facebook, Twitter, etc...

Some guys apear with opinions: "No , put Veemon" , "Guilmon is the best for Smash!" , "Put Renamon"

They don't realy understand what the Word "Mascot" means.

That happens with every character suggested for Smash, don't worry about it.