Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[xAquaCrystal]

Let's play a game.

What will Smash characters dress as this Halloween?

I'll start: Ness is going as a ghost. Lucas is also going as a ghost but he cut too many eye holes in his sheet.

Link is going to be dressed as Peter Pan and Zelda as tinkerbell for Halloween

 

[NextChannelGames]

Part of me actually hopes that such a direct would be on November 6th, if only to heighten the chance that a certain leak involving Phoenix Wright is legit.

Wait... Phoenix Wright leak? O.o

 

[Fenriraga]

This will probably get me yelled at since people treat Assist Trophies on a higher regard but considering how Pokeball Pokemon come and go at seemingly random with every Smash game, What if Sakurai treats Assist Trophies more or less the same way? Some stay, some get upgraded to playable or get a different role, and some are just cut/replaced just because?

Just my two cents on that...

No one is denying that that's a very real possibility. After all, that's what happened to Issac from Brawl to 4.

Still, the point is that many of the missing Assists this time around are very popular characters. Cutting some lesser assists makes sense, but cutting, for example, Shadow, one of the most popular anti heroes in all of gaming, just because? That doesn't really make a lot of sense, especially since Shadow is literally as easy as "have him stand in one place and give him the effect of the timer item". They cut Isabelle out, and look and behold...

Obviously that still doesn't mean much since it's just speculation. But still.

 

[Paperchampion23]

Reason we may end up with 79 characters (2 uniques, 3 echos left or 3 uniques, 2 echos) including echos is to fill in the last slot as a "?" random pick. At least that's what I'm thinking.








ultshulk:
TBA TBA
TBA TBA TBA Random

Don't know just a thought is all...

Or you know, we could get exactly 8 more to get 80 characters and make that nice little select you got going there perfect save for a Random slot

I'll keep dreaming

Edit: the only way I could see it happening is if we get a trailer next week, revealing 1 or 2 characters, then Sakurai proceeds to surprise us at the final direct

 

[kylexv]

What weird is that not knowing really anything about the single player in Smash Ultimate is killing me more than not knowing the full roster yet.

Maybe it's because I'm expecting only Ken and Incineroar, but idk.

 

[Wyoming]

Nah, they just need to make an actually good Mario Party like the peak of the series mp6
I wonder if they'll go the Game Freak route of guaranteed profit and remake an older Mario Party, like 2 or 3.

Make a Mario Party Collection with online and remastered graphics.
Would buy it in an instant and you wouldn't need anymore new installments.

Not gonna happen, though. The compilations aren't really a Nintendo thing. Rip Smash Collection dreams.

 

[Iridium]

I'll list the amount of Pokéball Pokémon we haven't seen yet, from across all games:

Spoiler: Pretty long list.

Arceus
Articuno
Beedrill
Blastoise
Bonsly
Celebi
Chansey
Chikorita
Clefairy
Cyndaquil
Dedenne
Fennekin
Fletchling
Gardevoir
Genesect
Gogoat
Groudon
Gulpin
Hitmonlee
Ho-oh
Inkay
Jirachi
Keldeo
Koffing
Kyurem
Manaphy
Marill
Meloetta
Moltres
Munchlax
Onix
Oshawott
Piplup
Porygon2
Raikou
Snivy
Spewpa
Starmie
Swirlix
Togepi
Torchic
Unown
Venusaur
Victini
Weavile
Weezing
Wobbuffet
Zapdos

Charizard used to be one of these fellows, but became playable later, so he doesn't count. Which of these Pokémon would you all like to see again?

 

[Penroze]

What weird is that not knowing really anything about the single player in Smash Ultimate is killing me more than not knowing the full roster yet.

Maybe it's because I'm expecting only Ken and Incineroar, but idk.

I'm really hoping that Special Orders returns...

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

I'll list the amount of Pokéball Pokémon we haven't seen yet, from across all games:

Spoiler: Pretty long list.

Arceus
Articuno
Beedrill
Blastoise
Bonsly
Celebi
Chansey
Chikorita
Clefairy
Cyndaquil
Dedenne
Fennekin
Fletchling
Gardevoir
Genesect
Gogoat
Groudon
Gulpin
Hitmonlee
Ho-oh
Inkay
Jirachi
Keldeo
Koffing
Kyurem
Manaphy
Marill
Meloetta
Moltres
Munchlax
Onix
Oshawott
Piplup
Porygon2
Raikou
Snivy
Spewpa
Starmie
Swirlix
Togepi
Torchic
Unown
Venusaur
Victini
Weavile
Weezing
Wobbuffet
Zapdos

Charizard used to be one of these fellows, but became playable later, so he doesn't count. Which of these Pokémon would you all like to see again?

Out of all of those on the list, Victini is my favorite, so him (her? them? Pokemon genders are so confusing).

 

[osby]

I'll list the amount of Pokéball Pokémon we haven't seen yet, from across all games:

Spoiler: Pretty long list.

Arceus
Articuno
Beedrill
Blastoise
Bonsly
Celebi
Chansey
Chikorita
Clefairy
Cyndaquil
Dedenne
Fennekin
Fletchling
Gardevoir
Genesect
Gogoat
Groudon
Gulpin
Hitmonlee
Ho-oh
Inkay
Jirachi
Keldeo
Koffing
Kyurem
Manaphy
Marill
Meloetta
Moltres
Munchlax
Onix
Oshawott
Piplup
Porygon2
Raikou
Snivy
Spewpa
Starmie
Swirlix
Togepi
Torchic
Unown
Venusaur
Victini
Weavile
Weezing
Wobbuffet
Zapdos

Charizard used to be one of these fellows, but became playable later, so he doesn't count. Which of these Pokémon would you all like to see again?

I just want Munchlax back.

 

[Waluigi is not getting in]

Apparently Super Mario RPG music plays during Bowser's video? Can anyone confirm.

 

[Will]

Apparently Super Mario RPG music plays during Bowser's video? Can anyone confirm.

Trust me, if that was a thing people would've figured it out months ago.

 

[Iridium]

Out of all of those on the list, Victini is my favorite, so him (her? them? Pokemon genders are so confusing).

Victini doesn't have a gender, actually. A bit in line with most mythical/legendary Pokémon.

 

[Noipoi]

I'll list the amount of Pokéball Pokémon we haven't seen yet, from across all games:

Spoiler: Pretty long list.

Arceus
Articuno
Beedrill
Blastoise
Bonsly
Celebi
Chansey
Chikorita
Clefairy
Cyndaquil
Dedenne
Fennekin
Fletchling
Gardevoir
Genesect
Gogoat
Groudon
Gulpin
Hitmonlee
Ho-oh
Inkay
Jirachi
Keldeo
Koffing
Kyurem
Manaphy
Marill
Meloetta
Moltres
Munchlax
Onix
Oshawott
Piplup
Porygon2
Raikou
Snivy
Spewpa
Starmie
Swirlix
Togepi
Torchic
Unown
Venusaur
Victini
Weavile
Weezing
Wobbuffet
Zapdos

Charizard used to be one of these fellows, but became playable later, so he doesn't count. Which of these Pokémon would you all like to see again?

Bring back Clefairy, with even more random effects.

 

[Arcad5]

I'll list the amount of Pokéball Pokémon we haven't seen yet, from across all games:

Spoiler: Pretty long list.

Arceus
Articuno
Beedrill
Blastoise
Bonsly
Celebi
Chansey
Chikorita
Clefairy
Cyndaquil
Dedenne
Fennekin
Fletchling
Gardevoir
Genesect
Gogoat
Groudon
Gulpin
Hitmonlee
Ho-oh
Inkay
Jirachi
Keldeo
Koffing
Kyurem
Manaphy
Marill
Meloetta
Moltres
Munchlax
Onix
Oshawott
Piplup
Porygon2
Raikou
Snivy
Spewpa
Starmie
Swirlix
Togepi
Torchic
Unown
Venusaur
Victini
Weavile
Weezing
Wobbuffet
Zapdos

Charizard used to be one of these fellows, but became playable later, so he doesn't count. Which of these Pokémon would you all like to see again?

With how rare it was, Celebi was always cool to see. I honestly liked the body swap mechanic that Manaphy brought, and I would love to see it return. And Porygon2 was just hilarious when it worked.

 

[Idon]

Apparently Super Mario RPG music plays during Bowser's video? Can anyone confirm.

More like Super Mario RPG uses Super Mario 3 music.

 

[kylexv]

Apparently Super Mario RPG music plays during Bowser's video? Can anyone confirm.

The music is from Super Mario Bros. 3.
The track was then remixed in Super Mario RPG

EDIT: 'd

 

[Deleted member]

Apparently Super Mario RPG music plays during Bowser's video? Can anyone confirm.

Nope, it's just a remix of the Super Mario Bros. 3 Final Boss music.

 

[_Fresh_]

As long as I'm going to use it as a Nintendo/Video game Walkman I'd be down for Music DLC.

Dude I'm ****ing crying hahahahahhahahahahahahahahahhahahahahahhahahahahhaha

 

[Waluigi is not getting in]

More like Super Mario RPG uses Super Mario 3 music.

Just saw a couple of people make a big deal out of it on Twitter but I wouldn't know.

 

[lightdrago]

I'll list the amount of Pokéball Pokémon we haven't seen yet, from across all games:

Spoiler: Pretty long list.

Arceus
Articuno
Beedrill
Blastoise
Bonsly
Celebi
Chansey
Chikorita
Clefairy
Cyndaquil
Dedenne
Fennekin
Fletchling
Gardevoir
Genesect
Gogoat
Groudon
Gulpin
Hitmonlee
Ho-oh
Inkay
Jirachi
Keldeo
Koffing
Kyurem
Manaphy
Marill
Meloetta
Moltres
Munchlax
Onix
Oshawott
Piplup
Porygon2
Raikou
Snivy
Spewpa
Starmie
Swirlix
Togepi
Torchic
Unown
Venusaur
Victini
Weavile
Weezing
Wobbuffet
Zapdos

Charizard used to be one of these fellows, but became playable later, so he doesn't count. Which of these Pokémon would you all like to see again?

Bring back Bonsly!

and replace Goldeen with Magikarp.

 

[Koopaul]

I think Sakurai's design philosophy has changed since then. He understands that, for a lot of people, clones are no substitute for fully unique fighters. That's why echoes are lower effort then Melee clones and don't get their own number, and also why characters like Isabelle and Wolf are barely even clones.

I think the backlash of Lucina and Dark Pit made him decide to rebrand thise kind of characters.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

I just want Munchlax back.

Munchlax was kinda fun...
You throw a Pokeball, Munchlax appears
Homerun Bat appears
You try to outrace Munchlax, and fail
Munchlax eats the bat.
You are standing there hopeless
Your opponent knocks you off the stage and you die.
Man, I love Brawl. I don't care what the Melee purists say.

 

[Deoxys911]

I can see it being a Melee-like situation. In Melee, Sakurai could either add one or maybe two new characters, or various clones to make the roster larger.

Only for Ultimate, I can see a few mid-priority newcomers partially through development already. Looking at the newcomer count, Sakurai may have opted to pause their development, and instead bloat the roster with clones to add more characters. From there, just use the original newcomers' assets to make them into Assist Trophies. That way, the characters are still in the game, and their efforts don't go to waste.

No, Sakurai could not have added one or two completely new characters in the time it took to make the clones in Melee. He outright stated that even if he cut all of the clones in Melee (and obviously this would also apply to Wii U/3DS's three) that the extra resources would not have been enough to create even a single unique newcomer. As for cutting Ultimate characters and turning them into Assist Trophies, that seems very unlikely based on his past development habits, with not a single instance of any planned character being an Assist Trophy and characters only scrapping characters due to technical or temporal limitations, neither of which should have been an issue here, at least not to the point of cutting several newcomers.

Excitebikes were like 12 individual objects on the screen and would certainly slow down the 3ds version.

But what about Infantry and Tanks? They were multiple objects appearing on-stage at once and firing multiple projectiles, yet they still worked in the 3DS version.

 

[AlphaSSB]

If Sakurai actually said this through an interview, I think it would get a lot of people pissed. :L

TBH, I am not sold on this possibility, there is still something about this kind of decision that is so un-Sakurai like to me.

I cannot put my finger on it.

I think a good example of the idea would be Bowser Jr. in Smash 4. Sakurai openly stated in a Nintendo Dream interview that Bowser Jr. was on the brink of being cut, but just barely made it. Now, look at the scenario if he was dropped because the staff didn't think they could finish him in time? Given Sakurai's DLC philosophy, I don't think he would've saved Bowser Jr. for DLC. Rather, I think he would've taken what Bowser Jr. already had and worked him into an Assist Trophy. Like I said, ensuring the character is in the game in some capacity, and preventing the effort put into developing him from going to waste.

Now, although that scenario is different than the one I originally made, both could apply to playable characters being made into Assist Trophies. Either opting to turn partially developed characters into Assist Trophies in favor of clones, or maybe the development team just felt that they couldn't finish those characters in time, and thus made into Assist Trophies.

Either way, I think its very possible some of our Assist Trophies were on the shortlist of unique newcomers at some point.

I actually can't see the ATs we have as playable characters. Maybe Bomberman/Shovel Knight but wouldn't they negotiate the character's role with the third parties in the first place?

I can definitely see a few Assist Trophies, old, new, Nintendo-owned, and 3rd Party, as playable.

With 3rd Party characters, its possible that they would have their role defined while getting their rights, but there's no guarantee that is the case. Things change during development, and I think it's possible Sakurai would've given himself some 'wiggle-room' to change things up if, for whatever reason, a specific 3rd Party character being in a specific role was no-longer realizable.

 

[Penroze]

I'll list the amount of Pokéball Pokémon we haven't seen yet, from across all games:

Spoiler: Pretty long list.

Arceus
Articuno
Beedrill
Blastoise
Bonsly
Celebi
Chansey
Chikorita
Clefairy
Cyndaquil
Dedenne
Fennekin
Fletchling
Gardevoir
Genesect
Gogoat
Groudon
Gulpin
Hitmonlee
Ho-oh
Inkay
Jirachi
Keldeo
Koffing
Kyurem
Manaphy
Marill
Meloetta
Moltres
Munchlax
Onix
Oshawott
Piplup
Porygon2
Raikou
Snivy
Spewpa
Starmie
Swirlix
Togepi
Torchic
Unown
Venusaur
Victini
Weavile
Weezing
Wobbuffet
Zapdos

Charizard used to be one of these fellows, but became playable later, so he doesn't count. Which of these Pokémon would you all like to see again?

I want Unown back...

 

[Locuan]

Apparently Super Mario RPG music plays during Bowser's video?

Technically. However, Bowser's fight theme in Super Mario RPG is based on one from a previous entry in the Mario series iirc. (Can't seem to find it though)

Smash U Bowser Video
https://youtu.be/liuwszyDhXM?t=9

SMRPG Bowser Fight
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ocAJZWp40Y8

EDIT: KMDP mentioned it below, it's SMB3

SMB3 Bowser Battle
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k1MUx-AiLek

 

[aarchak]

I'll list the amount of Pokéball Pokémon we haven't seen yet, from across all games:

Spoiler: Pretty long list.

Arceus
Articuno
Beedrill
Blastoise
Bonsly
Celebi
Chansey
Chikorita
Clefairy
Cyndaquil
Dedenne
Fennekin
Fletchling
Gardevoir
Genesect
Gogoat
Groudon
Gulpin
Hitmonlee
Ho-oh
Inkay
Jirachi
Keldeo
Koffing
Kyurem
Manaphy
Marill
Meloetta
Moltres
Munchlax
Onix
Oshawott
Piplup
Porygon2
Raikou
Snivy
Spewpa
Starmie
Swirlix
Togepi
Torchic
Unown
Venusaur
Victini
Weavile
Weezing
Wobbuffet
Zapdos

Charizard used to be one of these fellows, but became playable later, so he doesn't count. Which of these Pokémon would you all like to see again?

Like, all of them. Make it so everyone is here.

 

[KMDP]

Apparently Super Mario RPG music plays during Bowser's video? Can anyone confirm.

The music played in Bowser's trailer is a remix of his boss theme from Super Mario Bros. 3.

 

[Arcad5]

and replace Goldeen with Magikarp.

Only if a Gyarados rarely appears in its stead.

 

[Paperchampion23]

No, Sakurai could not have added one or two completely new characters in the time it took to make the clones in Melee. He outright stated that even if he cut all of the clones in Melee (and obviously this would also apply to Wii U/3DS's three) that the extra resources would not have been enough to create even a single unique newcomer. As for cutting Ultimate characters and turning them into Assist Trophies, that seems very unlikely based on his past development habits, with not a single instance of any planned character being an Assist Trophy and characters only scrapping characters due to technical or temporal limitations, neither of which should have been an issue here, at least not to the point of cutting several newcomers.

But what about Infantry and Tanks? They were multiple objects appearing on-stage at once and firing multiple projectiles, yet they still worked in the 3DS version.

Isn't it much less? They don't turn around and just fall of the stage. The excitebikes jumped and tried to survive if I remember

 

[Untouch]

The bowser video's song is NOT a remix of the SMRPG bowser fight.
It's much closer to the SMB3 bowser fight song, they sound slightly different. (The intro is different, the Smash version has the exactly same intro as the SMB3 song).

 

[Iridium]

I'll list the amount of Pokéball Pokémon we haven't seen yet, from across all games:

Spoiler: Pretty long list.

Arceus
Articuno
Beedrill
Blastoise
Bonsly
Celebi
Chansey
Chikorita
Clefairy
Cyndaquil
Dedenne
Fennekin
Fletchling
Gardevoir
Genesect
Gogoat
Groudon
Gulpin
Hitmonlee
Ho-oh
Inkay
Jirachi
Keldeo
Koffing
Kyurem
Manaphy
Marill
Meloetta
Moltres
Munchlax
Onix
Oshawott
Piplup
Porygon2
Raikou
Snivy
Spewpa
Starmie
Swirlix
Togepi
Torchic
Unown
Venusaur
Victini
Weavile
Weezing
Wobbuffet
Zapdos

Charizard used to be one of these fellows, but became playable later, so he doesn't count. Which of these Pokémon would you all like to see again?

I could say everyone, but I definitely need to see the legendary bird trio. Well, the fact that they have Spanish numbers in their names is subtly smart (and I like fire, electric and ice too). And Raikou too (we have Entei and Suicune, so...). Some others are obvious picks.

 

[ZephyrZ]

I think the backlash of Lucina and Dark Pit made him decide to rebrand thise kind of characters.

Oh definitely, but he also made it clear that Lucy and Pittoey took no additional man hours. They were "easy bonuses" as opposed to Melee clones who took more work snd were primarily to pad out the roster.

 

[Deleted member]

So if you had to add one newcomer from your favorite series, who would be?
For me,
: Skull Kid
: Sylux
: Rex and Pyra
: Zero
: Alcuard

 

[Dee Dude]

I miss 64 Pokemon like Onyx, Hitmonlee and Beedrill...

And whatever happened to Celefairy? That one Pokemon that copies moves from the others.

 

[aarchak]

So if you had to add one newcomer from your favorite series, who would be?

: Elma
: Bandana Waddle Dee
: Ephraim/Hector
: Raiden

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Let's play a game.

What will Smash characters dress as this Halloween?

I'll start: Ness is going as a ghost. Lucas is also going as a ghost but he cut too many eye holes in his sheet.

Pit dresses up as a roller skating chicken

 

[Wyoming]

I miss 64 Pokemon like Onyx, Hitmonlee and Beedrill...

And whatever happened to Celefairy? That one Pokemon that copies moves from the others.

Onix would be cool to see again. Hitmonlee would be pointless with Scizor there. Beedrill eeeeh could have another Pokemon with the same gimmick.

 

[Dee Dude]

Wyoming Uh, yes she was.....

https://www.ssbwiki.com/Clefairy

Chansey would be cool too to see return.