Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Exalt4747]

And mostly importantly Groose added.

I fixed it.

 

[TyrantLizardKing]

Ugh I hate how Forces turned Tails into a coward, he took on Chaos 4 for crying out loud.

That coupled with his portrayals in other games like Lost World and Colours have sadly caused me to develop a dislike of the dude. For as much as Shadow harmed the franchise, he's kept all his development and was the best-written character in Forces imo. Tails has just gone completely backwards from his Adventure heydays and I absolutely despise the writers for letting it happen.

 

[SonicMario]

"SONIC HELP ME!!!"

That was so last year

This is Tails now

(Only joking, I'm not meaning to start an argument or anything)

 

[Potato_]

Ugh I hate how Forces turned Tails into a coward, he took on Chaos 4 for crying out loud.

Not to mention his entire damn arc in SA2 was about learning to become a capable hero and not having to depend on Sonic so much. Which he succeeded with in the end.

But nah, that was boring, let's make Tails the butt of the joke again.

 

[Deleted member]

How about a real Smash free fight between vs?

 

[Dee Dude]

I actually was thinking of adding Tails...

EDIT: Added him!

Potato_ Actually that was SA1

 

[Impa4Smash]

I fixed it.

Make it so, Sakurai.

Spoiler

 

[Noipoi]

That coupled with his portrayals in other games like Lost World and Colours have sadly caused me to develop a dislike of the dude. For as much as Shadow harmed the franchise, he's kept all his development and was the best-written character in Forces imo. Tails has just gone completely backwards from his Adventure heydays and I absolutely despise the writers for letting it happen.

Adventure: I sound like i'm 5 years old and i'm gonna go fight Satan!

Forces: SOOOOONIIIC!!!! I NEEEEED YOUUUU!!!

oh how the times have changed...

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

How about a real Smash free fight between vs?

Probably Snake...

Make it so, Sakurai.

Spoiler

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/D4SrYyo_55I/maxresdefault.jpg

Yes, Please...
Groose is legit one of my most wanted joke characters...

 

[Impa4Smash]

Probably Snake...

Yes, Please...
Groose is legit one of my most wanted joke characters...

Groose is honestly one of the best written Zelda characters. No joke. Great, simple, but effective arc.

 

[CosmicQuark]

Here's a game:

You Are Sakurai Bias!

Pick 1 Smash Franchise (hell, it can be one that isn't in SSB yet if you want) and say how you would shamelessly cater to your own bias in Smash with content

My bias? Pokemon:

I would include three more Pokemon for Ultimate, a 3rd Gen, 5th Gen, and 7th Gen, and reveal them all in the same trailer
Pikachu's/Pichu's Side Special is now Volt Tackle (its much faster than Charizard's Flare Blitz, but does less damage and no recoil to itself)
Pikachu's/Pichu's Final Smash will be its Z-Move instead
Mewtwo's Shadow Ball damages as it charges
All of Pokemon Trainer's Pokemon will gain a 4th special; Pokemon Changing is now down by pressing A+B together
Even more stages including: Poke Floats, Tower of Mastery, Pokemon Battle Royal Ring, Battle Frontier Emerald, and Poketopia
Greninja in Ultimate is Smash 4 out-of-the-gate, pre-patched level (before the 20 nerfs and patches)

EDIT
Mewtwo is now a floaty, heavy character, at least as heavy as Samus.
Each of Pokemon Trainer's Pokemon also have their own Final Smash, instead of just doing one Triple Finish, giving players options before letting loose their FS.
Lucario has less startup and cooldown frames on its attacks as its Aura level increases.

Who would be your Gen 3, 5 and 7 characters? For me, if I had free reign with a Smash game (not Ultimate as I think every veteran should be in Ultimate), my Pokemon characters would be: Pikachu, Team Rocket/Meowth, Mewtwo, Kanto (sp?) Trainer, Tyranitar, Blaziken, Lucario, Zoroark, Greninja, Alolan Trainer (Litten/Brionne/Decidueye).

Series already in Smash: Sonic would get Tails, Knuckles, Blaze, Shadow and Dr. Robotnik as playable characters. There'd be an Egg Carrier stage from SA, Crazy Gadget from SA2, and Eggmanland from Unleashed. Amy, Tikal, and Rouge would be assist trophies. And Sonic would be getting 40 songs (which tbh, is what it should be closer to given Sonic's about the music).

Series not in Smash (yet): Banjo-Kazooie would get Banjo & Kazooie and Gruntilda as characters (maybe add Conker for another Rare darling from Diddy Kong Racing). Banjo & Kazooie would be a two-in-one fighter who are all-around when together, but could be separated briefly for more powerful attacks (Banjo's bag swing, Kazooie's Wing Whack), but the character left alone would become vulnerable. Their stages would be two travelling stages...

Banjo-Kazooie: Mumbo's Mountain, Treasure Trove Cove, Freezeezy Peak, Mad Monster Mansion, Rusty Bucket Bay, Click Clock Wood.
Banjo-Tooie: Mayahem Temple, Witchyworld, Jolly Roger's Lagoon, Terrydactyland, Hailfire Peaks, Cloud Cuckooland.

The music would be Gruntilda's Lair and Isle o' Hags that would transition to the various themes of the stages like in-game. Mumbo Jumbo would be an assist, and Brentilda would pop up in stages revealing Smash character's darkest secrets. And every song from both games would make an appearance, which it's around 30-ish so semi-possible. Hey, if I'm allowing myself to be biased, I'll be very biased.

 

[Robertman2]

I would have no bias towards one series, but instead third parties in general. I would just add Joker, Master Chief, Dante, Doomguy, Crash, Shadow, Sora, Banjo, Steve and of course, Waluigi.


Also Rex gets killed by a Grunt from Halo in Master Chief's trailer

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Not to mention his entire damn arc in SA2 was about learning to become a capable hero and not having to depend on Sonic so much. Which he succeeded with in the end.

But nah, that was boring, let's make Tails the butt of the joke again.

At least Mania Plus pretends Forces never happened.

That being said, how's the IDW comic so far? Looking through a few issues from right before the Archie run cancellation made me think Flynn deserved better.

 

[T3Z3R1]

This is Tails now

(Only joking, I'm not meaning to start an argument or anything)

>"Who's your daddy, Shadow?"

WHY. Now, I am reminded about worst parts of Sonic fandom again. Thanks alot for that by the way. I know that you are joking, but that damn line man!

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Here's a game:

You Are Sakurai Bias!

Pick 1 Smash Franchise (hell, it can be one that isn't in SSB yet if you want) and say how you would shamelessly cater to your own bias in Smash with content

My bias? Pokemon:

I would include three more Pokemon for Ultimate, a 3rd Gen, 5th Gen, and 7th Gen, and reveal them all in the same trailer
Pikachu's/Pichu's Side Special is now Volt Tackle (its much faster than Charizard's Flare Blitz, but does less damage and no recoil to itself)
Pikachu's/Pichu's Final Smash will be its Z-Move instead
Mewtwo's Shadow Ball damages as it charges
All of Pokemon Trainer's Pokemon will gain a 4th special; Pokemon Changing is now down by pressing A+B together
Even more stages including: Poke Floats, Tower of Mastery, Pokemon Battle Royal Ring, Battle Frontier Emerald, and Poketopia
Greninja in Ultimate is Smash 4 out-of-the-gate, pre-patched level (before the 20 nerfs and patches)

EDIT
Mewtwo is now a floaty, heavy character, at least as heavy as Samus.
Each of Pokemon Trainer's Pokemon also have their own Final Smash, instead of just doing one Triple Finish, giving players options before letting loose their FS.
Lucario has less startup and cooldown frames on its attacks as its Aura level increases.

Kid Icarus
Veteran Characters: stay
Newcomers: Viridi, Medusa, Pandora, Magnus join
Stages: Thunder Cloud Temple, Chaos Vortex, Rewind Springs, Viridi’s home, and the insides of Hades
Music: all of the Uprising music
Items: all of the Uprising weapons and powers
Assist Trophies: Phosphora, Arlon, Aurum, Cragalanche, Pyrrhon, and
Boss: Hades, The Heart of Hades, and Hewdraw
Dialogue: and Viridi talk about everyone and everything possible

Buffs: make so perfectly balanced that he’s the best character in Smash history
Nerfs: ****ing none

 

[Potato_]

I actually was thinking of adding Tails...

EDIT: Added him!

Potato_ Actually that was SA1

To an extent it was SA2 as well. Both deal with it for sure.

For example, Tails' last boss fight with Robotnik on the ARK literally has him man up and take charge when he assumes Sonic's been lost.

 

[Impa4Smash]

You know what would be great? (which CosmicQuark 's post got me thinking about)

A Diddy Kong Racing sequel. That game was great. An open-world adventure racing game, with boats, cars, planes, and a giant wizard pig as the final boss? Another one

 

[Wyoming]

Theory time, I think the Memories are a collectable and the translation team in English has only just decided what they'll be called in game. Flashbacks.

Makes sense since Masterpieces can't really be a thing. I'd love a chronicle/museum of artwork and factoids.

 

[Impa4Smash]

Rex gets killed by a Grunt from Halo in Master Chief's trailer

I like your attitude!

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Makes sense since Masterpieces can't really be a thing. I'd love a chronicle/museum of artwork and factoids.

On that note, I'm still low-key hoping for the entire of Smash 64 to be playable as a bonus.

 

[Jetsurge]

Woah there's memories on the English site now!

 

[Pyra]

Makes sense since Masterpieces can't really be a thing. I'd love a chronicle/museum of artwork and factoids.

That's a pretty fun idea honestly.

Also it didn't occur to me that to notice the Flashback post today because I'm used to flipping between the Japanese blog and the English blog so often that the memory posts are commonplace.
My first thought was "oh, guess Fox is confirmed"

 

[Dee Dude]

Speaking of bias, we know Sakurai was accused of Kirby & Star Fox bias in Brawl, and then understandably accused of Kid Icarus & Fire Emblem bias in 4.

Which will be his next accusation of series bias for Ulitmate? I'm personally betting on Metroid and Animal Crossing this time:

 

[amazonevan19]

Tails used to be likeable.

Then they utterly destroyed his character in Lost World and Forces. Lost World Tails was a complete asshole; Forces Tails was a whimpering *****.

Tbh it's why I'm not as big on Tails making it into Smash although I agree he and Shadow are both very good Sonic reps.

 

[TyrantLizardKing]

At least Mania Plus pretends Forces never happened.

That being said, how's the IDW comic so far? Looking through a few issues from right before the Archie run cancellation made me think Flynn deserved better.

I've only gotten a few issues cause local stores don't carry IDW, but they've been excellent. I met Flynn at a convention this year and we talked for a good while about his approach and how he wanted to build off Forces (and yes he didn't like the game's story either).

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Speaking of bias, we know Sakurai was accused of Kirby & Star Fox bias in Brawl, and then understandably accused of Kid Icarus & Fire Emblem bias in 4.

Which will be his next accusation of series bias for Ulitmate? I'm personally betting on Metroid and Animal Crossing this time:

Betting on Metroid and Xenoblade

pls let my gurl Elma come home

 

[Impa4Smash]

Speaking of bias, we know Sakurai was accused of Kirby & Star Fox bias in Brawl, and then understandably accused of Kid Icarus & Fire Emblem bias in 4.

Which will be his next accusation of series bias for Ulitmate? I'm personally betting on Metroid and Animal Crossing this time:

Imma be salty if Sakurai gets accused of bias for adding two more characters to Metroid (which is way more popular/important than KI, no offense) with only 1 added since Brawl

 

[TheCJBrine]

I just realized the English Flashback used the Japanese box art.

to be fair I've only played Star Fox 64 out of that series.

 

[Iridium]

You know what would be great? (which CosmicQuark 's post got me thinking about)

A Diddy Kong Racing sequel. That game was great. An open-world adventure racing game, with boats, cars, planes, and a giant wizard pig as the final boss? Another one

So, can anyone explained what happened to Conker though? In terms of demographic, and just...everything.

 

[Pyra]

So, can anyone explained what happened to Conker though? In terms of demographic, and just...everything.

Rare decided to be rare

 

[Exalt4747]

Speaking of bias, we know Sakurai was accused of Kirby & Star Fox bias in Brawl, and then understandably accused of Kid Icarus & Fire Emblem bias in 4.

Which will be his next accusation of series bias for Ulitmate? I'm personally betting on Metroid and Animal Crossing this time:

>Three characters is bias

>2.5 characters is bias

People smh.

 

[Impa4Smash]

So, can anyone explained what happened to Conker though? In terms of demographic, and just...everything.

Rare was like what if we made Banjo-Kazooie, but instead of collecting puzzle pieces you stumble around drunk while fighting zombies and helping talking bees and flowers do...stuff

 

[Potato_]

At least Mania Plus pretends Forces never happened.

That being said, how's the IDW comic so far? Looking through a few issues from right before the Archie run cancellation made me think Flynn deserved better.

I honestly don't know, but then again I followed the Archie comics verrrry loosely so. From what I've seen they seem decent.

Who would be your Gen 3, 5 and 7 characters?

I know you didn't ask me specifically, but I thought I'd chime in with my opinion:

Gen 3: I do think Sceptile is a good choice. Something about his design just looks like he'd fit into Smash well.

Gen 5: For a weirder option? I would LOVE to see Genesect.

Gen 7: MIMIKYU WHY WERE YOU DECONFIRMED I LOVE YOU

 

[Kirby Dragons]

Speaking of bias, we know Sakurai was accused of Kirby & Star Fox bias in Brawl, and then understandably accused of Kid Icarus & Fire Emblem bias in 4.

Which will be his next accusation of series bias for Ulitmate? I'm personally betting on Metroid and Animal Crossing this time:

It'll probably be FE again. Maybe Metroid too, though I personally don't mind it having four characters.

 

[CosmicQuark]

You know what would be great? (which CosmicQuark 's post got me thinking about)

A Diddy Kong Racing sequel. That game was great. An open-world adventure racing game, with boats, cars, planes, and a giant wizard pig as the final boss? Another one

I would absolutely love that, and if Microsoft's working with B&K in Smash... it's potentially possible with all of the original characters. However,

Spoiler: Rumor

if that Star Fox Racing game is true and its inspiration really is Diddy Kong Racing, I don't think a true sequel will come in the near future.

Diddy Kong Racing perhaps has the best framework for a great racing game. A variety of ways to race, the hub world was so much fun to play around in and find secrets. And I played the game, thinking I had almost completed it, only hearing years later there was *another* portion of the game after Wizpig's first race. My child self's mind was blown. Seeing something like that in modern graphics and gameplay--awesome.

 

[BrytonJ]

Here's a game:

You Are Sakurai Bias!

Pick 1 Smash Franchise (hell, it can be one that isn't in SSB yet if you want) and say how you would shamelessly cater to your own bias in Smash with content

My bias? Pokemon:

I would include three more Pokemon for Ultimate, a 3rd Gen, 5th Gen, and 7th Gen, and reveal them all in the same trailer
Pikachu's/Pichu's Side Special is now Volt Tackle (its much faster than Charizard's Flare Blitz, but does less damage and no recoil to itself)
Pikachu's/Pichu's Final Smash will be its Z-Move instead
Mewtwo's Shadow Ball damages as it charges
All of Pokemon Trainer's Pokemon will gain a 4th special; Pokemon Changing is now down by pressing A+B together
Even more stages including: Poke Floats, Tower of Mastery, Pokemon Battle Royal Ring, Battle Frontier Emerald, and Poketopia
Greninja in Ultimate is Smash 4 out-of-the-gate, pre-patched level (before the 20 nerfs and patches)

EDIT
Mewtwo is now a floaty, heavy character, at least as heavy as Samus.
Each of Pokemon Trainer's Pokemon also have their own Final Smash, instead of just doing one Triple Finish, giving players options before letting loose their FS.
Lucario has less startup and cooldown frames on its attacks as its Aura level increases.

Pikmin bias

Louie / Brittany and President / Charlie as echoes of Olimar / Alph
Plasm Wraith as a playable character
Emperor Bulblax as a boss
Stages based on Submerged Castle, The Shower Room, Wistful Wilds, Subterranean Complex, and on top of the Quaggled Mireclops
Ultra-Bitter spray item that turns opponents into stone
Assist trophies of Swooping Snitchbug (picks up fighters), Fiery Blowhog (just sprays fire), and Puffstool (gives players the mushroom status just like the rambling evil mushroom)
Lots of new music including remixes of The Final Trial, Bulblax Kingdom, and Challenge Mode

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

Speaking of bias, we know Sakurai was accused of Kirby & Star Fox bias in Brawl, and then understandably accused of Kid Icarus & Fire Emblem bias in 4.

Which will be his next accusation of series bias for Ulitmate? I'm personally betting on Metroid and Animal Crossing this time:

Pokemon, Metroid, and Donkey Kong...

 

[SonicMario]

Tails used to be likeable.

Then they utterly destroyed his character in Lost World and Forces. Lost World Tails was a complete *******; Forces Tails was a whimpering *****.

Tbh it's why I'm not as big on Tails making it into Smash although I agree he and Shadow are both very good Sonic reps.

One or Two games aren't enough for me to not want Tails though. Not like some of that would get heavily referenced in Smash. I just would really like Mario & Luigi Vs. Sonic & Tails possible which regardless of any moments where Tails hasn't exactly been a top notch character would be awesome just for the legacy of having in Smash.

And any faults like that in those 2 games should be more at the fault of the writers rather then the character. Tails wasn't playable in either game, but they still had to have him do something but without effecting gameplay so much. And unfortunately suddenly getting mad at Sonic or being a coward was just one of those ways they could still write Tails in without having him doing barely anything gameplay wise.

 

[Iridium]

Rare decided to be rare

True, but it's so weird thinking that Conker of all characters was in the same game as Diddy Kong. I mean, I don't know how many people here would say his game was good either.

 

[Pyra]

True, but it's so weird thinking that Conker of all characters was in the same game as Diddy Kong. I mean, I don't know how many people here would say his game was good either.

I quite liked it...