Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Luigifan18]

Silver Sonic is too small to be a boss.

And what the hell is a “Black Doom”? Sounds dirty.

Main antagonist of Shadow the Hedgehog.

I know...but does Sega remember that thing?

Black Doom is the antagonist of Shadow the Hedgehog.

Putting in Black Doom but not Shadow? Black Doom was only ever relevant in the Shadow game 13 years ago and never used again after that.

Eggman makes the most sense for a Sonic villain but he'll probably be a boss. Knuckles is the best pick for a newcomer imo but he's assist, leaving Tails as the next best newcomer and Shadow as an echo. What path do you all think Sakurai is going to take...a harder path (making a new character) that will piss off Shadow fans, or the easy route that will please the larger part of the Sonic fanbase and makes the most sense to promote the echoes concept even further? I'm not opposed to Tails (in fact, I'd like for him to be in), but thinking both he and Shadow will get in is very wishful thinking IMO. DLC maybe.

Sakurai could likely not put any new sonic character in base and have one or both Shadow and Tails as DLC. But I'd hope for Shadow as base echo and Tails as DLC newcomer as the best outcome

Edit: Forgot a word

I got the game when it originally released. Black Doom, though...when was the last time Sega acknowledged him? Even Zavok is more memorable.

And the original Tiger Mask was an orphan who became a heel Wrestler that went face after an orphan from his orphange wanted to become a villain, correct me if im wrong but doesnt King II have that to his backstory as well?

Shadow the Hedgehog (the game) sits at a funny place. Everything that happened in it for Shadow (the end of the amnesia storyline, him becoming a GUN Agent, the Commander's existance) all carried over from that game, but because everyone likes to meme on it Sega themselves slipped it into the Spinoff category.
Honestly, the game gets alot more hate than it deserves, Out of the Adventure generation of games it was probably the one that aged the most gracefully and was a pretty decent game still to this day, but ya know Edgehog

IT also helps in its favor the next game right after it was a dumpster fire, and now Sonic Boom exists.

SEGA doesn't really want anybody to remember Black Doom, he was barred from making a physical appearance in the comics. When the reboot came around writer Ian Flynn had to make a successor for him just to use the Black Arms finally.

A fun bit of trivia for you: Black Doom's English VA Sean Schemmel is also the voice of Lucario from Smash 4 onwards.

Personally, I find Black Doom to be a memorable villain, though it helps that he came around when I was in middle school, lol. Also, I really want to hear Sean Schemmel sing this as Black Doom:

 

[CommanderZaktan]

I predict we might get a newcomer trailer somewhere near Halloween.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

I’ll give a crack at dream DLC lineups too assuming Incineroar and Ken are it for base. Also this will not have anyone who can be considered “deconfirmed” in any way (so no Viridi, Fiora (), Lip etc)

Uniques:
Elma (Xenoblade)
Rex & Pyra (Xenoblade)
Bandana Waddle Dee (Kirby)
Lloyd Irving (Tales of Symphonia)
Shantae (Shantae)
Neku Sakuraba (The World Ends With You)
Isaac (Golden Sun)
Twintelle (ARMS)
Total: 7 8

Semi-clones:
Celica (Fire Emblem; of Robin)
Black Shadow (F-Zero; of Captain Falcon)
Shadow (Sonic, of well...this should be obvious lmao)
Dixie Kong (Donkey Kong; of Diddy)
Total: 4

Echoes:
Impa (Legend of Zelda; of Sheik)
Octoling (Splatoon; of Inkling)
Zack Fair (Final Fantasy VII; of Cloud)
Medusa (Kid Icarus; of Palutena)
Total: 4

Grand total: 15 16

Rate, debate, whatever

 

[monadoboy]

All this Incineroar hate from westerners who dont know any better. We really are such uncultured swine to not recognize

Being a reference to something doesn't suddenly fix their awful design tho

Those hands looks like a kid drew them. That ugly red neckbeard looks awful and they looks like they skip leg day since they were born. Incineroar is one of those Pokemon that the more I see the less they look like a Pokemon. How they went from Litten to this...thing is beyond me. I really can't stomach this design. The in-game model in SM is even worse. I very rarely dislike a design (I even like Rex's design) but this? I can't, it's Barbaracle/Simipour/Mr. Mime levels of bad without Mr. Mime's charms. Sorry to those who like Incineroar. If the hands weren't such an aberration, and their face looked like a face instead of a cat/octopus hybrid stuck in a bodybuilder I'd love it.

If they do get in I hope the moveset's beyond fantastic to make up for losing Decidueye, Lycanroc and all the amazing gen 7 Pokemon for this thing.

 

[Luigifan18]

I’ll give a crack at dream DLC lineups too assuming Incineroar and Ken are it for base. Also this will not have anyone who can be considered “deconfirmed” in any way (so no Viridi, Fiora (), Lip etc)

Uniques:
Elma (Xenoblade)
Rex & Pyra (Xenoblade)
Bandana Waddle Dee (Kirby)
Lloyd Irving (Tales of Symphonia)
Neku Sakuraba (The World Ends With You)
Isaac (Golden Sun)
Twintelle (ARMS)
Total: 7

Semi-clones:
Celica (Fire Emblem; of Robin)
Black Shadow (F-Zero; of Captain Falcon)
Shadow (Sonic, of well...this should be obvious lmao)
Dixie Kong (Donkey Kong; of Diddy)
Total: 4

Echoes:
Impa (Legend of Zelda; of Sheik)
Octoling (Splatoon; of Inkling)
Zack Fair (Final Fantasy VII; of Cloud)
Medusa (Kid Icarus; of Palutena)
Total: 4

Grand total: 15

Rate, debate, whatever

Wait, how is Lip deconfirmed?!?

 

[MainJPW]

Wait, how is Lip deconfirmed?!?

The Lip’s Stick item.

 

[Sharkarat]

Why do people hate Barbaracle?

 

[Luigifan18]

The Lip’s Stick item.

That's not a deconfirmation...

 

[Noipoi]

Being a reference to something doesn't suddenly fix their awful design tho

Those hands looks like a kid drew them. That ugly red neckbeard looks awful and they looks like they skip leg day since they were born. Incineroar is one of those Pokemon that the more I see the less they look like a Pokemon. How they went from Litten to this...thing is beyond me. I really can't stomach this design. The in-game model in SM is even worse. I very rarely dislike a design (I even like Rex's design) but this? I can't, it's Barbaracle/Simipour/Mr. Mime levels of bad without Mr. Mime's charms. Sorry to those who like Incineroar. If the hands weren't such an aberration, and their face looked like a face instead of a cat/octopus hybrid stuck in a bodybuilder I'd love it.

If they do get in I hope the moveset's beyond fantastic to make up for losing Decidueye, Lycanroc and all the amazing gen 7 Pokemon for this thing.

He's a beautiful boy and I won't stand for this slander.

 

[Deleted member]

That's not a deconfirmation...

Yeah, that’s really not confirmation, but I would think that if Lip is in Smash, she would use her primary weapon, and nkt have jt be reserved for an item.

 

[KMDP]

I only remember the Zeni because the green one is hot.

The Zeti are so forgettable you can't even get their name right.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

That's not a deconfirmation...

Maybe not, but it’s the prelude to one. What would REALLY sink Lip’s chances would be Kirby’s down B having a Face Block variant.

 

[Will]

Why do people hate Barbaracle?

the **** is a barbaracle

 

[Iridium]

Being a reference to something doesn't suddenly fix their awful design tho

Those hands looks like a kid drew them. That ugly red neckbeard looks awful and they looks like they skip leg day since they were born. Incineroar is one of those Pokemon that the more I see the less they look like a Pokemon. How they went from Litten to this...thing is beyond me. I really can't stomach this design. The in-game model in SM is even worse. I very rarely dislike a design (I even like Rex's design) but this? I can't, it's Barbaracle/Simipour/Mr. Mime levels of bad without Mr. Mime's charms. Sorry to those who like Incineroar. If the hands weren't such an aberration, and their face looked like a face instead of a cat/octopus hybrid stuck in a bodybuilder I'd love it.

If they do get in I hope the moveset's beyond fantastic to make up for losing Decidueye, Lycanroc and all the amazing gen 7 Pokemon for this thing.

I get a Tom & Jerry feel when I look at his hands...and that's not a bad thing at all.

the **** is a barbaracle

This, unless you're joking. Gen VI, man. A little bit weird.

 

[Gyrom8]

the **** is a barbaracle

This guy. As far as ugly Pokemon goes, it's not that bad - honestly a step-up from its pre-evolution.

 

[Chrono.]

People will hate Incineroar now but once they see he gets a ton of charm via gameplay/trailer they'll turn around.

 

[Will]

This guy. As far as ugly Pokemon goes, it's not that bad - honestly a step-up from its pre-evolution.

it looks like a machamp and a diglett got busy

 

[Deleted member]

People will hate Incineroar now but once they see he gets a ton of charm via gameplay/trailer they'll turn around.

If he does get in, then yeah, that will definitely be the case.

 

[Deleted member]

I predict we might get a newcomer trailer somewhere near Halloween.

That would be the perfect time to announce Si-wait hold the **** up.

 

[Will]

People will hate Incineroar now but once they see he gets a ton of charm via gameplay/trailer they'll turn around.

That's implying it is him that shows up.

 

[Chumpodile]

This guy. As far as ugly Pokemon goes, it's not that bad - honestly a step-up from its pre-evolution.

Barbarbacle is cool!!!!!

 

[MainJPW]

The Zeti are so forgettable you can't even get their name right.

Sonic Team couldn’t even give them a proper send off at the end of the game. The Deadly Six just disappear after getting defeated like *poof* and then Eggman makes an off-hand comment about controlling them again before comically falling off a cliff as if they’re supposed to make another appearance somewhere down the line.

If they do show up redesign them (they come straight from Mario) and give each of them a less generic personality. Did they get a trophy in Smash 3DS?

 

[Deleted member]

Also, am I the only one who thinks Freddy in Smash is ridiculous? I’d say FNAF’s a good game, but that doesn’t mean it needs a crossover with a fighting game.

 

[Chrono.]

Sonic Team couldn’t even give them a proper send off at the end of the game. The Deadly Six just disappear after getting defeated like *poof* and then Eggman makes an off-hand comment about controlling them again before comically falling off a cliff as if they’re supposed to make another appearance somewhere down the line.

If they do show up redesign them (they come straight from Mario) and give each of them a less generic personality. Did they get a trophy in Smash 3DS?

They got a Trophy in the Wii U version.

 

[Noipoi]

Also, am I the only one who thinks Freddy in Smash is ridiculous? I’d say FNAF’s a good game, but that doesn’t mean it needs a crossover with a fighting game.

I'm pretty sure no one seriously thinks about Freddy in Smash.
Ironically maybe, but not legitimately.

Unless they're like 7, but that can be excused. kids will be kids, y'know?

 

[Deleted member]

I'm pretty sure no one seriously thinks about Freddy in Smash.
Ironically maybe, but not legitimately.

Unless they're like 7, but that can be excused. kids will be kids, y'know?

Yeah. (Yeah, my saying that is ironic sense I do have a FNAF icon.) I do think the majority of people wanting Freddy in Smash are indeed kids, but he “technically” has a fanbase, so I figured I’d share my thoughts.

Also, here’s something to consider. Chrom is a Roy echo, and Roy’s our boy, so does that mean Chrom’s our... Mom?

 

[Hydrualic Hydra]

What fairly-to-super-obscure characters would you guys be most excited to see in Smash?

I mentioned him in passing a while back, but the Ninja from I-Ninja would make me pretty stoked.

In addition, Jenosa Arma from Scourge Hive (the definitely not Metroid Fusion game) would be killer.

 

[KingofKoopas]

Also, am I the only one who thinks Freddy in Smash is ridiculous? I’d say FNAF’s a good game, but that doesn’t mean it needs a crossover with a fighting game.

That still even a thing, i thought MatPat moved on to a diff indie game to make bank off of so he doesn't have to do research anymore.

 

[Crap-Zapper]

It's not wrong wanting Freddy Fazzbear, it's just a consensus within Smash that it's weird.
Most Smash fans are more into first party, and old school content.

 

[Deleted member]

It's not wrong wanting Freddy Fazzbear, it's just a consensus within Smash that it's weird.
Most Smash fans are more into first party, and old school content.

Exactly. I’m thinking the majority of people who want Freddy are really young kids, and niw his fanbase has died down, sense the FNAF hype was mostly in 2014.

That still even a thing, i thought MatPat moved on to a diff indie game to make bank off of so he doesn't have to do research anymore.

MatPat moved in from FNAF as the game series ended.

 

[KingofKoopas]

It's not wrong wanting Freddy Fazzbear, it's just a consensus within Smash that it's weird.
Most Smash fans are more into first party, and old school content.

There's very Few Characters (Goku) who its objectively wrong to want in Smash (Goku) and will never and SHOULD never be in Smash (Goku) lest it turns into Mugen the Video Game and loses what made it Special (Goku).


Though i cant for the life of me remember any.

 

[Crap-Zapper]

True, most people who idealy would want Freddy (or any FNAF) would most likely be young.
I don't mind that. Smash is for kids, but it's also for adults.

It's the same with Steve from Minecraft. I was quite anti-Steve for Smash for a long time, but now I won't mind.
Old schoolers just got K. Rool, Simon Belmont and Ridley. Isabelle, Daisy and Inkling for the modern Nintendo fan.
Why should the young generation not get a win? I mean, Minecraft has been out for so long that gamers like me know about it, and have adapted. I'd rather have Steve, over Angry Bird, Roblox or Freddy to be honest, but I don't think it's wrong to want these at all, but that the supporters are often associated to be of the younger generation.

 

[KingofKoopas]

True, most people who idealy would want Freddy (or any FNAF) would most likely be young.
I don't mind that. Smash is for kids, but it's also for adults.

It's the same with Steve from Minecraft. I was quite anti-Steve for Smash for a long time, but now I won't mind.
Old schoolers just got K. Rool, Simon Belmont and Ridley. Isabelle, Daisy and Inkling for the modern Nintendo fan.
Why should the young generation not get a win? I mean, Minecraft has been out for so long that gamers like me know about it, and have adapted. I'd rather have Steve, over Angry Bird, Roblox or Freddy to be honest, but I don't think it's wrong to want these at all, but that the supporters are often associated to be of the younger generation.

Most kids moved on from all those games ages ago, its Fortnite that the kids are into currently and even thats on its way out. Kids move on remarkably fast from these things hence why having a character in specifically for them would be rather difficult.

 

[UberMadman]

Why do people hate Barbaracle?

This one has baffled me for years. Barbaracle's design is excellent in my eyes, and is a very creative take on something as mundane as barnacles.

 

[Chrono.]

What fairly-to-super-obscure characters would you guys be most excited to see in Smash?

I mentioned him in passing a while back, but the Ninja from I-Ninja would make me pretty stoked.

In addition, Jenosa Arma from Scourge Hive (the definitely not Metroid Fusion game) would be killer.

I think Ray 01 counts at this point.

 

[lightdrago]

This one has baffled me for years. Barbaracle's design is excellent in my eyes, and is a very creative take on something as mundane as barnacles.

That is precious. I want one now.

 

[Crap-Zapper]

Most kids moved on from all those games ages ago, its Fortnite that the kids are into currently and even thats on its way out. Kids move on remarkably fast from these things hence why having a character in specifically for them would be rather difficult.

That won't help.
Fortnite is far out of reach onto the project plan for Ultimate.
You got to remember what was hot in 2015.

 

[TheCJBrine]

I feel like plenty of kids still play Minecraft, and it still has a huge fanbase overall.

 

[AzureFlame4]

There's very Few Characters (Goku) who its objectively wrong to want in Smash (Goku) and will never and SHOULD never be in Smash (Goku) lest it turns into Mugen the Video Game and loses what made it Special (Goku).


Though i cant for the life of me remember any.

Superman comes to mind.

 

[Thinkaman]

I feel like Goku and Master Chief are the only "out there" external characters who could someday work directly by virtue of how iconic they are. (In exactly the same way as Cloud, though these two are much more "out there" than he was.)

Mario vs. Sonic
Link vs. Cloud
Samus vs. Master Chief
Goku vs. Any of the Above

Smash is the playground argument given life, and these were the ultimate, be-all-end-all playground arguments. Our parents had Batman vs. Superman and Marvel Anyone vs. DC Anyone, but this was the form of our wars.