Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Is there a slight chance we might see Incineroar during a Pokémon direct?

I feel a character like Incineroar might appeal more to Pokémon fans than Smash fans in general

and a Pokémon direct seems like the best time and place to reveal him

The closest thing to this possibility was Shulk's reveal in a japanese only direct

Or i'm just on to nothing

Greninja was revealed in a Smash Direct.

 

[Aeon Lupin]

It's incredibly difficult to argue with the box theory at this point.
https://imgur.com/o31DlaI
But also, as already mentioned, even if the Coro Coro stage count wasn't a mistake, it doesn't inherently conflict with the box theory.

All of this is under the assumption we know the full box design. Which we don't.

 

[Exalt4747]

Okay but

Again

That's not Incineroar's crotch, christ.

 

[dezeray112]

Question:

Team Box?

Or

Team CoroCoro?

Hard to say, but if I were to pick one, I would opt for Team Coro Coro.

 

[Cosmic77]

Question:

Team Box?

Or

Team CoroCoro?

CoroCoro.

Five unrevealed stages and only one unique character left? It could happen, but I doubt it. We already have a ton of stages, so I don't see why Sakurai would feel pressured to make more unless (1) the stages are from extremely popular games like BotW and Odyssey, or (2) we got a newcomer like Inklings or Simon who would warrant a new stage.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

The direct part sounds fine, but boy would I rather we get it sooner than that.

I'd rather have it happen later for one good reason.

That Direct would give us everything we need to know. Then we'd get nothing until launch.

The wait between knowing everything and the game's release would be less painful if it was shorter.

 

[Exalt4747]

I'd rather have it happen later for one good reason.

That Direct would give us everything we need to know. Then we'd get nothing until launch.

The wait between knowing everything and the game's release would be less painful if it was shorter.

Well, this is an odd case because that's a sound argument, but one that doesn't apply to me personally. I want to see Incineroar.

 

[uebo7]

All of this is under the assumption we know the full box design. Which we don't.

We basically do. You'd have to ague for why certain decisions were made with the design if that weren't the case--about why they were split into 9-character sets in a way that perfectly fill out the box with their current size and aspect ratio, and why Corrin was placed in the deliberate way in which he was.

 

[TaichiYaegashi]

I lean more towards the box then CoroCoro just because of the evidence we've gathered for the box theory and I honestly feel that it's the most likely scenario at this point. Oh and when I say evidence for the box theory, I don't mean undeniable proof it's true or something crazy like that. Until we have evidence from Sakurai himself that the box theory is debunked, that's what I'm sticking with. Otherwise I'm just gonna get caught up in fan theories against a fan theory and that just gets annoying after awhile.

I'd love for the CoroCoro leak to, in the end, prove the box theory as false however. Or really, as soon as possible.


As for Incineroar, I was first wanting Buzzwole or Decidueye but the more I look up Incineroar information and think on it, the more ok I get when it comes to Incineroar being our new Pokemon.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

Ok, hold the damn phone. Are we seriously suggesting that all 5 of the stages are from new and existing franchises, that also don't have a character? Like, I could see 1 maybe but 5? I highly doubt that. I can't really see Inceneroar getting a stage either. Geno? Maybe we could talk about that but it seems like everyone who believes in the Box Theaory believes that the last two are Ken and Inceneroar

Take into consideration that there has only been what, 8(?) stages like that in ALL of Smash. Less so if Smashville and the Mii stages aren't included. What games do we expect to get a stage treatment but not a character treatment? I could see maybe Rythm Heaven but even then there's characters from there that I consider likely. Could they be from already represented franchises? Sure, but why would they wait so long to show it if they aren't also getting a character? I just don't see a game getting a stage without also getting a character. Maybe Nintendoland? But, again why not already show it?

Believe me I understand that the CoroCoro "leak" doesn't necessarily contradict the box theory but I personally fell like believing both is foolish. Because, basing off what we've already gotten, they wouldn't have hesitated to show off a stage that wasn't going to get a character. At most I feel like they could show a stage that would eventually get a character a la Boxing Stage and Little Mac but that doesn't see anymore likely. Sure, they don't contradict each other but there's no logic to them holding back stages unless it's for new characters. It doesn't make any logical sense.

 

[Hydrualic Hydra]

MUST I RELEASE MY BRETHREN FROM THE CHAINS OF THIS BOX

No but really I don't particularly 'believe' -BOX THEORY- but I've tempered my expectations to be willing to accept it as a possibility. I'm fine with it as a be-all end-all, but until we ACTUALLY get anything that disproves it I'm ready to only have 2 more characters. And as far as CoroCoro is concerned, getting 5 more stages really doesn't auto-disprove -BOX THEORY-, but I'm inclined to believe the magazine at least knows what it's talking about, though I find it extremely hokey they just let CoroCoro spill the beans without even showcasing any of these 5 new stages, and especially that CoroCoro got to break the news before Sakurai. I mean, they're super-official, but they could have TRIED to put a little more tact into deciding to unveil the new stage total this way.

 

[Aeon Lupin]

Ok, hold the damn phone. Are we seriously suggesting that all 5 of the stages are from new franchises, that also don't have a character? Like, I could see 1 maybe but 5? I highly doubt that. I can't really see Inceneroar getting a stage either. Geno? Maybe we could talk about that but it seems like everyone who believes in the Box Theaory believes that the last two are Ken and Inceneroar

Take into consideration that there has only been what, 8(?) stages like that in ALL of Smash. Less so if Smashville and the Mii stages aren't included. What games do we expect to get a stage treatment but not a character treatment? I could see maybe Rythm Heaven but even then there's characters from there that I consider likely. Could they be from already represented franchises? Sure, but why would they wait so long to show it if they aren't also getting a character? I just don't see a game getting a stage without also getting a character. Maybe Nintendoland? But, again why not already show it?

Believe me I understand that the CoroCoro "leak" doesn't necessarily contradict the box theory but I personally fell like believing both is foolish. Because, basing off what we've already gotten, they wouldn't have hesitated to show off a stage that wasn't going to get a character. At most I feel like they could show a stage that would eventually get a character a la Boxing Stage and Little Mac but that doesn't see anymore likely. Sure, they don't contradict each other but there's no logic to them holding back stages unless it's for new characters. It doesn't make any logical sense.

I still believe Incineroar will get a new stage. Pokemon has yet to get one, and every new Pokemon rep has come with a new stage from the current gen.

 

[uebo7]

Ok, hold the damn phone. Are we seriously suggesting that all 5 of the stages are from new franchises, that also don't have a character? Like, I could see 1 maybe but 5? I highly doubt that. I can't really see Inceneroar getting a stage either. Geno? Maybe we could talk about that but it seems like everyone who believes in the Box Theaory believes that the last two are Ken and Inceneroar

Take into consideration that there has only been what, 8(?) stages like that in ALL of Smash. Less so if Smashville and the Mii stages aren't included. What games do we expect to get a stage treatment but not a character treatment? I could see maybe Rythm Heaven but even then there's characters from there that I consider likely. Could they be from already represented franchises? Sure, but why would they wait so long to show it if they aren't also getting a character? I just don't see a game getting a stage without also getting a character. Maybe Nintendoland? But, again why not already show it?

Believe me I understand that the CoroCoro "leak" doesn't necessarily contradict the box theory but I personally fell like believing both is foolish. Because, basing off what we've already gotten, they wouldn't have hesitated to show off a stage that wasn't going to get a character. At most I feel like they could show a stage that would eventually get a character a la Boxing Stage and Little Mac but that doesn't see anymore likely. Sure, they don't contradict each other but there's no logic to them holding back stages unless it's for new characters. It doesn't make any logical sense.

I simply think that it's misinformation in general from Coro Coro. I expect those stage slots to be filled up with DLC character related stages.

 

[Deleted member]

Inb4 the remaining Echo is actually Soren :^)

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

MUST I RELEASE MY BRETHREN FROM THE CHAINS OF THIS BOX

No but really I don't particularly 'believe' -BOX THEORY- but I've tempered my expectations to be willing to accept it as a possibility. I'm fine with it as a be-all end-all, but until we ACTUALLY get anything that disproves it I'm ready to only have 2 more characters. And as far as CoroCoro is concerned, getting 5 more stages really doesn't auto-disprove -BOX THEORY-, but I'm inclined to believe the magazine at least knows what it's talking about, though I find it extremely hokey they just let CoroCoro spill the beans without even showcasing any of these 5 new stages, and especially that CoroCoro got to break the news before Sakurai. I mean, they're super-official, but they could have TRIED to put a little more tact into deciding to unveil the new stage total this way.

Honestly over all the Coro Coro thing is confusing...wither it's a misprint or they leaked something they weren't supposed to..and yet either way they would have to take action right?

Apologize for the typo, or try to cover up the leak in some way? Like would Nintendo/Coro Coro just let that slide by and go whelp what ya gunna do?

Actually in some ways it's similar to the box. It doesn't say what stages but reveals theres more, just as the box doesn't actually reveal any characters. Maybe Nintendo doesn't really mind that kind of leak. *Shrug*

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Ok, hold the damn phone. Are we seriously suggesting that all 5 of the stages are from new franchises, that also don't have a character? Like, I could see 1 maybe but 5? I highly doubt that. I can't really see Inceneroar getting a stage either. Geno? Maybe we could talk about that but it seems like everyone who believes in the Box Theaory believes that the last two are Ken and Inceneroar

Take into consideration that there has only been what, 8(?) stages like that in ALL of Smash. Less so if Smashville and the Mii stages aren't included. What games do we expect to get a stage treatment but not a character treatment? I could see maybe Rythm Heaven but even then there's characters from there that I consider likely. Could they be from already represented franchises? Sure, but why would they wait so long to show it if they aren't also getting a character? I just don't see a game getting a stage without also getting a character. Maybe Nintendoland? But, again why not already show it?

Believe me I understand that the CoroCoro "leak" doesn't necessarily contradict the box theory but I personally fell like believing both is foolish. Because, basing off what we've already gotten, they wouldn't have hesitated to show off a stage that wasn't going to get a character. At most I feel like they could show a stage that would eventually get a character a la Boxing Stage and Little Mac but that doesn't see anymore likely. Sure, they don't contradict each other but there's no logic to them holding back stages unless it's for new characters. It doesn't make any logical sense.

Who said they'd all be from franchises without a playable character?

 

[KMDP]

Both the August and September were in the earlier parts of the month, or at least the September one was supposed to be, and the release date is of course also early on in December. If we get any news next month I wonder if it'll also be early on, feels like it'd be a short wait, but of course we were always going to have to wait a week less after the Direct got delayed, and I doubt it has changed their plans. I also wonder when we'll get our last news in November, I feel like it's almost guaranteed we'll get something early that month as they won't risk scheduling too close to release, but at the same time a month's wait with no news might not be the best strategy

My guess is that we'll get a repeat of the 50-Fact Extravaganza either October 30th/November 1st or November 6th/8th (not necessarily a 50FE, but something similar).

These dates are the Tuesday and Thursday before and after the Smash Switch Bundle releases (which releases Friday like pretty much all Game releases), respectively; they likely timed the release of the Bundle to coincide with a big blowout of information (in Japan, the 50-fact Extravaganza was called "Super Smash Bros. for Wii U: 50 Reasons Why").

I would fully expect this hypothetical Smash Direct to have 2-5 characters (some Newcomers, some Echoes), but the focus will be moreso on stuff like Spirits and the like. Like the 50-Fact Extravaganza, you can bet there'll be a DLC announcement in this Direct too.

 

[Kaeltor]

Question:

Team Box?

Or

Team CoroCoro?

Neither. I'm team Vergeben.

 

[SlickWylde]

You know, I get confused whenever I hear people cite Bayonetta as an underwhelming reveal. Maybe it's just bias on my part, but I remember quite a few people, myself included, wanted her in the game.

I think there were an equal amount of people who really weren't excited for her, and an even larger group of people who shrugged and went "Oh, ok." The amount of hype from her fans was huge, but she didn't have nearly as much universal hype as some of the other newcomers.

 

[Untouch]

I find it really hard to believe that people only think we're getting 103 stages.
Looking at the 3DS and 64 stage layouts (which are the only two grid based stage select screen layouts along with ultimate), stages are unlocked in the exact same way, the stages don't center in the grid ever, because in both cases the grid is completely full of stages. I don't think it'd even be in a grid like that otherwise (looking at Brawl and WiiU here).

 

[Deleted member]

Take into consideration that there has only been what, 8(?) stages like that in ALL of Smash. Less so if Smashville and the Mii stages aren't included. What games do we expect to get a stage treatment but not a character treatment?

Minecraft? If the last two characters are Ken and Incineroar, we have reason to believe Minecraft content is coming. As for why they took so long to reveal the stage, maybe they didn't want Minecraft overshadowing Castlevania, and nothing new for 3rd parties was revealed at E3. Kind of weak reasoning, but it's all I got.

So the last 5 stages (if true) could be something like, new Pokemon stage, Minecraft, and 3 missing past stages (Mute City, Poke Floats, Rainbow Road).

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

Who said they'd all be from franchises without a playable character?

I didn't mean that, dude. I meant do we expect to get all new stages without a playable character? As in new stages for Pokemon, Street Fighter, etc. without getting a new character with those stages as well. Sure, new franchises are definitely included in that, more likely maybe if we go by past Smash games.

Edit: Returning stages ARE also a possibility but again, why not go ahead and show those?

 

[monadoboy]

https://imgur.com/o31DlaI

So Ignoring verg and going off the box theory and music theory I can still hope for a Shulk Echo? A tiny bit of hype restored : )

 

[uebo7]

Neither. I'm team Vergeben.

Team box does not contradict Vergeben. In fact, it's corroborated by him more than anything. See his latest statements:
https://imgur.com/92mLBdW

 

[Murlough]

I find it really hard to believe that people only think we're getting 103 stages.
Looking at the 3DS and 64 stage layouts (which are the only two grid based stage select screen layouts along with ultimate), stages are unlocked in the exact same way, the stages don't center in the grid ever, because in both cases the grid is completely full of stages. I don't think it'd even be in a grid like that otherwise (looking at Brawl and WiiU here).

Seeing “only” before 103 stages makes me a little sick.

Anyway, DLC stages are probably going to be a thing again anyway so a perfect grid can be fixed later if its absolutely necessary (spoilers: it isn’t).

 

[King Sonnn DeDeDoo]

So this has probably been thrown out before, but how would you feel if the rumored Minecraft content in Smash is actually the new stage builder? It may seem kind of unorthodox to implement a series through a mode rather than a character, but I feel this would be a great way to implement Minecraft content into smash.

Since we no longer have a Wii U game pad to work with, I imagine that they’ll go back to a grid based system rather than a free form drawing system for stage creation. The best way you could implement the core idea of Minecraft, a sandbox game about survival and creative expression through manipulation of blocks, is by a stage creation that allows you to manipulate blocks to create your own stages.

 

[uebo7]

So Ignoring verg and going off the box theory and music theory I can still hope for a Shulk Echo? A tiny bit of hype restored : )

You don't even have to ignore Verg, though. Look at his quote on that image, he strongly implies that DLC will be a thing himself.

 

[Murlough]

So this has probably been thrown out before, but how would you feel if the rumored Minecraft content in Smash is actually the new stage builder? It may seem kind of unorthodox to implement a series through a mode rather than a character, but I feel this would be a great way to implement Minecraft content into smash.

Since we no longer have a Wii U game pad to work with, I imagine that they’ll go back to a grid based system rather than a free form drawing system for stage creation. The best way you could implement the core idea of Minecraft, a sandbox game about survival and creative expression through manipulation of blocks, is by a stage creation that allows you to manipulate blocks to create your own stages.

I saw that on reddit, too. The idea is kinda neat but if the stage builder looks anything like Minecraft I probably won’t touch it. If its like an optional build mode then cool, but I’d prefer Brawl’s build maker just be ported over instead of being forced to use Minecraft blocks.

 

[Untouch]

Seeing “only” before 103 stages makes me a little sick.

Anyway, DLC stages are probably going to be a thing again anyway so a perfect grid can be fixed later if its absolutely necessary (spoilers: it isn’t).

I don't "only" in that way, 103 is a lot of stages obviously.

Also I don't think the empty slots will be for DLC stages, they were separated in the 3DS and WiiU games and that'd limit them to 5 possible DLC stages, 3DS and WiiU had 8 DLC stages.

 

[MSmariosonic]

So this has probably been thrown out before, but how would you feel if the rumored Minecraft content in Smash is actually the new stage builder? It may seem kind of unorthodox to implement a series through a mode rather than a character, but I feel this would be a great way to implement Minecraft content into smash.

Since we no longer have a Wii U game pad to work with, I imagine that they’ll go back to a grid based system rather than a free form drawing system for stage creation. The best way you could implement the core idea of Minecraft, a sandbox game about survival and creative expression through manipulation of blocks, is by a stage creation that allows you to manipulate blocks to create your own stages.

An entire mode dedicated to one 3rd party franchise seems unlikely

 

[Michele]

Inb4 the remaining Echo is actually Soren :^)

To be honest, when we try to bring up what would be the echo for Robin, everyone points to him. Why?

Soren's not at all similar to Robin. I always see peoples comparing Robin to Soren, at least from my experience.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Sigh.

Verge.

Did.

Not.

Back.

The.

Stupid.

Box.

Theory.

He said he's looking into it and nothing more. He's team neutral on it essentially.

Please team box. I know you want to really be right about this, but please stop bending Verge's words and leaks to fit this box theory agenda going on.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

The weird ****ing thing about this 108 stages thing is that it fits perfectly. 5 more stages and then a tab to go to the DLC stages fills out that Stage Select Screen very nicely. It'd be different if it was 109 because then where does the DLC stages go? It's weird man.

 

[Deleted member]

So Ignoring verg and going off the box theory and music theory I can still hope for a Shulk Echo? A tiny bit of hype restored : )

Let’s get Zanza in there sense Sakurai clearly doesn’t care about spoilers.

 

[Untouch]

I've seen some people say that they can't do 108 because they need a button for Stage Builder stages as well but I don't agree, Brawl had 3 pages for stages so I don't see how they can't do that again.

 

[Xgears]

Don't you guys have better stuff to discuss rather than:
-placeholder box
-Vergeben
-108 Stages
There's nothing new to be said about those anymore, let's move on.

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

Sigh.

Verge.

Did.

Not.

Back.

The.

Stupid.

Box.

Theory.

He said he's looking into it and nothing more. He's team neutral on it essentially.

Please team box. I know you want to really be right about this, but please stop bending Verge's words and leaks to fit this box theory agenda going on.

Although I know you're not reffering to me, I do want to point out I don't want to be right. I don't think anyone seriously considering the box theory wants to be right (and if they do I can only imagine it's because of wanting Ken or something...).

I really hope it's wrong. And I do think Vergeben is more credible so as soon as he comes out and says the SE rep is definitely base, or mentions any other characters, then boom I'll basically be done with it.


Unrelated, but for the music theory are we counting on AC music being revealed this week? Would it disprove it if it weren't? There's a lot of reason to expect it will be since the Pikmin song was pulled from a week in advance.

Don't you guys have better stuff to discuss rather than:
-placeholder box
-Vergeben
-108 Stages
There's nothing new to be said about those anymore, let's move on.

I get this sentiment, but there's nothing new to he said about a lot of things if you've been around since March lol. Actually I'd be interested in talking more about the 108 stages, it at least doesn't squash speculation like the box.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

So this might be a dumb question, but after Ridley, Simon and Isabelle, Do most of you believe Vergeben?

 

[Potato_]

Minecraft? If the last two characters are Ken and Incineroar, we have reason to believe Minecraft content is coming. As for why they took so long to reveal the stage, maybe they didn't want Minecraft overshadowing Castlevania, and nothing new for 3rd parties was revealed at E3. Kind of weak reasoning, but it's all I got.

So the last 5 stages (if true) could be something like, new Pokemon stage, Minecraft, and 3 missing past stages (Mute City, Poke Floats, Rainbow Road).

Why would they show off every returning stage but those three then? What's so special about them to warrant hiding them? I'm of the belief that those stages didn't make it because they were either too similar to other stages, are a ***** to fight on, or don't work at all with Stage Morph.

I feel like if you're on team both, you have to accept the fact that all 3 of those possible stages would be a mixture of a SF stage, Smash originals (which begs the question of WHY they wouldn't show it, unless it's related to Spirits) and a stage for a series with no characters.

 

[Deleted member]

Although I know you're not reffering to me, I do want to point out I don't want to be right. I don't think anyone seriously considering the box theory wants to be right (and if they do I can only imagine it's because of wanting Ken or something...).

I really hope it's wrong. And I do think Vergeben is more credible so as soon as he comes out and says the SE rep is definitely base, or mentions any other characters, then boom I'll basically be done with it.


Unrelated, but for the music theory are we counting on AC music being revealed this week? Would it disprove it if it weren't? There's a lot of reason to expect it will be since the Pikmin song was pulled from a week in advance.

Music Theory will effectively be disproven if the song this week is not from Animal Crossing.