Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Nethermoosen]

Spoiler: Not Smash related but interesting nonetheless

Well, it's a long story.

From what we in the community know, Sueprbot (the developer) was given a shoestring budget and very little help from Sony in securing licenses for third party characters. As a result, they were largely at the complete mercy of rights holders. This is horribly evident in Raiden and DmC Dante, who were pretty much demanded.

Heihachi, Big Daddy, and Isaac Clarke were the only third parties who worked with Superbot to make their characters feel great. Namco wrote all of Heihachi's dialogue, 2K lent them Ken Lavine for story and direction, and EA sent over tons of material to make Isaac as accurate as possible while letting them use pretty much whatever they wanted from it.

Konami wanted Raiden because maketing, and he wasn't allowed to use any of his weapons because spoilers. Same for Dante. We have confirmation that Lara Croft was pitched but SE wanted TR to come out before Lara was playable in anything else. Abe from Oddworld was DLC, paired with Dart, but after Isaac and Zeus (from God of War... yes...) didn't sell, plans were cancelled. We only know this from concept art and Oddworld developers accidentally letting it slip in a tweet.

We know there was a Final Fantasy item in the game that got removed thanks to leaked pre-release screenshots of the debug menu item list.

Now this next part is all potentially my memory going fuzzy, but I'll throw it out just in case. IIRC, a leaker showed up and bought some credibility by showing some concept art that was later released. They ranted about how licensing was an utter mess and they legitimately tried to make everyone happy but the money and the support wasn't there. Activision didn't want Spyro to seem "better" on any one platform because Skylanders and had no plans for Crash so they weren't able to secure them. (This is somewhat supported by an unverified Activision intern who did an interview, but they claimed it was more about money.) FF13 was "big" at the time so SE basically told them Lightning or STFU. Ryu Hayabusa was supposed to be her rival. Those two would have added development time and Tecmo didn't want Ryu to be DLC, so thanks to the Rival system, they were both cut. We don't know the veracity of this because there hasn't been much pre-release info datamined save some screenshots, one video, and concept art. Many others were difficult to obtain because nobody "wanted their characters to be shot in the face with real guns and stabbed by serial killers." They also said that basically the only time Sony stepped in was to tell them they couldn't do something. They also said that Vita crossplay hobbled the entire game. Imagine the 3DS development drain, but now they had to be 100% cross-compatible.

These next rumors are unsourced but I've seen them passed around and they're sad enough to be believable.
They also claimed they tried to reach real hard for just about anything, IIRC Krome (of Ty the Tasmanian Tiger) were really excited about the project. Croc was also supposedly sought. Both fell through, allegedly because Sony stepped in to say "No." These are probably hearsay but I'd buy it.

Really, the entire game was a perfect storm of poor timing, no support, and awful logistical choices. I fully believe if the Vita was buried, Crash and Spyro remasters were coming, FF13 was forgotten, and Lara's game was out, we'd have had a very very different roster.

I don't know why people are so opposed to calling Smash a fighting game. It's a game. You fight. End of story.

Arbitrary definitions for genres that were created by people who had no idea how much people would bicker over them, as if they made a difference.

 

[Blue7113]

Alright here’s a game.

Out of these possible newcomers:
-Geno
-Issac
-Isabelle
-Bandana Dee
-Shadow
-Rayman
-Banjo
-Incinaroar

Who do you think you’ll end up maining regardless if you supported them or not?

Banjo or Isaac, and as a secondary, Bandana Dee

 

[osby]

All this Persona talk reminded ne my most wanted character is a teenager who repeatedly shoots himself in the head and Nintendo might have small problems with the concept.

 

[Deleted member]

FNAF hasn't been on a Nintendo console before, therefore he's not in.

Final Fantasy VII.

 

[CosmicQuark]

I thought this might be 30 days of NES games and Cloud storage for free, you know?
So 30 more days after the "real" service launches.

From the post, it looks like they could start the free service now--which doesn't make sense, since the NES/cloud features aren't out yet. But it's anecdotal and the post is a bit ambiguous. I was specifically referring to the online portion, since they announced it as a free trial before going paid... and then delayed it a year.

 

[Zathura]

So is the leak legit? What are we waiting on? Until the day ends because I think the announcement was supposed to be today?

No one knows for sure if there's gonna be an announcement today or tomorrow or if the leaks are correct, we'll just have to wait and see

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

FNAF hasn't been on a Nintendo console before, therefore he's not in.

FNAF is going to be announced for Switch in the same direct

 

[MasterOfKnees]

Alright here’s a game.

Out of these possible newcomers:
-Geno
-Issac
-Isabelle
-Bandana Dee
-Shadow
-Rayman
-Banjo
-Incinaroar

Who do you think you’ll end up maining regardless if you supported them or not?

If I was forced to main someone from this pool of characters it'd probably be Bandana Dee, he'd likely be a simple character with a heavy focus on a tipper mechanic, and that works alright for me, plus I'm a Kirby fan. Geno and Isaac also have potential to be characters I'd enjoy, but they'd be more likely to have some kind of gimmick that might put me off of them.

I don't think they could add any character I'd be absolutely set on playing seriously at this point though, I've got all of my favorites, I'm very lucky in that regard. Skull Kid would be the closest, but even he would depend a lot on how he'd play.

 

[P1ZZ4CHU]

He's not talking about Smash lol

He's not talking about Smash lol

That's what I get for multiposting

 

[AwesomeAussie27]

Back with more polls. Took a break since I was on a fishing trip. But yeah, the winner of the last Namco poll was Valkyrie. Don-Chan and Rick Taylor had a decent following while few seem to care about Wonder Momo.

Moving on to another big Namco series, is the famous arena fighter Tekken. There are loads of characters to choose from, but I’ll go with the most popular for now. Your choices are Heihachi Mishima, Jin Kazama, King, and Yoshimitsu.

There was a problem fetching the tweet

Begin!

 

[Abha]

Final Fantasy VII.

Freddy deniers on the pain train tonight, he's in and there is nothing you can do to stop him.

 

[Dee Dude]

People seem to forget that this is Smash Bros of all games we’re talking about, any 3rd Party company would loudly vouch for their characters in the game.

The slumber party makes a nice hint but it means nothing atm.

Heck, as a Banjo supporter, I should know that Phil wanting them in as well as Ninty and Mirco’s recent cross play doesn’t guarantee their inclusion.

 

[staindgrey]

No, if we got another Fates character it'd (thankfully) be Azura, not...her. She's almost like the mascot of Fates and could also incorporate water bending into her moveset.

I want to agree, but Azura didn't even make it into the release roster of FE Warriors. Somehow.

I would actually welcome Azura, to be honest. Despite everything I don't like about Fates, I actually really like her character design.

 

[Deleted member]

Freddy deniers on the pain train tonight, he's in and there is nothing you can do to stop him.

Finally, it's time.

 

[KMDP]

Final Fantasy VII.

Theatrhythm Final Fantasy and Kingdom Hearts Chain of Memories.

 

[Shroob]

So is the leak legit? What are we waiting on? Until the day ends because I think the announcement was supposed to be today?

It has until tomorrow night(it's the 4th in the usa right now)

It's not looking good unless they announce a direct the day before.

 

[Nethermoosen]

Final Fantasy VII.

Kingdom hearts DDD, 35863/2 days, Chain of Memories for GBA.

 

[Deleted member]

All this talk of Persona has made me realize who the true best Echo option for Inkling is. I can't believe I was so blind, it was staring me in the face this whole time...

Spoiler

View attachment 161811

/thisisaveryoriginaljokeplzgivelotsoflikes

...In all seriousness, though, the small resemblance to Inkling is probably one of the reasons she's my favorite P5 character, lol.

....I never noticed...I feel so blind! I really have to go and beat Persona 5. I played it, loved it, but didn't get a chance to finish due to needing surgery. It was such a sucky time and afterwards, I just mentally associated Persona 5 with the surgery, so I never went back to it. I got pretty far too...continue or restart? I can devote my time to a different in-game relationship too. I was in pretty good with the Dr. Darn...gotta think about this now lol. Between Persona 5 and DQ XI, I'll have my time occupied up until Smash at least.

 

[Abha]

Finally, it's time.

View attachment 161812

Freddie calls into the smash at 1-900-490-FREAK

 

[P1ZZ4CHU]

It has until tomorrow night(it's the 4th in the usa right now)

It's not looking good unless they announce a direct the day before.

Have we ever really gotten a Direct with that kind of content only a day before? Seems like the kind of thing you'd announce at least a week in advance.

 

[Deleted member]

Theatrhythm Final Fantasy and Kingdom Hearts Chain of Memories.

Kingdom hearts DDD, 35863/2 days, Chain of Memories for GBA.

You're not wrong, but

This clearly says Final Fantasy VII.

Freddy's coming.

 

[Pyra]

Back with more polls. Took a break since I was on a fishing trip. But yeah, the winner of the last Namco poll was Valkyrie. Don-Chan and Rick Taylor had a decent following while few seem to care about Wonder Momo.

Moving on to another big Namco series, is the famous arena fighter Tekken. There are loads of characters to choose from, but I’ll go with the most popular for now. Your choices are Heihachi Mishima, Jin Kazama, King, and Yoshimitsu.

There was a problem fetching the tweet

Begin!

Please give me Yoshimitsu. Round out that Tekken and Soul Calibur representation.
Then we'll need a Walking Dead character to catch up with Tekken's roster.

 

[ZephyrZ]

I want to agree, but Azura didn't even make it into the release roster of FE Warriors. Somehow.

I'm not sure that really counts for much when Warrior's roster was such a huge mess to begin with.
Besides, Hinoka made it in over Azura as well.

 

[Shroob]

Have we ever really gotten a Direct with that kind of content only a day before? Seems like the kind of thing you'd announce at least a week in advance.

We've had Directs announced the day before, iirc the march one was.

 

[Deleted member]

Freddie calls into the smash at 1-900-480-FREAK

He's a DLC character that costs $2 a match.

 

[Nethermoosen]

I found a 4Chan leak that resembles the Smashboards leak, but the user changed random pieces of information. Some is identical, others completely different and it’s very clear it’s fake. Also, no mention of a gullible pokemon

http://boards.4chan.org/v/thread/430281509/nintendo-direct-september-6

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

Spoiler: Not Smash related but interesting nonetheless

Well, it's a long story.

From what we in the community know, Superbot (the developer) was given a shoestring budget and very little help from Sony in securing licenses for third party characters. As a result, they were largely at the complete mercy of rights holders. This is horribly evident in Raiden and DmC Dante, who were pretty much demanded.

Heihachi, Big Daddy, and Isaac Clarke were the only third parties who worked with Superbot to make their characters feel great. Namco wrote all of Heihachi's dialogue, 2K lent them Ken Lavine for story and direction, and EA sent over tons of material to make Isaac as accurate as possible while letting them use pretty much whatever they wanted from it.

Konami wanted Raiden because maketing, and he wasn't allowed to use any of his weapons because spoilers. Same for Dante. We have confirmation that Lara Croft was pitched but SE wanted TR to come out before Lara was playable in anything else. Abe from Oddworld was DLC, paired with Dart, but after Isaac and Zeus (from God of War... yes...) didn't sell, plans were cancelled. We only know this from concept art and Oddworld developers accidentally letting it slip in a tweet.

We know there was a Final Fantasy item in the game that got removed thanks to leaked pre-release screenshots of the debug menu item list.

Now this next part is all potentially my memory going fuzzy, but I'll throw it out just in case. IIRC, a leaker showed up and bought some credibility by showing some concept art that was later released. They ranted about how licensing was an utter mess and they legitimately tried to make everyone happy but the money and the support wasn't there. Activision didn't want Spyro to seem "better" on any one platform because Skylanders and had no plans for Crash so they weren't able to secure them. (This is somewhat supported by an unverified Activision intern who did an interview, but they claimed it was more about money.) FF13 was "big" at the time so SE basically told them Lightning or STFU. Ryu Hayabusa was supposed to be her rival. Those two would have added development time, and they tried to push them back as DLC. Tecmo didn't want Ryu to be DLC, so thanks to the Rival system, they were both cut. We don't know the veracity of this because there hasn't been much pre-release info datamined save some screenshots, one video, and concept art. Many others were difficult to obtain because nobody "wanted their characters to be shot in the face with real guns and stabbed by serial killers." They also said that basically the only time Sony stepped in was to tell them they couldn't do something. They also said that Vita crossplay hobbled the entire game. Imagine the 3DS development drain, but now they had to be 100% cross-compatible.

These next rumors are unsourced but I've seen them passed around and they're sad enough to be believable.
They also claimed they tried to reach real hard for just about anything, IIRC Krome (of Ty the Tasmanian Tiger) were really excited about the project. Croc was also supposedly sought. Both fell through, allegedly because Sony stepped in to say "No." These are probably hearsay but I'd buy it.

Really, the entire game was a perfect storm of poor timing, no support, and awful logistical choices. I fully believe if the Vita was buried, Crash and Spyro remasters were coming, FF13 was forgotten, and Lara's game was out, we'd have had a very very different roster.

I don't know why people are so opposed to calling Smash a fighting game. It's a game. You fight. End of story.

EDIT: I completely misread that as part of another comment chain

Wow, I feel really bad for the developers, and I feel bad for ****ting on the game, some of the gameplay concepts are pretty terrible but it's pretty clear they wanted to actually make something good and sony basically said "**** you"

 

[Michele]

That's what I get for multiposting

You know...I have a question. If you played Melee when you were a kid, would you have still played as Pichu?

Zinith has thought of that question himself, but he said that he wouldn't have been this cute but voracious Yoshi today if he played that game. Like, the art of Yoshi was not very appealing. Then I replied to him saying that I could have said the same for you

Back with more polls. Took a break since I was on a fishing trip. But yeah, the winner of the last Namco poll was Valkyrie. Don-Chan and Rick Taylor had a decent following while few seem to care about Wonder Momo.

Moving on to another big Namco series, is the famous arena fighter Tekken. There are loads of characters to choose from, but I’ll go with the most popular for now. Your choices are Heihachi Mishima, Jin Kazama, King, and Yoshimitsu.

There was a problem fetching the tweet

Begin!

Heeeeey Jibanyaaaaan!! Great to see you back.

But to be honest, most if not everyone will just choose Heihachi as the obvious choice. He's the protagonist, right?

 

[T-Hell]

What a boooring day today in Smashboards. Man, let's hope this damn Direct is announced soon. No offense btw.

 

[Nethermoosen]

You're not wrong, but
View attachment 161813

This clearly says Final Fantasy VII.

Freddy's coming.

I would think his origin is indeed more important to his character than KH.

 

[Rayman001]

Have we ever really gotten a Direct with that kind of content only a day before? Seems like the kind of thing you'd announce at least a week in advance.

As far as I remember, Nintendo always announced Directs a few days before they go live at most. Sometimes just a day before, can't remember them announcing one a week before, ever.

Edit: Except E3 Directs.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I found a 4Chan leak that resembles the Smashboards leak, but the user changed random pieces of information. Some is identical, others completely different and it’s very clear it’s fake. Also, no mention of a gullible pokemon

http://boards.4chan.org/v/thread/430281509/nintendo-direct-september-6

BIGGERFIREBALL FOR SMASH

 

[Dee Dude]

I don’t even care about a newcomer/echo reveal at this point, all I want is an overview of the Spirits mode.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Freddy is coming with a Foxy echo.

Just remember to avoid the purple guy on the pizzeria stage.

 

[Deleted member]

Final Fantasy VII.

Well...technically speaking, Cloud was on the GBA once. He was in Kingdom Hearts: Chain of Memories; he was both a card and someone fought, so to say Cloud has never been on Nintendo is false. Hooray for loopholes!

 

[Nethermoosen]

I don’t even care about a newcomer/echo reveal at this point, all I want is an overview of the Spirits mode.

I just want a damn demo with K. Rool so I can feed my addiction and get on with my life.

 

[BlueMagician]

Spoiler: Not Smash related but interesting nonetheless

Well, it's a long story.

From what we in the community know, Superbot (the developer) was given a shoestring budget and very little help from Sony in securing licenses for third party characters. As a result, they were largely at the complete mercy of rights holders. This is horribly evident in Raiden and DmC Dante, who were pretty much demanded.

Heihachi, Big Daddy, and Isaac Clarke were the only third parties who worked with Superbot to make their characters feel great. Namco wrote all of Heihachi's dialogue, 2K lent them Ken Lavine for story and direction, and EA sent over tons of material to make Isaac as accurate as possible while letting them use pretty much whatever they wanted from it.

Konami wanted Raiden because maketing, and he wasn't allowed to use any of his weapons because spoilers. Same for Dante. We have confirmation that Lara Croft was pitched but SE wanted TR to come out before Lara was playable in anything else. Abe from Oddworld was DLC, paired with Dart, but after Isaac and Zeus (from God of War... yes...) didn't sell, plans were cancelled. We only know this from concept art and Oddworld developers accidentally letting it slip in a tweet.

We know there was a Final Fantasy item in the game that got removed thanks to leaked pre-release screenshots of the debug menu item list.

Now this next part is all potentially my memory going fuzzy, but I'll throw it out just in case. IIRC, a leaker showed up and bought some credibility by showing some concept art that was later released. They ranted about how licensing was an utter mess and they legitimately tried to make everyone happy but the money and the support wasn't there. Activision didn't want Spyro to seem "better" on any one platform because Skylanders and had no plans for Crash so they weren't able to secure them. (This is somewhat supported by an unverified Activision intern who did an interview, but they claimed it was more about money.) FF13 was "big" at the time so SE basically told them Lightning or STFU. Ryu Hayabusa was supposed to be her rival. Those two would have added development time, and they tried to push them back as DLC. Tecmo didn't want Ryu to be DLC, so thanks to the Rival system, they were both cut. We don't know the veracity of this because there hasn't been much pre-release info datamined save some screenshots, one video, and concept art. Many others were difficult to obtain because nobody "wanted their characters to be shot in the face with real guns and stabbed by serial killers." They also said that basically the only time Sony stepped in was to tell them they couldn't do something. They also said that Vita crossplay hobbled the entire game. Imagine the 3DS development drain, but now they had to be 100% cross-compatible.

These next rumors are unsourced but I've seen them passed around and they're sad enough to be believable.
They also claimed they tried to reach real hard for just about anything, IIRC Krome (of Ty the Tasmanian Tiger) were really excited about the project. Croc was also supposedly sought. Both fell through, allegedly because Sony stepped in to say "No." These are probably hearsay but I'd buy it.

Really, the entire game was a perfect storm of poor timing, no support, and awful logistical choices. I fully believe if the Vita was buried, Crash and Spyro remasters were coming, FF13 was forgotten, and Lara's game was out, we'd have had a very very different roster.

I've heard more rumors about that game, including that the reason there's two Coles was that it was either two or none because of the rights holders. Or that the shoestring budget was the equivalent of a single Vita game. Or that Crash and Spyro would've cost more than the budget they had. Or that it wasn't supposed to be a Smash clone.

 

[Sharkarat]

Dear Sakurai, I hope so. I also really like this render, as it modernizes them while retaining their cartoonish charm. Though, if it turns out they're actually character #70, it means my uncontrollable hype will continue for another couple of months (it is the number I chose for their reveal, #70 being B&K and #71 being Geno, for last).

The modernizing is what I liked about it too, cause even tho Banjo was part of my childhood I don't like his classic design. It feels dated, like if designed purely for N64 (which it probably was) and never got a good rework. not big on the Smashified banjo because it didn't fix my problems with the design.
While i couldn't pinpoint why exactly I dislike Banjo's design, but this image really helped me:

• Bigger arms, It really help him feel like a cartoon bear.
• The Face. The snout only a little longer than the lower jaw. Classic Has a really long snout, and bear faces doesn't look like that at all.

These are both Things the Nuts & Bolts design did, but that design did other things wrong.

 

[osby]

FNaF in Smash? Well, it's a good thing we already have Timer item, that should come in handy.

 

[Noipoi]

Freddy is coming with a Foxy echo.

Just remember to avoid the purple guy on the pizzeria stage.

If you taunt enough Phone Guy will give you a call about who you're fighting.

Hello, hello? Make sure you avoid Wario's chomp move, we don't want a repeat of what happened in 87...