Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[DarkFalcon]

There's a ton of characters that definitely got a lot of ballot votes. Most of them probably won't make it. I'm sure the new echoes were popular picks but not high enough to consider them as a brand new character.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

That would easily work. Also her being mirroed would be hard to do since a lot of the hitboxes dont even have to change.
Id be ok with the shield appearing temporarily for her attacks

Unrelated...

Don’t get me wrong for a moment, Medusa would be perfect for Smash...but Sakurai seems to want Kid Icarus content in Smash to be set after Uprising, and Medusa is dead (unless someone managed to revive her with/without wasting many souls of course)...so for now Viridi (with a new model and all that) is still pretty viable to fight...and even if neither make it in, Viridi still has the Palutena’s Guidance and Mii Costume

Now if there’s a Kid Icarus character whom OBVIOUSLY has a chance for battle...

Spoiler

 

[Luigi The President]

Miyamoto will force paper mario to attack with nothing but a swarm of different coloured toads and asking for a better moveset will cause him to send a command to your switch forcing it to explode.

I don't even care at this point I just want him

Unrelated...

Don’t get me wrong for a moment, Medusa would be perfect for Smash...but Sakurai seems to want Kid Icarus content in Smash to be set after Uprising, and Medusa is dead (unless someone managed to revive her with/without wasting many souls of course)...so for now Viridi (with a new model and all that) is still pretty viable to fight...and even if neither make it in, Viridi still has the Palutena’s Guidance and Mii Costume

Now if there’s a Kid Icarus character whom OBVIOUSLY has a chance for battle...

Spoiler

View attachment 159178

Dark Samus and Ridley are also dead. I've also never seen him say he wants Uprising content to be strictly post-Uprising.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

Geno did not spike up to his pre-Brawl levels until Sakurai publically spoke about wanting to include Geno back during Brawl. Prior to that he was behind the likes of Paper Mario, Waluigi, Toad/Captain Toad, and probably even Daisy. You underestimate how many casual Smash Bros. fans there are that do not spend one minute on any sort of forums and just go with "hey I liked playing as that character in that game, they should go and be in this game" which would propel someone like Daisy a lot higher than veteran speculators think she would.

I remember her and Chrom doing really well on a Tumblr poll and people being shocked. K. Rool also did well on that poll.

There's a ton of characters that definitely got a lot of ballot votes. Most of them probably won't make it. I'm sure the new echoes were popular picks but not high enough to consider them as a brand new character.

I'm sure Isaac is making an appearance in Smash Ultimate. Whether he ends up an Assist Trophy or something else is a whole different matter.

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

Dark Samus didn't get a Mii costume and she got in due to overseas demand. Takamaru and Ashley got Mii costumes and they are still Assist Trophies.

That's not what I meant. Dark Samus definitely didn't do well enough to get a Mii costume, I believe that. Ashley and Takamaru had models in game so yeah that helped. However characters like Geno and King K got unique costumes, probably because they placed well in the ballot (and Sakurai likes them especially in the case of Geno). I'm saying it's surprising Isaac didn't get a Mii costume, especially if people think he did well on the ballot.

I think in the end he did well but no better than characters like Krystal who just became an AT.

 

[Onua]

Unrelated...

Don’t get me wrong for a moment, Medusa would be perfect for Smash...but Sakurai seems to want Kid Icarus content in Smash to be set after Uprising, and Medusa is dead (unless someone managed to revive her with/without wasting many souls of course)...so for now Viridi (with a new model and all that) is still pretty viable to fight...and even if neither make it in, Viridi still has the Palutena’s Guidance and Mii Costume

Now if there’s a Kid Icarus character whom OBVIOUSLY has a chance for battle...

Spoiler

View attachment 159178

Using if a character is alive or not in their games as an argument for them being in is quite frankly ridiculous and I never understood this line of reasoning from people
Also Viridi has no chance of showing up as a fighter. She is in the bomb reset stage. Casually deconfirmed like Ashley was, so shes not getting in. (especially since after ridley became playable pyrosphere was taken out)
If we get a new KI character it will be Medusa as an echo or Hades as a new character. No one else. Either one of these 2, both of them or no one.

 

[Paperchampion23]

Most recent article was very interesting. And I assume you've been over it a fair bit here
https://sourcegaming.info/2018/08/2...smash-direct-sakurais-famitsu-column-vol-561/

The two most interesting things are
1. Being very exact with stage count again, I'm convinced that this is the final count

2. Ballot absolutely having an impact.

To me, this screams Bandana Dee is getting in, while Isaac probably isn't due to stages (imo, wouldn't mind being wrong, don't hurt me)

As for Skull Kid, I think he'll be a "We get a lot of demand for a new Zelda character, and he's the most popular one" sort of deal, not necessarily the ballot. But maybe he did do well in the ballot? He refers to both Dark Samus and Chrom as popular picks despite both being deconfirmed in Smash 4.

The article specifies that they did the interview before the direct was released. The only thing it confirms about stages is that their goals was to get to 100. Who knows how many more they decided to add after. It COULD be nothing, yes, but it doesn't disprove there being more stages.

 

[Luigi The President]

I never see "Namco's making the game" and the Namco Mii costumes to explain each other.
Why are we assuming Heihachi and Lloyd did amazing in the Ballot when it very well just could've been Namco throwing in little costumes of their own characters?

 

[P.Kat]

Truth be told, Namco doesn't have too many obvious picks that jump out to people like Lloyd Irving, or anyone related to Tekken, Soul Calibur or Pac-Man. Klonoa's best (and possibly only) chance is if they included him to promote his movie that's currently under production hell.

If anything I can see them pick Valkyrie.

 

[Onua]

If we did get a 2nd namco character Id much rather have Nightmare from soul calibur. He fought Link once already and is super cool
Heihachi and lloyd just look so boring compared to him

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Unrelated...

Don’t get me wrong for a moment, Medusa would be perfect for Smash...but Sakurai seems to want Kid Icarus content in Smash to be set after Uprising, and Medusa is dead (unless someone managed to revive her with/without wasting many souls of course)...so for now Viridi (with a new model and all that) is still pretty viable to fight...and even if neither make it in, Viridi still has the Palutena’s Guidance and Mii Costume

Now if there’s a Kid Icarus character whom OBVIOUSLY has a chance for battle...

Spoiler

View attachment 159178

We can't really be certain if Sakurai will continue doing that, especially considering that we still don't know if the PGs will return.

Also, if the new Spirits mode does indeed have a story that involves reviving the spirits of the fallen, the decased KI cast might tie into that.

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

The article specifies that they did the interview before the direct was released. The only thing it confirms about stages is that their goals was to get to 100. Who knows how many more they decided to add after. It COULD be nothing, yes, but it doesn't disprove there being more stages.

If you include Battlefield, Big Battlefield, and Final Destination, then there are 103 stages–104 if you also add in the Training Stage. And if you factor in the Omega and Battlefield variants, then you have over 300!

They're being rather specific there with the count.

 

[Dixie Kong]

What would be your reaction if the rest of the roster severely disappoints? (disappoints in your view and in the communities?)

 

[Noipoi]

Assuming the 103 stages are all we're getting before DLC, the remaining newcomers would have to be part of a series already in the game.
So something like, Geno for Mario, Incineroar for Pokemon, Isabelle for Animal Crossing, Bandanna Dee for Kirby, Skull Kid for Zelda, etc.
Those games have characters already.

 

[Arcanir]

Heihachi and Isabelle got their costumes the day the ballot started, meaning that they were not influenced by it.

The ballot started on April 1st, the Bundle that their costumes were a part of came out in mid-June. While we do have to take into account the developers actually making the costume, that still about two months to collect and respond to preliminary results and possibly make Mii costumes out of them.

Granted, that doesn't mean it was definitely the case, but the possibility is there to consider.

 

[Deleted member]

What would be your reaction if the rest of the roster severely disappoints? (disappoints in your view and in the communities?)

They'd have to cut all the veterans for that to happen in my opinion. The community will be disappointed regardless.

 

[Dr. Jojo Phantasma]

If we did get a 2nd namco character Id much rather have Nightmare from soul calibur. He fought Link once already and is super cool
Heihachi and lloyd just look so boring compared to him

Yeah, Nightmare would be great. Honestly I'll take most Namco characters over Heihachi.

 

[Noipoi]

What would be your reaction if the rest of the roster severely disappoints? (disappoints in your view and in the communities?)

At this point a disappointment for me would be if we didn't get a new Pokemon, i'm a huge Pokemon fan and Gen 7 is so full of potential I would hate to see it go unused.
Though the rest of the "community" probably wouldn't care.
The rest of the roster is top notch so far, especially with the veterans. So I wouldn't be too disappointed.

 

[CHAMPIONX9]

Maybe Layton and Phoenix could join with one of them as an echo fighter. They have a cross over game and we see Layton in court with some "objections" and Phoenix Wright do some puzzles, so a character with some aspects of each would be interesting. Layton's size almost matches phoenix's with the hat so just give it a hit box.
It's a weird idea, but one that's utilitarian in that they'd be able to squeeze in more characters.

 

[Dixie Kong]

What if, starting November 15, Sakurai announces that he will cut a character each day until release?

 

[Noipoi]

What if, starting November 15, Sakurai announces that he will cut a character each day until release?

I cry.
hard.

 

[BlueMagician]

Assuming the 103 stages are all we're getting before DLC, the remaining newcomers would have to be part of a series already in the game.
So something like, Geno for Mario, Incineroar for Pokemon, Isabelle for Animal Crossing, Bandanna Dee for Kirby, Skull Kid for Zelda, etc.
Those games have characters already.

Again, ROB doesn't have a stage, so the newcomers don't need one either.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

What if, starting November 15, Sakurai announces that he will cut a character each day until release?

Sans confirmed since Sakurai is doing a Genocide run

 

[Deleted member]

You can count the number of new stages on one hand... I doubt that the currently revealed stage total is the final one.

 

[Noipoi]

Again, ROB doesn't have a stage, so the newcomers don't need one either.

Newcomers don't need a stage, true. I was just speculating.
Y'know, like you do in a thread meant for discussion and speculation.

 

[Deleted member]

Sans confirmed since Sakurai is doing a Genocide run

Sans is a veteran though, so he might get cut.

 

[Noipoi]

Sans is a veteran though, so he might get cut.

You're gonna have a bad time...
okey

 

[Momotsuki]

Uhm, correct me if I'm wrong, but don't we already have canonically dead characters in Smash? Dark Samus is dead in its own timeline, and so is Ridley. (He died in Super Metroid and later appearances in chronological order are of a clone of him.)​

 

[Noipoi]

Uhm, correct me if I'm wrong, but don't we already have canonically dead characters in Smash? Dark Samus is dead in its own timeline, and so is Ridley. (He died in Super Metroid and later appearances in chronological order are of a clone of him.)​

Ridley is in a constant state of being dead and coming back to life.

 

[Diem]

Assuming the 103 stages are all we're getting before DLC, the remaining newcomers would have to be part of a series already in the game.
So something like, Geno for Mario, Incineroar for Pokemon, Isabelle for Animal Crossing, Bandanna Dee for Kirby, Skull Kid for Zelda, etc.
Those games have characters already.

I wouldn't say that means new franchises are completely out of the question, since R.O.B. still doesn't have a stage, and many stages don't have associated characters.

It's possible that only the most critical newcomers got new stages. Castlevania and Splatoon obviously needed something because of the potential. Haven't played Golden Sun, but what kind of environments does it have to offer?

Uhm, correct me if I'm wrong, but don't we already have canonically dead characters in Smash? Dark Samus is dead in its own timeline, and so is Ridley. (He died in Super Metroid and later appearances in chronological order are of a clone of him.)​

Yes, Dark Samus is dead, and Ridley is also dead as of Super Metroid, like you say.

So is Ganondorf; he dies in Twilight Princess and Wind Waker.

And then characters from Fire Emblem and Castlevania weren't killed off so much as they occupy one generation in a long timeline. Marth isn't around when Chrom and co. are around, Simon and Richter don't coexist, etc.

 

[Pakky]

You're gonna have a bad time...
okey

Well I guess its okay to give a game to the Pope,where its possible to commit mass genocide.

Nope totally fine...

 

[Wambo]

Assuming the 103 stages are all we're getting before DLC, the remaining newcomers would have to be part of a series already in the game.
So something like, Geno for Mario, Incineroar for Pokemon, Isabelle for Animal Crossing, Bandanna Dee for Kirby, Skull Kid for Zelda, etc.
Those games have characters already.

I've said this a million times but nobody seems to care. I keep seeing the same questions repeated when we already have logical answers for them.

"Guys, waht stages do u think are left"
****ing none, because they specifically said there's 103 total in the game.

"But waht about teh six empty stage slots"
DLC.

"Guyz, if Banjo-Kazooie, Geno, or Isaac get in the game, what stage do u think they'll get"
Outside of DLC, again, ****ing none. Any newcomers from this point on would have to fit in the existing stages. This means Geno wouldn't get a Forest Maze stage, but he could still fit in on a Mario stage. Isabelle has two Animal Crossing stages. Skull Kid could fit in on Great Bay, etc.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Yes, Dark Samus is dead, and Ridley is also dead as of Super Metroid, like you say.

So is Ganondorf; he dies in Twilight Princess and Wind Waker.

And then characters from Fire Emblem and Castlevania weren't killed off so much as they occupy one generation in a long timeline. Marth isn't around when Chrom and co. are around, Simon and Richter don't coexist, etc.

In a twist, OOT is the only time he doesn't actually die, his current design choice. XD

And of course, Ness would be dead during Mother 3. You could go on with technicalities for ages, really. I'm just glad Smash is its own crossover and doesn't have to worry about stuff like canon.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Using if a character is alive or not in their games as an argument for them being in is quite frankly ridiculous and I never understood this line of reasoning from people
Also Viridi has no chance of showing up as a fighter. She is in the bomb reset stage. Casually deconfirmed like Ashley was, so shes not getting in. (especially since after ridley became playable pyrosphere was taken out)
If we get a new KI character it will be Medusa as an echo or Hades as a new character. No one else. Either one of these 2, both of them or no one.

That’s like people saying Mewtwo/Roy/Lucas and Toon Link were casually deconfirmed or how Dark Pit was considered to be a boss character during the Smash 4 speculation (based on a quick appearance on the Spirit Tracks, Greninja/the lack of dlc info/Roy the Koopaling/Ness having some of his moves as customs, and Palutena’s trailer); we even had people think Yoshi was cut due to not being mentioned for almost a year and people think of Chrom as the only new FE rep we’d get...and he “dies” instead

The living argument is being used due to how content for Kid Icarus was like in Smash 4 (closest thing to a dead character being in was Dark Pit...cause he doesn’t have his own life or some edgy ****)

If we do get a rep from KI, until a legit deconfirmation is given Medusa isn’t the only possible echo for Palutena (cause Viridi), and Hades...much better as a boss who doesn’t allow you to play as him. Fortunately there’s an entire thread about Viridi vs Medusa

We can't really be certain if Sakurai will continue doing that, especially considering that we still don't know if the PGs will return.

Also, if the new Spirits mode does indeed have a story that involves reviving the spirits of the fallen, the decased KI cast might tie into that.

With Pit having new lines and David Hayter confirmed to be voicing Snake once more...guaranteed (plus, why not bring those back when the Star Fox crew always have their old convos come back)

If the Spirits Mode relate to Dead people returning, then count me in on Medusa...but not as much as Viridi...but for now Imam stay in the middle of such dark times

What if, starting November 15, Sakurai announces that he will cut a character each day until release?

I wouldn’t like that one bit

 

[Luigi The President]

I've said this a million times but nobody seems to care. I keep seeing the same questions repeated when we already have logical answers for them.

"Guys, waht stages do u think are left"
****ing none, because they specifically said there's 103 total in the game.

"But waht about teh six empty stage slots"
DLC.

"Guyz, if Banjo-Kazooie, Geno, or Isaac get in the game, what stage do u think they'll get"
Outside of DLC, again, ****ing none. Any newcomers from this point on would have to fit in the existing stages. This means Geno wouldn't get a Forest Maze stage, but he could still fit in on a Mario stage. Isabelle has two Animal Crossing stages. Skull Kid could fit in on Great Bay, etc.

Sakurai has stated he doesn't think about DLC until after the game, hasn't he?

Also... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hpigjnKl7nI

 

[Tree Gelbman]

To be fair though Ridley is like Michael Myers and Jason Voorhees. He's only dead until a new story set past his death point requires him to be alive again.

So if Nintendo were ever to focus on Samus after Super Metroid. There's that chance.

 

[Diem]

I've said this a million times but nobody seems to care. I keep seeing the same questions repeated when we already have logical answers for them.

"Guys, waht stages do u think are left"
****ing none, because they specifically said there's 103 total in the game.

"But waht about teh six empty stage slots"
DLC.

"Guyz, if Banjo-Kazooie, Geno, or Isaac get in the game, what stage do u think they'll get"
Outside of DLC, again, ****ing none. Any newcomers from this point on would have to fit in the existing stages.

Which is part of why I expect Banjo Kazooie would probably be DLC instead of in the base game. Aside from that being another licensing hoop to jump through among all the other characters before release, it'd also require a lot more extra content, like stages and music. Castlevania would obviously be more of a priority in this scenario.

I still think Banjo and Kazooie will make it in, possibly as part of a big Microsoft x Nintendo deal where there will also be some Minecraft stuff, such as a stage or Assist Trophy. Depending on how negotiations unfold, they might throw Master Chief in there and obliterate the gaming industry.

 

[Deleted member]

To be fair though Ridley is like Michael Myers and Jason Voorhees.

Ridley clearly should've been in Mortal Kombat instead of Smash.

 

[NintenZ]

Another person in the Discord was talking about a leak about a Dedede Echo but refused to give a source...

Who would even be a Dedede Echo?

 

[Arcanir]

It's definitely not impossible that characters like Isaac and Incineroar do not get new stages. It would be odd since those characters have unique environments to use, but as we've seen with cases like Marth/Roy in Melee you don't need a newcomer to come with a stage.

I will say it would be headscratching for third parties to have that happen though. Geno would get a pass due to essentially being Mario, but a character like Dante, Banjo & Kazooie, and Heihachi coming in without a stage of their own would be strange to say the least considering every other third party character introduced into the series has had a place to call home, and we just had Castlevania continue that trend.