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Still, my point is that representation isn't always just playable characters. Pokemon gets enough representation for how big the franchise is, but it doesn't have as much representation as FE just because they both have 6 playable characters, which something that people who complain about FE getting "too many characters" seem to forget.
Weird, I just had a very similar dream where the Smash 4 port on the switch was announced with some new characters. The only one I remember distinctly was Wolf but then Sakurai started ranting about the fanbase hitting him hard with character requests and he was like "Here's your freaking game! Now leave me alone!"
Why is everyone having dreams about Smash games in their dreams? I had one awhile back. Spring Man was revealed, along with a super WTF character. I don't even care about Spring Man too much. Mario Circuit (SSB4) was also there.
Most of the major Zelda and FE characters are limited to one game before they're cast aside to the magical land of spin-offs. FE has a pretty good history when you consider how every character besides Robin/Lucina represent a single game. I think Zelda would've had a decent history too if Sakurai added Midna in Brawl and/or Girahim in Smash 4. It would've been...
Truthfully, I really don't see any Legend of Zelda newcomers being possible. The four champions could always hope to be Assist Trophies though.
It's pretty short-sighted to not see any as possible, honestly.
I agree with this, keep on hoping for those Zelda newcomers. Would you rather have Chrom, Lyn, both or none of the two characters mentioned previously in Smash? I do not mind all the Fire Emblem newcomers in Smash.
I will never not answer Chrom to this, haha.
Because frankly I disagree heavily with the notion that he'd be tough to make stand out.
Which is bs.
Not including Breath of the Wild Link would be a missed opportunity. A free-roaming, environmental-based character fits perfectly in Smash. There are already two Links with similar movesets. Axe one if you must (Breath of Wild Link can use axes).
Please, literally anything but a third/technically fourth Link.
On that topic, I think I've already thought of a potential newcomer:
I really wanted Midna in Brawl as well. Actually, I'd much rather have Midna in Brawl than the return of Sheik.
Exactly this!
That seems like a rash conclusion. Keep in mind that the franchise hasn't gotten a unique character since Melee. Sakurai has to acknowledge the series with a newcomer sooner or later.
...I mean, I wouldn't be ENTIRELY opposed to Wild Link if he were included, but that seems like such a cheap addition. That would be like Sakurai deciding to add "Galaxy Mario" over Rosalina just because a potential moveset would be more obvious.
I'm not sure about Mipha's popularity ranking in America or Europe, but I know she's hands-down the most popular Champion in Japan. If she's not the most popular Champion worldwide, then I'd feel confident in saying that she's at least the second most popular.
I agree with you on Impa and Ganon being better choice overall, but since Sheik and Ganondorf have stayed in Smash since Melee, any chance we had of replacing them with a different character seems all but lost. At this point, all we can do is hope that Sakurai will be inspired to add another Zelda character. No clue who that character could be, but I'm not about to start being picky about it. If Sakurai really thinks Wild Link is the best he can come up with, I'll take it.I really wanted Midna in Brawl as well. Actually, I'd much rather have Midna in Brawl than the return of Sheik.
I always thought that brining Sheik back for Brawl was a bad idea. It didn't fit at all, and having the CLEARY Twilight Princess-inspired Zelda transform into Sheik was just a terrible idea. Just because of a concept art for Sheik in the game was made.
Sheik didn't return in a Zelda game till Hyrule Warriors. And that game isn't even canon. Ganondorf also hugely relies on Hyrule Warriors to stay somewhat "relevant", but the recent remakes of Wind Waker and Twilight Princess for Wii U help him as well. Same as Ocarina of Time 3D likely kept Sheik around.
However I think it's highly hypocritical to have them around in Smash for this alone if they don't keep a lasting influence on the franchise. Sheik is a DISGUISE of Zelda, not even a proper character on her own, unlike say Tetra (who is more of a character on her own anyway). And Ganondorf is Ganon's humanoid form, which doesn't even use his canon moveset. And then there's Sheik, who just has a shoehorned moveset out of creative liberty and cause apperantly, a ninja-based moveset was needed.
Compare them to the rest of the cast, and it becomes apperant that these two characters are poor representation of their overall franchise. Ironically, their Hyrule Warriors counterparts would be a better representation of their character than their Smash version.
You could easily replace them with Impa and Ganon and have a better representation of the whole franchise, plus with some actual damn abilities of many source games. Impa can use Skyward Sword abilities like the barrier, a projectile similar to the Bomb Rune, Deku Nuts / Vanish, a mix of Sheikah and Yiga enemies' attacks in Breath of the Wild, and Statis to represent a few games she was in, plus the recent BOTW. Ganon has a lot to offer due to his overall giant size and trident, as well as various magical spells making him a very heavy zoner / grappler mix type of character.
Both Impa and Ganon seem way more fun to me than current Sheik and Ganondorf. I won't let nostalgia blind me here. If it was up to me, I'd freshen up the Zelda roster like this and give Zelda a better and more functional moveset. If I'd include Ganondorf and Sheik however, I would use the HW versions. And I would adjust Link, Zelda and Toon Link similary, whilst still including Impa in her HW-style.
Tl;dr: The Zelda roster is outdated and very bland. No concrete newcomers since Melee is bad for one of Nintendo's biggest and more active franchises, and Sheik and Ganondorf aren't very reoccuring faces anyway. Sheik far less so than Ganondorf even with ONE actual canon appearance that's somewhat relevant only because of remakes. Impa and Ganon would be a better, more recent and more functional option for a Sheikah moveset and a proper representation of Zelda's Big Bad.
Exactly this!
Skyward Sword's Impa gave a lot of base for the Sheikah's lore in BOTW anyway. They are DIRECT servants of Goddes Hylia, and Skyward Sword's Impa was the ACTUAL Goddess Hylia's handpicked warrior chosen to protect her mortal form in the future. This is a HUGE role in the overall Zelda lore. Especially since Skyward Sword was the beginning of the franchise / timeline, and BOTW is the ending.Impa could use a lot of inspiration from the Maz Koshia fight, IF we needed a BOTW character exactly. I still think Impa can draw from abilities from Breath of the Wild, like using the Statis rune abilitiy, the Bomb rune ability as a projectile and a movement style very similar to Maz Koshia.
Maz Koshia has the same hat as BOTW's Impa. Impa is also still the Sheikah's leader. It's very undoubtly she wouldn't be able to fight, at least when she was younger. Her appearance could also be easily made. Just use Paya as a base, and give her the hat and mask of Maz Koshia. That would be a good style for her BOTW apperance.
That being said, Impa is easily THE most important character in the Zelda lore and overall timeline influence outside of Link, Zelda and Ganon. She's therefore the best possible addition overall. Doesn't matter in what shape or form. Hyrule Warriors also gave her great prominence and story importance, and she was Link's first ally, as well as using Link's second most iconic weapon, the Biggoron Sword.
Combine this with BOTW elements of Sheikah magic (as Impa is the only character shown to have these magical abilities without using the Sheikah Slate anyway) and Impa easily has more moveset potential than a lot of the current Zelda cast; Zelda, Sheik and even GanonDORF - Ganon is a different story.
THE FACT PEOPLE ARE CALLING FOR "WILD LINK" IS TESTIMONY OF THE ZELDA'S ROSTER'S FAILURE! This can easily be fixed by adding Impa, with all due respect.
The problem is that we already have the most important characters in the whole Legend of Zelda series. As tempting as it is to try to get a newcomer, the four champions will probably meet the same fate as Tingle, Midna, and Girahim, or just be mere trophy cameos.
Man, I see you post about Impa all the time and I was reading this post at the end of my shift and only then did I get thinking...has Impa been in as many Zelda games as Ganondorf? Or more? I know Impa's been in OoT, SS and BotW and then Ganondorf has been in OoT, WW and TP. They've both been in HW if you bother to count that. I've yet to play Zelda 2, never beat aLttP though I don't recall seeing Impa in that game, never played Minish Cap though I did see a playthrough of it long ago, don't recall seeing her in it, saw playthroughs of PH and ST and she didn't appear, never played the Oracle games or the first 4 Swords game and I never beat ALBW and just finished watching Therunawayguy's playthrough of TFH where she also didn't appear. I've played every other Zelda game I believe. Kinda interesting how Impa never got added to Brawl or Sm4sh despite her being around as much as Ganondrof. Then again, Tingle has appeared in MM, WW and has his own games and he's not in either outside of being an Assist Trophy.I really wanted Midna in Brawl as well. Actually, I'd much rather have Midna in Brawl than the return of Sheik.
I always thought that brining Sheik back for Brawl was a bad idea. It didn't fit at all, and having the CLEARY Twilight Princess-inspired Zelda transform into Sheik was just a terrible idea. Just because of a concept art for Sheik in the game was made.
Sheik didn't return in a Zelda game till Hyrule Warriors. And that game isn't even canon. Ganondorf also hugely relies on Hyrule Warriors to stay somewhat "relevant", but the recent remakes of Wind Waker and Twilight Princess for Wii U help him as well. Same as Ocarina of Time 3D likely kept Sheik around.
However I think it's highly hypocritical to have them around in Smash for this alone if they don't keep a lasting influence on the franchise. Sheik is a DISGUISE of Zelda, not even a proper character on her own, unlike say Tetra (who is more of a character on her own anyway). And Ganondorf is Ganon's humanoid form, which doesn't even use his canon moveset. And then there's Sheik, who just has a shoehorned moveset out of creative liberty and cause apperantly, a ninja-based moveset was needed.
Compare them to the rest of the cast, and it becomes apperant that these two characters are poor representation of their overall franchise. Ironically, their Hyrule Warriors counterparts would be a better representation of their character than their Smash version.
You could easily replace them with Impa and Ganon and have a better representation of the whole franchise, plus with some actual damn abilities of many source games. Impa can use Skyward Sword abilities like the barrier, a projectile similar to the Bomb Rune, Deku Nuts / Vanish, a mix of Sheikah and Yiga enemies' attacks in Breath of the Wild, and Statis to represent a few games she was in, plus the recent BOTW. Ganon has a lot to offer due to his overall giant size and trident, as well as various magical spells making him a very heavy zoner / grappler mix type of character.
Both Impa and Ganon seem way more fun to me than current Sheik and Ganondorf. I won't let nostalgia blind me here. If it was up to me, I'd freshen up the Zelda roster like this and give Zelda a better and more functional moveset. If I'd include Ganondorf and Sheik however, I would use the HW versions. And I would adjust Link, Zelda and Toon Link similary, whilst still including Impa in her HW-style.
Tl;dr: The Zelda roster is outdated and very bland. No concrete newcomers since Melee is bad for one of Nintendo's biggest and more active franchises, and Sheik and Ganondorf aren't very reoccuring faces anyway. Sheik far less so than Ganondorf even with ONE actual canon appearance that's somewhat relevant only because of remakes. Impa and Ganon would be a better, more recent and more functional option for a Sheikah moveset and a proper representation of Zelda's Big Bad.
Exactly this!
Skyward Sword's Impa gave a lot of base for the Sheikah's lore in BOTW anyway. They are DIRECT servants of Goddes Hylia, and Skyward Sword's Impa was the ACTUAL Goddess Hylia's handpicked warrior chosen to protect her mortal form in the future. This is a HUGE role in the overall Zelda lore. Especially since Skyward Sword was the beginning of the franchise / timeline, and BOTW is the ending.Impa could use a lot of inspiration from the Maz Koshia fight, IF we needed a BOTW character exactly. I still think Impa can draw from abilities from Breath of the Wild, like using the Statis rune abilitiy, the Bomb rune ability as a projectile and a movement style very similar to Maz Koshia.
Maz Koshia has the same hat as BOTW's Impa. Impa is also still the Sheikah's leader. It's very undoubtly she wouldn't be able to fight, at least when she was younger. Her appearance could also be easily made. Just use Paya as a base, and give her the hat and mask of Maz Koshia. That would be a good style for her BOTW apperance.
That being said, Impa is easily THE most important character in the Zelda lore and overall timeline influence outside of Link, Zelda and Ganon. She's therefore the best possible addition overall. Doesn't matter in what shape or form. Hyrule Warriors also gave her great prominence and story importance, and she was Link's first ally, as well as using Link's second most iconic weapon, the Biggoron Sword.
Combine this with BOTW elements of Sheikah magic (as Impa is the only character shown to have these magical abilities without using the Sheikah Slate anyway) and Impa easily has more moveset potential than a lot of the current Zelda cast; Zelda, Sheik and even GanonDORF - Ganon is a different story.
THE FACT PEOPLE ARE CALLING FOR "WILD LINK" IS TESTIMONY OF THE ZELDA'S ROSTER'S FAILURE! This can easily be fixed by adding Impa, with all due respect.
It's likely but not confirmed.
Actually it kind of is confirmed, thanks to EA having an internal email leak mentioning a January 2018 Direct.
The issue is you're writing the Champions off way too early. They're getting so much promotion compared to past one-offs, including an entire DLC expansion (Game Awards segment included!) AND amiibo dedicated to them. They know they're popular and marketable, and I think that speaks wonders to their odds.
You have to try to limit this kind of thinking. I should know because I felt the exact same way about the Mario franchise after Brawl.
That's your sarcasm. I'm serious.
What? Impa appeared in several games besides Oot, SS and BotW.
Except that Cloud was never impossible to begin with. I never saw any fan rule saying Cloud couldn't be in Smash Bros.
Problem is though, WHICH Champion would they choose? Am not totally opposed to a playable Champion, but which one would they choose over the others?Actually it kind of is confirmed, thanks to EA having an internal email leak mentioning a January 2018 Direct.
The issue is you're writing the Champions off way too early. They're getting so much promotion compared to past one-offs, including an entire DLC expansion (Game Awards segment included!) AND amiibo dedicated to them. They know they're popular and marketable, and I think that speaks wonders to their odds.
Still, you probably don't want your hopes to be too high.
Being open to more possibilities that may or may not happen is better than dismissing potential choices because they have a chance of not making it, I'd think.
My money's on Daruk or Mipha. Gorons and Zoras are both incredibly recurring races and both seem pretty popular. Mipha can bring in water powers mixed with trident attacks, while Daruk could give us another heavyweight with earth powers and a weapon that's a sword in name only (seriously, the way he uses it, it's more like a club or hammer). Rivali could work too, especially if Decidueye doesn't make it, due to being a full-on archer, though he's a bit more controversial as a character.
I agree with this.
That's not his point, Opopo's already used to disappointment. His point is how you're actively trying to shut down discussion on them
Well, that's not entirely true. Bowser Jr. had always been a popular choice during Brawl speculation and after, to the point where people thought if there was any Mario character to be added it would be him. Also I don't remember it ever being stated he was a late choice for the roster, the roster was decided back in like 2011-2012. It was stated he was incredibly close to being cut late into development because of some of the challenges they faced with him. And I highly doubt Roaslina was only chosen because Galaxy was an amazing game, other wise we could have just as well got Lubba from Galaxy 2, she was always a popular Character it's just that the Smash community at the time laughed her off as nothing more than a Peach clone which was just the Smash Community being characteristically shortsighted.
Just thinking about which Champion would most likely be chosen makes my head hurt. I can think of good reason for why each Champion should or shouldn't be included in Smash.
Perhaps I worded that weird. I didn't necessarily mean that Junior was decided on late in development. I just meant that Junior was one of the last characters Sakurai decided to keep. Despite Rosalina having one of the most complicated movesets, and despite Junior being significantly easier to program, Rosa was never in danger of being cut. That means Sakurai put more emphasis on Rosalina than Junior during development.
I'm in the minority on this I believe, but Spear Pillar is actually my favorite Pokemon Stage in any Smash Game. I really do hope that we get it back if DP remakes are coming. I think it'd be more likely that they would make a new stage for Diamond and Pearl instead though.
