Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Rie Sonomura]

Aerith's Theme in a jazz theme, let's goooooo

You know

I actually wouldn’t mind that

 

[UberPyro64]

I've been firmly in the camp that Isabelle will be an Echo Fighter for quite a while.

Vergeben knowing about Isabelle but not Daisy doesn't mean anything in that regard. He said so himself. Info is all over the place. He knows some things but not others.

 

[Will]

You know we can't go another Smash without this absolute banger

Spoiler: BANGER ALERT

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

"This character doesn't fight" is not a good argument to say that a character should be in. Captain Falcon, Dr. Mario, Villager, Wii Fit Trainer, etc. are all non-combatants and they still got in. It's no different with Isabelle.

Captain Falcon is a bounty hunter. Wii Fit Trainer does not show any case where she would or wouldn't fight. Villager is blank-slate entirely. Dr. Mario is Mario, but also from the Mario series, where everybody is willing to fight because they can be thrown into any role due to how the series is made.

There is no comparison to Isabelle because, get this, everybody is capable to fighting within their own series. Nobody has a "strictly would never battle" stigma among the characters in Smash. This doesn't mean Isabelle won't fight in Smash. It could totally happen. There's just no legitimate case of a "will not fight" character playable in Smash at this time. Another poor analogy because people forget how it works; there's three categories for personalities and fighting, not two. It's not "will fight" and "won't fight". It's "will fight", "won't fight", "can't really tell either way." At this time, Isabelle falls under category number two. Villager was always category three. Every Mario character, due to the nature of the series, was always category one. Nobody currently playable in Smash fits under category two. They don't have a personalty that says "I will not fight". It's either category one or category three.

Blank-slate or lacking in personality is the reason they can easily be made playable in Smash because Sakurai doesn't have to care about going against their established personality.

 

[Apollo500]

Honestly, just include a **** ton of modern Kirby music. CROWNED, Under My Control, Triple Deluxe's regular boss theme, Sullied Grace, FLOWERED, VS Masked Dedede, VS Drawcia, VS Galacta Knight, Nature's Navel, Prayer Song of God, PROGRAM, any of Meta Knight's boss themes (even if most are Ridley theme-esque), etc. It's a crime that Smash 4 only included 1 of Kirby's phenomenonal boss themes and it was as DLC

Yeah, I could dig an influx of Kirby music. It's consistently great. Throw in City of Sound, too, why not?

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Blank-slate or lacking in personality is the reason they can easily be made playable in Smash because Sakurai doesn't have to care about going against their established personality.

That'd be great if you could prove that with a source.

Otherwise this seems like bull****.

 

[Deleted member]

Just a reminder that good, decent and smart people clamor for Cid's Theme in Smash.

I now really need this. Badly.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I was out researching Animal Crossing games a while ago, and found this gameplay of amiibo festival, featuring Isabelle whacking a robotic Resetti with a toy hammer:

This was a very interesting thing to discover to say the least.

...This is literally the first decent time I've ever seen Isabelle doing anything close to violent within her own franchise. Eh, I can believe it now. Though I still think she might be an AT due to her Smash personality already being a pacifist, but what'll happen happen.

 

[CodakTheWarrior]

Captain Falcon is a bounty hunter. Wii Fit Trainer does not show any case where she would or wouldn't fight. Villager is blank-slate entirely. Dr. Mario is Mario, but also from the Mario series, where everybody is willing to fight because they can be thrown into any role due to how the series is made.

There is no comparison to Isabelle because, get this, everybody is capable to fighting within their own series. Nobody has a "strictly would never battle" stigma among the characters in Smash. This doesn't mean Isabelle won't fight in Smash. It could totally happen. There's just no legitimate case of a "will not fight" character playable in Smash at this time. Another poor analogy because people forget how it works; there's three categories for personalities and fighting, not two. It's not "will fight" and "won't fight". It's "will fight", "won't fight", "can't really tell either way." At this time, Isabelle falls under category number two. Villager was always category three. Every Mario character, due to the nature of the series, was always category one. Nobody currently playable in Smash fits under category two. They don't have a personalty that says "I will not fight". It's either category one or category three.

Blank-slate or lacking in personality is the reason they can easily be made playable in Smash because Sakurai doesn't have to care about going against their established personality.

But Sakurai has gone against established personalities in the past, what's stopping him here?

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Also, Moonstruck Blossom is a must for Kirby tracks. I think I modded that into my track list for Halberd, not sure tho

 

[SquashiniKun]

Honestly, just include a **** ton of modern Kirby music. CROWNED, Under My Control, Triple Deluxe's regular boss theme, Sullied Grace, FLOWERED, VS Masked Dedede, VS Drawcia, VS Galacta Knight, Nature's Navel, Prayer Song of God, PROGRAM, any of Meta Knight's boss themes (even if most are Ridley theme-esque), etc. It's a crime that Smash 4 only included 1 of Kirby's phenomenonal boss themes and it was as DLC

Dude i'd kill someone for a remix of PROGRAM, get Jun Wakita to do it.

 

[Giveaway412]

Honestly, just include a **** ton of modern Kirby music. CROWNED, Under My Control, Triple Deluxe's regular boss theme, Sullied Grace, FLOWERED, VS Masked Dedede, VS Drawcia, VS Galacta Knight, Nature's Navel, Prayer Song of God, PROGRAM, any of Meta Knight's boss themes (even if most are Ridley theme-esque), etc. It's a crime that Smash 4 only included 1 of Kirby's phenomenonal boss themes and it was as DLC

This probably wouldn't fit in Smash during a fight but I'd kill for a rendition of My Friend and the Setting Sun.

 

[Deleted member]

Honestly, just include a **** ton of modern Kirby music. CROWNED, Under My Control, Triple Deluxe's regular boss theme, Sullied Grace, FLOWERED, VS Masked Dedede, VS Drawcia, VS Galacta Knight, Nature's Navel, Prayer Song of God, PROGRAM, any of Meta Knight's boss themes (even if most are Ridley theme-esque), etc. It's a crime that Smash 4 only included 1 of Kirby's phenomenonal boss themes and it was as DLC

I agree with adding more Kirby music.
I felt like we also need more Pokémon music.

 

[Deleted member]

This probably wouldn't fit in Smash during a fight but I'd kill for a rendition of My Friend and the Setting Sun.

Another person of culture. I've modded this song on Halberd, and it doesn't fit too badly, IMO. It's not going to amp you up or anything, but if you ask me, it fits way better than Route 209 did on Spear Pillar.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Yeah, I could dig an influx of Kirby music. It's consistently great. Throw in City of Sound, too, why not?

Oh City of Sound is absolutely brilliant but it isn't exactly fitting for beating the **** out of people with it

This probably wouldn't fit in Smash during a fight but I'd kill for a rendition of My Friend and the Setting Sun.

Meta Knight's Star Allies boss theme actually takes part of it!

 

[Deleted member]

Speaking of music, for God's sake, can Sonic have at least more than ONE new remix. Sonic Mania is RIGHT there, man.

 

[Iridium]

Imagine if we could play as this Ridley.

 

[Apollo500]

I felt like we also need more Pokémon music.

Gen 7 Elite Four theme and Ultra Necrozma Battle, please!

 

[Cosmic77]

Whether or not Isabelle is too "pacifist" for Smash doesn't really matter to me. I just want to know how she's handled as a character.

I'm fine with Isabelle being an Echo or semi-clone, but Sakurai will have to work overtime if he wants to convince me she's worthy of being one of the few unique characters. Villager already hits most of the areas to work with, so creating something new and unique for Isabelle will require pure creativity. If she isn't represented in a way that feels truly special, then I'd actually be upset Sakurai wasted time on a character who could've easily worked just as well as an Echo.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

I suppose now’s a good time as any to promote the Music and Sounds General thread! I listed a couple songs I wanted on pages 2 and 3

 

[Deleted member]

So, has loz18 leaked anything other than "Zelda redesign", "Stage first, then character" and "Daisy is in" for this particular Smash game?

One thing that we haven't seen yet is that Zelda is supposedly going to have BotW Zelda as an alt costume.

 

[Deleted member]

I felt like we also need more Pokémon music.

There's many Pokemon themes I'd like, but Decisive Battle! (N) is my number one want right now. Getting Unova Pokemon League in a game with (presumably) more than two music options for each stage has me quite excited.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Speaking of music, for God's sake, can Sonic have at least more than ONE new remix. Sonic Mania is RIGHT there, man.

We have 3 composers from Sonic iirc, Jun Senoue, the guy who did the Splatoon remix and the composer for F Zero: Daytona edition. If Sonic doesn't get a remix, I will send an angry email to Nintendo.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

That'd be great if you could prove that with a source.

Otherwise this seems like bull****.

It's beyond common sense.

They can't be made incorrect if there's nothing incorrect about them. Again, Villager is pure proof of this. He has no legitimate personality. He was given one in Smash first, where he's more dark than the original game, where has no personality at all. Just tiny reactions to events that happen.

Besides that, Wii Fit Trainer is more proof of this. Little personality to begin with. Doesn't have a "will not fight" personality. They like to teach people how to actually keep in shape. That's... it. Tell me where on earth this implies "will not fight", because it's the same proof as before. They either show a "will not fight" or they don't. If they don't, it's not an issue at all for Sakurai to even look at. He had to say no to Villager before because he believed the character would not fight. He changed his mind, but unlike Isabelle, it's a hard fact he was a blank-slate. This is a key factor that needs to be considered. And being she's already treated as a "will not fight" character as present in Smash alone, this means adding her in will require more than an echo alone. Or even a semi-clone. He already has a personality to reflect that is in Smash. So as I said below, accidental fighter or terraforming at least could reflect her better.

But Sakurai has gone against established personalities in the past, what's stopping him here?

Nothing, because he barely goes against personalities to begin with. Besides that, he already made one for Isabelle, being a "will not fight" character. Why would he change the role he already gave her just for the sake of it? It's not going to be a case where "suddenly she'll fight". It'll be a case where he finds an interesting way for her to battle without acting violent/having violent tendencies in order to keep what he already established. The idea of her being an accidental fighter or terraforming fighter sounds remotely possible. An echo fighter does not.

 

[Apollo500]

There's many Pokemon themes I'd like, but Decisive Battle! (N) is my number one want right now. Getting Unova Pokemon League in a game with (presumably) more than two music options for each stage has me quite excited.

Whoa. Dude. I totally forgot Unova Pokemon League stage is a thing. Gen 5 Elite Four theme incoming?

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Honestly, just include a **** ton of modern Kirby music. CROWNED, Under My Control, Triple Deluxe's regular boss theme, Sullied Grace, FLOWERED, VS Masked Dedede, VS Drawcia, VS Galacta Knight, Nature's Navel, Prayer Song of God, PROGRAM, any of Meta Knight's boss themes (even if most are Ridley theme-esque), etc. It's a crime that Smash 4 only included 1 of Kirby's phenomenonal boss themes and it was as DLC

This is one of the reasons I want Shinya Kumazaki to be the next Smash director, he wouldn't have any shame including Kirby music, up to and including the ones that aren't from his own work.

Edit: Do you figure that we might get a Smash director ballot someday?

 

[Deleted member]

Whoa. Dude. I totally forgot Unova Pokemon League stage is a thing. Gen 5 Elite Four theme incoming?

Please? Can we also get the original version of Ghetsis's Theme so we can have DEEEEEEEEEENNIS chants in Smash?

 

[Noipoi]

The fact that Iris', Cynthia's and Lance\Red's champion themes aren't in Smash will forever make me sad.

 

[Deleted member]

I will send an angry email to Nintendo.

Well you are wasting your time doing that, considering they will probably not care at all.
Do not send an angry email please.

There's many Pokemon themes I'd like, but Decisive Battle! (N) is my number one want right now. Getting Unova Pokemon League in a game with (presumably) more than two music options for each stage has me quite excited.

Gen 7 Elite Four theme and Ultra Necrozma Battle, please!

These two would be really cool.
I also want to see Cynthia's Champion theme original Diamond and Pearl in Smash Bros. Ultimate. The remix can stay, but I would like the original.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Honestly, I'd just love to see Pokemon anime music alone. The Gym Theme has some beyond awesome orchestral remakes that would fit Smash well. Mostly due to the fact it has more orchestrated music now. Closest we had was the Pokemon Evolution/Gym Theme which was... eh. The Midis just don't have the same oomph to it. Not cause they're midis, mind you. They still work, but they aren't as hard rock and pump you up.

To clarify, I mean the orchestrated music that are basically remakes of the midis. These are in all dubs/subs, and not specific to one region. I can't see any reason a vocal theme would get in unless it was in all regions, due to lots of licensing and that it would only entice a few people instead of the majority of fans(as more watch the anime, but not everybody watches every version with every unique region's theme. And I don't mean Pokemon region, I mean like Japan, Spain, USA, Mexico, etc.)

 

[peachy!]

One thing that we haven't seen yet is that Zelda is supposedly going to have BotW Zelda as an alt costume.

Pretty much. Other than that, he leaked basically everything: all characters returning--even mentioned Pichu and Young Link--, Link's changes, Inklings' moveset, and played the demo before E3.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

This is one of the reasons I want Shinya Kumazaki to be the next Smash director, he wouldn't have any shame including Kirby music, up to and including the ones that aren't from his own work.

Edit: Do you figure that we might get a Smash director ballot someday?

Absolutely not. A ballot for asking what characters we'd love to see is very understandable. A ballot asking who should work on the games as a director however is preposterous

 

[Idon]

I think the real issue for most non-combatant fighters isn't in their personality or ideology or whatever.
It's that since most of them are non-combatants, they don't have much flashy or iconic animations to draw from.

Compared to Villager who has all the Animal Crossing Actions, Wii Fit who has exercise poses, and the like, some of the popular character choices have little animations to draw from and reference.
Of course, Sakurai is no stranger to inventing movesets for characters like Peach and Zelda, but it's probably something he has to consider before deciding to feature them in Smash.

Or I guess he could just make them clones or something, but that's kinda laaaaaaaaame.

 

[blazefan519]

Whoa. Dude. I totally forgot Unova Pokemon League stage is a thing. Gen 5 Elite Four theme incoming?

Please? Can we also get the original version of Ghetsis's Theme so we can have DEEEEEEEEEENNIS chants in Smash?

I see people talking about Gen 5 music and I'm here. Give me the Gen 5 Elite 4 theme or give me death.

 

[Apollo500]

Edit: Do you figure that we might get a Smash director ballot someday?

A Smash Director Ballot would be a recipe for nothing other than disaster and bloody mayhem. I don't even want to think about the kind of arguments that would happen or the hard feelings that would be had if something like that ever happened.

 

[RileyXY1]

Isabelle, as I said before, won't work as an Echo. She and Villager have two completely different body proportions.

 

[MainJPW]

One thing that we haven't seen yet is that Zelda is supposedly going to have BotW Zelda as an alt costume.

That was leaked?

 

[KMDP]

Bet you anything this is exactly what happens.

Aerith's Theme in a jazz theme, let's goooooo

Not only are the FF7 remixes deliberately in ill-fitting styles. They're played by drunk people with ADHD, playing music in a studio with lots and lots of things to distract them as much as possible.

 

[RandomAce]

That was leaked?

Yes it was.

Though if they had a BOTW costume, shouldn’t that have been the default?

Anyways, Loz18 is probably someone I can get behind more.

 

[Deleted member]

Not only are the FF7 remixes deliberately in ill-fitting styles. They're played by drunk people with ADHD, deliberately put in a studio with lots and lots of things to distract them as much as possible.

So the end result is The Yoshi Clan on Midgar labeled as a Final Fantasy VII song?