Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Will]

K Rool was expected but I'm actually surprised with Gengar and it honestly makes sense.

That sounds like something Sakurai would do. It would also be cool to have a pokemon that is not just a starter

what the **** did we just go over a few days ago about this avatar stuff

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Dude I had no idea how much of a boss Reggie really was though.

After receiving his degree, Fils-Aimé took a position with Procter & Gamble. Following that, he took a position as Senior Director of National Marketing at Pizza Hut, where he launched the Bigfoot Pizza and The Big New Yorker.

Fils-Aimé has served as the Head of Marketing for Guinness in the United States and was responsible for all brands. He also worked as Chief Marketing Officer at Derby Cycle, directing sales and marketing efforts for eight brands. Fils-Aimé served as Managing Director and oversaw Raleigh U.K., Derby's British operations for six months in 1999.

He then joined the Chinese food company Panda Management Co. acting as Senior Vice President. Later, he came on board to VH1 as Senior Vice President. He was responsible for a 30% increase in ratings by refocusing the channel's content to appeal to younger viewers.[citation needed]

Man don't play. He kicking ass at all the companies he worked for.

 

[SirCamp]

So I sort of asked this question in the Captain Syrup character support thread, but nobody is really interacting with that particular thread sadly, so I figure I'd ask it here as well. But as far as first party characters go, what is it that really separates the super popular requests from those that are relatively ignored?

I asked this in the Captain Syrup thread specifically because I find that she is an interesting case. If you compare her to King K Rool for example, they are quite similar in what they have going for them with the exception of K. Rool's very obvious massive popularity (on the internet).

But if you think about it both characters are older, classic characters that aren't particularly relevant now. But they are recurring villains in their series. They were each in a similar number of games (4 for K Rool, 3 for Syrup). And those series are not particularly obscure series either, and in fact both can be tied to Mario. Both have a fair amount to work with in terms of design for Smash Bros. Captain Syrup actually has the benefit of being relevant more recently having been in Wario Land Shake It on the Wii. Not really relevant, but still more so than K Rool, as far as I'm aware anyway. And to the extent that you care about this, she is also a potential female character.

Despite those similarities though, King K. Rool is massively popular to the point where he is the most expected character, while Captain Syrup apparently JUST got her own support thread as of like a week ago. The difference is incredibly stark, and I don't really understand why?

I do get that there is a lot of intangibility in terms of what makes a character compelling and thus popular. So I don't really expect her to have the same, or even similar amount of support. I mean perhaps her character just doesn't connect with as many people. But that just doesn't seem to account for just how vast the difference in popularity seems to be.

Was Wario Land in general just that much less popular than the DKC games? Or do you think the online support in communities like these is a bit of a self fulfilling prophecy? It seems to me, that a fair amount of K Rool support (and before you say anything I do support K. Rool myself) sort of begets itself. Which is to say that after a certain point people start to support characters they deem to be popular almost as a matter of course, simply because the environment on these boards makes them appear to be such an obvious choice. The support snowballs and sort of distorts people's perception of what is likely I think. I imagine a large number of people also learned about and support K Rool through these boards, but obviously the same can't really be said for Syrup given that people just don't talk about her, either because they don't care, or just don't think she's likely (again despite many similarities with one of the most expected characters). I wonder if things would look different if Syrup had a small dedicated group of fanboys pushing for support for her as long as K Rool has. Would people now think of her as a shoo-in in a similar way?

Anyway, just sort of makes me think about what other characters we might be writing off as a community.

Hmm so disregard Syrup being more recently relevant. Turns out K Rool also was in super Mario Sluggers, so one more appearance for him, and that one came out around the same time.

Another similarity though. They're both pirates. lol Super important detail I know.

Anyway, just to clarify my question here again though, I'm just wondering what you guys think separates the super popular from the non-entities when it comes to Smash character speculation? There are certainly metrics we use, but sometimes it seems like that doesn't tell the whole story.

Being a staunch proponent of Isaac being in Smash as well, I can't help but wonder if characters from series that are usually on handhelds are at a disadvantage as well. Obviously Pokemon is a huge exception to this, but overall it seems like we don't get a whole lot of handheld exclusive characters otherwise.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

I should point out another thing about gengar

That wario/dedede being scared of something conspiracy theory

It could be gengar popping out (becoming visible) and scaring them

 

[Will]

I should point out another thing about gengar

That wario/dedede being scared of something conspiracy theory

It could be gengar popping out (becoming visible) and scaring them

No it's just because Red is siccing Charizard on D3 and the rest on Wario. Wario and Red make eye-contact. D3 and Charizard make eye-contact. There is 0 space left in that tiny little group to put in Gengar, notably because he's 1.) a fairly large boi 2.) blocking the sight of that cute af Jiggs.

 

[Idon]

I should point out another thing about gengar

That wario/dedede being scared of something conspiracy theory

It could be gengar popping out (becoming visible) and scaring them

Could be, but I don't see why they would do it for specifically them. Most characters in that mural are doing their own thing and not usually interacting much with the other characters.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

I don't know I don't think there's anything to Wario and Dedede being scared than the Pokemon Trainer sending his Pokemon after them.

The weirdest thing is how small Jigglypuff is and how she looks like part of Pokemon Trainer and not her own character, so who knows? Maybe there is another character there, but trying to put anyone else there, might overshadow Jigglypuff and Charizard in particular.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

If we are going with poster analysis.
Popo is clearly smacking something (and not just swinging his hammer) but there is nothing there to smack.

Could it be a spot where a future character will go?

 

[Iridium]

Knowing that has customs still, what you all think about legality for them? Personally, I feel like they should have more options for movesets (or maybe I just want to destroy them).

 

[Will]

If we are going with poster analysis.
Popo is clearly smacking something (and not just swinging his hammer) but there is nothing there to smack.

Could it be a spot where a future character will go?

Thanks for letting me promote my post talking about this a month ago because it goes deep into detail.

Something else that's interesting about the poster.

View attachment 149504

Popo is clobbering at something, and unless he's trying to get Game and Watch for breakfast, it may be something that hasn't been added yet. I thought that he may be trying to get the duck, but my mindset's looking more towards the duck reacting to Toon Link trying to get a shot at it instead. or maybe my tinfoil is on too tight

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

I'm rolling this as ballony but it shouldn't be too much longer anyway

 

[SuperSonicFlyer]

So what was happening with that Gengar leak that people were talking about on the last page?

 

[BlondeLombax]

So I've seen the counterarguements in my post for custom moves, and I can see where you're all coming from.
But one thing has crossed my mind: if we're able to bring our old amiibo FPs over from Wii U/3DS, then they would have to recall their customs and stats. Otherwise, players would need to overwrite the memories of the amiibos in order to start anew. Has anybody else thought about that one yet?

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

It has been brought to my attention by a friend on Discord that Smash Ultimate's initial reveal, March 8th, was 137 days ago and that there is now 137 days left until its release.

In other words...

 

[Idon]

So what was happening with that Gengar leak that people were talking about on the last page?

another 4chan leak.
some guy claimed that he was conveniently sick on the day they were signing **** so he isn't under contract which is laughablely convenient.
other than that, some easy picks and a whacky Gengar pick to make the bait look more real

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

another 4chan leak.
some guy claimed that he was conveniently sick on the day they were signing **** so he isn't under contract which is laughablely convenient.
other than that, some easy picks and a whacky Gengar pick to make the bait look more real

Don't forget the trailer concepts which sound like they came straight out of a fanfic

 

[Ignoritus]

another 4chan leak.
some guy claimed that he was conveniently sick on the day they were signing **** so he isn't under contract which is laughablely convenient.

And also not how anything works at all.

 

[Zeox]

Someone in /v/ made this, is obviously fake because that 3d model has been around internet for yers, but still funny:

Link: http://boards.4chan.org/v/thread/425247668

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

I understand and agree with all of that. Still had fun making them though.
As for Goemon characters, only expect Goemon if ever. All others are pipedreams.

I know. I expect the rest of the four heroes as ATs, if even that.

At this point in time,with the possible exception of Lip there really is only one Retro Rep who would be also a surprise character

Spoiler

View attachment 154097

He recently appeared in Tropical Freeze though.

I think Sakurai's idea of retro is NES era, which isn't necessarily wrong. But a lot of the general public who know a thing or two about their vidya will probably pin retro around SNES/N64. Again there's no real official label, but since we have the NES and SNES classic I think the SNES can warrant a retro by normal standards I guess?

Given that, it'd be cool to see people get behind the Star Fox 2 gals.

So I sort of asked this question in the Captain Syrup character support thread, but nobody is really interacting with that particular thread sadly, so I figure I'd ask it here as well. But as far as first party characters go, what is it that really separates the super popular requests from those that are relatively ignored?

I asked this in the Captain Syrup thread specifically because I find that she is an interesting case. If you compare her to King K Rool for example, they are quite similar in what they have going for them with the exception of K. Rool's very obvious massive popularity (on the internet).

But if you think about it both characters are older, classic characters that aren't particularly relevant now. But they are recurring villains in their series. They were each in a similar number of games (4 for K Rool, 3 for Syrup). And those series are not particularly obscure series either, and in fact both can be tied to Mario. Both have a fair amount to work with in terms of design for Smash Bros. Captain Syrup actually has the benefit of being relevant more recently having been in Wario Land Shake It on the Wii. Not really relevant, but still more so than K Rool, as far as I'm aware anyway. And to the extent that you care about this, she is also a potential female character.

Despite those similarities though, King K. Rool is massively popular to the point where he is the most expected character, while Captain Syrup apparently JUST got her own support thread as of like a week ago. The difference is incredibly stark, and I don't really understand why?

I do get that there is a lot of intangibility in terms of what makes a character compelling and thus popular. So I don't really expect her to have the same, or even similar amount of support. I mean perhaps her character just doesn't connect with as many people. But that just doesn't seem to account for just how vast the difference in popularity seems to be.

Was Wario Land in general just that much less popular than the DKC games? Or do you think the online support in communities like these is a bit of a self fulfilling prophecy? It seems to me, that a fair amount of K Rool support (and before you say anything I do support K. Rool myself) sort of begets itself. Which is to say that after a certain point people start to support characters they deem to be popular almost as a matter of course, simply because the environment on these boards makes them appear to be such an obvious choice. The support snowballs and sort of distorts people's perception of what is likely I think. I imagine a large number of people also learned about and support K Rool through these boards, but obviously the same can't really be said for Syrup given that people just don't talk about her, either because they don't care, or just don't think she's likely (again despite many similarities with one of the most expected characters). I wonder if things would look different if Syrup had a small dedicated group of fanboys pushing for support for her as long as K Rool has. Would people now think of her as a shoo-in in a similar way?

Anyway, just sort of makes me think about what other characters we might be writing off as a community.

I understand the feeling. Because so many people rally behind specific characters, many lesser-known ones are left behind in the wayside, with the faint hope they might get attention later. It can take years before popular Smash community choices are finally picked (as in Wario, Meta Knight/Dedede, Ridley and Daisy's cases), so that focus can be shifted elsewhere to characters that people feel they should earn a spot in Smash. In regards to DK characters, when K. Rool and Dixie can get in, what then? Will Lanky get fan love next? Funky and Cranky? The DK Crew? All of the above? The possible outcomes are nebulous.

With the scope of possible future Smash rosters likely placing more emphasis on what the fans want over promotional inclusions, one can only hope that the current situation can change someday for the better.

Also, I'm a Syrup supporter, for the record.

I'm rolling this as ballony but it shouldn't be too much longer

Oh boy, here we go again...

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

I should point out another thing about gengar

That wario/dedede being scared of something conspiracy theory

It could be gengar popping out (becoming visible) and scaring them

I'm still a firm supporter that Wario is afraid of the Trainer after SSE.

I'm rolling this as ballony but it shouldn't be too much longer

HMMMM that's almost too convinent. Checking how the American one looked for March and if it's the same image.

Edit: Eh it could be just the one from the American March direct....really would have been more helpful if it was like August 4th lol

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

"Leak" production kicked up and I've got enough for a whole two sessions (wow).

Spoiler: Session 1

Spoiler: "Leak" 1

King K. Rool: playable
Dixie Kong: Diddy echo but holds small items with her hair
Funky Kong: regular trophy
Ashley: AT again
Bandanna Dee: playable
Marx: absent
Isabelle: 4 Villager alt costumes (this was hinted at in the E3 trailer); Digby also gets 4
Dark Samus:now a true Samus alt (as in Dark Samus is the announced & displayed name); Meta Ridley is given the same treatment
Decidueye: appears with Rowlet (a new last-minute addition) during its Final Smash
Incineroar: released from Pokeballs
Mimikyu: released from Pokeballs
Lycanroc: regular trophy
Geno: Costume again
Octoling: 8 Inkling alts
Captain Toad: background appearance in a new stage (sometimes joined by Captain Toadette)
Shadow: Sonic echo but teleports with Chaos Control when dodging/rolling.
Tails: AT you can grab onto & fly around with
Simon Belmont: playable
Impa: regular trophy
Skull Kid: playable
Champions: regular trophies
Elma: regular trophy
Rex & Pyra: playable
Isaac: AT again
Porky: regular trophy
Black Shadow: absent
Medusa: regular trophy
Louie: regular trophy
Chorus Men: regular trophy
Karate Joe: regular trophy
Wonder Red: playable
Mach Rider: regular trophy
Excitebiker: AT again
Lip: absent
Heihaci: Costume again
Lloyd: Costume again
Shovel Knight: AT in sprite form that digs to bury others
Shantae: regular trophy
Quote: absent
Reimu: Mii Swordfighter Costume, along with other Touhou characters

An okay roster. Lloyd as a costume would be disappointing, but not the end of the world.

Spoiler: "Leak" 2

Got a list of newcomers and some miscellaneous info from a friend who works on modeling.

Belmont
Mimikkyu
Geno
King Krool
Elma
Ren

Quick google search says Elma is a Xenoblade character so idk why not go with Rex, maybe it's a promotion thing. Dunno who "Ren" is, they didn't specify any other name and nothing Nintendo related is coming up.

Alucard from Symphony of the Night is Simon's Assist trophy. Snake's is apparently cyborg Raiden now, they actually started modeling Grey Fox but Konami requested they reskin it with cyborg Raiden.

Source knows a Shadow model being worked on but they didn't say what it was for. They're also working on an Assist trophy requested by one of the guest composers. Guy apparently seems like a big deal so it's probably another guest Assist trophy. Saw pictures of a buff anime dude with weird hair being passed around the work space, claims "that's him".

I have no clue who the **** Ren is. *Googles*
Ren Amamiya...which is the canon name for Joker in Persona 5? (Just started playing it yesterday so I googled the canon name to use).

It's got the characters I want, therefore it has to be true.

Goku (buff anime dude with weird hair) as an assist trophy? That'd be pretty cool too.

Spoiler: "Leak" 3

>Mimikkyu
>Elma
>Shizue (Dash fighter) (Isabelle)
>Chrom (Dash fighter)
>K Rool
>Belmondo
>Geno
>Ninten (Dash Fighter)
>Dark Samus (Dash Fighter)
>Shadow (Dash Fighter)
>Tapper
>Reimu

I have no clue who Tapper is. Google yielded a 1983 arcade game, but it wasn't made by Nintendo nor did it prominently appear on any Nintendo systems, so that makes no sense. Otherwise the roster is safe bar Reimu.

Spoiler: "Leak" 4

I have Leaked info on the competitors
quiK (Albion 3 Winner Smash 4 Pro)
G-P (Smash 4 Community Leader and TO)
Alex From Nintendo Life (Youtuber)
Rabbidluigi (Youtuber)
Nicola Adams (Olympic Athlete)
Lost Voice Guy (Britains Got Talent Finalist)
Asa Butterfield (Actor)
J. Miller (Smash 4 and Mario Tennis Pro)

Doesn't have anything to do with characters, but a UK Invitational would be pretty exciting.

Spoiler: "Leak" 5

Nintendo Direct August 3rd 2018
>Bayonetta 3 reveal trailer. Bayonetta has long, loose hair after being 'killed' by human witch hunters.
>Sonic Adventure remakes, exclusive mushroom kingdom stage for Switch. Sonic amiibo line coming
>Shovel Knight King of Cards trailer. Release date October 2nd.
>Fzero: Mach Justice reveal trailer. Features both high speed chases and bounty hunting action sequences. Limited Edition includes an XL amiibo of the Blue Falcon
>Super Mario party overview trailer. Pikachu and Eevee promotional characters as well as a pokemon board.
>Fire Emblem Three Houses story trailer. A single kingdom is going through civil war, player can decide which group to support.
>Metroid Prime 3 'vidoc' discussing aims and vision for the game. Concepts shown as well as some early stages of development
>Smash Bros Ultimate trailer features Ganondorf and Bowser cornering young link before being saved by Guts. Tagline is "Guts goes berserk". Gameplay includes rapid fire arrows, arm cannon grab,ranged light explosives, and fast heavy attacks. Once damage taken is critical, Berserk armor activates, giving the player more defense and offensive damage.

What was that about an August 3rd Nintendo Direct? Guts would definitely be an out of left field pick, so props for that.

Spoiler: Session 2

Spoiler: "Leak" 6

TAKE THIS ALL WITH A GRAIN OF SALT. MY SOURCE COULD VERY WELL BE LYING. WITH THAT OUT OF THE WAY, LET'S GET INTO IT.

There will be 8 new characters. 5 first parties with completely unique movesets, 2 more echo characters making the echo count 5, and 1 third party newcomer. These newcomers were thought about but later rejected but could very well be DLC: Gen 7 Pokemon, Chibi Robo, Dixie Kong, Isaac, Isabelle, and any Fire Emblem characters. Let's get into the newcomers

King K. Rool. Due to outrageous amounts of fan support and the fact that Donkey Kong had very few reps, Sakurai's inclusion of a K. Rool mii costume was only a hint that K. Rool would gain a spot in ultimate. His moveset will be made up from his gimics as different roles in his previous donkey Kong games.

Elma. Xenoblade Chronicles X released on Wii U, and thanks to it's well received sales, Sakurai thought it would be necessary to include another wanted Xenoblade rep in the form of Elma. The final smash will be Elma and her mech unleashing complete chaos on the battlefield.

Bandana Dee. The requested Kirby rep had been on Sakurai's radar since brawl, and Sakurai finally chose to add him to represent the Waddle Dee's as a whole, as well as to represent the 4th Kirby character in smash. He will be a spear wielder.

Chorus Kids- Despite having rejection in Smash 4, Sakurai gave the Chorus Kids another go and gave them a moveset that would be difficult to learn yet unique and fun. It will be all three Chorus Kids singing their hearts out on the battlefield, representing Rhythm Heaven as a franchise.

Labo-Man. Labo Man will act as the WTF character this time around, and represent the Nintendo Labo. His moveset revolves around him using a joycon as his main weapon. What's cool is that you can change the color of the joy con with the different skins.

The two echo fighters are Impa (being a Sheik clone) and Black Shadow (being a Falcon clone) Third party is Simon Belmont bc Konami and Nintendo are close

Labo? In my Smash Bros? It's not likely at all.
Points for trying though.

Spoiler: "Leak" 7

I've got some info on the New Smash Bros. game, but I don't really have much to say.
According to my source:

Simon is in the game
However, my source doesnt know if he's playable or an assist trophy.

Ashley is in the game, but is in the same situation as Simon.

Isaac is back, but as an assist trophy, it could be possible that all the cut assists are returning.

I dont know anything about other newcomers, so no info on wanted characters like K. Rool or Waddle dee.

They're adding more alolan pokemon to the pokeball item including the ultra beasts, one of them is xurkitree. Another weird one is called silvally.

I dont know anything about stages, but the stage builder will be back.

As for single player, there's a possibility that a new mode is coming, possibily a type of adventure mode.

Tournament mode is returning.

I don't know if my source can get more info, it's going to be difficult considering the how well they're keeping the game's development very well hidden.

Vague and doesn't really say anything, but is believable because of that.

Spoiler: "Leak" 8

Alrighty everyone, here's a leak that I've heard floating around. I don't know all of the info, but these are some of the big things to expect.

-On August 9th, Nintendo will hold a 30-40 minute direct.
- Nintendo is partnering with Funko to release Mario, The Legend of Zelda, and Pokemon themed Pops.
- There will be a bit of info on Yo-Kai Blasters for the 3DS.
- Luigi's Mansion 3D will get a release date of October 22th.
- The 3DS section of the direct will end with the release date of Bowser's Inside Story, which is slated for February 18th.
- One of the highlights of the Switch section will be for Splatoon 2. This will showcase the 4.0 update of the game. This update will include:
- 2 New hairstyles for each Octoling gender
- 1 New hairstyle for each Inkling gender
- 50+ new gear
- 2 Stages from the first Splatoon are returning: Flounder Heights and Museum D'alfonsino. Along these returning stages is a brand new stage that seems a bit like Moray Towers.

- There will be an announcement of paid DLC for Mario Kart 8 Deluxe. There will be 2 new cups: Cap Cup and Boomerang Cup. Cap Cup will be based off of Mario Odyssey. The tracks are based off of the kingdoms in the game. 2 of the tracks are shown for this cup: New Donk City and the Snowline Circuit. Likewise, only 2 tracks are shown for the Boomerang Cup: Waluigi Pinball and DK Jungle Parkway. Only 3 new characters are shown, being Cappy (both in his Cap Kingdom design and Mario Hat design), Pauline, and Magikoopa. The release date is shown only as "Coming this fall."

-The direct will finish with a trailer for Smash Ultimate. This trailer will show King K. Rool and Dixie Kong.

STOP. REPEATING. THE. ****ING. JULY. 22ND. LEAK.

THANK YOU.

Spoiler: "Leak" 9

I have compiled all this information from an unnamed source.

There are to be 3 previously unnannounced fighters, Geno, King K. Rool and Isaac from Golden Sun. Dark Samus, Dixie Kong, Isabelle and Chrom will appear as Echo Fighters.

There are 4 new stages including Great Plateau Tower and Moray Towers. The remaining 2 are a stage based on New Donk City from Super Mario Odyssey and a stage based on Weyard from Golden Sun.

Custom moves return, custom equipment does not.

In Classic, you will be fighting a random assortment of fighters. After defeating Master Hand and Crazy Hand on higher difficulties, you will fight a new boss called "Master Wonder". Each character has a 'comic book-esque' opening and ending cutscene for Classic explaining why they have gone on an adventure and what they had acheived from the adventure. These cutscenes have a tone similar to that of the character's series. All-Star has you fighting all unlocked characters on your roster in order of when they appeared in the Smash series.

A new mode called Smash Quest allows you to unlock the remaining 63 characters. This mode features platforming levels inspired by the characters you are unlocking. These levels have aesthetics, enemies and some even have bosses from the characters respective series. When you beat these levels, you will be challenged by the respective character. When you beat that character, you will unlock them and a hard mode of the platforming level. Although you will only be able to unlock an additional 8 characters when you start playing, the more characters you unlock, the more that will become available to challenge in Smash Quest. This is the only way to unlock characters. The other modes will allow you to unlock the unlockable stages, trophies, ect.

There is a new smash mode where you and/or a friend can play as Master Hand and Crazy Hand against the cpu(s) or other local players.

K. Rool -> Geno -> Isaac, just as we discussed.

Spoiler: "Leak" 10: The Great Wall of Text

Believe this or don't. You'll ultimately see as we get closer to Smash Ultimate's release. For those who are interested in knowing some details about Smash Bros Ultimate, here are some details I've learned from my sources at Nintendo, Bandai Namco and at a few other companies closely associated with Smash Bros and the Smash Ballot.

- As many have figured, the Smash Ballot was indeed used to plan Smash Bros Ultimate. However, the entire concept of the game is using the ballot as a center point. Sakurai is making newly relevant characters a very low priority, so don't expect characters like Decidueye, Spring Man, Rex and Pyra or Edelgard in the base roster, but they may very well be DLC. DLC is not fully decided quite yet. There is one exception to this exclusion of new characters, however. Currently relevant things will appear as things like costumes, music or an occasional stage or Assist Trophy.

- Sakurai originally planned for 12 completely new characters and 2 echo fighters, expecting it to be managable to match the increase from the original to Melee. Legal and business reasons however, meant he had to scrap 2 of these new characters. He is expecting to be done with these new characters by the end of July and will then begin creating as many additional echo fighters as he can before the game goes gold in about 2 months. He is considering newer or more relevant characters like the Octolings, Celica and Alm for these echo characters. Last I heard, expecting to be able to manage including 3-4 additional echo fighters into the roster to compensate for the two cut characters. Due to ratings concerns, Sakurai is not considering characters from M/D rated or more mature T/C rated games as these last minute echo fighters.

- Several 3rd party characters were a struggle to get the rights to use. One of these was Bomberman, who was cut and made an Assist Trophy instead. Bomberman was fairly popular worldwide in the ballot, but Sakurai and Konami couldn't come to an agreement on how to represent Bomberman in Smash Bros with a reasonable moveset and abilities. Sakurai spent several months making changes to Bomberman and trying to figure out a way to make him work and satisfy Konami, but Konami was never satisfied. Sakurai eventually decided to abandon a playable Bomberman after falling months behind schedule, instead submitting a concept for an Assist Trophy that Konami approved without many changes required.

- The other cut character was Krystal who hadn't gotten far into development and was one of the less requested characters from the ballot, so was not a good choice for DLC. Due to being behind schedule, Sakurai chose to scrap her and make her an assist trophy as well, so she'd be included in some way at least.

- The two planned echo fighters were Daisy and Shadow who both had a notable presence in the ballot, but weren't that high, not making the top 10 worldwide (excluding veterans). Sakurai saw the opportunity to base these two on existing characters and thought he'd throw these fanbases a bone. Shadow may end up being a semi-clone due to some requirements from Sega that may make him a little too different for Sakurai to feel comfortable calling him an echo fighter.

- Veterans did very well in the ballot and that fact led to Sakurai deciding to bring every past character back assuming he could secure the rights to certain uncertain characters like Snake.

- Ridley was one of the most popular characters in the ballot and Sakurai decided this time he would figure out how to make Ridley work to give the fans what they wanted.

- Inkling actually did decently in the ballot despite the Mii costumes, which surprised Sakurai a little and secured them a place.

- K Rool was another very popular character worldwide, though less so in Japan than other regions. K Rool is going to be an all new character taking inspiration from many of his appearances and classic boss battles.

- Dixie Kong also did pretty well, but was not a front runner. She will be a semi-clone of Diddy Kong in much the same way as Luigi is to Mario.

- Isaac was much, much more popular than Sakurai expected, especially in Europe, but not on par with Ridley or K Rool. This surprise popularity led to Sakurai making him high priority alongside K. Rool, Ridley and Inkling.

- Ashley was very popular in Japan and fairly popular elsewhere and has been chosen to appeal to Japanese players.

- Kos-Mos had a dedicated, but quiet fanbase voting which coincided with Monolithsoft and Bandai Namco both wanting to see her be included in Smash Bros and cameo in Xenoblade 2. Sakurai saw a great deal of potential in her moveset and it was a perfect storm despite her being a little less popular than several other characters who didn't make the project plan.

- Geno has been considered often by Sakurai and also performed very well in the ballot. Sakurai made a point to figure out how to satisfy Square Enix and they were more reasonable than Konami.

- Shovel Knight was relatively popular for what he is. Initially, Sakurai was leaning against including him, but ultimately decided to talk with Yacht Club games and came around to the idea. Yacht Club games reportedly offered to help Nintendo and Sakurai in any way they could with Shovel Knight.

- Chibi-Robo saw a shocking spike in the final days of the ballot after Nintendo's grim comments about how Zip Lash needed to sell well. Sakurai had to twist a few arms at Nintendo, but Chibi-Robo will be in this Smash Bros at least and Nintendo are reportedly planning to rerelease the original Chibi-Robo digitally next year to gauge the franchise's popularity one last time. The picture of the flaming Chibi-Robo seems to be something Kensuke Tanabe is using to remind his team of the passion the fans have for Chibi-Robo.

- Bandana Waddle Dee was another surprise for Sakurai. Initially, Sakurai considered dismissing him due to having trouble thinking of a moveset, but spent a couple days brainstorming with Hal Laboratory. Bandana Waddle Dee's moveset in Star Allies is based on some of these brainstorming sessions. Sakurai was hesitant though and decided he wouldn't quite fit this time.

- Paper Mario also did relatively well in the ballot in America, but Sakurai ultimately decided to include the more popular Geno who would have a more straightforward and unique moveset in his eyes. Sakurai instead planned to bring back the stage and look into including some Paper Mario Assist Trophies.

- Belmont, a character including various Belmonts as alternates, was briefly considered early on, but Bomberman was far more popular and iconic and was chosen instead. Sakurai expected difficulty from Konami and didn't want to negotiate 3 characters.

- Fiora had a small following, so she was added to Shulk's final smash.

- Proto Man and Bass also had a small presence, so Sakurai chose to include them in Mega Man's final smash.

- Paula, Poo, Kumatora and Boney all had some minor presence in the ballot, so were included in Ness's and Lucas's final smashes.

- From what I've heard, Waluigi seems to be Sakurai's favorite Mario character and the one he identifies with most, but he doesn't want to be the one to add him because he is afraid he is too biased. I've heard the recent and hateful Waluigi backlash left him with very mixed emotions.

- Many western fans also expressed requests outside of their chosen character. It took a long time, but Sakurai had a team group and list some of the frequently recurring requests like directional air-dodges, stage hazard toggles, a better Menu UI and a faster game pace.

- Sakurai isn't sure he wants to have another worldwide ballot, although he values what he has learned about the west's desires.

- Bayonetta did not actually win the ballot or do particularly well in any region. Nintendo and Platinum Games wanted her to be added and the fanservice characters to be saved for the Switch game.

Say it with me:
BEING DETAILED DOESN'T MAKE YOUR LEAK ANY LESS BULL****.

It has been brought to my attention by a friend on Discord that Smash Ultimate's initial reveal, March 8th, was 137 days ago and that there is now 137 days left until its release.

In other words...

View attachment 154105

 

[StormC]

So I sort of asked this question in the Captain Syrup character support thread, but nobody is really interacting with that particular thread sadly, so I figure I'd ask it here as well. But as far as first party characters go, what is it that really separates the super popular requests from those that are relatively ignored?

I asked this in the Captain Syrup thread specifically because I find that she is an interesting case. If you compare her to King K Rool for example, they are quite similar in what they have going for them with the exception of K. Rool's very obvious massive popularity (on the internet).

But if you think about it both characters are older, classic characters that aren't particularly relevant now. But they are recurring villains in their series. They were each in a similar number of games (4 for K Rool, 3 for Syrup). And those series are not particularly obscure series either, and in fact both can be tied to Mario. Both have a fair amount to work with in terms of design for Smash Bros. Captain Syrup actually has the benefit of being relevant more recently having been in Wario Land Shake It on the Wii. Not really relevant, but still more so than K Rool, as far as I'm aware anyway. And to the extent that you care about this, she is also a potential female character.

Despite those similarities though, King K. Rool is massively popular to the point where he is the most expected character, while Captain Syrup apparently JUST got her own support thread as of like a week ago. The difference is incredibly stark, and I don't really understand why?

I do get that there is a lot of intangibility in terms of what makes a character compelling and thus popular. So I don't really expect her to have the same, or even similar amount of support. I mean perhaps her character just doesn't connect with as many people. But that just doesn't seem to account for just how vast the difference in popularity seems to be.

Was Wario Land in general just that much less popular than the DKC games? Or do you think the online support in communities like these is a bit of a self fulfilling prophecy? It seems to me, that a fair amount of K Rool support (and before you say anything I do support K. Rool myself) sort of begets itself. Which is to say that after a certain point people start to support characters they deem to be popular almost as a matter of course, simply because the environment on these boards makes them appear to be such an obvious choice. The support snowballs and sort of distorts people's perception of what is likely I think. I imagine a large number of people also learned about and support K Rool through these boards, but obviously the same can't really be said for Syrup given that people just don't talk about her, either because they don't care, or just don't think she's likely (again despite many similarities with one of the most expected characters). I wonder if things would look different if Syrup had a small dedicated group of fanboys pushing for support for her as long as K Rool has. Would people now think of her as a shoo-in in a similar way?

Anyway, just sort of makes me think about what other characters we might be writing off as a community.

K. Rool's recurrence extends far past a couple of games.

-He was the main villain of the DKC trilogy, the DKL trilogy, DK64, and appeared in every Paon game, either as the main villain or as a playable character (or both). That's a lot more than just 4.
-He was a major character in the DKC cartoon, appearing in almost every episode.
-The DK series destroys Wario Land in popularity and iconicness; DKC1 sold 9 million copies and 2 and 3 both sold 5M and 3M respectively. DK64 sold 5 million copies and the first character you meet in that game is K. Rool. Offhand I don't know how many copies Wario Land 1 and 2 sold, but DKC1 probably sold more than both of them combined.
-Captain Syrup doesn't stand out as much because in her first appearance, her boss fight involves her riding a genie. Her role in Land 2 is a fair amount more significant, but her boss fights don't exactly give her a lot to work with there either. She's just an NPC in Shake It as well.

I like Captain Syrup and wish Nintendo used her more - but there is simply no comparison to K. Rool. K. Rool was probably Nintendo's second highest profile villain in the 90s after Bowser, even moreso than Ganon.

 

[Zeox]

Also, you guys have seen the last "leak" from /v/?

Spoiler: Image leak

Link: http://boards.4chan.org/v/thread/425243947
This one, what's your opinion?

 

[Pyra]

HMMMM that's almost too convinent. Checking how the American one looked for March and if it's the same image.

It's not. Spain Nintendo Direct images have leading 0s, neither America (nor Japan, for that matter) has those.
Doesn't mean anything towards its validity though.

 

[CrusherMania1592]

Did you buy the ESRB leak? Before Shulk got announced?


That mouth is horrifying.

That was when we wanted leaks to pop out.


This game has these so-called "leaks" being thrown out EVERY day. I ain't buying nothing

 

[Rie Sonomura]

"Leak" production kicked up and I've got enough for a whole two sessions (wow).

Spoiler: Session 1

Spoiler: "Leak" 1

King K. Rool: playable
Dixie Kong: Diddy echo but holds small items with her hair
Funky Kong: regular trophy
Ashley: AT again
Bandanna Dee: playable
Marx: absent
Isabelle: 4 Villager alt costumes (this was hinted at in the E3 trailer); Digby also gets 4
Dark Samus:now a true Samus alt (as in Dark Samus is the announced & displayed name); Meta Ridley is given the same treatment
Decidueye: appears with Rowlet (a new last-minute addition) during its Final Smash
Incineroar: released from Pokeballs
Mimikyu: released from Pokeballs
Lycanroc: regular trophy
Geno: Costume again
Octoling: 8 Inkling alts
Captain Toad: background appearance in a new stage (sometimes joined by Captain Toadette)
Shadow: Sonic echo but teleports with Chaos Control when dodging/rolling.
Tails: AT you can grab onto & fly around with
Simon Belmont: playable
Impa: regular trophy
Skull Kid: playable
Champions: regular trophies
Elma: regular trophy
Rex & Pyra: playable
Isaac: AT again
Porky: regular trophy
Black Shadow: absent
Medusa: regular trophy
Louie: regular trophy
Chorus Men: regular trophy
Karate Joe: regular trophy
Wonder Red: playable
Mach Rider: regular trophy
Excitebiker: AT again
Lip: absent
Heihaci: Costume again
Lloyd: Costume again
Shovel Knight: AT in sprite form that digs to bury others
Shantae: regular trophy
Quote: absent
Reimu: Mii Swordfighter Costume, along with other Touhou characters

An okay roster. Lloyd as a costume would be disappointing, but not the end of the world.

Spoiler: "Leak" 2

Got a list of newcomers and some miscellaneous info from a friend who works on modeling.

Belmont
Mimikkyu
Geno
King Krool
Elma
Ren

Quick google search says Elma is a Xenoblade character so idk why not go with Rex, maybe it's a promotion thing. Dunno who "Ren" is, they didn't specify any other name and nothing Nintendo related is coming up.

Alucard from Symphony of the Night is Simon's Assist trophy. Snake's is apparently cyborg Raiden now, they actually started modeling Grey Fox but Konami requested they reskin it with cyborg Raiden.

Source knows a Shadow model being worked on but they didn't say what it was for. They're also working on an Assist trophy requested by one of the guest composers. Guy apparently seems like a big deal so it's probably another guest Assist trophy. Saw pictures of a buff anime dude with weird hair being passed around the work space, claims "that's him".

I have no clue who the **** Ren is. *Googles*
Ren Amamiya...which is the canon name for Joker in Persona 5? (Just started playing it yesterday so I googled the canon name to use).

It's got the characters I want, therefore it has to be true.

Goku (buff anime dude with weird hair) as an assist trophy? That'd be pretty cool too.

Spoiler: "Leak" 3

>Mimikkyu
>Elma
>Shizue (Dash fighter) (Isabelle)
>Chrom (Dash fighter)
>K Rool
>Belmondo
>Geno
>Ninten (Dash Fighter)
>Dark Samus (Dash Fighter)
>Shadow (Dash Fighter)
>Tapper
>Reimu

I have no clue who Tapper is. Google yielded a 1983 arcade game, but it wasn't made by Nintendo nor did it prominently appear on any Nintendo systems, so that makes no sense. Otherwise the roster is safe bar Reimu.

Spoiler: "Leak" 4

I have Leaked info on the competitors
quiK (Albion 3 Winner Smash 4 Pro)
G-P (Smash 4 Community Leader and TO)
Alex From Nintendo Life (Youtuber)
Rabbidluigi (Youtuber)
Nicola Adams (Olympic Athlete)
Lost Voice Guy (Britains Got Talent Finalist)
Asa Butterfield (Actor)
J. Miller (Smash 4 and Mario Tennis Pro)

Doesn't have anything to do with characters, but a UK Invitational would be pretty exciting.

Spoiler: "Leak" 5

Nintendo Direct August 3rd 2018
>Bayonetta 3 reveal trailer. Bayonetta has long, loose hair after being 'killed' by human witch hunters.
>Sonic Adventure remakes, exclusive mushroom kingdom stage for Switch. Sonic amiibo line coming
>Shovel Knight King of Cards trailer. Release date October 2nd.
>Fzero: Mach Justice reveal trailer. Features both high speed chases and bounty hunting action sequences. Limited Edition includes an XL amiibo of the Blue Falcon
>Super Mario party overview trailer. Pikachu and Eevee promotional characters as well as a pokemon board.
>Fire Emblem Three Houses story trailer. A single kingdom is going through civil war, player can decide which group to support.
>Metroid Prime 3 'vidoc' discussing aims and vision for the game. Concepts shown as well as some early stages of development
>Smash Bros Ultimate trailer features Ganondorf and Bowser cornering young link before being saved by Guts. Tagline is "Guts goes berserk". Gameplay includes rapid fire arrows, arm cannon grab,ranged light explosives, and fast heavy attacks. Once damage taken is critical, Berserk armor activates, giving the player more defense and offensive damage.

What was that about an August 3rd Nintendo Direct? Guts would definitely be an out of left field pick, so props for that.

Spoiler: Session 2

Spoiler: "Leak" 6

TAKE THIS ALL WITH A GRAIN OF SALT. MY SOURCE COULD VERY WELL BE LYING. WITH THAT OUT OF THE WAY, LET'S GET INTO IT.

There will be 8 new characters. 5 first parties with completely unique movesets, 2 more echo characters making the echo count 5, and 1 third party newcomer. These newcomers were thought about but later rejected but could very well be DLC: Gen 7 Pokemon, Chibi Robo, Dixie Kong, Isaac, Isabelle, and any Fire Emblem characters. Let's get into the newcomers

King K. Rool. Due to outrageous amounts of fan support and the fact that Donkey Kong had very few reps, Sakurai's inclusion of a K. Rool mii costume was only a hint that K. Rool would gain a spot in ultimate. His moveset will be made up from his gimics as different roles in his previous donkey Kong games.

Elma. Xenoblade Chronicles X released on Wii U, and thanks to it's well received sales, Sakurai thought it would be necessary to include another wanted Xenoblade rep in the form of Elma. The final smash will be Elma and her mech unleashing complete chaos on the battlefield.

Bandana Dee. The requested Kirby rep had been on Sakurai's radar since brawl, and Sakurai finally chose to add him to represent the Waddle Dee's as a whole, as well as to represent the 4th Kirby character in smash. He will be a spear wielder.

Chorus Kids- Despite having rejection in Smash 4, Sakurai gave the Chorus Kids another go and gave them a moveset that would be difficult to learn yet unique and fun. It will be all three Chorus Kids singing their hearts out on the battlefield, representing Rhythm Heaven as a franchise.

Labo-Man. Labo Man will act as the WTF character this time around, and represent the Nintendo Labo. His moveset revolves around him using a joycon as his main weapon. What's cool is that you can change the color of the joy con with the different skins.

The two echo fighters are Impa (being a Sheik clone) and Black Shadow (being a Falcon clone) Third party is Simon Belmont bc Konami and Nintendo are close

Labo? In my Smash Bros? It's not likely at all.
Points for trying though.

Spoiler: "Leak" 7

I've got some info on the New Smash Bros. game, but I don't really have much to say.
According to my source:

Simon is in the game
However, my source doesnt know if he's playable or an assist trophy.

Ashley is in the game, but is in the same situation as Simon.

Isaac is back, but as an assist trophy, it could be possible that all the cut assists are returning.

I dont know anything about other newcomers, so no info on wanted characters like K. Rool or Waddle dee.

They're adding more alolan pokemon to the pokeball item including the ultra beasts, one of them is xurkitree. Another weird one is called silvally.

I dont know anything about stages, but the stage builder will be back.

As for single player, there's a possibility that a new mode is coming, possibily a type of adventure mode.

Tournament mode is returning.

I don't know if my source can get more info, it's going to be difficult considering the how well they're keeping the game's development very well hidden.

Vague and doesn't really say anything, but is believable because of that.

Spoiler: "Leak" 8

Alrighty everyone, here's a leak that I've heard floating around. I don't know all of the info, but these are some of the big things to expect.

-On August 9th, Nintendo will hold a 30-40 minute direct.
- Nintendo is partnering with Funko to release Mario, The Legend of Zelda, and Pokemon themed Pops.
- There will be a bit of info on Yo-Kai Blasters for the 3DS.
- Luigi's Mansion 3D will get a release date of October 22th.
- The 3DS section of the direct will end with the release date of Bowser's Inside Story, which is slated for February 18th.
- One of the highlights of the Switch section will be for Splatoon 2. This will showcase the 4.0 update of the game. This update will include:
- 2 New hairstyles for each Octoling gender
- 1 New hairstyle for each Inkling gender
- 50+ new gear
- 2 Stages from the first Splatoon are returning: Flounder Heights and Museum D'alfonsino. Along these returning stages is a brand new stage that seems a bit like Moray Towers.

- There will be an announcement of paid DLC for Mario Kart 8 Deluxe. There will be 2 new cups: Cap Cup and Boomerang Cup. Cap Cup will be based off of Mario Odyssey. The tracks are based off of the kingdoms in the game. 2 of the tracks are shown for this cup: New Donk City and the Snowline Circuit. Likewise, only 2 tracks are shown for the Boomerang Cup: Waluigi Pinball and DK Jungle Parkway. Only 3 new characters are shown, being Cappy (both in his Cap Kingdom design and Mario Hat design), Pauline, and Magikoopa. The release date is shown only as "Coming this fall."

-The direct will finish with a trailer for Smash Ultimate. This trailer will show King K. Rool and Dixie Kong.

STOP. REPEATING. THE. ****ING. JULY. 22ND. LEAK.

THANK YOU.

Spoiler: "Leak" 9

I have compiled all this information from an unnamed source.

There are to be 3 previously unnannounced fighters, Geno, King K. Rool and Isaac from Golden Sun. Dark Samus, Dixie Kong, Isabelle and Chrom will appear as Echo Fighters.

There are 4 new stages including Great Plateau Tower and Moray Towers. The remaining 2 are a stage based on New Donk City from Super Mario Odyssey and a stage based on Weyard from Golden Sun.

Custom moves return, custom equipment does not.

In Classic, you will be fighting a random assortment of fighters. After defeating Master Hand and Crazy Hand on higher difficulties, you will fight a new boss called "Master Wonder". Each character has a 'comic book-esque' opening and ending cutscene for Classic explaining why they have gone on an adventure and what they had acheived from the adventure. These cutscenes have a tone similar to that of the character's series. All-Star has you fighting all unlocked characters on your roster in order of when they appeared in the Smash series.

A new mode called Smash Quest allows you to unlock the remaining 63 characters. This mode features platforming levels inspired by the characters you are unlocking. These levels have aesthetics, enemies and some even have bosses from the characters respective series. When you beat these levels, you will be challenged by the respective character. When you beat that character, you will unlock them and a hard mode of the platforming level. Although you will only be able to unlock an additional 8 characters when you start playing, the more characters you unlock, the more that will become available to challenge in Smash Quest. This is the only way to unlock characters. The other modes will allow you to unlock the unlockable stages, trophies, ect.

There is a new smash mode where you and/or a friend can play as Master Hand and Crazy Hand against the cpu(s) or other local players.

K. Rool -> Geno -> Isaac, just as we discussed.

Spoiler: "Leak" 10: The Great Wall of Text

Believe this or don't. You'll ultimately see as we get closer to Smash Ultimate's release. For those who are interested in knowing some details about Smash Bros Ultimate, here are some details I've learned from my sources at Nintendo, Bandai Namco and at a few other companies closely associated with Smash Bros and the Smash Ballot.

- As many have figured, the Smash Ballot was indeed used to plan Smash Bros Ultimate. However, the entire concept of the game is using the ballot as a center point. Sakurai is making newly relevant characters a very low priority, so don't expect characters like Decidueye, Spring Man, Rex and Pyra or Edelgard in the base roster, but they may very well be DLC. DLC is not fully decided quite yet. There is one exception to this exclusion of new characters, however. Currently relevant things will appear as things like costumes, music or an occasional stage or Assist Trophy.

- Sakurai originally planned for 12 completely new characters and 2 echo fighters, expecting it to be managable to match the increase from the original to Melee. Legal and business reasons however, meant he had to scrap 2 of these new characters. He is expecting to be done with these new characters by the end of July and will then begin creating as many additional echo fighters as he can before the game goes gold in about 2 months. He is considering newer or more relevant characters like the Octolings, Celica and Alm for these echo characters. Last I heard, expecting to be able to manage including 3-4 additional echo fighters into the roster to compensate for the two cut characters. Due to ratings concerns, Sakurai is not considering characters from M/D rated or more mature T/C rated games as these last minute echo fighters.

- Several 3rd party characters were a struggle to get the rights to use. One of these was Bomberman, who was cut and made an Assist Trophy instead. Bomberman was fairly popular worldwide in the ballot, but Sakurai and Konami couldn't come to an agreement on how to represent Bomberman in Smash Bros with a reasonable moveset and abilities. Sakurai spent several months making changes to Bomberman and trying to figure out a way to make him work and satisfy Konami, but Konami was never satisfied. Sakurai eventually decided to abandon a playable Bomberman after falling months behind schedule, instead submitting a concept for an Assist Trophy that Konami approved without many changes required.

- The other cut character was Krystal who hadn't gotten far into development and was one of the less requested characters from the ballot, so was not a good choice for DLC. Due to being behind schedule, Sakurai chose to scrap her and make her an assist trophy as well, so she'd be included in some way at least.

- The two planned echo fighters were Daisy and Shadow who both had a notable presence in the ballot, but weren't that high, not making the top 10 worldwide (excluding veterans). Sakurai saw the opportunity to base these two on existing characters and thought he'd throw these fanbases a bone. Shadow may end up being a semi-clone due to some requirements from Sega that may make him a little too different for Sakurai to feel comfortable calling him an echo fighter.

- Veterans did very well in the ballot and that fact led to Sakurai deciding to bring every past character back assuming he could secure the rights to certain uncertain characters like Snake.

- Ridley was one of the most popular characters in the ballot and Sakurai decided this time he would figure out how to make Ridley work to give the fans what they wanted.

- Inkling actually did decently in the ballot despite the Mii costumes, which surprised Sakurai a little and secured them a place.

- K Rool was another very popular character worldwide, though less so in Japan than other regions. K Rool is going to be an all new character taking inspiration from many of his appearances and classic boss battles.

- Dixie Kong also did pretty well, but was not a front runner. She will be a semi-clone of Diddy Kong in much the same way as Luigi is to Mario.

- Isaac was much, much more popular than Sakurai expected, especially in Europe, but not on par with Ridley or K Rool. This surprise popularity led to Sakurai making him high priority alongside K. Rool, Ridley and Inkling.

- Ashley was very popular in Japan and fairly popular elsewhere and has been chosen to appeal to Japanese players.

- Kos-Mos had a dedicated, but quiet fanbase voting which coincided with Monolithsoft and Bandai Namco both wanting to see her be included in Smash Bros and cameo in Xenoblade 2. Sakurai saw a great deal of potential in her moveset and it was a perfect storm despite her being a little less popular than several other characters who didn't make the project plan.

- Geno has been considered often by Sakurai and also performed very well in the ballot. Sakurai made a point to figure out how to satisfy Square Enix and they were more reasonable than Konami.

- Shovel Knight was relatively popular for what he is. Initially, Sakurai was leaning against including him, but ultimately decided to talk with Yacht Club games and came around to the idea. Yacht Club games reportedly offered to help Nintendo and Sakurai in any way they could with Shovel Knight.

- Chibi-Robo saw a shocking spike in the final days of the ballot after Nintendo's grim comments about how Zip Lash needed to sell well. Sakurai had to twist a few arms at Nintendo, but Chibi-Robo will be in this Smash Bros at least and Nintendo are reportedly planning to rerelease the original Chibi-Robo digitally next year to gauge the franchise's popularity one last time. The picture of the flaming Chibi-Robo seems to be something Kensuke Tanabe is using to remind his team of the passion the fans have for Chibi-Robo.

- Bandana Waddle Dee was another surprise for Sakurai. Initially, Sakurai considered dismissing him due to having trouble thinking of a moveset, but spent a couple days brainstorming with Hal Laboratory. Bandana Waddle Dee's moveset in Star Allies is based on some of these brainstorming sessions. Sakurai was hesitant though and decided he wouldn't quite fit this time.

- Paper Mario also did relatively well in the ballot in America, but Sakurai ultimately decided to include the more popular Geno who would have a more straightforward and unique moveset in his eyes. Sakurai instead planned to bring back the stage and look into including some Paper Mario Assist Trophies.

- Belmont, a character including various Belmonts as alternates, was briefly considered early on, but Bomberman was far more popular and iconic and was chosen instead. Sakurai expected difficulty from Konami and didn't want to negotiate 3 characters.

- Fiora had a small following, so she was added to Shulk's final smash.

- Proto Man and Bass also had a small presence, so Sakurai chose to include them in Mega Man's final smash.

- Paula, Poo, Kumatora and Boney all had some minor presence in the ballot, so were included in Ness's and Lucas's final smashes.

- From what I've heard, Waluigi seems to be Sakurai's favorite Mario character and the one he identifies with most, but he doesn't want to be the one to add him because he is afraid he is too biased. I've heard the recent and hateful Waluigi backlash left him with very mixed emotions.

- Many western fans also expressed requests outside of their chosen character. It took a long time, but Sakurai had a team group and list some of the frequently recurring requests like directional air-dodges, stage hazard toggles, a better Menu UI and a faster game pace.

- Sakurai isn't sure he wants to have another worldwide ballot, although he values what he has learned about the west's desires.

- Bayonetta did not actually win the ballot or do particularly well in any region. Nintendo and Platinum Games wanted her to be added and the fanservice characters to be saved for the Switch game.

Say it with me:
BEING DETAILED DOESN'T MAKE YOUR LEAK ANY LESS BULL****.

The only thing I can somewhat believe is from Leak 9: “Fiora had a small following so she was added to Shulk’s Final Smash”. LMAO at the Belmont thing tho

Also, what’s with all the Reimu in leaks lately???

Also, you guys have seen the last "leak" from /v/?

Spoiler: Image leak

Link: http://boards.4chan.org/v/thread/425243947
This one, what's your opinion?

I don’t trust ANYTHING that doesn’t show off fighter models with the so called new fighter icons. Faaaaaake.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Can I get some new info Smash website

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

Also, you guys have seen the last "leak" from /v/?

Spoiler: Image leak

Link: http://boards.4chan.org/v/thread/425243947
This one, what's your opinion?

They aren't even trying anymore

In 4chan they even pointed out it's just the one image but flipped

Not to mention they aren't even showing the character models

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

I get the feeling that people often mistake the words Retro and Classic for each other. They're kind of interchangeable at some points but at others not so much.

 

[SirCamp]

K. Rool's recurrence extends far past a couple of games.

-He was the main villain of the DKC trilogy, the DKL trilogy, DK64, and appeared in every Paon game, either as the main villain or as a playable character (or both). That's a lot more than just 4.
-He was a major character in the DKC cartoon, appearing in almost every episode.
-The DK series destroys Wario Land in popularity and iconicness; DKC1 sold 9 million copies and 2 and 3 both sold 5M and 3M respectively. DK64 sold 5 million copies and the first character you meet in that game is K. Rool. Offhand I don't know how many copies Wario Land 1 and 2 sold, but DKC1 probably sold more than both of them combined.
-Captain Syrup doesn't stand out as much because in her first appearance, her boss fight involves her riding a genie. Her role in Land 2 is a fair amount more significant, but her boss fights don't exactly give her a lot to work with there either. She's just an NPC in Shake It as well.

I like Captain Syrup and wish Nintendo used her more - but there is simply no comparison to K. Rool. K. Rool was probably Nintendo's second highest profile villain in the 90s after Bowser, even moreso than Ganon.

Fair enough, seems my info was wrong. Tbh I checked wikipedia and for some reason it lists only 4 "main appearances" and like DKL appearance separately, which I overlooked. What is paon though? Also I didn't realize there was a cartoon. That's actually very significant as far as exposure goes. Makes sense.

 

[StormC]

Let me just break out this classic:

 

[SuperSonicFlyer]

Looks like this thread is becoming leak happy now, if you know what I mean. Aside from the Direct thing Smashoperatingbuddy posted, maybe, I wonder what else can be talked about?

 

[Pyra]

Looks like this thread is becoming leak happy now

You can't honestly think this is a new thing

 

[CrusherMania1592]

Looks like this thread is becoming leak happy now, if you know what I mean. Aside from the Direct thing Smashoperatingbuddy posted, maybe, I wonder what else can be talked about?

More Fire Emblem

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Let me just break out this classic:
(Snip)

Might wanna censor the F-bomb using Paint there so you don’t get in trouble, but other than that, this is the exact fact we should be aware of

 

[StormC]

Fair enough, seems my info was wrong. Tbh I checked wikipedia and for some reason it lists only 4 "main appearances" and like DKL appearance separately, which I overlooked. What is paon though? Also I didn't realize there was a cartoon. That's actually very significant as far as exposure goes. Makes sense.

Paon is the developer that make multiple DK spin-offs in the 2000s.

King Of Swing, 2005 (GBA): K. Rool is the main villain and playable in multiplayer.
Jungle Climber, 2007 (DS): K. Rool is the main villain.
Barrel Blast, 2007 (Wii): K. Rool is playable.

 

[KMDP]

sick on the day they were signing **** so he isn't under contract which is laughably convenient.

Not to mention that NDAs don't work that way.

 

[DoctorSanity]

Also, you guys have seen the last "leak" from /v/?

Spoiler: Image leak

Link: http://boards.4chan.org/v/thread/425243947
This one, what's your opinion?

...Props for an obscure character?

 

[SuperSonicFlyer]

You can't honestly think this is a new thing

Oh, it's old, alright. The only thing new about this are the newly created leaks created nearly every day about Smash 5.

 

[lordvaati]

I was interpreting the Geolyte thing not as a Newcomer but a new foe for Multi-Man Smash.

64=Polygons
Melee=Wireframes
Brawl=Alloys
Sm4sh=Miis

if that was the case, it would be a maybe. if it's being shown as a newcomer, yeah that's bogus.