Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Zinith]

You know, all these 4Chan leaks describe the characters, assist trophies and stages, and that's fine and dandy. But what about the small things? I want to see a leak that goes into excruciating detail about EVERY SINGLE MINUTE THING about Smash Ultimate. The trophies, the changes made to each character, the framedata, the items, the music tracks used for each stage, the modes, the minigames, new game mechanics, what the ****ing unlock section will look like. Hell, I want sheet music for what the minigame menu music will sound. I want the most detailed, autistic manifesto of a leak ever conceived by the human mind. I want it to exceed the word count of the Bible!!!

No pressure 4Chan...

 

[Jetsurge]

Anyone know what Yoshi's and Diddy's new final smash will be?

 

[Zinith]

Anyone know what Yoshi's and Diddy's new final smash will be?

*sigh* Unfortunately no, but I at least predict that Yoshi's will be the Eggdozer from Yoshi's New Island

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

I’d like an event where defenseless Yoshi’s replace Mr Sandbag for the Homerun Contest.,...


( ˊ̱˂˃ˋ̱ )

You monster!

Jokes aside, I just hope that if event matches return, we're not forced to have to increase the difficulty. Smash Wii U had way too many hard difficulty reward conditions. And why the game records your event match history is beyond me.

 

[RileyXY1]

Some random though I had, but I’m starting to feel worried about the newcomer lineup.

In my opinion, when I first started speculating on this new game I was really interested in what curveball characters that can pop up, the possibilities of IPS that can get revitalized, and anything new and enticing to get in with the roster.

Although they haven’t really showed anything yet, the only thing that is tossed around is fanservice, fanservice, and more fanservice. Yes this game is taking feedback from the things people didn’t like about Smash 4 which is great! However, I don’t want to the newcomer lineup to be just characters from the ballot. I want to see more wacky and unique characters Sakurai can create from Nintendo’s vast library that wouldn’t have been noticed by people to begin with.

So far I have enjoyed many of Sakurai’s curveball characters, but if the newcomers are only going fanservice characters, then I’d feel that Sakurai didn’t really he had the freedom he had when it came to the roster than in previous games. Like he’s chained to OBEY what the fans want and what the fans say. Yes, it’s great to see characters that people have been asking for a long time, but I also want to see what unique concepts and characters Sakurai can put out for us as well that wouldn’t have gotten in if it weren’t for him. A lot of his oddball choices became staples and fan favorites and I also want to see some of that for this game too, since chances are, they defenitley aren’t going to have oddball choices as DLC.

Yeah. I like oddball and out there picks. I would be upset if we didn't have any.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Here's a question.

What is the character with the most recent debut that you think will get in?

Both for unique characters and echoes.

 

[Zinith]

Here's a question.

What is the character with the most recent debut that you think will get in?

Both for unique characters and echoes.

What do you mean by "most recent debut?" Like just last month recent?

 

[zeldasmash]

Probably Rex from Xenoblade Chronicles 2 as a new fighter or Decidueye.

As for an Echo? I can't seem to think of one at the moment.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Here's a question.

What is the character with the most recent debut that you think will get in?

Both for unique characters and echoes.

Pokemon Sun and Moon Pokemon. After that? Elma.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

So, here's a question.

Do you think there will be more third parties and if so, why were there no third parties revealed at E3?

Maybe for the first question, but only characters that aren't as overwhelmingly big as the likes of Sora and Steve, because I figure if the likes of them were in the base roster, why weren't they used to kick-start hype in the biggest gaming event of this year, being E3? Instead, Ridley was used as the big hype character, which pretty much implies there aren't any super-big third-party newcomers for the base roster.

Here's a question.

What is the character with the most recent debut that you think will get in?

Both for unique characters and echoes.

Unique? A Gen 7 Pokemon. I wouldn't be surprised if the Octolings, based off their Splatoon 2 designs, were echo characters.

 

[Zinith]

Here's a question.

What is the character with the most recent debut that you think will get in?

Both for unique characters and echoes.

Ok, I guess I'll have to go with Elma and Octoling...

 

[Cosmic77]

Here's a question.

What is the character with the most recent debut that you think will get in?

Both for unique characters and echoes.

From newest to oldest:

Rex/Pyra, Spring Man, a Champion, or a Gen VII Pokemon for a unique character.
Octolings or Isabelle for an Echo.

Regardless of what others might say, I'm still not convinced we should write off these 2017 characters just yet.

 

[Deleted member]

Here's a question.

What is the character with the most recent debut that you think will get in?

Both for unique characters and echoes.

For unique characters, a Gen 7 Pokemon.
For Echoes, not sure and I don't really care.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

I forgot echoes? Hmmm.

I don't know what they'd do there.

I honestly don't think they have many of them and I think none of them are more popular than Daisy. Sorry, people who suggest Shadow, Isabelle, etc are echoes. If they were? They'd have been revealed instead of her.

 

[Jetsurge]

Here's a question.

What is the character with the most recent debut that you think will get in?

Both for unique characters and echoes.

Mimikyu, Decidueye or Lycanroc

 

[P.Kat]

Ooh, Sonic is the Fighter of the Day.

So, on that note, what kind of things from the Sonic series do you want or expect?

As unlikely as it would be I want Blaze The Cat to be playable.

 

[DutchPichu]

Some random though I had, but I’m starting to feel worried about the newcomer lineup.

In my opinion, when I first started speculating on this new game I was really interested in what curveball characters that can pop up, the possibilities of IPS that can get revitalized, and anything new and enticing to get in with the roster.

Although they haven’t really showed anything yet, the only thing that is tossed around is fanservice, fanservice, and more fanservice. Yes this game is taking feedback from the things people didn’t like about Smash 4 which is great! However, I don’t want to the newcomer lineup to be just characters from the ballot. I want to see more wacky and unique characters Sakurai can create from Nintendo’s vast library that wouldn’t have been noticed by people to begin with.

So far I have enjoyed many of Sakurai’s curveball characters, but if the newcomers are only going fanservice characters, then I’d feel that Sakurai didn’t really he had the freedom he had when it came to the roster than in previous games. Like he’s chained to OBEY what the fans want and what the fans say. Yes, it’s great to see characters that people have been asking for a long time, but I also want to see what unique concepts and characters Sakurai can put out for us as well that wouldn’t have gotten in if it weren’t for him. A lot of his oddball choices became staples and fan favorites and I also want to see some of that for this game too, since chances are, they defenitley aren’t going to have oddball choices as DLC.

Well, I guess I found someone with the same opinion!

In fact, I love it that they brought two of my favourites back (Pichu in Melee, Ice Climbers in Melee and Brawl), and I love the fact that Inkling and Ridley are in (Daisy doesn't bother me), but I just downright hope that there are at least one or two wacky oddball characters. That's also one of the reasons why I really want Rhythm Heaven representation. Apart from the fact that it's a series that NEEDS and SCREAMS representation, it is also a series from which I expect the oddball character for Smash Ultimate to be from. Sakurai being so original with his movesets, I can see something fantastic out of a Rhythm Heaven character. It actually hurts that such a small amount of people are putting a Rhythm Heaven character on their prediction roster, and when they have one, almost everytime, it is Karate Joe. I think that is the most uninteresting Rhythm Heaven character they can choose.

On the other side, and I really want to note this out: I love the fact that Sakurai does something with fanservice. Ganondorf getting a sword, Ridley getting in, bringing back stages like Saffron City, bringing back literally every character ever. I love it that Sakurai did this. However, he needs to keep the balance between fanservice and his own influences 50/50. I love the fact that he came up to make a Game and Watch character, or make the Wii Fit Trainer a playable character. Heck, making a playable character out of a Stack-Up / Gyromite controller is just downright amazing.

I certainly don't give my hopes up for a Rhythm Heaven character. Give me my Chorus Kids!

 

[EchoAegis]

Here's a question.

What is the character with the most recent debut that you think will get in?

Both for unique characters and echoes.

Alright i'm cheating a bit here but i'm picking Celica. And like Nintendzilla i'm so confident that i will eat a shoe if she isn't in.

 

[MainJPW]

Ooh, Sonic is the Fighter of the Day.

So, on that note, what kind of things from the Sonic series do you want or expect?

A Sonic Mania stage. Less vocal tracks and more stage music.

 

[Makai Wars]

Here's a question.

What is the character with the most recent debut that you think will get in?

Both for unique characters and echoes.

Oct
O
Lings
Though I guess technically they were a thing in S1, they weren't really a thing until Splatoon 2.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I think I figured out something about the development cycle of Smash 4 DLC and Ultimate's roster choices...

1. Smash for 3DS/Wii U release with its base roster.

2. Plans for DLC are formed. Mewtwo is picked as a super popular character to include for DLC. Lucas and Roy are picked to be popular returning veterans from Melee and Brawl respectively. Ryu and Cloud are picked to be big name characters that will draw in the hype. Corrin is eventually picked to be a character that will be used to advertise an upcoming game. That would give us six slots. If you were around the Nintenzone social during the DLC days, you may recall that soon after the game launched, we found six slots for DLC characters. Only six. Not the seven that we would eventually receive.

3. The ballot launches. Sakurai and his team plan to ignore votes for any character that was already planned to be included. The ballot continues and Sakurai finally starts to work on plans for Ultimate.

4. Sakurai sees that veterans are scoring really high on the ballot. Sakurai then decides that he will make Ultimate's main goal to bring everyone back. Sakurai decides that he will add no more veterans as DLC in order to hype up Ultimate. Veterans are knocked out of the running. as they'll be included next game.

5. Sakurai picks a handful of characters that scored really well on the ballot for Ultimate's initial plan. He picks multiple winners.

6. Sakurai decides that one of these characters should be included for DLC for Smash 4. Sakurai decides that the character should be a now or never character. One where timing could play a big factor in requests for Smash. One that could be used to advertise something current. Other characters with predicted long staying requests or the inability to advertise anything will be held off for the next one.

7. Sakurai picks Bayonetta from his list of winners to be the final DLC character for Smash 4 as she was the ballot winner that fit all those criteria.

8. The seventh DLC slot is added.

9. Bayonetta is released.

10. Ultimate starts serious development with every veteran and several ballot winners in tow.


Major takeaway from this theory?

Bayonetta wasn't the winner. She was one of the winners.

The only reason she got into Smash 4 was because she was the prime candidate to advertise something. Not because she didn't win the ballot, but because of the ballot winners, she could advertise something right then and potentially only then, the best.

If Bayonetta didn't make it into Smash 4, she would have made it into Ultimate with the rest of the ballot winners. Who knows? Maybe Inkling, Ridley and Daisy are some of those characters.

She wasn't THE winner, but one of several. Bayonetta was just a taste of what is to come.

 

[Makai Wars]

I think I figured out something about the development cycle of Smash 4 DLC and Ultimate's roster choices...

Bayonetta wasn't the winner. She was one of the winners.

Yeah I kind of figured that out when Kamiya stated on Twitter that Bayonetta began development like, a few months after the ballot was announced. And Corrin too? Lol.

Smash 5 is probably where we're actually going to see some of those fan demands, that's why I think it's impossible to rool K. Rool out, he's a heavy hitter and definitely got a ton of international votes. I don't have any stake in this fight though, I got my Squid, I got my Ice Climbers, I'm good on the roster, so all I hope for now is that some long time fanbases actually get the characters they've been begging for for ages.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Yeah I kind of figured that out when Kamiya stated on Twitter that Bayonetta began development like, a few months after the ballot was announced

Can I have a source?

 

[True Blue Warrior]

I think I figured out something about the development cycle of Smash 4 DLC and Ultimate's roster choices...

1. Smash for 3DS/Wii U release with its base roster.

2. Plans for DLC are formed. Mewtwo is picked as a super popular character to include for DLC. Lucas and Roy are picked to be popular returning veterans from Melee and Brawl respectively. Ryu and Cloud are picked to be big name characters that will draw in the hype. Corrin is eventually picked to be a character that will be used to advertise an upcoming game. That would give us six slots. If you were around the Nintenzone social during the DLC days, you may recall that soon after the game launched, we found six slots for DLC characters. Only six. Not the seven that we would eventually receive.

3. The ballot launches. Sakurai and his team plan to ignore votes for any character that was already planned to be included. The ballot continues and Sakurai finally starts to work on plans for Ultimate.

4. Sakurai sees that veterans are scoring really high on the ballot. Sakurai then decides that he will make Ultimate's main goal to bring everyone back. Sakurai decides that he will add no more veterans as DLC in order to hype up Ultimate. Veterans are knocked out of the running. as they'll be included next game.

5. Sakurai picks a handful of characters that scored really well on the ballot for Ultimate's initial plan. He picks multiple winners.

6. Sakurai decides that one of these characters should be included for DLC for Smash 4. Sakurai decides that the character should be a now or never character. One where timing could play a big factor in requests for Smash. One that could be used to advertise something current. Other characters with predicted long staying requests or the inability to advertise anything will be held off for the next one.

7. Sakurai picks Bayonetta from his list of winners to be the final DLC character for Smash 4 as she was the ballot winner that fit all those criteria.

8. The seventh DLC slot is added.

9. Bayonetta is released.

10. Ultimate starts serious development with every veteran and several ballot winners in tow.


Major takeaway from this theory?

Bayonetta wasn't the winner. She was one of the winners.

The only reason she got into Smash 4 was because she was the prime candidate to advertise something. Not because she didn't win the ballot, but because of the ballot winners, she could advertise something right then and potentially only then, the best.

If Bayonetta didn't make it into Smash 4, she would have made it into Ultimate with the rest of the ballot winners. Who knows? Maybe Inkling, Ridley and Daisy are some of those characters.

She wasn't THE winner, but one of several. Bayonetta was just a taste of what is to come.

Also, keep in mind the ballot was never a pure popularity contest, but rather more like a suggestion box. Bayonetta didn't need to be the absolute number 1 character to be a legitimate choice, she just needed to score high enough to be a ballot choice.

Also, keep in mind we know thanks to Mewtwo that a unique, made-from-scratch DLC character takes about 6 months to be developed so it's clear that Bayonetta was started long before the Ballot closed in October. She was already decided to be popular enough before then.

 

[SquashiniKun]

TBH, i'm worried about the newcomer roster consisting of JUST ballot winners.

 

[EchoAegis]

Sorry if the question has been asked before but how much newcomers did you think we're getting pre-DLC?

I'm guessing 5 newcomers plus three Echo characters, including Inkling, Ridley and Daisy were getting 11 characters in total for Ultimate

 

[P.Kat]

Can I have some sauce with that?

Well this is what found as proof although ultimately it doesn't mean she's certain to make it.

But didn't Sakurai also visited/talked to Platinum Games as well too?

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Here's a question.

What is the character with the most recent debut that you think will get in?

Both for unique characters and echoes.

Captain Toad and Pyra/Mythra...my only recent enough prediction

Anyone know what Yoshi's and Diddy's new final smash will be?

Nothing yet

 

[Venus of the Desert Bloom]

Here’s something fun to try:

Add one, promote one, and rosterblock one. (Add a newcomer, promote an AT, pokeball, boss, item, hazard, game element, trophy), and deny a roster addition to an unconfirmed newcomer.

Add one: Elma
Promote one: Takamaru
Rosterblock one: Ashley

 

[Cosmic77]

TBH, i'm worried about the newcomer roster consisting of JUST ballot winners.

I don't think that's gonna be the case. Even if this game feels like fanservice overload, Sakurai enjoys taking risks and experimenting with characters we never would've expected. I can't see him completely submitting to the ballot and going down a list of popular requests.

Besides, if people think Simon Belmont is likely, then I have no idea why they're still buying into the "newcomers will be from the ballot" idea. Rest assured, Simon Belmont did not do well on the ballot for a number of reasons. Snake's absence and Konami were two of them.

 

[UberMadman]

Here's a question.

What is the character with the most recent debut that you think will get in?

Both for unique characters and echoes.

Decidueye in the base roster, and Rex and Pyra if the game gets DLC. I don’t think any Echo Fighters will be unveiled that have a more recent debut than either of these two, but I think Dark Samus will be the most recent overall Echo Fighter.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

Rex/Pyra, Spring Man, a Champion, or a Gen VII Pokemon for a unique character.
Octolings or Isabelle for an Echo.

Regardless of what others might say, I'm still not convinced we should write off these 2017 characters just yet.

Given that Xenoblade X was the most recent title at the time the roster was being conceptualized (especially given its international release date), there is really no reason to consider them for the base roster when Elma was the most recent Xenoblade character at the time and we all know that what's recent around the time Sakurai starts conceptualizing the game is what's important in terms of recency. He said it himself:

So what’s popular around the time when I begin designing the game is important.

(And I have doubts if we are even going to get a Xenoblade character in the base roster)

 

[92MilesPrower]

Ooh, Sonic is the Fighter of the Day.

So, on that note, what kind of things from the Sonic series do you want or expect?

I expect a Forces stage, but I WANT Sonic's own equivalent of codecs. Knuckles may be an AT, but that doesn't stop us from getting Tails and Amy (and Eggman through hijacking) briefing Sonic on the other fighters. I feel it's kind of a pipe dream, but I'd love to see it happen.

 

[Makai Wars]

Can I have a source?

Bluhg, I've been wading through his twitter and googling like crazy but then I remember Bayo's reveal was almost 3 years ago so I'm having a really tough time find a tweet. It was just stated that DLC character development takes 6 months though so do the math lol

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

TBH, i'm worried about the newcomer roster consisting of JUST ballot winners.

I am certain that Sakurai will still be able to sneak in at least one curveball somewhere.

 

[EchoAegis]

Here’s something fun to try:

Add one, promote one, and rosterblock one. (Add a newcomer, promote an AT, pokeball, boss, item, hazard, game element, trophy), and deny a roster addition to an unconfirmed newcomer.

Add one: Elma
Promote one: Takamaru
Rosterblock one: Ashley

Sounds like a fun idea

Add : Celica
Promote : Geno
Rosterblock : Decidyeye

 

[P.Kat]

Here's a question.

What is the character with the most recent debut that you think will get in?

Both for unique characters and echoes.

For Unique: Elma, Rex & Pyra, Dixie Kong, Spring Man a BOTW Champion 3 Gen, or 7 Gen Pokémon, Fjorm , Shadow.
For Echoes: Isabelle, Dark Samus, Chrom, some girl living in a haunted mansion, didn't get to learn her name

 

[Makai Wars]

Here’s something fun to try:

Add one, promote one, and rosterblock one. (Add a newcomer, promote an AT, pokeball, boss, item, hazard, game element, trophy), and deny a roster addition to an unconfirmed newcomer.

Add: Shantae

Bomberman or Ashely.
BLOCC: Chrom/Ceclia. I'd say Waluigi but Sakurai did that for me lmao

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Knuckles is the item/assist trophy of the day (and still appears on Green Hill Zone)...and Sonic is the character of the day...Shadow or Tails please

Here’s something fun to try:

Add one, promote one, and rosterblock one. (Add a newcomer, promote an AT, pokeball, boss, item, hazard, game element, trophy), and deny a roster addition to an unconfirmed newcomer.

Add one: Elma
Promote one: Takamaru
Rosterblock one: Ashley

Add: Captain Toad
Promote: Lyn
Block: Waluigi

 

[MagnesD3]

Some random though I had, but I’m starting to feel worried about the newcomer lineup.

In my opinion, when I first started speculating on this new game I was really interested in what curveball characters that can pop up, the possibilities of IPS that can get revitalized, and anything new and enticing to get in with the roster.

Although they haven’t really showed anything yet, the only thing that is tossed around is fanservice, fanservice, and more fanservice. Yes this game is taking feedback from the things people didn’t like about Smash 4 which is great! However, I don’t want to the newcomer lineup to be just characters from the ballot. I want to see more wacky and unique characters Sakurai can create from Nintendo’s vast library that wouldn’t have been noticed by people to begin with.

So far I have enjoyed many of Sakurai’s curveball characters, but if the newcomers are only going fanservice characters, then I’d feel that Sakurai didn’t really he had the freedom he had when it came to the roster than in previous games. Like he’s chained to OBEY what the fans want and what the fans say. Yes, it’s great to see characters that people have been asking for a long time, but I also want to see what unique concepts and characters Sakurai can put out for us as well that wouldn’t have gotten in if it weren’t for him. A lot of his oddball choices became staples and fan favorites and I also want to see some of that for this game too, since chances are, they defenitley aren’t going to have oddball choices as DLC.

I wouldn’t be worried too much, it’s Sakurai after all. I personally believe the weird one will be chorus kids if all that smash 4 leak stuff had any validity at all.