Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Chandeelure]

I wish Rainbow Curse made an impact, because that was the most recent Kirby game when the roster was decided and it had playable Bandana Dee.
It was the only Wii U Kirby game too, but I don't know, it was meh... but considering we got Other M and Star Fox Zero representation...

Also, I don't know why, but after the update of this website I can't really upload much pictures, they are all broken lol.
I hate it.

 

[osby]

Maybe say with a character like Isaac but K. Rool's popularity was acknowledged by the team with his mii costume alonngside an updated design and not long after the that the project plan for this game was completed. It's very likely he's in.

It's very likely he was considered seriously when the roster was being decided on.

It doesn't mean he's in.

 

[Opossum]

I wrote in that post why I didn't include Bowser.

As for Falco and Wolf....I'm gunna keep it the same. Either way it just shows that Sakurai generally uses playable characters.

I'd argue the Mario spin offs were rare enough back then that Bowser should count. Mario Golf, Mario Tennis, Super Mario Kart, Mario Kart 64, and SMRPG only constitute five games, so they were rare enough for a playable Bowser to be a big deal.

 

[92MilesPrower]

And with that, June is at an end. Many codecs have been written, and many are still waiting to be written. Regardless, here is a compilation of all codecs that have been written within this month: (Note: Codecs include potentially sensitive topics such as children using axes, mutant baby rats, coconut guns, Yoshi digestive systems, and time paradoxes. Reader's disgression is advised.)

Spoiler

Spoiler

Snake: ...I've dealt with weird looking people and creatures before in Smash, but Otacon, what the heck is that thing?

Otacon: That "thing" you're referring to is called Greninja, a Water and Dark type Pokémon. It's able to shoot shurikens made of compressed water from its hands, and can make swords from water too.

Snake: So it's some sort of frog ninja... it also seems to wear a scarf, but what is it made of?

Otacon: WAIT SNAKE, DON'T TOUCH IT, THAT'S ITS-

Snake: EUGH, it's all wet and sticky, just what kind of scarf IS THAT?

Otacon: ...that's not a scarf, Snake, that's its tongue.

Snake: ...well, that explains a lot. But why didn't you tell me that earlier?!

Otacon: I-but-you-f-forget it... just make sure to shower after this fight.

Snake: Right.

Spoiler

Snake: Great, they let another young kid in here. Why do they think it's fine for us to beat up children? And what's with the blue get-up anyways?

Colonel: That's no ordinary child, Snake, that's Mega Man. He's a walking arsenal in the form of a child sized robot.

Snake: So he's a robot, and not just some ordinary human kid... What can he even do that makes him an "arsenal" aside from shoot lasers out of that cannon of his?

Colonel: Far more than you think. He uses the powers of various Robot Masters he's defeated in the past, including shooting mini tornadoes, flames, and bombs from both of his arms, as well as using other weapons like claws, swords, and blades.

Snake: Impressive... even a Metal Gear can't do all of that. Even with all of those weapons, he has to have some sort of weakness, though...

Colonel: I hope you still remember the basics of CQC, Snake, they'll be useful against Mega Man. Most of his weapons are long range, so the best way to take him down is by getting up close and personal with him.

Snake: Got it.

Spoiler

Snake: Otacon, what's with this guy? He looks, acts, and sounds just like Pit, but... edgier...

Otacon: That, Snake, is Dark Pit, an evil clone of Pit created by the Mirror of Truth. His personality is made entirely of Pit's repressed thoughts and feelings, and is far more aggressive than the original Pit. He also uses similar weapons and abilities as the original, so he basically has the same strengths and weaknesses.

Snake: So he's an evil clone... sounds familiar, right?

Otacon: Snake, you and I both know very well that Les Enfants Terribles is nothing like the Mirror of Truth, and you're also a clone too!

Snake: And yet Liquid is still the evil one, not me. Anything else that I need to know?

Otacon: No, just... do what you normally do.

Spoiler

Snake: Okay, who's the genius that decides who gets into Smash? The fact that they're still letting young children participate is starting to get out of hand, this kid doesn't seem to have any psychic powers, weapons, or anything else they can fight with...

Mei Ling: Oh, that's the Villager, Snake, they're the young mayor of the town called Smashville! Just because they may basically be a normal person doesn't mean they can't fight. Rather than using weapons or super powers, the Villager uses simple items including an umbrella, a bug net, and a slingshot in battle.

Snake: But it seems like all of these items are just coming out of nowhere, where are they getting them from?

Mei Ling: They have the ability to store many items in their pockets, just about anything can be stored in the form of a leaf back where they come from. Large items like a bowling ball, a shovel, and even an axe can be stored in their pockets.

Snake: An axe?! Why didn't you tell me about that before?!

Mei Ling: They don't use their axe to attack you with directly, they can plant a tree and chop it down in an instant with the axe.

Snake: Oh... but I'm still going to keep my distance, I get a bad feeling just from looking in their eyes...

Spoiler

Snake: Great, Sonic's here again, and I'm still not a fan. Any new dirt on him, Otacon?

Otacon: *staticy* ...Sna-...I...some-...inter-...

Snake: What the- Otacon, come in! What's going on?

???: Ohohoho... Don't worry about him, Snake, if you want information about Sonic, I'm just the guy.

Snake: Who are you? How did you get into this channel?

???: Who am I? Only the world's greatest genius, Dr. Ivo Robotnik! But you may call me Dr. Eggman.

Snake: Couldn't say I've heard of you before. Plus, the name Eggman is ridiculous, makes it seem like you're a giant talking egg.

Eggman: WHAT?! HOW DARE YOU INSULT ME! I'M TRYING TO HELP YOU DEFEAT SONIC!

Snake: More like trying to distract me from this fight. This call is over.

Eggman: W-WAIT, DON'T HANG UP, I-

Spoiler

Snake: Why is this normal dog and duck so annoying to fight? And where's all of this cover fire coming from?

Colonel: If you've played the original Super Mario Bros., then the classic game titled Duck Hunt should sound familiar to you, Snake. It came in the same cartridge as Super Mario Bros..

Snake: So that explains why these two are here... But it still doesn't explain where all these shots are coming from, though. Is there a sniper somewhere?

Colonel: Essentially, yes. This animal duo is being assisted by an unseen gunman, using an NES Zapper to fire shots to help with their attacks, just as if they were playing a game of Duck Hunt. The dog can also summon one of five different Wild Gunmen from the game Wild Gunman to attack you with and protect itself, but they can be taken out easily.

Snake: Interesting... You know, I wonder how good Ocelot would be at Duck Hunt, seems just like his kind of game.

Spoiler

Snake: Hey Otacon, isn't that Ryu, that Japanese guy known all over the world for winning all of those World Warrior martial arts tournaments?

Otacon: Yeah, that's him! I can't believe you're actually getting to fight him!

Snake: He looks as tough as we've heard, and seems ready to take anyone on.

Otacon: You know, there's also that one thing I always really wanted to do with you if you ever met Ryu in battle... ...can we do it?

Snake: Oh yeah, that thing. Let's do it. aaahhh... HADOUKEN!

Otacon: SHORYUKEN!

Snake: ...Please don't tell Colonel and Mei Ling we do these things.

Spoiler

Snake: Looks like someone got quite a nose job compared to the last time I saw him.

Colonel: Be on your guard, Snake, Ganondorf isn't fooling around this time. He's stronger than ever, and quite a force to be reckoned with.

Snake: Aside from the obvious wardrobe change, what's new about him that makes him so dangerous?

Colonel: That sword of his is the main reason, he now has access to attacking any opponent at a further range than ever before. His more youthful appearance also lets him move faster, ever so slightly, so watch out for him.

Snake: ...So he just has a long range weapon and is younger... that's it? Changed or not, I'm still gonna try to blow him sky high with C4s. Better than any old sword.

Spoiler

Mei Ling: It's even more adorable than I imagined!

Snake: This thing? It looks like it's just a smaller Pikachu, what's the big deal?

Mei Ling: That's because it's exactly that, Snake, a baby Pikachu! Pichu is the pre-evolved form of Pikachu. It can't store electricity well in its body, unlike Pikachu, so if it's startled, it can end up shocking itself.

Snake: That's kind of... sad. It's like I were to always blow myself up every time I used a grenade.

Mei Ling: Oh, and one last thing, Snake?

Snake: ...don't even bother, I've already told you NO! For the last time, I'm here to fight, not capture a mutant baby rat for you!

Mei Ling: ...fine.

Snake: ...look, I'm sorry, we'll talk after this battle.

Spoiler

Snake: Hey Otacon, it's Donkey Kong, he sure looks ready to fight.

Otacon: Watch out, Snake! Apparently DK's bigger, faster, and stronger too!

Snake: I mean he is somewhat bigger, I'll give him that... Anything else new on him?

Otacon: Not too much, but I've heard that he also has a coconut gun, I'm surprised he doesn't use it here.

Snake: Coconuts? That's gotta hurt, getting hit in the face with something that big repeatedly...

Otacon: Not only that, but he's also the leader of a group called the DK Crew, there's 5 of them!

Snake: 5 of them? Huh, they must do a lot of monkeying around together...

Otacon: *groan*...

Snake: ...fine. Less puns, more fighting.

Spoiler

Snake: This thing... it's giving off a very weird vibe...

Colonel: That thing you're referring to is Mewtwo, a clone of the mythical Pokémon Mew, created by Team Rocket scientists, mainly a man named Dr. Fuji. They recombined the genes of Mew to create Mewtwo's body, but he lacks any and all compassion, being an extremely savage creature instead.

Snake: A clone, huh? Looks like we're in the same boat.

Colonel: He has extremely powerful psychic powers, so be on the defensive around him, Snake.

Snake: Psychic powers... I'll really start worrying about this guy if he asks me if I like Castlevania.

Spoiler

Snake: Real or not, that sword looks like it was a prop made for one of your anime conventions, Otacon.

Otacon: That sword is called the Monado, and the guy wielding it is named Shulk. And it's the furthest thing from just a simple prop, the Monado is an extremely powerful weapon.

Snake: It looks like it's just a giant red piece of plastic, what makes it so powerful?

Otacon: It can manipulate ether around it, being able to change the material and immaterial shape of the world. The Monado also lets the user have visions of the future, helping them predict their opponents' moves.

Snake: ...wow, that sounds strong. Yet this Shulk guy swings it around like a giant toy.

Otacon: Oh, I almost forgot, the Monado can only be used by a person with very strong willpower, anyone else that tries to control it will only hurt themselves.

Snake: That sounds messed up...

Otacon: I think that's enough from me before I start to fanboy over seeing Shulk and the Monado in action. He's so cool...

Snake: ...Right.

Spoiler

Mei Ling: Look, Snake, it's Yoshi! Isn't he adorable?

Snake: I refuse to call him adorable, especially when nearly everything he eats comes out as an egg. His digestive system is the furthest thing from being normal.

Mei Ling: Snake, why are you so worried about that stuff? Eggs or not, he's super cute!

Snake: Not to mention, he also uses his tongue to grab people to eat, which is already disgusting without the egg part...

Mei Ling: Knock it off! *sigh* One day I'll get to ride a Yoshi, but until then, I guess I'm stuck with you talking about its digestive system...

Snake: Just the thought of being eaten alive by a Yoshi still creeps me out regardless of how "cute" it is.

Mei Ling: *groan* ...

Spoiler

Snake: This is Snake, do you copy? I repeat, do you copy?

???: Loud and clear, Snake.

Snake: Huh? You're not Mei Ling... who are you?

???: No need to contact her when you have me to tell you everything you need to know about, well, me.

Snake: Wait a minute, you're the green-haired lady that I'm currently fighting? You definitely don't seem to be familiar with this technology, how did you get onto this channel?

Palutena: First off, you can call me Palutena. Second, there's no fancy technology involved in what I'm doing, just some telekinesis. After all, I am the Goddess of Light.

Snake: A goddess? No wonder you look so stunning.

Palutena: Oh Snake, don't make me blush, we're currently battling after all. As a goddess, I have many powers such as light magic, lasers, and teleportation. Just because I am beautiful like you said, doesn't mean I'm not going to go all out on you.

Snake: You're on.

Spoiler

Snake: Otacon, I thought that Marth was a guy, why does he sound like a girl and have longer hair now?

Otacon: No, Snake, that's Lucina, his Great Great Great Great Great... uh... actually, let's just say that she's his descendant by quite a few years.

Snake: Descendant? Are you sure I've only been gone for 10 years? It's now starting to look like 100 at this point...

Otacon: Well, she actually came back to the past from the future in order to stop the world from being destroyed by Grima, the Fell Dragon.

Snake: Time travel, huh... but isn't she potentially risking a time paradox by sticking around?

Otacon: Time paradox? Uh... you should talk to Colonel about that instead of me, I think he's more familiar with that kind of stuff.

Snake: Huh, alright.

& Koopalings

Spoiler

Snake: Did Bowser have a kid or something? That turtle in the smiley face hovercraft looks kind of similar to him...

Otacon: Yes, Bowser does have a biological son, as well as seven adopted children. Whoever you're facing right now is one of them, and they're very dangerous, the Junior Clown Car they're in is loaded with weaponry like drills, cannons, buzzsaws, and wrecking balls.

Snake: Interesting... But how did they manage to fit so many things into that tiny vehicle?

Otacon: ...I don't think we should question that... Anyways, be careful around them, you never know what item will come out of the Junior Clown Car next. It could even be a giant tongue.

Snake: Giant tongue? Great, I hate having to constantly take showers after these fights... Third time today, even.

And as always, tomorrow's preview:

Snake: Oh great, it's you again...

Next up:

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

I'd argue the Mario spin offs were rare enough back then that Bowser should count. Mario Golf, Mario Tennis, Super Mario Kart, Mario Kart 64, and SMRPG only constitute five games, so they were rare enough for a playable Bowser to be a big deal.

But none of Bowsers moveset is based off any of that. Well maybe SMRPG I'm not familiar enough about that one which is why I made that note about it.
But as far as I know, unlike Peach, his moveset doesn't include anything that is a specific call back to that game.

Sorry but this was the first time you could play as Bowser as he is meant to be, a fire breathing turtle monster, and not just playing golf or driving.

 

[Opossum]

But none of Bowsers moveset is based off any of that. Well maybe SMRPG I'm not familiar enough about that one which is why I made that note about it.
But as far as I know, unlike Peach, his moveset doesn't include anything that is a specific call back to that game.

Sorry but this was the first time you could play as Bowser as he is meant to be, a fire breathing turtle monster, and not just playing golf or driving.

Bowser's Melee and Brawl run animation came from SMRPG...I think?

 

[PlayerOneTyler]

I known people who don't interact on smash online communities and still voted in the ballot. People can show support of a character and still vote for someone ELSE they want. Some people just find it annoying when people talk about their most wanted character and constantly claim they're the most popular character / deserving character to be in Smash (becomest annoying over time) or that the character is topping all the Fan-Made polls (as if they don't have bias). I voted for Snake in the ballot and no one talked about Snake and only dismissed him. During the ballot; I never heard any relevant discussion about Bayonetta on smash boards; instead it was just about K.K Rool, Isaac, Geno, Wolf, Krystal, Bandanna Dee and other characters that I forgot about. Bayonetta was rarely mentioned about from my experience and clearly topped the polls in some fashion in the actual ballot. I actually have little attachment to characters not already in Smash so I don't really care who gets in Smash as long as they're competitively viable and thus I admit I have a small bias against super-heavyweight characters. I despise clones / echoe's from a competitive standpoint and wish for new and fresh characters. Nothing hurts more than getting a character you want in only to find out they're bottom tier or low tier in the game. If you're casual then this doesn't apply to you of course; but don't be mad if the character is never / rarely showcased at t higher levels of play if you spectate. I don't mind if any character was to get in.

The only base newcomer in Smash 4 that actually was Top Tier from the very beginning was Rosalina ().

Everyone else was either bad (), mediocre (:ultrobin) or average () and still are bad, average, or mediocre. It was only until DLC () when newcomers actually became good with 3 of them (Cloud (destroys most characters), Bayonetta (do I even need to explain this?, Ryu) being classified as Top Tier (2 of them are the BEST characters in the game), Corrin as high tier and Mewtwo (Veteran but DLC who's Top Tier after getting the most ridiculous amount of buffs in the game).

Clearly the best condition for your wanted character is to obviously advocate for them to get in as DLC so they will be high-tier or Top Tier.... at least for me :D
........
:D

Just curious as to why you left out Lucina and Dark Pit. I know Dark Pit was average at best, but Lucina was pretty good!

Also, Mewtwo wasn't a newcomer, lul.

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

Bowser's Melee and Brawl run animation came from SMRPG...I think?

Well again even if I do decide that counts the number of characters that were first playable in Smash diminishes further, and this was just to show how Dixie might be more likely since she's been a playable protagonist.

King K. Rool was only playable in spin offs that don't really reflect how he'd actually play.

Anyway I think people want to get off that topic lol.

 

[Chandeelure]

Bowser's Melee and Brawl run animation came from SMRPG...I think?

Really? I don't remember that.

The weird car run thing that made no sense?

 

[Opossum]

Really? I don't remember that.

The weird car run thing that made no sense?

Like I said I'm not sure, haha. I've heard some folks say so in the past but I have no clue if it's accurate.

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

Like I said I'm not sure, haha. I've heard some folks say so in the past but I have no clue if it's accurate.

I tried searching on YouTube didn't get immediate results and decided it wasn't important enough XD

 

[KMDP]

Maybe say with a character like Isaac but K. Rool's popularity was acknowledged by the team with his mii costume alonngside an updated design and not long after the that the project plan for this game was completed. It's very likely he's in.

I'd like to point out that Golden Sun was one of the best-selling games (naturally competing with Mario, Zelda and Pokemon) on the 9th best-selling console of all time (4th best-selling Nintendo console, and 3rd best-selling Nintendo handheld). So, you know, don't sell Isaac short now.
*puts away soap box*

 

[Chandeelure]

Like I said I'm not sure, haha. I've heard some folks say so in the past but I have no clue if it's accurate.

Well, first I tried to watch a Mario RPG video with Bowser in the party, but then I remembered that party members are not behind Mario in the map.
Then I had to search for a cutscene with Bowser moving and well, he just walks normally, so I don't know.

 

[NintenZ]

I like K Rool and support him, but I never really got where most of his appeal came from tbh. I feel like his fanbase overstates his importance a lot tbh.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

"Canon" is so stupid.

It's a videogame, it doesn't have to make sense.

Tell that to Kid Icarus (and I guess Bayonetta)

 

[Metal Shop X]

Bowser's run in Melee and Brawl make sense, there is actually an army of very, veryyyy little goomba using skate roller underneath Bowser foots that transport him whaetever he goes.

And that doesn't come from nowhere, oh no, this is actually a reference to a very obscure canceled game named Super Mario Roller, who was supposed to come on the 64DD before the console was cancel.

This is true info coming from my grandpa who worked at Nintendo, I swear.

 

[NintenZ]

Also I have to say Dixie always appealed to me more, I dunno why but I feel that it’s because she’s just more important and has more to pull from than K. Rool. Tbh it doesn’t have to be a competition, they could always add both but I always wanted Dixie more.

 

[KMDP]

You know, the Ballot was a "you can vote for literally anyone" affair. I wonder how the results would have changed if it was limited to a specific pool of, let's say, 50 characters.

Ah, what ifs.

Also I have to say Dixie always appealed to me more, I dunno why but I feel that it’s because she’s just more important and has more to pull from than K. Rool. Tbh it doesn’t have to be a competition, they could always add both but I always wanted Dixie more.

K. Rool is kind of esoteric (multiple guises that might not gel well when brought together), while Dixie is comparatively standard. So I can see how Dixie appeals to you more (as an aside, I'm on your side on this ).

 

[Megadoomer]

I like K Rool and support him, but I never really got where most of his appeal came from tbh. I feel like his fanbase overstates his importance a lot tbh.

I can think of a few reasons. Smash is lacking in both Donkey Kong characters and villains, and out of the Donkey Kong characters, he seems to have the most to work with, given how wildly different each of his boss fights can be.

Plus, he's been almost completely absent from the franchise since Rare was bought out by Microsoft, so people want to see him make a comeback, and he immediately stands out from the rest of the Donkey Kong cast from a design standpoint. It also helps that he is (or, at least, he can be) a fairly goofy character, which seems like it would result in an entertaining moveset.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Back to King K. Rool discussion?

I think he has decent chances, but I could also see him sharing the same fate as Krystal back in Brawl.

In Brawl, Sakurai put serious consideration into both Krystal and Wolf. Both were heavily requested characters with potential for unique movesets. In the end, he went with Wolf because he could reuse assets from Fox, whereas Krystal would have to be built from scratch.

If we're bound to get only one Donkey Kong newcomer, it'll come down to King K. Rool and Dixie Kong, and I see the latter happening. King K. Rool would have to be built from scratch, whereas Dixie Kong could be built off of Diddy Kong's assets.

Granted, their situation isn't quite the same as Wolf and Krystal, as the they were both considered near the end of the plan where there were time constraints. With Smash Ultimate, there could be enough time in the plan where we could see them both. Although it's possible, it's something I'm more skeptical about.

So for now, my prediction is that we'll be getting Dixie Kong over King K. Rool, with the latter maybe becoming an Assist Trophy as a nod to his popularity. Once again, sharing the same fate as Krystal.

That's quite well logically thought out.

And honestly, with Krystal and Wolf, both characters where exceptionally popular. The situation between King K.Rool and Dixie Kong is quite similar.

To be extremely frank, in matters of overall importance, Dixie Kong is in all actuality more important compared to King K.Rool as it currently stands. I am one of those DKC fans that just wants DKC to have the same respect in terms of playable characters as franchises as Kirby, Star Fox and Metroid. DKC is a bigger franchise than all of them, and has more potential for playable characters.. so it's weird to see it being neglected so.

Dixie Kong as a newcomer is much like Diddy's addition in Brawl, heavily needed and the absolute minimum that's acceptable. King K.Rool would be an awesome extra.. but am still holding my breath for him. Besides, with Dixie's absense in Smash 4, I feel to be far more vocal about wanting her in,

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Also I have to say Dixie always appealed to me more, I dunno why but I feel that it’s because she’s just more important and has more to pull from than K. Rool. Tbh it doesn’t have to be a competition, they could always add both but I always wanted Dixie more.

If they ever both get in, at least it would get people to pay more attention to the rest of the Kongs (mainly Funky and Cranky, whom finally got playable platform appearances recently).

 

[NintenZ]

You know, the Ballot was a "you can vote for literally anyone" affair. I wonder how the results would have changed if it was limited to a specific pool of, let's say, 50 characters.

Ah, what ifs.


K. Rool is kind of esoteric (multiple guises that might not gel well when brought together), while Dixie is comparatively standard. So I can see how Dixie appeals to you more (as an aside, I'm on your side on this ).

I just always felt Dixie had more focus in terms of a potential moveset in all honesty, with K Rool there’s a lot to work with but there isn’t any sort of focus in any of the fan moveset I’ve seen.

 

[KMDP]

I like K Rool and support him, but I never really got where most of his appeal came from tbh. I feel like his fanbase overstates his importance a lot tbh.

K. Rool Fan: Weeeeeellll! Listen here, while I make it clear, I can't believe you can't see what we see here~!

 

[Jetsurge]

Bowser's Melee and Brawl run animation came from SMRPG...I think?

Bowser's side b in Melee s his default attack in Mario RPG and Peach's frying pan side smash is from Mario RPG.

 

[lordvaati]

K. Rool is a higher priority than Krystal to be playable since he's the main villain of his series and Star Fox got Wolf back.

Being honest im thinking if nothing major happens with K.Rool in the next 3 yesrs then freaking Cranky Kong is more likely to be in Smash then him.

 

[MasterWarlord]

Also I have to say Dixie always appealed to me more, I dunno why but I feel that it’s because she’s just more important and has more to pull from than K. Rool. Tbh it doesn’t have to be a competition, they could always add both but I always wanted Dixie more.

"Relevance" has been corrupted to mean has appeared in a game recently. As described in my previous posts, K. Rool has more impact across the series as a whole over Dixie, what with his appearances in DKC1 and DK64, while having important roles in King of Swing/Jungle Climber while Dixie only cameos. Dixie has one DK game over him. That's it.

As far as "potential to draw from..."

Spoiler

Dixie's hair could maybe do anything for her normals in terms of making them more unique, but people never propose it for her specials other than the token recovery.

Pre Tropical Freeze, this is a moveset I remember people suggesting:

Neutral B: Tiny's feather crossbow
Side B: Blow bubblegum
Up B: Hair Recovery
Down B: Guitar

She has so much potential that even fans suggest stealing from Tiny? She has the token bubblegum gun now because of Retro, but these people had no qualms suggesting giving her moves based off idle animations and victory animations simply because she does nothing. Should Mario kill people with the flagpole from the end of his levels? No, because he should do things he actually does, and unlike Dixie, Mario does do plenty of things.

Animal Buddies could be given to absolutely any Kong. I suppose you could argue that the DKC3 exclusive Ellie could be used and make more sense for her specifically, but then we have Ellie in a prominent role while Rambi, Enguarde, and Squitter get jack all.

List of K. Rool's abilities/powers

Originating in DKC1
Super strength
Supernatural jumping
Crushing people with girth
Brief bursts of speed
Boomerang Crown toss
Cannonball rain (No reason this has to be relegated to Final Smash)
Playing dead (Could be used as counter. More unique animation than turning into a dragon honestly)
Minions (Most iconic are Kritter, Klump, Krusha, or Klap Trap, though there is logic to use Klobber/Knocka since he can shoot barrels)
Beastial crocodile attacks (Gives mouth and tail as extra attacking limbs)

Originating in DKC2
Blunderbuss physical attacks
Blunderbuss cannonballs
Blunderbuss spiked cannonballs
Blunderbuss barrels
Blunderbuss freezing stun cloud
Blunderbuss control reversal cloud
Blunderbuss slowing cloud
Blunderbuss suction, moving around other projectiles
Blunderbuss bouncing the projectiles off the ground
Blunderbuss fire
Blunderbuss propelling him with fire
Opens door for general pirate flavoring
Invisibility
Alt #1

Originating in DKC3
The propeller pack everybody suggests for recovery
Electric barrier/projectile
KAOS summon (Obviously not in main set, but good Final Smash fodder)
Opens door for general mad scientist flavoring
Alt #2

Originating in DK64
Opens door for general boxer flavoring
Boxing glove boomerang
Ground Pound shockwaves
Charge, comparable to DKC1
Invisibility (Without the blunderbuss)
Blast-o-matic (Another popular choice for Final Smash, K. Rool has many)
Alt #3

Originating in Lands
Belly flop (Land 1)
Bombs (Land 3)
Shooting Electricity (Land 3)

Originating in crappy Paon/spin off games
Giant form (This and below are usually negatives for how "generic" he is, though he only has them once obtaining a "god" power up)
Fire breath
That flying machine that resembles Robotnik's Eggpod
Flying barrel vehicle (This or above are possible alternate recoveries)
Alt #4 (Pharaoh)
Alt #5 (Pilot)

 

[Darkraid]

Haha I think the first DLC for the game is gonna be Waluigi

 

[Deleted member]

The Krystal comparison is simply wrong. Krystal was in one game when Brawl came out, barely in said game, and most of her potential is wielding a weapon primarily/near exclusively used by Fox. She was popular but not anywhere near as popular as K. Rool is now.

When you compare Krystal and Wolf to K. Rool and Dixie Kong, it's pretty obvious that Wolf and K. Rool are very comparable as characters, both are villains/they have a history in their series. However Wolf having his own set would just be ridiculous given his series. It made sense for him to be a semi-clone of Fox.

There's no proof that Sakurai chose Wolf because he was the easier character. Wolf was really popular too for Brawl - I remember as one of the supporters of Wolf for that game.

 

[KMDP]

Bowser's side b in Melee s his default attack in Mario RPG and Peach's frying pan side smash is from Mario RPG.

Peach also used a Frying Pan in the Chef minigame of Game & Watch Gallery 2. (Not saying it's not from SMRPG, though.)

 

[osby]

I just always felt Dixie had more focus in terms of a potential moveset in all honesty, with K Rool there’s a lot to work with but there isn’t any sort of focus in any of the fan moveset I’ve seen.

I prefer Dixie Kong tbh, moveset potential aside. I know we don't have tons of villains but it feels wrong to overlook main characters because of this.

 

[Mega Bidoof]

Haha I think the first DLC for the game is gonna be Waluigi

Honestly I could see them pulling a Mewtwo for Waluigi.

The fan-demand for the character gets really high, but too late into the development cycle when the roster has already been decided for a long time.

So a little bit before release, they announce that they are currently working on him and that he will be the first DLC character, releasing around next Spring or so.

 

[Opossum]

"Relevance" has been corrupted to mean has appeared in a game recently. As described in my previous posts, K. Rool has more impact across the series as a whole over Dixie, what with his appearances in DKC1 and DK64, while having important roles in King of Swing/Jungle Climber while Dixie only cameos. Dixie has one DK game over him. That's it.

As far as "potential to draw from..."

Spoiler

Dixie's hair could maybe do anything for her normals in terms of making them more unique, but people never propose it for her specials other than the token recovery.

Pre Tropical Freeze, this is a moveset I remember people suggesting:

Neutral B: Tiny's feather crossbow
Side B: Blow bubblegum
Up B: Hair Recovery
Down B: Guitar

She has so much potential that even fans suggest stealing from Tiny? She has the token bubblegum gun now because of Retro, but these people had no qualms suggesting giving her moves based off idle animations and victory animations simply because she does nothing. Should Mario kill people with the flagpole from the end of his levels? No, because he should do things he actually does, and unlike Dixie, Mario does do plenty of things.

Animal Buddies could be given to absolutely any Kong. I suppose you could argue that the DKC3 exclusive Ellie could be used and make more sense for her specifically, but then we have Ellie in a prominent role while Rambi, Enguarde, and Squitter get jack all.

List of K. Rool's abilities/powers

Originating in DKC1
Super strength
Supernatural jumping
Crushing people with girth
Brief bursts of speed
Boomerang Crown toss
Cannonball rain (No reason this has to be relegated to Final Smash)
Playing dead (Could be used as counter. More unique animation than turning into a dragon honestly)
Minions (Most iconic are Kritter, Klump, Krusha, or Klap Trap, though there is logic to use Klobber/Knocka since he can shoot barrels)
Beastial crocodile attacks (Gives mouth and tail as extra attacking limbs)

Originating in DKC2
Blunderbuss physical attacks
Blunderbuss cannonballs
Blunderbuss spiked cannonballs
Blunderbuss barrels
Blunderbuss freezing stun cloud
Blunderbuss control reversal cloud
Blunderbuss slowing cloud
Blunderbuss suction, moving around other projectiles
Blunderbuss bouncing the projectiles off the ground
Blunderbuss fire
Blunderbuss propelling him with fire
Opens door for general pirate flavoring
Invisibility
Alt #1

Originating in DKC3
The propeller pack everybody suggests for recovery
Electric barrier/projectile
KAOS summon (Obviously not in main set, but good Final Smash fodder)
Opens door for general mad scientist flavoring
Alt #2

Originating in DK64
Opens door for general boxer flavoring
Boxing glove boomerang
Ground Pound shockwaves
Charge, comparable to DKC1
Invisibility (Without the blunderbuss)
Blast-o-matic (Another popular choice for Final Smash, K. Rool has many)
Alt #3

Originating in Lands
Belly flop (Land 1)
Bombs (Land 3)
Shooting Electricity (Land 3)

Originating in crappy Paon/spin off games
Giant form (This and below are usually negatives for how "generic" he is, though he only has them once obtaining a "god" power up)
Fire breath
That flying machine that resembles Robotnik's Eggpod
Flying barrel vehicle (This or above are possible alternate recoveries)
Alt #4 (Pharaoh)
Alt #5 (Pilot)

My preferred play style for Dixie is a whimsical grappler with good air game. I could see a potential set up where her neutral special is the Bubble Gum Gun, which would shoot out a gum ball that would burst on impact with either the stage or an opponent. Sticky opponents slow down or get momentarily stuck, allowing Dixie to come in safely and get a command grab with her hair.

It just sounds like a really fun playstyle to me.

 

[osby]

The Krystal comparison is simply wrong. Krystal was in one game when Brawl came out, barely in said game, and most of her potential is wielding a weapon primarily/near exclusively used by Fox. She was popular but not anywhere near as popular as K. Rool is now.

When you compare Krystal and Wolf to K. Rool and Dixie Kong, it's pretty obvious that Wolf and K. Rool are very comparable as characters, both are villains/they have a history in their series. However Wolf having his own set would just be ridiculous given his series. It made sense for him to be a semi-clone of Fox.

There's no proof that Sakurai chose Wolf because he was the easier character. Wolf was really popular too for Brawl - I remember as one of the supporters of Wolf for that game.

Didn't Sakurai literally stated that he did exactly that?

 

[Deleted member]

Didn't Sakurai literally stated that he did exactly that?

I looked it up, the relevant interview: https://sourcegaming.info/2015/08/17/sakuraibrawlquestions/

"In the end, the three playable characters in this game from “Star Fox” are Fox and Falco, and on top of that, Wolf, because he was popular and easy to create. On the other hand, if it was a situation where it wasn’t easy to create this character, and we had to make him from scratch, “Star Fox” may not have had 3 representatives"

So the ease of making Wolf, taking "70%" of the time to create was a factor in his addition but so was his popularity. It was a combination of both. Another relevant tidbit is when he talks about Krystal directly.

"Host: I see. But we did get a lot of questions like, “Why wasn’t Krystal a playable character?”
Sakurai: It’s not that I don’t understand how that feels, but if you start saying that, it becomes “Why isn’t Waddle Dee playable?” or Dry Bones, or Baby Peach. There’d be no end to it."

 

[SuperSmashStephen]

You guys, Waluigi is an Assist Trophy. He can not be both an Assist Trophy and playable in the same game.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Question about that Google Trends thing. Can we see those results but for 'Final Fantasy' or 'Bayonetta'? Because we know for a fact those did well on the ballot and it'd be a better way to determine the whole 'silent majority' or 'actual support' stuff I feel

 

[KMDP]

With all this talk about DKC, it's put me in the mood for some DK Island Swing.

 

[Ignoritus]

You guys, Waluigi is an Assist Trophy. He can not be both an Assist Trophy and playable in the same game.

Coincidentally I hear Alfonzo has been practicing his tennis game lately.

 

[GunBlaze]

The Krystal comparison is simply wrong. Krystal was in one game when Brawl came out, barely in said game, and most of her potential is wielding a weapon primarily/near exclusively used by Fox. She was popular but not anywhere near as popular as K. Rool is now.

When you compare Krystal and Wolf to K. Rool and Dixie Kong, it's pretty obvious that Wolf and K. Rool are very comparable as characters, both are villains/they have a history in their series. However Wolf having his own set would just be ridiculous given his series. It made sense for him to be a semi-clone of Fox.

There's no proof that Sakurai chose Wolf because he was the easier character. Wolf was really popular too for Brawl - I remember as one of the supporters of Wolf for that game.

Well then, how about this?

Also, in Brawl, like, very few animations were shared between them.

EDIT: 'd

 

[**Gilgamesh**]

Just curious as to why you left out Lucina and Dark Pit. I know Dark Pit was average at best, but Lucina was pretty good!

Also, Mewtwo wasn't a newcomer, lul.

Lucina and Dark Pit (Pits has next to no results at all) are basically clones and Marth (only one person gets any notable results) is considered better anyway and I put in parenthesis about Mewtwo being a Veteran but DLC.