Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Makai Wars]

You know, just because Smash 5 introduces the term echo fighter doesnt mean Shadow has to be one. He can be a semi clone, the Lucas to Sonic's Ness. Maybe not run quite as fast (or possible have to accelerate before hitting Sonic speed, or something) but hit harder and possibly have a projectile. There are a lot of ways to spin him and I think he's on the list in terms of being in Smash considering he's popular among Sonic's target audience.

I'm more of a Metal Sonic guy myself.

 

[Will]

A Fourside "Echo Stage", Moonside, where you have higher knockback the LOWER your percentage is.

You realize how unfair that is, right?

 

[Jetsurge]

The only one I'm sold on is Metroid missing her Dark Metroid costume, but it may have just been left out of the demo but the possibility of another clone Echo for her is up there I think. Can't speak the same for Chrom, Sakurai's concerns about having a lot of FE boys makes me undecided.

Also don't forget Ridley's victory theme is a dark version of Samus' theme instead of Ridley's theme suggesting another Metroid villain like Dark Samus will be in.

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

Ganon's not an echo.

In fact, Sakurai's gone out of his way to actually finally give the fans what they've wanted with him this game.

If know that, I'm just pointing out that Sakurai has given characters moves that aren't fitting of the character. The only reason Ganondorf has this move is because Sakurai didn't want to give Ganondorf a unique up tilt and just gave him a modified version of Captain Falcon's up tilt.

The point I was making is that if Sakurai would allow Ganondorf to kick up to his head like a cheerleader, because he didn't want to give him a unique move then I don't see why he wouldn't let Shadow perform certain moves like a wind up punch.

 

[Shroob]

Also don't forget Ridley's victory theme is a dark version of Samus' theme instead of Ridley's theme suggesting another Metroid villain like Dark Samus will be in.

I don't think that really 'suggests' anything.

Meta Knight has a rock remix of Kirby's theme, but it's unique to him.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

I wonder how hard it'd be to make a semi clone out of assist trophy material?

Dark Samus could keep her assist trophy moveset, but also add in bits of Samus.

And you have the model but you'd obviously have to polish it up.

 

[KMDP]

You realize how unfair that is, right?

Yes, because it wasn't a serious suggestion. XD

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

You know, just because Smash 5 introduces the term echo fighter doesnt mean Shadow has to be one. He can be a semi clone, the Lucas to Sonic's Ness. Maybe not run quite as fast (or possible have to accelerate before hitting Sonic speed, or something) but hit harder and possibly have a projectile. There are a lot of ways to spin him and I think he's on the list in terms of being in Smash considering he's popular among Sonic's target audience.

I'm more of a Metal Sonic guy myself.

To be fair though, we haven't had any semi-clones since brawl and the introduction of echo fighters makes me doubt we'll get more this game tbh. Seems like they wanna move away from semi-clones

 

[marcuzoo]

Been seeing rumors about Tails as an echo fighter and all i can do is pray. Although its weird that in Sonic Forces, Shadow was technically Sonic’s echo fighter

 

[KMDP]

Been seeing rumors about Tails as an echo fighter and all i can do is pray. Although its weird that in Sonic Forces, Shadow was technically Sonic’s echo fighter

I'd say that Tails as an echo fighter would be... well... impossible?

Mostly because he wouldn't be able to use Sonic's Up Throw. (Also, it'd be a waste if his Up Special wasn't his Flying ability).

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

I'd say that Tails as an echo fighter would be... well... impossible?

Mostly because he wouldn't be able to use Sonic's Up Throw. (Also, it'd be a waste if his Up Special wasn't his Flying ability).

His name is literally tails, him not fighting with his tails would be extremely weird. And his main thing is flying, you can't just leave that out. It'd be like if they didn't let Dixie use her hair, it'd just be wrong

 

[Shroob]

I'm just dying internally since we probably won't get a Direct until August... which means rehashed information through July.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Been seeing rumors about Tails as an echo fighter and all i can do is pray. Although its weird that in Sonic Forces, Shadow was technically Sonic’s echo fighter

A link to these rumors please?

Not that I believe it, but eh.

 

[Mask and Mirror]

It would be really strange if there wasn't someone from ARMS in there.

The main thing I want is more Nintendo characters. I don't care a jot about 3rd party characters.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

It would be really strange if there wasn't someone from ARMS in there.

It's getting an assist at most considering that's less time consuming. A newcomer isn't happen, and Sakurai might just wait till DLC to throw Springman in there.

But not before DLC. A December 2015 first proposal would imply it's very unlikely for anything from Arms.

 

[dezeray112]

Judging by the project plan's timing, probably.
Though only time will tell.

I see. I still wished I could change my choice for the Smash Ballot as she made it in as part of Shulk's Final Smash.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Please do not double post. Edit your messages instead.

 

[KMDP]

His name is literally tails, him not fighting with his tails would be extremely weird. And his main thing is flying, you can't just leave that out. It'd be like if they didn't let Dixie use her hair, it'd just be wrong

I still like my idea from the other day about Tails being able to use his Up Special to carry other characters if they're on the same team.

It would be really strange if there wasn't someone from ARMS in there.

Considering when the project plan was submitted and development of Smash Ultimate likely started, the expectation now is that an ARMS character would be DLC.

 

[Shroob]

Hey, anyone here from Smash4 speculation days, any of y'all got a picture of Scare-ly?

That really ****ing deformed Ridley someone tried to pass off as real on a fake CSS?

 

[Jetsurge]

There's too many good Sonic stages to pick just one and call it a day. So how about that stage in Sonic '06 with the orca?

How about another Green Hill but with sand!
"Green Hill's Looking A Lot More Like Sand Hill Right Now"

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

Hey, anyone here from Smash4 speculation days, any of y'all got a picture of Scare-ly?

That really ****ing deformed Ridley someone tried to pass off as real on a fake CSS?

this one?

lmfao

 

[Shroob]

this one?
View attachment 149524

lmfao

Kill it with ****ing fire

That head is soo deformed looking it's not even funny.

 

[KMDP]

this one?
View attachment 149524

lmfao

Terrifyingly deformed Ridley aside. This CSS shape might be close to what we will end up getting with all characters unlocked (with, say, more lines).

Though... if we go over a certain number of characters, Sakurai might have to drop the current method of character selection outside of multi-switch play.

I have an idea, but it's probably not a great one.

Spoiler: My Stupid Idea

What if there are x number of 'cylinders', each one representing a CSS for each player, that way you can fit way more characters on the screen, and nobody is prevented from selecting a character because the tokens move the CSS.

Eh, I don't put too much stock into it, but it's worth putting out there.

 

[Deleted member]

this one?
View attachment 149524

lmfao

Please tell me no one believed this "leak".

 

[vaanrose]

Terrifyingly deformed Ridley aside. This CSS shape might be close to what we will end up getting with all characters unlocked (with, say, more lines).

Though... if we go over a certain number of characters, Sakurai might have to drop the current method of character selection outside of multi-switch play.

I have an idea, but it's probably not a great one.

Spoiler: My Stupid Idea

What if there are x number of 'cylinders', each one representing a CSS for each player, that way you can fit way more characters on the screen, and nobody is prevented from selecting a character because the tokens move the CSS.

Eh, I don't put too much stock into it, but it's worth putting out there.

Smash character icons are pretty large when you compare them to other fighting games. Tekken Tag 2 has 60 characters divided over two and a half rows that take up around 30% of the screen. They could still afford to go way smaller on the icons without sacrificing that much clarity.

 

[KMDP]

Smash character icons are pretty large when you compare them to other fighting games. Tekken Tag 2 has 60 characters divided over two and a half rows that take up around 30% of the screen. They could still afford to go way smaller on the icons without sacrificing that much clarity.

Yeah, I agree. It's worth remembering though, that there's a minimum size limit (a character's icon has to be able to fit up to eight player tokens with you able to yours amongst them).

EDIT: I don't think it'll be an issue, though, until we reach ludicrous amounts of characters.

 

[Zeox]

I had a dream that Sakurai added Rayman to smash, but he had his design of Rayman 1

And his stage was inspired in the first levels of Rayman 1, with the purple tomato thingy being a stage hazard that you could throw to your enemies by hitting it

The weirdest part is that I don't even care for Rayman in smash.

 

[papagenos]

Smash character icons are pretty large when you compare them to other fighting games. Tekken Tag 2 has 60 characters divided over two and a half rows that take up around 30% of the screen. They could still afford to go way smaller on the icons without sacrificing that much clarity.

the way you select a character in smash involves using those marker pieces and it would be difficult to select a character and cover them with that marker and still see where the character is, especially with 8 player smash, if everyone chooses the same character. its hard to make the icons much smaller due to that in smash. Though the marker pieces themselves do look a lot smaller this time around.

 

[Sabrewulf238]

I had a dream that Sakurai added Rayman to smash, but he had his design of Rayman 1
View attachment 149525
And his stage was inspired in the first levels of Rayman 1, with the purple tomato thingy being a stage hazard that you could throw to your enemies by hitting it
View attachment 149526
The weirdest part is that I don't even care for Rayman in smash.

I had a dream once where Homer Simpson was revealed as a newcomer in Smash.

So I don't think desire has anything to do with it, at least not all the time.

 

[vaanrose]

the way you select a character in smash involves using those marker pieces and it would be difficult to select a character and cover them with that marker and still see where the character is, especially with 8 player smash, if everyone chooses the same character. its hard to make the icons much smaller due to that in smash. Though the marker pieces themselves do look a lot smaller this time around.

View attachment 149527

The tokens don't look that much smaller, it's just because the demo icons are so big. The final icons will probably be close to exactly the same size as the Wii U's, because the vertical space of the section dedicated to icons has increased exactly enough to fit one more row of Wii U sized icons.

 

[WaddleMatt]

Who's the girl with the headphones in you character predictions?

Tap Trial Girl from Rhythm Heaven. It is more of a placeholder for any character from the series but I put her because she is the one I most want.

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

Please tell me no one believed this "leak".

From what I remember about this leak was that people were scouring the internet for that smash lock symbol, to see if it was fan made. I think it was an edit of a fan made one or something.

So no one reallllly beleived but it was definitely a situation of "guys, are we really bothering to do research on this one???"

 

[Shroob]

Honestly, looking at the schedule for "Character of the days" and knowing that they'll run out by November 9th, I'm hard pressed into thinking that we're going to get anywhere from 7-9 newcomers, which would indeed make this the lowest amount of newcomers in Smash history.

If it's 7, that'd put us at 71 characters, 75 including all 3 Miis and 3 Pokemon Trainer Mons, which would be, a really nice number to end on pre-dlc, tbh.

That, and it'd allow the original 12 to be together on the top row of the CSS together, echoes notwithstanding(**** off Dark Samus, you'll ruin the symmetry).

 

[Guybrush20X6]

I had a dream once where Homer Simpson was revealed as a newcomer in Smash.

So I don't think desire has anything to do with it, at least not all the time.

I had a Dream that Strong Bad was announced for Smash. I didn't see a trailer or anything so the rest of the dream was spent wondering how he'd work. And now we'll never know...

 

[Mega Bidoof]

I had a dream last night where Professor Layton was announced as an echo fighter of Link.

The sword made some sense since he used one once, but everything past that didn’t.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Dark Samus semi clone.

Solves the symmetry problem.

I want that sweet assist trophy moveset if she got in.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

That's more on Other M and less on Fusion.




For Some new topics....

How do we feel about Isaac's performance on the ballot?

And...

How likely do we think Dillon is?

And...

Do you think Sakurai wants to keep third party characters Japanese? As in he will only allow series that are owned by Japanese companies?

Isaac might have done decently enough, but I'm not sure if he's a Camelot-owned creation, and we all know how Waluigi ended up because of that.

Dillon doesn't seem too likely, even with Dead Heat Breakers on the pipeline.

Not really, especially since they went out of their way to include Ubi's custom-made Rayman trophy model. Definitely seems like he'd be open to the idea of more Western creations that aren't Diddy getting in, as the Smash 4 DLC ballot was a testing ground for how those would be received.

https://sourcegaming.info/2015/08/22/japantopdlcpart1/

It's king k rool of Japan's most wanted

>Ray, Arle and Magolor are among top choices
This pleases me.

 

[Murlough]

Dark Samus semi clone.

Solves the symmetry problem.

I want that sweet assist trophy moveset if she got in.

I like how everyone is near unanimously saying Dark Samus would be a semi-clone but Shadow has been near unanimously written off as an echo.

Like wut. Tbf I've never played Metroid so I don't know jack about Dark Samus but it makes me think that the same is true for the people who think Shadow should just be an echo.

Seriously, if someone could clear that up for me that would be great. I really have a hard time believing a "Dark" version of another character could be more different from the original than Shadow is to Sonic.

(Also not really trying to have the Shadow discussion again. I just don't understand the logic in here sometimes.)

 

[True Blue Warrior]

How do we feel about Isaac's performance on the ballot?

Most likely not that well. If Mii costumes are supposed to have been consolation prize for characters that did well onthe ballot, him not having one doesn't really seem to bode too well. Hopefully, he'd at least do well enough to be acknowledged in some way, shape or form.

this one?
View attachment 149524

lmfao

I still laugh at how terrible Ridley looks here. He looks worse than pre-release MvCI Chun Li.

Like wut. Tbf I've never played Metroid so I don't know jack about Dark Samus but it makes me think that the same is true for the people who think Shadow should just be an echo.

Seriously, if someone could clear that up for me that would be great. I really have a hard time believing a "Dark" version of another character could be more different from the original than Shadow is to Sonic.

Shadow would make more sense at this point as a semi-clone than a pure clone.

 

[Shroob]

So, if we get a max of 7 more newcomers, this would be how our roster would be aligned, barring the top row getting any echo fighters.

I'm not sure if we'll get exactly 7 more, and DLC will screw this up royally, but 71 characters, 75 with Miis and Transformations, I'd be more than okay with it.

In fact, I'd argue that this WILL be out final roster count.

They're going to want to keep the original 12 together, especially since this game is about Smash's history.