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Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

Almost one month has passed since release. In retrospect....

  • This is by far the best Smash ever. Like, I don't even know how they will top this.

  • Pretty freakin' good; I have a few qualms over things like internet play, balancing issues, etc.

  • It's ok, but [insert Smash game here] is better.

  • I'd rather play Parcheesi.


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Pacack

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You say that, but Roy came back due to fan demand and K. Rool was recognized enough to get a Mii Costume.

There really are no hard rules. I'm sorry but Sakurai is a human being who does things on a whim and loosely follows the rules he makes up on the spot.

Almost every argument or rule people on here pretend exists already has at least one exception by Smash 4 except the "no cartoon/anime originating" characters. (Maybe a few more but you get what I'm saying)
Roy coming back due to fan demand is not equivalent. Roy was a popular cut veteran. K. Rool is a popular villain that hasn't appeared in his home series games in 18 years.

I'm not quoting any rules. I'm just trying to point out that K. Rool isn't a shoe-in, and honestly has nothing aside from the ballot, which he may have only done modestly well in.

A costume doesn't give us concrete evidence for a character. If it did, we would have Lloyd, Heihachi, Knuckles, Geno, and Mega Man X in the next game.

I don't think K. Rool is impossible by any means, but I have no reason to consider him likely when he has been so noticeably absent from his franchise as of late. Until he appears in his own franchise again, I consider him less likely than Dixie, Cranky and even Funky.
 

Guybrush20X6

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For "fun" look through your post history and show us all the things you said that were proven wrong.

Here's some of mine

"Given Alolan Dugtrio appeared as well, we may get confirmation on it's typing.

Either fire because of Pele's hair or Grass because it looks a little like hay."

"While Rosalina is my favorite Mario character that's not a green dinosaur and my no. one choice for a female Mario Rep I'm not optimistic about her chances of being added as playable. "
 

Wyoming

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I would like Miis's cut tbh, but I don't think it's happening.
Do Miis have a function on the Switch? I keep hearing that they've been reduced to icons: but how customizable are they this time around? If it's the same as the Wii and Wii U, then I don't see why they'd have to be cut.
 

Verde Coeden Scalesworth

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Miis are still part of Switch and also are an easy money maker on Smash Switch. Cutting them is unlikely. They still provide their purpose, an infinite option for different kinds of actual characters anybody can make. They were redesigned to be a Smash representative, not unlike how they're added to other games(which their moveset/play style is based upon the type of game they're in).

Them being a bit less prevalent doesn't mean they're getting cut, not after they became a unique Smash option. They are just a simple Mii, but a Mii Fighter with a far bigger purpose than "Wii Sports rep".
 

Zinith

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Hmmm... Imma break down the new additions of each game by what they were importnace wise to their own games

64

9 Main characters :mario64::dk64::kirby64::fox64::falcon64::ness64::yoshi64::samus64::link64: (DK and Yoshi having been promoted from Villain and side-kick)
1 Side character :luigi64:
2 Pokemon Mascots :pikachu64::jigglypuff64: (Jigglypuff was really big back in the Gen 1 days)

Melee

4 Main Characters :icsmelee::marthmelee::roymelee::gawmelee:
3(4) Side Characters :peachmelee::zeldamelee:(:sheikmelee:):falcomelee:
2 Villains:bowsermelee::ganondorfmelee:
2 Pokemon:pichumelee::mewtwomelee:
2 alt versions of a character :drmario::younglinkmelee:


Brawl

8 Main Characters :pit::wario::snake::ike::pt::sonic::olimar::lucas:
2 Side Characters :metaknight::diddy:
2 Villains :dedede::wolf:
1 (4) Pokemon (:squirtle::ivysaur::charizard:):lucario:
2 Alt Versions :zerosuitsamus::toonlink:
1 Hardware Accessory :rob:


Smash 4


11 Main Characters :4villager::4megaman::4littlemac::4bayonetta::4cloud::4duckhunt:(at least the gunman in the trio):4robinm::4corrin::4pacman::4ryu::4shulk:
3 Side Characters :rosalina::4palutena::4lucina:
2 Villains :4bowserjr::4darkpit:
1 Pokemon :4greninja:
1 NPC Instructor :4wiifit:
1 (3 versions) Avatar :4mii:

What this all means is anyone's guess but there you go (predicts the trouble he's gonna get for not having Lucina as a MC and starts digging a hole)
Finally, someone who sees the light with Yoshi...
 

Murlough

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Roy coming back due to fan demand is not equivalent. Roy was a popular cut veteran. K. Rool is a popular villain that hasn't appeared in his home series games in 18 years.

I'm not quoting any rules. I'm just trying to point out that K. Rool isn't a shoe-in, and honestly has nothing aside from the ballot, which he may have only done modestly well in.

A costume doesn't give us concrete evidence for a character. If it did, we would have Lloyd, Heihachi, Knuckles, Geno, and Mega Man X in the next game.

I don't think K. Rool is impossible by any means, but I have no reason to consider him likely when he has been so noticeably absent from his franchise as of late. Until he appears in his own franchise again, I consider him less likely than Dixie, Cranky and even Funky.
Then I misunderstood you. I'm shocked their are people who think he's a shoe-in.

I was just saying people overestimate what they think is important for a character inclusion.

I wasn't attempting "concrete evidence" and anybody who thinks they have any when it comes to unrevealed newcomers at this point is fooling themselves imho. The argument was that K. Rool, despite your point that he is irrelevent, was already recognised by Sakurai last game. I never said it was a guarentee and quite frankly I'm annoyed you are even attempting to imply that.
 

MopedOfJustice

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For "fun" look through your post history and show us all the things you said that were proven wrong.
Years ago I made a self-appointed bet about Pacman's inclusion (linked in my signature, though the terms changed). I was very confident at the time and now I've grown too fond of the resulting profile picture.
 

Jak_spoon

Smash Journeyman
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You claim that Sakurai has dismissed characters that weren't recurring "time and time again", claiming there is a pattern and conclude that the Champions will not be in Smash because of that.

However, there were only two instances where Sakurai could've dismissed one-offs: In Brawl, vis-a-vis Midna and in Smash 4 for any Skyward Sword character.

I claim that those two *possible* instances of Sakurai dismissing a character that has only appeared once, do not constitute a pattern.

I also give counter-evidence to your claim by saying that Ganondorf, the human form of Ganon, and Sheik only appeared once before being added to Melee and Toon Link, being based on his Wind Waker incarnation, who also appeared once, got in Brawl.

Thus, there is no pattern and possibly no precedent to Sakurai dismissing a Zelda character based on the fact he or she only appeared in a single game, which gives the Champions better credentials than you claim they have.
I think you have me confused with someone else. I've been proposing that Skull Kid and Midna are going to be the inclusions. I've never been on the wagon for characters like Impa and Ganon if that's what you're implying. I was saying I don't think the champions have a chance because their inclusions would be unprecedented. Essentially they're too new. Generally Smash looks at characters from the previous gen. Exceptions to the rule where Sakurai pulls someone who's game is in development have all been the main characters of their series not side characters like the champions.
 
D

Deleted member

Guest


My comment on Twitter for this day:
We're training ourselves to become better fighters to endure a lot of nonsense with Smash Speculation. #SmashBros #SmashBrosSwitch #E32018
These gifs are impressive should I say myself. Keep on doing this. :)
Mandatory Awkward Zombie reference, coming through.

I love these comics, thank you for sharing one of these. :laugh:
There was a huge push for K. Rool in Smash pretty much immediately after Brawl came out. It was already at a fever pitch when the game was announced in 2011, a full year before the roster was decided. And from the start people saw him as "a virtual guarantee," or at the very least, they did here.
If Sakurai does not add King K. Rool as a character in Smash Bros. Switch, expect mass fans to attack Sakurai like a Cape Buffalo stampede.

I never really cared for King K. Rool being added to be honest.
To think the situation is so cut and dry is the same kind of **** that lead people to think Cloud was impossible and on a level with Goku, a character from a damn anime.

Or how everyone thought Animal Crossing would never be in Smash because Sakurai deemed them pacifist and non-violent fighters. This same **** haunts a Nintendo icon like Isabelle even now that the series IS in Smash.

Nothing is impossible and to think that something is impossible is just not realistic.

Nothing is that set in stone. There's always room for the other possibility.

And that's all I'll say on that.
You sir need a raise.
I would like Miis's cut tbh, but I don't think it's happening.
Why? Just curious.
I like the Miis and I really like how you can make random characters.
I think the Miis just need to be more buffed, because they feel so slow.
The Miis in Smash 4 were not fun to play, and unlocking customs in was a big pain. Customs should be right there for you instead of having to get them.
 
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BluePikmin11

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With Vergeben’s Simon Belmont/Ridley leak on Gamefaqs having notable credibility, I figured that I would analyze Simon again. What would be the main reason Sakurai wanted to add a Konami character in Smash Switch, despite the company’s incredibly awful treatment to Kojima during their restructure? I can only think of three possible reasons, one of them being personal impact. Sakurai has personal history with Castlevania since the vert first game on the NES, based on the statement he gave in the Sakurai x Nomura interview:

“For me personally, it was the year 1986, when games like The Legend of Zelda and Castlevania were released, and I experienced physically interactive games. They had a big impact on me.”

I feel that such personal impact with this iconic franchise would tempt him to consider Castlevania character representation. Second, his potentially overwhelmingly massive ballot popularity. I have seen Simon Belmont constantly requested/campaigned in online forums since the ballot creation. Simon’s amount of votes in the ballot could have convinced Sakurai enough at least consider the idea thoroughly.

Third and most importantly, pure will. I think there would be no way Konami characters would be a consideration to Sakurai without getting past the Konami Kojima treatment. I feel two things would play into this. One, the strong likelihood that Kojima would want Snake back in Smash. Even back in Smash 4, he still wanted Snake to be in the game despite not being contacted by Sakurai to do negotiations. Metal Gear Solid is still Kojima’s baby, and I cannot imagine an event where Kojima would not want it to happen even in the hard circumstances. If Sakurai contacted him primarily for permission, Kojima would still say yes and possibly help Sakurai with his anger with Konami.

Two, wanting to make Smash have the best roster in fighting games ever. Sakurai has managed to create an unbelievable roster for Smash 4 thanks to the third-party additions like Sonic, Megaman, Pac-Man, Ryu, Cloud, all big gaming icons in a single fighting game. With Smash 4 in specific, he wanted the 3DS/Wii U installment to be the best character game in the world. If he wanted to fill in the remaining bases for big third-parties like he stated in a Nintendo Dream interview, then he will have to get past Konami’s treatment and try to negotiate one of Konami’s big icons to truly make Smash the number one character game in the world.

In my perspective, with Konami’s restructuring in 2016 when the Smash Switch project plan was created, they would still be open and fair with the negotiation of Simon Belmont. Around this time, they previously brought a majority of their old library via Wii U eShop consistently throughout the years when other third-parties couldn’t, allowed their titles to be part of the NES Mini lineup, and had a Castlevania anime in production in 2016. (If Vergeben’s information is anything to go by.) I personally think in 2016, Konami was free and available to make profitable business deals with Nintendo and Sakurai.

All of these factors create an small opening in which Simon Belmont’s inclusion in Smash Bros. is very possible. This is just my theory though to explain how an addition like Simon came to be.
 

SuperSmashStephen

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Could some make a roster for me? I have it all mocked up, I just don’t have the means to create it because there’s no mobile roster app.

Edit: I know that’s a big favor to ask, and I understand if I’m completely ignored or laughed at.
 
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MasterWarlord

Smash Champion
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Dixie has nothing but cameos, spin offs, and remake roles between DKC3 and TF while K. Rool has plenty of main villain roles in completely new games. Dixie's relevance is never questioned despite her 18 year gap of irrelevance, all because of one game.

The franchise itself is very relevant and people are specifically screaming for a DK character, that's enough. K. Rool is good enough to represent Returns and TF as a representative of the franchise despite not appearing in them.
 

SonicMario

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I'd personally like that. Like I said in my last post, I expect they'll do free updates like they've been doing for all their multiplayer games. It will likely last for a year and maybe there will be a single player expansion like Splatoon's Octo Expansion.

That said, I don't think every character will come back (most of the guest will be cut due to licensing as Nintendo wont want to do it for 6 different characters) and Miis are definitely gone (Nintendo has scrubbed them from every game that isn't a port. They'll just be profile icons for here on out).

Its one reason I expect they'll scale back heavily on guest characters. They can't have them be free as they will be a cost to license them as well as other reasons (not a lot of big names left, complaints that the game is moving away from Nintendo which Sakurai has responded to, new management ect). Characters are not unrealistic as Nintendo added new characters for ARMS.
Your well-known controversial opinion on 3rd Party inclusions aside. How in the heck does Sakurai responding about "moving away from Nintendo" automatically mean "We're scaling back on 3rd Parties!". We went from 2 in Brawl, 3 in the Base game for 4, and doubled that to 6 in Smash 4 DLC all with mostly positive fanfare. Frankly, I wouldn't be surprised if we ended up getting at least 10 3rd Parties (Including returning characters in that number BTW. Nothing crazy like 10 additional ones on top of the ones returning) by the time all of Smash Switch's development finishes (That's including DLC, in terms of Base game. I think most if not all the 3rd Parties return from 4. At the very least Sonic, Megaman, Pac-Man, and Bayonetta should all be safe for obvious reasons each. With Ryu maybe coming in with Megaman already signed on. And Cloud's the most iffy but I could easily see him returning too since Square hasn't really pulled a Konami on Nintendo. Plus at least one newcomer 3rd party in the base game that will take center stage as an E3 Reveal this year)

Also I don't think Miis are definitely gone just yet. Even with the less amount of games using them lately could be a concern for those who wouldn't mind them back. The fact they're still there in the Switch's system and capabilities at all still provides some chance for them. The biggest obstacle in the Miis case is whether or not Custom Moves return. If they're for the most part being removed then yeah, the Miis are going to be in danger of being left out. But if they are back even if it's only for the Smash 4 veterans that had them for some odd reason, then they're practically assured. Though I think there is room for a 3rd option where only the Miis keep their customs (Palutena getting a revamp and/or gets the best moves out of her arsenal in this scenario).

Cause I just find it hard to believe they'd cut them that easily when Sakurai has gone on record of including them to help satisfy many of the impossible requests of some of the younger Nintendo fans (He has said something akin to "The younger the fan, the more impossible the request") for something as arbitrary as Nintendo isn't putting them front and center as much as they did in the Wii and Wii U eras. I've said this many times in other posts already but I'll say it again: If there's any game that's going to get people making Miis on the Switch despite them not quite having it as easy to share and/or featured as they were on 3DS and Wii U. It's Smash.
 

Chandeelure

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Why? Just curious.
I like the Miis and I really like how you can make random characters.
I think the Miis just need to be more buffed, because they feel so slow.
The Miis in Smash 4 were not fun to play, and unlocking customs in was a big pain. Customs should be right there for you instead of having to get them.
-I don't like their designs, movesets or anything about them tbh.
-They can't even be used online.
-Customs are garbage (in general, not just Miis's), they look terrible (just explosive and windbox versions of moves) and are super unbalanced (like, some are literally unusable and others are like 100 times better than the other counterparts).
-Miis also have 3 movesets that probably take a lot of time.

But yeah, my reasons are just personal stuff.
They make sense.
 

SmashChu

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I understand what you mean, as it stands rex is more popular but I feel the vast majority of people wouldn't really care either way, people "wanted" chrom because he was the latest protagonist and I feel a lot of Rex's supporters are the same. Neither Rex or Elma would really generate that much hype to begin with since they're still pretty niche characters from a niche franchise. And still when rex would've been chosen no one knew about him anyway.
That's partically true, at least from what I've seen on English speaking communities, but this is more due to Rex being the least interesting character compared to the other 4. I think Rex is more popular in Japan in part due to the better VA.

That said, I do think fans will be excited for his inclusion. It's one of those things were people will talk about the other characters getting, but they still want a character from Xenoblade Chronicles 2. It's just that Rex is the most obvious choice. I think you'll see more people get excited them you think.
 

Chandeelure

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I forgot to say that Custom Moves probably take a lot of time, because DLC characters didn't have them.

Well... that, or they just realized nobody cares about Customs, so they didn't even try.
 

True Blue Warrior

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If anything, I think it's more likely that 2/3rds of the Mii Fighter movesets gets cut than the Miis getting scrapped entirely.
 
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Verde Coeden Scalesworth

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-I don't like their designs, movesets or anything about them tbh.
-They can't even be used online.
-Customs are garbage (in general, not just Miis's), they look terrible (just explosive and windbox versions of moves) and are super unbalanced (like, some are literally unusable and others are like 100 times better than the other counterparts).
-Miis also have 3 movesets that probably take a lot of time.

But yeah, my reasons are just personal stuff.
They make sense.
But they can be used online. Just not every mode. People really need to stop saying this. It's become such a bad meme it's ridiculous. They can be used With Friends, which is Online. With Anyone is just one of more than one Mode.

I do like customs, but that's fair. They have balance issues, and I think need improvement instead of cutting.
 

YoshiandToad

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Weirdly I feel like the Miis were the only fighters who should have gotten customs to begin with. Palutena should have just got a good moveset as her default. Everyone else was mostly fine and even if we get some fun ones like Ganondorf's blade or Ice balls for Luigi, I tend to forget their customs even exist most the time.

I'll be sad if the Mii fighters are gone. It was fun watching Toad Vs. Geno vs. K. Rool vs. Chrom vs. a random Goomba vs. Samurai Goroh, something which I'll never get to experience without the Mii fighters.
 

The Stoopid Unikorn

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Miis are essentially Smash's answer to other fighting games getting a "create your fighter" option. With that said, the only relevant fighting franchise that kept the option after introducing it is SoulCalibur, and that's assuming the upcoming sixth game gets it.

Basically, my point is that Mii Fighters are just as likely to be cut as anyone who isn't a huge Nintendo character like Mario, Link or Pikachu. Their unique gimmick of being customizable fighters changes nothing since other franchises have done the same thing and ended up cutting the feature.
 
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Smashoperatingbuddy123

Smash Legend
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took a Crack at my prediction roster

and yes based off of if the leak is true or not

Smash Bros Switch Prediction.png


everything under the third party row (the row with sonic, megaman and pac-man) is the "who can get each slot catergory" for example the DK slot could be either Funky or king k rool or none at all

if rumor real ridley if false sylux for the metroid rep but maybe none at all for the 5th time in a row

Rhythm heaven girl is just a place holder for a rhythm heaven rep since chorus men would have happened if it weren't for the same reason ice climbers failed for smash 4

replace simon with another random 3rd party rep if leak is false

the two explamation point between rhythm heaven and ness are just completly unexspected characters

spring man is set to the side because he could have appeared too son for the roster

the gyromite is just another retro rep takamaru has the best chance from all possible

if another pokemon rep would happen my best guess is any of the five on the lower left

3rd party possiblities in my opinion on the right

soras only there because of this
 
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SmashChu

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Your well-known controversial opinion on 3rd Party inclusions aside. How in the heck does Sakurai responding about "moving away from Nintendo" automatically mean "We're scaling back on 3rd Parties!". We went from 2 in Brawl, 3 in the Base game for 4, and doubled that to 6 in Smash 4 DLC all with mostly positive fanfare. Frankly, I wouldn't be surprised if we ended up getting at least 10 3rd Parties (Including returning characters in that number BTW. Nothing crazy like 10 additional ones on top of the ones returning) by the time all of Smash Switch's development finishes (That's including DLC, in terms of Base game. I think most if not all the 3rd Parties return from 4. At the very least Sonic, Megaman, Pac-Man, and Bayonetta should all be safe for obvious reasons each. With Ryu maybe coming in with Megaman already signed on. And Cloud's the most iffy but I could easily see him returning too since Square hasn't really pulled a Konami on Nintendo. Plus at least one newcomer 3rd party in the base game that will take center stage as an E3 Reveal this year).
10 third party characters!? You do realize that Nintendo would have to license out all of those characters correct. These aren't handshake agreements. These companies are allowing Nintendo to use their IPs. This is why I've said they will cut a lot of them because Nintendo will have to re-licenses each and every one of them.

The reason I bring up the complaint was it was something Sakurai directly responded too (same with Fire Emblem which I think they wont add a new one). Its one of the reasons that I think you are going to see a scaling back. There is an article on Source Gaming with that and the Fire Emlbem thing. For a quick summary, here are the reasons why
  • Third party characters wont work in Nintendo's "Splatoon" moble like paid DLC does (and Nintendo will do the former as they are looking at engagement heavily)
  • There are very few strong choices left and there is no conscience on who should be included (constant that to Sonic, Megaman, Final Fantasy ect)
  • Change in management which may be more restrictive in what Sakurai can do (contrast to Iwata who let developers run wild)
  • The complaints I mentioned earlier.
So there is enough reason to think you are going to see less, not more.
 

PLATINUM7

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I honestly hardly tried customs and that came down to having to unlock them.

I was at least planning on trying them out a few times but going to customise characters and only having half their options, or sometimes barely any because RNG, to choose from made me very disinterested. By the time I had unlocked a majority of the moves I pretty much forgot about customisation.

If they come back, make them all available at the start. That way I can actually test out different combinations early on in the game, instead of having to remember to come back when I've actually unlocked enough to make it worthwhile.
 

Megadoomer

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Could some make a roster for me? I have it all mocked up, I just don’t have the means to create it because there’s no mobile roster app.

Edit: I know that’s a big favor to ask, and I understand if I’m completely ignored or laughed at.
I can do that. I won't be able to do it right away (I'm on a train for the next hour or so), but send me your roster list through a private message or post it here (whichever you'd prefer), and I'll see what I can do.
 

TumblrFamous

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Could some make a roster for me? I have it all mocked up, I just don’t have the means to create it because there’s no mobile roster app.

Edit: I know that’s a big favor to ask, and I understand if I’m completely ignored or laughed at.
I can do it!

Oh Megadoomer Megadoomer didn't see you there :p
 
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D

Deleted member

Guest
(Side note: I hate coming in late on discussions here but i feel since this would relate to the video i would put what i said earlier from the BWD speculation thread)
Im a supporter of BWD, but 3 argument that the game explain team didn't present was the case of how implementation would have worked in his favor, hals recent push for him, and not including the smash ballot and fan service.
Im no game developer, and im sure as hell am no sakurai, but wouldnt it be easier to add in BWD, since they already have a working rigged model, and several bits of animations, of Waddle Dees. They have both high quality models thanks to Dedede entrance and win screen, smash run uses both parasol WD and waddle doos(and even if smash run dosent return they still have the animations of those enemies), and possible leftover bits of animations from dededes old side smash and final smash.
Imho, they would just need to gather all of those things together, polish the animations bits, or use kirby as a base to finish some animation, and slap a bandana on his head and thats like a good portion of his implementations finished by using old resources. While the counter argument could be made that sakurai may not like the idea of reusing old assets to being in characters, smash has had a history of utilizing old assets (be it clones, captain falcon reusing an okd character model in the 1st pitch of smash bros, wireframes, ect.)
Hal also has push the character in almost every game. While its ultimately up to sakurai to decide to put him in or not(or in the case of Corrin, have no choice but to do it) there push for the character over the years has not gone unnoticed, even if people want to act like he isnt anything special (see resetera reaction to the video).
They negeleted fan service and the smash ballot as well is a problem. While he may or may not have been the highest in the ballot, he was most likely the most popular kirby character during the ballot. And thanks to source gaming, we know that the ballot will be used to determine the roster for future entries. I felt as though this point could have brought up a good argument for the character(and future characters that relate to this) but that they didnt felt like a wasted oppritunity.
I know allot of effort has been put into these videos and its a wip but man, i am not feeling these at all. Its already one thing that i dislike people speculating characters and saying words like "deserving" to justify a character to be in or not, but its worse when people of considerable influences(ala youtubers) do it. It brings unneeded conflict within the community and Knowing the smash fan base they will(and already have) taken these video seriously. And to me... Its tiring to see these arguments time and again from the community thinking that they know what nintendo will do with this game, when we all know this is the most unpredictable smash game to date, and most likely the community's conceptions of characters are almost always destroyed(have we learn nothing from "too sexy for smash", "no guns in smash", "must have a major role in an nintendo game", "4 characters per series", and chrom.)

As a final note lets all remember that not 1 person or group of people have a final say in the smash brothers. At the end of the day gameexplain, while i dont agree with the video verdict, nor am i a fan of these types of videos, are just youtubers on the internet expressing there opinions. Sakurai will do what he wants and what he wants to do is please the fans(not to sound like he only lives to serve, but to satisfy as many people as possible), and the opinions of people like youtubers, reddit members, smashboards, twitter, gamefaqs users*, and resetera* are just a very small part of the nintendo community as a whole, no matter how bad they are (especially those with * have very VERY terrbile taste).
 

Verde Coeden Scalesworth

Flap and Swish~
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Customs are a cool idea. They were handled badly, not so much the equipment, which being randomly unlocked made it interesting due to how they aren't hard set in what they give besides the type of custom part. Custom Moves, on the other hand, should've at least been purchasable other than the ones you need to directly unlock. That said, if they cut 'em, they need to stay for Palutena and the Mii Fighters(none of these 4 characters are very likely to be cut, as they provide a lot of unique stuff for Smash in itself).

But yeah, Mii Fighters not being available for With Anyone is annoying, in which case, that can be fixed by at least having default options for them, like a total of 3 per, based upon height. Tall, Medium, Small. This at least fixes the issue of balance, but also gives options for everyone and also makes sure they're all reasonable designs(as the main reason for being removed from With Anyone is due to copyright-related issues as well as inappropriate Miis. Using something like Shaq himself in a random match online can gather complaints, as silly as it is. But it's still the reason behind it). With Friends is irrelevant to this.
 

SuperSmashStephen

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I can do that. I won't be able to do it right away (I'm on a train for the next hour or so), but send me your roster list through a private message or post it here (whichever you'd prefer), and I'll see what I can do.
I can do it!

Oh Megadoomer Megadoomer didn't see you there :p
Thanks you guys! I really appreciate it! I sent something to you both, so I guess just whoever gets to it first. Thanks again though. I made one at work the other day and posted it (almost got in trouble), but after I looked I saw how hastily I made it; and thought more about character selection and came home to write up a new mock up for a final Pre E3 roster. I also took recent rumors into account as I researched them more.

Anywho. Thanks! You guys are awesome.
 

TheLastJinjo

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Also compare to Mario, Zelda, and Pokémon series... When thenfour characters that tend to represent Smash Bros (cover art wise), Kirby series has the least character rep... So adding a fourth Kirby character actually makes sense.
Not really. People are still going to complain that Kirby doesn't have as much as Mario & Zelda, which is exactly what they say about Donkey Kong. So adding another newcomer to either of those IPs for that sake doesn't accomplish anything. And it's not a valid justification for adding Waddle Dee as a playable character
 
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Koopaul

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God I hope if Simon Belmont is in they'll use his classic design. They probably will seeing how Mega Man looks as close to his NES self as possible. But man, if he ends up looking like this and not like this, I'm going to be pretty mad.
 

SonicMario

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10 third party characters!? You do realize that Nintendo would have to license out all of those characters correct. These aren't handshake agreements. These companies are allowing Nintendo to use their IPs. This is why I've said they will cut a lot of them because Nintendo will have to re-licenses each and every one of them.

The reason I bring up the complaint was it was something Sakurai directly responded too (same with Fire Emblem which I think they wont add a new one). Its one of the reasons that I think you are going to see a scaling back. There is an article on Source Gaming with that and the Fire Emlbem thing. For a quick summary, here are the reasons why
  • Third party characters wont work in Nintendo's "Splatoon" moble like paid DLC does (and Nintendo will do the former as they are looking at engagement heavily)
  • There are very few strong choices left and there is no conscience on who should be included (constant that to Sonic, Megaman, Final Fantasy ect)
  • Change in management which may be more restrictive in what Sakurai can do (contrast to Iwata who let developers run wild)
  • The complaints I mentioned earlier.
So there is enough reason to think you are going to see less, not more.
Keep in mind when I mentioned 10. I meant most of that number or at just about half of them would be characters that were already in Smash 4. At the very least we should get 4 out of the 6 from Smash 4 (Sonic because Sega's remained a strong 3rd Party support for Nintendo with both new Sonic Games being released on the Switch, Megaman had the Legacy Collection and the upcoming Megaman 11, Pac-Man especially as it seems Bandai Namco was behind this game too based on a goof that spilled the beans about that fact from a former employee's tweet about Smash Switch, and Bayonetta for being the ballot winner plus Bayonetta being pretty much adopted by both Sega and Nintendo to keep her new games Nintendo Exclusive with Bayonetta 3 on the way)

I could see maybe 10 being a stretch if say Ryu and Cloud are indeed gone. But I do expect one new 3rd Party being announced this E3. Which if all the Smash 4 3rd Parties return that makes it 7 already. Easily making it wide open for an additional 3 in the DLC period of Smash 4 to bring that up to 10. If Ryu and/or Cloud are left behind for whatever reason, then maybe 8 (The 4 I mentioned that are likely to return + 1 new base game 3rd party + 3 DLC 3rd Party choices) is a more realistic probability. While Smash Switch's DLC could be a different approach to Smash 4's. We still got a good look at what Sakurai could desire for DLC choices. Which were either wanted veterans from past games, a promotional character for a newly released and/or upcoming game, plus additional 3rd parties and/or those who scored high in the ballot.
 

MamaLuigi123456

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Seeing quite a bit of hostility/passive aggression today...easy everybody...don't make Old Man Jones come back :troll:.

So here's something I've been thinking about today...let's say Smash Switch started by transferring the Wii U roster over and building balancing as they went with new characters.

Now, here's the catch. Let's say the game launches with the Wii U Roster, +10 characters. The E3 presentation then goes on to reveal that Smash Switch will follow the same routine as Splatoon and ARMS. By this I mean, the game will update once in awhile with new, free content in the game. This would include newcomers, Mii Fighter costumes, stages, etc. Every month or two, we'd get new characters for roughly a year.

What do you think?
I've been both hoping and predicting that's the case. Smash becoming a service would be a good way to keep the hype for it going.
 

Pazzo.

「Livin' On A Prayer」
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I'm going to give Miis 50/50 chances. On one hand Nintendo has been distancing themselves from everything Wii era... The Mii Creator isn't on the main menu anymore.

But Sakurai isn't "Nintendo Internal" so he might keep them anyway.
 

MBRedboy31

Smash Lord
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But they can be used online. Just not every mode. People really need to stop saying this. It's become such a bad meme it's ridiculous. They can be used With Friends, which is Online. With Anyone is just one of more than one Mode.

I do like customs, but that's fair. They have balance issues, and I think need improvement instead of cutting.
To add onto the online point, weren’t Miis allowed in some of the automatically scheduled official mini tournaments in Wii U’s online tournament mode? IIRC they were allowed in the ones that also allowed the use of customs. (How come nobody ever brings those up?)

Anyway, I hope Miis do return, with some tweaks to make them more balanced and more easily standardized for tournaments.
 

SmashChu

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Keep in mind when I mentioned 10. I meant most of that number or at just about half of them would be characters that were already in Smash 4. At the very least we should get 4 out of the 6 from Smash 4 (Sonic because Sega's remained a strong 3rd Party support for Nintendo with both new Sonic Games being released on the Switch, Megaman had the Legacy Collection and the upcoming Megaman 11, Pac-Man especially as it seems Bandai Namco was behind this game too based on a goof that spilled the beans about that fact from a former employee's tweet about Smash Switch, and Bayonetta for being the ballot winner plus Bayonetta being pretty much adopted by both Sega and Nintendo to keep her new games Nintendo Exclusive with Bayonetta 3 on the way)

I could see maybe 10 being a stretch if say Ryu and Cloud are indeed gone. But I do expect one new 3rd Party being announced this E3. Which if all the Smash 4 3rd Parties return that makes it 7 already. Easily making it wide open for an additional 3 in the DLC period of Smash 4 to bring that up to 10. If Ryu and/or Cloud are left behind for whatever reason, then maybe 8 (The 4 I mentioned that are likely to return + 1 new base game 3rd party + 3 DLC 3rd Party choices) is a more realistic probability. While Smash Switch's DLC could be a different approach to Smash 4's. We still got a good look at what Sakurai could desire for DLC choices. Which were either wanted veterans from past games, a promotional character for a newly released and/or upcoming game, plus additional 3rd parties and/or those who scored high in the ballot.
Even if the character was in a previous game, the license still needs to be renewed because it would only exist for that one game.
 

TheLastJinjo

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I'm going to give Miis 50/50 chances. On one hand Nintendo has been distancing themselves from everything Wii era... The Mii Creator isn't on the main menu anymore.

But Sakurai isn't "Nintendo Internal" so he might keep them anyway.
Yeah, Nintendo doesn't care about Miis anymore. That's why they are the main avatar of the player for Nintendo Switch. Because Nintendo's trying to distance themselves from Miis which they could have easily done by making new avatars or not having any.
 
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