Smash to the Future on hiatus for the summer!

[john!]

john, the issue with that is that you are still making things more difficult for good players who worked hard to do well in pools, because youve drawn a distinction between the 1 seeds who deserve it and those who dont. if tink and kels had gotten a 1 seed like they were supposed to (and they obviously could have considering the end results of the tournament) none of this would have happened. putting them on the opposite side from matt and darkrain would just make them have to play the people who worked hard to beat them in pools in 2nd round and ruin the tournament for people who didnt **** around

planning should be done pre-pools, after that just dont let the r bros play in second round, everything else is the players' responsibility to avoid by playing to the best of their ability

michigan would stomp on wisconsin in crews, i dont think wisconsin realizes how deep michigan is

if there are 4 pools, nobody from the same pool should play in the first 2 rounds of bracket. the guys who got 1st seed ahead of kels and tink are rewarded by not having to face a first seed from another pool during their first 2 rounds. that's the idea i'm going for here. maybe it would be easier to give examples if we could see the bracket.

if kels and tink **** around in pools, then they will have to play the first seed from another pool (matt or darkrain) in their first two rounds, and have a higher chance of getting sent to losers early.

and i know michigan is pretty stacked, but nobody respects WI potential* and we need to fix that

* except for a few IL people like chris, good doctor, etc. who have come to several of our tournaments and not taken a single one

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

I respect WI because I know Frootloop is the secretly the second best player in the world, behind Matt

 

[Tink]

i respect Wi, i just respect MI more...they are alot more deep in good players.

 

[BigD!!!]

john youre missing my point, i agree with all of that, but tink is saying the right thing to do is subjectively judge players and change things that should have been previously designed to make up for mistakes they made in pools

hes drawing a distinction between the quality of the different 2 seeds ("2 veryyy hard 2 seeds"); and separately the 1 seeds (as a 3/4 seed, he would be on the easy side of the bracket, which is also full of 1 and 2 seeds that he considers worse than the 1/2 seeds on his side)

i dont think we should make changes to brackets based on opinions of players when the data gathered that day contradicts it, if tink and kels had gotten first seeds like the good players they are then none of this would have happened

tink, getting a 2 seed always makes you play a 1 seed in second round, this tournament isnt unique in that regard. also, a 3 seed would generally be on the same side as the 2 seed from the same pool, so if you wanted to be on the other side you'd have needed a 4 seed, which would have put you against tom first round, who historically has frequently beaten you; hardly an easy bracket

 

[The Good Doctor]

ROFLL...u kidding me jeff?!?

first of all, the C thing....he implied it? you assumed it lolll...what thee?
second....you play each other at tournaments alot, so what? me and kels play EVER tournament....everyyyy one...should be be split up automatically? we never are...were never even given that consideration....even tho were teammates and play only with eachother/vro(sometimes rat) at smashfest as well.

theres no inconvenience, i had to go through oro, darkrain, and mattr in winners....how was that convenient to me? easy in any way?

big D, my 4th seed would be on the other side of the much easier bracket...thats how.

ppl are thinking that i changed the bracket to make other ppl screwed, but i left after 10 MINs of argueing and left darkrain to do it for me....if your mad things got changed, blame him...im sick of this "inconvenience to tink" posts, then it wasnt even me who got it changed to what it was.....ppl are ridic blaming me cause its easier that way...**** off.

You and Kels are split up, I have no idea what you are trying to say. Also if you read what I bolded, you would understand that even though he was refering to this tournament, that he also meant it in general.

You also can't have the top team on the same side of the bracket, or 2 brothers who play each other all the time on the same side of the bracket.

That was what he said, meaning that he would prevent it in any way possible, meaning I think he would change seeds if it came down to that. If you change the bracket it bias ways, you are going to screw someone. How is it fair to screw someone that earned his spot if it's not fair to play out the bracket after Tink and Kels ****ed around?

Also, it's not me assuming anything, it's me believing what he said. He didn't say anything like "I would prevent it if I didn't have to change seeds" he simply said,"No U cAnt Do thaT!"

Either you both need a lesson in understanding the English language, or you are just I dont even ****ing know.

 

[BIG C]

You and Kels are split up, I have no idea what you are trying to say. Also if you read what I bolded, you would understand that even though he was refering to this tournament, that he also meant it in general.



That was what he said, meaning that he would prevent it in any way possible, meaning I think he would change seeds if it came down to that. If you change the bracket it bias ways, you are going to screw someone. How is it fair to screw someone that earned his spot if it's not fair to play out the bracket after Tink and Kels ****ed around?

Also, it's not me assuming anything, it's me believing what he said. He didn't say anything like "I would prevent it if I didn't have to change seeds" he simply said,"No U cAnt Do thaT!"

Either you both need a lesson in understanding the English language, or you are just I dont even ****ing know.

You just didn't infer what I was saying because apparently you don't understand how to construct a bracket or something (which, if you don't you should not even be arguing in this matter). You can't change seeds and if you think that any T.O would ever just say a 1 seed was a 4 seed that is just a ludicrous notion, sir. So if someone needs a lesson in anything it would be you.

There is always another 1 seed, 2 seed, 3 seed, or 4 seed that can be switched with the corresponding 1 seed, 2 seed, 3 seed, or 4 seed. This is not a difficult thing to do unless there are conflicting pools in said switch.

 

[The Good Doctor]

You just didn't infer what I was saying because apparently you don't understand how to construct a bracket or something (which, if you don't you should not even be arguing in this matter). You can't change seeds and if you think that any T.O would ever just say a 1 seed was a 4 seed that is just a ludicrous notion, sir. So if someone needs a lesson in anything it would be you.

You weren't there, but seem to think you know everything that was said. Tink himself said that, and then promptly Sveet and criticized him for it. Also, it was going to be a 1 seed for a 2 seed so stop twisting my words around. They were talks of switching Duck and Darkrain after Darkrain argued that Duck won the pool, which he didnt.

Which there was, I think there was a possibility of MI to play 2nd round, and then Chris playing HIV 2nd round resulted in Chris changing the bracket.

 

[BIG C]

You weren't there, but seem to think you know everything that was said. Tink himself said that, and then promptly Sveet and criticized him for it. Also, it was going to be a 1 seed for a 2 seed so stop twisting my words around. They were talks of switching Duck and Darkrain after Darkrain argued that Duck won the pool, which he didnt.

I'm not twisting your words around you said nothing of the sort of what the seeds were. I have no idea what the seeds were and have not claimed to. I was using the ridiculous notion of switching a 1 seed to a 4 seed, or vice versa as an example, to make what you thought that I said out to be ridiculous, which is what it is. If anyone was twisting words it was you.

 

[Tink]

lolll...jeff your ridiculous....your points are hilarious...i enjoy reading your opinions on the matters. however bad they are....
i simply brought up an example to counter your...."im cool and a big man and can play ppl i usauly play once/mayyybe twice a month at tournaments" bul**** 0_0. i never complained about having on my side always lolll...your a funnnnyyy man.

edit: also, "You weren't there, but seem to think you know everything that was said. Tink himself said that, and then promptly Sveet and criticized him for it. Also, it was going to be a 1 seed for a 2 seed so stop twisting my words around. They were talks of switching Duck and Darkrain after Darkrain argued that Duck won the pool, which he didnt.

Which there was, I think there was a possibility of MI to play 2nd round, and then Chris playing HIV 2nd round resulted in Chris changing the bracket."

what are you even talking about? i never said switch at 1st seed for a 4th or any kind that wasnt the same...dude....stop putting words in my mouth...on top of that, i wasnt around for any of the bracket making your talking about in this post.....i was playing rat at the time to warmup...get the facts straight yoo.

 

[darkatma]

sanchaz, darkatma: I like how you guys judge without even knowing what happened. FYI: Duck beat Darkrain in pools, I beat Rat in pools, and HIV+ double eliminated ORLY. We brought one of our top players into town and didn't end up placing top 5, big deal.

Sorry, I said MI is still lagging behind Chicago. What is wrong with that statement in light of the results? The top 4 places are still Chicago.

I think you guys are good, I just recall much of MI thinking they were on the same level as chicago.

Edit: Juggleguy, I don't think you understand when I comment about Michigan, it's usually in response to a point. I think Michigan community has a ton of potential and is an extremely active region for smash, and the players are really cool, but any pretense about being equal to chicago should probably be scrapped as of now

Also GJ to James for beating Darkrain, you for beating rat, and HIV for beating ORLY... that still leaves kels, tink, matt, tom above everyone else

 

[Tink]

roflll...so much drama in this thread....i think its a jinxed thread....we need a new one!

 

[The Good Doctor]

lolll...jeff your ridiculous....your points are hilarious...i enjoy reading your opinions on the matters. however bad they are....
i simply brought up an example to counter your...."im cool and a big man and can play ppl i usauly play once/mayyybe twice a month at tournaments" bul**** 0_0. i never complained about having on my side always lolll...your a funnnnyyy man.

edit: also, "You weren't there, but seem to think you know everything that was said. Tink himself said that, and then promptly Sveet and criticized him for it. Also, it was going to be a 1 seed for a 2 seed so stop twisting my words around. They were talks of switching Duck and Darkrain after Darkrain argued that Duck won the pool, which he didnt.

Which there was, I think there was a possibility of MI to play 2nd round, and then Chris playing HIV 2nd round resulted in Chris changing the bracket."

what are you even talking about? i never said switch at 1st seed for a 4th or any kind that wasnt the same...dude....stop putting words in my mouth...on top of that, i wasnt around for any of the bracket making your talking about in this post.....i was playing rat at the time to warmup...get the facts straight yoo.

You were playing Al right next to us when it was brought up, and both Sveet and I said, "If you are going to change the seeds dont even waste time doing pools" and then you stopped talking.

@Big C
I was taking what you said more literally than you might have liked, but you still said it. I over reacted thinking you knew what Tink suggested because you are supporting his side.

 

[BIG C]

@Big C
I was taking what you said more literally than you might have liked, but you still said it. I over reacted thinking you knew what Tink suggested because you are supporting his side.

LOL it's cool, I'm not mad bro. It just seemed as if you were thinking I was. And I'm just theorizing with my T.O knowledge here I was going solely based off of the 1 and 2 seeds that were posted in the thread earlier.

 

[Tink]

roflll....idk if that even happend...but if i did shut up, you can guarentee it wasnt because of you and sveet lolll....id just come in from powering up..after 10 mins, i could care less what was up, and left to warm up 0_0.

also, once again, neverrr said to switch diff seeds 0_0....i said theres 3 diff groups of seeds you can use...why not use a diff pairing to make the bracket justtt as random and more balanced. that was my whole point that got shut down by everyone, and wasnt even disscussed.

 

[The Good Doctor]

LOL it's cool, I'm not mad bro. It just seemed as if you were thinking I was. And I'm just theorizing with my T.O knowledge here I was going solely based off of the 1 and 2 seeds that were posted in the thread earlier.

He also argued that we should treat both himself and Kels as 1 seeds anyway, so that was where my anger is coming from.

 

[Tink]

no i didnt omg...what the hell dude...never said that.

and i think anyone that was right by the computer can attest to that....never said or implied that i would like me and kels treated as first seeds lolll...its like you were the really high person there, not me 0_0.

 

[The Good Doctor]

roflll....idk if that even happend...but if i did shut up, you can guarentee it wasnt because of you and sveet lolll....id just come in from powering up..after 10 mins, i could care less what was up, and left to warm up 0_0.

also, once again, neverrr said to switch diff seeds 0_0....i said theres 3 diff groups of seeds you can use...why not use a diff pairing to make the bracket justtt as random and more balanced. that was my whole point that got shut down by everyone, and wasnt even disscussed.

It was, but it would have conflicted everything else. Like MI playing each other, team mates, people in the same pool, etc.

Let just stop ****ing arguing anyway, the tournament was **** anyway and I had a blast.

 

[Tink]

ill agree to stop arguing....but johns....and not the blue kind 0_0.

waiting for results thread to post my shout-outs....just real quick tho/

predictions

1: kels
2: tom
3: matt
4: darkrain
5: orly+rat
too chicken: tink
Reply With Quote

Exposed 0_0!

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

The bracket isnt random, tink. It goes

P1S1
P4S4
P3S3
P2S2

P4S1
P1S4
P2S3
P3S2

P2S1
P3S4
P1S3
P4S2

P3S1
P2S4
P4S3
P1S2

If you switch P1S2 with P3S2 suddenly you have those two players playing the first seed from their pool. If there was an issue with P1S2 then you should be trying to switch the pairings between pools. This is how you should think of the bracket. If you want a better seeding into bracket, make better pools, don't just throw people in pools haphazardly and mess with the bracket later.

 

[Tink]

loll...thats one way, yes sveet...thats 1-4/2-3 pools together...u know you can do 1-2/3-4 and 1-3/2-4 right? how is that soo hard? pool pairing is suppose to be done randomly, not the same 1/4, 2/3 every time. anytime ive run a tournament, weve had a random person come and pick random 1-4 numbers to match the pools(most recent at sakurai where rat pulled the random pool pairings) thatsss the way its suppose to be done.

 

[Juggleguy]

@ Good Doctor: I'm really sorry about your bracket at The Big House. Travis (Jungle) and I spent a ton of time on it for the exact purpose of separating regions and this is actually the first time I've noticed your bracket. I don't know how we missed it, but common sense should have told us to replace FrootLoop with a 2 seed from another region, like Idea or Tafokints. =\ my bad

@ john, Sveet: I disagree with the notion that everyone in the same quad of a 16-man bracket must be from different pools 100% of the time. You should have the right to avoid a second round pools rematch if the seeds play out like projected (ex: ORLY has the right to avoid a projected second round winners rematch vs Tink since they were a 1 seed and 2 seed). But you shouldn't have the right to say, hmmm if this 1 seed gets upset by this 4 seed then this 1 seed might have to do a pools rematch with this 3 seed in first round losers, so let's change it up. It's obviously possible and convenient to have everyone in the same quad come from different pools, in order to avoid any potential second round rematches, but that shouldn't be a requirement that is enforced at the cost of players from a same visiting region being forced to play (ex: Duck vs HIV+). It's more important to separate known matchup conflicts, while still going by the correct seeding from pool results, than to protect someone from potentially playing a pools rematch in the event of a 4 seed > 1 seed upset.

 

[The Good Doctor]

@Tink
I couldnt have been high because you didnt smoke me up like you said. =/
I'll bring some to SMYM and I'll match you or something.

Better?

@Juggle
You were TOing a bracket of like 48 players, I just didn't want to be "that guy" you know?
I was pretty salty, but I knew you weren't doing it for a biased reason.

 

[Tink]

LOLLLL.....i was actually going to bring that up, but there were farr to many ppl that were trying to free smoke heh....meneks didnt get out there either ://. sago/loosh did however heh/.

 

[BIG C]

The bracket isnt random, tink. It goes

P1S1
P4S4
P3S3
P2S2

P4S1
P1S4
P2S3
P3S2

P2S1
P3S4
P1S3
P4S2

P3S1
P2S4
P4S3
P1S2

If you switch P1S2 with P3S2 suddenly you have those two players playing the first seed from their pool. If there was an issue with P1S2 then you should be trying to switch the pairings between pools. This is how you should think of the bracket. If you want a better seeding into bracket, make better pools, don't just throw people in pools haphazardly and mess with the bracket later.

Yes, this is true, if the person made the bracket this way, but you can set it up anyway you want.

P1 S1
P2 S4
P4 S3
P3 S2

P2 S1
P1 S4
P4 S2
P3 S3

P3 S1
P4 S4
P2 S2
P1 S3

P4 S1
P3 S4
P1 S2
P2 S3

this is also a perfectly acceptable allocation of seeds, where no pools are intertwined or anything, and there are other ways to arrange it as well.

 

[Dekuschrub]

tink is starting to play really good again

just in time to blow it at SMYM v sanchaz

PERFECT

 

[Tink]

sounds about right...smym has been a fickleb itch to me in the past -_-.

 

[Quaz]

yeah I guess you might lose to Sanchaz after all.

Also I'd love to do a WI vs MI crew, but Im pretty sure WI would get demolished.

 

[john!]

P1S1
P4S4
P3S3
P2S2

P4S1
P1S4
P2S3
P3S2

P2S1
P3S4
P1S3
P4S2

P3S1
P2S4
P4S3
P1S2

P1 S1
P2 S4
P4 S3
P3 S2

P2 S1
P1 S4
P4 S2
P3 S3

P3 S1
P4 S4
P2 S2
P1 S3

P4 S1
P3 S4
P1 S2
P2 S3

using these tournaments as examples...

if kels got 2nd seed in pool 1, and tink got 2nd seed in pool 2, then a good TO would use sveet's bracket instead of big c's bracket, because it puts kels and tink on opposite sides of the bracket

Also I'd love to do a WI vs MI crew, but Im pretty sure WI would get demolished.

yeah yeah i know, but apparently MI thinks they're as good as chicago and we need to bring 'em down to size

 

[BIG C]

yes, john, they would I just threw random pools and seeds and wasn't trying to say anything, other than the fact that you can make a bracket in more than one way.

 

[Tink]

see, the prob is, that somehoww i get put into pool 4 all the time, while kels is in pool 1 :/...i dont see how u jump from kels 1, to me 4, but hey....it seems to happen everytime its random 0_0.

if me and kels both got 1st seeds, we wouldve been on the same bracket...orly/tom were and those were our 1 seeds.

 

[Moooose]

i like watching this lol
no one from michigan has said anything to the effect of "we're as good as chicago"
darkatma said that...and brought up this tournament as a counterexample, and i dont even know why he thinks we think that.

tldr
talking is for children
play me

 

[john!]

yes, john, they would I just threw random pools and seeds and wasn't trying to say anything, other than the fact that you can make a bracket in more than one way.

i agree just using your bracket as an example

i like watching this lol
no one from michigan has said anything to the effect of "we're as good as chicago"
darkatma said that...and brought up this tournament as a counterexample, and i dont even know why he thinks we think that.

don't mind me, i'm just looking for an excuse to talk mad **** lol

 

[Oro?!]

I think Tink/my quadrant was the most stacked quad in the bracket. Come at me.

 

[Tink]

it was a pretty staked quad heh....all killers in it.

 

[Juggleguy]

I've never heard anyone here compare MI to Chicago

darkatma is delusional

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

Of course, Big C, that is another way to do it! I'm just saying you can't just move people around without messing up the pools separation. I think finding the best pools to pair is a good idea.

@juggleguy, you can get away with making assumptions about seeds progressing sometimes, but every player has the right to not play someone from their pool no matter what happens. Had HIV lost I don't think the excuse, "sorry you got eliminated from the tournament by the same guy you played in pools, he was expected to win his match," would cut it.

I'm sorry, but if you travel to a tournament 4 deep and all of you make it into the 16 man bracket, you have to be prepared to play each other. Like I said before, the only way to guarantee you don't play someone in the first 2 rounds is either to be in the same pool as them or to get the same seed. I don't think you guys should have to play first round, but 2nd round can't be avoided.

 

[darkatma]

i like watching this lol
no one from michigan has said anything to the effect of "we're as good as chicago"
darkatma said that...and brought up this tournament as a counterexample, and i dont even know why he thinks we think that.

tldr
talking is for children
play me

you don't need a tl;dr for 3 lines of text.

chicago isnt that much better than michigan besides kels

Maybe 5 months ago isn't valid anymore because chicago got way better in that span?
Or maybe you're not counting Abu as part of MI rofl. I'm fairly sure there are more of these posts, but I don't have time to be doing extensive searches.

Also I would love to play you sometime moose. I'm fairly sure the only one from MI that has a chance of beating me is velynn though. (matchup advantage, experience, etc)

 

[ORLY]

i'm going to go get tacos

here're the resultsss

 

[_marth1_]

too many samuss here

what a broken character

oh and falco

 

[Kels88]

you don't need a tl;dr for 3 lines of text.



Maybe 5 months ago isn't valid anymore because chicago got way better in that span?
Or maybe you're not counting Abu as part of MI rofl. I'm fairly sure there are more of these posts, but I don't have time to be doing extensive searches.

Also I would love to play you sometime moose. I'm fairly sure the only one from MI that has a chance of beating me is velynn though. (matchup advantage, experience, etc)

lol Atma don't underestimate MI. They really are good. Also this thread is hilarious. i enjoy reading all this ****. In the end no one will ever beat me so does it really matter who gets what seed?