First off,
https://www.reddit.com/r/smashbros/comments/2upcs0/one_unit_and_the_melee_chant_at_apex/
This is relevant to the thread and everyone should read it. Scar makes valid points and some even relate to PM lower in reddit. Makes me glad Scar is stepping up for everyone on bad behavior and assumptions.
I'm not saying it has to be Melee, I'm saying that it's BS when D1 says how fun and exciting it is when Pacman vs Rosalina time out.
Also what design flaws do Melee and PM have? I'm not trying to be smarmy, I've just actually never heard anyone say that about fundamental design and would genuinely be interested in hearing your thoughts.
Also, I'm not asking commentators to trash the game. I'm expecting them to be honest. Lovage doesn't make it seem like it could go either way. He straight up said that PewPewU would trash Taj, which made it even more exciting when Taj took it to game five. I see commentators complain if Sheik chaingrabs Pikachu to a kill. MacD said how idiotic it was that Fox's Uair chains into itself and kills ridiculously early. We don't trash our game, but we don't put on a false face for the sake of the scene.
Melee has flaws, but Melee people aren't afraid of speaking the truth for the sake of OneUnit. Sm4sh fans know if they talk about their games weak points that a lot of fans would take in the flaws and strengths of every game, and participate in the game with the collectively agreed fewest flaws. And I'm not talking about Brawl.
I'll talk about Melee at the end but focus on the Smash 4 and commentator stuff first.
I think a lot of the stuff people wanted, like talking about specific players is harder than Melee. Melee has a stronger history and more players people recognize and want to see play each other. 1k MM in bracket? that was hype. But with Smash 4 it's still in the works and no real rivalries have been made to that regard. People did mention some BS stuff with Diddy and Sonic if I recall, mostly on Sonic's Throws and Diddy's Uair being dumb. Still I kind of see what you mean. There was some sugarcoating in that. But at the same time, it's hard to see what people were expecting, I mean what did people want Sky and co to say?
If the game has issues there is no problem admitting it, but then the last part I can't agree with, "and participate in the game with the collectively agreed fewest flaws" This is where you need to think of this more from a critic, film and art perspective. Not everyone is going to persevere the same mindset or likes and dislikes. What might seem as a good thing to one person might be something another hates like the plague. What one sees as no big deal another sees this as game destroying.
At what point do people accept and dismiss when the quality of each smash game is indeed good even objectively in each one, but to what appeals to who and what people like the most is different. I'm not even talking on a casual level, I mean even on a competitive level.
Shields? kind of flow chart combos? Rolls? Ledges? Defense? I have no issues with this and many others don't either.
Which leads into Melee and PM. Melee is my #2, since I decided to only practice two games over all of them unless I want to out of interest since I like training. But from an aspect of somethings I don't like about Melee.
L-Cancelling, this mechanic sucks and has no purpose other than to alienate players more without adding any really good depth, I know about shields and weird situations where you don't want to. See I've played Street Fighter and still do to a decent level ever since I came into the smash scene, canceling a move for a better version, less lag or stronger hits/other properties, had a cost and real decision making. It added depth while improving gameplay.
This doesn't at all. You will never want to not L-Cancel, if that is the case, it had no purpose in the grand scheme of the game. Tech skill is a part of a game, but it should have a point to exist and I do not think this deserves to exist.
Crouch Canceling cancelling hitstun. I'm ok with reduced knockback and damage, not people being punished for hitting their opponent. I know this requires timing and seeing an attack come, but it just seems to add a universal option to everyone I really don't think should exist outside of a counter if they want something like that. I don't think it is proper to punish being hit like this in such a way where the only real fitting punishment for this is Peach's Dsmash which is a bogus move in melee on it's own right.
Spacies design being repeated in PM with love taps. I don't the the Spacies are OP ban worthy, but damn they are really good in Melee at what they do. Be a jack of all trades and a master of a few. Their main weakness is how combo'd they get when you break their neutral, but others have the same weakness but worse by far yet don't get a recovery with no endlag when they land? The best projectiles in the game? Win ever camp war with lasers alone? Have shine which cover 6 or more other options and does so much on just one move? Yet PM puts them back in and instead of toning them down tries to buff everyone to their level.
It created a speed chase to which the PM Dev team tried to make characters compete with them, and they succeeded but only making it so anyone who couldn't fight a spacie was doomed to them as well. It lead to characters being bloated with good traits without clear and defined weaknesses like Smash 4 and tried to fit into it's design. And when they do tone it down, they still pull bias balancing by leaving them untouched for the most part pretty much putting it back to square one.
From there, I pretty much agreed to stick with Melee since I didn't want to deal with the bias balancing, readding of mechanics I don't like and I've been generally been not a fan of non PC mods.
That's where my problems are in a nutshell, and pretty much why I don't agree with the idea that people seem to think Melee is the best when really the thing that has appealed to me the most at this point is Smash 4. I have issues with both games and other smash titles, but the I still like them and the smash series on a whole is my favorite of all time.
), and the rush and combo strategy used by most in the time I played just felt boring to watch, imo. Really, it's exactly the fact it was fast that I didn't like in that game.
I honestly liked the Sm4sh top 8, and didn't care at all for the Meele one. I never really liked the way meele played, as I stated before.
