DraKmoN001
Smash Apprentice
- Joined
- Jun 16, 2003
- Messages
- 88
Ganon's dair is so insane =[ Even when spammed via thunderstorming that thing can still star KO very easily when I'm bounced off of the ground.
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Should Metaknight be Banned? **Take 2** (Post-podcast)
- Thread starter SamuraiPanda
- Start date
- Status
choknater
Smash Obsessed
lol, when is an mk gonna lose to a ganon?
HRNUT (Honey Roasted)
Smash Master
ask reflex...
adumbrodeus
Smash Legend
Yeah, it's one of his few good moves when autocanceled, it'd be worth exchanging pretty much any dair in the game.
Not often but, dair can still gimp Mk like 20%.
Zorrioh
Smash Rookie
Stop attacking MK, and learn to use other characters better, people.
B_AWAL
Smash Master
Thank YOU!!!!
People that lose to MK's are merely cowards that aren't willing to work to beat GOOD MK's!!!
Hell, do U kno how long it took me to beat good MK's? Months! Guess who I use..... SONIC, F***ING SONIC!!! Come on now!!! It's not that hard!!! MOST People that use MK don't know much besides constantly attack and they kno ur afraid of MK!!! So this is what U do... Go up to MK, kick him in his nuttz and take off his mask so U can have ur way with his mask!!! I die laughing at every1 who plays against me going "well ur gay with Sonic so I'm gonna go use MK" and I beat them worse than the other character that they were using!!! It's called having SKILL!!! Reflex wins tourneys with PT and C. Fal. POKEMON TRAINER AND CAPTAIN FALCON!!!! WTF!!!! Hell I've made it to top positions in tourneys after beating several weak A$$ MK's and Snakes. (but my friends Wario counters Sonic 2 badly :-/) Grow sum Nuttz and a brain so U can counter MK!!! Geez!
Anther
Smash Champion
By comparison I say no XD.
Niko_K
Smash Master
Completely agreed.
Now if MK had a JC'able Shine.......
Now if MK had a JC'able Shine.......
Justblaze647
Smash Lord
Niko... your my hero...
You give peach mains everywhere a good name...
You give peach mains everywhere a good name...
The Milk Monster
Smash Champion
lol.
Metaknight is just the better character out of most everyone, saying it's not that hard to beat Metaknight because you beat a supposed good Metaknight with Sonic is ignorant. Most people don't know how to use him? lol. Most people study their mains and know how to use them, no different with Metaknight. PT is a pretty decent character, he just takes such a weird mindset to use, you have to change your Metagame 3 times in the match, and change your playstyle. He doesn't place well with JUST Falcon, he uses other characters too.
SmashAura4
Smash Apprentice
As much as I hate MK, I can't bring myself to ban him. Yes, he has a huge advantage over almost the entire smash cast, but he's not unbeatable. Think of him as.........that final boss. And come on, don't you get that deep sense of satisfaction when you do beat him?
I just have too much respect for the guy to keep him out of the game.
I just have too much respect for the guy to keep him out of the game.
Sosuke
Smash Obsessed
- Joined
- Aug 3, 2007
- Messages
- 25,073
- Switch FC
- 8132-9932-4710
Why wouldn't everyone just pick the final boss then? o_o
You wouldn't pick Ganondorf from the Zelda games if he was playable?
Regarding respect, I played as MK in Kirby: Air Ride.
Brawl made me lose my respect for him. Kirby racing games are serious business.
You wouldn't pick Ganondorf from the Zelda games if he was playable?
Regarding respect, I played as MK in Kirby: Air Ride.
Brawl made me lose my respect for him. Kirby racing games are serious business.
The Milk Monster
Smash Champion
I wish Air Ride was like balanced.
It was so fun.
B_AWAL
Smash Master
1.) I never said that MK wasn't broken or wasn't the best character in the game. I'm just tired of every1's constant B****ing about how gay he is. Every1 talks about MK as if he is just 1 big unstoppable tank without any flaws at all. Granted, some1 can b extremely gay with him abusing up B and B ftw. He is still beatable. Hell, Snake is a BEAST and people don't B**** about him. My comment implied that MK is a great character, but if a new kid comes in picking MK, theres no reason to S*** ur pants.
Thus none of my comments were ignorant. However they were rude, I'll apologize 4 that much.
2.) Yes, I've beaten several "good" MK's. The point of this comment is to let every1 know that MK isn't unbeatable. M2K is a beast + he uses MK and thus he is the best. Although he admits himself that Azen is better than him. (Although now the DSF and NL are put into the picture, Hell it's any1's title now) And the main reason why I beat MK's is cuz they don't know how to fight Sonic. Hence Sonic is the king of mindgames(kind of :-/)
3.) Reflex is a hell of a Player....period. The point is that he uses low tier chars and stilll places well in tourneys. For example, he just placed 1st in a tourney in the GA on Nov 15th using PT and C.FAL only... (Granted he is the Best Wario EVER) The point of this was to show every1 that ANY1 can win with a bad character if they put their hearts into it and stop freakin out everytime they see a big bad MK waltzing into the neighborhood.
You know, its funny how the majority of the SBR which are god players voted on him not being banned, while most people here say that he should be. More proof that majority of the people that want him banned are scrubs that are too lazy to find a way to beat him.
Are you stupid like that in real life too?
I'm guessing you support the ban.
I actually don'tanymore.
I just find that your logical thinking ability seems to be below the level of Brinboy's on this subject.
MorphedChaos
Smash Lord
I dunno if I'm to hate or respect you Aeghrur, your like the nice Yuna. I'll say respect for now.
Well, I think I've fallen ill to the MK disease, hes now my secondary....
Well, I think I've fallen ill to the MK disease, hes now my secondary....
Meta Knight isn't Akuma with 80:20 match-ups and better across the board. He has a lot of 60:40 matches and even 55:45 matches.
Hell, Falco might even go neutral against the ball with legs.
The point is that Meta Knight is not a god that you need to try to lose with to actually lose. Is he better than most of the cast? Yes.
But does he make some of the lower-tier characters viable? Comically enough...yes. (Yoshi and Bowser both go 45:55, an effective neutral match sometimes considered the crown jewel of their games.)
And is he beatable? Yes.
I say not to ban him yet. If he remains dominant and overcentralizing, ban away, but not even 11 months since the release of Brawl can accurately portend what will happen.
For an example, look at Sheik in Melee: she dominated the tournament scene (and the metagame) early, but she's not even second-best now.
Hell, Falco might even go neutral against the ball with legs.
The point is that Meta Knight is not a god that you need to try to lose with to actually lose. Is he better than most of the cast? Yes.
But does he make some of the lower-tier characters viable? Comically enough...yes. (Yoshi and Bowser both go 45:55, an effective neutral match sometimes considered the crown jewel of their games.)
And is he beatable? Yes.
I say not to ban him yet. If he remains dominant and overcentralizing, ban away, but not even 11 months since the release of Brawl can accurately portend what will happen.
For an example, look at Sheik in Melee: she dominated the tournament scene (and the metagame) early, but she's not even second-best now.
It doesn't matter anyway. SBR won't ban MK for a good while so for now, the whiners have to deal with him.I actually don'tanymore.
I just find that your logical thinking ability seems to be below the level of Brinboy's on this subject.
MorphedChaos
Smash Lord
Ha, Alright, Your alright!Oh crap, I'm reaching that level. Dx
Better start being nicer.
As for MK... Eh, I've seen Reflex kill Desnu's MK with CAPTAIN FALCON, so I'm not so much for the ban anymore.. YET.
B_AWAL
Smash Master
Jus out of curiosity, whats ur logic? Whats wrong with fighting a banned character if U can beat him? Does it make the game less fun when U play against him(I could understand that much)? If it makes that game that less fun then Y? I'm just curious as to what ur arguement and I'm currently willing to lend an open ear and be fair...I actually don'tanymore.
I just find that your logical thinking ability seems to be below the level of Brinboy's on this subject.
nuro
Smash Lord
Hah, this is quite a funny little topic.
Have fun trying to integrate this. Most of the people who voted yes are probably just SWF browsers and have never been to a tournament before. Many people who voted yes just get off on the fact that Meta Knight is supposedly "over powered".
Most tournament hosts are people who invented the melee tournament community or people who follow "that" method.
You may think that it is threads like these that started the foundation for our melee community and this is the process we should take to establish the brawl foundation but that isn't quite right..
The fact of the matter is that unless this is integrated in a major MLG like tournament it is not going to be picked up. MLG tournaments set the foundation for the rules of Melee. MLG may not even pick up brawl so it is likely that this ban will not even happen.
People who run tournaments are going to continue to go on something that they know will work. Hosts will look back on the reliable rules that already exist and just use those.
Have fun trying to integrate this. Most of the people who voted yes are probably just SWF browsers and have never been to a tournament before. Many people who voted yes just get off on the fact that Meta Knight is supposedly "over powered".
Most tournament hosts are people who invented the melee tournament community or people who follow "that" method.
You may think that it is threads like these that started the foundation for our melee community and this is the process we should take to establish the brawl foundation but that isn't quite right..
The fact of the matter is that unless this is integrated in a major MLG like tournament it is not going to be picked up. MLG tournaments set the foundation for the rules of Melee. MLG may not even pick up brawl so it is likely that this ban will not even happen.
People who run tournaments are going to continue to go on something that they know will work. Hosts will look back on the reliable rules that already exist and just use those.
I'm nice... to people who deserve it. I tried the being nice to everyone shtick to a few months. The stupidity on SWF made me stupidity-intolerant.
It wasn't like being nice helped me drive my points across more to obvious idiots.
Justblaze647
Smash Lord
ssbbFICTION
Smash Champion
- Joined
- Mar 5, 2008
- Messages
- 2,535
MK isnt all that hard. My recent opinion on this has changed. and YES i have good mks around here. Some of the best actually
nuro
Smash Lord
...
I usually don't like to talk bad about people but whenever I see you posting you are pretty blind about somethings. It is kind of irritating.
xPeachKidx
Smash Rookie
i never liked meta spammer
popsofctown
Smash Champion
It's Reflex dude... it doesn't matter what character reflex used, what reflex's opponent was using, and it barely matters who Reflex's opponent was. It's Reflex.
Brinzy
Godfather of the Crimean Mafia
Learn to comprehend, and suddenly you realize that Yuna's actually a very good poster.
(Not a personal attack against you.)
Eddie G
Smash Hero
Honestly...it would be wonderful to just be able to walk up to some of the people in the community and punch their scrawny little selves in the mouth. This community is getting worse with each passing day.
On topic- I'm pro ban. I can handle the matchup just fine (I play Vidjo a lot for practice), but the character himself has just too many glaring advantages with little disadvantages that don't really do much to compensate for those huge advantages. Ok, he's light, and? He'll still combo/gimp/kill you at early percentages as well, regardless of good DI. Many of the anti-ban arguments are based on future predictions/promises/speculation of some mysterious and marvelous technique/tactic that would completely turn the tables on MK, when pro-ban has their data here and now, ready to present. The thing about MK is that he has NO bad matchups, Snake has a couple bad matchups, DDD has a couple, GnW has a couple, ROB has a couple, does MK? Nope...his lowest is 50/50. He has no predetermined disadvantages that really contribute to Smash being a game of options and counterpicks between the characters. He has the moves and potential to deal with any situation at nearly any time. As was said in the podcast, why pick up someone else and learn the strategies to beat MK or any other high tier character when you can just pick up MK and get him down faster to deal with those issues?
Call me a random scrub you elitist fools lurking out there, I'll gladly call transportation johns with no hesitation. I still know what I'm talking about.
On topic- I'm pro ban. I can handle the matchup just fine (I play Vidjo a lot for practice), but the character himself has just too many glaring advantages with little disadvantages that don't really do much to compensate for those huge advantages. Ok, he's light, and? He'll still combo/gimp/kill you at early percentages as well, regardless of good DI. Many of the anti-ban arguments are based on future predictions/promises/speculation of some mysterious and marvelous technique/tactic that would completely turn the tables on MK, when pro-ban has their data here and now, ready to present. The thing about MK is that he has NO bad matchups, Snake has a couple bad matchups, DDD has a couple, GnW has a couple, ROB has a couple, does MK? Nope...his lowest is 50/50. He has no predetermined disadvantages that really contribute to Smash being a game of options and counterpicks between the characters. He has the moves and potential to deal with any situation at nearly any time. As was said in the podcast, why pick up someone else and learn the strategies to beat MK or any other high tier character when you can just pick up MK and get him down faster to deal with those issues?
Call me a random scrub you elitist fools lurking out there, I'll gladly call transportation johns with no hesitation. I still know what I'm talking about.
risemix
Smash Apprentice
- Joined
- Dec 12, 2008
- Messages
- 88
I'm against the ban. Over time, people will learn to deal with the character. There was a time when Sheik was considered to be unbeatable in Melee in a similar way to MK now. In Melee, a Fox that made no mistakes won every time. The entire tournament metagame in melee revolved around four or five characters, and Fox was the best of all of them.
Overall balance is better in Brawl. Metaknight stands out because he's easy to pick up and play. He also has a very high skill ceiling despite not being very technical. That's a powerful combination without a doubt.
The same could be said for Fox; a friend of mine with no grasp of end-game techniques and couldn't even Wave Dash in training mode won $500 at a local tourney playing Fox vs. players who could do these things and were very good because Fox was just that powerful. It's the same kind of imbalance.
I guess the difference is that was near the end of Melee's "life" when the game's resources had been mostly tapped. But it didn't justify a character ban then and it definitely doesn't now.
Overall balance is better in Brawl. Metaknight stands out because he's easy to pick up and play. He also has a very high skill ceiling despite not being very technical. That's a powerful combination without a doubt.
The same could be said for Fox; a friend of mine with no grasp of end-game techniques and couldn't even Wave Dash in training mode won $500 at a local tourney playing Fox vs. players who could do these things and were very good because Fox was just that powerful. It's the same kind of imbalance.
I guess the difference is that was near the end of Melee's "life" when the game's resources had been mostly tapped. But it didn't justify a character ban then and it definitely doesn't now.
Eddie G
Smash Hero
The Sheik comparison is a little...much. The difference is that at that time in Melee, the community was still young and growing, which is what made Sheik seem so difficult at that time. The community now is already brimming with seasoned and experienced players, who have immediately been jumping on everything on this game regarding competitive play. Different things are being discovered FAST, however...MK still remains dominant by far.
Also, to address your message about Fox. A Melee Fox usually has to play very precisely and be a fine-tuned player overall to compete at high levels of play. Not to mention Fox can be comboed significantly by a good portion of the cast as well as gimped by a lot of characters. The two are not comparable, not at all.
Balance in Brawl? The credibility of your comment started slipping from there. Sorry.
Velox
Smash Ace
wait, people play brawl?
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