Should Metaknight be Banned? **Take 2** (Post-podcast)

[JesiahTEG]

Lol, gj SL. i think this "get better" thing should get shot down a little more just so we can bring it up as well when it's " your interpretation of data sucks cuz i'm better than you, so get better before your opinion can count."

God, seriously, elitism is the stupidest crap. -_-" It's as good as saying, I'm rich, your poor, so my opinions on the economy counts more than yours because I must know more because I'm rich. -_-"

Wow. I'm not being elitist. I have EXPERIENCE. I do a lot of research, talk with good players, go to tournaments, study my opponents, spend hours thinking of strategies.

If you're going to use that analogy, it's not like saying I'm rich you're poor my opinion counts more. It's more like an economist who spends hours studying the economy talk to a civilian that only follows along, and the civilian just disagreeing with everything the economist says. The economist obviously knows more than the civilian, because they have experience in the industry/business and converse with other economists who are very knowledgeable. Does that make sense?

 

[∫unk]

Wow. I'm not being elitist. I have EXPERIENCE. I do a lot of research, talk with good players, go to tournaments, study my opponents, spend hours thinking of strategies.

If you're going to use that analogy, it's not like saying I'm rich you're poor my opinion counts more. It's more like an economist who spends hours studying the economy talk to a civilian that only follows along, and the civilian just disagreeing with everything the economist says. The economist obviously knows more than the civilian, because they have experience in the industry/business and converse with other economists who are very knowledgeable. Does that make sense?

Don't take scrubs seriously.

 

[Browny]

you need to stop assuming everyone mains snake lol. its one thing to get better, but your options are pretty much limited to get better with snake if you really want to win vs a meta of same skill level (who knows how to play the matchup, i should add...)

 

[The Real Inferno]

Didn't one of the other SBR members say it is actually 2.3333 to 1 for an MK ban? Because if that was true I wonder why we keep rounding that fraction up when you should either round it down to the whole number of 2 due to being under .5 or round it to 2.3.

 

[JesiahTEG]

I'm not assuming everyone mains Snake. Lots of characters do good vs MK.

70% exactly want the ban, 30% don't.

 

[Turbo Ether]

you need to stop assuming everyone mains snake lol. its one thing to get better, but your options are pretty much limited to get better with snake if you really want to win vs a meta of same skill level (who knows how to play the matchup, i should add...)

Anyone playing to win, should be using a character that can succeed in the current meta game.

 

[Overswarm]

Wow. I'm not being elitist. I have EXPERIENCE. I do a lot of research, talk with good players, go to tournaments, study my opponents, spend hours thinking of strategies.

If you're going to use that analogy, it's not like saying I'm rich you're poor my opinion counts more. It's more like an economist who spends hours studying the economy talk to a civilian that only follows along, and the civilian just disagreeing with everything the economist says. The economist obviously knows more than the civilian, because they have experience in the industry/business and converse with other economists who are very knowledgeable. Does that make sense?

It's more like the economist says something about the price of houses being fine, the civilian disagrees because he sees everywhere they aren't.

Anyway.

If you want to say "get better" and not sound like a tool, say "There are options against Metaknight that aren't fully being taken advantage of right now, (such as.... and list options) and I truly believe that (other characters... list them) can go toe to toe with Metaknight because (reasons why...)".

Then it's an actual discussion, and not us facepalming ourselves because your argument is presented as a veiled ad hominem regardless of what your intent was.

 

[The Real Inferno]

At OH Snap, my pool only had one Meta Knight main he did not survive and he only earned like 4 points total or something. Also my pool had 7 Snakes o.O

 

[JesiahTEG]

It's more like the economist says something about the price of houses being fine, the civilian disagrees because he sees everywhere they aren't.

Anyway.

If you want to say "get better" and not sound like a tool, say "There are options against Metaknight that aren't fully being taken advantage of right now, (such as.... and list options) and I truly believe that (other characters... list them) can go toe to toe with Metaknight because (reasons why...)".

Then it's an actual discussion, and not us facepalming ourselves because your argument is presented as a veiled ad hominem regardless of what your intent was.

I've said that all so many times, it's hard to type it out over and over so I just say get better. I need to get better too, I'm not dissing everyone. Even M2K should get better. Everyone should. It's not an insult.

 

[The Real Inferno]

I thought Jesiah made a topic just for the sole purpose of helping people against MK if I do recall

 

[salaboB]

I've said that all so many times, it's hard to type it out over and over so I just say get better.

Not every post needs a direct response when it's already been answered -- the people really involved in the discussion know what the answer is, the rest can skim and find it if they care. If they don't care, why should you cater to them? (Or get insulting to them, same thing (This is not necessarily directed at you it's just related) -- just spamming up the thread and wasting everyone's time with posts that are better off ignored)

 

[Overswarm]

Not every post needs a direct response when it's already been answered -- the people really involved in the discussion know what the answer is, the rest can skim and find it if they care. If they don't care, why should you cater to them? (Or get insulting to them, same thing (This is not necessarily directed at you it's just related) -- just spamming up the thread and wasting everyone's time with posts that are better off ignored)

Or, link to your thread and say "Here's what I've got so far".

I repeated myself like a million times in these threads with coherent and logical posts and then kept getting ******** people saying "Mew2King says Snake counter Metaknight, so doesn't Metaknight have counters?".

Then I started messing with their heads and stopped caring about posting intelligently, because apparently everyone that plays smash has ADD and a few broken synapses.

 

[JesiahTEG]

Yeah you guys are right...Good stuff good stuff.

 

[ShadowLink84]

Lol, gj SL. i think this "get better" thing should get shot down a little more just so we can bring it up as well when it's " your interpretation of data sucks cuz i'm better than you, so get better before your opinion can count."

God, seriously, elitism is the stupidest crap. -_-" It's as good as saying, I'm rich, your poor, so my opinions on the economy counts more than yours because I must know more because I'm rich. -_-"

The thing is that he is not being elitist when he says "get better."
However, such an argument automatically presumes that the person in question is a low level player who is making an argument based on their poor skill level.

Especially when they say crap like "If you disagree with get better then you know nothing of high level play and don't deserve to post."

I disagree on one point(that was disproved long ago) so that automatically destroys everything I have said and automatically declares I am a bad player?

I may tolerate it from people who say stupid things so I generally ignore it, but I won't tolerate it from a people who have shown themselves to be knowledgeable but then say it anyway.

That behavior should not occur.
its one thing to say get better but for him to say everything else along with it? Sorry but no.

 

[Turbo Ether]

So people are still arguing over nothing.

 

[ShadowLink84]

So people are still arguing over nothing.

In a word.
yes.

 

[aeghrur]

Wow. I'm not being elitist. I have EXPERIENCE. I do a lot of research, talk with good players, go to tournaments, study my opponents, spend hours thinking of strategies.

If you're going to use that analogy, it's not like saying I'm rich you're poor my opinion counts more. It's more like an economist who spends hours studying the economy talk to a civilian that only follows along, and the civilian just disagreeing with everything the economist says. The economist obviously knows more than the civilian, because they have experience in the industry/business and converse with other economists who are very knowledgeable. Does that make sense?

Oh, sorry, I didn't mean you specifically. Sorry, lol, didn't make that clear. I meant others.
Point is, I wasn't trying to interrupt the argument as much as rather seeing future applications for it against the idea of elitism. My comment wasn't targeted much at either you or the argument.

 

[brinboy789]

In a word.
yes.

we have been takling about elitism for how many pages?

and since the SBR already made the decision, 2.33333333333:1, shouldnt this thread be over?

 

[salaboB]

and since the SBR already made the decision, 2.33333333333:1, shouldnt this thread be over?

People are still allowed to discuss things.

 

[XienZo]

we have been takling about elitism for how many pages?

and since the SBR already made the decision, 2.33333333333:1, shouldnt this thread be over?

No, we as the stubborn, adamant, bored members of SWF must continually argue over this until SBR changes their mind.

Or until we get banned, whichever comes first.

 

[brinboy789]

No, we as the stubborn, adamant, bored members of SWF must continually argue over this until SBR changes their mind.

Or until we get banned, whichever comes first.

nice

10char

 

[ShadowLink84]

we have been takling about elitism for how many pages?

and since the SBR already made the decision, 2.33333333333:1, shouldnt this thread be over?

No. Again he SBR is not the final word on anything. What they say is a recommendation not law.
Feel free to discuss it if you so choose.

 

[aeghrur]

I thought it was 75% to 25% considering it was a 3:1 ratio lol.

 

[brinboy789]

No. Again he SBR is not the final word on anything. What they say is a recommendation not law.
Feel free to discuss it if you so choose.

i know, but they should have the general decision, seeing as they are a collection of intelligent posters and/or amazing players...

I thought it was 75% to 25% considering it was a 3:1 ratio lol.

its more like 70:30

 

[salaboB]

i know, but they should have the general decision, seeing as they are a collection of intelligent posters and/or amazing players...

Tell you what: if you're tired of the thread, stop clicking on it.

Everyone's happy.

 

[aeghrur]

i know, but they should have the general decision, seeing as they are a collection of intelligent posters and/or amazing players...



its more like 70:30

3:1 means for every 3 people against, there's 1 person 4, um, if it's that type of ratio.
That means, there's 4 people in all, 3 against, 1 for. 3/4=75%, 1/4=25%.

 

[Tenki]

Have you seen the poll? I think you mean to say "most players."

40.61% is most?

also this is only indicative of smashboards

Not even.

Voters: 1097

>_>

Go see how many people voted in the original poll. There are alot of people who didn't vote this time around.

And seriously, don't call the argument annoying. It may be annoying to you since you've never been to a Brawl tourney and you're absolutely out of the loop and have no idea what you're talking about when it comes to high level smash play, but to other people that don't think it's annoying and take that advice to heart...Guess what. They win.

I thought he placed 5th at a tourney recently. Or maybe it wasn't counted.

9_9; I got a 1st on friday, but I don't think results/anything were posted on smashboards since it was hosted by a group at my college and I'm not sure if anyone hosting it has TO status on SWF.

 

[brinboy789]

3:1 means for every 3 people against, there's 1 person 4, um, if it's that type of ratio.
That means, there's 4 people in all, 3 against, 1 for. 3/4=75%, 1/4=25%.

it was 35:15, according to umbreons post. thats 70:30

 

[Lovely]

Did someone try the, "ban Meta Knight for a month" plan yet? Because I think this topic has lasted too long and needs to end sooner or later.

 

[Inui]

Ally won twice this month~

So has Bum, lol. DK ftw.

I only won one tournament? Oh, right, I got 2nd to Mew2King two times. x_x

 

[iMichael]

People are still crying about MetaKnight? This thread needs to hurry up and close......

 

[aeghrur]

it was 35:15, according to umbreons post. thats 70:30

okay, I was going off a different ratio lol.

 

[brinboy789]

So has Bum, lol. DK ftw.

I only won one tournament? Oh, right, I got 2nd to Mew2King two times. x_x

lol, no shame losing to M2K.

i'd actually be honored to play him and get 3 stocked, lol. maybe 2 if i got lucky?

and btw, i saw g-reg in a tourne ylist before, and i was wondering, since falcon sucks now, who does he use?

 

[Inui]

G-regulate is one of the best Snakes.

 

[MorpheusVGX]

There should be honor in competitive spirit...

I listened to all the podcast discussion, and I want to say a couple of things to this community:

First of all.. I am sad to see that there is no honor or manlyness in many players... counterpicking? analyzing and taking advantage of matchups? picking the best character to win? WTF?? So if you cannot defeat Metaknight.. will you use him? What kind of unmanly attitude is that? It is so pathetic ... so coward.. Is it that the competitive spirit of this community?

So many pro players are using metaknight and those very players want him banned.. others because they don't want to deal with it.. The truth is that what is to blame is they low attittude of changing to Metaknight and using counter picking as part of their strategy... Counter picking is not manly..
A true main strives to destroy every other character with his character...It is.. "so.. you are a great Metaknight.. I am a great Sheik and will kick your sorry azz" That's the fighting spirit!! Not going for counterpicking, counter staging, and ditto picking... Do you really feel good after winning with those lowly resources?

You may have as secondaries characters you like. But having secondaries to counter pick and overcome other characters? How low... so will you do anything to win... so you would become a pro player with no honor. How disgraceful.. I am so disappointed..

Can we have a tournament of honorable smashers? were people cannot change their characters or pick stages to win? A tournament were people enter with a main and gives everything they have to win against anyone?

 

[Nic64]

Can we have a tournament of honorable smashers? were people cannot change their characters or pick stages to win?

this will encourage more people to play meta knight

 

[¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯]

Why is this not closed now that the SBR has released their thoughts on the matter?

 

[brinboy789]

this will encourage more people to play meta knight

he said players keep thier "true" mains, or the char that they stick with. like ally: snake. co18: d3. you get the point.

 

[kr3wman]

I listened to all the podcast discussion, and I want to say a couple of things to this community:

First of all.. I am sad to see that there is no honor or manlyness in many players... counterpicking? analyzing and taking advantage of matchups? picking the best character to win? WTF?? So if you cannot defeat Metaknight.. will you use him? What kind of unmanly attitude is that? It is so pathetic ... so coward.. Is it that the competitive spirit of this community?

So many pro players are using metaknight and those very players want him banned.. others because they don't want to deal with it.. The truth is that what is to blame is they low attittude of changing to Metaknight and using counter picking as part of their strategy... Counter picking is not manly..
A true main strives to destroy every other character with his character...It is.. "so.. you are a great Metaknight.. I am a great Sheik and will kick your sorry azz" That's the fighting spirit!! Not going for counterpicking, counter staging, and ditto picking... Do you really feel good after winning with those lowly resources?

You may have as secondaries characters you like. But having secondaries to counter pick and overcome other characters? How low... so will you do anything to win... so you would become a pro player with no honor. How disgraceful.. I am so disappointed..

Can we have a tournament of honorable smashers? were people cannot change their characters or pick stages to win? A tournament were people enter with a main and gives everything they have to win against anyone?

Wanna play Fox against my Pikachu?

 

[Tenki]

Why is this not closed now that the SBR has released their thoughts on the matter?

People are still bothered by Metaknight, and individual TO's can still choose to ban or not ban Metaknight.