Shantae, the Half Genie Protector of Scuttle Town! (A Switch To A New WayForward)

[RetrogamerMax]

I think your referring to mighty no. 9

No I'm not, I'm referring to the Jammies Mode hints.

 

[SuperNintendoKid]

Hey, I haven't been around and have been busy until tonight. Just showing this off before bed. I finished it, but I couldn't really use the same style as the mural did. I enjoy WayForward's style anyway.
My Shantae Hip Bump

Also, I have uploaded what the hip bump may look like next to a certain princess...
Shantae Hip Bumping Daisy

Hope you all like it!

love it, yours is much more dynamic than my version

 

[Moderately obsessed]

Er, maybe not go into that considering they have a kid. It’s a loose explanation at best, but I found a comment on Gnoggin’s video on Ms. Pac-Man:

Spoiler

Ms. is pronounced 'miz'. It was introduced in the early 20th century as an alternative to "Miss" or "Mrs.", for when addressing a woman whose marital status is unknown to the speaker. Eventually it became common for women, especially early feminists, to prefer going by 'Ms.' because they didn't want to be defined as a person by whether they were married to a man or not. "Ms." also began to be used just as an abbreviation for "Miss", in which case, it's pronounced the same way as "Miss". But these days, whether a woman goes by Ms., Miss, or Mrs. is pretty much a matter of personal preference.

Buzzkill.
Nothing is going to stop me from creating the story that the ghosts succeeding in killing pacman and Ms. Pacman is on a revenge killing spree. Imagine the Punisher mixed with Ms. Pacman's logo. If anyone is good at drawing please make it.

 

[Deleted member]

Us right now:

(Replaces yellow popsicle with shantae ice cream treat)

 

[RetroMetalSonic]

Just dropping a doodle here that I made of our favorite half genie and zombie.

Wish we'd get some sort of news soon... These info droughts are killin' me.

(Dang it, the image isn't popping up for me... Eh, if it's not showing for everyone, here's a link. https://www.deviantart.com/jonretro/art/Shantae-and-Rotty-Doodle-768438597)

 

[Shinuto]

I know they like/retweet fan art and respond to questions from the fans, but what I said isn't dumb because that would be a giant false promise to the fans.

No. its you and others letting your own expectations get the better of you.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

No. its you and others letting your own expectations get the better of you.

Or could it be you and others being too loyal to a company no matter what.

 

[LaBeteNoire]

Or could it be you and others being too loyal to a company no matter what.

My two cents: Jammies mode does "seem" like a lot to go through for an assist trophy. But, none of it is a promise for anything. It was just a free mode given to thank the fans. People didn't pay for it and they didn't have to do anything to get it. It was just a gift, so it not being anything any one fan is expecting can't be seen as a betrayal on Wayforward's part.

I do think it is a reference, and tho it seems like too big a deal to be about an assist trophy, that is only my opinion. To the folks at WF, her being an assist trophy could have been a big enough deal to celebrate as such. In the end, we don't know what it worth how much to them, so we can't assume it could only be explainable one way.

 

[Wademan94]

Us right now:

(Replaces yellow popsicle with shantae ice cream treat)

Hopefully not from the same company that makes those Sonic ones

 

[Shinuto]

Okay can anyone post images? Im getting a server error every time I try.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

My two cents: Jammies mode does "seem" like a lot to go through for an assist trophy. But, none of it is a promise for anything. It was just a free mode given to thank the fans. People didn't pay for it and they didn't have to do anything to get it. It was just a gift, so it not being anything any one fan is expecting can't be seen as a betrayal on Wayforward's part.

I do think it is a reference, and tho it seems like too big a deal to be about an assist trophy, that is only my opinion. To the folks at WF, her being an assist trophy could have been a big enough deal to celebrate as such. In the end, we don't know what it worth how much to them, so we can't assume it could only be explainable one way.

I will just close this conversation and say it's Sakurai's decision in the end whether she becomes a playable character, a Assist Trophy or isn't in the game at all.

 

[Aurora Jenny]

There was an analysis of the Evidence for Shantae video done a couple of pages back. There was a good counterpoint about Jammies mode having been in development BEFORE the game was revealed. As much as I appreciate this, I've got to play devil's advocate here if only so we can eliminate all false conclusions. If I'm wrong, then there'll be a OBJECTION to cast (Which I don't mind). Now then...

Do you recall the article Sakurai wrote after the E3 reveal? IF I recall correctly... they kept a lid on things so tightly because not only did Sakurai want to keep it from getting out to the public, but to surprise the others at Nintendo who had no clue what was going on, so I'm not quite sure Wayforward themselves would have any idea that was going to happen. I think in any deals, they would only have to know that Sakurai wanted to use Shantae as a playable fighter or whatnot.

 

[Deleted member]

NO ALL OF YOU ARE WRONG don’t 2 cents anything no doubting I just want to be happy

 

[LaBeteNoire]

There was an analysis of the Evidence for Shantae video done a couple of pages back. There was a good counterpoint about Jammies mode having been in development BEFORE the game was revealed. As much as I appreciate this, I've got to play devil's advocate here if only so we can eliminate all false conclusions. If I'm wrong, then there'll be a OBJECTION to cast (Which I don't mind). Now then...

Do you recall the article Sakurai wrote after the E3 reveal? IF I recall correctly... they kept a lid on things so tightly because not only did Sakurai want to keep it from getting out to the public, but to surprise the others at Nintendo who had no clue what was going on, so I'm not quite sure Wayforward themselves would have any idea that was going to happen. I think in any deals, they would only have to know that Sakurai wanted to use Shantae as a playable fighter or whatnot.

I don't know with a third party, there would need to be contract singed and all sort of legal goings on. I suppose all contracts could have said "x to appear in as of now untitled Smash Bros game..." but I don't know how likely that would be.

Like, a lot of people at Nintendo would still be surprised since most of them wouldn't be in a position where they would need to be approached about any character being included, as no matter which division they worked at (Mario team, Zelda team, GameFreak) only the higher ups at that department would need to be involved to give the go ahead for any of their characters to be included.

I don't know, I'm no legal expert and I'm sure any rule i do know probably has countless work arounds. That aside tho, the plot and keywords in Jammies are an amazing coincidence if they are not a reference made with prior knowledge.

 

[MajestyIndigo]

There was an analysis of the Evidence for Shantae video done a couple of pages back. There was a good counterpoint about Jammies mode having been in development BEFORE the game was revealed. As much as I appreciate this, I've got to play devil's advocate here if only so we can eliminate all false conclusions. If I'm wrong, then there'll be a OBJECTION to cast (Which I don't mind). Now then...

Do you recall the article Sakurai wrote after the E3 reveal? IF I recall correctly... they kept a lid on things so tightly because not only did Sakurai want to keep it from getting out to the public, but to surprise the others at Nintendo who had no clue what was going on, so I'm not quite sure Wayforward themselves would have any idea that was going to happen. I think in any deals, they would only have to know that Sakurai wanted to use Shantae as a playable fighter or whatnot.

I agree with you. But what if they knew about the "everyone is here" line as well after all ?
For example, look at Daisy's renders poses for both Smash and Super Mario Party :

Spoiler: Daisy renders

They are the same and it's the first time Daisy held this pause in her renders ! Which means both teams kinda "worked together" in some ways and were aware of each other's work for some minor parts. Same thing could have been done to allow such characters as Rex&Pyra to be included in smash. A game does not need to be released for Sakurai and his teams to be aware of its content.

EDIT: I know the Daisy render thing is kinda irrelevant but I still find it interesting to point out as it proves that different teams can work together at some point. Oh woops the pictures don't even work lol

 

[Aurora Jenny]

I don't know with a third party, there would need to be contract singed and all sort of legal goings on. I suppose all contracts could have said "x to appear in as of now untitled Smash Bros game..." but I don't know how likely that would be.

Like, a lot of people at Nintendo would still be surprised since most of them wouldn't be in a position where they would need to be approached about any character being included, as no matter which division they worked at (Mario team, Zelda team, GameFreak) only the higher ups at that department would need to be involved to give the go ahead for any of their characters to be included.

I don't know, I'm no legal expert and I'm sure any rule i do know probably has countless work arounds. That aside tho, the plot and keywords in Jammies are an amazing coincidence if they are not a reference made with prior knowledge.

Agreed, and this is the kind of thing, y'all should bring up in response. If we keep arguing and finding the holes, eventually we might be lucky enough to arrive at a solid conclusion.

 

[meleebrawler]

I don't know with a third party, there would need to be contract singed and all sort of legal goings on. I suppose all contracts could have said "x to appear in as of now untitled Smash Bros game..." but I don't know how likely that would be.

Like, a lot of people at Nintendo would still be surprised since most of them wouldn't be in a position where they would need to be approached about any character being included, as no matter which division they worked at (Mario team, Zelda team, GameFreak) only the higher ups at that department would need to be involved to give the go ahead for any of their characters to be included.

I don't know, I'm no legal expert and I'm sure any rule i do know probably has countless work arounds. That aside tho, the plot and keywords in Jammies are an amazing coincidence if they are not a reference made with prior knowledge.

Plus, they may have started Jammies before they were aware of Shantae's inclusion, but could easily have adjusted dialogue after the fact.

 

[Aurora Jenny]

MajestyIndigo , meleebrawler HA! Good points to both of you!

 

[Dyllybirdy]

I agree with you. But what if they knew about the "everyone is here" line as well after all ?
For example, look at Daisy's renders poses for both Smash and Super Mario Party :

Spoiler: Daisy renders

They are the same and it's the first time Daisy held this pause in her renders ! Which means both teams kinda "worked together" in some ways and were aware of each other's work for some minor parts. Same thing could have been done to allow such characters as Rex&Pyra to be included in smash. A game does not need to be released for Sakurai and his teams to be aware of its content.


EDIT: I know the Daisy render thing is kinda irrelevant but I still find it interesting to point out as it proves that different teams can work together at some point.

Wow, the Smash Daisy looks much cuter than the Mario Party one.

 

[Teeb147]

Plus, they may have started Jammies before they were aware of Shantae's inclusion, but could easily have adjusted dialogue after the fact.

That's the most likely explanation, and it's the one I assumed at first. They'd already planned a jammies mode, but nothing says they can't tack on the dialogue after. It's most likely not 'because' of any inclusion they made the mode, thought might've just got inspired to add something afterwards. Or could be coincidence ;p

As for something I brought up yesterday, I do wonder if they planned the 'Risky's Ship' bit beforehand, or if they'd changed it due to a possible stage inclusion.

 

[LaBeteNoire]

Plus, they may have started Jammies before they were aware of Shantae's inclusion, but could easily have adjusted dialogue after the fact.

I doubt that. the roster was finalized around 2015, so they already had gotten all the rights, or had decided who they wanted by then and shortly after went about securing all the rights.

Jammies mode wouldn't have been in the works that far back as they would still be working on the modes that we already knew were coming. Jammies probably was being conceived as they were finishing up the last few other modes and worked on after all other updates had been released.

I'd say the only way they wouldn't have known about Shantae being in Ultimate while making Jammies mode, then finding out in the middle with enough time to make alterations for a reference would be if she wasn;t in the base roster and then selected for DLC. In that case it's possible that they would approach WF that late about wanting her in.

The problem with that tho, is that WF has been publicly avoiding the subject of Shantae in Smash since the ballot ended, so if they weren't approached around that time to have her in Ultimate, then all that silence would have been for no particular reason.

 

[meleebrawler]

This is the most likely explanation, and it's the one I assumed at first. They'd already probably planned a jammies mode, but nothing says they can't tack on the dialogue after. It's definitely not 'because' of any inclusion they made the mode, they just got inspired to add something afterwards.

As for something I brought up yesterday, I do wonder if they planned the 'Risky's Ship' bit beforehand, or if they'd change it due to a stage inclusion.

I just don't see the ship being a stage when Wind Waker Pirate Ship has that covered. Not even K. Rool could get his Gangplank Galleon in over it. Plus it's hardly the most iconic locale in Shantae compared to her lighthouse or Scuttle Town.

As the setting of a reveal, however (especially with the rash of pirate characters we've been getting recently)...

 

[Teeb147]

I just don't see the ship being a stage when Wind Waker Pirate Ship has that covered. Not even K. Rool could get his Gangplank Galleon in over it.

As the setting of a reveal, however (especially with the rash of pirate characters we've been getting recently)...

Or an adventure mode / boss mode part

 

[Dyllybirdy]

Or an adventure mode / boss mode part

Nah, the story mode should include a section where you reenact the Run Run Rottytops stage, as any of the characters.

Imagine Pichu trying to carry Rottytops through The Nightmare Woods?

 

[Teeb147]

I doubt that. the roster was finalized around 2015, so they already had gotten all the rights, or had decided who they wanted by then and shortly after went about securing all the rights.

Jammies mode wouldn't have been in the works that far back as they would still be working on the modes that we already knew were coming. Jammies probably was being conceived as they were finishing up the last few other modes and worked on after all other updates had been released.

I'd say the only way they wouldn't have known about Shantae being in Ultimate while making Jammies mode, then finding out in the middle with enough time to make alterations for a reference would be if she wasn;t in the base roster and then selected for DLC. In that case it's possible that they would approach WF that late about wanting her in.

The problem with that tho, is that WF has been publicly avoiding the subject of Shantae in Smash since the ballot ended, so if they weren't approached around that time to have her in Ultimate, then all that silence would have been for no particular reason.

Someone said it was shown off before. But maybe they just saw her in her jammies and thought it was the mode? when it was just.. her in jammies

"This DLC is the second to not be a part of the initial Kickstarter Campaign's stretch goals (the first being Hardcore Mode). "
So at the very least, it wasnt outwardly planned.

 

[MajestyIndigo]

Wow, the Smash Daisy looks much cuter than the Mario Party one.

As one might expect, I Love Daisy either way but her hair on the Super Mario Party render looks a bit off to me

 

[LaBeteNoire]

Someone said it was shown off before. But maybe they just saw her in her jammies and thought it was the mode? when it was just.. her in jammies

"This DLC is the second to not be a part of the initial Kickstarter Campaign's stretch goals (the first being Hardcore Mode). "
So at the very least, it wasnt outwardly planned.

I'm sure they had an idea for a Jammies mode, but I doubt they put any development into it before the Smash roster was finalized in 2015. they still had other promised modes they had to work on and finish. So if she is in the base Roster, I'm sure they knew about it long before they had a chance to start development on Jammies mode.

Of course I could be wrong, but it just makes sense that they would want to prioritize all the modes they promised their backers before working on an extra thing they weren't obligated to include.

 

[Deleted member]

I'm sure they had an idea for a Jammies mode, but I doubt they put any development into it before the Smash roster was finalized in 2015. they still had other promised modes they had to work on and finish. So if she is in the base Roster, I'm sure they knew about it long before they had a chance to start development on Jammies mode.

Of course I could be wrong, but it just makes sense that they would want to prioritize all the modes they promised their backers before working on an extra thing they weren't obligated to include.

Oh no

 

[LaBeteNoire]

Oh no

calm down and read what I have been writing carefully. Nothing I'm saying counts against Shantae. I am saying that Jammies mode has to be a reference to Smash because there is no way they wouldn't have known she was getting in by the time they were programming it. We don't have anything to worry about.

 

[Shinuto]

Hey guys look what I've been working on. Its for a potential reveal of Shantae in Smash!

 

[meleebrawler]

Nah, the story mode should include a section where you reenact the Run Run Rottytops stage, as any of the characters.

Imagine Pichu trying to carry Rottytops through The Nightmare Woods?

Has to be one of the Mario Bros., for Mario it'd be a nice twist on all the times he's done that for Peach, and for Luigi it'd be cruel irony that for once he has a "damsel" of his own to rescue and carry to safety, and yet it's through a trail of horror.

 

[Teeb147]

I'm sure they had an idea for a Jammies mode, but I doubt they put any development into it before the Smash roster was finalized in 2015. they still had other promised modes they had to work on and finish. So if she is in the base Roster, I'm sure they knew about it long before they had a chance to start development on Jammies mode.

Of course I could be wrong, but it just makes sense that they would want to prioritize all the modes they promised their backers before working on an extra thing they weren't obligated to include.

I think that's a good base, as a likely case.

What I'd add though is that I dont believe it's all fully planned before. In example for Greninja it was said (quoting):
“You know, hey, here’s our… our Pokemon slot,” and then they said “let’s make sure that we have that and then we will fill it in.”

So there could also be a thing where it's a certain slot planned for a fighter, like an 'indie slot' or something and then they try to fill it for the roster.
The news site I checked also said:
"Another interesting note to draw from these comments are that Sakurai mentions that there are still “characters being looked at,” which could mean his team is still hard at work trying to keep additional fighters from being left on the cutting room floor. It could also mean that some characters may have been shifted to DLC as a result of time restraints. "

So it's possible certain characters are saved for later anyway, and then put as dlc if they dont have time for them, depending on how develoment is going.
Anything's possible

 

[LaBeteNoire]

I think that's a good base, as a likely case.

What I'd add though is that I dont believe it's all fully planned before. In example for Greninja it was said:
“You know, hey, here’s our… our Pokemon slot,” and then they said “let’s make sure that we have that and then we will fill it in.”

So there could also be a thing were it's a certain slot planned for a fighter, like an 'indie slot' or something and then they try to fill it for the roster. The news site I checked also said:
"Another interesting note to draw from these comments are that Sakurai mentions that there are still “characters being looked at,” which could mean his team is still hard at work trying to keep additional fighters from being left on the cutting room floor. It could also mean that some characters may have been shifted to DLC as a result of time restraints. "

So it's possible certain characters are saved for later anyway, and then put ias dlc if they dont have time for them, depending on how develoment is going.
Anything's possible

True, we will probably never completely know how things went down with the process of completing the roster this time around and anything truly is possible.

 

[Deleted member]

Hey guys look what I've been working on. Its for a potential reveal of Shantae in Smash!View attachment 170014

Sakurai: The indie rep is a loyal, hard-working title.
SK: [Thinking] Yes.
Sakurai: The obvious choice for the roster.
SK: [Thinking] He's right.
Sakurai: A name you all know. It starts with an S.
SK: [Thinking] That's me.
Sakurai: Please welcome our first indie rep...Shantae! [A banner falls with Shantae's face on it]
SK: Yes! Yeah! [Dances around then he shakes Shantae's hand] Oh, better luck next time, buddy. [Cheers as he runs to the stage] Yeah! All right!

I can still see sakurai puting in a playable indie rep and he choose wisely

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

I don't want to be that guy, but I would have preferred if the final HGH bonus DLC was one of those scrapped extra chapters.

It actually becomes somewhat of the opposite with him (well, except for when you game over in the original Punch-Out!!). He comes to the realization that he's done pretty much everything he wanted to do as boxer (get the champion's belt and successfully defend it from anyone who might take it), but he doesn't want to just quit while he's at the top of his game either, so he imposes a three-loss retirement condition as a sign to retire while he's ahead, instead of doing so in shame years down the line. So if anything, his struggle comes from the fact he's too good rather than not thinking himself good enough.

Fair enough there.

So…? Unless cowardice doesn't count.

 

[candysell]

I don't know if you guys have seen this yet but I'll post it anyway.

https://youtu.be/_yFAjPxHySA

 

[Deleted member]

I don't know if you guys have seen this yet but I'll post it anyway.

https://youtu.be/_yFAjPxHySA

I tried showing this on ifunny but then i started getting the hate

 

[Inoj]

I would love that!

Potential heresy: I really enjoyed 1/2 Genie Hero but found it to be disappointingly short. Hopefully a Smash presence would give them the funding and demand they need to make a longer sequel.

I agree that basegame HGH was a bit short. Couldn't pass the opportunity to post that video.

 

[ジョルノ ジョフラミンゴ]

I think that's a good base, as a likely case.

What I'd add though is that I dont believe it's all fully planned before. In example for Greninja it was said (quoting):
“You know, hey, here’s our… our Pokemon slot,” and then they said “let’s make sure that we have that and then we will fill it in.”

So there could also be a thing where it's a certain slot planned for a fighter, like an 'indie slot' or something and then they try to fill it for the roster.
The news site I checked also said:
"Another interesting note to draw from these comments are that Sakurai mentions that there are still “characters being looked at,” which could mean his team is still hard at work trying to keep additional fighters from being left on the cutting room floor. It could also mean that some characters may have been shifted to DLC as a result of time restraints. "

So it's possible certain characters are saved for later anyway, and then put as dlc if they dont have time for them, depending on how develoment is going.
Anything's possible

For literally any other game I'd say this is possible but Sakurai is the type of dev who would sooner delay the game rather than shave some of it off to charge people extra money for. I get that a lot of people are already saying "WE SHOULD BE PAYING $80 FOR THIS GAME, WE'RE NOT WORTHY OF ALL THIS CONTENT!!" but if there's one thing I feel we can all trust Sakurai on is that the man doesn't release unfinished games and the only way I see any characters getting thrown in the dlc bucket for lack of dev time is if they're being released for free when they're finished.

 

[Teeb147]

For literally any other game I'd say this is possible but Sakurai is the type of dev who would sooner delay the game rather than shave some of it off to charge people extra money for. I get that a lot of people are already saying "WE SHOULD BE PAYING $80 FOR THIS GAME, WE'RE NOT WORTHY OF ALL THIS CONTENT!!" but if there's one thing I feel we can all trust Sakurai on is that the man doesn't release unfinished games and the only way I see any characters getting thrown in the dlc bucket for lack of dev time is if they're being released for free when they're finished.

Who said anything about an unfinished game? Adding more characters is just extra content. I'm pretty sure he'd like to get as many in as possible, but has to balance and gauge how much time and resources there are left before release, to see which ones can make it as base roster or will end up as dlc.