Official Seizon Senryaku: Marth General

[Locuan]

US locals are crazy, and I thought those with 70-80 entrants was a lot. I'm used to tournaments that are at most 40 entrants.

 

[LoreLes]

Aha, well SUPPOSED to be a local I should say. Turned to out to be crazy.

 

[Shaya]

anywho, true pivoting is the ****.

It's so drastically easier than it was in Brawl. True pivot away into shield is kinda game changing. I finally have a new power shielding technique for this game that's even better than CROUCHING. Holy ****.

 

[JingleJangleJamil]

Yeah I believe that perfect pivoting will change the meta-game, though I am not even going to TRY to do that on my 3DS, because I don't want to destroy it.

 

[Locuan]

Wait, true pivot = perfect pivot?

 

[Quickhero]

Wait, true pivot = perfect pivot?

My guess is that. Also, perfect pivoting is just consistent pivoting right? I'm just pivoting consistently and it seems to work just fine. I'm managing to do many of the punishes as explained in Smash Corner.

 

[Locuan]

My guess is that. Also, perfect pivoting is just consistent pivoting right? I'm just pivoting consistently and it seems to work just fine. I'm managing to do many of the punishes as explained in Smash Corner.

There are some errors in this video in terms of testing. And the wavedashing and perfect pivot comparison which is just... I do not like comparing them both because while both are spacing tools they still have many differences. Anyways this is perfect pivoting:

Spoiler

 

[Emblem Lord]

It is a must for Marth. Easy spacing tool and really helps clench the tippers in trap situations and for whiff punishes.

 

[Locuan]

Indeed. It also helps to get out of dangerous situations where you end up in grab range against your opponents. It's something that does need a lot of practice to get used to though. It has a tricky timing.

 

[Quickhero]

@ Locuan Yeah that was the video I was referring to haha. I think I got it right, but I'm just sure, especially how he explains it. It's just pivoting almost throughout the entire match. The only time I really would think of not to pivot is when you've knocked someone far off the stage and you need the extra speed given by just dashing.

 

[Shaya]

For me right now, it's the tool I'm going to work on to beat rolls.
And aerials. And everyone.

It's about half the length of the standard roll but I'm assuming it's a sub 10 frame action (or close to).
I'm also really excited to implement it into my Falco... true pivot down tilt on Falco is worth salivating over.

But THE CRAZY power shields I've gotten that almost look like the games bugging out with true pivot shielding. Probably to do with the inputs likely being beneficial for shield shuffling and stuff.

 

[KillLock]

@ Emblem Lord http://smashboards.com/threads/dec-20-21-get-wrapped-edmonton-ab-canada.383942/

 

[JingleJangleJamil]

I am convinced that Lucina players just hate Marth players at this point. I just played against a Lucina player, here is what happened: I started the match with a taunt because I always do that when I get in a ditto or clone match, and they get in a cheap shot right away,but I end up winning the match in the end. In the next match I could tell they were salty, because when they beat me they just left right away. Why the hell do Lucina players always act like they have to prove something to Marth players? You don't see Falcon players act like that to Ganon, you don't see Mario act like that to Doc, etc., so why do so many Lucina players have so much hate for Marth players?

 

[Ekans647]

I am convinced that Lucina players just hate Marth players at this point. I just played against a Lucina player, here is what happened: I started the match with a taunt because I always do that when I get in a ditto or clone match, and they get in a cheap shot right away,but I end up winning the match in the end. In the next match I could tell they were salty, because when they beat me they just left right away. Why the hell do Lucina players always act like they have to prove something to Marth players? You don't see Falcon players act like that to Ganon, you don't see Mario act like that to Doc, etc., so why do so many Lucina players have so much hate for Marth players?

Was the person you were facing named Ekans? If so, then you were facing me.

 

[LoreLes]

I am convinced that Lucina players just hate Marth players at this point. I just played against a Lucina player, here is what happened: I started the match with a taunt because I always do that when I get in a ditto or clone match, and they get in a cheap shot right away,but I end up winning the match in the end. In the next match I could tell they were salty, because when they beat me they just left right away. Why the hell do Lucina players always act like they have to prove something to Marth players? You don't see Falcon players act like that to Ganon, you don't see Mario act like that to Doc, etc., so why do so many Lucina players have so much hate for Marth players?

You know whenever I play against people who get salty easily, they always switch to Lucina and proceed to get destroyed. They don't even know how to use that character but I feel like they really want to prove something.

 

[JingleJangleJamil]

Was the person you were facing named Ekans? If so, then you were facing me.

I don't remember the name. I only have the 3DS version, and since most people have the wii u version now it probably wasn't you.

 

[Sneether]

Merry Christmas my fellow marth mains, if Anyone is up for Games this week I am down on either Wii U or 3DS

Have a Sm4shing Christmas everyone !

 

[Ekans647]

I don't remember the name. I only have the 3DS version, and since most people have the wii u version now it probably wasn't you.

I only have the 3DS version as well. My opponent's name was oomowow. What that you?

 

[JingleJangleJamil]

Have a Sm4shing Christmas everyone !

Absolutely SMASHING!

I only have the 3DS version as well. My opponent's name was oomowow. What that you?

No that was not me then. I just use Jamil as my tag in Sm4sh 3DS.

 

[Ekans647]

Absolutely SMASHING!



No that was not me then. I just use Jamil as my tag in Sm4sh 3DS.

Ok. My opponent was playing as Marth and I was playing Lucina. My opponent taunted I went in for the Fair. He still won and after a few more matches, I switched to Ike and won. I then immediately left because I needed to use the bathroom.

 

[JingleJangleJamil]

Ok. My opponent was playing as Marth and I was playing Lucina. My opponent taunted I went in for the Fair. He still won and after a few more matches, I switched to Ike and won. I then immediately left because I needed to use the bathroom.

Yeah the person I faced only played against me in two matches and they only used Lucina.

 

[Locuan]

Happy Holidays everyone!

So two things:

1. I decided to start building my Amiibo collection and actually found a Marth figurine!
2. While I got destroyed in all but one games, I won one match against the best player here in PR when he used Shiek. Dair spike to seal it off too. But I got destroyed all the other times though. I have a lot to learn still but anyways, feels good to get at least one match under my belt against him.

 

[roymustang1990-]

Merry Christmas my fellow marth mains, if Anyone is up for Games this week I am down on either Wii U or 3DS

Have a Sm4shing Christmas everyone !

Merry Christmas!

I'll be happy to play a couple of rounds with you this week, or anyone here for that matter. ^^

 

[Shaya]

Merry Christmas friends.

Perfect pivots are AMAZING.

 

[Emblem Lord]

Shaya test all of Lucinas moves with it. It was confirmed that Lucinas utilt slides better than Marths. Test other moves go go go.

Merry Christmas brother.

 

[Shaya]

Was it now?

Why would I play Lucina when I can wave dash backward into forward smash again.
But yeah, it's cool she seems to get a slide out of it. I'm almost understanding why Falco's lasers are so "bad" now when he can slide forwards/backwards with that ****, wouldn't be surprised if there's jab lock set ups for it.

Since Monday I magically woke up to being able to perfect pivot with a good amount of consistency (it's for some unknown reason easier to do in Smash4 than it is in Brawl or any other smash). Two days later and I'm sitting down with 3 others on Big Battlefield practising it on 99 stocks for some half an hour+ and have retreating pivots down to about 95%, while going forwards is a tad bit harder (turning around is a 1 frame animation, hence that extra leeway is the difference between 95% consistency and like 30% right now :<) and then the lab time was over and I just got out of 5 hours of legitimately the best matches I've had in Smash 4 thus far.

I kinda need to keep a notepad and pen around while I'm playing with all of this though, there's just too many things to remember in terms of movement options in this game... Perfect pivots are gelling it altogether. The FLUBS of perfect pivots have interesting nuances to them as well (you'll stand still in your dash animation and have a long time to input a dash attack, dash grab, jump etc and you can roll if in danger), M2K is hyping that up more than perfect pivots for some reason, but **** him, he'll learn the truth tomorrow.

Then there's the dash turn around sliding attacks/movements as well and then it all just hit me at the same time...

Oh and this exists too

 

[Loachy]

Oh and this exists too

What the

 

[Locuan]

Im still only able to perform perfect pivoting around 30% efficiency. However, perfect pivoting grabs are interesting. I have yet to test it on opponents but it seems legit. But yea Lucina's Utilit retains more momentum than Marth for some reason.

 

[Quickhero]

Merry Christmas everyone! I hope you all enjoy today. (As well as the rest to come)

I think perfect pivoting is amazing. From the ability to just instantly move+up smash to punish heavy smash attacks, to unexpectedly hitting a side smash, perfect pivoting is such an amazing mechanic, and thanks to it's also pretty easy. (Only needs practice and nothing else) Although my only complaint is that if I don't attack or anything I have a slight moment of delay thanks to the stop animation but I think that the delay is so small it doesn't really matter and is still metagame changing. :3 Marth benefitted the most from perfect pivoting, however. I can definitely see him rise up in tiers once more people utilize this.

I'm almost understanding why Falco's lasers are so "bad" now when he can slide forwards/backwards with that ****, wouldn't be surprised if there's jab lock set ups for it.

Not to go completely off-topic, but by "bad" did you mean as in Falco has bad lazers or now the lazers are pretty good with perfect pivoting? Also, by he, did you mean Marth or Falco?

 

[kj22]

For me right now, it's the tool I'm going to work on to beat rolls.
And aerials. And everyone.

It's about half the length of the standard roll but I'm assuming it's a sub 10 frame action (or close to).
I'm also really excited to implement it into my Falco... true pivot down tilt on Falco is worth salivating over.

But THE CRAZY power shields I've gotten that almost look like the games bugging out with true pivot shielding. Probably to do with the inputs likely being beneficial for shield shuffling and stuff.

I feel like being able to true pivot consistently would work wonders in the brawl mk mu. Pivot jab to keep him out.

You're finding it easier to PS with perfect pivoting? Similar to the crouching PS thing from brawl?

Pivot ftilts to stuff approaches. I really liked the pivot fsmash here: http://youtu.be/zJ_ZzAvSFis?t=10m27s

That is soooo perfect for ledge trap opportunities. Stand at that distance and just watch your opponent think they're safe. Little do they know...

Also shieldbreaker has surprising range. Especially when used to cover normal getups/get up attacks, it hits surprisingly far. Actually it might even cover the roll option.

 

[Bullys]

Merry Christmas all, hope everyone had a great one.

Finally got to make the transition from Marth 3DS to Marth Wii U and people werent lying when they talk about how much of a difference the C-Stick makes.

Now its a case of just retraining (or actually straight training) my muscle memory for the gamecube controller, had a nightmare sorting it out (I couldnt get a official adapter, so have a 3rd party one that plugs into a Wii chuck, but my Wii Chuck didnt sync on Xmas day, so took a lot of running around and finding out stores in the UK just dont stock Wii controllers at all. Thankfull the Wiichuck decided to work).

 

[Rich Homie Quan]

Happy holidays fam wishing you all the best.

 

[Phantom High]

wish i can prefect pivot but i don't want you destroy my circle pad in the process

 

[Random4811]

So, I found THIS:

in my sub box. (shout out to fellow members of the Etika World Network)
What do you guys think? If my eyes are not decieving me, I think I can see the little roll sparkle. So my first thought was roll canceled Breverse'd SB. I dont know japanese, but given the connontations of the Cstick + NB (neutral B) I can only assume the Japanese man/woman displaying this is B-sticking. So, is a roll canceled B-reverse SB possible while B-sticking? Am I reading waaay too deep into this? (probably)

 

[Locuan]

@ Random4811 I was made aware of that yesterday in the Q/A thread. If you want you can go to that thread and see my mind going nuts trying to understand it.

 

[Random4811]

@ Random4811 I was made aware of that yesterday in the Q/A thread. If you want you can go to that thread and see my mind going nuts trying to understand it.

Thanks! Also, I completely forgot who you were without your Lisse avatar. You can tell I've been busy, I guess. ^^; I had the same issue with Shaya for a bit, until I learned the name. It just takes me a bit.

So, another thing. This is just for the lot of you. I've got my hands on the Wii U version now, but I'm having a /very/ hard time playing at the same skill level I did on the 3DS. I cant even do my Foxtrot -> Fsmash's consistently right now. Did any of you have a hard time adjusting? (btdubs, don't have any GC adapters. Got myself a pro controller. I like the layout, but Im gonna switch to GCC asap.)

 

[Locuan]

There's the possibility of the video being fake according to the person who posted it on the Q/A thread. So don't take my crazy mind games seriously.

I originally did have trouble adjusting, the c-stick was the thing that gave me the most difficulty to adjust to though.

 

[Random4811]

There's the possibility of the video being fake according to the person who posted it on the Q/A thread. So don't take my crazy mind games seriously.

I originally did have trouble adjusting, the c-stick was the thing that gave me the most difficulty to adjust to though.

I came to that conclusion like 20 minutes before coming here, and I reviewed the footage extensively. Other than a slight shift in camera position itself, which is like, expected for potato phone videos, I do not see anything indicating the video being fake. I'll continue to review the footage at a later time.

 

[Locuan]

I came to that conclusion like 20 minutes before coming here, and I reviewed the footage extensively. Other than a slight shift in camera position itself, which is like, expected for potato phone videos, I do not see anything indicating the video being fake. I'll continue to review the footage at a later time.

I believe it can be real as well but for now I won't lose sleep over this. I quite literally did yesterday trying to recreate the effect without success. But, I really do not know what to think of it at this moment.

 

[Satan-]

So, I found THIS:

in my sub box. (shout out to fellow members of the Etika World Network)
What do you guys think? If my eyes are not decieving me, I think I can see the little roll sparkle. So my first thought was roll canceled Breverse'd SB. I dont know japanese, but given the connontations of the Cstick + NB (neutral B) I can only assume the Japanese man/woman displaying this is B-sticking. So, is a roll canceled B-reverse SB possible while B-sticking? Am I reading waaay too deep into this? (probably)

@ Random4811 I was made aware of that yesterday in the Q/A thread. If you want you can go to that thread and see my mind going nuts trying to understand it.

What it is is a perfect pivot followed by a b reversed SB. With a little practice, you can fi something similar, at least I could.

EDIT: Looking back at the video, I don't think that's a perfect pivot since it was done out of full dash. I don't think you can p-pivot out of full dash, or at least I haven't tried it yet. Still, you can do a p-pivot b reverse SB to do something similar.