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Roster Discussion Thread (Closed)

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ChronoBound

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One thing that's interesting about the pool of newcomers is that it's both the easiest and hardest game to speculate on. Deciding on which newcomers have a fair shot seems to be generally agreed on, yet deciding on which one will actually get in is hard to say.
Yeah, I agree with this.

On a sidenote, the Xenoblade fans on GameFAQs are really thrilled about Shulk being one of the most wanted characters in Japan.

One Xenoblade fan said that he tweeted the wife of the Xenoblade's director about Shulk's inclusion in Smash 4, and that he said her response was "fingers crossed ;) "

I take it with a grain of salt, but its interesting to think that even Xenoblade's development team wants to see Shulk in the most popular fighting series out there.
 

Ridley_Prime

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Well today certainly has been interesting. Too much to comment on due to having to finish a psychology paper.

One thing I will say is this; I understand the pessimism entirely in regards to the roster, but I'd rather not go down this route myself. The thing is, disappointment is inevitable in life and can easily happen with at least one area in SSB4. Whenever it's gameplay changes, character roster, stage selection, etc, even expectations that seems too easy to meet may not get there.

I'm not expecting 60+ characters, but I have no intentions to hide from potential disappointment.
While I agree with where you're coming from, I think people are mainly just wanting to avoid having the same level of disappointment with SSB4 that they had with Brawl, than they are trying to avoid disappointment altogether. I mean no one in the right mind would expect SSB4 to have zero disappointment in all areas, let alone the roster because the roster can't please everyone no matter what they do with it, but if people don't keep their expectations as overly high out of hype with like the roster or something as they did with Brawl, then they shouldn't be disappointed with SSB4's roster when it's revealed to the extent that they were with Brawl's on the day the leaked 35 roster for it was proven true. etc, etc.

Yeah, I agree with this.

On a sidenote, the Xenoblade fans on GameFAQs are really thrilled about Shulk being one of the most wanted characters in Japan.

One Xenoblade fan said that he tweeted the wife of the Xenoblade's director about Shulk's inclusion in Smash 4, and that she has her response was "fingers crossed ;) "

I take it with a grain of salt, but its interesting to think that even Xenoblade's development team wants to see Shulk in the most popular fighting series out there.
Interesting indeed, if not admirable, though I wouldn't have too high hopes for Shulk just based off of that either, but I know many would, or will.
 

Croph

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That was hyperbole. Although, there are always a few people out there that probably want something like that.
Phew. Yeah, I kinda thought so. XD Although, I really do hope there's no cuts. If it's necessary, I hope it's like 1-2. 3 max. But jeez, just thinking about the idea of half the roster...it's a bit extreme...

Shulk seems like a really cool guy. It's a shame I haven't played Xenoblade.
 

Diddy Kong

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Ike met Sakurai's criteria, but in a... different way. He said that even though he looks light weighted, he wanted to make Ike a heavy weight. A slow powerhouse. Which doesn't really reflect his character, at least in Path of Radiance (even though he's easily amongst the strongest characters).

And yeah, it's hard to argue Fire Emblem characters, as they easily could go any way with them. That being said, if Roy would've got in Brawl, we'd had 3 reps. That'd be easier to envision having 4 characters in SSB4, but I'm still not sure if we can expect 4. Sure Chrom and Roy are both feasable choices, but I can't see Fire Emblem getting 4 characters while say, DKC and Kirby will leave with 3 characters. If they give Fire Emblem 4 characters, surely DKC, Kirby, Mario and Zelda at least will have one newcomer, in DKC's case maybe two.
 

yani

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One Xenoblade fan said that he tweeted the wife of the Xenoblade's director about Shulk's inclusion in Smash 4, and that he said her response was "fingers crossed ;) "

I take it with a grain of salt, but its interesting to think that even Xenoblade's development team wants to see Shulk in the most popular fighting series out there.
While I haven't seen that tweet myself, I have seen one of her thanking Operation Rainfall, so it is definitely possible that she tweeted that too.
which is awesome!!
 

Starphoenix

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One Xenoblade fan said that he tweeted the wife of the Xenoblade's director about Shulk's inclusion in Smash 4, and that he said her response was "fingers crossed ;) "

I take it with a grain of salt, but its interesting to think that even Xenoblade's development team wants to see Shulk in the most popular fighting series out there.
Entirely possible, almost every game director would love their character to be in Super Smash Bros.
 

Aipom

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What does everyone think about the chances for veterans returning? Melee saw the loss of 5 (Mewtwo, Roy, Dr. Mario, Pichu & Young Link). I think Brawl's roster seems more likely to keep more characters than Melee.

I hear people throwing around Lucario, ROB, Ike and Toon Link alot. I also hear Lucas, Falco, Wolf, the third parties, and even Jigglypuff thrown around a bit.

I think ROB and Lucas are safe. Same with Lucario, since I feel more Pokemon reps will be added in addition to him. Jigglypuff should be safe being a 64 veteran (even though I prefer Meowth, it probably wont happen & if it would somehow, it'd just be an addition). I feel as though there will be some third parties (even though I don't really like them), but who they will be.... I have no clue. Ike is difficult, I liked his moveset (which is rare since I don't like/stink at most swordsmen), but could be replacable.

Falco is a Melee veteran, Wolf was in Brawl. All StarFox characters were fairly similar to each other. I think all 3 will return if it gets no new reps, but if Krystal gets added, Falco might be in jeopardy........ However, this could still easily be refuted since Falco wouldn't be that challenging to add.
 

Gamingboy

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What does everyone think about the chances for veterans returning? Melee saw the loss of 5 (Mewtwo, Roy, Dr. Mario, Pichu & Young Link). I think Brawl's roster seems more likely to keep more characters than Melee.

I hear people throwing around Lucario, ROB, Ike and Toon Link alot. I also hear Lucas, Falco, Wolf, the third parties, and even Jigglypuff thrown around a bit.
And don't forget, Young Link was de-facto still in as Toon Link.

I'd have to guess that if Krystal were added, it'd be Wolf in jeopardy, but that's just me.

I think the inclusion of Sonic and Snake will depend 99% on Konami and Sega. I see no reason why Nintendo would want to remove them since they have good relationships with Konami (at least on the personal levels) and especially Sega (you still get a rumor every year or two that Nintendo might buy Sega to "save" it from it's doom), so I think the only way they'd go away is if Konami or Sega doesn't want them in.
 

Aipom

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And don't forget, Young Link was de-facto still in as Toon Link.

I'd have to guess that if Krystal were added, it'd be Wolf in jeopardy, but that's just me
I initially thought that as well, but then I thought of the whole hero, villain, female trio concept & felt as though Falco would be out of the loop. Honestly, I like Falco's moveset and handling the best out of the three
 
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Hey Chrono, on GameFaqs you mentioned that if Mewtwo and Roy were not counted as "true" Newcomers, then Black Shadow and Starfy would be in the Top 10.

While this is interesting to me, I remember you said that characters after the "B Tier" were hard to list. Did those two somehow get easier by pushing out ahead of the rest? Would they be B Tier as well, or part of a new C Tier?
 

~ Valkyrie ~

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Yuui: Something I thought up as well. I'd be interested on seeing the C-tier as well. Maybe would include those longshots but who knows. At least Starfy would be there.
 

3Bismyname

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I hear people throwing around Lucario, ROB, Ike and Toon Link alot. I also hear Lucas, Falco, Wolf, the third parties, and even Jigglypuff thrown around a bit.

I think ROB and Lucas are safe. Same with Lucario, since I feel more Pokemon reps will be added in addition to him. Jigglypuff should be safe being a 64 veteran (even though I prefer Meowth, it probably wont happen & if it would somehow, it'd just be an addition). I feel as though there will be some third parties (even though I don't really like them), but who they will be.... I have no clue. Ike is difficult, I liked his moveset (which is rare since I don't like/stink at most swordsmen), but could be replacable.

Falco is a Melee veteran, Wolf was in Brawl. All StarFox characters were fairly similar to each other. I think all 3 will return if it gets no new reps, but if Krystal gets added, Falco might be in jeopardy........ However, this could still easily be refuted since Falco wouldn't be that challenging to add.

i feel like the only people who want characters like ROB or Jigglypuff gone are really just those people who suck with them. same reason a lot of people try to advocate dropping Ice Climbers. but like you said Jigglypuff seems pretty safe and ROB is a very unique addition to the roster that i don't see leaving either.

as for characters like Toon Link, Lucas and the Starfox characters thats also the whole dislike of "clones." though i could see Toon Link dropping unless a new toon Zelda game comes out soon. and yeah I could only see Wolf or Falco being dropped in place of Krystal but otherwise i wouldnt see a new addition or dropping in any other way. Lucas just needs to be changed up a little imo but i would like him to stay.

I would like Lucario to stay myself but he is the highest on my "might get dropped" list.
 

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i feel like the only people who want characters like ROB or Jigglypuff gone are really just those people who suck with them. same reason a lot of people try to advocate dropping Ice Climbers. but like you said Jigglypuff seems pretty safe and ROB is a very unique addition to the roster that i don't see leaving either.
There is a small contingent of people left over from the early Brawl days that dislike R.O.B because they believe he prevented Ridley, or some other popular character from becoming playable. It was irrational then, and I think today people still harbor seeds of malice against one of my favorite characters. :(

There is a reason this image was created:

 

3Bismyname

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There is a small contingent of people left over from the early Brawl days that dislike R.O.B because they believe he prevented Ridley, or some other popular character from becoming playable. It was irrational then, and I think today people still harbor seeds of malice against one of my favorite characters. :(

There is a reason this image was created:

thats dumb and really doesn't make that much sense. I don't really like R.O.B that much but i see his value. but the picture is kinda funny :awesome:
 

FlareHabanero

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This reminds me of those threads on 4chan that focused on varies antics of a ROB and a Gameboy. It was apparently popular enough to make people like ROB more; even changing peoples thoughts of him in Brawl.
 

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R.O.B was bit of an oddball to me. Maybe because how prominent he was as an enemy in Subspace. On the other hand I didn't really know who to want after hearing about him and he's not really that bad. One of the more unique characters Smash has thrown in.

He's though pretty forgotten in the fandom as I can see.
 

ChronoBound

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Hey Chrono, on GameFaqs you mentioned that if Mewtwo and Roy were not counted as "true" Newcomers, then Black Shadow and Starfy would be in the Top 10.

While this is interesting to me, I remember you said that characters after the "B Tier" were hard to list. Did those two somehow get easier by pushing out ahead of the rest? Would they be B Tier as well, or part of a new C Tier?
They would be at the top of a C-tier.

Also, why the hell is Pac-Man so popular at GameFAQs? It seems they are just supporting him just for the sake of having a Namco character.
 

Robert of Normandy

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Also, why the hell is Pac-Man so popular at GameFAQs? It seems they are just supporting him just for the sake of having a Namco character.
That seems to be the reason most(but not all) of Pacman's supporters support him. People assume there's going to be a Namco rep, and I guess Pacman is just the default for that or something.
 

ChronoBound

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That seems to be the reason most(but not all) of Pacman's supporters support him. People assume there's going to be a Namco rep, and I guess Pacman is just the default for that or something.
Pac-Man is really bland. Heck, Namco could not even think of what do with the guy with the guy in Tekken except throw him in a mech.

On a side note, I always wondered why there are so much Roy haters on the GameFAQs Smash Bros. Wii U board. My theory is because there is still a very large contingent of the "we need a female lord" crowd over there, and they think Roy is the character standing in the way of said hypothetical female lord.

Heck, there is some idiot thinking a Marth-look-alike (Lucina) is going to get in despite me saying that she is not even within the Top 15 most wanted characters in Japan, and half of her supporters in Japan don't think she would work with having her own slot due to how similar she is to Marth (the only other character that received that kind of sentiment is Dr. Mario).
 

8-peacock-8

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That seems to be the reason most(but not all) of Pacman's supporters support him. People assume there's going to be a Namco rep, and I guess Pacman is just the default for that or something.
Well he is their mascot. So it's understandable why some people would immediately gravitate towards him. (I support him because he is one of my favorite fictional characters. So i at least have a reason. I still don't expect a Namco rep though.)
 

Gamingboy

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I support Pac-Man because he's Pac-Man. One of my favorite parts of SSB is that it has the greatest video game characters fighting each other. I think it's safe to say that Pac-Man is one of the greatest video game characters.

I'm talking iconicness. I mean, yeah, I'm sure that the "Tales of", "Tekken" and Soul characters might be better fighters in the game itself, but they are nowhere near as iconic or famous as Pac-Man, the first great video game character.
 

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On a side note, I always wondered why there are so much Roy haters on the GameFAQs Smash Bros. Wii U board. My theory is because there is still a very large contingent of the "we need a female lord" crowd over there, and they think Roy is the character standing in the way of said hypothetical female lord.

Heck, there is some idiot thinking a Marth-look-alike (Lucina) is going to get in despite me saying that she is not even within the Top 15 most wanted characters in Japan, and half of her supporters in Japan don't think she would work with having her own slot due to how similar she is to Marth (the only other character that received that kind of sentiment is Dr. Mario).
I always figured the Roy hate was coming from 2 camps:

1. People who played FE6 and didn't like him as a character.
2. Clone haters.

I would hazard that second group is probably the bigger group, and responsible for more of the hate. But I don't spend any time on GameFAQs, so I wouldn't know.
 

~ Valkyrie ~

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I used to support Pac-Man but I started to see that him being included isn't really done to him in much faithful way. He pilots a mech in SF X Tekken.

I had made a support topic where I stated out of Pacman's support being just a bandwagon. Most of people slammed me for this in there but I'm quite confused on why Pacman's support just went WAY UP after Namdai was announced to be working on this game. IGN also seems to be "hypothising" for Pacman to be in Smash due them doing some long history article about Namco's contribution to Nintendo:

IMO at the end, Pacman wouldn't feel very faithfully thought addition from the developers. If iconism is all that there is to run him for a playable spot, then that tells me bandwagon people are just looking towards him with rose-tinted eyes and might not really think he might come out as generic and not really being based on his appearances in his own games. I mean, most of his games after the classic aren't too widely heard off compared to likes of Mario or Sonic.

Now for ones who like him as a character and all, you can support him. But I'm wondering why he garners now so much support when he seems uninteresting to say the least.
 

SmashChu

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As most of us have already discussed, Sakurai does not have many characters to choose from left. While some people like to think that Sakurai is the type who is going to cut half of the roster just so he can add more characters, the truth is he likes adding more variety. There is enough evidence out there to show us that King DDD was cut in Melee for the sake of having more characters (Ganondorf, Young Link, Roy, Pichu, Dr. Mario, Falco). Waddle Dee is a safe gamble for Sakurai that has more upside then down. Think about it, very few people I've met actually dislike him as a character, the only real complaint is that he is a generic enemy. or that Kirby as a series is finished. Still, most people seem to think he can translate to Super Smash Bros well; and he can. Sakurai cares as much about variety in playstyle as much as he does the individual character itself. Waddle Dee has that. Heck, Kirby's Return to Dreamland already gives Sakurai a lot to work with, especially when you consider that a majority of the attacks for Metaknight and King DDD in that game came from Brawl. There is already a starting point for Sakurai to work with.

Yes, popularity could be a factor, but at this point it is not as though adding Waddle Dee is going to prevent someone important. The only thing that might hinder a Waddle Dee appearance is Sakurai fearing showing favoritism, but since he hasn't handled the Kirby series in a while, I think his (and his team) focus will be on the Kid Icarus content, where as HAL will probably spear head (no pun intended) much of the Kirby content from Epic Yarn/Return to Dreamland.

tl;dr version: Sakurai likes to gamble, and Waddle Dee is the safest gamble with the best upside. Brings a fresh moveset, from a popular series, from a recent game that outperformed Skyward Sword in Japan, and is a likeable character. My gut tells me Sakurai will make this move.
Kind of makes sense.

I did decide to check the sales of the game. it did well in Japan. 12th best selling Kirby game. It also seemed to do the best in Japan. I did notice that Epic Yarn did do better than it. For some reason, it's the second best selling Kirby game in Europe. Weird. Still, it did OK. I'm still not 100% sold on the character idea, but it could happen. He's popular enough in Japan. More power to him.
 

~ Valkyrie ~

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Bandanna Dee would be a solid addition. He'd complete the Kirby 4 for me IMO. Besides love the sound of a spear user. Though at times makes me think Caeda would fit this bill too but I don't think she'll be featured.

8-Peacock: Well that's all going for him. There's not much people thinking over what he'd be like in Smash. Besides if every VG mascot made it in Smash, this game might just feel like Mugen in this aspect. This is a Nintendo-crossover so we could use more characters having some good history with Nintendo (Snake is an exception though...)

The best moveset for Pacman would be the ones from his 3D-adventures. (Pacman World-titles) Maybe if those were given I'd be willing to give Pacster a chance. (-l`l-)
 

Robert of Normandy

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Bandanna Dee would be a solid addition. He'd complete the Kirby 4 for me IMO. Besides love the sound of a spear user.
I loves me some Bandana Dee, and him being in Smash would be badass. But I don't think he's terribly likely.

Though at times makes me think Caeda would fit this bill too bu
bu? bu what?

Caeda wouldn't be a lance user - while she could fight unmounted, she could only use lances when mounted*, and I don't think they'd include a mounted character.

*I haven't played FE11/12, so please let me know if this has changed.
 
D

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They would be at the top of a C-tier.

Also, why the hell is Pac-Man so popular at GameFAQs? It seems they are just supporting him just for the sake of having a Namco character.
Pretty much. I don't see a lot of interest in him, just people saying "yeah, he's in". I really don't see why Pac-Man is considered so likely.
Pac-Man is really bland. Heck, Namco could not even think of what do with the guy with the guy in Tekken except throw him in a mech.

On a side note, I always wondered why there are so much Roy haters on the GameFAQs Smash Bros. Wii U board. My theory is because there is still a very large contingent of the "we need a female lord" crowd over there, and they think Roy is the character standing in the way of said hypothetical female lord.

Heck, there is some idiot thinking a Marth-look-alike (Lucina) is going to get in despite me saying that she is not even within the Top 15 most wanted characters in Japan, and half of her supporters in Japan don't think she would work with having her own slot due to how similar she is to Marth (the only other character that received that kind of sentiment is Dr. Mario).
Don't bother with him. He has an female obsession and has an obvious confirmation bias towards them, especially towards Fire Emblem women. I've tried arguing with him a few times in regards to characters and it's the same ignorant bullocks that has posioned the GameFAQs community.
 

Robert of Normandy

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ChronoBound

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Pretty much. I don't see a lot of interest in him, just people saying "yeah, he's in". I really don't see why Pac-Man is considered so likely.Don't bother with him. He has an female obsession and has an obvious confirmation bias towards them, especially towards Fire Emblem women. I've tried arguing with him a few times in regards to characters and it's the same ignorant bullocks that has posioned the GameFAQs community.
Ok, I will pretty much just ignore him then. The problem is that loudmouth fanboys end up convincing a lot of GameFAQs dumb masses to their opinions.
 

~ Valkyrie ~

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Chrono, don't bother with GameFAQs-people. Most of them are not too levelheaded anyway. There's this guy who thinks Smash Bros puts in only "the likeliest and most important to Nintendo"-franchises, which is why "Pacman's likely". He also hates ones supporting any JPN-only characters.

Oh, and one more tip if you want to ignore this Lucina-fanboy user:

Press "Message Details" of the user you want to ignore -> Scroll down -> Press Ignore User-button.

ShinPichu: Completed my reply, I missed it just bit quick, hahah-
 

8-peacock-8

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The best moveset for Pacman would be the ones from his 3D-adventures. (Pacman World-titles) Maybe if those were given I'd be willing to give Pacster a chance. (-l`l-)
It isn't exactly the best either. But it's good for smash at least.

B: Bite (Expected move)
Forward B: Rev Roll (Basically Spin Dash/Roll Out)
Down B: Butt Bounce (He ground pounds three times. His body will have the properties of a rubber ball, thats why he ground pounds three times.)
Up B: Pellet Trail (Pac-Man flies back to the stage by eating a trail of pellets.)

Final Smash: Power Pellet (Expected)

All the moves except the Neutral special and final smash come from the Pac-Man World Trilogy.
 

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鉄腕
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Caeda wouldn't be a lance user - while she could fight unmounted, she could only use lances when mounted*, and I don't think they'd include a mounted character.
Technically in FE3 she'd often be forced to/optionally dismount and fight on foot with a sword. Her artwork also has her more than often fighting on foot as well. Either way, I like her better than any of the other FE choices, but I'm done with outspokenly supporting her.


Honestly Bandana Dee feels like another Toad to me (bar Dee can fight, but is less notable). So I don't like him for whatever reason, just rubs me the wrong way.
Am still betting on him becoming another enemy Dedede throws.
 
D

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Chrono, don't bother with GameFAQs-people. Most of them are not too levelheaded anyway. There's this guy who thinks Smash Bros puts in only "the likeliest and most important to Nintendo"-franchises, which is why "Pacman's likely". He also hates ones supporting any JPN-only characters.

ShinPichu: Completed my reply, I missed it just bit quick, hahah-
That guy. Can't believe he's among the most respected members. I would hate for him to make the SSB4 roster.

@ChronoBound: Said guy sent you a PM. I'd suggest ignoring it.
 

~ Valkyrie ~

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Not mentioning his name but you know, that guy who hates ones supporting Lip and Takamaru.

Also I checked who's the one speaking and I think I know him from Devianart: loves Pauline. Not really a dumbo IMO, but I think he must've went too far with female supporting now.

Also I'd die if we got 4 bluehaired reps, one of which is essentially a look-alike to Marth.
 

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鉄腕
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BRoomer
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TripleDash
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TripleHyper: I thought Toad-like characters would be in everyone's favour but no? (-l^l-)
Depends on what aspect of Toad you're talking about.


@Chronobound: Say are you on Screwattack as well? I just noticed a blog that looks almost exactly like it was written by you over Japanese Smash Popularity. lol
 
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I always figured the Roy hate was coming from 2 camps:

1. People who played FE6 and didn't like him as a character.
2. Clone haters.

I would hazard that second group is probably the bigger group, and responsible for more of the hate. But I don't spend any time on GameFAQs, so I wouldn't know.
Well, to be fair, The Sealed Sword/Blazing Sword saga is among the weakest entires in the Fire Emblem franchise, not to mention FE6 is Japan only and Roy is a very underwhelming Lord in a very underwhelming game. Seriously, if you compare FE6, to FE 4 and 5, it is most certainly a downgrade. FE7 makes up for a it a little by giving you a slightly longer game.

In the grand context of representing Fire Emblem, Roy is largely insignificant to be honest, and already a clone character. My personal stance is if it comes between Roy, or another Fire Emblem Lord, I'll take the latter any day.

Also, on the subject of Shiida/Caeda, as much as I like her character, I don't find her relevant enough to actually make it in Smash, she falls below all of the FE lords in priority.

Ok, I will pretty much just ignore him then. The problem is that loudmouth fanboys end up convincing a lot of GameFAQs dumb masses to their opinions.
Who cares what the loudmouth fanboys say. Let them preach and say what they want. It likely won't cause any change really. From what we've discussed already, the roster seems to have been decided on, so people can clamor and vouch for so-and-so to get it, but it really won't cause any changes.

Ultimately it'll just come down to an E-Penis competition of who's right and who's wrong. You see a lot of those GameFAQs tards over on /v/, and over time you just learn to ignore them.

Also, a slightly offtopic/personal question Chrono.

Do you speak Moon/Live in Japan?
 
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