ROM 5 - Mew2King vs Unknown522

[Battlecow]

Ok look this is dumb. Inui could have been whispering in Unknown's ear and it is still harassment.

Look, regardless of whether smack talk/cheering SHOULD be allowed, it WAS allowed at that tourney and has been since the beginning of the american smash scene. Inui was well within his rights to say whatever the **** he wanted to as long as he wasn't saying it loudly enough to hurt unknown's ears. Dealing with **** talk is part of the job description, whether it should be or not.

And if he really only said "Mad cute" and "nice gimp" (not that I necessarily believe that)... lol. Just lol.

 

[Bones0]

Well, we have two completely one-sided accounts. Who didn't see that coming? We honestly just need Alex Strife or someone else who was literally RIGHT THERE when all of this happened.

 

[da K.I.D.]

When you remove everything else and boil everything down to the very base of the matter, you get:

a guy doing something that May or May Not be in bad taste, and the other guy responding by doing something is ACTUALLY PROHIBITED BY LAW not only in the country he was currently in but also in the country he is from.

Thats really all the information that you need to know. Everything else is inconsequential

 

[prog]

No, actually, trash talk is NOT part of the game. Trash talk is an element of tournaments, not the games themselves. Idk if you read Wobbles's blog (I'd love to hear what Wobbles has to say on trash talking as well), but he actually talks about how tournaments are an artificial element used when determining who the best Melee player is. At one point, he justifies the usage of tournaments as a means to determine the best player because "Performing well in high-pressure situations is an unbelievably important life skill that translates to everything you do. Measuring and improving it is arguably more useful to everybody involved than figuring out who the best player is."

I think the question about trash talking comes down to whether we feel the same. Is being able to perform under pressure an important life skill? Obviously. What about performing when others are cheering for your opponent? I would say so. What about performing when you are actively being demoralized by virtual strangers, but your opponent is not, based primarily on where the competition is taking place or the tactics you use? I just don't buy it that that is an important skill. It certainly is a skill to be able to ignore hate raining down upon you, but it neither seems fair nor relevant to someone's Melee abilities, so the reason that it's tolerated on any level is beyond me. I realize I don't have any credibility to discuss anything on these forums because I'm not a talented player or Melee personality, so hopefully someone on the podcast's panel feels similarly and can convey this point in the discussion.

Actually, I was going to thank you on the next podcast, for letting me clarify my thoughts on trash talk etc.

I'd agree with what Wobbles says, I constantly say if you want to determine who is better Mango vs Armada, put them in the same room to play a set, and remove as many biases (crowd participation, etc.) as possible. Unfortunately, that's not a luxury we can afford so we have the argument to this day.

I'll expound upon this more.

 

[slikvik]

unknown was the victim imo

of loser's finals

t_________t

 

[Jockmaster]

When you remove everything else and boil everything down to the very base of the matter, you get:

a guy doing something that May or May Not be in bad taste, and the other guy responding by doing something is ACTUALLY PROHIBITED BY LAW not only in the country he was currently in but also in the country he is from.

Thats really all the information that you need to know. Everything else is inconsequential

technically harassment is as well

http://crime.about.com/od/Crime_101/f/What-Is-Harassment.htm

 

[Construct]

Unknown was the victim imo

of loser's finals

Post of the year

 

[da K.I.D.]

actually technically so is harassment

http://crime.about.com/od/Crime_101/f/What-Is-Harassment.htm

Misdemeanor vs a possible Felony.

Still in two different leagues

 

[Jockmaster]

Misdemeanor vs a possible Felony.

Still in two different leagues

lellllllllllllllllll oh em gee Im done here

you literally just backed *** first out of your own argument

 

[da K.I.D.]

lellllllllllllllllll oh em gee Im done here

you literally just backed *** first out of your own argument

I mean, i could just say that what inui did couldnt possibly endanger unknowns safety. Which is one of the qualifications in the link you just gave. Seeing as Inui is quite literally half of unknowns size.

But my last comment was just a point to get the message across that theres no possible way anyone can justify putting what inui did on the same level as what unknown did.

But i apologise for giving you the benefit of the doubt, and trying to save time thinking that you could gather that

 

[Atomsk_92]

You know **** gets real when PokemonMasterJamal3 is viewing the thread.

 

[TeeVee]

kid maybe you should literally back your *** out of this thread




Kappa

 

[da K.I.D.]

kid maybe you should literally back your *** out of this thread




Kappa

You right, i should be monstering streams, not smashboard threads.




WHENS MARVEL

 

[Jockmaster]

I mean, i could just say that what inui did couldnt possibly endanger unknowns safety. Which is one of the qualifications in the link you just gave. Seeing as Inui is quite literally half of unknowns size.

But my last comment was just a point to get the message across that theres no possible way anyone can justify putting what inui did on the same level as what unknown did.

But i apologise for giving you the benefit of the doubt, and trying to save time thinking that you could gather that

Holy bejeezus nobody here is trying to justify what Unknown did. He overreacted and lost his cool. He deserves to be banned. You were simply saying that because what he did was ILLEGAL and because what Inui did was not ILLEGAL, that only Unknown should be banned. Technically, though, both of them have broken the law, rendering your initial argument moot. Yes, Unknown did the more "severe" thing, but Inui is not some kind of poor little helpless victim here; HE is the one who started talking **** to someone he had a history with. It's not like Unknown walked in the room and started bucking up to him or anything, Inui has done this before and plans on doing it again.

 

[KageMurphy]

I stole Teartbears wallet at Apex2012 and blamed it on another minority #teamInui

 

[TeeVee]

Holy bejeezus nobody here is trying to justify what Unknown did. He overreacted and lost his cool. He deserves to be banned. You were simply saying that because what he did was ILLEGAL and because what Inui did was not ILLEGAL, that only Unknown should be banned. Technically, though, both of them have broken the law, rendering your initial argument moot. Yes, Unknown did the more "severe" thing, but Inui is not some kind of poor little helpless victim here; HE is the one who started talking **** to someone he had a history with. It's not like Unknown walked in the room and started bucking up to him or anything, Inui has done this before and plans on doing it again.

as of right now all we have of the story is --

" I was sitting near the players and said "good **** M2K" when he got the first kill and was playing well. Unknown asked me to step back a bit. I did. I moved about four feet back. After M2K pulled off some amazing gimp, I said "damn that was cute as hell" or something along those lines. Said it. I didn't yell it. I was being fairly quiet considered it was a competitive gaming tournament. I wasn't near him, I wasn't shouting, I wasn't in his ear."

since somehow, unknown doesn't remember any words inui has spoken. if this is true, then what inui did was not against the law.

 

[Reioumu]

DJNintendo still owes mad money.

but seriously, I want to hear the story from someone who was there in the front and wasn't Inui or Unknown. Regardless laying hands on a guy for heckling or pissing you off is the wrong way of handling things. You need to tell the TO, as much as it looks like the ***** thing to do, just man up and ****ing do it.

-Rei

 

[Warhawk]

So many ****** brawlers in this thread. Seriously guys, you complain about all the ******* melee players in the past that relentlessly insulted your community but then you guys take every opportunity you can to try and make our community look bad as to make some petty justification as to why your community is better as if it matters (really the same **** those melee players did). You further the stereotypes a lot of members of our community holds to be true with your poor representation of your community. Stop picking apart what you want to hear from what is actually said, very few people are saying unknown shouldn't be banned for his actions, just that inui should also suffer some form of punishment.

If you aren't here to add anything and are just here to condemn our community you should just leave.

 

[prog]

disregard this post.

 

[V-K]

We should get the opinion of Jason Zimmerman Van Cinnaminson into this thread.

 

[Keitaro]

Eazy was right there, I will ask him now.

 

[TheCrimsonBlur]

Cactus was right next to all of them right?

He can probably clear this up.

fake edit: lol Aziiizzz

 

[BigWenz]

as of right now all we have of the story is --

" I was sitting near the players and said "good **** M2K" when he got the first kill and was playing well. Unknown asked me to step back a bit. I did. I moved about four feet back. After M2K pulled off some amazing gimp, I said "damn that was cute as hell" or something along those lines. Said it. I didn't yell it. I was being fairly quiet considered it was a competitive gaming tournament. I wasn't near him, I wasn't shouting, I wasn't in his ear."

since somehow, unknown doesn't remember any words inui has spoken. if this is true, then what inui did was not against the law.

if Inui spoke loud enough if unknowns ear to cause him physical pain, that is considered battery which is against the law.

Also, if this discussion is to continue to anything more than he said, she said type of thing, someone needs to upload the actual confrontation. Regardless of if u saw **** happen on the stream, two people who witness the same exact event will more often then not have different views on the details when asked to recall it at a later time. Until then, neither person's story should be taken at face value.

 

[TeeVee]

if Inui spoke loud enough if unknowns ear to cause him physical pain, that is considered battery which is against the law.

it isn't strange to you that it was somehow loud enough to hurt his ears, but he doesn't remember a single word inui said and we couldn't hear inui on the vod (yet we could hear unknown VERY clear when he was threatening inui with a drop kick)?

regardless, we need an m2k/alex strife/eazy/someone who there confirmation

 

[Hamek]

Unknown's post doesn't really make much sense though, even without looking at Inui's side of it. Inui was so loud that he physically damaged Unknown's ear but Unknown couldn't remember what he said? Like, I don't see how that's really possible.

Also, for people saying Inui should get banned, would you still be saying this if Unknown had merely complained and not choked Inui or wasn't banned from Apex? I'm willing to bet that at the majority of you, if not all of you would not.

Stop trying to even out the punishment because Unknown got banned. Look at both cases individually. Of course, we do need a 3rd party for this, but based on what both have said and what was said by someone who heard the vod, Inui did not seem to be as loud as Unknown claimed him to be.

At the very least hold off and saying "ban inui" until a 3rd party gives their account, regardless of whether you personally dislike Inui.

 

[ZeldaFreak0309]

Do we all at least agree that unknown should have gone to a TO with the problem, and that the TO should have removed Inui from the immediate area if he didn't stop?

 

[KrIsP!]

I highly doubt unknown would choke a ***** for someone who agreed to move 4 feet away after saying "that gimp was mad cute"

 

[BigWenz]

it isn't strange to you that it was somehow loud enough to hurt his ears, but he doesn't remember a single word inui said and we couldn't hear inui on the vod (yet we could hear unknown VERY clear when he was threatening inui with a drop kick)?

regardless, we need an m2k/alex strife/eazy/someone who there confirmation

Hearing and listening are 2 different things. Listening requires an intent to comprehend and remember what is being said. He could have heard the sounds coming from Inui, but as he was playing a damn match, he was more than likely not trying to listen to what he was saying. Also, again if someone is close enough to your ear, it doesn't have to be that loud to hurt ur ear, eardrums are very sensitive.

 

[ihavespaceblondes]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RgcPNtoaAB8

 

[Hamek]

Do we all at least agree that unknown should have gone to a TO with the problem, and that the TO should have removed Inui from the immediate area if he didn't stop?

If what Unknown says was 100% true and Inui's account of it was 100% fabricated, sure. But I don't think Unknown's makes much sense, how could he not remember something that was apparently said so loud that it physically hurt him?

 

[Max?]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RgcPNtoaAB8

You still have the best avatar on this site.


Also, this game is ****ing dead, goddamn

 

[Cactuar]

Unknown was playing a tournament match. I barely recognize what people are trying to say to me when I'm playing friendlies. Him not knowing exactly what Inui said doesn't surprise me at all.

 

[Hamek]

I highly doubt unknown would choke a ***** for someone who agreed to move 4 feet away after saying "that gimp was mad cute"

But you don't doubt that Unknown could completely forget what was said when he claims that was said so loudly that it physically hurt him?

 

[ZeldaFreak0309]

If what Unknown says was 100% true and Inui's account of it was 100% fabricated, sure. But I don't think Unknown's makes much sense, how could he not remember something that was apparently said so loud that it physically hurt him?

Put yourself in his shoes dude. He's actively trying to ignore the shouting while he's playing a tournament match vs M2K, I think it's very easy to imagine how he could have not heard anything specific...

 

[Keitaro]

I feel like Inui is sugarcoating what he said. Eazy didn't get to hear what Inui said cause he was playing a match. He just saw a chair get thrown and Inui get choked.

What is hurting Unknown's case right now is that he apparently doesn't know what Inui said. So that allows Inui to make up whatever story he wants about what he said. Not saying that Inui did make a false story, but he could have easily since no one knows what he said.

 

[KrIsP!]

If what Unknown says was 100% true and Inui's account of it was 100% fabricated, sure. But I don't think Unknown's makes much sense, how could he not remember something that was apparently said so loud that it physically hurt him?

Can I ask why you joined the boards just to post in this thread? I mean...were you watching on stream and it pissed you off that much?

 

[The Business]

But you don't doubt that Unknown could completely forget what was said when he claims that was said so loudly that it physically hurt him?

Are you forgetting the part where Unknown completely lost his mind and attacked him? In that state of blind rage, you don't tend to remember trivial things like "what he screamed in my ear", just that he screamed in your ear so loud it hurt.

 

[Hamek]

Can I ask why you joined the boards just to post in this thread? I mean...were you watching on stream and it pissed you off that much?

Oh, no, I wasn't even watching it on the stream, I just saw it on facebook and decided to check through the thread

I don't see how that is relevant at all to the question I posed though, please do not try to sidestep my question. I haven't really seen much of a response as to why/how Unknown wouldn't be able to remember something said loudly enough to apparently physically hurt him.

 

[Alphicans]

it isn't strange to you that it was somehow loud enough to hurt his ears, but he doesn't remember a single word inui said and we couldn't hear inui on the vod (yet we could hear unknown VERY clear when he was threatening inui with a drop kick)?

regardless, we need an m2k/alex strife/eazy/someone who there confirmation

Hearing and listening are 2 different things. Listening requires an intent to comprehend and remember what is being said. He could have heard the sounds coming from Inui, but as he was playing a damn match, he was more than likely not trying to listen to what he was saying. Also, again if someone is close enough to your ear, it doesn't have to be that loud to hurt ur ear, eardrums are very sensitive.

If what Unknown says was 100% true and Inui's account of it was 100% fabricated, sure. But I don't think Unknown's makes much sense, how could he not remember something that was apparently said so loud that it physically hurt him?

But you don't doubt that Unknown could completely forget what was said when he claims that was said so loudly that it physically hurt him?

Lol at this knockdown argument. Some really logical crime solvers here...

Have you ever had someone yell in your ear? I sure as **** have and when it happens you don't recognize anything because it's sensory overload. All I remember is the pain and ringing in my ears afterwards.

As of right now we have two, essentially opposite versions of the story. No judgement can be made.

 

[BigWenz]

Oh, no, I wasn't even watching it on the stream, I just saw it on facebook and decided to check through the thread

I don't see how that is relevant at all to the question I posed though, please do not try to sidestep my question. I haven't really seen much of a response as to why/how Unknown wouldn't be able to remember something said loudly enough to apparently physically hurt him.

if you would read the damn thread, ur question has been answered multiple times by multiple people.