Retro Gamers and why they need to get over it

[SuperBowser]

*shrugs*

Somebody brought down an N64 and four controllers a few years ago at uni. We played it for about 4 hours straight and everyone had a blast. Even the people I didn't know played videogames. Sitting, doing nothing in the toilets at facility is still funny. Planting proximity mines anywhere and everywhere still makes you a terrible human being. Running in small circles to dodge bullets as oddjob still works.

Sure, the game has not aged well. At all. But it's still a fun nostalgia trip for what defined the FPS genre at the time and with the right group of people it's still a heap of fun.

 

[Jim Morrison]

find me a better game from before 2000

 

[Firus]

find me a better game from before 2000

I could easily name games that I find better, but that's YOUR favorite game from before 2000 so it's not going to make any difference to you.

Also, inb4FFVIIisoverrated.

 

[X1-12]

FFVII is underrated...

 

[Firus]

Of all the things you can argue about FFVII, I don't think "underrated" is one of them.

 

[finalark]

find me a better game from before 2000

I could probably list more games than necessary that I found to be better than FF7 that were made before 2000. But you seem to love it so despite how much reason and logic I could put out your nostalgia won't let you change your mind.

 

[Hyper_Ridley]

Of all the things you can argue about FFVII, I don't think "underrated" is one of them.

With the amount of people who seem to hate FF7 these days I could almost see it being called "underrated", lol.

*has never played FF7 and doesn't have an opinion on it one way or the other*

 

[Requiem]

The fanbase is utterly and unbelievably ********.

But FFVII is a really good game, and even better when viewed in perspective of the time when it was released.

 

[Black Mantis]

find me a better game from before 2000

 

[finalark]

The thing is with Final Fantasy VII is that all it really did was popularize JRPGs in the west. Other than that, it really isn't that good of a game. Don't get the wrong, the game play is great but the story and almost everything else is poor. Plus a lot of it did not age well.

 

[Jim Morrison]

overrated game

rofl ***** plz no

 

[Jam Stunna]

JRPGs in general are pretty absurd when you get down to it. The good ones are just less absurd than the rest.

 

[finalark]

JRPGs in general are pretty absurd when you get down to it. The good ones are just less absurd than the rest.

I think this might just be why I grew out of them after Middle School. Either that or I suddenly found that their stories (the thing that appealed to me the most at that time) were usually really crappy.

rofl ***** plz no

They're both overrated.

 

[X1-12]

With the amount of people who seem to hate FF7 these days I could almost see it being called "underrated", lol.

This, lol,

so many people decided that since everyone liked it it would be cool to not like it or w/e

 

[Jam Stunna]

I think this might just be why I grew out of them after Middle School. Either that or I suddenly found that their stories (the thing that appealed to me the most at that time) were usually really crappy.

Yeah, you just grew out of the "OMG Japan made it so it must be good phase!" Everyone goes through it, most people grow out of it, but not everyone (see: everyone who bought Final Fantasy XIII).

 

[finalark]

Yeah, you just grew out of the "OMG Japan made it so it must be good phase!" Everyone goes through it, most people grow out of it, but not everyone (see: everyone who bought Final Fantasy XIII).

Yeah... I grew out of anime and manga around the same time too. I mean don't get me wrong, there are a number of Japanese made games that I enjoy (my avatar is a character from Metal Gear Solid, for example) but I'm not going to think that something is "OMG AWESOME" just because it's from Japan. I actually think I enjoy western games these days more so than I do eastern ones.

 

[Jim Morrison]

I'm learning Japanese so I can watch anime and read manga the way it was intended to.

 

[Black Mantis]

now this is an overrated game

 

[Firus]

I'm learning Japanese so I can watch anime and read manga the way it was intended to.

I want to learn Japanese just so I can expand my game library. So many games never made it outside of Japan, and even those that did are -- for the most part -- much cheaper in Japanese. I mean, I could get Earthbound for $30 instead of $80, and actually play Mother 3 in its original form on an actual video game system. (I really want to play both games at some point just so I can decide for myself if the hype is deserved or not, and I really don't like emulators at all.)

Of course, I've yet to actually start trying to learn Japanese, but given the opportunity, I would very much like to learn to read it.

And yes, I'm aware of the region lock, but there are ways to circumvent it.

 

[Big-Cat]

Yeah, you just grew out of the "OMG Japan made it so it must be good phase!" Everyone goes through it, most people grow out of it, but not everyone (see: everyone who bought Final Fantasy XIII).

I must be in the minority because I like Final Fantasy XIII.

 

[finalark]

I want to learn Japanese just so I can expand my game library.

Firus, you are officially the most hardcore collector that I know.

I'm a bit of a collector myself but I'm not nearly as serious as you are. I saw a copy of Street Fighter III: 3rd Strike for the Dreamcast in near-mint condition and then cringed at the $40 price tag despite how much I wanted it.

One of these days you need to upload some pictures of your collection so that way I can properly envy it.

 

[Jim Morrison]

I want to learn Japanese just so I can expand my game library. So many games never made it outside of Japan, and even those that did are -- for the most part -- much cheaper in Japanese. I mean, I could get Earthbound for $30 instead of $80, and actually play Mother 3 in its original form on an actual video game system. (I really want to play both games at some point just so I can decide for myself if the hype is deserved or not, and I really don't like emulators at all.)

Of course, I've yet to actually start trying to learn Japanese, but given the opportunity, I would very much like to learn to read it.

And yes, I'm aware of the region lock, but there are ways to circumvent it.

I kidded, I'm not learning Japanese, but live & learn bro, you can start anytime. It's piss easy when you translate songs, cruise their wikipedia and use some online help. Don't be like "man I would like to learn it someday", make it that day.

 

[Black Mantis]

Good the MW2 fanboys didn't try to tear me to pieces.

 

[Browny]

Theyre all too busy on IW forums complaining about hackers and getting banned.

 

[Black Mantis]

Theyre all too busy on IW forums complaining about hackers and getting banned.

good one

 

[Anth0ny]

In all seriousness, it's the gamers that change. Lets take a mid-generation video game. Majora's Mask (one I know you particularly like). Now imagine playing it for the first time at say... 6 years old. Now imagine playing it for the first time at 16. Or maybe 36? You should be able to imagine the difference in experience. Granted not being in your mid-30's means you may not know how it feels, so I can fill that gap for you. It sucked. It was HARD. I mean, I had to have help to beat a lot of OoT, but MM, even WITH faqs I still couldn't bring myself to complete it, it just didn't do it for me.

get the HECK outta here

How is it's difficulty directly proportional to how much it sucks?

Spoiler

which it doesn't, it's actually the greatest game of all time

Besides, it's really not hard. I beat it as a kid without a guide. They fairy, and people in the game tell you pretty much everything you need to know.

Want a hard game? PLAY LINK TO THE PAST. Jesus, that game is kicking my *** right now. There is literally no guidance in that game, I swear they made it with Nintendo Power sales in mind.

HOW DO I KNOW I'M SUPPOSED TO THROW SOMETHING IN THE LAKE TO GET THE QUAKE MEDALLION. HOW.

 

[finalark]

HOW DO I KNOW I'M SUPPOSED TO THROW SOMETHING IN THE LAKE TO GET THE QUAKE MEDALLION. HOW.

You're not. It's all apart of the retro experience, having no freaking idea of where in the hell you're supposed to go next or what you're supposed to be doing. Come on, isn't it fun? Isn't it so much better than all of those crappy, player-friendly games that we have today? I mean, why would I want guidance or help of any sort when I can run around for hours trying to figure out some insane puzzle that the developers put into the game only to sell more strategy guides?

 

[Anth0ny]

You're not. It's all apart of the retro experience, having no freaking idea of where in the hell you're supposed to go next or what you're supposed to be doing. Come on, isn't it fun? Isn't it so much better than all of those crappy, player-friendly games that we have today? I mean, why would I want guidance or help of any sort when I can run around for hours trying to figure out some insane puzzle that the developers put into the game only to sell more strategy guides?

Well, it's really not like that in all retro games. It's not fair to call it the retro experience, but it's true that there a quite a few games out there that just expect you to know what to do, or at the very least pick up that issue of Nintendo Power.

 

[finalark]

Well, it's really not like that in all retro games. It's not fair to call it the retro experience, but it's true that there a quite a few games out there that just expect you to know what to do, or at the very least pick up that issue of Nintendo Power.

How many NES/SNES era RPGs have you played? Almost all of them are like that.

I supposed I should have said "retro RPG/adventure game experience."

 

[firelord767]

HOW DO I KNOW I'M SUPPOSED TO THROW SOMETHING IN THE LAKE TO GET THE QUAKE MEDALLION. HOW.

Hey man, i read to do so on a sign. It said not to throw something into the lake. C'mon, that DIDN'T scream "POLLUTE MY DARK WORLD POND!" in any way at you? Dang, you must be one of them "Decent Human Beings" i've heard about all these years.

MM was hard for me, too, but you have to calculate the bad gamer variable in.

Also, for the sake of irony, OoT is old, but Skyward Sword is new. Which one was 3D again? Oh yeah, OoT.

 

[cutter]

find me a better game from before 2000

Since Ocarina of Time was already said...

 

[finalark]

Also, for the sake of irony, OoT is old, but Skyward Sword is new. Which one was 3D again? Oh yeah, OoT.

Um... Skyward Sword is 3D....

 

[firelord767]

Um... Skyward Sword is 3D....

By 3D, i mean stereoscopic coming-out-of-the-screen. Not a polygonal world.

 

[Omnicron's Baklava Enterprises]

New Gamers and why they need to get over Retro Gamers.

 

[Sucumbio]

How is it's difficulty directly proportional to how much it sucks?

I actually judge games based on how hard it is to beat. If it's so hard I have no hope of beating it no matter how hard I try, I don't like it. It's not -fun-. MM is not this. It wasn't so hard I couldn't beat it. I honestly just... didn't care? I didn't find the game compelling. I also hated the time-limit aspect. Apparently you can reset the timer but I'd already abandoned the game before finding this out, and I just, meh don't really want to try again. Maybe I will... maybe. But it's definitely one of those games that would require me to have a printed walkthrough in my lap while playing, and that's just not fun to me, it's more like a chore.

How many NES/SNES era RPGs have you played? Almost all of them are like that.

Really? See I found NES/SNES RPGs to be just right in terms of difficulty. I rarely got stuck in these games, and if I did I'd just ask a friend who'd already played it, or experimented with stuff until I got it to work.

NES:

* AD&D: Pool of Radiance (has tactical elements in its combat system). Port of PC title.
* The Adventures of Musashi (Ja: 1990 as Musashi No Bouken) *
* The Bard's Tale. Port of PC title.
* Chaos World *
* Deep Dungeon IV *
* Dragon Warrior. (US: 1989), (Ja: 1986 as Dragon Quest *)
* Dragon Warrior II. (US: 1990), (Ja: 1987 as Dragon Quest II *)
* Dragon Warrior III. (US: 1991), (Ja: 1989 as Dragon Quest III *)
* Dragon Warrior IV. (US: 1992), (Ja: 1990 as Dragon Quest IV *)
* Dungeon Magic: Sword of the Elements *
* Earthbound Zero (the "US version" is a ROM dump of an unreleased prototype) (Ja: 1990 as Mother)
* Final Fantasy (US: 1987), (Ja: 1987)
* Final Fantasy II * (Ja: 1988)
* Final Fantasy III * (Ja: 1990)
* The Glory of Heracles II: Titan's Downfall * (Ja: 1989)
* Legend Of The Ghost Lion (US: 1993), (Ja: 1987 as White Lion Densetsu)
* Might and Magic: Secret of the Inner Sanctum. (Might and Magic I). Port of PC title.
* Pool of Radiance see AD&D: Pool of Radiance
* Super Black Onyx * (Ja: 1988) (with an odd timing-based combat system)
* Sweet Home * (Ja: 1989)
* Swords and Serpents
* Tombs And Treasure (with Mystery elements)
* Ultima: Exodus (Ultima III) (US: 1989), (Ja: 1987) (has tactical elements in its combat system). Port of PC title.
* Ultima: Quest Of The Avatar (Ultima IV) (has tactical elements in its combat system). Port of PC title.
* Ultima: Warriors Of Destiny (Ultima V) (has tactical elements in its combat system). Port of PC title.
* Wizardry: Proving Grounds of the Mad Overlord. Port of PC title.
* Wizardry 2: Knight Of Diamonds. Port of PC title.

SNES (US titles):

7th Saga
Arcana
Breath of Fire 1
Breath of Fire 2
Chrono Trigger
Dragon View
Drakkhen
Dungeon Master
Earthbound (Mother 2)
Estopolis 1 (Lufia & the Fortress of Doom)
Estopolis 2 (Lufia 2: Rise of the Sinistrals)
E.V.O. Search for Eden
Eye of the Beholder
Final Fantasy 2
Final Fantasy 3
Final Fantasy Mystic Quest
Front Mission 1
Illusion of Gaia (Soul Blazer 2) (Illusion of Time)
Illusion of Time (Soul Blazer 2) (Illusion of Gaia)
Inindo: Way of the Ninja
Lagoon
Lord of The Rings
Lufia & the Fortress of Doom (Estopolis 1)
Lufia 2: Rise of the Sinistrals (Estopolis 2)
Might & Magic 3: Isles of Terra
Mother 2 (Earthbound)
Paladin's Quest
Robotrek
Romancing Saga 3
Secret of Evermore
Secret of Mana (Seiken Densetsu 2)
Secret of the Stars
Seiken Densetsu 2 (Secret of Mana)
Shadowrun
Soul Blazer
Soul Blazer 2 (Illusion of Gaia) (Illusion of Time)
Soul Blazer 3 (Terranigma)
Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars
Terranigma (Soul Blazer 3)
Ultima 6: The False Prophet
Ultima 7: The Black Gate
Ultima: Runes of Virtue 2
Uncharted Waters
Uncharted Waters 2: New Horizons
Wizardry 5: Heart of the Maelstrom

Of course there's several I haven't played, the ones I highlighted are the ones I've played. None of them were terribly difficult or frustrating, but that's just me...

I thought about this thread as I was re-watching the Star Wars remakes and prequels. In his own words, they were the movies "he'd always wanted to make." And with 100k dollar a whack digital cameras and all this, he made them. And many of us who were kids when the originals came out in theaters, all threw up a bit in our mouths at the sheer ugliness of them. Because he had so much power at his fingertips, he... frankly didn't have to try as hard to make the movies -great- just good. Passable. Mediocre even. Now granted I still love them, because I love Star Wars. But really, I'd have liked them better if they'd been made traditionally like the originals. All that CGI, it just ... meh. It's like when someone tries to buy you off with fancy illusions. A smart kid will see through it, and realize how shallow or hollow it really is.

 

[firelord767]

By remakes and prequels, do you mean episodes I-III, or did Mr. Lucas remake the entire thing and throw in a prequel when i fell asleep last night?

 

[Sucumbio]

1-3 are the prequels, remakes are the special editions of 4-6.

 

[firelord767]

...? So basically, you mean to tell me that the CGI in episode III wasn't the coolest thing you ever saw? I don't know much about the special editions of IV-VI besides the fact that they changed the gravel in the spaceport in IV, but the prequels, which are actually main movies in the saga, were probably ten times better than the day and age of the rebels. The CGI was used awesomely. It looked real. Not fake. Some of the stuff in the "original" trilogy educed some gaging, but I-III looked as if they went to a galaxy far far away and traveled back to a long time ago with their cameras and filmed it, rather than making it as blant and ugly as possible.

If I-III are "shallow and hollow", then that makes just about every other movie in excistance look like the poorer of the youtube videos out there.

 

[finalark]

...? So basically, you mean to tell me that the CGI in episode III wasn't the coolest thing you ever saw? I don't know much about the special editions of IV-VI besides the fact that they changed the gravel in the spaceport in IV, but the prequels, which are actually main movies in the saga, were probably ten times better than the day and age of the rebels. The CGI was used awesomely. It looked real. Not fake. Some of the stuff in the "original" trilogy educed some gaging, but I-III looked as if they went to a galaxy far far away and traveled back to a long time ago with their cameras and filmed it, rather than making it as blant and ugly as possible.

If I-III are "shallow and hollow", then that makes just about every other movie in excistance look like the poorer of the youtube videos out there.

You liked James Cameron's Avatar, didn't you?

 

[finalark]

Really? See I found NES/SNES RPGs to be just right in terms of difficulty. I rarely got stuck in these games, and if I did I'd just ask a friend who'd already played it, or experimented with stuff until I got it to work.

Maybe's it's just because you're used to that style of game where they pretty much tell you to figure it out yourself.

EDIT: oops, didn't mean to double-post.