Rate Their Chances - Smash Ultimate Edition! Day 672: Five Most Likely First and Third Parties for Smash 6, and Final Goodbyes

[Ridrool64]

Okay, so...

1. Byleth: Holy **** it happened. If it wasn't for more DLC, we would have had Corrin 2. This is the worst possible (reasonable) choice they could have made for a newcomer. But don't get me wrong: Byleth is far more awesome than I could have anticipated. But first impressions are first impressions, the character was a wimpy, weak wet fart on their own with lacking personality. The MOVESET attached to the character? Fantastic. It's finally not wasted potential outside of the fact that we still don't have more FE magic, in particular staves, but whatever. I really expected the Sword of the Creator to be everything. I also expected them to be in post-pass, or a Mii Swordfighter outfit. And I expected that the similar looks to basically every FE character before them, plus the sword, would make them a harder sell to Sakurai but I thought wrong. I'd give Byleth a 7/10 for the moveset, 4.5/10 for everything else, so 6/10 in general.
2. Garreg Mach Monastery: Infinity/10, perfection. The stage is beautiful and looks even better than the original game. The characters look way worse, though, including Byleth themselves. The music selection is awesome, but Fire Emblem is missing a bunch more good songs. Like the Sacred Stones' library, or Twilight of the Gods, or a bunch of other ones. For rating's sake, 9/10.
3. The Mii's: ARLE WASN'T THERE, THANK SOTHIS AND LILITH. In general: 7.5/10.
   1. Altaïr: I had no idea who this was, but okay.
   2. Rabbids: Rayman fans are popping off right now!
   3. X, EXE: Okay, returning costumes are pretty nice.
   4. Cuphead: Neat! Didn't really think he had that much of a shot to begin with.
4. Six characters after the pass: Aw yeah! Now that's what I call a Volume 2. Sakurai is going to be a miracle worker. I have my thoughts on who's next, but for those of you curious, the next character is gonna be huge. 10/10.

****, I missed my chance to nominate Arle for the rerate stuff.

But since juggling three concepts is basically impossible, Paper Mario x 5. I'll stick with him to the end.

 

[Sari]

Direct reactions:

Gotta say I am really glad with how things turned out. Three Houses is one of my favorite Switch games, and although I would've preferred Edelgard I am still really happy Byleth got in. I know people are tired of yet another FE character, but damn did Sakurai make Byleth stand out through the use of the Hero Relics.

I still can't believe Between Heaven and Earth actually got into Smash. I can die happy now.

Only nitpicks were the lack of God-Shattering Star as one of the music tracks as well as a few more cameos I would've liked to see (mainly Annette and Bernie). But overall I can't be dissapointed in what we got.

Mii costumes were great and that Cuphead outfit is one of the best costumes they've ever released. Also, 6 more characters! I honestly wasn't expecting that many.

And on a personal note, no characters I want had their chances harmed as a result of this Direct (barring Edelgard and Dimitri of course). In fact Byleth's inclusion shows that first parties aren't dead so their inclusion even boosted a lot of character's chances.

Oh yeah and although my predictions were mostly wrong, two of them were spot on:

• I think we will definitely get a mii costume that makes people go "HOLY CRAP" like the Sans one. (Cuphead)
• I don't think we'll get a post-pass character reveal. At best I just see Sakurai explaining how the post-pass content will work.

Overall, I give this Direct a 9.3/10.

--------------------

For how hype I was for the Fighter Pass characters, I rank them in the following order:

> Byleth > > >

No one except for Kyo could ever top Terry's reveal. Even Banjo who I don't really have much personal connection to was still an amazing reveal for me.

I give the fighter's pass as a whole a 9.5/10. They made some really amazing choices with those picks and I can't wait to see how they top it in the future.

Nominations:
Chun-Li x5

 

[DrifloonEmpire]

Gonna have to say that I'm not very happy with the turnout. While I'm happy for a few of my fellow Dragonborn supporters who wanted Byleth, I am not happy about Byleth's addition, and how soon it was.

While I did like that Sakurai implemented the house leaders into their moveset, I still think that Fire Emblem is overrepresented and the timing of this reveal was terrible, given the momentum of the previous four choices. I have no attachment to modern Fire Emblem, and while everyone is ragging on the detractors for complaining about the over representation of anime swords (Fire Emblem/Persona fans are not the be all authority of the fandom, everyone has different tastes), I feel like a lot of the Three Houses fans are acting just as bad if not worse in some ways (it's basically the National Dex controversy and Waluigi all over again). Still, every fanbase has its' bad apples and I shouldn't let that affect the analysis. Either way, I just don't have any interest in the character at all, and if we did have to have another FE rep I would've chosen Lyn or Hector.

Now for the stage. The layout isn't too interesting, but Fire Emblem lacked decent stages, and it's nice to see another one based on an actual location. Plus it's nice to see Sakurai continuing with the character cameos, I can tell he put a lot of love into it and it adds a lot of nice screenshot potential and just a lot of fun all around.

As for the Mii costumes I honestly wasn't expecting Cuphead. I mean, anything's possible after Sans, but I wasn't expecting another surprise like that. Plus the costume looks fantastic, and I love how the right hand makes the actual finger pointer when shooting. Great attention to detail! I'm very pleased with how he turned out!
Meanwhile, I feel bad for Rayman fans. With this DLC further affirming that Spirits deconfirm, and the Altier and Rabbids costumes, things are not looking good for the limb less hero, which does make me sad. If they were gonna add Rayman, these Ubisoft costumes would more than likely come with him instead.

Overall, I'd give the presentation a 4/10. I'm not at all thrilled about the character choice and I personally think it was a bad decision, but I will give credit where credit is due and try to concentrate on the positives. Furthermore there were no deconfirmations for any of my most wanted and we still have six slots left, so there's plenty of time!

Nominations:
Gex x5

 

[GoodGrief741]

Guess I might as well post my reactions

I'm whelmed. I think I would have been much more excited if I'd actually been expecting Byleth or any other first party, but I wasn't, so my initial reaction was more of a "Byleth? That's random". And then I thought it's kind of weird that Fire Emblem keeps getting the red carpet treatment like this. Then I started dreading reactions to him. But all in all, Byleth is a great choice from a great game, so in a vacuum he's an excellent character. Garreg Mach looks neat, the moveset looks neat, the stage cameos only increased my uncertainty on what house I'm gonna pick when I play Three Houses (initial impressions are that Dimitri gang is too vanilla and Edelgard house is too waifu cringe, but then again what do I know). So I'm really happy that Byleth is in, and I wish things were different so that everyone could appreciate him for what he is. I'll give a 75% satisfaction rating.

The rest of the presentation was OK. I think everyone could've done without the Fire Emblem history lesson after being in the series since Melee. But Sakurai was funny throughout. And the fight was mercifully short. I'd give a 6.5/10.

Now if we're doing a rating for the whole Pass... It's been a great Pass. To think I only bought it when E3 came around, but I have zero complaints. Joker's moveset I still don't like and feel like it misrepresents the character, but other than that the selection is great, the stages are great, the music is great. Hero and Banjo are probably main material for me. I love all the heroes in Hero's alts (started DQXI yesterday!) and that the ones that didn't make it get shown off in his FS. I love how unique and balls to the wall awesome Terry is (even if I don't like the more complex inputs on principle), and the stadium might be the best DLC stage. And I love everything about Banjo, just a dream come true. So I'd give a 90% satisfaction rating.

And Mii Costumes. Good selection. Aside from Cuphead, no character with great chances was killed (sorry X). Glad to see both Mega Man Costumes back as they're some of the best. Altair was random but increases my hope for Ezio. AND Rabbids are disconformes which is always great. Now Cuphead, he could have been a contender, but his costume is great and it comes with music. And honestly he was pretty low-key so if anything this should really increase support going forward, so I see it as a good thing.

Noms: Kiryu

 

[ShinyRegice]

Finally I've found an opportunity to watch the character's reveal live, although I only watched the entire video later because I knew I wouldn't have enough time.

So the last fighter pass character is yet another Fire Emblem character from the latest entry in the series. Exactly the kind of reveal I would have hated four years ago xD (I was pretty salty when they revealed Corrin) although just because I've stopped hatinf new inclusions that don't fit my vision of the Smash roster doesn't mean I'm necessarily super excited with new additions either, so to me the reveal felt, well, okay I guess?

When Sakurai said that it's something really unexpected I really wondered who it could be. I thought it would be a third-party from a stingy company when it comes to their choices, I even dared to think the sacred "no video game character" rule would be broken but… nope. Well, actually that was a surprise since it thematically doesn't fit with the fighter pass characters we've gotten so far.

The trailer started with a view of a forest seen from above in an anime style and I was clueless about who it would be. Then I saw the swordsman and I immediately thought about Fire Emblem because it fits the aesthetics and artstyle. Seeing the girl I remembered from FE:3H trailers sealed the deal. It surprised me to see the "fighter pass in all third-party and Nintendo characters are kept for later" hypotheses shattered, and I thought about the salt it would cause in part of the fanbase. When I saw him in action as a Smash fan I naturally thought "oh another swordsman? disappointing" so seeing the additional weapon was both satisfying and also hilarious with how it was presented, it shows Sakurai is aware of Smash fans being tired of FE swordsmen I legit laughed out loud in front of the computer screen. Plus all the weapons fit well in the same moveset aesthetically.

Also SIX more characters are coming. This is the extreme higher end of how many additional characters I thought we could get after FP1, I'm fairly surprised they went that high, although not necessarily shocked. But more than surprised I'm very satisfied and excited with that number!

Byleth being fighter pass 5 means FE:3H gets as a game the same special treatment series introduced in the FP1 got with a new stage and their own spirit board. I didn't expect a new stage to be bundeled with a Nintendo newcomer. And it begs the question of how FP2 characters will be treated. Will they receive their own new stage and spirit board too? AFAIK I don't believe there's info about that, but it might be reasonable to assume it will follow that format. If that's the case then RIP gen 8 Pokémon rep. (And Astral Chain too, but I already considered this one deconfirmed with the recent spirit event because I always thought it was all or nothing for new series. Not that it will prevent me from playing the game. I don't play games just to speculate about Smash content )

It should be noted that there's only one slot left in the stage select screen (SSS) after the new FE:3H stage's release, considering that this high number of DLC characters seems like it wasn't planned when the game released I wonder how the SSS will be arranged. Currently there are 110 slots in the SSS (random + 103 base game + 5 DLC + 1 empty) which makes for a beautiful 10*11 rectangle. Assuming we get 6 more stages (1 for each FP2 newcomer) then there should be 116 slots, but 116's only divisors are 2, 4, 29 and 58. You can't do a beautiful rectangular SSS with that. So either it's not one stage for each FP2 character or the SSS will be rearranged to fir the additional stages, or a combination of both.

I hope we will get FP6 soon. It was only one month between Piranha Plant's reveal's and Joker's, and the first Fighter Pass went on sale as soon as Smash Ultimate released. Hopefully we get a general Nintendo Direct soon with FP6 as well as other Nintendo news so we can look forward to the Switch's near future.

 

[DaUsername]

Corrin 2: Electric Boogaloo
Chance: 10%
Let's see, he's the guy from the newest game and uh... that's it, really.
I can only see this guy being in if Nintendo decides to pull a Corrin and shove this guy in because he's new. But Nintendo has been learning from theirmistakes recently so that probably won't happen.

Want (For all of these jerks): 0%
Fire Emblem does not need any more characters. It has enough. Seriously, why does Fire Emblem always get special treatment? Why does every moderately successful FE game need a new character while games like ARMS and Xenoblade 2 get passed over? Why does FE keep getting new characters while more successful franchises like Zelda haven't gotten anything since Brawl? Why is it that after all of this, there are still people who think Fire Emblem deserves more? Enough is enough. Let some other franchise have a chance to shine for once.

 

[DanganZilla5]

1/16 Presentation Reaction

Not gonna lie, I was super salty with Byleth when there was so much evidence for 3rd party characters. But I've calmed down now. I don't care about Fire Emblem so I'm not super excited to play him. His moveset and stage do look cool though.

I really like the Altair and especially the Cuphead Mii costumes. I wanted Cuphead, so to see him make it in with a music track is great. And the announcement of 6 more characters was hype.

Overall, I give this direct a 5/10. I will eventually embrace Byleth and the Cuphead and 6 characters announcements made it up for me.

Fighters Pass Rating

Joker: What a hell of a surprise he was. I'm not a big fan of his moveset, but his stage and music is great. Never played Persona 5 before his inclusion though and so far his game hasn't sucked me in yet.

Hero: At first he was an underwhelming pick for me, but I got around to him and I'm glad he's in the game. His gimmick is fantastic with great troll and replay-worthy moments. Plus it got me to try Dragon Quest 11 which I really enjoy.

Banjo: My favorite when it comes to the character themself and what it means for the DLC. Banjo was the only character out of this pass that I actually had a decent connection with before his announcement. Having Microsoft allow one of their characters in Smash is a huge deal and Banjo is pretty fun to play as. His music is very good as well. Banjo proved that highly requested characters can get in.

Terry: I really like Terry. I'm not a fighting game fan, but his moveset is super fun and his stage is one of my favorites. And 50 songs is a stunningly high amount.

Overall, I give the fighters pass a 7.5/10. Honestly I don't have a lot of attachment to any of these characters. Banjo was the only one I wanted and he wasn't even in my top 10. But this pass has proven to me that I don't have to recognize a character for them to make their inclusion in Smash meaningful to me, or for me to enjoy their moveset and the content they bring.

Noms: Crypto x5 (not using my extra ones yet)

 

[Ridrool64]

Oh, I should rate the whole Fighter's Pass.

1. Terry Bogard: Holy **** I did not expect to love him as much as I do. I want to get into the series he's from now, mostly because I love the character, the design, the music, the abilities, the Engrish. It's all perfect.
2. Banjo & Kazooie: What can I say? Great characters, arguably missing Nintendo icons, and more importantly evidence that Sakurai can make magic happen when people don't believe.
3. Hero: A great character who's a lot of fun to use. Represents one of the biggest JRPG franchises of all time, and brings a lot to friendly, just for fun matches. They're fantastic.
4. At this point, there's a significant quality drop off.
5. Byleth: See above. However I will note that Byleth is only here because I feel they would have been better off in the sequel pass, though if he didn't know he'd get a chance to put them in otherwise, I don't mind it as much that Sakurai would go for it. Plus, we haven't used them yet.
6. Joker: The character is dumb fun, but I still, honestly, hold a tiny bit of a grudge against him. When I prefer the content he comes with to him, you know something's wrong. At the same time, though, the moveset is still incredible. But I find Joker not very... likeable, due to the circumstances surrounding his reveal. My hopes and dreams were dashed. Sorry Ren, no amount of me loving your series now changes how I feel about you in Smash in particular. But maybe that'll change.

The pass as a whole: stellar. It does what it set out to do. New worlds brought in to the world of Smash, new playstyles that provide fun takes on characters. Everything's great, and more stages, music and Spirits give more for us to do. And overall, it's been a wild ride. If it were the end, I'd be more than obliged to say thank you all for this crazy road.

But it's not. Anyway, 8/10. Terry individually is 10/10, Banjo is 9/10, Hero is 8/10. Byleth is 5/10, and Joker is 4.5/10. All of these scores account for the Fighter alone, but their content is all 10/10. It could've been better, but overall this lineup is stellar.

 

[Ninjaed]

Garreg Mach Monastery: Infinity/10, perfection. The stage is beautiful and looks even better than the original game. The characters look way worse, though, including Byleth themselves. The music selection is awesome, but Fire Emblem is missing a bunch more good songs. Like the Sacred Stones' library, or Twilight of the Gods, or a bunch of other ones. For rating's sake, 9/10.

Going to interject a bit here: Sakurai did mention the reveal was recorded 2 months in advance with a limited number of employees involved for the utmost secrecy. As a result, some things may change... and I'm assuming that their 3D models have been improved since. They may or may not have been, but until it's out, let's not dismiss the idea.

 

[3BitSaurus]

1/16 Reactions
6/10 - not great, but could have been a lot worse. Byleth is the weakest character in the pass for me when it comes to hype - but as I said in the General Thread, at least they use a FE aspect that isn't Counter, so... okay, I guess. That, and they have several songs, not just remixes of a single one, and a cool-looking stage.

So basically... they're what Corrin should have been. This presentation was basically Nintendo getting right what they got wrong with Corrin, the more I think about it. Unfortunately, while some things are kinda cool... I can't really get hyped for them. That ship sailed a long time ago.

Also, I don't really understand why people are celebrating as if first parties and promotions are somehow more likely because of Three Houses - a game that had no content in Ultimate yet and is from a franchise that notoriously gets some priority compared to the most wanted picks of the core community. I'm still skeptical and think that most - if not all - of the second Pass will be third parties as well. Considering my few first party wants are pretty much dead... I'd be okay with that too.

The highlight of the presentation for me were the Mii Costumes, the more I think about it. The Ubisoft and Cuphead costumes came out of nowhere and may change some things for our ratings in the future. Plus, the joke with Altair landing on hay wasn't lost on me. Still a few questions left unanswered, like why Altair's franchise label was just "Altair" and why Cuphead's costume didn't come with Banjo and Kazooie if they're both from Microsoft.

Finally... six more DLC characters... along the next two years. Strap in, ladies and gentlemen... Sakurai's wild ride never ends. And nearly every third party that was dead is now back in the running - maybe one or two first party promotions as well..

So, general Pass ratings:
- 9/10
- 8/10
- 10/10
- 9.5/10
- 6/10

TOTAL: 8,5/10 - Three characters I really like, one I enjoy and one neutral. In the end, it was indeed worth my money.

Nominations
[Rerate] Travis Touchdown x 5

 

[ShinyRegice]

Byleth being fighter pass 5 means FE:3H gets as a game the same special treatment series introduced in the FP1 got with a new stage and their own spirit board. I didn't expect a new stage to be bundeled with a Nintendo newcomer. And it begs the question of how FP2 characters will be treated. Will they receive their own new stage and spirit board too? AFAIK I don't believe there's info about that, but it might be reasonable to assume it will follow that format. If that's the case then RIP gen 8 Pokémon rep. (And Astral Chain too, but I already considered this one deconfirmed with the recent spirit event because I always thought it was all or nothing for new series. Not that it will prevent me from playing the game. I don't play games just to speculate about Smash content )

It should be noted that there's only one slot left in the stage select screen (SSS) after the new FE:3H stage's release, considering that this high number of DLC characters seems like it wasn't planned when the game released I wonder how the SSS will be arranged. Currently there are 110 slots in the SSS (random + 103 base game + 5 DLC + 1 empty) which makes for a beautiful 10*11 rectangle. Assuming we get 6 more stages (1 for each FP2 newcomer) then there should be 116 slots, but 116's only divisors are 2, 4, 29 and 58. You can't do a beautiful rectangular SSS with that. So either it's not one stage for each FP2 character or the SSS will be rearranged to fir the additional stages, or a combination of both.

PushDustIn said on Twitter that Fighter Pass 2 will feature stages and music too alongside the new fighters (https://twitter.com/PushDustIn/status/1217819495583993856), but I haven't seen a source for that. Can anyone provide evidence from an official source? Not that it's surprising anyway, but I'd like to be sure.

 

[Nemuresu]

Alright, wrote this earlier today because reasons.

Stream's overall satisfaction: 10%-You know, I said that I didn't mind who came after Terry, mainly because he set such a high bar on content that I honestly can't really ask every single fighter to live up to him, and on the context of Byleth being just another character, I'm still totally fine. You know what's the effed up thing about it? The fact that THIS was their ideal closure for this Pass. After everything that the past four characters offered, the guy they chose to close this season was the eighth Fire Emblem character. Not to mention the obscene heat going on everywhere. Not in the mood to break down all the rage, the lame jokes about all that rage or the infantile attempts at sounding badass for liking things others don't. They're all ****ty for the same reason. Not worth anyone's time.

Sounds like I'm not really that enraged, but as I said, Terry set such a high bar that I can't force myself to hate the next characters for not being as filled with content as him. Not to mention, when my brother and I bought the Pass, I kind of already had the idea that I'd be running the risk of lame characters, so I'm not that surprised it did happen. It's just a lame-ass ending to what was prior a really great line-up. I'll be back on school by the time Byleth is out, but once I get my hands on them, I'll do what I've been doing with all DLC characters, play their spirit board with them, try training mode for a while, and if they don't convince, I'll just stick to what I already have

Now, as far as the Mii costumes go? Cuphead looks pretty damn kickass! Not gonna lie, I didn't expect another top-quality outfit after Sans, but here it is. It's a shame he doesn't have a remix, but I'll still take it. Altair is also nice, but his crossover picture bugs me. Why "Smash X Altair" and not just "Smash X Assassin's Creed"? Are there any copyright shenanigans that guaranteed such odd title? Perhaps we're getting Ezio or any of the other dudes later down the line? Who knows.

And finally, Fighters Pass Volume 2. I should be excited, but you know what kind of killed the mood a bit? The date. Every character will be ready before December 2021 ends. Sounds like just a simple placeholder date, but many thought the same about this February and look at where we are, done barely a month before the deadline ends. So yes, I fear that these next guys are going to move at the pace of a tortoise and thus lead into some long droughts of news. I'm still going to buy as soon as possible though, because I love my full rosters and I'm optimistic about these next guys. One character can't outweigh four, and as some some say: hope dies last.

As far as the overall Fighters Pass, here are my scores:
9/10
8/10
7/10
10/10
6/10

In general, the pass was worth it.

That's all I can say, well that and congratulations to Vergeben for once again, showing that he's not spouting bull**** (in the most cynical fashion as well). But then again, someone will always look for a reason to say it's just a lucky guess, even if all the evidence shows it's not the case, that and the fact that if this character was so complicated to leak, then I'm not sure what awaits for these next six guys. Maybe it'll be just another fake-out like Joker, but that's up in the air for now.

 

[GoodGrief741]

So, let's play another game of confirmations/disconfirmations!

Confirmed

Stages outside the Fighter Pass
43.27% Chance - 85.96% Want (first rating)
28.06% Chance - 75.35% Want (second rating)
(I'd appreciate a second source, but PushDustin is claiming that the Japanese website states that FPVol2 will also come with stages and music - and it could be a placeholder at this early stage)

Fire Emblem Three Houses rep
14.81% Chance - 26.68% Want

Second Fighter Pass
40.43% Chance - 94.77% Want

Byleth
13.35% Chance - 40.87% Want

Disconfirmed

Edelgard
28.85% Chance - 25.66% Want (first rating)
13.57% Chance - 50.68% Want (second rating)

Dimitri
4.11% Chance - 37.64% Want

Claude
2.90% Chance - 38.91% Want
We're curently discussing what to do about his scheduled rating.

All DLC will be third-party
65.95% Chance - 39.42% Want

No more stages beyond the Pass
29.96% Chance - 9.32% Want
See above

X
80 noms

So yeah, this was lowkey a bloodbath, though the disconfirmed tend to have lower want scores than the confirmed so I imagine you'll be happy. Also funny to see that Edelgard was seen as likelier, I don't wanna say I told you so, but...

Anyway, going forward, we're starting a new era of DLC, which means that many perceived disconfirmations are now back on the table. It depends on the person, of course, and we have several kinds of disconfirmations. I'm not speaking for the team right now, but in my opinion I'd only say that DLC Costumes and Spirits are the only things that disconfirm (with the exception of Rex because he was chosen very early on). But, yeah, it's going to be exciting times going forward, I hope you'll keep participating!

Also NintenRob congratulations! You alone guessed Byleth would be Fighter 5, and for that you get 100 extra nominations!

 

[Ninjaed]

I do think Rex is disconfirmed though. If Monolith were negotiated with for a new fighter, they'd likely go for KOS-MOS instead because:
- beloved mascot of theirs, several cameos even today (i.e. Project X Zone 2, XC2)
- face of the Xenosaga series, the very first project of the Monolith team
- Sakurai once again said he wants to create new game styles, and KOS-MOS would offer that more than Rex
- Rex mii costume is a bonus for buying the FP1, they're not going to void that

Now mind you, I'm not saying KOS-MOS is a lock or that she's damn likely (I do think it but even I can't deny subjectivity here). All I'm saying is that because of those reasons (and probably more I'm missing atm) if we do get a new Xeno rep, it won't be Rex but KOS-MOS... I doubt Elma would make the cut when compared to KOS-MOS either.

Last thing, speculating just got harder! Sakurai casually handwaved rules some took for certain like only 3rd party characters and only new IPs (remember his new gaming worlds line?).

 

[GoodGrief741]

Spoiler: Nominations post-1/16 Livestream Predictions pre-1/16 Livestream Reactions

Toxtricity x115
The Blob (De Blob) x105
Kazuma Kiryu x105
Freddy Fazbear x105
Crypto x95
Carmen Sandiego x95
[Rerate] Ryu Hayabusa x90

100 - 51

Mii Costume: Hollow Knight x85
Ryo Hazuki x80
Gex x80
Proto Man x75
Papyrus x75
Sackboy x70
Brian (Quest 64) x65
Decidueye x62
Reporter & Wrestler x60
[Rerate] Waluigi x58
[Rerate] Bandana Dee x55
Chun-Li x53

50 - 25

Dwight Fairfield (Dead by Daylight) x50
[Rerate] Dante x50
Meowth x50
Concept: Echo Fighters post-Fighter Pass x50
Concept: Pokéball Pokémon becomes playable x49
Earthworm Jim x45
Echo: Zeraora (41e) x40
Kasumi (Dead or Alive) x35
[Rerate] Reimu Hakurei x35
Concept: Octopath Traveler rep x35
Concept: Devolver Digital rep x30
Urbosa x25

Under 25

Boss: Ender Dragon x24
Giygas x23
[Rerate] Crash Bandicoot x20
Concept: Assist Trophies added in updates x20
Ring Fit Adventurer x20
Big Daddy (BioShock) x20
Rival Pokémon Trainer x17
[Rerate] Rayman x15
[Rerate] Paper Mario x15
Echo: Lord Fredrik (67e) x15
[Rerate] Travis Touchdown x15
Echo: Dark Bowser (14e) x13
[Rerate] Skull Kid x12
[Rerate] Doomguy x10
[Rerate] Jin Kazama x10
Terra Branford x8
Black Shadow x7
Sparky (Clash Royale) x5
Concept: Overwatch character x5
Gordon Freeman x5
Asha (Wonder Boy) x5
Nightmare (Soul Calibur) x5
[Rerate] Monster Hunter x5
[Rerate] Isaac x5
Alucard (Castlevania) x5
Concept: Darksiders rep x5
Urshifu x5
Segata Sanshiro x5
Chell x3
[Rerate] Andy x2
Taranza x1

Toxtricity breaks up his tie with Kazuma Kiryu and Freddy Fazbear, zaps past The Blob to take number 1. Carmen Sandiego sneaks past Ryu Hayabusa and ties with Crypto for fifth.

Bandana Dee waddles past 50 noms.

I do think Rex is disconfirmed though. If Monolith were negotiated with for a new fighter, they'd likely go for KOS-MOS instead because:
- beloved mascot of theirs, several cameos even today (i.e. Project X Zone 2, XC2)
- face of the Xenosaga series, the very first project of the Monolith team
- Sakurai once again said he wants to create new game styles, and KOS-MOS would offer that more than Rex
- Rex mii costume is a bonus for buying the FP1, they're not going to void that

Now mind you, I'm not saying KOS-MOS is a lock or that she's damn likely (I do think it but even I can't deny subjectivity here). All I'm saying is that because of those reasons (and probably more I'm missing atm) if we do get a new Xeno rep, it won't be Rex but KOS-MOS... I doubt Elma would make the cut when compared to KOS-MOS either.

Last thing, speculating just got harder! Sakurai casually handwaved rules some took for certain like only 3rd party characters and only new IPs (remember his new gaming worlds line?).

Monolith doesn't own KOS-MOS, Bandai Namco does. And Monolith doesn't need negotiation as Nintendo owns them outright. And Xenosaga isn't even the team's first project, that's Xenogears.

 

[BowserKing]

My reactions

First of all, I was right that the fighter's pass will have a Nintendo character, and that a Three Houses Rep will appear in some form (was expecting Edelgard, but Byleth got in. And Byleth had unique abilities, including an axe and a bow, that makes Byleth different from the other Fire Emblem characters, so that is good.

Second, the stage is quite unique and fun, with all sorts of stuff in it, plus new soundtracks as well. And some new spirits to boot.

Third, I'm surprised that Cuphead got in as a Mii Costume, and same thing for the Rabbids. It's good that Ubisoft got more then just a spirit. Also we are getting a second fighters pass, with 6 fighters in it, that is hype.

Overall, this is worthy of DLC.

Ratings are 85% (), 75% (), 95% (), 75% () and 80% (Byleth)

Noms: 4 for Pokeball Pokémon Promotion and 1 for Echo: Dark Bowser (14E)

 

[I.D.]

And Xenosaga isn't even the team's first project, that's Xenogears.

Monolithsoft didn't exist when Xenogears was made. That was back when Tetsuya Takahashi worked for Squaresoft.

 

[warpenguin55]

Ratings:

Byleth: 7/10
I'm OK with it. Fire Emblem 3 Houses is a great game and deserves a place in Smash. Nintendo really wants to push Fire Emblem as one of their top franchises, so another Fire Emblem character was going to happen at some point. My biggest issue with the choice is that I wanted Edelgard. Byleth is the boring choice imo. At least Sakurai knew the House Leaders were important enough to make them alt costumes. The Claude and Edelgard colors look really close to the actual characters, if you wanted them over Byleth maybe you can still feel like you're playing them.


Direct: 8/10
I don't have much to say on the direct. It did what it needed to do. Byleth's moveset was explain well, the stage and tracks are good. Cuphead's Mii costume is great and I'm buying that. I like that the next fighters pass was confirmed with an extra character. I think they should have revealed the 1st fighter in the new pass. Byleth was going to be a divisive pick, and I think the blow could been softened by announcing another character. I do think people over hyped themselves for it.

Fighters Pass: 9/10
Overall, pretty good pass, but not perfect. For fun, my rankings of each pass character

1: Joker
Objectively the best DLC fighter. Joker's reveal was absolutely amazing. He was a character I wanted pretty badly, but I thought he was an unrealistic pick and never gave him a chance for inclusion. Good thing I was wrong too. Joker is my favorite fighter in Ultimate. I spammed the crap out of him and I wasn't disappointed. The stage is cool and the tracks are good. I do see people complain that Joker's moveset doesn't rep him the best. It doesn't bother me but I can see why people think that. Only 1 persona showing up is a strange choice and you probably could have kept the rebellion gage and just got other personas involved with other moves instead of just Arsene. It doesn't bug me too much though.

2: Hero
I love Hero. I actually really like the amount of RNG he has. Every game feels unique and I love spamming command menus. Hero has made some really funny moments for me and my family when he's in the game. A few examples, I got a game winning Whack with 2 seconds left on the clock, my random Kamakaze out of a Hocus Pocus resulting in the game being paused for about 3 minutes while my brother and I laughed our asses off, and 2 more minutes for me to stop raging about it. A few times the hero player gets too excited at the start of the fight, rapid fires the first thing on the command menu and either gets either Kamakaze or Magic Burst. Another reason I like Hero's inclusion was that it got me into Dragon Quest. When I found out about the Dragon Quest 11 demo on switch, I was super bored and said f it, why not. I ended up buying the full game and I'm still playing it. It's a really fun game.


My major complaint is that I think Hero's execution was botched. 2 Tracks per hero. The spirit board having mostly generic enemies. The stage isn't very fun imo either. Square Enix, why are you like this? The good out weighs the bad imo, it's definitely confusing as to why Square didn't want to go all out. Wasn't the rumor that they wanted Dragon Quest in smash to get more people in the west to play it. I think they should have had more tracks than 2 per hero, and the spirit board should have had some party members from games that weren't DQ11.

3: Terry
I had some serious doubts about this one. When the website leaked SNK, my first though was "What's SNK?". Then for the 2 or so days between the website leak and the direct where Terry was being speculated on, it was "Literally Who?". When Terry was revealed, I wasn't hyped for him, but still was going to give him a shot. I had never heard of him at all until the website leak, so screw it, I'll wait for more info. Turns out I like playing him. Terry also came with the best stage. KOF Stadium is one of my favorite Battle Royal stages, along side Temple and New Pork City. The only reason Terry isn't #2 is because Hero got me to give the Dragon Quest demo a shot, and it's a game I really enjoy.


4: Byleth
Byleth could leapfrog Terry, but on paper he doesn't have what it takes. There's not really alot more to say about him that I didn't already put above. One thing I did want to talk about is that I don't think Fire Emblem is over repped. Nintendo clearly thinks Fire Emblem has the potential to be a major franchise and therefore, it does deserve to get attention in Smash. The complaint of "Anime Swordfighter" isn't a good complaint either. It's a stupid and illogical complaint. By this kind of logic, Donkey Kong doesn't deserve more reps because it's just a bunch of monkeys. Earthbound reps, nah we don't need any more magical little kids. Pokemon? Why do we need another mutant animal? Kirby is a hard pass too, we have enough cute blobs. See how stupid that sounds? It's such a lazy comment to make.

I do agree Corrin didn't deserve his smash invite though.


5: Banjo-Kazooie
I like the fact that Banjo-Kazooie made it in. They've been wanted for a long time, and probably were the character of the pass for a lot of people. Banjo-Kazooie doesn't do much for me though, which is why they get the bottom slot for me. I didn't grow up with Banjo, I really only knew them from people wanting them in Smash. Banjo is kinda fun to play, but prefer other characters much more. I don't really like the stage that much either. When I play Battle Royals on it I always lose myself. What I do like is the music. Spiral Mountain is my favorite. It's such a happy and fun track. I listened to it to help cool down after that rant I went on about Byleth.


Noms:
GoodGrief741 is Echo FIghters post pass a viable thing to nom anymore?

If so Echo Fighters post pass x5

If not, Octopath Rep x5

 

[GoodGrief741]

Monolithsoft didn't exist when Xenogears was made. That was back when Tetsuya Takahashi worked for Squaresoft.

Yeah, and tons of members of the Xenogears team left Square with Takahashi to found Monolith, and worked on Xenosaga. Hence, the same team.

GoodGrief741 is Echo FIghters post pass a viable thing to nom anymore?

I don't see why not.

 

[I.D.]

Yeah, and tons of members of the Xenogears team left Square with Takahashi to found Monolith, and worked on Xenosaga. Hence, the same team.

The guy you replied to specifically mentioned monolith though.

 

[chocolatejr9]

1/16 Direct Reactions

Okay, real talk, the way they handled Byleth was genius. As many of us know, Smash has a tendancy to end on lackluster reveals (Brawl had Olimar, 4 had Duck Hunt, Ultimate had Incineroar), and as a result people thought Nintendo would learn from that. And they did... just not the way we expected. We all knew Three Houses would get something in Smash, so it was the most-predictable thing. So what did Nintendo do? They had all the hype announcements come first to throw us off. And it worked! Joker, Hero, Banjo, and Terry all got people's expectations high, causing them to make tinfoil hat theories about who Fighter 5 would be. As a result, we all tossed aside the idea of Byleth being in Smash because he was "too predictable"... just like they planned. Then, while we were busy making conspiracy theories, Nintendo slipped Byleth in as Fighter 5, which by this point, nobody expected. In short, the most predictable character to add became LEAST predictable!

At least, that's what I think...

Anyway, Byleth looks pretty cool, especially with the Weapon Triangle aspect. Garreg Mach is what you'd expect, and Cuphead music is coming, which is always nice. Honestly, my one complaint is that God-Shattering Star isn't coming, but hey, at least we got Apex of the World.

Nominations: Freddy Fazbear x5

 

[NintenRob]

Appreciate the extra 100 noms, probably gonna hold on to the for now.

Satisfaction

Byleth
7/10. He came at good time for me. I was getting really tired third parties absolutely dominating discussion. People were so convinced that it had to be all third party, even after the pass. That it's nice to see this wake up call. Also I kinda wanted all 3 house leaders and he does use their weapons.

The fighters pass
8/10

Banjo >>>>> Byleth = Hero >>> Terry > Joker.

Banjo was among most wanted so he carries the score a lot. But I thought Hero made a ton of sense and the alts were an awesome surprise. Eight is my favourite there, really want to play them. Terry and Joker were kinda duds for me, especially Joker who lacks Nintendo presence.

Other stuff was nice, Mii costumes were neat. Will probably get Cuphead for song (even though it doesn't quite have same impact as megalovania) again hoping for something first party but we got Byleth.


Really happy about Garreg Mach Monastery. To me it was the perfect Fire Emblem stage with how much time you spend there.


Nominate Carmen Sandiego x5

 

[Ninjaed]

Monolith doesn't own KOS-MOS, Bandai Namco does. And Monolith doesn't need negotiation as Nintendo owns them outright. And Xenosaga isn't even the team's first project, that's Xenogears.

Obviously Namco owns the rights to KOS-MOS, but it's also Monolith's baby so both would need to be involved.
Monolith may be owned by Nintendo, they'd still need to be included in the negotiations and would have their input on that decision.
Xenosaga is Monolith's first project. The individuals themselves come from Xenogears but the first project of Monolith Soft is Xenosaga Episode 1.

Sorry if I wasn't clear enough. It looks like we actually agree and both know our facts so that's miscommunication on my end. Whether that's enough to dismiss Rex in favour of KOS-MOS... YMMV. I'd say yes, especially with the costume as a bundle bonus treatment but others may think otherwise.

 

[NintenRob]

One thing I am taken aback by, 6 dlc characters in the next fighters pass. Specifically 6.

It sort of messes with my maths a little. I figured when all was said and done, there would be 16 DLC characters total, fill in those slots and turn the css into that perfect square. It would line up well with 3 fighter passes too. But now a fighter pass with 6? Maybe I was wrong. Quite easily the case. Maybe the other four will be standalone characters. Maybe they will be echoes. I believe four echoes would perfectly square the echoless roster too (I think)

 

[Deleted member]

Byleth Reveal:

I HATE MY LIFE

With that fake angry reaction out of the way, holy **** this was not what I was expecting at all, and tbh, I actually like it. I figured Byleth would be the frontrunner for a 1st Party Pick as DLC, but I never expected him to be FP5 at all. There was basically nothing leading towards Byleth being FP5, let alone 1 of the characters in the Fighter Pass. He happened to be the only Nintendo character I wanted in Smash anyways, so I guess this makes it 1/5 for characters I wanted for this Pass. I sure know Byleth will probably be the next DLC character I'll play the most after Hero. He's already looking to be my favorite Fire Emblem character in Smash with how his moveset looks, and I also really dig fem Byleth as well. Too bad there's only going to be 9 Spirit Battles coming with him thoe. Three Houses has a lot of characters, so to see there only be 9 spirits bummed me out on wanting a Fighter Pack with more spirit battles than Castlevania

Byleth's Trailer:

Oh boy, this trailer's not great. They gave it away as soon as they showed the ground, and that made it pretty disappointing tbh. It would've been better for it to just do what a lot of other trailers did and lead up to who it could be slowly instead of instantly showing us Byleth right away. I also didn't like how they used the mouse clicking sound effect during the trailer; was there no other sound effect that could make it sound cooler than that? At least Fem Byleth looked great thoe. That was the best part of the whole thing.

Garreg Mach Monastery:

It's a pretty good looking stage, and all the cameos are good as well. It's a shame that they can't get everybody in, but I can't really complain since it'd take even longer for Sakurai and friends to add all the House members anyways.

Random Notes:
-I never knew Fire Emblem has 17 games excluding the spinoffs. If that isn't a clear sign that Fire Emblem is 1 of Nintendo's biggest IPs then I don't know what is.
-Sakurai is hardcore as ****. He played Three Houses pre-release with a limited set of days just to get as much references to the game as possible.
-I hope Byleth won't be the only character that somewhat wields a spear in Smash.
-Sakurai kept on making vague spoilers while also saying he doesn't want to spoil us. This madman I swear
-Team Fire Emblem blew a 4 - 1 lead. What a bunch of losers.

Mii Costumes:
-Altair is an interesting pick. I dunno why it wasn't listed as Assassin's Creed when the thing popped up, but it sure did caught me offguard.
-Rabbids being hats is the best outcome for people like me who have no interest in seeing them playable in Smash. I'd probably buy it just to mash it with the Sans costume for ****s and giggles.
-Interesting how the Mega Man costumes came back in this cycle of Costumes. There were some Mega Man costumes released on the same day as BK, so I wonder if Mega Man costumes will lead to the reveals of Indie Mii Costumes.
-I like that Cuphead made a lot of people happy, but I wasn't as crazy about it as the Sans costume. I don't really know why that is, but I sure am looking forward to what other indie characters get the Mii Costume treatment. A lot of people are probably looking at Hollow Knight being the next character getting a costume, but I'm really hoping for Sakurai and friends to make a Mii Costume out of Jacket from Hotline Miami. Of all the Indie titles out there, Jacket would be the 1 I'd buy in a heartbeat.

Fighter Pass Vol 2:

It's nice to know there's going to be 6 Fighter Packs this time around. Now, I can start going stir crazy over the idea that 2 of those Fighter Packs involve 2 Musou franchises which is why there's 6 in total haha. We don't know anything else from Vol 2 other than what was shown, so I'm guessing there will be more info dropping sometime in Spring.

Sakurai's Last Bit:

Sakurai doesn't consider Smash Bros a fighting game but more of a celebration of gaming, which means Fire Emblem is officially the best franchise in Smash and there's nothing you can do about it!

Overall, I give this a 85% rating. It wasn't what I wanted from FP5, but I'm not mad about it cause Byleth happens to be the only 1st Party character I wanted as DLC.

Noms:
Devolver Digital Rep x5

 

[3DSNinja]

Alright, final Byleth score.
90%.
I honestelly was confused as to why I wasn't dissapointed or angry like I was with Corrin. Then I realized something.
Corrin was from an unreleased game that I absolutely hated. Byleth was from a game that I loved and had already released, and used weapons beyond a sword. (I don't like Corrin. First character I would cut in a heartbeat.)
MII COSTUMES:
Altair i never saw coming. But why didn't they choose Ezio? Ezio might be DLC lol.
Rabbids got what they deserved
I honestly thought they would bring the Mega Man costumes with Dante... Eh
Cuphead is sick. More music is always great. Not as great as Sans though.
Ranking the FP fighters
> > Byleth > >>>>>>>>
Nominations: Freddy Fazbear x5

 

[Jomosensual]

The reception in here and on Smashboard in general has been a lot better than I expected it to be. In a discord or 2 where people are really mad still about it all

 

[chocolatejr9]

The reception in here and on Smashboard in general has been a lot better than I expected it to be. In a discord or 2 where people are really mad still about it all

Don't forget Twitter. It's either people hating Byleth, or people hating people hating Byleth.

 

[Sari]

The reception in here and on Smashboard in general has been a lot better than I expected it to be. In a discord or 2 where people are really mad still about it all

Twitter and r/smashbros were the biggest dumpsters (though to be fair that sub has always been toxic as hell).

I legit saw tweets with tons of likes/favorites that said that Sakurai should be fired for adding Byleth. Big yikes from me.

 

[GoodGrief741]

I honestelly was confused as to why I wasn't dissapointed or angry like I was with Corrin. Then I realized something.
Corrin was from an unreleased game that I absolutely hated. Byleth was from a game that I loved and had already released

It's honestly embarrassing that Sakurai didn't realize something so obvious when he included Corrin. Corrin the character I hate, but Corrin the fighter that was so unnecessary, unwanted, and unfairly added that made the Smash fandom hate Fire Emblem? That, I can't forgive.

 

[NintenRob]

I do wish Sakurai would show this kind of love to other franchises now.

It's still insulting we haven't had a Kirby stage from anything newer than Super Star. Hopefully a fighter pass with Bandana Dee fixes that.

 

[Jomosensual]

It's honestly embarrassing that Sakurai didn't realize something so obvious when he included Corrin. Corrin the character I hate, but Corrin the fighter that was so unnecessary, unwanted, and unfairly added that made the Smash fandom hate Fire Emblem? That, I can't forgive.

I think I read before that he didn't want Corrin but didn't expect things to get this bad either. It's a shame that we're at the point where any FE rep might as well be Goku getting in. Corrin was really dumb in all regards though. Boring character from a bad game that not even FE fans liked and it sucks that an awesome game is getting hate because of how awful Fates in Smash was

 

[Sid-cada]

Byleth Reactions

Overall Score - 35% - As I'm not a fan of RPG's this wasn't my cup of tea. For Fire Emblem specifically I tried Awakening but lost interest to the point where I never finished. I understand that Three Houses was a good game, but I think this was not the time to reveal them. I feel like they may have been better received as a starter to the next pack, as a way to say that Nintendo Characters are now on the table. A lot of hopes for third parties were on the table, so there's a bit of a letdown when it turns out to be something some people might be tempted to call a shill pick.

As far as move set is concerned, Byleth's fine, if not wow inducing. It works and is functional, but nothing that screams must buy to me. They at least seem more inventive than the typical Fire Emblem folk. While I might have been okay with it if it were a base game character, as DLC it's not enough for me to buy.

Overall, the DLC has been heavy on misses the last few characters. 2/5 being characters I would consider buying isn't exactly a good track record. I can take Hero and BK, but with no PS4 I have no reason to support Joker, dislike the complex controls of fighting game characters like Terry, and are left with a character I don't care enough about in Byleth.

At the very least, with Nintendo Characters back on the table and with 7 new characters to be added, I can at least take solstice in the fact that characters I like are more likely to get in, including my most wanted in B. Dee. Here's hoping...

 

[GoodGrief741]

Byleth Reactions

Overall Score - 35% - As I'm not a fan of RPG's this wasn't my cup of tea. For Fire Emblem specifically I tried Awakening but lost interest to the point where I never finished. I understand that Three Houses was a good game, but I think this was not the time to reveal them. I feel like they may have been better received as a starter to the next pack, as a way to say that Nintendo Characters are now on the table. A lot of hopes for third parties were on the table, so there's a bit of a letdown when it turns out to be something some people might be tempted to call a shill pick.

As far as move set is concerned, Byleth's fine, if not wow inducing. It works and is functional, but nothing that screams must buy to me. They at least seem more inventive than the typical Fire Emblem folk. While I might have been okay with it if it were a base game character, as DLC it's not enough for me to buy.

Overall, the DLC has been heavy on misses the last few characters. 2/5 being characters I would consider buying isn't exactly a good track record. I can take Hero and BK, but with no PS4 I have no reason to support Joker, dislike the complex controls of fighting game characters like Terry, and are left with a character I don't care enough about in Byleth.

At the very least, with Nintendo Characters back on the table and with 7 new characters to be added, I can at least take solstice in the fact that characters I like are more likely to get in, including my most wanted in B. Dee. Here's hoping...

This is meant with no ill will, but I'm curious. You say RPGs aren't your thing. I remember you previously said that stuff like character actioners aren't your speed either. And before that I recall that you can't do complicated inputs for fighters. I was just wondering what genres of games are you into?

 

[FancySmash]

Oh gee, these days are always the hardest...

OK, OK. Reactions. Let's get the easy stuff out of the way.

If you give Mii a costume
They're cool. I mean, I've never played Assassin's Creed, but it's interesting to see Altair and Rabbids as a costume but not Rayman. They hiding something for the second pass? Maybe, but there is still much confusion on those spirits. It would also appear Megaman is getting some more Mii Costumes as well. But the real star of the Mii costumes had to be Cuphead. It would seem another Sans was pulled, and I'm enjoying these types of Mii costumes. Now I only hope that future smash titles with mii fighters don't say "Mii Gunner" or "Mii Brawler" when you win. Ruins the immersion for me to be honest. I'd rather have the narrator go silent and the Mii's name splash on the screen.

Pass 2: Return of Pass
No opinion whatsoever. What? Can you blame me? We don't know anything about it yet. If it's a repeat of this pass with the majority being 3rd party, I probably won't get much out of it. I'll have to wait the... 2 years. Oof, that's quite the wait. Hope it's worth it.

FP5, or how I broke the fanbase
...
No. I don't want to... ugh, fine.

Ya know, every time we have to come here to talk about this series, I wonder if it's a running gag to the outsiders looking in. Yes yes, Fire Emblem once again stole the 1st Party newcomer slot. On one hand, it's more warranted. For one, Three Houses is a game people actually care about compared to Corrin's, and it's finally addressing the fact that no other weapon in the game gets utilized. So, problem solved... some of them. Non resolved issues? Well for one, they clearly didn't learn their lesson with Corrin. Using that kind of character to end a pass? Yeah, it's not a good idea. Another, the representation thing. For the most part, this is an internal issue in the fanbase, there's no such thing as 'slots' (unless you're Pokemon so a spot is immediately reserved for you). But uh, I can't deny, it looks biased when fans notice that the Mario, Pokemon, and of course, Fire Emblem series' get constant attention while a series like Zelda or Kirby is supposedly good where it is. I just don't buy that. Even if we do end up getting someone like Impa or Bandana Dee in pass 2, to save them until after a series that actually did get a newcomer already (albeit an echo) in the base game isn't gonna get you good attention. What's worse, if you don't plan on adding characters for these series that have been neglected, well, that's just it, those fans feel neglected. I mean, I cannot deny, when Arms and Rex were considered too recent, but Three Houses that didn't release until during the DLC session, uh, yeah, something's wrong there.

I'm not gonna pretend I'm not greatful for characters like King K. Rool or Ridley, giving the long neglected DK and Metroid fanbases something after so long felt good. I guess I was kinda hoping every first party series would get something like that. Hmm, at the very least though, I'm glad the weapon part of FE has been resolved with the characters play style and mechanics. However, whenever the matter of representation is brought up again (not that it probably should, but hey, things happen), I can no longer use that to defend the series. At this point, it really does represent the series well, and I don't think another is needed.

As for the reveal itself, well, I'm not a Fire Emblem fan, so it really didn't do anything for me. Honestly, the trailer was a bit dragged out, kinda felt like a base game trailer if I'm being honest. It also didn't help that we got another FE history lesson.

"SMASH FANS! YOU ARE GONNA LEARN ABOUT THE FIRE EMBLEM SERIES AGAIN, AND YOU ARE GONNA LIKE IT!"

Always best to end on humor I say.

Nominations: Meowth x5

 

[GuiltyGyarados]

0% satisfaction with anything to do with this Byleth direct. Nobody who isn't already a Fire Emblem fan cares about Fire Emblem, so this was a really deflating experience for me. Considered quitting the game. Haven't felt this way since Bayonetta was revealed in Smash 4.

This isn't even a case where I can say "I'm happy for Fire Emblem fans," because Fire Emblem fans are spoiled rotten as it is, with their EIGHT reps. It just feels so lame and cynical and corporate and insulting. The more Nintendo keeps trying to shove this franchise down my throat, the less I want to play it. It's really starting to feel like a psyop, and I'm not even joking.

People here seem to be more on the Byleth side, and thinks anyone who doesn't like Byleth is "toxic," which I think is pretty toxic. It's okay to not like things.

On a positive note... Six more characters. Yay. They're all gonna be blue-haired anime swordsmen, though, so it's hard to be too excited about that.

 

[Ninjaed]

People here seem to be more on the Byleth side, and thinks anyone who doesn't like Byleth is "toxic," which I think is pretty toxic. It's okay to not like things.

I don't know who you're referring to but from what I've read, people here are accepting both of Byleth and of people not liking the fact there's another FE rep in smash. Folks have the right to be happy or disappointed, can't blame anyone for feeling the way they do - both good or bad.

Also we haven't had a single blue-haired anime swordsman in the Fighters Pass! Byleth's hair is green not blue...

 

[Sid-cada]

This is meant with no ill will, but I'm curious. You say RPGs aren't your thing. I remember you previously said that stuff like character actioners aren't your speed either. And before that I recall that you can't do complicated inputs for fighters. I was just wondering what genres of games are you into?

Platformers, mostly. I don't care about 2D vs. 3D, as I've enjoyed both, but I mostly joined the gaming sphere after the fallout of the collect-a-thon, so 3D stuff naturally tends to be harder to find. I do have A Hat in Time on the Switch sitting at home, but I haven't had time to get to it. Mario Odyssey was fun, but I'm not the crazy sort of guy to go for 100% on that game. 3D World was also fine, but World Star was about the limit of my capabilities. Kirby's always been a favorite, and I've 100% just about all the games I've played.

Not to say that I haven't dipped my toes into other genres, but I tend to game at a somewhat glacial pace, so I can't enjoy every game I want to get. I enjoyed my time with Wind Waker HD and Samus Returns (got 100% on Samus, but only finished Wind Waker), but that's the only games I've managed to play of those series. Perhaps it's my distaste for RPGs may contribute to it, but it's telling that the only Pokemon game that I've played is Mystery Dungeon Blue! I spent a huge amount of time on Splatoon 1, though.

Right now for Christmas Gifts got Shovel Knight Treasure Trove sitting at home, and also have Hollow Knight ready to go to alongside Hat. I've done Shovel of Hope, but haven't gotten around to playing anything else, as I've been away on vacation.

I think that about does it for explaining game taste, though. Hopefully this has been enlightening!

 

[DaUsername]

Okay, I guess I'll post some "normal" direct reactions.

Well, congratulations Sakurai December 15 is no longer the worst Smash livestream anymore! YAAAYY!! *Confetti flies everywhere*
You know, instead of talking about all the bad things from this garbage fire (I'll save that for the satisfaction day), I think I'll list the few good things instead.
1. Cuphead Mii costume! With music! Cool!
2. Rabbids got Mii costume'd. Which is good because they were one of the potential Smash characters I hated even more than FE shill pick #8.
3. Actually yeah that's about it.

I guess I'll post fighter pass rankings since everyone else is doing it.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>[I could keep doing this until I reach the character limit]>>>>>>>>:ultByleth:

Noms: Rillaboom x5

 

[TCT~Phantom]

Ok, with the initial reactions out of the way, time to give satisfaction scores for Byleth and the Fighters Pass.

Byleth
60% Satisfaction

Byleth is the worst character in the pass. In terms of smash newcomers this set, I dislike Plant more and personally did not like Isabelle. Byleth to me is like Incineroar was in base game. A character I did not really want but they did a knockout job with.

Byleth using the Hero’s Relic is a weird choice but tbh it works. I’m glad it’s something to make them represent Fire Emblem better. I overall really like the moveset chosen. Those aerials except for Nair look super strong too. I’ve been itching for a swordsman on my roster of characters but outside of Cloud and Shulk who was nerfed hard and I need way more practice with retrospectively no one has satisfied.

Garreg Mach looks great. I could nitpick on how the Dining Hall and Fishing pond were not chosen when I spent most of my time there but they did a great job. Music selection was good too.

A disappointment but not the worst thing in the world.

Fighters Pass 1
90% Satisfaction

Joker and Banjo are my mains now, so I love them. Terry and Hero both are cool but I can’t play for my life. Messing around with them casually is a ton of fun tho. This would have been higher if it didn’t end on a low note.


Housekeeping stuff for rerates. I’m thinking either folding the characters left on the schedule into the rerate schedule or finishing the week and then do rerates. What are all your thoughts on that?

as for rerates, since we know we have at least 6 more characters and a whole new season there’s a lot to reassess.

Also as of now here’s my prediction
Travis Touchdown
Phoenix Wright
Crash
Doomguy
Arle Nadja
Geno/Waluigi