Ragnarok Mafia - Game over!

[T-block]

Mkay. That's fine then.

 

[Killstic]

Acrostic here. I posted this in the social thread, however in case you guys missed it I will be V|LA from Friday to possibly Sunday the latest. Werekill should be able to field questions in my absence. I also apologize for my lack of activity yesterday and will try to answer questions addressed to me later tonight.

 

[Gova]

I do believe in the possibility of mutual exclusivity. But I don't believe that his fos is completely coincidental. I think that his justification on me seems plausible but I disagree with his assessment of JTB and dabuz.

Why do you beleive in mutal exclusivity? I don't see that being the case here as I've explained how DH can dislike T-Block and the people on the wagon. What do you mean by you don't believe his FoS is completely coincidental?

Would be willing to lynch inactives if they don't start posting.

 

[Killstic]

Killstic's other head here. I was staying out of the way so that Acrostic could reply to questions without me tripping him up.

So far, I don't like Dark Horse and T-Block, with both being null/leaning scum. I don't like this from DH:

Dislike kill's latest post.

The first paragraph just seemes to be...writing critique, and a restatement, with an ending fos that you didn't explain

I mean, writing an analysis should sound like critique, right? Besides that, it was only a minor FoS in the post (and was stated as such) that was based on the paragraph it was located in and previous opinions. I don't see what there is to gain by pushing on the FoS.

T-Block I still don't like because of how he responded to my earlier pressure and the fact that he took freaking forever to respond to several questions. I say "took forever," even though I'm not sure if he even answered a couple questions. Feel free to prove me wrong, though; it'll save me from confusion later on.

Anyway, they're both null leaning scum with not enough scumminess for me to be completely clamoring for a lynch, yet I wouldn't mind potentially seeing a lynch if the scummy play continues.

@Gova: Lynching inactives is never a bad way to spend D1, imo, but we should see if the mod can find a replacement first.

 

[Gova]

Not if Newbie 13 is an indication of anything.

 

[Killstic]

Haha, well, if we HAD gone on and lynched Pheonix/Seikend (which we were doing for inactivity reasons), we would have hit scum.

The replacement just threw us for a loop, and since there wasn't really any other valid lynch, we went for another inactive.

 

[#HBC | Dark Horse]

I mean, writing an analysis should sound like critique, right? Besides that, it was only a minor FoS in the post (and was stated as such) that was based on the paragraph it was located in and previous opinions. I don't see what there is to gain by pushing on the FoS.

@bolded: The main thing I was attacking when I said writing critique was how the beginning of your "analysis" had nothing to do with T-blocks attack, and was instead focusing on how he phrased it, with a rewrite.

@Italics: So then, what's the difference between a minor Fos, a regular FoS, and a Vote? You seem to be defending yourself with "It was only a minor FoS here," so I'd like to see the distinction.

@underline: "Nothing to gain by pushing on the FoS?"
You could, say, strengthen your read. Why did you automatically assume there was nothing to gain?

Notice how this doesn't explain the original reason why kill voted T-Block? the attack on T-block in this post is based on current information.

Anyway, they're both null leaning scum with not enough scumminess for me to be completely clamoring for a lynch, yet I wouldn't mind potentially seeing a lynch if the scummy play continues.

SO now we're "not scummy enough to lynch?"

Interesting, you thought I was scummy enough for a fos, but now I'm "not scummy enough to lynch?"

This reads like you trying to play it safe, to avoid upsetting people byt thinking i'm scum.

Same with T-Block.

 

[#HBC | Dark Horse]

I mean, writing an analysis should sound like critique, right? Besides that, it was only a minor FoS in the post (and was stated as such) that was based on the paragraph it was located in and previous opinions. I don't see what there is to gain by pushing on the FoS.

@bolded: The main thing I was attacking when I said writing critique was how the beginning of your "analysis" had nothing to do with T-blocks attack, and was instead focusing on how he phrased it, with a rewrite.

@Italics: So then, what's the difference between a minor Fos, a regular FoS, and a Vote? You seem to be defending yourself with "It was only a minor FoS here," so I'd like to see the distinction.

@underline: "Nothing to gain by pushing on the FoS?"
You could, say, strengthen your read. Why did you automatically assume there was nothing to gain?

Notice how this doesn't explain the original reason why kill voted T-Block? the attack on T-block in this post is based on current information.

Anyway, they're both null leaning scum with not enough scumminess for me to be completely clamoring for a lynch, yet I wouldn't mind potentially seeing a lynch if the scummy play continues.

SO now we're "not scummy enough to lynch?"

Interesting, you thought I was scummy enough for a fos, but now I'm "not scummy enough to lynch?"

This reads like you trying to play it safe, to avoid upsetting people byt thinking i'm scum.

Same with T-Block.

 

[Terywj [태리]]

Before this gets any worse, I think I will most likely be replacing out. I should probably play in another Newbie if I really wanna get back into Mafia, and signing up to play during this week was a huge mistake. I'm ********.

 

[Killstic]

@bolded: The main thing I was attacking when I said writing critique was how the beginning of your "analysis" had nothing to do with T-blocks attack, and was instead focusing on how he phrased it, with a rewrite.

Phrasing can be quite important, and I'm not in Acrostic's head, so I can't really answer this quite so well.

@Italics: So then, what's the difference between a minor Fos, a regular FoS, and a Vote? You seem to be defending yourself with "It was only a minor FoS here," so I'd like to see the distinction.

I'd think that since an FoS doesn't count at all for any counts, they're unimportant and can be used in a way that shows that you are MINORLY suspicious of a person if you state that it is a minor FoS.

A vote is quite different from an FoS, and I hope you realize that and are just using the concept of a vote as a joke part of your question.

@underline: "Nothing to gain by pushing on the FoS?"
You could, say, strengthen your read. Why did you automatically assume there was nothing to gain?

There was literally nothing to gain. We had already been suspicious of T-Block and were suspicious enough to pressure vote him, so how is it unreasonable to think that we wanted to put a minor FoS on him? The FoS was valid based on previous information and Acrostic's paragraph.

Notice how this doesn't explain the original reason why kill voted T-Block? the attack on T-block in this post is based on current information.

You do realize that we've said several times that it was a pressure vote, right? And yes, current information is useful, but since we didn't want to pressure him that much at that moment, a minor FoS was perfectly handy.

Hell, I even stated it in my previous post:

T-Block I still don't like because of how he responded to my earlier pressure and the fact that he took freaking forever to respond to several questions

Are you even reading this thread, or is this just a bad attack?

SO now we're "not scummy enough to lynch?"

Interesting, you thought I was scummy enough for a fos, but now I'm "not scummy enough to lynch?"

This reads like you trying to play it safe, to avoid upsetting people byt thinking i'm scum.

Same with T-Block.

Hello, we're a hyrda. We're allowed to have slightly varying opinions on this game. Acrostic has been playing the majority of this game, and he thought you were scummy enough for an FoS. I, personally, saw no reason for an FoS in the middle of me simply stating my reads instead of a case of any sort, so I didn't do anything.

I'm not sure if you're a bad player or scum, so I'm not voting. Yet.

 

[Killstic]

And how was I "playing it safe?" I was stating my reads, and I even implied that I thought you two were the scummiest players since I didn't mention anyone else.

 

[Killstic]

Sorry. That is what I was talking about! I don't see any point in saying "I'm town!" Plus there are way better ways to look for reactions than for saying "I'm town". Like seriously even with that explanation I still don't see the point in saying that you're town. What reactions were you looking for and did it change your views on him?

I wanted to put him into an awkward position and try to see how he would react. His reaction to it was mostly null, he didn't give me a response I would probe further. I didn't have a prior read on him due to it being RVS.

This post just makes me feel that you're scum. Its literally nothing but AtE and a question. If you were trying to get reactions out of the question, then sure (honestly I was rushing so I don't remember if you were), however, besides that, I literally can't see any reason for saying anything like that as town.

Reconsidering, I could have probably prepared something more elaborate. It was something that was intended to appeal to emotion in order to measure a response, but IIRC I didn't get a response to it. If you can't see a reason for town saying it, then is it something that arguably makes sense for scum to use in RVS?

I still don't see why he would do that as town :/. Saying that you think hes scummy for that when its the townie thing to do is kinda... .-.'! Plus the statement about Dabuz made it way worse. Honestly, if the statement about Dabuz wasn't there... then I wouldn't have thought of it as a scummy thing and more of a pressure thing... but it looks really bad when the two things are combined.

Ah so you think that I was trying to defend dabuz and also apply pressure by counter-voting T-block in order to make him back down. I honestly didn't agree with T-block's analysis on dabuz and countered with my own reasons regarding how I felt about it. I can see though how it could have been construed as an offensive defense, however I believe that the time between the vote and my rationale wrt dabuz were somewhat timed out.

What are your thoughts on T-block having dabuz as a town read?

Okay I guess. So everything against T-block to this point (144) was reaction fishing basically? Please tell me if I'm wrong lol.

In lamest terms, yes.

Okay. Just note that it really looked like you were and if he flips scum I'm probably going to go after you ._.'! Defending a townie as scum leads to people thinking you're trying to look townie. Defending a scum as scum obviously means you're defending your scum mate. Defending a townie as town leads to saving a mislynch hopefully, but if not then whatever. Defending a scum as town leads to you getting lynched. 3/4 of these situations are scummy things and its not worth the time at all to defend people unless you have a HUGE obvious town read on them. I agree with T-block's push on Dabuz which includes that analysis.

If you have doubts on this slot then please ask us questions so we can address them. I believe that if someone is pushing on logic that I don't agree with, then I will critique that logic as there is a lot of intent behind even a statement that is seemingly illogical.

If you agree with T-block's push on dabuz then do you believe that I got in the way of T-block forming reads which you feel was an anti-town maneuver?

Thats not what I'm saying. I'm saying that with the vote on him + FoS and then changing him to a null afterwards just looks like you were trying to paint him as scum if you were scum, which I was under the thought that you were at the time (still am a bit). You were responding to something about "fake content" and used that wording. I agreed with that response. Honestly too lazy to pull the quote out though XD!

If you find anything suspicious wrt my actions|behavior then ask me for rationale. I understand that many things we have done so far have been unconventional and looked suspicious, however they were with the intent of trying to gauge and measure other people. If you continue to have doubts then I will do my best to convince you otherwise, however I believe that if you do think we are scum then you should press on it so that you can clarify your own reads in order to evaluate this game with more clarity.

 

[Killstic]

Oh boy. Laughing so hard. Hydra ninja.

 

[Killstic]

Haha, it's ok. We were saying different things to different people. <3

 

[#HBC | Dark Horse]

And how was I "playing it safe?" I was stating my reads, and I even implied that I thought you two were the scummiest players since I didn't mention anyone else.

PLaying it safe by not saying that we were scummy enough to lynch. It shows that you have scum reads, while at the same time not taking the risk of full-throttle trying to lynch them.

I'd think that since an FoS doesn't count at all for any counts, they're unimportant and can be used in a way that shows that you are MINORLY suspicious of a person if you state that it is a minor FoS.

Foses are unimportant?

Then why do you keep using FoSes for just about everything?

Also, you danced around my question:

What is the distinction you make between an fos and a minor FoS?

A vote is quite different from an FoS, and I hope you realize that and are just using the concept of a vote as a joke part of your question.

Kill, you seem to be using FoSes much more than voting, so I was wondering what your distinction was about it.

There was literally nothing to gain. We had already been suspicious of T-Block and were suspicious enough to pressure vote him, so how is it unreasonable to think that we wanted to put a minor FoS on him? The FoS was valid based on previous information and Acrostic's paragraph.

Nothing to gain?

If you had "pressure voted" him, why not pursue it? You seemed to do nothing excepct for now add a bit about "previous pressure"

You do realize that we've said several times that it was a pressure vote, right? And yes, current information is useful, but since we didn't want to pressure him that much at that moment, a minor FoS was perfectly handy.

not pressure him that much?

Make the distinction between when you should use a minor Fos for pressure and when you use something else, like a vote.

Hell, I even stated it in my previous post:


Are you even reading this thread, or is this just a bad attack?

So, kill, did you explain why the pressure ended up negative on T-Block in that post?

Nope. My point still stands.

 

[#HBC | Dark Horse]

Hey, acrostic, you're here.

Mind answering killstic's first response in your 290.

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

Yeah sure, I'll answer all of it. Give me a second.

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

@bolded: The main thing I was attacking when I said writing critique was how the beginning of your "analysis" had nothing to do with T-blocks attack, and was instead focusing on how he phrased it, with a rewrite.

I understand where you are coming from. When T-bloc asked me what I thought about the post, I approached it literally and noted the construction of the post itself. If by T-bloc's attack we are referring to dabuz being anxious then I believe I addressed that I didn't find dabuz to be anxious.

@Italics: So then, what's the difference between a minor Fos, a regular FoS, and a Vote? You seem to be defending yourself with "It was only a minor FoS here," so I'd like to see the distinction.

Minor fos is when a post is questionable and needs an explanation. If the explanation is sufficient then the fos has been clarified.

Regular fos is when a series of posts or a certain behavior is suspicious. An explanation is not good enough to clear suspicion and there is still some residual doubt.

A vote is for when you want to indicate with intent that someone you think is scum or make them believe that you believe they are scum.

I used the minor fos in a bit of a non-traditional way which I previously stated. I got it from a mafiascum game with someone named Glorkspar who used it in San-Francisco mafia to indicate his relative opinion of each post. I will stop using this as it will likely confuse people in this game and even my partner.

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

Kill, you have to realize that there's a difference between "Intention" and "Execution." So he's going under the radar. Should I let him go under the radar some more? That seems to be the basis of your attack, as you're saying how I attracted attention to T-Block by attacking him, while attacking him too.

I wasn't sure what "going under the radar" was supposed to indicate. Was it intended as a town-tell or a scum-tell? The basis of my premise is that [I'm assuming] you found something T-bloc did suspicious, but also you find the people who are asking T-bloc questions and applying pressure to also be suspicious and applying pressure on them. I may have a different belief on how to handle this, but I believe that I would have gained more from joining the wagon and questioning T-bloc directly rather than phrasing it as an analysis.

Killstic: If I can mention people as scum for reasons other than just voting a person, should it be assumed that I'm voting them simply because they're voting a person?

Very few people are going to blatantly admit that they are voting someone for such a reason, even if that was their intention. And if the intention isn't elaborated as to why they are voting someone, then there is no way to really know.

Kill: JTB and Dabuz aren't 100% scum reads, as I know I've only got a couple of things going against them. That's why, when dabuz asked me for their reads, I put them as "Null/leaning scum"

Okay.

@Killstic: Can you define chainsaw for me please?

Chainsaw from what I have read is when someone tries to defend another player by attacking the players who are on the wagon|fos that respective player. It is called a chainsaw defense because it does not involve a direct defense of the respective player, but rather an attack on people who are on that player.

This looks like an attempt to do two things: 1: A DESPERATE attempt to persuade town to make a case on Dark Horse, quite scummy considering he is the one voting you.

You do realize that I came up with the analysis because Dark Horse was voting me. I believe I stated that I wanted to address any further points that Dark Horse brought up which caused me to read through his posts. While re-reading I noticed something resembling a chainsaw defense. I found the behavior suspicious so I brought it up.

Out of curiosity, does making a case against Dark Horse make me scum or is it the fact that contextually speaking I look like I'm OMGUS'ing Dark Horse? And is OMGUS'ing in this situation scummy fypov?

2: DIVERT attention back to the case on T-Block

I dropped T-block. The post was in regards to someone defending T-bloc. Not T-bloc himself. I stated that most material was regarding T-bloc anyway. I doubt that we can escape from the emptiness he left us in the wake his RVS shadow.

Also, this post is basically you trying to make Dark Horse appear anti-town based on his opinions and reasoning.[/COLOR]

Is it anti-town to point out something you find suspicious or anti-town in another player?

Now you are trying to use JO_OEY's lack of wrt to JTB as a way to discredit Dark Horse's opinions

Actually that was a complete botch-up lol. I was thinking that JO_OEY had really good reasons to fos us in comparison to Dark Horse. That's the way it should be construed.

what is this? You basically just claimed that Dark Horse has good reason to suspect you. Also, when did you mention Dark Horse's fos? This is the first time i recall seeing ANY mention of that fos

Again mixed it with JO_OEY. See above. Um Dark Horse started pointing the finger of suspicion on me with regards to my response to T-bloc earlier in the day. DH didn't say, this is my "FoS" but his general behavior indicated that he found us suspicious when he was addressing my response post to T-bloc.

So, you are trying to defend yourself without even trying to make 100% sure of why he is questioning you. Now, you are saying DH did have a focus around T-Block like its a bad thing, T-Block and everything surrounding him was the focus of the game until you starting responding poorly to the pressure.

Um no. I was trying to find out why DH found me suspicious and to address it with a response, but I couldn't find anything solid. I did notice something resembling a chainsaw defense when I looked through his previous posts. If you don't believe there was a chainsaw defense due to the oversaturation of T-Block material then that is understandable. I already said that it was a possibility. Wrt pressure, lol. I just answer questions honestly, it is up to you whether you believe me or not.

I think you didn't vote DH because it would look even scummier to vote the person pressuring you, because of the way he is pressuring you. Vote: Killstic

If you think that it is scummy to counter-vote someone, then it is a null point to differentiate between using a FoS or a vote. Under either circumstance, you find both circumstances to be scummy. If that is the case, then using a FoS has actually no impact behind this reason. The more central question goes back to how you interpret an OMGUS.

Poor reaction to pressure. Trying to discredit Dark Horse based on how he gets his opinions. Attempting to divert attention back to T-block and to DH. You claimed DH has a good reason to suspect you.

JO_OEY had good reasons, DH doesn't. I am suspicious of how DH behaved since he started playing and no I didn't want to bring attention back to T-bloc. My reaction to pressure is based on your interpretation of the use of a FoS and a Vote. I went with what I felt was more appropriate, see previous response to DH.

 

[Lore]

I'm using this post to ask: are we allowed to use our own accounts at times for the hydra? I can copy and paste if not.

 

[Raziek]

You're supposed to post all material from the Hydra, and any mis-posts should be quoted by the hydra for searching purposes.

 

[T-block]

Don't quote. Just copy and paste. But yeah, use your hydra at all times.

JTB why do you keep saying you'll catch up and then not post anything? D=

 

[JTB]

Because I start reading, then I go out and buy a 3DS and play ocarina of time all day D:

 

[T-block]

Well dammit hurry up >=(

Deadline in four days, and we haven't done that much. I'm also busy basically all day Friday, Saturday, and Sunday.

@mod: Are prods going out?

 

[Terywj [태리]]

I'll replace out.

Seeking replacement.

 

[Terywj [태리]]

I'm terrible at predicting how busy I will be.

 

[#HBC | J]

Aight, I have my role pm and will be caught up momentarily. Thanks for having me.

I'm replacing Tery btw. =P

 

[DtJ S2n]

Well. Yeah sure. I guess.

"Oh, hello new player. Bathroom is down the hall and to the right. Don't play with WashedLaundry and you should be fine, alright? Also don't use Plum or I'll kill you "

Seikend, Armor, and GLG have been prodded!
J replaces Terywj, starting now!


Vote Count
T-block[2]: Ryker, JTB,
dabuz[1]: Gova,
Ryker[1]: GLG,
Killstic[3]: Dark Horse, Raziek, dabuz

Not Voting: Armor, Dark Horse, J, JO_OEY, Killstiq Seikend, T-block,

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch!
Deadline is set for Monday, 8/15 at 11:59 PM EST.
​

 

[Seikend]

Will be super duper active tomorrow and catch up then. Too tired currently. Apologies.

 

[#HBC | J]

I would disagree. I don't buddy usually, but I remember J talking about it in KSSU that it helps him get reads.

Also, buddying isn't permanent either.

Yuuuup.

W.r.t. this, buddying is completely dependant on situation. However I've begun to hate that since that's a majority of why...PF...~_~

Moving on.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

I have no clue what's going on and am less than inclined to catch-up with a weekend V/LA coming up for a smash tournament. Someone fill me in on what I've missed and isn't worthless.

/doridori

 

[#HBC | Laundry]

Jbby~

You look so good today! Would you like some coffee?

(Dammit Stew, you promised to play me up as the hottest chick around.)

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Well. Yeah sure. I guess.

"Oh, hello new player. Bathroom is down the hall and to the right. Don't play with WashedLaundry and you should be fine, alright? Also don't use Plum or I'll kill you "

Seikend, Armor, and GLG have been prodded!
J replaces Terywj, starting now!


Vote Count
T-block[2]: Ryker, JTB,
dabuz[1]: Gova,
Ryker[1]: GLG,
Killstic[3]: Dark Horse, Raziek, dabuz

Not Voting: Armor, Dark Horse, J, JO_OEY, Killstiq Seikend, T-block,

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch!
Deadline is set for Monday, 8/15 at 11:59 PM EST.
​

You know, when I changed avatars, I was gonna use plum, then I remembered you.

/doridori

 

[#HBC | J]

Current content is garbage anyways.

T-block, what dabuz did is nothing more than a null tell. Should I jump on you for voting yourself because I believe that you are scum and don't want to make any connections to your scumbuds, even in RVS?

No, because it's a null tell and it's stupid to consider it a scumtell.

I like you because of this post but am afraid to like you due to our last game and I said this.

Atm, I like JTB/TB/Razzy.

Don't know on Dabuz cuz he still isn't that serious. Kill is...odd but I'm leaning more towny atm.

Baaack to reading.

 

[#HBC | J]

I would understand if you guys wanted to vote me for that. Are you going to vote me for the contradiction now then? I mean... what if I had mafia powers =o

Last I recall, you were better then saying stuff like this.

 

[JTB]

（╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻

DH, why am I scummy?

 

[JTB]

another table flip because idgaf

（╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻

 

[#HBC | J]

Grrrr I'll get to this tomorrow hopefully but got distacted by other things. >_<" (twilight princess and FF9)

Anyways Heya WL, I'll take a coffee with one sugar. Be a doll and make it snappy.

 

[JTB]

Hey J, why do you like TB? I'm re-reading his posts right now and I'm just disliking him more and more.

flipping tables all night

（╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻

 

[#HBC | J]

From what I've read, I've seen nothing besides what are more dummy tells then scummy tells. (though I haven't fully read.) Plus I haven't seen anything inherently that scummy from him.