Quick Draw's Advantages

[Nyjin]

I've been seeing alot of posts about how Quickdraw is a move that everyone should avoid at all costs. And I have to say this is -not true-. I'm pretty sure this assertion rises from the fact that

1. It's predictable.
2. Horrible lag if hit connects.
3. Recovery-wise, it is easily gimped.

Yes, these are true. However, most moves Ike has at his disposable have alot of cons. The pros of Quick-draw, however, are actually quite good also.

1. Good for ledge-mindgames
2. If spaced correctly, great approach with little lag.
3. Can kill, like most of Ike's moves.

Just had to get this out here. I'm NOT saying that Quick-draw is "Omg, teh ultimat3 m0ve!"
I'm just saying don't disregard it completely.

 

[MxGm]

I personally think Quickdraw is a good move. I just use it for getting close to my opponent,though. I never use it for attacking, only if my opponent is slow and has no projectiles.

 

[Tsukuyomi]

Quick Draw for attacking??? Quick Draw is for escaping/mind games...

 

[Ussi]

QD kills light weights by 100% when like 2/3 charged. I find that funny cause i killed a lucario trying toedge guard me but i made the final blow QDing him. xD

 

[Tenki]

When people start jumping around, rolling, or spotdodging, thinking you're going to attack them, and you have a fully charged quickdraw, that's when you can go and 'punish' landing lag. Especially by ledges.

Strangely enough, an Ike player I played often against lands most of his kill on me with quickdraw.

>_> I guess the only way around it would be to jump behind Ike, or DD>shield.

 

[Ussi]

He must be using QD to keep up with you lawlz. Sonic vs QD who is faster?

 

[Rykoshet]

Quick draw's advantage is to get across the stage after you blast someone from here to milwaukee, otherwise it's worthless.

 

[__V]

Use it to jump in someone's face and neutral-A, or grab them. Sheesh. It's a great move, just don't use it to hit them.

 

[Tsukuyomi]

I bet Quick Draw would be an actually great move if it actually never attacks, just the swift movement...

 

[3xSwords]

^ Tru dat.

I made a thread with my thoughts.
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?p=4973048#post4973048

there it is. I made it b/c of __V so don't blame me. (lol it rhymes)

 

[__V]

^ Tru dat.

However I am finding some interesting uses of aerial QD as a long range game which I hope to expand upon with the community. Sonic players consider moves like their spin dash (sideB or downB) to be their long range game and in the those respects aerial QD is the same.

I'm sure we all know counter draw? Well apply that expect doing other moves besides counter this gives Ike a plethora of options. He doesn't get a sudden boost but the slide increases the range on all attacks except for upB, QD, and dsmash. Why is this inportant? Well all attacks includes grab and we all know how ****ty Ike's grab range is, but with this it is drastically improved. There are many things that can be done and these are what I believe have very good uses:

Shield and slide so you can shield grab, D-tilt slide, grab slide, pivot and you will slide with your back to the opponent, sets up shield>bair out of shield, jab slide, and F-smash SLIDE (lulz XD). Sure this tactic may only apply to characters that have no projectiles and don't have insane speed, but this is a perfect complement to Ike's game which is usually landing one-hit, waiting, landing another hit. With this after you knock them across the stage you can do SH>QD aerial release>anything to constantly pressure them. One example is f-throw or b-throw at around mid%'s sends them pretty far from there you can SH backward>aerial release QD>into another grab to reset situation, jab, etc.

Discuss. (And I know it isn't amazing but Ike really needs some sort of advancement in his playstyle and if you've already expanded on this tactic please post your uses of the aerial release QD so we can bring out the full potential of this move).

Maybe I should make a seperate thread?

Holy crap. Someone who isn't a total ****** in the Ike boards!

QD is one of Ike's most useful moves. It isn't hard OR complicated, and yet stupid people can't use it. Go ahead, make a thread and explain how it works to them. I'd love to see Ike rise a few tiers.

 

[Nyjin]

Quickdraw is great and all...

But don't expect it to revolutionize Ike (As of yet, at least. Not unless some big discovery is made that can broaden it's uses.)

 

[3xSwords]

^I know I just hope you check out my thread and post your comments. Let's be honest Ike is really not going to advance in terms of gameplay that much but if we can open up all the options of something like the aerial QD its bound to be more helpful than not. So just check out my thread plz.

 

[Nyjin]

I have nothing better to do I suppose. ^_^

*Roams the forums aimlessly*

 

[Buddahmonk]

QD is awesome in sudden death, just dash short hop backwards and quick draw lol, just use fake outs then quick draw somehow.

 

[Rykoshet]

(sigh) Ignoring the fact that sudden death in of itself makes me question wtf you're talking about, they can just spam spot dodge and then breathe on you for the free KO if you attempt to quick draw at all.

 

[Roller]

(sigh) Ignoring the fact that sudden death in of itself makes me question wtf you're talking about, they can just spam spot dodge and then breathe on you for the free KO if you attempt to quick draw at all.

I agree with him. Competent opponents will have no problem doing that.

 

[Falconv1.0]

Every example of QD being used in a 'effective' manner given by most idiots around here seem to lack the fact that what is listed doesn't really matter seeing how anyone with half a brain can stop it, as Ryko and Rollerking pointed out already.

Seriously, stop with these threads.

 

[Rykoshet]

Here, perfect example. Just go to the end of the match.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=pb466sN0nmI&fmt=18

I did something stupid, I paid for it.

Dont use quick draw as an attack.

 

[DizzyDevilx]

The lag on quickdraw is so bad that even Ike can get a FSmash in from a perfect shield

 

[lajackson07]

I don't think anyone here is saying to use Quickdraw as an attack. I think the point being made that Quickdraw can be used to follow an opponent after Ike attacks. We all know that with minimal charging, Ike moves forward a fair distance. Quickdraw could be charged just enough to be spaced appropriately without the lag provided by gimping. Using Quickdraw in this way could potentially link together (not combo) attacks rather than waiting on an opponent.

For example, Ike uses AAA combo>opponent flies away from Ike> Ike uses Quickdraw and comes closer to opponent> Ike uses AAA combo again......

That's the biggest use of Quickdraw in my mind.... or to break up combos from aggressive players rather than using his counter.

 

[Nidtendofreak]

What's your guy's opinion on using QD as a edgeguarder? Meaning, you sit back at QD's maximum distance to the edge if you're opponent is trying to get back to the stage, charging up QD. If they grab the ledge, they have these options:

1) Crawl back up. You let go of QD and peg them right after the invisibility frames wear off, but before they can really do anything.

2) Attack back up. Same as above, except now they have ending lag after their attack. And of course, it doesn't hit you, because you are fairly far back, sitting there with a charged QD.

3) They jump back, and regrab onto the stage in an attempt to fake you out. Unless you fall for it, you just sit there charging while they regrab. Nothing really happens.

4) They ledgejump up onto the stage, in which case, you release it as they go up. You stop on the other side of them. The ledgejump is a full jump, so you should be able to fit under most people without getting hit. And because you didn't hit them, you won't be a sitting duck, and be able to attack them. More then likely, you have also set yourself up for a B-air nicely.

5) They land on the stage instead of grabbing the ledge. In which case, they probably had to use a move that leaves them in a free fall after, and you can nail them when they are about to hit the ground/landing lag. If they just jumped back onto the stage without using a move that leaves them in a freefall, why on earth were you charging QD in the first place?

There isn't a lot of situations were this would be better then going off the stage after them, however, there are some, such as if they are at high %, and you hit them with Fair to the far side of the stage. They'll end up grabbing the ledge, and you can't get to the otherside in time to intercept them. However, A charged QD will work well, as you have effectively trapped them. And when you hit, if they are falling far enough away from the stage that they need to grab the ledge, QD will have enough knockback to keep you safe, as it will send them back off the stage. And now, you are close enough you can edgeguard them normally.

However, I don't know how practical or do able this is, as I don't have the money to go to tournaments yet (Apparently, Texan's don't like hiring Canadians who are currently in Texas because they got posted there visa the military. Go figure. -_-), and online isn't exactly the best way to test things. Obviously, some characters this won't work well against. Falco, for example, could jump off the ledge, laser, regrab, and get back on before you could have QD back up to full charge. However, against most most non-projectile users, I believe this would work well in the few situations were this could be used effectively.

 

[__V]

I don't think anyone here is saying to use Quickdraw as an attack. I think the point being made that Quickdraw can be used to follow an opponent after Ike attacks. We all know that with minimal charging, Ike moves forward a fair distance. Quickdraw could be charged just enough to be spaced appropriately without the lag provided by gimping. Using Quickdraw in this way could potentially link together (not combo) attacks rather than waiting on an opponent.

For example, Ike uses AAA combo>opponent flies away from Ike> Ike uses Quickdraw and comes closer to opponent> Ike uses AAA combo again......

That's the biggest use of Quickdraw in my mind.... or to break up combos from aggressive players rather than using his counter.

You're too smart for these forums.

 

[ptown]

haha, if you don't quickdraw as an attack.

if they're hitting you back, you're just not doing it right.

 

[Arturito_Burrito]

You're too smart for these forums.

your to dumb for these forums (thats saying a lot). countless people have told you over and over that QD is bad even as an approach method. your savior 3x even said it wasn't good he was just talking about it not being totally useless.


Bowser
Diddy Kong
Falco
Game & Watch
Ice Climbers
King Dedede
Kirby
Link
Lucario
Lucas
Luigi
Mario
Meta Knight
Ness
Olimar
Peach
Pikachu
Pit
Pokémon Trainer
R.O.B.
Samus
Sheik
Snake
Toon Link
Wolf
Zelda
Zero Suit Samus

all these characters have projectiles which out prioritize QD

QD probably last around 50-60 frames a person can react as fast as 6 frames or 12 if they are mediocre players. This leaves you open and completely helpless for a good amount of time especially if you are playing at a tournament where people will most likely be playing to win and spamming the **** out of you.

haha, if you don't quickdraw as an attack.

if they're hitting you back, you're just not doing it right.

there are no words to describe how stupid you are.

 

[Falconv1.0]

your to dumb for these forums (thats saying a lot). countless people have told you over and over that QD is bad even as an approach method. your savior 3x even said it wasn't good he was just talking about it not being totally useless.

there are no words to describe how stupid you are.

Dude. I want to give you a great. Big. Hug-right now.

Seriously, v, give up. It's getting really, really sad now. It's as if you think you're the one guy who has figured out how to use QD, and the ENTIRE Ike boards have no idea what the **** they're talking about, you're right, WE WERE ALL WAITING FOR YOU.

SAVE US V. WE'RE IDIOTS, WE NEEEEEEEED YOOOOOOOOOOOOOU.

 

[lajackson07]

You're too smart for these forums.

I do what I can.

What's your guy's opinion on using QD as a edgeguarder? Meaning, you sit back at QD's maximum distance to the edge if you're opponent is trying to get back to the stage, charging up QD. If they grab the ledge, they have these options:

1) Crawl back up. You let go of QD and peg them right after the invisibility frames wear off, but before they can really do anything.

2) Attack back up. Same as above, except now they have ending lag after their attack. And of course, it doesn't hit you, because you are fairly far back, sitting there with a charged QD.

3) They jump back, and regrab onto the stage in an attempt to fake you out. Unless you fall for it, you just sit there charging while they regrab. Nothing really happens.

4) They ledgejump up onto the stage, in which case, you release it as they go up. You stop on the other side of them. The ledgejump is a full jump, so you should be able to fit under most people without getting hit. And because you didn't hit them, you won't be a sitting duck, and be able to attack them. More then likely, you have also set yourself up for a B-air nicely.

5) They land on the stage instead of grabbing the ledge. In which case, they probably had to use a move that leaves them in a free fall after, and you can nail them when they are about to hit the ground/landing lag. If they just jumped back onto the stage without using a move that leaves them in a freefall, why on earth were you charging QD in the first place?

There isn't a lot of situations were this would be better then going off the stage after them, however, there are some, such as if they are at high %, and you hit them with Fair to the far side of the stage. They'll end up grabbing the ledge, and you can't get to the otherside in time to intercept them. However, A charged QD will work well, as you have effectively trapped them. And when you hit, if they are falling far enough away from the stage that they need to grab the ledge, QD will have enough knockback to keep you safe, as it will send them back off the stage. And now, you are close enough you can edgeguard them normally.

However, I don't know how practical or do able this is, as I don't have the money to go to tournaments yet (Apparently, Texan's don't like hiring Canadians who are currently in Texas because they got posted there visa the military. Go figure. -_-), and online isn't exactly the best way to test things. Obviously, some characters this won't work well against. Falco, for example, could jump off the ledge, laser, regrab, and get back on before you could have QD back up to full charge. However, against most most non-projectile users, I believe this would work well in the few situations were this could be used effectively.

Someone could roll and shield while getting back on the stage. Another gimp.....

your to dumb for these forums (thats saying a lot). countless people have told you over and over that QD is bad even as an approach method. your savior 3x even said it wasn't good he was just talking about it not being totally useless.


Bowser
Diddy Kong
Falco
Game & Watch
Ice Climbers
King Dedede
Kirby
Link
Lucario
Lucas
Luigi
Mario
Meta Knight
Ness
Olimar
Peach
Pikachu
Pit
Pokémon Trainer
R.O.B.
Samus
Sheik
Snake
Toon Link
Wolf
Zelda
Zero Suit Samus

all these characters have projectiles which out prioritize QD

QD probably last around 50-60 frames a person can react as fast as 6 frames or 12 if they are mediocre players. This leaves you open and completely helpless for a good amount of time especially if you are playing at a tournament where people will most likely be playing to win and spamming the **** out of you.

Of course, in situations where an opponent spams a projectile, you would not use Quickdraw. And what projectile does Metaknight have? It's not coming to mind right away.

Just a small thought to put in your head.....
How can someone react to something they never saw coming?

 

[Falconv1.0]

Just a small thought to put in your head.....
How can someone reacts to something they never saw coming?

Only an idiot wont see it coming.

^_^

 

[lajackson07]

Only an idiot wont see it coming.

^_^

How dare you call everyone I've ever played against with Ike idiots!!!
Let me play you and show you what Ike can do.

Changes the whole meaning of "I fight for my friends", huh?

 

[Betaz]

Dude. I want to give you a great. Big. Hug-right now.

Seriously, v, give up. It's getting really, really sad now. It's as if you think you're the one guy who has figured out how to use QD, and the ENTIRE Ike boards have no idea what the **** they're talking about, you're right, WE WERE ALL WAITING FOR YOU.

SAVE US V. WE'RE IDIOTS, WE NEEEEEEEED YOOOOOOOOOOOOOU.

LMFAO

Bowser
Meta Knight


these characters have projectiles which out prioritize QD


there are no words to describe how stupid you are.

I agree with all other parts of this post.... but this part.....

oh also, ignore the trolls...your letting them win by noticing their post and replying to it...

How dare you call everyone I've ever played against with Ike idiots!!!
Let me play you and show you what Ike can do.

Changes the whole meaning of "I fight for my friends", huh?

you are showing a stereotypical noob response. -.- honestly.....
ok let me put it this way THEY ARE YOUR FRIENDS!
>.> do you see where I'm going with this?
no?
ok, no one will take you seriously because your pretty much saying "QD is great because my friends can't see it coming all the time, so therefor no one can see it coming"

people like you a part of the reason that I don't really even lurk on these boards anymore...hell when the whole clan stuff was going on at least it was interesting

-.- sigh what ever happened to Enshoku....

EDIT: lol @ online matches proving you have skill

stuff

you forgot rolling back onto the ledge...which most smart players will do...and will then shield right after their rolling frames are done...if you don't release your QD then...they'll jump out of thier shield and easily make it to you by air, in which case if you QD while they are jumping...well it doesn't matter, because you really didn't do anything...and you let them get back onto the stage


DOUBLE EDIT lol Falcon you play kirby now? what happened to shiek? xD

EDIT AGAIN FOR ON-TOPIC...NESS: as for this whole discussion on QD...eh what can I say it's a horrible move for recovering, approaching, and attacking...yet for some reason I still use it =.= it's like the hiccups, you can't stop doing them T.T

 

[Falconv1.0]

LMFAO

I try

DOUBLE EDIT lol Falcon you play kirby now? what happened to shiek? xD

I was kinda maining her just to learn more about her. I use her in friendlies, but I found Kirby and DDD to be fun to use in tourneys.

EDIT:BTW, I totally love you for that post.

 

[Arturito_Burrito]

lol I just noticed I left metaknight on there. When I was making the list I was considering bowser's fire breath being a projectile although its probably to slow on start up to stop QD but then again I don't know much about bowser.

As for the metaknight part I was actually considering posting people who where fast enough to stop QD and punish you for a smash I had Marth on the list to but I guess I just forgot to take off metaknight

 

[lajackson07]

you are showing a stereotypical noob response. -.- honestly.....
ok let me put it this way THEY ARE YOUR FRIENDS!
>.> do you see where I'm going with this?
no?
ok, no one will take you seriously because your pretty much saying "QD is great because my friends can't see it coming all the time, so therefor no one can see it coming"

people like you a part of the reason that I don't really even lurk on these boards anymore...hell when the whole clan stuff was going on at least it was interesting

-.- sigh what ever happened to Enshoku....

EDIT: lol @ online matches proving you have skill

First of all, I don't play online and if I did, I doubt I would play with Ike.
Second, I am not one to argue like this. I would rather not talk and prove my point in battle. So let me fight you in Brawl and this poor excuse for an argument would be over.
Third, you are missing my point and my motivation. I NEVER said that Quickdraw is great. Since practically everyone else wants to put the move down, I (along with the creator of this thread) want to be the one to point out some uses for Quickdraw because it is not completely useless though at times, it may seem like it. Basically, I'm only putting up for Quickdraw because no one else is.
Fourth, I didn't say my friends. I said "everyone I've ever played agaist with Ike." That includes friendlies before tournaments, people at Gamestop, and whatever friends I may have fought in Brawl. Everyone I've ever played against with Ike has been hit by his Quick draw at least once.
Fifth, what do you mean by "people like me?"

 

[Betaz]

First of all, I don't play online and if I did, I doubt I would play with Ike.
see below
Second, I am not one to argue like this. I would rather not talk and prove my point in battle. So let me fight you in Brawl and this poor excuse for an argument would be over.
>.> how are you going to fight me if you don't play online?
Third, you are missing my point and my motivation. I NEVER said that Quickdraw is great. Since practically everyone else wants to put the move down, I (along with the creator of this thread) want to be the one to point out some uses for Quickdraw because it is not completely useless though at times, it may seem like it. Basically, I'm only putting up for Quickdraw because no one else is.
your "sticking up" for it for all the wrong reasons you said "How can someone react to something they never saw coming?" well that's just it...as Burrito explained allready "QD probably last around 50-60 frames a person can react as fast as 6 frames or 12 if they are mediocre players." people CAN react to it
Fourth, I didn't say my friends. I said "everyone I've ever played agaist with Ike." That includes friendlies before tournaments, people at Gamestop, and whatever friends I may have fought in Brawl. Everyone I've ever played against with Ike has been hit by his Quick draw at least once.
friendlies don't count, Gamestop people DEFINATELY don't count...and friends. However of course people are hit by it at least once but most of the time it's in a situation where they can react to it but the limits of the game won't allow them to (ie. landing lag, begining and ending frames, ect.)In other words you pretty much just get lucky if you hit with it
Fifth, what do you mean by "people like me?"
a noob is what I meant, how you didn't see that is beyond me...

pretty much yeah that sums it up...also how the hell ,if you don't play online, are you going to play me in person when your in Alabama and I'm in Washington? I seriously don't think you would come all the way up here for a regular tournament that I may or may not show up to.... -.-
also WHY THE HELL would you stick up for a move that you know sucks in every way shape and form? it has crappy damage and crappy knockback, and it can't really be used for anything except for in a teams situation. Sticking up for a move like that proves your a noob...not your post count...not your join date (but most of the time it can) but the things you say and do...

 

[Falconv1.0]

First of all, I don't play online and if I did, I doubt I would play with Ike.
Second, I am not one to argue like this. I would rather not talk and prove my point in battle. So let me fight you in Brawl and this poor excuse for an argument would be over.
Third, you are missing my point and my motivation. I NEVER said that Quickdraw is great. Since practically everyone else wants to put the move down, I (along with the creator of this thread) want to be the one to point out some uses for Quickdraw because it is not completely useless though at times, it may seem like it. Basically, I'm only putting up for Quickdraw because no one else is.
Fourth, I didn't say my friends. I said "everyone I've ever played agaist with Ike." That includes friendlies before tournaments, people at Gamestop, and whatever friends I may have fought in Brawl. Everyone I've ever played against with Ike has been hit by his Quick draw at least once.
Fifth, what do you mean by "people like me?"

There was like such a huge lack of sense in that post my head almost imploded.

*copy pasta what Betaz said

 

[ptown]

your to dumb for these forums (thats saying a lot). countless people have told you over and over that QD is bad even as an approach method. your savior 3x even said it wasn't good he was just talking about it not being totally useless.


Bowser
Diddy Kong
Falco
Game & Watch
Ice Climbers
King Dedede
Kirby
Link
Lucario
Lucas
Luigi
Mario
Meta Knight
Ness
Olimar
Peach
Pikachu
Pit
Pokémon Trainer
R.O.B.
Samus
Sheik
Snake
Toon Link
Wolf
Zelda
Zero Suit Samus

all these characters have projectiles which out prioritize QD

QD probably last around 50-60 frames a person can react as fast as 6 frames or 12 if they are mediocre players. This leaves you open and completely helpless for a good amount of time especially if you are playing at a tournament where people will most likely be playing to win and spamming the **** out of you.

nice list.

i think you should quit playing ike. your list of characters with projectiles and your frame data proves ike is no good.

 

[Falconv1.0]

nice list.

i think you should quit playing ike. your list of characters with projectiles and your frame data proves ike is no good.

I uh..just wow.

Your stupidity amazes me.

 

[lajackson07]

The fact that I play my friends and people at GameStop and friendlies at tournaments does not matter and is not the point I was trying to get across, I just meant to list people I have played. It was “everyone” that was important. And how do friendlies at tournaments not count anyway? How else would I (and many other Ikes) fight what people would consider “quality” opponents? I’m sorry to disappoint you but I’m not going to waste my time and money putting my Ike in a tournament. I think I could get pretty far but in the end, I believe I would lose as many other Ike mains do or else, we would see more Ikes at tournaments.

I say that “no one would see it coming” because I like to use Ike to pressure my opponents. I pride myself on making people second guess themselves and what I want to do to them. I use a lot of the options that Ike’s moves provide to do the same thing, pressure my opponent. Quickdraw helps to do that. Quickdraw is not limited to a teams situation, this thread is to prove exactly that. (Explain HOW Quickdraw could be limited to a team situation and not to a one on one battle. I don’t exactly get what you mean by that. Do you mean your teammate would hold the opponent and Ike then would Quickdraw? I don’t think that won’t really work either.) Quickdraw probably lasts 50-60 frames (which should be about a second) when it is fully charged, it couldn’t possibly last 50-60 frames uncharged. In saying that, I mean just to get the move off, not to actually reach the opponent.

I figured since you jumped to a conclusion that I was a noob and that Quick Draw was completely useless, you could also jump to a conclusion as to how you would get from Washington to Alabama. If you can’t or don't want to play me then just leave it alone. I’m not going to play you online because I don’t know how to set up the Wi-Fi connection (I would appreciate someone helping me with that) and I’ve heard too many times that it lags. I’m not going to record a match of mine for you to view because you would just say I was playing against poor quality opponents. Everything you have said or would say about me goes right back to the fact that you have never played me.

I knew exactly what you were implying by saying “people like me,” I just didn’t believe you had the audacity to call me a noob. I didn’t resort to calling anyone here a noob just because they may not agree with me and do not like Quick Draw so I do not know why you would want to call me one. I really have not said anything to validate being called a noob. Just considering the fact that it takes more skill to appropriately use and hit someone with Quick Draw than to just forget about it and not use it, I shouldn’t be called a noob. Yes, I hit people at the times when they really can’t do anything about it. Isn’t that what good Smash Bros. competitors (really anybody who plays fighting games) do? Would you seriously wait until the hit lag wears off to hit someone? No. You would try to hit them again before it ends. How can you describe hitting someone in the lags of their moves “lucky?” Many people love to wait for their opponent to make a wrong move and punish. I am no different. To call me “lucky”, you might as well call everyone on Smashboards and anybody who plays a fighting game “lucky.” It does not take luck to hit someone in their lag; it takes a certain amount of skill/knowledge of the game/practice, timing, and spacing. You wouldn’t call a Game and Watch or Lucario’s up tilt lock or a Sheik’s forward tilt lock “lucky.” You should just accept the fact that you knew it could happen and you failed to avoid it. It’s just a part of the game. If you don’t like it, don’t play it.

I’m trying to be as nice as I can about this but you are making it hard. People on the internet always seem to think they can do or know something. I am not one to talk bad on the internet because I do not know you and you do not know me. If I say something, I want you to be able to come get me and do whatever you are going to do to me. That’s why I said from the start, play me. That’s the only way to get it out. You and all these other naysayers have effectively ruined a thread that had good intentions and possibly advances to Ike’s metagame. People like you, not me, have ruined these forums. If you don’t want to help an up and coming Ike main, you don’t have to, you can simply let someone else handle it who will most definitely be more help than you putting the Ike newcomer down. Just because you don’t agree with or like the point I’m trying to make does not give you a reason to try to insult or talk down to me. I don’t want to argue like this. It really doesn’t get the argument anywhere because people can’t seem to get past a point and so the argument never ends. I like evidence. I provide valid proof for anyone who disagrees with me and I expect everyone who argues with me to do the same so please stop if you are not going to advance or offer anything to the argument.

Back to the topic, Quickdraw has uses but it also has its faults. I will try to only pinpoint the advantages to such a move and will not go in depth but try to give you an idea of what I mean. As a move in general, I, personally, would rate it may be a 4/10 or a 5/10. It has uses, just as Mario’s cape, Pit’s mirror shield, or, in comparison to a more offensive move, the Knee of Justice. It all depends on when and how you use it. It is by no means, a move to be spammed. Personally, I probably use it once or twice in an opponent’s stock life, not including when I might (just might) use it as a recovery. Remember, this is all my personal opinion and it is prone to being wrong. If you think I am wrong, please let me know and I will consider it. Consider does not mean accept, it means I WILL THINK ABOUT IT. Be prepared for whatever I may say back.

Just as my friend here has pointed out, it is a good idea to use Quick draw when the opponent really can’t do anything about the attack such as landing or ending lag, (I don’t agree with beginning lag because you might be setting yourself up to get hurt) mainly when you’re too far away to use any other move, otherwise you could probably just smash. Offensively, Quickdraw could be used to follow an opponent with another attack after Ike knocks them back. Quickdraw itself could be the attack you follow up with but I prefer using Quick draw to get close and, depending on their damage and knockback range, proceeding to up tilt, AAA combo, or smash. Defensively, it is a good quick recovery at the appropriate times. If you need to get on stage in a hurry as to avoid being gimped, spiked, or in other words or ways, edgeguarded, it is a better idea to use Quick draw over Aether. It can sometimes be used to stop certain approaches when the opponent might not be expecting it. Some people like to counter approaches or take advantage of the Super Armor frames in Ike’s Eruption to ruin approaches. I like to hit people with Quick draw in their aerial approaches.

From someone whose opinion would matter to you more than mine: (quoted from "I write for my friends" - the complete Ike guide by Kirk and Empy.) In addition, I wrote mine before I read this, whether or not you believe it.
QuickDraw (side B)

Uncharged 9%, degrade to 4%.
Fully charged 16%, degrade to 7%.

10/10; amazing move. Learn how far you go when using it uncharged, both in the air and on the ground. This is the best way for Ike to get around. It's also often used for mind games, by coming short of the opponent on purpose. This works because quickdraw has no lag when it doesn't attack so you can do whatever you want right away. It's often used with utilt and called "The Grand Viper". However, using it with a jab is better, because once your opponent gets used to this grand viper thing, he'll just roll back. If you know that your opponent will be rolling back, a short hopped fair might do the trick though. All in all this move is great for mind games and spacing.

You should use this move to get back to the stage as well. Don't be too happy about charging it though, that makes you predictable and this move is very easily gimped. When someone jumps in front of it and airdodges you'll swing your sword and drop down. You'll be unable to recover. So whenever you use this move for recovery do it high in the air and aim for the middle of the stage. If you aim for the ledge the opponent can just hang on it and his invincibility will make sure you can't grab it.

Longest post I have ever made.....

 

[Betaz]

-.- jesus this is alot to go through so I'll try to narrow it down, and I guess I'll try to be nice about it...

And how do friendlies at tournaments not count anyway? How else would I (and many other Ikes) fight what people would consider “quality” opponents?[...] I believe I would lose as many other Ike mains do or else, we would see more Ikes at tournaments.
allright friendlies are not really considered to count because friendlies durring tournaments people tend to sandbag so as to not show how they really play...as for Ikes in tournaments you don't have to use him in every match but it would be a better way to get better with him

Quickdraw is not limited to a teams situation, this thread is to prove exactly that. Explain HOW Quickdraw could be limited to a team situation and not to a
I mean in a teams situation in the fact that you actually CAN use it better as a recovery to get back to your team mate faster and help them

Quickdraw[...]last 50-60 frames uncharged. In saying that, I mean just to get the move off, not to actually reach the opponent.
you see QD projects an easilly seeable movement at startup that lets your opponent know what you're doing...as for charged it makes the sound

I figured since you jumped to a conclusion that I was a noob and that Quick Draw was completely useless, you could also jump to a conclusion as to how you would get from Washington to Alabama.you wanted to fight me... I didn't really want to actually... so... yeah..
If you can’t or don't want to play me then just leave it alone.will do since (like you pretty much said we're supposed to be discussing QD

a noob just because they may not agree with me and do not like Quick Draw so I do not know why you would want to call me one. I really have not said anything to validate being called a noob.it isn't only the stuff about QD, I looked at some of your other posts before I even made that statement

[stuff about the whole "lucky" statement I made]
allright I admit it was a bad choice of wording there on my part what I MEANT was that from ending lag and landing lag there are alot better choice of moves you can make...as for when they're a distance away and you try and use it to punish landing lag...that won't happen too often because they can SEE you're about to use it and act so that you won't hit them with it, as they have to be pretty far up in the air if you plan on hitting them from a distance

and possibly advances to Ike’s metagame.
....with...Quick Draw?

If you don’t want to help an up and coming Ike main, you don’t have to, you can simply let someone else handle it who will most definitely be more help than you putting the Ike newcomer down.
you see that's the thing...I wouldn't mind helping an Ike newcomer...but someone that comes in and disagrees with everyone who already knows what they are talking about and says that THAT person is wrong...well...
Just because you don’t agree with or like the point I’m trying to make does not give you a reason to try to insult or talk down to me.
well sorry for calling you a noob...geez its not like I called you a scrub...I really don't see how noob is an insult

I like evidence. I provide valid proof for anyone who disagrees with me and I expect everyone who argues with me to do the same so please stop if you are not going to advance or offer anything to the argument.

there HAS been evidence, multitudes of it in fact

As a move in general, I, personally, would rate it may be a 4/10 or a 5/10. It has uses. It all depends on when and how you use it. It is by no means, a move to be spammed.
you see most of this here I agree with

mainly when you’re too far away to use any other move, otherwise you could probably just smash.
explained up above...and instead of a smash an u-tilt or f-tilt would work alot better
Offensively, Quickdraw could be used to follow an opponent with another attack after Ike knocks them back.
with Brawls reduced hitstun this does'nt work too well

Defensively, it is a good quick recovery at the appropriate times. If you need to get on stage in a hurry as to avoid being gimped, spiked, or in other words or ways, edgeguarded, it is a better idea to use Quick draw over Aether.
when your close to edge by all means use it to get back on quickly...when your recovering from a farther distance it's much better to use aether and sweet spot the edge

"I write for my friends" - the complete Ike guide by Kirk and Empy:
QuickDraw

all right so the gist of it is...usefull as a mind game, getting around (not approaching) and good for quick recoveries not long distance....pretty much what people have been saying

Longest post I have ever made.....
yes...it was long

Anyways I wanted to expand the whole concept of using QD to enhance Ike's metagame first of all...let's put a list of characters down that don't have a projectile...as those that do have a projectile pretty much **** Ike's QD

Bowser (I'm not counting his fire breath)
Captain Falcon
Donkey Kong
Ganondorf
Ike
Jigglypuff
Marth
Metaknight
Squirtle
Charizard (once agian fire breath)
Sonic
Wario

so about 12 out of about 39 characters (including transformations) so about 30% of the roster...now lets take out the characters that are fast enough to still be able to hit you out of QD...and the fire breathers

Captain Falcon
Donkey Kong
Ganondorf
Ike
Jigglypuff
Sonic(kind of)
Wario

....7 characters...17 percent of the roster can't hit Ike out of QD by normal means (some characters up there even still can with SAF and such)

so with these odds I really can't see on how to use QD as means to help Ike's metagame...instead we should focus on some other things...maybe moves like Aether & jab which people came up for new uses for them not too long ago, or we look at some of the lesser used AT's and see if that can improve Ikes game in any way...like for example I once brought up boost grabbing in the General Ike disscussion...it got some discussion but not much for some reason...but those kind of AT's are what I'm talking about, the little ones that most people don't pay attention to.

 

[Ussi]

Waddle Dee/Doos, and grodos Do NOT out prioritize Ike's QD. They cancel on ground/Ike just..dies if recovering cause he doesn't cancel in air.