Q&A thread ASK QUESTIONS HERE.

[hichez50]

Think Gorilla warfare(pun intended). You have to hit and run. DK will tank though and chains you try to do. Try baiting him so he is facing forward when you use fairs. simply. DK isn't really that good in the air he just has Bair to make up for it. just do stuff to juggle him then fish for the kill. You have to think out of the box though. You may have to resort to things like dtilt and side B. If you use fsmash too much you will most likely be baited into a super armor donkey punch.

 

[Browny]

guerilla warfare isnt hit and run...

 

[Karnu]

Think Gorilla warfare(pun intended). You have to hit and run. DK will tank though and chains you try to do. Try baiting him so he is facing forward when you use fairs. simply. DK isn't really that good in the air he just has Bair to make up for it. just do stuff to juggle him then fish for the kill. You have to think out of the box though. You may have to resort to things like dtilt and side B. If you use fsmash too much you will most likely be baited into a super armor donkey punch.

Ok thanks, there's a PR ranking player in our state and he mains DK I can beat his sheik but never his DK >.<

I'll keep that in mind~

 

[infiniteV115]

I know FP throw-->fair-->ffnair is guaranteed on Snake (barring godlike SDI) but is it guaranteed on any other characters? If so, which characters?

Edit: Or, at least, it seems guaranteed cause I see Trela do it to Snake players all the time.

 

[Pivot]

Do you guys have your tap jump on or off? I'm asking here because I'm talking about specifically Lucario use.

With it on its extremely hard for me to Utilt, but I don't want to miss out on anything useful I could do with tap jump on. Also, how does one short hop with ease? It's very difficult for me.

Does it matter whether I use the C-stick for aerials, or the 'A' key for aerials? Or is one better? Should I use each for different scenarios?

And since Nair isn't achievable through C-stick use, would it really be practical to have to switch from the C-stick to the 'A' button just for Fair -> Nair combos?

Sorry for all the questions, I'm a former MK user and I really want to main Luc.


Thanks.

 

[hichez50]

C stick is better for aerials. Without it you can't do retreating fair or bait which is lucario's bread and butter. It is not that hard to move your hand to the "A" button with in the time it takes to actually complete a fair.

Short hopping really isn't that hard. Sit by yourself and practice 10 minutes and you will never miss it again. Or you could try short hopping with fox in melee and I promise you won't mess up short hopping.

It doesn't really matter if you have tap jump on or off just comit to one of them.

 

[Pivot]

Thanks, I will do some practicing. ^^

It seems like tap jumping is best for retreating Fair. Do most Luc pros have it on? However, it also seems very difficult to perform Utilt with it on.

 

[hichez50]

You get used to it if you leave it on. M2K uses tap jump and he has great tournament results. It really doesn't matter just commit to one seriously.

 

[Pivot]

If I'm able to do both tap jump and use the X/Y buttons to jump, which way should I commit to?

 

[AlexoftheAura]

Whichever one you're more comfortable with, that's all there really is to it.

 

[Pivot]

For F-air to N-air combos, should I use the "A" button for the F-air so that I can get the N-air out quicker, or should I use the C-stick for the F-air and then switch to the "A" button?

 

[Sunnysunny]

Its a matter of preference. I prefer c-sticking my f-air then switching to A. Whatevers most comfortable for you.

 

[DrSoussou]

If you don't have a preference, always just opt to learn whatever has the most frequent use. For example, with Lucario's aerials you want to learn to use the C-stick whenever you can so that you have maximum control over them. Unfortunately, you can't nair with C-stick so you'll have to use A once in a while. Since Nair is mostly done when:
1. Rising (out of shield/punish opponent above you)
2. FFall after SHFair
3. Invincible from ledge
4. Juggling (punish opponent airdodging through you)
just condition yourself to use A in those situations alone. No need to learn to switch between A and C-stick if you don't have to. Retreating Fair/Advancing Bair/FFalling Uair are awesome, and can only be done with analog movement and c-stick aerials.

 

[Karnu]

Whats the best thing to do when your opponent is off stage?

 

[DrSoussou]

lol, glad these questions are coming up as Hichez and I work on our "options" thread/list/guide. It depends on where exactly they are (recovering high, recovering at edge-level, recovering low, on the ledge), but also depends highly on what character you're edge-guarding.

Never chase certain characters off the map and try to gimp them if they can fly or have much better recovery than Lucario (Pit, MK, ROB, etc.) unless you're 100% sure of what you're doing (they're vulnerable, you have nothing to lose/desperate, you can predict their option beyond a doubt).

In general, however, some good edge-guarding options are:
1. Fullhop bair
2. Aura sphere (jump, move, cancel while charging to remain unpredictable)
3. Fsmash spaced so that the aura meets the ledge
4. Dtilt
5. Walk-off -> Fair string (for gimps)

 

[BlueXenon]

Is Lucario an easy character to learn? I main meta knight right now but I dont enjoy using him. Im trying to find another character to learn how to use and I want to use meta knight as a second. The characters I like using are Lucario and Marth.

 

[hichez50]

Well lucario and marth are two characters where you get as much as you put into them. From a pure technical side I would say lucario is easier. Just play who you feel like and ask questions as you go along. Quite a few people here who will be happy to help. I have been a lucario player since the game practically game out, but many people find him awkward to play. Maybe you can help me help others by explaining this sensation if you still feel that way.

 

[Host Change]

I'm interested in using Lucario as a secondary to cover the Pikachu matchup since I've pretty much given up on it as Falco. What are some good options Lucario has against Pikachu to start with?

 

[DrSoussou]

Fair cancels Jolts, Pika's CGs don't work very well on Lucario at all, Lucario isn't gimped as easily by Pika compared to other characters, Fsmash can punish most of Pika's wiffed smashes, Lucario can use DT to counter Thunder rather than airdodging and potentially still getting hit by it, Force Palm grabs Skull Bash.

That's pretty much all I can come up with off the top of my head, but I know there are other small things that make a big deal. Unfortunately, the only Pika I usually play against is ESAM so none of this helps, lol.

Edit: Incidentally, I'm thinking of picking up Falco to cover MU's for Olimar, Ness, and a few others like Snake and Wario lol.

 

[Sunnysunny]

You play against ESAM?
**** yea. Question then.

How do you deal with the Icies MU? I wanna know every little trick and gimmick about it. D-lux is gonna be visiting here, and I wanna make sure I know the MU. I'm guessing were pretty good at keeping him out and seperating him, but just incase, everyone hit me with what ever knowledge ya got.

 

[Browny]

Personally Id just put the controller down and refuse to play.

In-fact, you are being more sportsman-like than him, since choosing IC's is the ultimate d!ck move, and respecting his choice wont help these people learn just how much they ruin the game for everyone else.

Thats not how you win the matchup, but how you win life.

 

[BlueXenon]

You can watch this lucario vs ice climbers video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9GxbrZ_3TKg

 

[RT]

Why would yyou link a vid over two years old...?

 

[DrSoussou]

Personally Id just put the controller down and refuse to play.

In-fact, you are being more sportsman-like than him, since choosing IC's is the ultimate d!ck move, and respecting his choice wont help these people learn just how much they ruin the game for everyone else.

Thats not how you win the matchup, but how you win life.

XD

You play against ESAM?
**** yea. Question then.

How do you deal with the Icies MU? I wanna know every little trick and gimmick about it. D-lux is gonna be visiting here, and I wanna make sure I know the MU. I'm guessing were pretty good at keeping him out and seperating him, but just incase, everyone hit me with what ever knowledge ya got.

I've only played his IC's once in tournament and it was at ZP during pools. It was my first high-level ICs game ever and as expected, I got destroyed. I was able to take a stock off thanks to Lucario's Dair separating the climbers. I gimped Nana and dealt with SoPo, which was disturbingly strong. My problem was that I've never had to focus so hard on not being grabbed, and I couldn't adapt quickly enough because my gameplay is largely CQC. He went Pika the next game and beat me with 2 stock as well.

I wouldn't feel comfortable giving advice about this MU since that's all the experience I had with it. Seems more broken than even MK, though. Grab = stock = wtf...

 

[hichez50]

lol IC. I haven't played a really good IC in about a year and a half(if not more), but even on FD I remember it wasn't that hard to separate them. What you have to remember though is there meta game doesn't really evolve chain grabs it revolves around baiting you into getting grabbed.

I have played Esam once in tournament and in a couple of friendlies when he was active in GA for a bit, and he never seemed to even consider IC vs. Lucario. I even beat his pika in a friendly, and I came to the conclusion that he like the challenge. If you have ever spoken to the guy in real life it would make sense. This is the same guy who says pika vs. marth is even .

 

[DeLux]

It also doesn't help that ESAM and I play polar opposite styles lol

 

[Host Change]

Fair cancels Jolts, Pika's CGs don't work very well on Lucario at all, Lucario isn't gimped as easily by Pika compared to other characters, Fsmash can punish most of Pika's wiffed smashes, Lucario can use DT to counter Thunder rather than airdodging and potentially still getting hit by it, Force Palm grabs Skull Bash.

That's pretty much all I can come up with off the top of my head, but I know there are other small things that make a big deal. Unfortunately, the only Pika I usually play against is ESAM so none of this helps, lol.

Edit: Incidentally, I'm thinking of picking up Falco to cover MU's for Olimar, Ness, and a few others like Snake and Wario lol.

Thanks for the input. I'll try all of that! And I personally think Falco/Lucario is a good potential character setup to run at tournament. Falco/Snake is probably one of my best top tier MUs to play in tournament, and I normally lose to Wario, but thats because I really only play Reflex all the time. I don't really know much about the Olimar matchup though because nobody in AL/GA plays him at all.

I was doing fairly well against my friends Pikachu last night in friendlies, so I'm definitely going to keep working on Lucario. I'll probably be posting on these boards more when I have some more questions.

 

[BlueXenon]

Can someone please tell me easy lucario combo's I can learn in training mode.
Edit: Sunnysunny sent me a pm of combo's.

 

[DrSoussou]

This is what I work on in Training mode, enjoy (the squares are arrows):

1. J  J  FPalm/Tilt/GrabCancel
2. SHFair  Dair
3. SHFair  FFNair
4. ^Fair  FCAS
5. ^Fair  BrevASC
6. J  J  Dtilt Fsmash
7. Datt chain (back and forth @ low%)  combo#15
8. SHFair  WavebounceAS
9. DthrowFairNair
10. FPFairDairFCAS
11. DtiltFtilt
12. SHFairfollow-through Bair
13. SHFair FFNair Jab1 Uthrow Utilt
14. UtiltUairJumpFairNair
15. DashAttturnaroundSHFairDairFCAS
16. String@0%: FPalmFPalmSHFairFFNairJab1+2cancelgrab
17. String@100%: JJFPalmFPalmGrabUthrowUsmashUpAirFairFCAS=KO

 

[hichez50]

I use training mode for technical execution. If you actually want to learn combos you would be better off analyzing videos of lucario players. Even lesser known lucario players may use an interesting idea that you may want to implement into your game.

 

[BlueXenon]

This is what I work on in Training mode, enjoy (the squares are arrows):

1. J  J  FPalm/Tilt/GrabCancel
2. SHFair  Dair
3. SHFair  FFNair
4. ^Fair  FCAS
5. ^Fair  BrevASC
6. J  J  Dtilt Fsmash
7. Datt chain (back and forth @ low%)  combo#15
8. SHFair  WavebounceAS
9. DthrowFairNair
10. FPFairDairFCAS
11. DtiltFtilt
12. SHFairfollow-through Bair
13. SHFair FFNair Jab1 Uthrow Utilt
14. UtiltUairJumpFairNair
15. DashAttturnaroundSHFairDairFCAS
16. String@0%: FPalmFPalmSHFairFFNairJab1+2cancelgrab
17. String@100%: JJFPalmFPalmGrabUthrowUsmashUpAirFairFCAS=KO

Thankyou, but idk what these mean:
FCAS
Datt chain

 

[RT]

Fully charged Aura Sphere

Dash attack

Keep in mind, you need to test all combos on an actual person, because people will try to DI or buffer a move out of hitstun...

 

[DrSoussou]

^absolutely. the problem is that it can be hard to consciously execute one of these in-game in a situation that calls for it unless you've practiced going through the motions a few times. For example, fair->nair should become a muscle-memory combo because its used so often.

if you have questions about any of those, PM me and I'll elaborate on it for you.

 

[hichez50]

forget this post

 

[BlueXenon]

What are the best uses for downsmash?
So far i only use it when i predict rolls and to punish missed up b's.

 

[hichez50]

It doesn't even punish rolls that well due to it's range. If you read cross ups it would probably be better in that situation. It is a couple of frames faster than fsmash, so I like to abuse that if I see it as an option. Also if your opponent is in free fall you I always dsmash, because I would have to commit to smash and miss free damage/kill. If you are close to ground and you dair sometimes a dsmash is guaranteed if they DI weird(I forget the exact conditions I just know it when I see it.)

Lets be honest though fsmash is the only smash you need. UP smash is only good a laughing at your opponent when you read there air dodge.

 

[BlueXenon]

Thankyou.
10

 

[DrSoussou]

I tend to connect with Dsmash a lot after Jab2. If your opponent has been taking damage from your jab combo a lot or realizes that you can grab after the second hit, they'll try to attack out of it if they're a character with fast moves (Marth Up-B, Falco jab) or roll away / spot-dodge. If they choose one of those defensive options, Dsmash hits 2/3 times. Obviously, thats not 100% so try to make a read lol.

When Lucario is at high %, and hits with Dsmash at one of the sweetspots at his sides (not on his body), he can do a lot of damage and even kill surprisingly early. At full charge, its one of the strongest killmoves in the game. Don't toss it out like candy, but don't neglect it either. Covers rolls and stand-ups from the ledge, and like Hichez said, can punish rolls very well if you see them coming.

 

[BlueXenon]

Is Lucario the most difficult character in the game to learn?

 

[#HBC | Joker]

Metaknight is much more difficult to learn. Lots of characters are probably a lot harder to learn. I wouldn't call Lucario "difficult to learn" by any stretch of the imagination. The reason you don't see people pulling pocket Lucarios out of their butts very often is because he's just really different from the rest of the cast. Someone who plays another character probably isn't gonna pick up Lucario and just start wrecking with him, because his playstyle is kind of unique. At least I think so. I'd say he's actually a really simple character to play, since he doesn't really require learning any advanced techniques or any very technical inputs.