Project M Social Thread

[shanus]

Oh you know what, I just thought of something. How big is this project going to be in file size by the end? Any predictions? I have an extra 1gb SD card lying around that I was planning on using but if it's supposed to be bigger than that I'll have to get a new one.

It's currently around 80megs. Codes and character files will probably be max, 120ish.

If we have optional DLC with textures and all, I'm sure thatll be large, but entirely optional.

 

[Cyan_Blau]

Yeah?

Are there any stage replacements so far?

 

[Wind Owl]

Final Destination has fixed (Melee-style) ledges and a Melee texture. Other than that, not as of yet.

 

[Octave]

It's currently around 80megs. Codes and character files will probably be max, 120ish.

If we have optional DLC with textures and all, I'm sure thatll be large, but entirely optional.

Wow. I'm really surprised it's that small. .__. Will the textures from B+ be usable? I'm assuming it would be a yes but better to ask than be unsure.

 

[Wind Owl]

Yes, any DLC you could use with B+ will be useable with P:M.

 

[vectorace]

Final Destination has fixed (Melee-style) ledges and a Melee texture.

so by saying fixed does that mean the stage is bigger like ive seen being discussed in previous posts. or are all the stages the same size as regular Brawl?

 

[shanus]

We are currently focused on game mechanics, not on stage related stuff. If someone like FrozenHobo, or others, would like to join the development team to develop melee-esque stages with cameras, I'd be down for that.

 

[ValTroX]

The stage hacking hub is kinda dead now, Maestro is on hiatus and FroHo is slacking, maybe he's working on some stuff, but he hasn't released anything. I love testing their stages and they probably will join the team is you ask them Shanus.

 

[GPDP]

so by saying fixed does that mean the stage is bigger like ive seen being discussed in previous posts. or are all the stages the same size as regular Brawl?

He means the ledges on FD no longer act like a ceiling, meaning if you are Ike and use Aether right below the lip, instead of hitting it and falling to your doom, you'll traverse it just like in Melee FD and you will grab the ledge.

I've actually been playing this version of FD on Brawl+ for a while now. Look in the Stage Hacking thread.

 

[Shell]

Is it just me, or does Marth not lean nearly as far forward on his f-smash in brawl as he does in melee?

Case in point http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x1qwMjaHCYc#t=1m39s

0_o

Basically, as Melee marth swings his sword he slides forwards about 1-2 units independently of the actual movement of the animation. He swings his sword strictly down the central axis.

In the brawl animation, he doesn't have this teleport slide. He actually pivots on his back foot in place. Also, his sword does not traverse the central axis, but rather a bit of an angle away from it, decreasing its effective range slightly. However, when brawl marth's f-smash hits the ground, he's holding it ~1-2 units further out from his body. It's also one frame slower. To make things easy I'll momentarily pretend they're both melee timings...

What this means is that the range for frames 10 and 11 (vs. aerial / platform opponents) is greater in Melee due to angle differences, and that the range on frame 12 (vs. grounded opponents) isn't that different.

Ultimately, I like animations that make more sense (model movement vs. teleport slide), however in this case it is actually a balancing point to the move, putting marth closer to the opponent on whiff.

I will take care of this tomorrow after my exam -- sword angle, timings, slide, etc.

 

[Wind Owl]

Couldn't you do both? Give him an animation that makes sense but nets the extra range, like a quick step forward or something?

 

[Shell]

Eh, it's not really worth the time to program the step (feet are a ***** to animate since they have to interact with the ground and change everything) for a teleport that small moving that quickly. Obviously DS is a long time Marth vet and he couldn't even put his finger on what precisely was different about the moves.

...It'll look fine, bottom line. I will try to make it as organic as possible given the time I have to work on that and other things tomorrow.

 

[Wind Owl]

Though now that I think of it, what were they thinking when they made him in Melee? "You know, his sword just isn't absurdly long enough, and his limbs aren't long enough either. Let's just TELEPORT HIM SOME MORE."

... Really?

 

[humble]

Marth should have D3's grab range, twice his current Fsmash range and power, and six jumps. :x Then he might be able to fight metaknight in a 50:50 matchup.

 

[Wind Owl]

... He won't need any of that when he has the rest of his Melee abilities.

 

[vectorace]

... He won't need any of that when he has the rest of his Melee abilities.

aww **** he said it!!! i just got real happy

 

[humble]

What are you guys plans for King D3?

 

[ItachiFire2]

lol Olimar and Ivy with Zair would be the exact thing to make their onstage game so good to warrant their recoveries to be #$%& but in all seriousness... how about this concept? It hasn't been discussed much yet.

2 Tether recoveries from Ivy + Olimar in the air until once again touching ground (excludes ledge). Prevents 90 frames of edgehogging from rolling off ledge.

Normal Up-b will sweet spot ledge but take some frames of start up lag. The sweet spotted tether will have the properties of Melee where the tether grapples the ledge and the other player may grab the ledge still. Useful for gimping then edgehogging.

Air diagonally up + a will cause a 45 degree tether grapple, while an air dodge + a horizontally will cause a 0 degree tether grapple (Samus's + Link's Melee tethers). Or however the heck one could implement the angled tethers well with controls. Melee tether plus options.

The recoveries would still be gimpable and retain normal weaknesses of tethers. However, since these characters depend on tether recoveries only, it is reasonable to expect more options and an at least reasonable recovery.

There's best of both worlds. Discuss plz.

What about make olimar's up B not send him in special fall. Then he could use up B to get a little bit of recovery and then airdodge if it doesn't send him high enough.

 

[ETWIST51294]

Nah, that would be too good.

If he had two tethers, one a horizontal zair, his other one a 45º up-b, his recovery would still be pretty bad, but not too bad.

 

[Super_Sonic8677]

Just a quick question as I can't look through 188 pages .__.; What's going to be done to "melee-atize" MK?

 

[ETWIST51294]

OKAY, MELEE JIGGS IS JUST A BETTER VERSION OF MK. SERIOUSLY, MK WON'T BE A PROBLEM.

He's also going to be a FF.

 

[JayFizzy]

OKAY, MELEE JIGGS IS JUST A BETTER VERSION OF MK. SERIOUSLY, MK WON'T BE A PROBLEM.

He's also going to be a FF.

Correct me if im wrong but hasnt it not yet been confirmed if hes a FFer?

 

[ETWIST51294]

idk, nothing character specific is really confirmed at this point besides the Melee high tiers.

 

[Sterowent]

what else will be done with Oli anyway? isn't his spam game going to take a huge nerf, considering how fast melee is?

 

[ETWIST51294]

What? Ever heard of Falco? What spam game are you talking about? fsmash or Pikmin throw? I don't see how Melee's gravity would call for a nerf.

 

[Sterowent]

well, besides melee's gravity, it's the speed at which he spams vs the rest of the game. not to mention his spam isn't as ranged as the lasers and his don't, for the most part, have hitstun. as to the gravity, won't his, like DDD's, spam be less effective in a non-floaty setting?

 

[Drew69]

It'll be hard to get the grappling to work for walls ._. can't wait to see if you can do that, only way I think it would work is to make every wall have a ton of ledge animation spots which would make it possible for people to grab lmao. Can't wait to try it out on release, though I'll need to make a snapshot of it >_>. Also, are you going to try and make link have his old Zair? and give bombs the ability to be hit in air?

 

[ETWIST51294]

well, besides melee's gravity, it's the speed at which he spams vs the rest of the game. not to mention his spam isn't as ranged as the lasers and his don't, for the most part, have hitstun. as to the gravity, won't his, like DDD's, spam be less effective in a non-floaty setting?

Yeah, I'm pretty sure Oli's camping will be nerfed by the physics itself.

 

[Sterowent]

awesome. if that's the case, i'd really love to see what you guys make of him beyond his ****ed spam. being such a huge part of him before, buffing him in a way that makes him less of a bull**** spammer ought to be very refreshing to see! huzzah!

 

[ETWIST51294]

Yeah, he still *****. Dthrow, usmash, and fsmash are still really, REALLY good. He doesn't need any buffs. His camping game is still good, just not as good as in vBrawl.

 

[Sneak8288]

Oli's recovery would be good if he could up-b after a directional air dodge... or even if his down b sent up slightly upward

 

[humble]

Lol oli gets nerfed by the physics, higher gravity equals=even worse off stage, worse on stage, have fun with that. xD

Who really benefits (of the new characters) from the physics changes?

 

[Sneak8288]

it seems like sonic should... i think he would beast and diddy

 

[Shell]

Higher gravity = faster, (usually) greater offensive capabilities... the spacies wouldn't be able to do half the things they can if they floated around like molasses.

Stop. Worrying. About. Balance.

Also MK will not be anything like Jiggz. They're both light-weights with quick moves and multiple jumps, so one is a potentially inferior version of the other? wat? No.

If you want something to talk about, try something like "innovative ways to make the lower tiers more technical beyond JC-able moves."

Examples of cool ATs on Mario that don't involve JC or otherwise canceling something:

Mario's Aerial Cape Extension
Mario's Up-B to wall jump
Mario's SH bair waveland (AT? eh, tight timing and looks sexy)

 

[SiD]

Hmm...you could take away endlag for Pika's quick attack, he could zip around for combo follow ups on the ground.

 

[Shell]

That sounds pretty cool... maybe we could name it something like Quick Attack Cancel, or QAC.

>.<

 

[ETWIST51294]

Jiggs has better grabs, a OHKO. better spacing, and more range(Jiggs' bairs had the range of Marth's fair). She's just better.

As for some low tier buffs, some characters resolve themselves (Kirby, G&W, etc) but some like Link, Zelda, Zard, Ivy, and Ike are going to need some help. I wanna discuss Charizard.

edit:^^ yeah thats already in Brawl SiD. as for Pika, I'm pretty sure if you give him Melee uair and nair back he'll be good.

 

[Shell]

You are comparing Melee Jiggz to Brawl+ MK. We're not even close to balancing yet or even beginning to realize MK's P:M form.

Go easy with the massive assumptions.

 

[ETWIST51294]

K'

I honestly don't even care much about balancing, but people want it so yeah...

Anyone know how to make Charizard good? I don't see him being very good but idk.

 

[shanus]

People need to take a step down and come back to earth a little bit. Loads of assumptions and all going on it here :-O