Project M Social Thread

[shanus]

Lmao, i can't believe you are a tester.

Falco's bair didn't autocancel in previos revisions of pm (after porting melee physics obv)

And Mario's sh bair waveland is as easy as it was in melee



Yeah, now remember when the pmbr said it wasn't even possible because of LD

First off, you were using a leaked build, and you are comparing an old leaked build to our released demo and asking why there are differences.

Not all the attributes were ported per character, we later discovered (more in the patch, as well), as to some of the unnamed attributes and their impacts on a character. In these cases, jump heights were not quite right (for example, most were too short, as was evident by a FH jump on placed like Dreamland). These were corrected to match exact melee length. (+-1-3 frames due to Landing Detection, which we will back compensate when we fix LD). We know what we are doing, have frame data, melee and PM files to prove it, so please don't address us like we don't.

 

[Dark Sonic]

edit: double ninja'd

 

[JCaesar]

Ya'll got Ninja'd hard.

Step yo game up son.

ggs all dai




In defense of my fellow sonic user, TH. He doesn't play Mario. So he probably went off word of mouth from someone else, likely JCz.

Not I. I'm aware that Mario's bair waveland has been possible since the demo.

Lmao, i can't believe you are a tester.

Falco's bair didn't autocancel in previos revisions of pm (after porting melee physics obv)

And Mario's sh bair waveland is as easy as it was in melee



Yeah, now remember when the pmbr said it wasn't even possible because of LD

There was a problem with the momentum on the first frame of jumps which Magus fixed shortly before the demo came out. Jumps are now slightly higher overall and it fixed some of the problems formerly attributed to landing detection. Attribute-wise they have matched Melee for a long time, the heights were just slightly off before due to that little Brawl bug which Magus discovered and fixed.

Edit: wow, superninja'd

 

[leelue]

I demand that one of the people in charge fuse squirtle and zubat in their avatar.

Horror movie material man.

http://alexonsager.net/pokemon/

either that, or the entirely too sexual mixture of Magneton and Primape

 

[XkaruX]

yea Karu i noticed that....my guess is that they claimed to have ported Melee physics a little too early

Melee physics happened 7 months ago, do you really think they were perfect then? no, there were probably just things that couldn't be done until now

I just said they have changed them, they said they didnt, so i gave arguments, Stuff like AC'd falco's bair shouldn't be possible until LD is fixed. Now it "matches" melee physics because they made the jumps go higher.

I'm not complaining or anything, just pointing that out.

 

[Revven]

Now it "matches" melee physics because they made the jumps go higher.

Uh, no, go read the 4 posts above you from 4 PMBR members (including myself) about what was done.

You're pointing it out as if to say "Don't trust these guys!" :|

 

[XkaruX]

Uh, no, go read the 4 posts above you from 4 PMBR members (including myself) about what was done.

You're pointing it out as if to say "Don't trust these guys!" :|

Didnt' read those, lol, thanks for letting me know.

However, i now find kind of funny that you guys used to say "It's the same exact as melee", and now you just said that some stuff wasn't correct.

Anyway, it's all good now.

 

[kaizo13]

what's the moral of today?

when in doubt.....ask Magus

 

[Vigilante]

Yeah because having more options is always good... I can't wait till you guys make Fsmash and Dsmash OoS possible, oh, what about adding 2 more jumps to every character? That would add more recovery options.

This isn't Brawl Minus, they're actually making something competitive.

Jokes aside, your gripe has mostly been due to Landing detection. Because you land earlier, you feel things are off and are harder to do. Your timing is thrown off form Melee. And yeah, some things are harder like falco's short hop laser (Although still feasible). But as far as the characters go, sans landing detection and directional influence, Falco's pretty close to Melee. Mario is also close to Melee, save for improvements. But as far as physics go, like gravity, and jump height, he is the exact same.


Also, Brawl graphics sometimes confuse poeple. I guess something about the is giving poeple optical illusions. Perhaps the higher amounts of detail.

Edit: ninja comboed.

 

[shanus]

Didnt' read those, lol, thanks for letting me know.

However, i now find kind of funny that you guys used to say "It's the same exact as melee", and now you just said that some stuff wasn't correct.

Anyway, it's all good now.

When you have a list of 200+ unlabeled constants and trying to determine their functionality and which match and don't match (or even exist in both versions), there is always a distinct possibility we missed something. All of our changes will of course have incremental improvements, and assuming otherwise would be a pretty foolish stance on a project that is only a demo build.

 

[Dark Sonic]

Can't wait for this patch to be released and lol as everyone finally sees how much the game changes in a week.

 

[kaizo13]

Can't wait for this patch to be released and lol as everyone finally sees how much the game changes in a week.

well....more like a month now lol

but yea, they will see

 

[Slashy]

A request for Ike

Air dodge out of Aether fall

Honestly I don't think that Aether works well as a recovery in a Melee setting, only because of the lack of backwards grabbing.

 

[Thunderhorse+]

In defense of my fellow sonic user, TH. He doesn't play Mario. So he probably went off word of mouth from someone else, likely JCz.

Yep. I'm not sure if it was JCz (thought it was, in fact I was 99% sure it was him, but he said that wasn't the case), but I remember a fairly reliable source telling me it wasn't possible.

But if it's possible, then it's possible. I stand corrected.

 

[MonkUnit]

A request for Ike

Air dodge out of Aether fall

Honestly I don't think that Aether works well as a recovery in a Melee setting, only because of the lack of backwards grabbing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=prV1KQWCTKE

 

[Slashy]

That's Fountain of Dreams, it doesn't help on a stage like Temple:M, SmashVille, or Lylat Cruise where there is no place to walljump below. I just think that Ike shouldn't have to be screwed over by the ledges with Aether.

 

[Jiangjunizzy]

A request for Ike

Air dodge out of Aether fall

Honestly I don't think that Aether works well as a recovery in a Melee setting, only because of the lack of backwards grabbing.

Thank you for the suggestion.

 

[Slashy]

Thank you for the suggestion.

I think you're showing false politeness, if you're not going to suggest something at least tell me and explain why rather than pretending like you'll consider it.

 

[kaizo13]

A request for Ike

Air dodge out of Aether fall

that's not gonna happen lol

i'm pretty sure his side-b was sped up enough to be somewhat useful for recovery but other than that.......Ike just isn't meant to be good at recovering

deal wit it

 

[Eternal Yoshi]

Project M: The thread where ninjas ninja people.

 

[Deleted member]

If Ike could JC his aerial Quick Draw, he may not necessarily be screwed by stages not having walls, but it could make his QD and his recovery too good or something.

 

[kaizo13]

actually drpepper, it would make his recovery very similar to that of Sonic's....

so Sonic = broken

/that is all

 

[Slashy]

I was just requesting backwards ledge grab when he falls with aether, that's the only thing I think should be added.

 

[Strong Badam]

is it that hard to turnaround when you aether, bro?

 

[kaizo13]

is it that hard to turnaround when you aether, bro?

looool


but yeah Slashy, reverse grab wouldn't really help his recovery distance wise or anything.......just when you're facing the wrong way......for some reason

Edit:
wait so only Ike and Kirby are loosing reverse grab on up-b?

 

[MonkUnit]

can't you also b-reversal aether in brawl? if so, you don't need reverse ledge grab on aether. rofl

 

[Strong Badam]

wait so only Ike and Kirby are loosing reverse grab on up-b?

I AM NINJA'ING FALCO400
no they aren't, they can.

 

[Revven]

Edit:
wait so only Ike and Kirby are loosing reverse grab on up-b?

lolno, they can still grab backwards. Neko was just trolling Slashy (Neko isn't apart of the PMBR).

 

[Slashy]

looool


but yeah Slashy, reverse grab wouldn't really help his recovery distance wise or anything.......just when you're facing the wrong way......for some reason

Edit:
wait so only Ike and Kirby are loosing reverse grab on up-b?

It helps prevent gimps, unlike most recoveries there was a reason not to reverse the recovery as you could punish your opponent while you recovered, and if you were high enough you could meteor smash them while you grab the ledge.

It was extremely risky, as even in Brawl+ it was unlikely that you would grab the ledge if you weren't facing it, this basically changes a high risk/high reward scenario situation to a suicide move.

To me, giving Ike backwards ledge grab during the landing of aether is the same reason you give Ganondorf a double jump back during Wizard's Kick, it keeps a high risk/high reward move from becoming a suicide move.

EDIT: Wait, so you're not removing this instance of reverse ledge grabbing? Okay then I have nothing to complain about.

 

[kaizo13]

wait so which is it?

Edit: lol strong Bad

 

[Jiangjunizzy]

It helps prevent gimps, unlike most recoveries there was a reason not to reverse the recovery as you could punish your opponent while you recovered, and if you were high enough you could meteor smash them while you grab the ledge.

It was extremely risky, as even in Brawl+ it was unlikely that you would grab the ledge if you weren't facing it, this basically changes a high risk/high reward scenario situation to a suicide move.

To me, giving Ike backwards ledge grab during the landing of aether is the same reason you give Ganondorf a double jump back during Wizard's Kick, it keeps a high risk/high reward move from becoming a suicide move.

EDIT: Wait, so you're not removing this instance of reverse ledge grabbing? Okay then I have nothing to complain about.

Unless you've played a build of Project M from the last 1-2 weeks, I don't think you have enough perspective on the character to be suggesting buffs for him. Also Brawl+ is hardly comparable to Project M.

Please stop discussing Ike related enhancements, as he's not in the demo therefore it's not worth discussing him at the moment. Try to keep discourse related to characters that are in the demo. If you want to further discuss Ike, please take it to the suggestions forum on smashmods, or PM one of the PMBR members. Let's try to keep this thread clean guys.

Thanks.

 

[Slashy]

Unless you've played a build of Project M from the last 1-2 weeks, I don't think you have enough perspective on the character to be suggesting buffs for him. Also Brawl+ is hardly comparable to Project M.

Please stop discussing Ike related enhancements, as he's not in the demo therefore it's not worth discussing him at the moment. Try to keep discourse related to characters that are in the demo. If you want to further discuss Ike, please take it to the suggestions forum on smashmods, or PM one of the PMBR members. Let's try to keep this thread clean guys.

Thanks.

When is it appropriate to discuss characters such as Ike? If the rumors are true that there might not be a second demo before the final release, then when would be able to discuss aspects such as this?

 

[kaizo13]

it's called the "balance phase" Slashy

once all the characters are out there is obviously still gonna be adjustments that will need to be made

 

[Slashy]

I thought final meant final, meaning that all characters are assumed to be balanced at that point. I didn't think there would be a second demo solely for bug-fixing and balance testing.

 

[Strong Badam]

He did mention going to the Smashmods forum, you know.

 

[Slashy]

I didn't think anyone went there though.

 

[kaizo13]

well his point is, SB, how are we suppose to give input on the other 20+ characters that we can't play

 

[Strong Badam]

We're there constantly, since that's where the Back Room is.

 

[Jiangjunizzy]

When is it appropriate to discuss characters such as Ike? If the rumors are true that there might not be a second demo before the final release, then when would be able to discuss aspects such as this?

project m is very organic.. so things are subject to change. don't take any "rumors" for face value.

like i said in the previous post, you can discuss ike on smashmods, or when youtube videos of a more complete build are uploaded, you can post comments on the video about concerns.

 

[Slashy]

well his point is, SB, how are we suppose to give input on the other 20+ characters that we can't play

My only fear is that Project:M ends up like Brawl+ Gold (7.3) which felt like it was rushed, and wasn't done with any sort of care (since the B+BR was basically broken up by that point, heck had Brawl+ continued it would have been me and Count_Kaiser running the project).

-The game was balanced, but felt sloppy in how it balanced things (i.e. Metaknight's extreme tornado nerfs made it a useless move)
-It seemed that the stage selection was still being decided at that time (it was using an early version of the stage roster expansion code)
-It had crashes (caused by the Stage Roster Expansion Code)

While single player modes weren't the goal of the project, it seemed like blatant laziness that they didn't try to do something to prevent the crashes in All-Star mode, with all complains basically being diverted to "This is a competitive mod, and we know best."


That being said, I highly doubt that the PMBR will release a final build until the product was complete, rather than "close enough" like Brawl+'s final build, so perhaps these worries don't apply to this project. Also, the PMBR seems mostly static, there are not new project goals every week.