Project M Social Thread

[ph00tbag]

I think most of it comes from the fact that for a Marth player, Wario's options are still opaque and novel, whereas a P:M Wario player who has at least a basic understanding of the character will have a deeper understanding of Marth's options, which haven't changed much at all from Melee, and how to exploit his weaknesses, and from there you just ask yourself which of Wario's moves fit into those roles.

Basically, JC knows more about Wario than P:M Marth mains, and he knows just as much about Marth.

 

[`dazrin]

Lack of MU experience is what P:M tournaments are all about right now xD

"wtf does this character do!? die heathen character!"

 

[Archangel]

So...I heard you need inputs from a melee marth main?

Honestly Marth one of my best characters in Project M and I've explored alot of the Brawl MU's since the game has been out. I can give some input that could help but who needs help? I am too lazy to go to previous pages....

Edit: omg Marth vs Wario? are you serious?

 

[| Big D |]

wat wud u gais rate ddd

 

[Medz!]

If u look up my sets vs kiraflax and k9 I think I did ok for not knowing the matchups. K9 came back in losers finals and kira was hungry in the MM. Axe freaking ***** me tho

 

[Archangel]

Well the first character my roomate settled on was Wario and I'll admit he was tricky at first but past the tricks he's too laggy to beat Marth. Considering the throw set ups and his lack of multiple jumps I'd say it's in Marth's favor but Doable for Wario. It's better for Wario to play campy as **** and try to save up fart charges. It really helps in that MU. All in all though Wario having laggy'er moves than Marth is what kills him. Shield-WD OoS, Taunt before Wario can move :D.

 

[JCaesar]

Are you coming to PMS? We should do a Wario vs Marth mm.

 

[Archangel]

Are you coming to PMS? We should do a Wario vs Marth mm.

it's still a possibility if I do then sure.

to clear it up though by challenging me to a MM are you also saying that you feel it's in Wario's favor? Or is it simply a friendly challenge?

 

[TheReflexWonder]

to clear it up though by challenging me to a MM are you also saying that you feel it's in Wario's favor? Or is it simply a friendly challenge?

Well, it's a good way to learn the matchup, and, everyone keeps saying, "Are you serious? Marth shouldn't lose to Wario," so, there are a number of things that it could mean.

 

[JCaesar]

I just want to see how the matchup goes against a good Marth. I still feel that Marth should win the matchup despite all my personal anecdotal evidence to the contrary.

 

[abcool]

The Marth vs Wario match-up comes down to how safe the Wario plays and staying away from the ledge. On stage if Marth can't grab he can't set Wario up for the proper combos to get him to the ledge and deal with him from their.

I think it is in Marths favor overall though, with the range and combo tools he can deal damage faster than Wario can output on him and kill him easier. Simply because Wario recovery sucks and being in front of or above Marth is a terrible position to be in.


Getting str8 to the point: Wario can gimp Marth with Dsmash/Dair(Although dair is risky). Marth can combo the Fart stain out of Wario's pants.

 

[TheReflexWonder]

I can't imagine Marth combos Wario particularly better than most of the cast. It's just that Wario should have trouble getting in, so each small string adds up quickly (that Brawl status). That said, abusing the sudden space you control on some moves can mess up a Marth pretty badly if Wario guesses correctly, like Forward-B (getting between aerials) and F-Tilt (awesome).

 

[abcool]

I can't imagine Marth combos Wario particularly better than most of the cast. It's just that Wario should have trouble getting in, so each small string adds up quickly (that Brawl status). That said, abusing the sudden space you control on some moves can mess up a Marth pretty badly if Wario guesses correctly, like Forward-B (getting between aerials) and F-Tilt (awesome).

Isn't coming Wario like comboing Samus?! I am sure you can Ken combo him or atleast Fair to Dair him easily, Which is one of Wario's best tools for getting in on Marth is in the air, but you are right about SB inbetween SHDF, If Marth is smart he'll bait it though, an because shields don't work like Melee; Dashattack can't be properly used to get behind his shield so he won't be shield grabbed. Also SB got a lot of cooldown so WDOOS is Wario kryptonite.

Wario offstage vs Marth waiting by the ledge = death. Only position you wanna be in is below the edge so you can sweetspot up-b.

 

[drsusredfish]

Are Youtube and the entirety of the rest of the internet down for anyone else?

you may be infected by that DNS changing virus. the government shut down the server that kept infected people online. They shut it down on the 9th

 

[CORY]

I can see how that might turn you off. I like screwing around on Hyrule Castle (especially in teams), but I would never allow it at a tourney I host.

i feel the same. i think it's a fun stage, but i wouldn't want to use it in a tourney. maybe teams, but not singles, definitely. it's just too gimmicky and odd (the blastzones being literally right outside the visible boundaries, **** tent on the right, and though the left isn't so bad, it's still a funky spacing between the main area and the slant.).

but, the people who play like it, so it stays. now i just need to convince them to play rainbow cruise over port aero : p cruise is still the best moving stage and it's totally legit, imo!

 

[DrinkingFood]

As long as we're making comparisons, he's mostly a Brawl character with a lot of his good stuff taken away.

By good stuff, do you mean broken recovery?

 

[DrinkingFood]

OH MY GAWD U GUYS only 4 more revisions till P:M hits the 8000 mark! I'm so excited PMBR should totes do a "happy 8000!" patch release XD

 

[TheReflexWonder]

By good stuff, do you mean broken recovery?

Broken (and it is indeed beyond ridiculous in Brawl, yes) recovery, very strong single hits, the ability to adequately pressure shields, the ability to apply strong pressure after a weak hit, a top-tier aerial game, useful super armor, a rather good item game...

In exchange, he has overall nerfed power, a weaker approach game, a weaker camping game, a weaker follow-up game (when considering risk/reward, Brawl Wario could do about as much per intelligent read, but could cover more options with them), fewer KO opportunities, a somewhat-bad recovery, an a slightly-better-but-still-bad ground game. His metagame has changed a little to compensate, but, he's still trying to do the same things he wanted to do in Brawl--He's just not as good at them.

Don't get me wrong--He's still quite fun, and Brawl Wario and P:M Wario are very similar characters in concept. It's just that the individual changes have definitely nerfed his similar tool set overall.

 

[DrinkingFood]

I think a large part of the problem is the new cast he is competing against.
He's still got strong single hits and decent (although probably more situational) shield pressure. I think it's just that it's not up to par in P:M.
I also think he's still quite a bit lacking compared to the other characters. If I were to make a tier list, he'd be in the bottom tier, maybe with Charizard.

 

[RaphaelRobo]

Wario can't be bottom tier. Have you used his downB? If timed correctly, it not only KOs your opponent, but also causes them to burst out laughing. By then using his side taunt, you will cause them to laugh so hard that you can easily get another KO. What move is more powerful than that?

 

[`dazrin]

I wouldn't say he's bottom tier, but maybe mid tier in relation to the rest of the cast, if not a bit lower.

But lets not delve into tier discussion here. There's a smashmods thread for that.

 

[standardtoaster]

OH MY GAWD U GUYS only 4 more revisions till P:M hits the 8000 mark! I'm so excited PMBR should totes do a "happy 8000!" patch release XD

you are terrible

 

[DrinkingFood]

3 more revisions to 8000

@toaster
wut

 

[RaphaelRobo]

I agree. Just post a link to the 8000th revision here. Make sure it has lots of bugs in it that cause the game to crash. Also, make sure it crashes on TL's milk taunt (because he's DrinkingFood). And make sure Kirby's available, and his downB is twice as strong as Rest.

 

[`dazrin]

Lmao.

Wait till the 9001th revision. Everything will be 9k+1's face.

 

[DrinkingFood]

Lulz

Spoiler

10lulz

 

[Archangel]

Wario is good. I think he's about on Par with Marth he just loses vs Marth I think. If he gets less ending lag he could possibly change the MU completely.

I feel Wario does better against some characters Marth goes even-ish with or struggles with slightly. Have any of you tried Wario vs Puff yet? That Match-up is like...so fun. Never thought I'd say that either but you can sort of Mirror Puff except you hit harder.

 

[Dantarion]

So guys, I made two commits today!
Also, we just hit revision 8000 of Project M!
And it actually was something important!

 

[SpiderMad]

2nd 10 seconds

 

[DrinkingFood]

Happy "National PMBR declares today National 8000 revision day" day!

 

[UltiMario]

So guys, I made two commits today!
Also, we just hit revision 8000 of Project M!
And it actually was something important!

So I'm guessing a big bug just got patched.

But then it created a bigger bug and you patched it.

Dant:M

 

[Juushichi]

Sounds like it could be accurate.

 

[Fly_Amanita]

wat wud u gais rate ddd

I think he's much better than most people give him credit for and a very viable choice for tournaments. A lot of people rate him lowly, or at least used to, but from what I've seen, most DDD players are really bad, so that correlation makes it hard for me take the popular opinion seriously. I hear you tore up BC with him, so you probably have a good idea about what he's capable of, though.

I do think he has a few faults that will cause him problems, but hopefully nothing insurmountable. His long jump-start and lack of extremely fast OoS options make Falco threatening, but only if the Falco is very familiar with DDD. There is nothing easier than a Falco that doesn't know the match-up, but ones that know how to pressure him without getting grabbed and ones that know what space he can control well and how he can approach are much trickier to land clean hits on. Of the match-ups I've played against very good players, that's actually the only one I'd be worried about, but it'll probably be a while before Falcos learn how it works.

 

[Lorenzo The Comic]

Kc:mm irc

While at KC:MM's IRC Channel:

Spoiler

akuma_need_diddy_for_2_min pika you play pm
akuma_need_diddy_for_2_min ?
the98pika pm?
akuma_need_diddy_for_2_min project m
the98pika no
akuma_need_diddy_for_2_min aww why
DiddyKong ?
the98pika because i just dont like it
akuma_need_diddy_for_2_min ok you plat brawl hax
LorenzoTheComic I don't like what they did to Toon Link aside from his Down-Taunt.
the98pika project m is just making brawl to melee and it ruins the purpose of brawl
akuma_need_diddy_for_2_min play brawl hax?
the98pika i play brawl with hacks
DiddyKong its a tourney version of brawl
akuma_need_diddy_for_2_min add me o3o
the98pika yeah lol
akuma_need_diddy_for_2_min loool
DiddyKong all it does is "balances everything" and at the same time, overpowers everything at par
akuma_need_diddy_for_2_min diddy seem to dont like pm
DiddyKong and restores the CHEAP clitches of melee
akuma_need_diddy_for_2_min true
DiddyKong glitches
the98pika i never liked wavedashing
DiddyKong jigglypuff's rolly move wasnt supposed to have a high knockback value
DiddyKong but i believe they gave that back in PJM
akuma_need_diddy_for_2_min the only things i hate on pm its the overpower alot of thing
akuma_need_diddy_for_2_min diddy
the98pika yeah i think they should had kept melee inside melee
the98pika instead of brawl
DiddyKong if they want they can go mod melle to contain brawl's fighters lol
DiddyKong ye?

Just sharing their opinions here. So what about Pikachu's bair compared to the one found in the unofficial leak (I used to have it and one of my videos even shows it in action.)? Even with those complaints of mine, keep it up, team.

 

[SpiderMad]

Was the important thing Isai dropping?

Wow such insightful IRCers you have lol

 

[MonkUnit]

KCMM tends to not like Project M and tournament oriented things.

 

[Kink-Link5]

KCMM doesn't seem to like any mods that aren't cloud and other really bad things.

 

[DrinkingFood]

I almost raged at how stupid they are. Then I realized how stupid they were.
If I had a penny for every time I heard wavedashing called "a glitch", I'd have like 20 dollars.
That's seriously a lot of pennies. It's like 2000. That's a lot of times.

 

[JCaesar]

They're just casuals. I don't see why anyone here would care about their opinions. Let the haters hate.

 

[DrinkingFood]

Casuals spreading lies about a game doesn't exactly help its popularity.