Project M Social Thread

[Samus-T]

Not sure if this has been discussed recently, but how extensive are the changes to squirtle, charizard, and ivysaur? Which of the three has been worked on the most and which the least?

 

[phurgawtin]

as far as i know, Ivysaur is still the most experimental.

 

[JOE!]

Charizard is a monster, trufax

Also, what do you mean Spear Pillar is unfixable? Theres plenty of hacks that turn it neutral (doesnt blow up / flip / etc, and only the top plat is usable, etc)

 

[Kink-Link5]

The only thing Ivysaur has changed that's streamable is her Dair makes her go even more up. Which I already hated in vBrawl ;[

Charizard is a monster, trufax

Also, what do you mean Spear Pillar is unfixable? Theres plenty of hacks that turn it neutral (doesnt blow up / flip / etc, and only the top plat is usable, etc)

And give it a blast zone so low no one can recover low. It's worse than Jungle Japes' water

 

[JOE!]

Hey, her Uair makes her fall faster, why not the reverse for Dair?

 

[Kink-Link5]

Hey, her Uair makes her fall faster, why not the reverse for Dair?

I personally don't like either but at least Uair can be L-canceled. I still don't like uair either though.

 

[MonkUnit]

@ stage discussion, we also don't want it to be Project M: Neutrals Only!

keeping hazards on a stage doesnt make it a bad thing as long as we can make the hazards work tthe way we want them to. however, spear pillar has too much going on to make it a good, unique CP. imo

 

[Stunts]

tingle confirmed for demo 2 GET HYPE

 

[9Kplus1]

Bomberman confirmed for Demo 2

 

[Stunts]

cooking mama confirmed for demo 2

 

[Kink-Link5]

Confirmations confirmed for Demo 2

 

[Stunts]

PEEF confirmed for demo 2

 

[standardtoaster]

Stop that.

 

[Kink-Link5]

Three is more than enough, four is overdoing it. And 5 is about where it cuts off any chances for humourous parody.

Edit: toaster'd

 

[Stunts]

Thank You Shadic.

Dair time.

Basically, he does some crazy wolf upside down version of the other spacies' dairs. If I really had the time and effort, I'd draw out a more elaborate depiction of it, but animals are already hard to draw and Wolf's outfit is ********.

What's wrong with his volleyball spike? Seems like a clone of Falco's

EDIT: Im really digging your Fsmash Idea

 

[Shepp]

Is the pmbr truly satisfied with the way tether's work now? Is there any drive left to revert tethers back to their melee form or is the current way they function good enough by popular opinion of the pmbr?

 

[Redd]

Is the pmbr truly satisfied with the way tether's work now? Is there any drive left to revert tethers back to their melee form or is the current way they function good enough by popular opinion of the pmbr?

Come play with us this fall, man!

 

[drsusredfish]

is the stream over? this a long food break.

 

[MonkUnit]

Is the pmbr truly satisfied with the way tether's work now? Is there any drive left to revert tethers back to their melee form or is the current way they function good enough by popular opinion of the pmbr?

It's a step up from how Brawl tethers work and a just dandy fix to use for now because we can't make melee tethers yet. So yeah, its fine.

 

[9Kplus1]

We're almost done. Tacos are amazingly time consuming.

 

[drsusredfish]

tacos. please. yall know yall eating steak and siping tea.

 

[iLink]

What's the trajectory on MK's dair? Sometimes I looked like it hit them up and sometimes it like dragged them down. Also did I see his shuttle loop go into a glide again?

 

[JCaesar]

http://www.twitch.tv/jcaesar baaack

 

[Virum]

Thank You Shadic.

Dair time.

Basically, he does some crazy wolf upside down version of the other spacies' dairs. If I really had the time and effort, I'd draw out a more elaborate depiction of it, but animals are already hard to draw and Wolf's outfit is ********.

Normally, I'm very accepting of ideas and concepts and a lot of Wolf's movements are just strange but this just looks really weird...

I mean, visually it would make no sense. Almost as little sense as his gravity defying old vBrawl U Smash.

 

[Kink-Link5]

What's wrong with his volleyball spike? Seems like a clone of Falco's

EDIT: Im really digging your Fsmash Idea

Considering Falco's is a clone of Fox's, I'm not quite sure what you mean. The entire point is that he's a spacie, but, just a little off. He did not attend the same military academy as the Star Fox crew, so his take on the combat style they use ends up being similar, but at the same time, very opposite. It is this same train of thought under which I came up with a "Roundhouse backhand smack" for F-smash, to contrast the other spacies' Roundhouse kick while giving him a solid replacement to his nonsensical barwl F-smash.

The other moves vary on their degree of "want" of change from me. Right about the same level as F-smash is nair, that silly Pichu spin he does. I've talked before with one of the backroom animators about a sex kick but "More feral with his 'monkey palm'/crane stance his hands have going on"

After nair is U-smash, which has already been changed and LOOKS FANTASTIC SERIOUSLY GREAT JOB WHOEVER MADE IT. About the same level is Dash attack which has also been changed.

Next comes D-smash, which I'd like to see be a single hit double claw strike instead of his two swipes.

As you can see, the more this train of thought goes the more analogous to the other spacies Wolf becomes, but the more solid his design becomes. Instead of having "jagged, twitchy attacks" Wolf becomes a fighter befitting his species, his role as a space animal, and his default stance. He becomes a precise, yet dangerous, refined, yet wild character who knows he can get the job done just as well as the other Spacies while retaining his signature style.


So, along that train of thought, I came up with ideas for F-tilt, D-tilt, Uair, Dair, and lastly Bair.

F-tilt- A half step forward and a horizontal slash reaching the length of the other Spacies' F-tilt foot pokes. Afterwards returns footing to original position without having to do a full turn.

D-tilt- Using his heel and forward hand palm as a pivot, swipes forward while rotating back into position with the speed of his rival's simple tail flick.

Uair- A sommersalt midair, Wolf crosses his arms and readies them. At the end of the front flip, he slashes upward while uncrossing his arms, a hitbox happening when his hands overlap, and then another just afterward when his arms spread out.

Dair- The aforementioned downward Duriririririlll

Bair- The move I have the least enthusiasm for changing, but worth mentioning to fit in line with his other moves. A backward palm strike with open claws held out afterward. A sex "kick" with his hand in line with the worthless Starfox crew who rely on their feet so much.

As I said, his current bair is still good though, and has a nice, clean, full animation that looks and feels natural and fitting with his character. I only mention the bair idea to make it a part of the whole picture of the changed moves I listed.

I will probably at least do more motion recording for D-smash, f-tilt, and D-tilt, maybe get a snapshot for nair since sex kicks are mostly near identical frames, and if I can, show the last part of uair (the swipe) and the bair strike (Though it isn't too different from Falcon/Ganon's). Not tonight though, I'm already tired and it's still not quite 8 yet.

EDIT: Thank you for the compliment on my F-smash idea.

 

[kaizo13]

... this just looks really weird...
I mean, visually it would make no sense.

I personally don't think Wolf needs a new dair.....but i also don't see how his proposed dair idea makes no sense?

 

[Kink-Link5]

I mean, I don't have any particular problem with Wolf, I just think he would style on everyone with these "Reciprocal Spacie" moves. Enough to make me change my main from Ice Climbers? Only if they can't do melee Desynchs.

 

[iLink]

The only one of those i'd be willing to accept is fsmash, even then I already like his fsmash.

I'll boycott if wolf's bair animation is changed

 

[MonkUnit]

give him puff's bair animation

 

[JOE!]

So, just turn him into a near straight-up spacie clone? Do not want.

Also, isn't his new usmash just his old dash attack essentially?

 

[Comeback Kid]

Looking at streams I think Wolf's animations look really good and slicingly efficient, i would not put him in the "characters with wonky animations" list.

 

[Kink-Link5]

Except that clones have the exact same animations as the person of whom they are a clone.

 

[I R MarF]

I like the idea of Fox and Falco having nair and dair as their approach options and their dairs lead into their shines quite consistently.

Wolf should have an approach aerial and a shine-lead aerial

Here is what his aerial pools should be:

Nair: Even though I think the nair looks stupid, it is the best way to give him a drilling shine-lead aerial without giving him the same dair as Fox and Falco as long as its multi hit

Fair: Something similar to Fox's 64 fair. Could operate as approach aerial

Uair: The current one just doesn't seem to match the high speed and copious endlag of Spacey aerials that means suicide when done offstage. It should be a claw swipe, then a kick in the fashion of Shiek's dair, but flipped vertically to be a uair

Bair: Leave it the way it is. should be good as long as it has kill power akin to Fox and Falco

Dair: Leave it

 

[shanus]

Falco combO on hyrule by p4 was epic

 

[AeonClock]

For real. If the stream is being recorded, that clip seriously needs to be shown to all the PM haters out there.

 

[Eternal Yoshi]

Shadow Moses is unfixable, like spear pillar. I'd say it should be replaced with something like Vs Liquid Snake on top of Rex, Vs Liquid Ocelot on top of Outer Haven, or possibly the buildings around the Sniper Wolf battle. Pretty much anything that is on top of something large, instead of being in front of or at ground level. In fact, if it was the Sniper Wolf battle, it could even still be called Shadow Moses, technically.

Or Big Shell

I liked the double Falcon Punch edgeguard on Hyrule Castle in JC's stream BTW.

 

[UltiMario]

Today I proved I had a physical form.

Today was a good day.

 

[standardtoaster]

I missed the falco combo. ;_;

 

[Shadic]

Today I proved I had a physical form.

Today was a good day.

How was Project M? I'm not sure if you've played the P:M since the demo.

 

[UltiMario]

How was Project M? I'm not sure if you've played the P:M since the demo.

I haven't.

Wolf felt so sexy, even though I do miss his jump cancel lasers. He just felt like a spacie but like in an entirely different way. His normals are just sooooo gooooood. I'd forget I have a shine because his Normals are just beyond amazing. Dash attack is the best.

Link is really easy to use, but in a good way =p. He's easy to pick up, fun to use, and seems pretty beast.

Zelda makes me sad. :<

I want Bowser to feel legit but I always expect his armor to last longer and be stronger than it is. Particularly on Side-B.

Ganon is a ****ing beast that ***** everything <333333333333333333333333333333

Squirtle has melee written all over him. I'd totally believe that's how he would be in Melee :3

For the really bad part (aka the part I care the most about so I write a wall of text about it compared to everything else):

New experimental MK feels like absolute ****. I'm not talking about even character tiering. I'm talking feel. That **** does not fit in a Melee environment in terms of feel at all. I've never played Wolf in my life and I still feel more at home with Wolf and his sexiness than MK. Up-B isn't a usable recovery move anymore in any circumstance, and IDK how I feel about the Multi glide thing, I'd need to have to lab with it to see if I really liked it or not. New Dair just doesn't work, and the hitboxes don't seem like anything a dair with that animation would have as properties. New FSmash just starts so slow it looks bad, it'd be a better even if just a little of the startup was put into the cool down so it just didn't feel like you spend 3 days charging it.

IDK MK might be being rebuilt from the ground up but this direction doesn't seem like a sensible, or a very Melee-esque one.

One particular recommendation I can make it to make Side-B act more like Illusion. Faster, meatier on hit, goes a little farther (obv not as long as brawl though), very little vertical control, puts you into special fall. At least that would feel like Melee and make me feel like I'm actually getting hits in with it when I hit with it (which it doesn't feel like at all now). I can probly think of more stuff that makes MK feel more like Melee but nothing else I have a concrete opinion on right now.

One thing I do like about MK though is how Mach Tornado was redone. That was pretty nice.