Peach Critique Thread

[Mikachiru]

Okay, I'm going to try to give this a shot. If what I say sounds stupid/ignorant, then it's probably because I'm a newb and don't really know this match up. I'm still going to try this but take what I say with a grain of salt.

Kyle, I'm starting with you, even though this was like a week or so late.

I need critique please!!

I played absolutely awful and impatient in this video!!

This is the last match of a double or nothing money match for $10.

The score was 3-3 the second set. I won the first set 4-2 I think...

Jet4 is primarily a Melee player but he used to place well with Snake back in the day. He's a smart player who spaces very well, punishes bad habits hard, and has great mindgames.

I had trouble dealing with my emotions properly during the match. There were many times where I was visibly frustrated and angry... It's something I need to work on!! My mindset has improved since then and I am very excited with my progress month to month with Peach.

Here's a video from the end of last month:

Silly Kyle vs. Jet4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eGYSUWfJH7Y

My approach with dair was a result of bad habits I picked up from playing wifi. Needless to say, I haven't played on the AiB ladder since then because of it... However I did play a wifi Pikachu the other day. I won, but it was not fun and it reminded me of why I hate wifi!!

Critique please! <3 <3 <3

What I liked:

Those glidetossing turnips. Yesh~. I really liked the Forward glidetoss at 1:44 into a recatch backwards glidetoss at 1:45. Made me so happy~. Great uses with those turnips. XD

Fglidetoss @ 1:17, 1:44, 2:07, 3:55, 4:43, 4:52, 5:02 (intercepted, I think)

Bglidetoss @ 1:45, 2:10, 2:30, 3:33, 4:50

Uglidetoss @ 3:28, 4:22

Your DI/SDI. Maybe not that impressive to other people since I think most good players can do this already, but I still think it was pretty good. Keep it up.

Killing with more than fair. Alot of newbs (such as myself) have a bad habit of ALWAYS using fair as a killing move (more recently though, I've started killing with ftilit, nair, and bair)

Your textures~~. <3

What I think there should be more of:

Grabs, jab combos, d/ftilts, fsmash, and Toad.


Grabs. I don't remember seeing any. Adding some grabs might of helped, especially since I saw you jab a couple of times and followed up with the second jab instead of a grab or dtilt. Speaking of tilts...

Not enough dtilts and ftilts. I put dtilt here because you could of used it for spacing and stuff. You were playing agro, so I dunno about whether you should take this as advice or not. But yeah. Ftilt is a good killing move that I think you could of used on Snake @ 175%, though you opted out for fair instead, which is fine too.

You also could of added some more forward smashs. I don't remember seeing a forward smash and fsmash is a pretty good killing move too (if you filter it, of course).

Toad. I think using Toad might of been a good choice, idk. I personally like using Toad when people least expect it. When you were approaching via glidetoss, maybe you could of stopped and used Toad? Idk I just like Toad. XD

Otherwise, you did really well here. I know that I wrote more about what I think there should of been more of than I did for what I liked, but that's because there's was too much to list and I didn't want to make it sound cheap and repeative. So anything I didn't list, I liked for sure~. <3

Razmakazi, I do you next once I get back from my tournaments and stuff. I'm not going to be on the computer until waaaaaay later. I'll be on my PSP though. :3

 

[Razmakazi]

oh kyle, more turnips, more jab coz it's fast and clashes with everything snake has. jab oos and dash atk oos is rly good in this match-up.

the only prob w/ your dairs is that it's snaaaake, u gotta do it higher or u gotta space it and back off to bait his utilt or his roll or somethin'.

and just be more patient in general on the ledge. annyway u got shud be able to beat that snake. he's pretty slow so once u get in the swing of things it shudn't be too hard.

 

[Eddie G]

I disagree with anyone who tells any Peach to use a floating dair at all in this matchup if Snake is not holding a grenade. I personally advise any Peaches to use a floating dair only when he has a grenade in hand (either in his grenade pull stance or normal stance, it doesn't matter). What Peach needs to do is treat a Snake who pulls a grenade like any other character if they were to catch her weaker turnips; he just limited his options willingly, so capitalize, capitalize, capitalize! That is when you want to use a floating dair on him, and space it to hit only his head/shoulders area and prevent the nade from exploding.

There are four possible scenarios

1. He'll DI up and try to force Peach to hit his nade with her dair. If you can anticipate this, just pull away on the last hit like you normally would and you'll (more often than not) avoid making the nade explode. Worst case scenario: you both take damage.

2. You hit him with all four hits of dair and he gets popped up with the nade still in hand. This is when you pull back and don't try to follow up. Depending on how long he's already cooked his nade, he'll either have to get rid of it any way he can, airdodge through the blast, or he'll have cooked it too long prior to getting launched and will get hit by it. Peach can then follow up on each of these outcomes, with the last one being percentage dependent because of the nade hitting him. So wait, watch, and react; don't rush a followup.

3. You hit with all four hits of dair and he drops his nade in the process. Depending on his DI/percentage and how far he gets sent flying, you'll either have scored a free combo or you'll have to reset your positioning away from him.

4. He shields in time and drops his nade. Pull back, pull back, pull back! He just reset his ground options and has a waiting nade explosion to cover him just in case. If it comes to this, just reset your positioning away from him try something else until the opportunity presents itself again, it's not worth the risk.

 

[Razmakazi]

floating dair is fine sometimes even when he doesn't have a nade. it's just that approaching with it from a far distance will easily get you nair'd/bair'd/utilted.

but at the same time having a nade in his hand didn't rly limit his options b/c he can just retreat shield drop it/roll away and bair/nair you. he cud also pull nades with his back facing you so if he shields dair he can still react oos after his shieldig drops the nade.

then there's the fact that he can just toss it into dair or into peach. it's not hard to weak toss/nuetral toss/retreat jump hard throw it into peach. there's a lot snake can do and i think you're underestimating that.

i play both characters so i know a bit about this haha. you're not wrong though. float is safer with a nade in snake's hand but turnips are a lot easier to hit him with too and it'll increase the likelihood that you can get at him with his own nade.

ima just address your scenarions right quick.

1. He cud also DI to the right or the left or downwards and then shield or roll away or sh airdodge. And in your worst case scenario Peach also is going to be hit out of her float in the air and Snake lands quicker so this cud be pretty bad.

2. true true haha

3. also true

4. Iiiiiiidk, you don't haaaaave to pull back all the time. Your fair would still be safe and who knows, he might not react oos if you just keep dairing over him b/c of the nade right next to him. There are times when you can use your mixups and pressure snake in this situation because Peach is much more suited for spacing around nades that Snake himself. Depending on the percent and stage position it may be worth the risk after all lol.

You can't just say there are only 4 scenarios when there are plenty of others.

 

[Eddie G]

floating dair is fine sometimes even when he doesn't have a nade. it's just that approaching with it from a far distance will easily get you nair'd/bair'd/utilted.

Why use float dair at all when he's not holding a nade if said nade is not there to threaten a sh dair instead? From there you have the option of double jumping to float and dair again (in the case he shields your first dair, to prevent a shieldgrab). Hell you can even just dair to double jump to dair again and initiate her float at about his head/shoulders height. Peach's spacing options are plentiful.

but at the same time having a nade in his hand didn't rly limit his options b/c he can just retreat shield drop it/roll away and bair/nair you. he cud also pull nades with his back facing you so if he shields dair he can still react oos after his shieldig drops the nade.

Perhaps not against grounded options, but against aerials (especially Peach's with her unique spacing options) his options are quite lackluster with a nade in his hand (especially if he re-grabs it after a shielddrop). And if you remember my last example in my previous post, you'll notice that I said to pull back if he decides to shielddrop his nade in the first place, so your example of him rolling away and using bair/nair is moot if the Peach does not commit to her approach.

If he's facing away from you with a nade, just run up and grab him. He just willingly took away his own simultaneous shielddrop/shieldgrab option. If you're feeling hesitant, toss a turnip and make his nade explode/force him to shielddrop further away from you. We're not MK, Snake actually gives us a temporary advantage of having more options if he faces away and pulls a nade.

then there's the fact that he can just toss it into dair or into peach. it's not hard to weak toss/nuetral toss/retreat jump hard throw it into peach. there's a lot snake can do and i think you're underestimating that.

Indeed, but why give him that chance? If he cooks for even a second, don't commit, because he'll have already had the time to prepare how he's going to react to your approach. If he's too far from her and pulls a nade, wait and see what he'll do with it; if he soft/medium tosses it, approach/glidetoss to him on the ground. If he decides to cook, there's your chance to dair if you're about midrange from him. Of course, you always have the option to just run up and grab him (don't pummel) just as he pulls the nade.

I'm not underestimating his abundance of options, I'm merely picking at the frequent openings they leave, how Peach can specifically pick at them, and the fact that they're often overrated and underpunished by the majority. There's a reason I enjoy playing this matchup so much.

i play both characters so i know a bit about this haha. you're not wrong though. float is safer with a nade in snake's hand but turnips are a lot easier to hit him with too and it'll increase the likelihood that you can get at him with his own nade.

Same here, and I agree.

1. He cud also DI to the right or the left or downwards and then shield or roll away or sh airdodge.

If he DI's away, good, he just removed the threat of Peach making the nade explode. The most he can do at this point, as you just pointed out yourself, is try to avoid his own nade. This just resets both characters' positioning to neutral.

And in your worst case scenario Peach also is going to be hit out of her float in the air and Snake lands quicker so this cud be pretty bad.

Not always. In the case of a nade exploding, prepare your DI, anticipate his uair/bair, and airdodge/jump away. Simple. I've avoided many said attempts by numerous different Snakes. It's a rather telegraphed "surprise".

4. Iiiiiiidk, you don't haaaaave to pull back all the time. Your fair would still be safe and who knows, he might not react oos if you just keep dairing over him b/c of the nade right next to him. There are times when you can use your mixups and pressure snake in this situation because Peach is much more suited for spacing around nades that Snake himself. Depending on the percent and stage position it may be worth the risk after all lol.

Not always. As I said, fair is only safe if he decides to roll away after the shielddrop. Depending on how long his nade has cooked, fairing may not be a valid option in said situation at all, unless you're looking at a beneficial risk/reward factor of fair knocking him far/killing him while you take a simple nade (if you're not at kill percent for it to threaten you). I honestly do not operate on "might" and "might not" against Snake. If he's holding a nade, I will not use dair more than once. Doing so will only give him more time to decide how to react in addition to the nade still being present to harm you if you happen to misspace. I agree with Peach having the superior tools to work around a grenade than Snake does, props to that.

You can't just say there are only 4 scenarios when there are plenty of others.

I never said only. =/

 

[Razmakazi]

yeah i see what you're getting at. i'd prob float w/ a turnip in hand though. idk. i kinda like to mess around w/ it all w/ turnips and nade baiting and all that til we get a neutral position but w/ Snake near the edge.

good to know that there's another peach that likes this mu though.

 

[lloDownedu74]

I have a few friendly vids with my bro. Critique please??

Peach vs Mario
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jkNdH-xE1d4
Peach vs Snake
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVZrXA5DhoA
Peach vs Samus 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ld47K4c2rYY
Peach vs Samus 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LWp_TA8Sqvs
Peach vs MK
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KGBsZ_73bYQ

 

[Diabolique]

Don't worry you made up the lack of turnips with Banana's. Watching this helped me learn the diddy mu. I could tell the diddy knows the Peach mu just as you know the diddy mu. For diddy's second stock when he was recovering under the stage ish you could have easy gimped him. Try to go for the gimps and grabbing the ledge more and things get easier. Try to beware his upair. He usually wins so just don't bother it at all. There 'much for me to say here since im bad at this mu but keep up the good work. =)

Thank you!

I have three Meta Knight videos, if anyone could help me that would be great

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3KPJiYF0i38
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f0NRDekKRJw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=twngxMPqUx0

 

[z00ted]

I have a few friendly vids with my bro. Critique please??

Peach vs Mario
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jkNdH-xE1d4
Peach vs Snake
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVZrXA5DhoA
Peach vs Samus 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ld47K4c2rYY
Peach vs Samus 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LWp_TA8Sqvs
Peach vs MK
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KGBsZ_73bYQ

It must be fun having a brother that is close to your skill level.
I could tell you two know how to play each other it showed in the playstyle.

I watched all of them except for Samus 2.

Really there is not alot to say you both played really well - your brother sd's alot haha.

Versus Snake and Metaknight though you might want to be more aware of your percentages and how easily you can die. Try to dair Snake when he has a greenade in his hands it can help you more thank you think. You really rushed in alot (which is good) but not at higher percentages. Try to play lure Snake offstage or to the edge of the stage when you feel you are safe and not in threat of being killed his landing lag is bad and he doesn't like being in the air. Vs the Metaknight you played very well but a tip I could give would to stay in the center of the stage with turnips when you have a significant lead. I can recall that you had a stock lead with 50% at a point versus the Metaknight but had poor stage position so he just swept you and took your stock evening out the score. Try to work on that.

Great matches lloD!

Oh yeah...where did you get those textures for your shield to make them look darker?
I've been looking for them forever but cant find them.

 

[Razmakazi]

llod, i watched the other 2 mk vids (lmao@hitting him 3 times w/ the same stitchy) xD

you need to stop using your float to float back to the stage


it's slow, you're defenseless. you basically have no options in that situation so that's why shuttle loop keeps killing u. it's best to use the float to stall out mks jumps if he comes out after u.

hmm and u keep using ftilt sometimes to punish landings but there are better options for it like lingering hitboxes like dair or dsmash, charged fsmashes, grabs, ground float fair, etc.

i likez wut i sees though haha.

edit: watched the rest. yeah nothing is rly wrong. it's just that you get ***** for floating back to recover. you get hit most of the time. that's how fludd to spike happens XD
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

kaaate~ ;O

i liked how consistent you seem to be with footstooling the nado but just try not to land next to MK when you do get out. especially when MK is grounded just waiting for you. his options would vastly outnumber yours so just go for a platform or edge or float way or somethin'.

well, i just like how you fight around nado in general but just one little thing to keep in mind is that if it's eating your shield and your shield is getting low you can spot dodge the very end of it and then try to punish him or get out of the way.

also it doesn't seem like you think you can punish dsmash on your shield but dash atk oos or jab or turnip oos work just fine and you can grab MK if you powershield. you might be able to sh dair but if you're too far away or if you're too slow then up b is going to hit first.

i'd quit using so much toad stall vs MK or in general as well coooooz MK is soooo fast. Those were easy opportunities to shuttle loop or nair you that were for the most part missed by him. Ima steal your stalls though like when you use it at that perfect height to gay him out. it's pretty cool haha. just remember that you can still do things like DI away from mk or peach bomber away or use bair's movement or just simply attack MK haha.

i think that your ground game needs to be expanded a little too b/c u seem to use too much dsmash. i'd just toy w/ other options. liiiike 2nd stock on SV when you died, if you had thrown out an ftilt, spot dodge, shield, mid height dair/fair, etc. you would've lived. hell, if you just grabbed the edge you would've lived too xD

hmmm aaaaand you always ledgehop when you're on the ledge. mix it up coz it got you killed a couple times. just mess w/ **** and you'll work it out.

i rly like your peach too lol

 

[Xyro77]

Illmatic

+

Xyro

l
l
l
l
V

Xyro(samus)+Illmatic(peach) vs Ozz(fox)+P4(mk) WF 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yIht6Ho8P70

Xyro(samus)+Illmatic(peach) vs Ozz(marth)+P4(mk) WF 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fo_CRCwn8ig

Xyro(samus)+Illmatic(peach) vs Ozz(fox)+P4(mk) WF 3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wp0knARzdlw

Xyro(samus)+Illmatic(peach) vs Zori(toonlink)+Pj(toonlink) 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fvKToBqHkNE

Xyro(samus)+Illmatic(peach) vs Zori(toonlink)+Pj(toonlink) 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u41PsvndpQ0​

 

[Eddie G]

Fun team to watch. Stop hitting each other so much though, like your charge shot at point blank in WF 1. xD

 

[hiROI]

So I have some vids from this past tourney, so please critique? <3
And I realized that I play a lot differently from the beginning of a match and then towards the end when I'm behind in stocks.

vs Olimar (Tourney Match 2)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V1mzawmCN-w

Rest are friendlies

vs MK
I love that second stock kill I did :D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yZFPPESTVW0

vs Marth
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JcpyYJ4xsOc

vs Snake
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BPsQNJK3Y7w

 

[Metatitan]

So I have some vids from this past tourney, so please critique? <3
And I realized that I play a lot differently from the beginning of a match and then towards the end when I'm behind in stocks.

vs Olimar (Tourney Match 2)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V1mzawmCN-w

Rest are friendlies

vs MK
I love that second stock kill I did :D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yZFPPESTVW0

vs Marth
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JcpyYJ4xsOc

vs Snake
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BPsQNJK3Y7w

You seem to be more worried about what you're doing instead of what your opponent is doing. Like vs the marth, you'll Fair-> spotdodge despite not being in grab range and despite the fact that marth's side B eats spotdodges for breakfast. It was pretty noticeable with the olimar too because you seemed to be more focused on killing pikmin and making yourself as random as possible instead of reading, punishing, and killing him. At this point you're more preactive instead of reactive; you try to predict everything instead of reacting to it as it is happening (don't get me wrong, prediction is a key skill but don't adapting is more important). Because of this the olimar was able to land so many up smashes x_x. Idk I'm tired, on meds, it's latish and that's all I could think of right now.

 

[Mister Eric]

EDIT:
Nevermind, found the Q&A thread on the bottom of the 2nd page XD That should really be stickied haha.

 

[Diabolique]

Ok, new video, Thanks for the advice last time

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ad37n2hnpY
vs.

That Nair so sooo annoying any tips? I remember Praxis saying something about jabbing inbetween Bair hits and it helped me out a little bit. I also let go of my shield too early

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

@hiROI - vs Olimar, you were Floating far too high and far too much when you were approaching him. Mix up Floating and SH's so you don't get too predictable. Because you were Floating too high, it took you longer to land which gave Olimar enough time to escape punishment (because it took you longer to land on the ground) and to punish you (because your stuck in aerial ending animation rather than being on the ground and Jabbing him). If you're going to Float, do it at around head height - this way, you avoid F Smash but are close enough to the ground to stop Olimar from running away or prevent him from Up Smashing/Grabbing you as you land because he doesn't have enough time to do so. Also if you use Dair, your Dair is actually going to connect with Olimar rather than just hitting his Pikmin

You hardly ever used Bair. Use more Bair instead of Fair. I'd show you using hitbubble pictures but they're too big and would clog up the page soooo imagine they're there or look at the pictures
Fair has a nice big blindspot below it which is just begging for Olimar to running Up Smash you. Fair is also has slow start up and doesn't cover your whole body as much as Bair does. Bair is a much better choice because you can kill any Pikmin on you with it, you can essentially 'sit' on Olimar and his shield and follow up with Jabs and D Smash because of his slow grab and you can outprioritize his Pikmin moves which keeps you safe and lets you break through and hit Olimar. Heck, approaching with Nair or SH Dairs would have been better than Fair. I didn't see a single SH Bair which imo its a key move to use in winning vs Olimar

You also do that ******** 'lets mash jump so I start Floating asap and waste my double jump' which not only removes a useful baiting option, it increase the time it takes for you to get in the air (leaving you more vunerable to getting Up Smashed/Faired) and because Olimar is so short, causes you to start Floating at the wrong height (waaaay above head height)
Also - This was really really really bad. Its not even like you could have used the Turnip to catch and edgeguard Olimar because you were already holding one. You threw away a massive positional advantage you had for...no reason at all :/ I really don't know why you did this


Those were the things I thought caused you to lose that match. The beginning of the match was fine but towards the end, Olimar really started to abuse the fact you didn't use Bair (mainly SH'ed) and kept pulling up Turnips, which aren't useful unless you're edgeguarding him. You had the advantage the whole time but when Olimar realized he was in danger of losing, he really started to play on the things you weren't doing


@Diabolique - Make sure your Turnip pulls are safe. Either make sure you have enough distance or Bone Walk away. Avoid taking G&W head on in the air because aerials have much more power and range than Peach's. Use more Dash Attack to punish his landings

The thing that really made you lose was that hiccup on your 2nd stock. Practice floating down with your Parasol to where the ledge sweetspot is because you ended up going straight past it, then trying to correct yourself and zooming straight past it again. G&W shouldn't have been able to edgeguard you like that

I would also advise some practice on how to DI out of and sucessfully punish G&W's Bair. If he's SH'ing like he did in the beginning, use the 2nd hit of Dash Attack to punish his landing. You can use Turnips but as you saw, the Bair will sometimes hit the Turnip and cancel it out. If you get hit in the air with Bair or by the beginning hits in general, DI up out of his Bair and also DI either left or right as well. If you DI into G&W and you're good at it, you can DI digonally up out of the Bair and hit G&W with your own Bair
Against his Nair...IIRC, you have to DI away from it but you're best off asking someone else or watching some vs G&W vids to see how other people do it

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i5VZHrjCl3Q
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=djchILV8oJ0

My turn for some help.

 

[Razmakazi]

hiroi, i think the problem is what metatitan said. you kind of do things a lot despite which ones get you hit. I see a lot of double jump bair sometimes but that's not exactly the greatest option in the world. I just don't feel that you're thinking about what is it about what you do that gets you punished. Liiiike vs the olimar you could've been shielding a lot of his pikmin. Oli can punish well sometimes during your move lag when you knock pikmin off. It's just as simple as shielding his pikmin or retreating before you knock pikmin off.

kate, u can punish gdubz bair oos after the 4th it. you did it right once when you jabbed it oos. and in the nair juggles it's haaaarc coz gdubz can uair too so what you need to do is get to the edge or the other side of the stage. you can use uair's forward momentum or bair's backward momentum, your double jump and your float to make this happen lol. you played pretty well but I think you also need to camp gdubz more. you'd reverse glide toss away but with your next turnip you'd glide toss into him for no reason. you gotta play gayer coz his priority is too good.

xeylode, i'll look later. ;o

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

I'll hold you to that Raz 0.0

 

[rm88]

So this is the first time I post of a vid of my Peach :D It's not the best video, but I liked the ending. My opponent still hasn't figured out how to destroy Peach with Marth, by the way.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vwZ-UZSVxA

I have other vids on my channel but they're somewhat older and/or worse. It sucks because my absolute best matches can't be recorded due to the 3 minute limit (unmodded Wii).

 

[Queen B. Kyon]

So this is the first time I post of a vid of my Peach :D It's not the best video, but I liked the ending. My opponent still hasn't figured out how to destroy Peach with Marth, by the way.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vwZ-UZSVxA

I have other vids on my channel but they're somewhat older and/or worse. It sucks because my absolute best matches can't be recorded due to the 3 minute limit (unmodded Wii).

I actually watched the vid before I read all of what you wrote. I enjoyed your usmash reads and good use of dash attack. I feel dash attack is used the best when people are falling. To be honest there isnt much to say on the vid. Except you roll quite alot. I loved your shieldng against his side b. Im guessing you play that person abit?

 

[duckuggs]

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[Two-Ell]

^ lol I don't I've ever seen a bot on smashboards until now.

 

[Moozle]

So this is the first time I post of a vid of my Peach :D It's not the best video, but I liked the ending. My opponent still hasn't figured out how to destroy Peach with Marth, by the way.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vwZ-UZSVxA

I have other vids on my channel but they're somewhat older and/or worse. It sucks because my absolute best matches can't be recorded due to the 3 minute limit (unmodded Wii).

Very nice Usmash kills One note I have is that when you are momentum canceling, use an aerial (UpAir or Dair) instead of air dodging. It's much better, and will help you survive longer.

 

[Eddie G]

Hmm...guess I should post these here too.

Some friendlies (and a MM) from two separate smashfests/tournies not too long ago. Recording courtesy of 2link121.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k0bnl13cZfU - King Beef (Peach) vs. Links24 (King Dedede)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z5iICwldGyE King Beef (Peach) vs. Grandmaster Smexi (Ness)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iK13ZgGrcXg - King Beef (Peach) vs. Omni (Pikachu)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xO5q0XHVAmk - King Beef (Peach) vs. Feiy (Pit)

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

I greatly approve of the Final Fantasy VI cave music in the DeDeDe video
Which was the MM?

 

[Eddie G]

The Pikachu one. :3

 

[Razmakazi]

i shall watch after i get home from school in maybe 8-9 hrs haha

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

Without wanting to be harsh, I got the impression that you were simply better than your opponents KB in all your videos. The Pikachu was the MM which I imagine would be the most likely match you'd play serious sooooo

Learn to DI out of D Smash (whack up on both sticks), don't go to such lengths to avoid thunder jolts, a simple powershield would suffice. You were a bit wasteful with your Turnips, insta dropping them off a edge cancelled pull is flashy but it didn't really do anything because it either a) didn't hit because Pikachu had ledge invincibilty or b) Pikachu had jumped up over the Turnip whilst you were on the moving platform
...I can't really think of anything else because you weren't really in any danger of losing. I would normally say 'camp more' but you didn't really need to

Maybe its just because I play so campy myself lol >.>

 

[Two-Ell]

I greatly approve of the Final Fantasy VI cave music in the DeDeDe video
Which was the MM?

Thanks, I loved it when I first heard it myself and it fits the stage well. Oh sorry for topic deviation.

 

[Eddie G]

Without wanting to be harsh, I got the impression that you were simply better than your opponents KB in all your videos. The Pikachu was the MM which I imagine would be the most likely match you'd play serious sooooo

Learn to DI out of D Smash (whack up on both sticks), don't go to such lengths to avoid thunder jolts, a simple powershield would suffice. You were a bit wasteful with your Turnips, insta dropping them off a edge cancelled pull is flashy but it didn't really do anything because it either a) didn't hit because Pikachu had ledge invincibilty or b) Pikachu had jumped up over the Turnip whilst you were on the moving platform
...I can't really think of anything else because you weren't really in any danger of losing. I would normally say 'camp more' but you didn't really need to

Maybe its just because I play so campy myself lol >.>

Good critique. :3

My response is:

- I already know how to DI out of Pikachu's d-smash (that's so 2008 xD), but the fact that he hit me with the ending hitbox was either because: he caught me by surprise which happens sometimes due to his unorthodox style of play, or it's just that...I get hit by the ending of them move lol.

- The comment on the thunderjolt avoidance was a good one to bring up. However, and I apologize for not explaining it earlier, I can fight Pikachu in two different ways: I either go full blown sexy-on-the-eyes aggro against him because I'm just that acquainted with the matchup, or I do just what you suggested and powershield just about everything he throws at me and respond with a jab/turnip OoS or the next quickest/most efficient option depending on where he is at that moment. I chose to play a little more flashy for the camera in this case, but what you advised is certainly valid and is something I utilize against Pikachu more in tournament play. Just never forget the context of the match being played, that's all. :3

- I see what you mean about the my use of turnips following a ledge cancelled pull. However, I have to say that I will hold true to my own philosophy of turnip use because I feel there is even more potential to it than what I am currently utilizing (which is quite a bit of branching options already from one initial motion), and it often proves fruitful in tournament situations because of its uncommon nature. An example: Not many people are familiar with recatching a z-dropped turnip off of a platform with dash attack (among other things) because Peaches tend to hold onto the turnip after pulling it in anticipation of their next move once they land, instead of initiating a temporary strategy with the turnip before they even land.

What I mean is: I often give my opponents more than one thing to watch out for in situations that they wouldn't expect most Peaches to do, such as using ledgedropped and z-induced mixups in uncommon scenarios as opposed to "Hey, I have a turnip in hand, you see it already; I'll either do this, this, or this at this specific moment". Again, I understand that some of my choices may not prove to be fruitful 100% of the time but my main intent is to add a different element of stage presence (instead of a turnip just simply traveling up, down, left, or right from a c-stick toss) all while applying some aggressive zoning of my own and creating openings. I'm not sure if you notice, but some of my what would be perceived as "whiffed" aerials are actually meant to be "hey, I'm blocking this movement option from you so you can run into this instead", or they're just simply appropriate reads that were counter-read by the opponent in time to avoid them, but can also result in conditioning a correct read the next time the opponent makes a move. It's all a big complex cycle once you get down to the nitty-gritty details of higher level thinking (which, admittedly I'm not particularly up at yet, but I'm working more and more on it).

And yes, I'm a little better than the players now simply because I practice more and harder than they do.

 

[Nicole]

yeah kb, like rick said, you're just better than your opponents. i wouldn't say you're just a 'little' better either, you are significantly better - more technical, smarter, faster...yeah. much better.

i watched the pikachu and ddd ones, pika because it promised to be flashy and ddd because you MM-ed my pal tmacc at mlg and i wanted to see if you improved at that MU at all. pika absolutely did not disappoint, you basically **** on the poor guy. i love seeing all the technical stuff you can pull off. it's hard for me to actually critique you though, because you pretty much just went to town and *****. i would say that many of your choices were entirely unsafe, but because you were able to totally outplay the guy, it didn't matter. perhaps had he been a better player, you would have played safer (i can't know that). so my critique i suppose would be to always space your moves, never commit entirely (that's what floatings for). you commit to ALOT of approaching fairs - you fair and land. i would stay in the air afterwards and if you want to fall, fall with nair afterwards - fair doesnt have much ending lag and nair comes out in 3 frames.

for ddd, again, you were way better than him. i think you played a bit too aggressively though. that matchup is kind of a mystery to me, i think that you should play it similar to mk -insofar as- using a hit and run style. which is weird, because ddd is so fat. however, you have to hit him way more than he has to hit you, so you cant afford to take as much damage. you REALLY need to stay in the air more and space better against this guy. if you fair his sheild, DO NOT drop your float. do a retreating fair. good ddd's will run under you and if you drop your float you'll get grabbed even easier than you would anyway, plus them running underneath you messes up your spacing and you're more vulnerable. so i really really really try to be floating when ddd's on the ground. when he's in the air, i stay the hell out of there unless i see that he likes to shorthop bair, then i'll fullhop dair.

overall - play safer. peach is hard to punish and i dont think you're abusing that aspect of her nearly as much as you could. also, you don't punish your opponent AS much as you could. just kind of a general statement, i suppose. your style seems to be based almost entirely on baiting and punishing, so you definitely want to be top notch at punishing, since your baiting is incredibly good. as far as flashy baiting goes, it can get you quite far, until you meet that opponent that knows how to play safe and effectively. there is a very good, very flashy lucas in my area who relies alot on random lucas ATs that make him zoom around and do crazy ****. everyone loses to him regularly except for me (typically), because i don't get baited. i let him do his crap and i'll never chase after him. if you meet an opponent who doesn't fall for your baiting, i think things won't go as well for you. so, in that regard, i would practice playing more boring at times, just to be sure that you don't lose to more cautious players. against the opponents in your vids...yeah, have some fun

i would also practice spacing a little better. you zone well, but you don't space all that well. (no it's not the same). if you are picking up marth as well, this is crucial (though i think spacing is very crucial for peach as well.)

finally, i would use nair more. i have been working this into my own game and it's been paying off. fair is a great move, but it's slow and stales quickly. nair of course is no substitute, but there are situations where you can use nair that you aren't using it. on ddd's shield, use dair and fall a nair and jab/grab. what's his *** going to do about that (providing you land behind him)? nair doesn't always have to hit - its a fast, great move for making them stay in their shield longer while you get back to the ground safely. lee told me about how great nair was at columbus, but at the time i was like...psh, that move doesn't have any range, whatever. then i did start to use it more and realized what he meant. so yeah, work in more nairs.

that's all, i think i wrote a big enough wall 'o text for the night.

 

[Eddie G]

I appreciate the critique, Nicole. Okay...now that I watched over the vids again myself, I have to say that I agree on the huge skill gap that was present, and that may have been why my play was so over-the-top flashy. So with that said...just use them as a basis from which to study some of my tricks, baiting methods, and any other kinds of things you may not have thought to use yet. xD

As far as playing a more "boring" and safe style, I have no problem switching to it once the necessity presents itself, especially against higher level opponents. A good example of my patience is when I fight high level Warios. I just...get in the zone lol; able to adapt to their movements while playing as patient, opportunistic, and wary of the fart as possible (I need to teach you that MU btw so you can beat Malcolm or any good Wario next time you play them!).

Regarding my spacing...ehh I'll admit that these videos are my best showcase in that regard, but I absolutely do space well when I'm put against a tough opponent (a great example being when I beat Lee Martin's Lucario in a friendly at MLG; that being another matchup I "specialize" in, and one that takes incredible patience, read speed, and spacing to avoid being the one to die earlier and punish/kill faster).

With all that said, I'll make more of an effort to save my replays against opponents around my skill level or higher (and more tournament matches that possess more of a pressure induced mindset) so that you all can have a better opportunity to critique me from a more appropriate source.

Thanks again, everyone. ;D

 

[Razmakazi]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=78PYvKIEO8I matches 1 and 2

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4zJKAUVcfR match 3

it was a 3/5 set but the one where i win didn't get saved apparently XD

dsmashes/toads from across the stage = whiffed mannypulls

i've gotten a lot better at bonewalking/mannypull lately though so maybe next time i can rly start to implement that stuff.

aaaaand that's about it i think.

critique meh, help meh, give meh ideas, etc. etc.

 

[Nicole]

As far as playing a more "boring" and safe style, I have no problem switching to it once the necessity presents itself, especially against higher level opponents. A good example of my patience is when I fight high level Warios. I just...get in the zone lol; able to adapt to their movements while playing as patient, opportunistic, and wary of the fart as possible (I need to teach you that MU btw so you can beat Malcolm or any good Wario next time you play them!).

lol yeah, please. i hate wario. i dont understand him at all :/ next time i see you (prob one of th mlgs?)

 

[Eddie G]

lol yeah, please. i hate wario. i dont understand him at all :/ next time i see you (prob one of th mlgs?)

Most likely MLG DC, or maybe even Yink's tournament if I can make it, weather permitting. You should try to come to Today's School is in Session 3 tournament and bring some MO with you. The turnout is already looking like 50-60+ with a lot of big names showing.

@ Thread- Oh yeah, look at 2:10 of my match vs the Pit to see exactly what I'm talking about regarding some of my usage of ledge/platform pulled turnips. That midair criss-cross was DISGUSTING, and I've evaded/temporarily confused (which are opportunities players strive to create) higher level players with similar tactics as well. I won't abandon my method of turnip development no matter how initially unnecessary it may seem to the naked eye, that's for sure. xD

 

[Nicole]

^apparently i am going to school is in session, so i suppose i will see you there. are you for sure going to that? (if so, do you know anyone good who still needs a teammate?)

 

[Eddie G]

Yeah as of now I'm going for sure. I'm not sure who still needs a teammate but you might want to ask around some of the Ohio threads or in the tourney thread itself. I'll be teaming with Tmacc.

 

[gantrain05]

Yeah as of now I'm going for sure. I'm not sure who still needs a teammate but you might want to ask around some of the Ohio threads or in the tourney thread itself. I'll be teaming with Tmacc.

Is Tmacc the D3 main? i think thats the guy i teamed with at futures. he was pretty new at the game back then, but he has a good head on his shoulders and no doubt has gotten pretty darn good. **** i miss goin to tournies =[