Official "Who is going to return?" topic

[cb_marth]

Hey LEAVE Pichu alone...he's cute!

LOL. He might be cute but that might not save him from making the roster. Although I can see him still being in the game. He is a pretty cool character if you know how to use him.

 

[Ipslne]

Just like most of the other clones... the effects of his moves are original, not necessarily what his moves are. Therefore you have to incorporate different play style, and because of many cons to some of the clones... you require a certain level of skill to play them well. Mainly by greatly exploiting their pros.

So in other words, they're "challenge" characters. Challenge yourself to be able to play them.

 

[AmyCooper000]

i think that pichu contributes nothing to the game... peach should be replaced with daisy, given a new moveset. doctor mario doesnt contribute either. mr. game and watch may play an important role to nintendo but was a bit of a dissapointment. mewtwo needs to be modified for sure. young link and roy may be fun to use but also contribute little. luigi needs unique moves. jigglypuff is too slow. the ice climbers arent that great... and shiek is not neccessary. ness needs a few new moves but otherwise is fine.

 

[thebasman]

Ok, a few things.

What would be the point of replacing Peach with Daisy? Peach is obviously the stronger candidate here.

Luigi has different moves already, he's only vaugely similar to Mario now, I know that I at least play them completely differently.

How do you go about just giving new moves to a character? There are x amount of button combinations which form attacks, so even if Nintendo were to add like b-tilts and b-smashes, as opposed to just B moves (which I am not advocating by any stretch) it still wouldn't be just adding moves to one character (I'm talking about your comment about Ness here).

 

[Champion Marth]

if marth goes or gets switched with ike that'll be stupid marth is the bomb ike is just a marthalike character if you think about it. Marth-Blue hair ike-blue hair
both uses swords, only difference is that Marth is a fallen prince and ike is a Mercenary

 

[loki1321321324]

Hey thebasman! obviously amycooper000 meant that peach is that just because peach is a main character and daisy isnt, that doesnt mean that daisy cant kick butt just as much. also, peach's moves are somewhat stale and basic and daisy has never really been explained so almost anything could be done about daisy as a character.

By "ness needs a few new moves but otherwise is fine" he/she did not mean that ness will get extra moves but as replace some ,such as the yoyo, with better moves. i mean come on, a yoyo is just so intimidating isnt it? and the fire thing should be upgraded to a better fire move.

Luigi's moves are deffinetly not different from mario's because they were BASED ON MARIO'S MOVES. honestly, you need to expand your mind's limits of thoughts and logical ideas. they both have EXTREMELY similar moves and were just changed a little bit by speed, direction, appearance, or power. and the cape was just replaced with a missile like move.

 

[AmyCooper000]

peach has some great moves but her personality and portrayal as "the chick getting kidnapped by bowser" makes her a bit of an oddball to the game while daisy with her tomboyish personality fits in with the idea of the game

 

[SuppaRoy]

I dont think all the clones will be kicked out cause they werent like perfect clones they hade their unique stuff so maybe little changes will be made or even none cause it wasnt that bad. Only REALLY bad clone was pichu i mean he was pichu...but self damaging come on how could they even think of that. Plus Roy is my best character and even though he is the clone of Marth i suck with him.

 

[fluffy]

Hey LEAVE Pichu alone...he's cute!

yup. thats good reason for having pichu again.

 

[thebasman]

Pertaining to the Peach issue: Daisy is just the princess of neighboring kingdom of the mushroom kingdom. She is not very different from Peach. That said, I think that Peach's "get kidnapped" personality is one of the reasons she was included. It's cool to see her kicking ***.

On the Luigi topic, if you look at the degree of similarity between Luigi and Mario, and then lookat the degree of similarity between Marth and Roy, you see a huge difference. Not just in B moves, but in A moves. And just in general demeanor. Luigi and Mario are completely different characters in those respects.

As for Ness, if you wanted to say that you wanted his moves to change, then you could have just said "eliminate the yoyo." That I can understand.

 

[loki1321321324]

thebasman, you have no idea of waht you are talking about. by peach being known for getting her butt kicked that does not make her cool but the fact that daisy's tomboyish personality makes her more appealing, is awesome!

luigi is not different you moron. i know that marth and roy have 99% the same moves (the only difference is that one is stronger and one is easier killed) but you cant compare tat pair of people to another or else you will obviously think that the other pair of people (in this case mario and luigi) are different. so f*** marth and roy just pay attention to the pair of italian idoits!

and shut up about my comments on ness! you are such an immature child! and those yoyo attacks are so dumb, that that comment was very neccesary.

 

[loki1321321324]

oh yes, and we have barely ever seen daisy kick butt so i would like to see that for once

 

[Rhyme]

So he should be kicked out just because he was a weak version of Pichu? That's not a very good excuse.

Pichu did have some small importance in a few shorts and specials. For example, the Pichu brothers were some of the main characters in some episodes of Pokemon Chronicles. They were featured in some shorts before Plusle and Minun came along.

He is not totally weak. He is faster than Pikachu, and his up smash is better than Pikachu's IMO. Plus, learning how to use a character that hurts himself shows how good a player is. It's also fun to beat a really good character using Pichu.

Being a clone is not a good excuse to be cut out either. All clones have potential to be different. I had a post long ago that gives an example of how different Pichu could be. He could just use moves he learns by breeding in game. For example, he could have the attack Present. He would toss a Present which would either explode on impact on enemies or heal allies. Another good attack is Rest. Instead of doing the same thing as Jigglypuff, he will sleep until he fully recovers or is hit. He could also keep a few moves, but with altered effects. An example is his Thunderbolt. If it damages himself, it should also paralyze the enemy for a few seconds. Finally, he could have the move Volt Tackle while Pikachu does not.

He has some importance in the series. He was one of the first baby Pokemon to be introduced. He symbolizes baby Pokemon and Johto in SSBM. There's no other baby Pokemon that could be a better representative than Pichu.

Before I get to addressing this long quote, Loki shut up! Mario and Luigi are completely different. In the interest of time and money, they left the animations the same. I don't know a single person who plays Mario AND Luigi competitively, because they are actually THAT different. So it is abundantly clear that you do not know what you are talking about. As for Peach/Daisy, while Daisy's attitude fits smash better, Peach's history, popularity, and importance fit it better. Plus with Super Princess Peach, nintendo has moves to draw from, whereas with Daisy, she has never fought in a nintendo game before.

Ok now the Pichu quote. Sure nintendo could make him better. They could make any fighter the best in the game. Now, how strong do you want a baby to be, exactly? Sure he is fast, but that is his only pro I can think of. And yes it's true that no clone had to be a clone, but I think Pichu would be the most similar to his origional, no matter how hard they worked to change him. Sure they could give him some new moves, but he just wasn't that popular. He is cute, but how many people do you know that, while they were playing smash 64, went around saying "I hope, in the next smash, they put pichu in cause he would totally kick ***?" I would much rather see any of the other 30+ characters nintendo is adding over Pichu. Pichu as a character...just doesn't excite me.

 

[bijoukaiba]

thebasman, you have no idea of waht you are talking about. by peach being known for getting her butt kicked that does not make her cool but the fact that daisy's tomboyish personality makes her more appealing, is awesome!

Peach is not being replaced. Popularity, history, significance. Three words all characters need to have to be in Brawl. Peach easily qualifies. Daisy would too, but Peach's popularity > Daisy's popularity. Not only that, but I think we have plenty of Mario characters already.

luigi is not different you moron. i know that marth and roy have 99% the same moves (the only difference is that one is stronger and one is easier killed) but you cant compare tat pair of people to another or else you will obviously think that the other pair of people (in this case mario and luigi) are different. so f*** marth and roy just pay attention to the pair of italian idoits!

Luigi IS different. The term "luigify" was named after him, meaning to alter a clone from the original fighter. True, Luigi and Mario have some similarities, but they also have several easily noticed differences and some that are less obvious. And they are not Italian "idoits".
And how dare you insult Marth and Roy like that! >=( I personally hope both of the swordsmen return, with Roy luigified (ring a bell?)... although I realize Marth has a greater chance of returning and Roy has a greater chance of removal. I'll be 100% happy with Brawl as long as Marth returns.

and shut up about my comments on ness! you are such an immature child! and those yoyo attacks are so dumb, that that comment was very neccesary.

So, thebasman is the one being immature here? Hmmm... thebasman actually put up some very good arguments while keeping a cool head. tbm, I've gotta +rep you for that. Yep, you can't get more immature than that. *sarcasm*

One of Ness's original weapons from the Earthbound series was a yo-yo, so it personifies him well.

luigi is not different you moron.

thebasman isn't the moron here...

 

[MiraiGen]

Pertaining to the Peach issue: Daisy is just the princess of neighboring kingdom of the mushroom kingdom. She is not very different from Peach. That said, I think that Peach's "get kidnapped" personality is one of the reasons she was included. It's cool to see her kicking ***.

On the Luigi topic, if you look at the degree of similarity between Luigi and Mario, and then lookat the degree of similarity between Marth and Roy, you see a huge difference. Not just in B moves, but in A moves. And just in general demeanor. Luigi and Mario are completely different characters in those respects.

As for Ness, if you wanted to say that you wanted his moves to change, then you could have just said "eliminate the yoyo." That I can understand.

The main reason they included her was because of Super Mario Bros 2, Mario Sports, and Super Mario RPG, actually. The frypan and umbrella were from SMRPG, golf club, tennis racket, etc from the Mario sports games, and Float and Turnip from SMB2. And unless I'm mistaken, her Toad came from the Super Mario comics ran in Nintendo Power.

So they took all this and said, "Woah, hey guys, I think I have an idea."

And about the yo-yo, oh hell no! Leave the yo-yo alone. That needs to be there. Hell, I'd be cool with them improving it. It was too vital as a weapon to Earthbound/Mother to leave out of Brawl.

 

[thebasman]

Bijoukaiba, thanks for the +rep, I appreciate it.

I guess I would just like to point out that I love Marth and I think Roy has potential for Luigification, even though I'm not really sure if he'll be back.

And I love the yoyo, I was just trying to figure out a better way that loki could have phrased his contention.

No reason for anyone to fly off the handle.

I guess that opens up another question: which clones do you think can be Luigified, and which clones do you think are better left alone.

I personally feel that Ganondorf has the best potential for luigication because his character isn't actually related to Captain Falcon at all. It's kind of random that their moveset is so similar. Contrast this to something like the Fox/Falco relationship, where I think it would be a lot harder to Luigify.

 

[Jawa]

Just to clarify with everyone here, you all do know you don't have to say "If they return" right?

In three press conferences over a large amount of time since Brawl's first info released, they have confirmed with several interviewers that Every SSB/SSBM character will return?

Don't flame me about this, but it's been in articles for a very long time now.. And it helps when you just go to a Gaming Expo near you when given the chance and find out for yourself, although we aren't all blessed with the chance to do so I know.

As for the Luigi issue, he's totally different than mario, that's why I can't f'in use him like mario at all, like someone said above they have almost identical animations, but they aren't the same, they really are totally different, as they are in most storylines of their games.

The yoyo is a great move, it catches alot of people off guard and shouldn't be removed or modified, it's fine as is, Roy should be Luigified in my opinion, oh and The Baseball Bat with ness should exist as Mario's cape, if used to rapidly, it should break.

 

[thebasman]

Hey, maybe I'm behind, I wouldn't be surprised, but could you point me to some link where I can verify what you just posted? I would be interested in reading it. Because what I had heard was that he said that he was definitely making some cuts of characters, and that they weren't all returning.

 

[Thrillhouse-vh.]

Hey thebasman! obviously amycooper000 meant that peach is that just because peach is a main character and daisy isnt, that doesnt mean that daisy cant kick butt just as much. also, peach's moves are somewhat stale and basic and daisy has never really been explained so almost anything could be done about daisy as a character.

By "ness needs a few new moves but otherwise is fine" he/she did not mean that ness will get extra moves but as replace some ,such as the yoyo, with better moves. i mean come on, a yoyo is just so intimidating isnt it? and the fire thing should be upgraded to a better fire move.

Luigi's moves are deffinetly not different from mario's because they were BASED ON MARIO'S MOVES. honestly, you need to expand your mind's limits of thoughts and logical ideas. they both have EXTREMELY similar moves and were just changed a little bit by speed, direction, appearance, or power. and the cape was just replaced with a missile like move.

thebasman, you have no idea of waht you are talking about. by peach being known for getting her butt kicked that does not make her cool but the fact that daisy's tomboyish personality makes her more appealing, is awesome!

luigi is not different you moron. i know that marth and roy have 99% the same moves (the only difference is that one is stronger and one is easier killed) but you cant compare tat pair of people to another or else you will obviously think that the other pair of people (in this case mario and luigi) are different. so f*** marth and roy just pay attention to the pair of italian idoits!

and shut up about my comments on ness! you are such an immature child! and those yoyo attacks are so dumb, that that comment was very neccesary.

oh yes, and we have barely ever seen daisy kick butt so i would like to see that for once

1. If you've ever played Luigi, you would know about Green Missle, his foward smash, and loads of other differences. Hell, even the B fireball is different. He is 75% his own character
2. If you ever played Earthbound, you would know that the Yo-yo is a very powerful weapon and is a STAPLE of the franchise. there is no way they will remove it. that would be like removing all the PSI moves
3. Marth and Roy are closer than Mario and Luigi by ALOt, and even they play differentley.
4. You can't spell
5. Don't double post
6. YOU'RE being acting like an immature child
7. When you say "Italian idiots", you sound awfully racist

 

[Zink]

Jawa, it has been explicitly stated by Sakurai that not all characters will return. Where are you getting your wrong information?

 

[bijoukaiba]

Bijoukaiba, thanks for the +rep, I appreciate it.

I guess I would just like to point out that I love Marth and I think Roy has potential for Luigification, even though I'm not really sure if he'll be back.

And I love the yoyo, I was just trying to figure out a better way that loki could have phrased his contention.

No reason for anyone to fly off the handle.

I guess that opens up another question: which clones do you think can be Luigified, and which clones do you think are better left alone.

I personally feel that Ganondorf has the best potential for luigication because his character isn't actually related to Captain Falcon at all. It's kind of random that their moveset is so similar. Contrast this to something like the Fox/Falco relationship, where I think it would be a lot harder to Luigify.

You're welcome! While all clones have the potential for luigification, I think the easiest ones would be:

Ganondorf: Originally intended to have an original moveset, cancelled due to time constraints. It'll more than likely feature that sword of his, and maybe a transformation to his beastly form.

Falco: Too popular to be destroyed, and SF: Assault had a decent array of weaponry to give him his own luigified-if not completely new- moveset.

Young Link: Personally, I don't care for him, but he has potential. A lot of recent games- particularly Windwaker- starred the little hero and featured unique weaponry: Iron Boots, Deku Leaf, Skull Hammer, etc. He could easily be given a new moveset or a Luigified one in any case.

Roy probably would have a decent chance of luigification, as there's more than one way to wield a sword/fire.

The only two that might prove challenging would be Pichu and Dr. Mario.

 

[Jawa]

Jawa, it has been explicitly stated by Sakurai that not all characters will return. Where are you getting your wrong information?

The wrong information was from IGN >_<

My bad I didn't noticed the post was modified a week later as a translation error.

 

[woody72691]

ness going to return he goopd but he need a little work on. fox glad hes back just don't like the fact he has falcos fighting stance from melee and don't like him holding his blaster. and i just got word in that there not taking anyone out.

 

[Caleb Wolfbrand]

Ness' Yoyo was so much better in 64...

I rly hope Captain Falcon returns. I hope Ganon and Falco are "Luigized" and I also hope Luigi returns with his same crazy traction. I want Sheik Marth Jigglypuff G&W Boozer and yes Mewtwo. Revamped to hell and back, all of em...

 

[thebasman]

I think the Sheik question is an interesting one. Sure, she was a very popular character, but at this stage in the game she isn't even close to current. We're talking a decade. And Zamus seems very similar from what we've seen of Brawl, especially in the new trailer. I kind of feel like Sheik isn't coming back.

 

[cb_marth]

You bring up some good points. I do agree that there is a big chance that she won't be in Brawl. I would like to see her in it though. I don't think that there will be a lot of characters taken out of the game, I think they will probably replace a few with better charatcers. I can see them haveing a roster of 40-60 from anywhere around there. Which I think would be a great number seeing how there is a great chance that Brawl will be online. As long as they bring Marth back and make him look half decent then I am happy. Go Marth, and go Brawl lol!!!!

 

[Jawa]

What I don't get is in a load of translations from Sakurai it says he feels its better to add then remove to keep old fans happy, I'm kind of leaning towards like the loss of maybe two characters who might be clones, and I must agree with the feeling of Shiek not returning. As much as I love shiek.

I think it would be nice to see Ganon Luigized too.

 

[MiraiGen]

Basman, you're probably one of the better posters I've seen on this forum since I joined. For that, I +rep you.

At least once I figure out where the rep button is on this son of a *****...

Anyway.

I personally feel that Roy doesn't need Luigification. I think Marth does. Nobody really ever thinks about this, because Marth "came first" for a variety of reasons (In the Fire Emblem series, unlocking him in Melee, his tier list, etc), but honestly. Marth really is just a quick swordfighter. All of his moves really have very little "Unique" feel to them.

Can't say the same about Roy, considering Blazer, upsmash, counter, Flare Blade, and such. Why would you want to modify him at all? He already has enough unique qualities. It's only his sluggish lag that makes him on the short end of the tier list.

Since I didn't play Fire Emblem originals (With Marth) I can't say how to Luigify him. But I honestly think he needs it less (But only slightly) than Gannondorf and Falco.

About Shiek: I really hope they separate Zelda and Shiek. Zelda is quickly moving to become one of my mains, and Shiek is outstandingly good. They have enough reason to make them independent characters, since very few people actually play both interchangeably (The transforming sequence is too laggy to use it reliably). I don't think she's getting the axe, because alot of programming work went into her.

She's one of the few completely bipedal, fast, hand-to-hand fighters, and they probably just borrowed some moves to make Snake and ZS Samus.

/tip 2 CP

 

[thebasman]

First of all, thank you for the rep.

Second of all, I think that the reason Marth and Roy play the way they do has to do with the nature of their swords themselves, actually. Marth's sword is called Falchion, and it's supposed to cut the wind. Roy's sword is, obviously, more fire based. I think it's easier to make the fire theme easy to see than it is to do the same with Falchion. Marth speed is a testament to the sword and it's nature, more swift. Roy's sword is all about power, and that's the way he is presented in Melee. I think it's fine how they are now and I would hope to see them both again, but if one has to go/ get Luigified, I think it should be Roy simply because Marth is more iconic of the series, and Lugifying Marth is to Fire Emblem and Luigifying Fox is to Star Fox.

I might be a little biased, though, because Marth is my main.

 

[MiraiGen]

See, but the idea of Luigifying Roy instead of Marth is simply based off of the fact that "Marth was there first." Than again, I do happen to like Roy alot, which is probably why I want him to get improved. He needs more love.

I doubt Roy's even coming back (I'll miss you buddy, we had some good times.), but I'm hoping he does. If only for Blazer and his Counter, he's a thrill to play in casual matches.

 

[Rhyme]

When you say "Italian idiots", you sound awfully racist

No, I think the term you were searching for would be moronic. I'm Italian and I wasn't bothered by it at all. Although in that sentence, Italian is used as an adjective and not idiots. Then again, I know that this is not true, so why should it bother me? Then of course is the fact that I find racial jokes funny, and what kind of person are you if you can't laugh at yourself?(For the record that 'racist' statement was in no manner, funny)

I think that the reason we say Roy should be luigified can be contributed to one of a few things...

1. Roy has the outer placement in character selection, singling him out because that is where all the other clones are located.
2. Melee Marth performed better than melee Roy.(IMO)
3. Marth seems to be more popular outside of melee.(but Roy has T3H PH1R3 or w/e)
4. Roy was unlocked by playing as Marth, making Marth the origional.

Yes some of the above theories were previously stated, but I am compiling a list and thought I would re-state for the record.

I personally like Marth better as a fighter, and would rather see him in brawl. Even though the fire element is so much better than wind, boosting Roy to match Marth's performance would be unspeakable so I would sacrifice cool for playability.

 

[thebasman]

I think the question as to who should be Luigified is interesting and up for debate, but as for you will be Luigified, I think Roy is a clear choice, for the reasons that Rhyme stated just now.

I think it's legitimate to argue that Marth shoujld be Luigified though, even though I don't neccessarily agree.

 

[MiraiGen]

Yeah, I'm just trying to raise support for Roy. He got shafted in Melee, and I want him back and badder than ever.

It's just that saying that "He performed better in Melee" is kind of ridiculous logic, since if any character wasn't as good as others, they will probably change that, and even still, the devs don't pay attention to tier list or tournament videos.

 

[Stratovarious]

could someone please just allow me to rest easy by reassuring me that yoshi will still be in the game? please?

 

[alpha n00b]

relax exlax, that stupid dino isn't extinct yet

 

[icymatt]

could someone please just allow me to rest easy by reassuring me that yoshi will still be in the game? please?

The Pastel-y stage wasn't from Metroid's Island, was it?

 

[Rhyme]

The Pastel-y stage wasn't from Metroid's Island, was it?

You are reffuring to the stage typically deemed Yoshi's, are you not? That stage just radiates hope, how could it not be Yoshi's? The textures even seem familiar to Yoshi if you look closely, and the design patterns. Notice the curved, rolling hills in the background, the smiling flowers, the cartoonish bird in the top left. And look at the hump with a face and eyebrows with a platform on his head, located to the left of the main platform. That is actually from Yoshi's Island. If that isn't Yoshi's level, I may have just lost a small but recognizable amount of faith in Nintendo.

 

[icymatt]

I was trying to offer hope by giving an example of what that stage most definetly was not.

Yoshi's Island is one of my favorite games, ever. I would recognize it a million miles away. I'm so very happy that decided to make that stage, it's something I've always wanted.

Buy, yeah, unless we live in Bizarro World and the stage is actually for Baby Mario, it's pretty definitive proof that Yoshi is coming back. Not that we needed it, because any fool with half a brain could tell you that. Yoshi is one of Nintendo's most popular characters, ain't no way they're going to take him out.

 

[Rhyme]

I was trying to offer hope by giving an example of what that stage most definetly was not.

Well, you confused me with that statement. Perhaps it was missing that little "[/sarcaism]" thing at the end, which you really should include on a message board since we can't hear how you are saying whatever you are saying. Sorry for assuming that you might actually be that stupid.

 

[Wendy Wu]

All the characters who are confirmed are the only characters returning.

yeah right, i think that they are not going to tell us what the unlockable charactors are, duh!