Official SWF Tier List v8

[Grim Tuesday]

sero zuit zamus

 

[Djent]

^ Had a hard time perceiving what you did

 

[infiniteV115]

Because you're literally the only person on the forum whom I've ever seen use the term Zamus to refer to Samus, and you're reasoning behind it is terrible. MK's use B moves like nado and shuttle loop all the time but I don't see you calling him Beta Knight. Or calling Wario Wairio.

Itd be like if I started referring to Diddy Kong as DK because he's always using dsmash and downB, and then when people get confused I'm like "What why are you guys so confused I clearly said Donkey Kong earlier when referring to Donkey Kong" while also claiming that only a few scrubs on the forums refer to Donkey Kong as DK

 

[Man Li Gi]

My reasoning isn't terrible, plus I have never heard anyone refer to ZSS as Zamus. If you refer to ZSS as Zamus, to me, it comes off as saying that you transform between ZSS and Samus every time mid match. No one complains when people say Sheilda because with the same mentality, people should've been confused a long time ago with that term as in referring to Sheik or Zelda. My reasoning is not flawed, but different.

 

[Shiny Mewtwo aka Jigglysir]

You've never heard people refer to ZSS as Zamus before?

You need to get out more.

Or less, I'm not sure.

 

[Man Li Gi]

NO, people always say Zero Suit or ZSS from where I'm from. Zamus sounds way too much like Samus, so I guess people didn't want to say it, so to be clear, people say ZSS (and its shorter). Being rude doesn't make you go far. Making these forums unnecessarily exclusive in an inclusive game is a bad look.

 

[infiniteV115]

Not everybody on the forums is from where you are. I prefer the term 'ZSS' too (I've always hated the name 'Zamus" for ZSS) but the idea that you're gonna insist on calling Samus Zamus despite the fact that Zamus is a widely recognized alias for ZSS and solely because Samus players use Zair a lot is ridiculous. Again, why don't you apply this logic to other characters and start calling them Beta Knight, Wairio, Farth, etc.

If you wanna come up with a cutesy nickname for Samus based on her gameplay, you could just call her Spamus because
1) Tons of people already call her Spamus so using this name would cause no confusion
2) Samus 'spams' missiles and zair to zone them out and camp and whatnot

If Zamus wasn't already a widely recognized name for ZSS, nobody would be complaining. But since it is, insisting on calling Samus that is unnecessarily confusing because it's like you expect people to go from thinking "Zamus means Zero Suit Samus" to "Zamus means Zero Suit Samus unless it's a post by Man Li Gi, in which case Zamus refers to Samus"

 

[Shiny Mewtwo aka Jigglysir]

Again, why don't you apply this logic to other characters and start calling them Beta Knight, Wairio, Farth, etc.

IZE CLIMBERZ

 

[Man Li Gi]

People already call MK Nado Night. Anyway, the Spamus title has been taken by Spake. Also Diddy is BK. I don't know how widely recognized the term is as everyone, including the university I attend (U of I), has a quite a few ZSS mains, and they've never heard of the Zamus term referring to ZSS. The reason I know that is because I just asked them (like half an hour ago) and they thought it was a reference to Samus' Zair. Remember, the few people 136,000+ people on this forum are a minority (and an even smaller part is Brawl). Anyway, Zamus is not too out of the way like Beta Knight, Wairio, IZE CLIMBERZ, and Farth as each time you say those other terms, people will try and correct and say "You mean (respective character's name)". Zamus and Spamus sounds like it really fits Samus and so the title(s) can stick. Now that that's out of the way, is there actually any tier talk or are people that bored to continue this conversation that really offers nothing to the metagame/tiers in general?

 

[Grim Tuesday]

NO ONE HAS EVER SAID NADO NIGHT WHO DO YOU THINK YOU ARE

caps

 

[infiniteV115]

Pretty sure the few ZSS mains at your university are a minority in comparison to the people on this forum and other websites for competitive Brawl

The people I started playing Brawl with referred to ftilt as "secondary side A", but you don't see me insisting on using that on the forums lmao. Part of becoming a part of the competitive community (not just for Brawl, or smash, but I imagine for fighting games altogether) is to get used the lingo. It prevents confusion and is an integral part of the culture, and insisting on using the same lingo incorrectly (when interacting with the rest of the competitive community) just because a few of your friends (who I imagine aren't even really that heavily involved in the competitive community? Most colleges/universities don't have many competitive players, let alone many competitive players who main the same character) do so is just stubborn. I mean if you wanna use that lingo when talking to other people who use it similarly, go ahead. But on the boards where ZSS/Zamus mean Zero Suit Samus and Samus/Spamus mean Samus, all it's going to do is create confusion and derail discussion (eg this post lul)

Also wtf I've never heard Nado Knight, Spake, BK. Or were you joking about these

Anyway, I'd like some productive discussion too. Just saying though I'm gonna keep responding to any posts of yours with the word 'Zamus' in it as if you're talking about ZSS, whether intentionally or not (likely the former at first but then eventually the latter)

Samus is underrated because YB imo

 

[Shiny Mewtwo aka Jigglysir]

There needs to be a Quiksilver vs YB Spzamus ditto imo

 

[xBlitz]

Isn't "the girl with the sword and tiara" 1337 swag slang for marth? I'm disappointed in this forum :|

 

[pidgezero_one]

Isn't "the girl with the sword and tiara" 1337 swag slang for marth? I'm disappointed in this forum :|

youre definitely thinking of peach with a beam sword

 

[Thor]

I've heard nado knight but that's cuz they were one person and an idiot. They said anyone could win doing that. I dared them to beat me doing that. Then they tried and I three-stocked them. With Ike.

I'm also not sure if "sero zuit zamus" was anything other than simply swapping s and z, if it was I'm still out of the loop.

 

[pidgezero_one]

how to beat a nado-only MK using jigglypuff: dair

 

[Shiny Mewtwo aka Jigglysir]

how to beat a nado-only MK using jigglypuff: dair

Or Nair

Or Bair

 

[Shaya]

Man Li Gi, you're using a colloquialism for something that no one else uses, hence completely defeating the purpose of it. It's deranged and illogical. V115 covered some analogies, but you're still arguing with it. Do you realise how silly it is to argue colloquialisms in a social environment in which the context applies?

[Skewed analogy time] It's like me talking to Doctors one day and matter-of-factually stating how great placebos are for all your problems; back pain, headaches, sore thumb from playing too much Mario Party on N64. And when the Doctors tell you that you those things are "made" to that affect but how you think about it is completely wrong, your response is "it works for me, I must be right".

 

[Man Li Gi]

Never did I claim that the people are competitive pros, but they do know plenty of the mechanics and incorporate it into gameplay. These people are competitive though. My reason for not knowing the term probably stems from the fact 1) ZSS mains hate it and never use it, 2) Back home, I'm the best no contest, 3) Being the best does mean you have to know the most, and since everyone knows less than me... you see the picture.

Shaya......hush. Plenty of colloquialisms are skewed even if they are in correct context. Anyway, not adhering to another's view of term makes me sociopathic? Man, I must be sociopathic because when people are angry at me or my friends and say F*** you, I reply, "Later". I highly doubted they wanted to engage in those activities, but in either case the response or reasoning is appropo. Since someone does/says something different from you doesn't mean they should adhere to what you think of. I was going to back down or adhere to what V115 said, but Shaya had to get on his highest of high horses while making insane and unfounded claims, so I will vehemently deny conforming until I deem fit (probably not that long because Zamus isn't interesting in Brawl). You're acting like lingos never change, get subbed, or are completely/near eradicated in the Smashiverse and human language (remember JDI or Japanese DI?). Who's to know that the highly unlikely, but still plausible change could be from Spamus, Samus, CHIBOOOOO (Skip to around 12:20) to Zamus.

Now that I've dragged in more people into this dead conversation, I think y'all should know that I don't care what you call or think of Zamus or Spamus or or or or or. Simply put, Zamus=Samus until I conform with the community (which wouldn't be that long realistically).

 

[Shaya]

My post was way too harsh, my apologies; you got back to it too quickly before I could post-morning-coffee edit it. I do agree that this conversation shouldn't continue here (there is that pesky social thread). However, we aren't telling you that your way is "wrong", but it seems like you're the one saying that the social norm is wrong/not worth conforming to. Analogies applying all day.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

how to beat a nado-only MK using jigglypuff: dair

Puff has no way of challenging a proper MK nado, fyi

 

[pidgezero_one]

Puff has no way of challenging a proper MK nado, fyi

pretty sure a MK who says he's only going to use nado has no idea how to do a proper nado

 

[Man Li Gi]

I don't think the norm is wrong, but not worth conforming to. If we are speaking in stats terms, I reject the null hypothesis. Zamus has been ingrained in me this entire time and I already call Zero Suit Samus, ZSS. It's not like calling Spamus, Zamus causes a tectonic shift in the planet. I'm happy you've removed that part of your original post, but you still are calling me deranged and illogical..senator...both of our analogies apply to the situation anyway.

 

[Shaya]

"It" being the argument, not you.

 

[Man Li Gi]

My bad bro.

 

[ぱみゅ]

And so, it finally happened....

 

[Shaya]

*cleaning up intensifies*

I wonder what ground breaking amazingness will be revealed next?

 

[pidgezero_one]

how do you guys feel about Lucas being used in low tier tourneys still? I personally like it because he's better than jigglypuff (sorry max)

 

[Grim Tuesday]

People run low tier tourneys?

 

[pidgezero_one]

theres this fairly popular tournament series you might have heard of its called "Whobo" that stands for world hobo

 

[Grim Tuesday]

People run Brawl tournies full stop?

 

[ぱみゅ]

Lucas is not a Low Tier.
Has never been and I'm glad it got changed as soon as I made it into the BBR.

 

[Luco]

I wish we'd get a little notification before the threads got closed so we could make some final stuff rather than it being smack bang middle of something being discussed haha. Just for neatness' sake.

Especially in the case of the MU chart seeing as it's stickied.

 

[Z'zgashi]

Lucas is not a Low Tier.

Depends on your definition of Low Tier. I agree though, only character above Low Tier that I could see dropping into it is Luigi. I feel like PT should as well, but he's a weird character and for the sake of Low Tier tournaments (even though thats technically not a criteria) I see why he isnt. I could go on for ages about PT's placement, but I dont want to because Im lazy.

 

[Delta-cod]

I personally think low-tier should be expanded to eat up all the characters below Sheik.

Seriously, all those characters are bad and unviable and wow why are they even considered mid-tier.

 

[Radical Larry]

Why not put Link above Bowser?

 

[Z'zgashi]

Because Link is bad and Bowser is less bad.

 

[Radical Larry]

Because Link is bad and Bowser is less bad.

Yet you have to think about how each other would play out. Link has a great chance of besting Bowser because of the former having better range and speed compared to the latter. Whilst Bowser does have better air speed than Link, Link could be fully capable of defeating Bowser hands down. Look at this other fact; Link combos Bowser better than Bowser can to him, and can edgeguard Bowser when necessary.

Bowser is an incredibly large target, much larger than Link, and with this in mind, Link could spam his N-air, F-air, B-air and Z-air at Bowser just to really get to him. It's all about the range of the two.

Though I know of Bowser's advantages, I still think that he doesn't really benefit from them as much.

 

[-LzR-]

Just because Link might have a chance against Bowser doesn't mean anything when considering tiers. Tiers aren't made by comparing 2 incredibly bad characters with each other.

 

[Radical Larry]

Of course. But I do have rather too many mains to count for the Smash Bros. games. Look at my signature and you'll know what I mean. How this really affects me, metagame and my MU against other players is a mystery.