![[FBC] ESAM](/data/avatars/l/92/92614.jpg?1365783210){kind=avatar}
[FBC] ESAM
Smash Legend
2nd stage = CG heaven if you can ever get somebody in it.
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Official Pikachu Stage Discussion - Rainbow Cruise
- Thread starter Jupz
- Start date
gallax
Smash Hero
yeah well most of the time they know a cg is coming so they avoid you...
gallax
Smash Hero
no to MK. for him you need a wide open stage so that your projectile is more useful. marths sword is godlier on smaller levels.
so i would say no to marth and MK here.
so i would say no to marth and MK here.
iSpiN
Smash Journeyman
They have plenty of room to avoid the CG's :/
4 platforms? Not a chance v_v
4 platforms? Not a chance v_v
[FBC] ESAM
Smash Legend
So then you thunder them if they go up, or T-jolt them. You can also refresh your moves with the statues with jab.
gallax
Smash Hero
true esam. that is a good point. but no amtter what the statues can block your tjolts. they will most likely remain near them and depending on who you play, it can get ugly if you get aggressive.
fsmash away on the first transformation!!!!
fsmash away on the first transformation!!!!
iSpiN
Smash Journeyman
Make them approach from the sides or from above if they are camping in the middle.
gallax
Smash Hero
we can still pre-emp talk about stages. lol. just getting warmed up!!!!
[FBC] ESAM
Smash Legend
Fine, so just make the new thread for it so we can discuss it.
I PROMISE to get the Stage Discussion summaries written up this weekend. I've lagged behind a bit due to school work, but I have two days to start up stage discussions again. I do realize I'm like 2-3 stages behind, but I'll get them written up ASAP.
[FBC] ESAM
Smash Legend
It's ok K_2, we understand.
Ussi
Smash Legend
KLo does her best against me here. Geez tjolts are just too annoying cause they are just perfectly angled here. Pikachu can easily run away from projectile-less characters (ie. Ike... lol) QA from ledge to ledge sounds fun lol. Lava combos exist. Platform love too. Beware of planking.
This stage is banned 50% of the time for me. NJ/NY have banned it but PA doesn't always ban it. Mainly due to hazards being ridiculous and planking.
This stage is banned 50% of the time for me. NJ/NY have banned it but PA doesn't always ban it. Mainly due to hazards being ridiculous and planking.
KayLo!
Smarter than your average wabbit.
Yeah, the stage discussions are going well, don't worry about it. <3
neji32
Smash Lord
You can do some cool things here *hopes no one mentions it trying to make a thread on it currently*
Geekhead
Smash Apprentice
pikachu can do some pretty good qac mindgames here, if you have a lot of practice. I don't personally like this stage, but i can play pretty good here. And pika can recover from spikes easy because of all of the platforms, and a great recovery can help a little. Since pika has great combo-ing ability he can use the platforms to string more moves together as he lands to jump again while they're still shocked (duh?). Another advantage he has is his amazing ledge guarding technique, and he can gimp well. Using his thunder low off of the stage is a great wall o hurt for them to try to get past. then you can QAC back to the lowest platform. i guess the double thunder and triple thunder work well here. And maybe if there is enough room, you can pull off a quad thunder and not get punished.
So i pointed out some good things for pika, i can point out bad ones.
Pikachu's most favorite thing to do, chaingrabs, he can't do because of the small many platforms. But he can do the Dthrow Chaingrab good here
even though ussi said tjolt is good here, (it can be, don't get me wrong) we can't really attack from a distance. only certain angle, AND we can't go up and hit them during the frames the thunder hits them, unless you get it perfect in the air.
I can't really think how any of the stage hazards can help or hurt pikachu.
So that's how i think of pika in norfair!
So i pointed out some good things for pika, i can point out bad ones.
Pikachu's most favorite thing to do, chaingrabs, he can't do because of the small many platforms. But he can do the Dthrow Chaingrab good here
even though ussi said tjolt is good here, (it can be, don't get me wrong) we can't really attack from a distance. only certain angle, AND we can't go up and hit them during the frames the thunder hits them, unless you get it perfect in the air. I can't really think how any of the stage hazards can help or hurt pikachu.
So that's how i think of pika in norfair!
Stealth Raptor
Smash Legend
in response to the cgs you can always go for fthrow to usmash or dthrow to wave pivot grab.
If you want to kill your opponent, stand on the top platforms and bait them in with tjolt and kill with usmash. If you are at really high percents, its better to stay on the bottom platform and wait for your opponent.
Olimar and the tethers do really well here, given the 6 ledges.
G&W is broken here...lol
How does Snake fair on this stage?
This is one of IC's worst stages, if not their worst stage. Diddy also gets ***** here. If you learn this stage, it could potentially be a great CP stage for certain matchups.
Olimar and the tethers do really well here, given the 6 ledges.
G&W is broken here...lol
How does Snake fair on this stage?
This is one of IC's worst stages, if not their worst stage. Diddy also gets ***** here. If you learn this stage, it could potentially be a great CP stage for certain matchups.
KayLo!
Smarter than your average wabbit.
I. Love. Norfair. My "magic juju" stage. When it's legal, I CP it against everyone except for G&W and MK unless I'm feeling in the mood for Corneria.
Pros:
- A ridiculous number of ledges means lots of QA & Skull Bash shenanigans. Abusing the invincibility frames and being able to recover in really unpredictable ways is always good.
- When the opponent is on a platform above you, it's easy to jump, uair, and start an aerial combo from underneath them.
- Tjolt hugs the platforms, so against taller characters, you can shoot tjolts onto the platform above them and it'll hit them in the head as it travels under the bottom. Most people don't expect that and fail to shield it the first few times, at which point you can mix it up and start shooting more tjolts directly at them.
- When the lava wall advances, you can throw/hit the opponent into the wall, then juggle them against it with multiple thunders. It requires timing, but depending on their damage, hitstun will make this inescapable..... I've had Stealth do this to me online.
- Killing-wise, usmash is **** on the upper platforms. Utilt > thunder works well too.
- Evasion tactics are too good here, and most characters aren't as speedy getting from platform to platform as Pikachu is.
Cons:
- The high ceiling means that unless you're on the top platforms, vertical kills won't be happening.
- Characters with spikes can spike you through the lava but will get saved by it if they can't recover.
- Stage hazards. NEVER go into the pod when the huge lava wall comes (from behind). You'll be stuck in there after the lava passes, and if your opponent is moderately close, they can attack you through the walls.
Characters to take here: slow, bulky characters that lack a good spike do badly here. DDD (can't CG effectively), Bowser, Ike, possibly DK although he doesn't do as badly as the others here. Edit: I forgot to say Diddy.... others have mentioned it already, but Diddy gets ***** here. Bring him here if you can.
Characters to never take here: MK (his ledge game > ours imo), G&W (better aerials + better killing potential), Ganondorf (you will probably get spiked, and the lava will save him afterwards.... plus it's hard to gimp him here)
I would probably hesitate to take ZSS here as well. Tether recovery, good mobility.... plus her paralyzing attacks around all those hazards is not good. I've been stunned, then left for death by lava before......
Rating: 7.5/10 I really love this stage. I'd give it an 8, but it's not so great against certain characters, it's banned a lot of the time, and I think it's somewhat of a personal thing that I do well here, lol.
Pros:
- A ridiculous number of ledges means lots of QA & Skull Bash shenanigans. Abusing the invincibility frames and being able to recover in really unpredictable ways is always good.
- When the opponent is on a platform above you, it's easy to jump, uair, and start an aerial combo from underneath them.
- Tjolt hugs the platforms, so against taller characters, you can shoot tjolts onto the platform above them and it'll hit them in the head as it travels under the bottom. Most people don't expect that and fail to shield it the first few times, at which point you can mix it up and start shooting more tjolts directly at them.
- When the lava wall advances, you can throw/hit the opponent into the wall, then juggle them against it with multiple thunders. It requires timing, but depending on their damage, hitstun will make this inescapable..... I've had Stealth do this to me online.
- Killing-wise, usmash is **** on the upper platforms. Utilt > thunder works well too.
- Evasion tactics are too good here, and most characters aren't as speedy getting from platform to platform as Pikachu is.
Cons:
- The high ceiling means that unless you're on the top platforms, vertical kills won't be happening.
- Characters with spikes can spike you through the lava but will get saved by it if they can't recover.
- Stage hazards. NEVER go into the pod when the huge lava wall comes (from behind). You'll be stuck in there after the lava passes, and if your opponent is moderately close, they can attack you through the walls.
Characters to take here: slow, bulky characters that lack a good spike do badly here. DDD (can't CG effectively), Bowser, Ike, possibly DK although he doesn't do as badly as the others here. Edit: I forgot to say Diddy.... others have mentioned it already, but Diddy gets ***** here. Bring him here if you can.
Characters to never take here: MK (his ledge game > ours imo), G&W (better aerials + better killing potential), Ganondorf (you will probably get spiked, and the lava will save him afterwards.... plus it's hard to gimp him here)
I would probably hesitate to take ZSS here as well. Tether recovery, good mobility.... plus her paralyzing attacks around all those hazards is not good. I've been stunned, then left for death by lava before......
Rating: 7.5/10 I really love this stage. I'd give it an 8, but it's not so great against certain characters, it's banned a lot of the time, and I think it's somewhat of a personal thing that I do well here, lol.
When the pod/lava comes, learn to either Perfect shield the lava or abuse ledgeroll invincibility. Assuming you use this stage as a CP a lot, you should get lots of practice on it. I always play on this stage as G&W, so adapting it over to Pikachu should be fairly easy.
I love fastfalling through the platform and jumping back through it while using an aerial. It adds a really nice mixup to it.
If you've mastered QA->ledge. It will be almost impossible for your opponents to keep up with you. I love playing the gay tjolt + QAC camp style. This stage is large enough to do it and the angle of the platforms is perfect for tjolt
I love fastfalling through the platform and jumping back through it while using an aerial. It adds a really nice mixup to it.
If you've mastered QA->ledge. It will be almost impossible for your opponents to keep up with you. I love playing the gay tjolt + QAC camp style. This stage is large enough to do it and the angle of the platforms is perfect for tjolt
Stealth Raptor
Smash Legend
first off you dont need to p sheild the lava, just have it out when it comes. basically what you want to do is stay below the other person. harry them from below. if they get the bottom platform, herd them with thunder and tshocks so you can get on that platform with them. knock them up so they have to go on an upper platform, rinse and repeat. highly effective at keeping pika from getting hit, while ****** them. absolute favorite stage for pika. 8 out of 10 for same reasons as kaylo. except its an 8 
[FBC] ESAM
Smash Legend
Ahh, the level that is banned in Florida...I'll try to write as much as i do for other stages, but i don't have much exp on this stage since every tournament in florida other than Gigabits has this banned...
Pros
6 ledges + Skull Bash/QA = Unpredictable Pika
Best camping level in the game. Abuse it against characters without projectiles
Speedy attacks and throws easily send people into lava wall/pillars (the ones that come out of the background
Pikachu can abuse those who go in the pod from the super lava wave of death
Pikachu can run circles around most opponents on this level
Cons
Broken up ground means F-throw CG isn't very effective
Characters better at camping than pika will do so, and **** you
Vertical kills are a pain
Lava wall will kill pika at 110% or less if fully extended
People with vertically disjointed hitboxes can hit you through the platforms
People with better ledgegames than ours will own us with invulnerability
Overall
I give Norfair a 7, just because i personally don't like the level and don't have much exp on it. If the new rule is implemented with the 75 ledgegrabs, this could become a very good level for pikachu since people won't be able to abuse the invulnerability, and we can still QA away.
People to take to norfair: People without projectiles, DDD, and Diddy
People to ban this against: Wario (time out), MK (time out), and G&W. If you aren't going to ban luigi's mansion against those characters, ban this instead.
Pros
6 ledges + Skull Bash/QA = Unpredictable Pika
Best camping level in the game. Abuse it against characters without projectiles
Speedy attacks and throws easily send people into lava wall/pillars (the ones that come out of the background
Pikachu can abuse those who go in the pod from the super lava wave of death
Pikachu can run circles around most opponents on this level
Cons
Broken up ground means F-throw CG isn't very effective
Characters better at camping than pika will do so, and **** you
Vertical kills are a pain
Lava wall will kill pika at 110% or less if fully extended
People with vertically disjointed hitboxes can hit you through the platforms
People with better ledgegames than ours will own us with invulnerability
Overall
I give Norfair a 7, just because i personally don't like the level and don't have much exp on it. If the new rule is implemented with the 75 ledgegrabs, this could become a very good level for pikachu since people won't be able to abuse the invulnerability, and we can still QA away.
People to take to norfair: People without projectiles, DDD, and Diddy
People to ban this against: Wario (time out), MK (time out), and G&W. If you aren't going to ban luigi's mansion against those characters, ban this instead.
Stealth Raptor
Smash Legend
esam whats this ledgegrab rule? if its what i think it is how can they inforce it? can you link me to a thread discussing this?
[FBC] ESAM
Smash Legend
The rule is that you are only allowed to have 70 ledge grabs or less. After a match in the more info section, there is a part that says ledges grabbed: (insert number here) so its actually very easy to do.
Thread here: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=221198
Thread here: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=221198
Geekhead
Smash Apprentice
i'm sorry, but i just had to point that out. lolfirst off you dont need to p sheild the lava, just have it out when it comes. basically what you want to do is stay below the other person. harry them from below. if they get the bottom platform, herd them with thunder and tshocks so you can get on that platform with them. knock them up so they have to go on an upper platform, rinse and repeat. highly effective at keeping pika from getting hit, while ****** them. absolute favorite stage for pika. 8 out of 10 for same reasons as kaylo. except its an 8
Stealth Raptor
Smash Legend
i know right? pika is a sex machiiiiiiiiiine! thank you esam, i fully support this idea.
gallax
Smash Hero
snake ***** hardcore here. especially with his tech chase dthrow.
M15t3R E
Smash Master
For Pikachu, this stage rocks offline. Pikachu can nimbly maneuver around the platforms more easily than most characters. Thunder jolt moves around the platforms to surprise the opponent. Take DDD here for sure. Do not take campy players here.
The high ceiling helps Pikachu more than it hurts him. When in doubt at a tournament, CP this stage and see what happens!
The high ceiling helps Pikachu more than it hurts him. When in doubt at a tournament, CP this stage and see what happens!
gallax
Smash Hero
im not so sure i would want to play DDD here. DDD can stay in the air with his WoP for quite some time and his waddles would be a little more effective due to all the room allotted on the stage. he was never able to CG pika so that should not be a factor in choosing this stage. against DDD, i would prefer a stage where i could CG him and then make him uncomfortable in the air....maybe even a level like green hill zone.
as for playing snake here, pick and choose your battles wisely. this is a good stage for both of you. if the snakes love to grab, stay away from this level. snake has an infinite grab off the edge. plus his can tech chase you better here off his dthrow. he can just camp the whole match if he wanted to. set up c4's everywhere and let the nades loose. we CANNOT cg snake on this stage. bad for us.
playing marth. i would say do not play him on this stage. his fair and nair ***** hardcore on this stage.
as for playing snake here, pick and choose your battles wisely. this is a good stage for both of you. if the snakes love to grab, stay away from this level. snake has an infinite grab off the edge. plus his can tech chase you better here off his dthrow. he can just camp the whole match if he wanted to. set up c4's everywhere and let the nades loose. we CANNOT cg snake on this stage. bad for us.
playing marth. i would say do not play him on this stage. his fair and nair ***** hardcore on this stage.
KayLo!
Smarter than your average wabbit.
The lack of CG against DDD on Norfair does hurt a little, but I'm curious: how do you figure waddles are more effective here? They're pretty linear and easy to see coming, so if you stay on a different "level" of platform from him, he can't really hit you with them.
DDD's just too slow to play on this stage effectively, imo.... maybe I have a biased opinion because I absolutely love this stage and have a knack for playing on it, but I just stay underneath him and harrass him with uair combos and ledge games. It's too easy to play a hit and run keep-away game here. Getting the kill is annoying at times, but if you can bait him to an upper platform (fairly easy with the rising lava and other stage hazards), he has a really hard time dealing with thunder, especially utilt > thunder.
DDD's just too slow to play on this stage effectively, imo.... maybe I have a biased opinion because I absolutely love this stage and have a knack for playing on it, but I just stay underneath him and harrass him with uair combos and ledge games. It's too easy to play a hit and run keep-away game here. Getting the kill is annoying at times, but if you can bait him to an upper platform (fairly easy with the rising lava and other stage hazards), he has a really hard time dealing with thunder, especially utilt > thunder.
[FBC] ESAM
Smash Legend
If you try to come from under him he can just SH dairs, and its really annoying to get around.
KayLo!
Smarter than your average wabbit.
Well, the great thing about Norfair is that you can mix it up with all the space, platforms, and ledges. If you keep getting caught with SH'd dairs, approach differently? I dunno, that particular move has never been a problem for me on this stage.
Like I said, Norfair is magic for me. **** just works when I use it here, I can't explain it, lol.
Like I said, Norfair is magic for me. **** just works when I use it here, I can't explain it, lol.
gallax
Smash Hero
well then it seems that you have found your stage. hoorah!!!!!!!
KayLo!
Smarter than your average wabbit.
Yeah, too bad it's banned half the time, along with Corneria.
It's okay, though, I keep PS2 in my back pocket for those occasions.
It's okay, though, I keep PS2 in my back pocket for those occasions.
gallax
Smash Hero
*note to self* never play KLO on norfair/corneria or PS2.
Stealth Raptor
Smash Legend
i would. cause honestly i am used to beating G&W on both stages lol. i fear him more on neutrals.