Why are you so sure it's not DI? I know when get bthrowed and I hold diagonally toward stage + up, I go almost straight up, and when I don't hold anything at all, I go much more horizontally (in range to be hit by a DAC).
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Official Link Question and Answer Thread
- Thread starter Swordplay
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D
Deleted member
Guest
it is DI and throws can stale which is the main reason you see people refreshing their moves by grab pummeling
Oddler
Smash Journeyman
I thought Gimpyfish quit brawl and didn't do WiFi? I just played a ladder match with the guy. Ridiculous amount of fun playing with him.
Kief
Smash Ace
i second that. i also had a question about ledge hop fairs a while ago but didn't ask cus somebody else did so i just read the answers to theirs.
Oddler
Smash Journeyman
Yep, should be in the FAQ. Legan said it best to me a good while back...."it's almost like you're hitting all the buttons at the same time". The only button you want to really space out is when you hit down or away- otherwise you could self destruct.
Same with Jump Canceled bombs. I hit Y and A at the exact same time with my finger being lower to the controller on the jump button than on the A button so Jump gets hit first. I press down at the same time though...works the same way with ledge hop fair...except you space down more noticeable than hitting the direction of going on stage + Y (jump) and A (attack). Do it fast and both hit boxes hit.
Oddler
Smash Journeyman
Yeah, it's weird...it's most noticeable on standing infinites with DDD against like Samus. Our Zair doesn't stale which is a good and bad thing...bad thing and good thing.
D
Deleted member
Guest
thats why falco can CG you up to 45% instead of 35%. you can DI a fresh dthrow at 35% and get out of it
Deva
Smash Lord
yeah, we've gotten Gimpy back into Brawl, melee as well, dont know what's up with the wifi deal though.
Onomanic
Heaven Piercer
Wow Gimpy quit! O_o Oh snap. I didn't know that. Guess that's good.
I kinda noticed that thing too I heard about the DDD throw staling on DK and such. I kinda knew they stale but I didn't know if it was a small direction change or the throw just became stronger/weaker.
(Bassically I knew it existed but not how it worked. TY guys.)
(Bassically I knew it existed but not how it worked. TY guys.)
Oddler
Smash Journeyman
I've thought a lot about this too trying to get a conscious understanding of it...but it's a pretty broad question. Here's a few predictable things off the top of my head...I say this too often but.....I was planning on making a video tutorial on this BUT TOO LAZY lulz.
If you're scrapping with a guy face to face and you see him whiff an attack and if he feels you're closing in on him he's likely to roll behind you.
Whenever you hit a person with like F-Smash and they're in the air a scrub thing to do is for them to use their second jump to regain balance while advancing toward you again....best thing to do is to predict it and just hit the air space they will be in the moment they regain control of their character in the air and about where they would be when they use their double jump. (Doesn't work on pros...I played Gimpyfish yesterday and he'd never do it along with a bunch of other predictable scrub things like instantly using double jump to get back on stage directly after being knocked off it) but still worth doing it anyway since everyone has different holes in their game.
Rolling toward your opponent after being knocked down with ,say, an F-Smash. Easy setup for an F-Tilt or another F-Smash.
Ledge tacticz...most people when hanging from a ledge will instantly get off it...and it makes for easy punishment. Better to wait a little...most real pro players I see do it when they're calm and thinking straight.
If you're on top of the stage and someone is hanging off the ledge most people will do a get-up attack if you're standing on top within hit range...
If you're not within hit range they'll most likely choose ledge jump....in other words don't devalue just getting on the stage without doing a tech hit/jump/roll. Plain old getting on it works great...same with after you've been hit on your back...
Last thing is to use projectiles and zair and make people always approach you since that generally always puts you in a place of power since they only have a few legit ways to get in that should be within easy prediction range. Won't work with all characters but just a general rule of thumb.
It's a pretty broad question and I'm sure this would have been more helpful with video but hope it helps >_<
If you're scrapping with a guy face to face and you see him whiff an attack and if he feels you're closing in on him he's likely to roll behind you.
Whenever you hit a person with like F-Smash and they're in the air a scrub thing to do is for them to use their second jump to regain balance while advancing toward you again....best thing to do is to predict it and just hit the air space they will be in the moment they regain control of their character in the air and about where they would be when they use their double jump. (Doesn't work on pros...I played Gimpyfish yesterday and he'd never do it along with a bunch of other predictable scrub things like instantly using double jump to get back on stage directly after being knocked off it) but still worth doing it anyway since everyone has different holes in their game.
Rolling toward your opponent after being knocked down with ,say, an F-Smash. Easy setup for an F-Tilt or another F-Smash.
Ledge tacticz...most people when hanging from a ledge will instantly get off it...and it makes for easy punishment. Better to wait a little...most real pro players I see do it when they're calm and thinking straight.
If you're on top of the stage and someone is hanging off the ledge most people will do a get-up attack if you're standing on top within hit range...
If you're not within hit range they'll most likely choose ledge jump....in other words don't devalue just getting on the stage without doing a tech hit/jump/roll. Plain old getting on it works great...same with after you've been hit on your back...
Last thing is to use projectiles and zair and make people always approach you since that generally always puts you in a place of power since they only have a few legit ways to get in that should be within easy prediction range. Won't work with all characters but just a general rule of thumb.
It's a pretty broad question and I'm sure this would have been more helpful with video but hope it helps >_<
ArdeS
Smash Journeyman
Yeah sasook, don't expect someone you've never played before to be very predictable. But try and find habits that many players do and take advantage of it.
Here's a good example that I take advantage of a lot...
When you respawn after a death and get off of your platform, your opponent will obviously run away from you. A lot of predictable players will roll behind you as you run towards them in order to avoid you while you're invincible, so the natural thing to do is to fsmash behind you so that they roll right into it. It's gotten me plenty of kills and your opponent feels stupid for being punished.
It's not an answer, but yeah, that's an example for you.
Oddler pretty much summed up the rest. :]
Here's a good example that I take advantage of a lot...
When you respawn after a death and get off of your platform, your opponent will obviously run away from you. A lot of predictable players will roll behind you as you run towards them in order to avoid you while you're invincible, so the natural thing to do is to fsmash behind you so that they roll right into it. It's gotten me plenty of kills and your opponent feels stupid for being punished.
It's not an answer, but yeah, that's an example for you.
Oddler pretty much summed up the rest. :]
D
Deleted member
Guest
once you learn how to guess what your opponent will do in advance is a huge step in advancing your gameplay. how do you think i DI so well? half of the time i can already see the move coming and i DI accordingly.
sasook you have to work on this on your own, nobody can really help you with this
sasook you have to work on this on your own, nobody can really help you with this
Ich Bin Awesome
Smash Journeyman
Hey sasook, I can help you with this.
Try looking through your replays or other people's vids online and try to think about what are the options an opponent has. For example, if your opponent is on the floor after missing a tech he has 4 options: roll left, roll right, getup attack, and just get up. Now you already have a 25% chance of guessing correctly. Now it's time to limit his options, if you stand right next to an opponent and shield you eliminate his option to getup attack or regular getup since you can punish both those easily. Try applying this to situation when they are hanging on the ledge. So...
1. Consider there options
2. Limit there options
3. Learn there habits
This link might help I think it says some of the same things:
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=160643
Try looking through your replays or other people's vids online and try to think about what are the options an opponent has. For example, if your opponent is on the floor after missing a tech he has 4 options: roll left, roll right, getup attack, and just get up. Now you already have a 25% chance of guessing correctly. Now it's time to limit his options, if you stand right next to an opponent and shield you eliminate his option to getup attack or regular getup since you can punish both those easily. Try applying this to situation when they are hanging on the ledge. So...
1. Consider there options
2. Limit there options
3. Learn there habits
This link might help I think it says some of the same things:
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=160643
D
Deleted member
Guest
basically, like i said you have to learn it on your own, other people can't really help you too much with this.
Onomanic
Heaven Piercer
Gentlemen (and maybe a few ladies >_>), I'd like to introduce a new idea that I'm borrowing from the Marf boards. I'd like your opinions on a universal critique thread. A place where posters can post their critique videos without having to create a new thread.
I wanted some opinions on the thread before creating it. So question:
Would a universal critique thread be helpful?
I wanted some opinions on the thread before creating it. So question:
Would a universal critique thread be helpful?
Oddler
Smash Journeyman
I thought the video arkive Legan has serves that semi-purpose? Idk...but there really are too many video threads...
Question: Does anyone have Frame Data on Links Spin Attack? How long the first and second hit boxes last?
Lol, you mean archive.
Oddler
Smash Journeyman
Jeez, I wonder where I could have possibly gotten the spelling of that word mixed up XD
Kief
Smash Ace
there have been alot of critique threads lately. i've actually thought about making one myself but decided to hold off cus there have already been so many. it would most definitely have its advantages. on the other side of the coin however there may be some people that get overlooked, or less people may see them because they have to go in a thread to find them.
it just depends on how you make it i guess.
Deva
Smash Lord
This is the reason you'll hear Elitists always say your not good if you dont go to tournaments. The fact is no matter how good someone may think they are or how good their tech skill or control over the game is etc, you wont be good unless you can effectively read your opponents. The only way you can get this is through experience. Experience in general matchups, and against specific players. You have to consistantly be playing against them, and in a competitive environment at that. When in a tournament, your brain will try to focus more on the matches since it's subconsciously important for you to do so, so you will remember things more clearly afterwards and be able to learn from your mistakes and your opponents mistakes more easily. I can't stress how important it is for everyone here to try to attend tournaments as often as possible if your serious about improving as a Link main.
Wafflez
Smash Journeyman
I gots a question. Do you know what it's like... to be in loooove?
*Swoon*~
Question: Does anyone have the frama data for Link's entire moveset? I'm curious about the frames for Link's aerials/Dsmash.
*Swoon*~
Question: Does anyone have the frama data for Link's entire moveset? I'm curious about the frames for Link's aerials/Dsmash.
AeroLink_the_SoulMaster
Let's rock, baby!
Well said, Deva. Well said. I'm learning as I go.
Dear Link boards, Today my friend 30-0ed me. It seems that he has been practicing his Marth. Probably reading the guides on the marth boards. We were fairly even the last time we played but he's quickly learned how to abuse all of Marth's priorities. His spacing is really good. He mostly spams fairs to either approach or to get me to the ledge and I can't do much about it. He can keep me at the ledge at will, spamming more fairs or whatever else. He also gimps me with (I think Marth's side smash?) that can kill me at 60%. I'm trying to learn how to DI (arkive's tutorial) and I generally live up to 150% but I still can't get anything going.
I've tried zairs, tried to space him properly, jabs, fairs, nairs, projectiles but he can spam his fair just incredibly fast. Probably 2-3 times before he hits the ground.
I've tried zairs, tried to space him properly, jabs, fairs, nairs, projectiles but he can spam his fair just incredibly fast. Probably 2-3 times before he hits the ground.
D
Deleted member
Guest
NEW RECORD! i've never seen those words next to each other, what do they mean?
if he's spamming fairs you can powershield the second fair and grab him right as he touches the ground. learn to DI the fsmash and don't waste your jump and that should keep you from getting gimped. the zair is much easier to space then the fair is so learn how far the zair goes.
i can't help you any more unless you supply me with vids
SuSa
Banned via Administration
Few questions-
1. Do the Link boards know about jump-canceled usmash with bomb's (aka: how to usmash while holding a bomb, and without SH dropping it to a catch)
2. Do you think its possible to jump-cancel DAC? I HIGHLY DOUBT it is, but what if I'm just to slow? (again, I'm like 99.9999% sure this is impossible because I don't think you can JC DA
1. Do the Link boards know about jump-canceled usmash with bomb's (aka: how to usmash while holding a bomb, and without SH dropping it to a catch)
2. Do you think its possible to jump-cancel DAC? I HIGHLY DOUBT it is, but what if I'm just to slow? (again, I'm like 99.9999% sure this is impossible because I don't think you can JC DA
1. I didn't know but that's just me. Everyone else'll probably have known that since the day before Brawl came out or something.
2. JC's seem to work only into attacks. Since you need to dash before you can activate the DAC, you can only JC Usmash, not JC a DAC.
SuSa
Banned via Administration
Explain 'attacks' more =p
I know you can JC up-b/upsmash/throw item, but I haven't actually bothered to... you know what...
Off to BARWL!!! Forget LoZ for now... I have a lot of testing about a lot of things I need to do... and record that video for the frames (and a ton of testing -_-) of lock frames...
EDIT:
what was I on when I posted that second point? If you try to JC a DA with a bomb... you throw the bomb..... the only move that doesn't throw the bomb that I know of is JC usmash.
ignore my whole DAC with bomb via JC... I was high or something ...
Hey ArkiveZero, first off, I just gotta give you props. You (and finns7
) are to me what Legan is to Sasook. Yes, I lurk these boards hard. I never don the black tunic because I'm not worthy.I gotta say that I'm not very good at all. I've just been able to recently beat level 9 CPUs and my friend is the first actual person I've played. I'm not sure if it actually is a fair he using. I've never tried marth before. What he does is hit once in the air, almost like in a forward motion. And he repeats it again as he's coming down (It's a single hit move). Also, where can I learn how to DI the fsmash? And in what way? fmsash+retreat?
I don't have a youtube account and even if I did I don't have anyway to upload the replay into my PC (Don't have a memory card). I can send you the replay though. (Might take me a while to sift through and find a representative replay. Plus the t.v. upstairs is taken right now).
0302-2118-5052
If you want I can record the matches and put them up on my Youtube account for you. I need your Wii code as well as your friend code, though.
My FC and Wii code are
<-------
Only if you want to of course.
But if you're going to send a replay to Arkive then just talk to him.
Ich Bin Awesome
Smash Journeyman
No one has ever mentioned this. I've never even tried since I though that would only result in a bomb upthrow (and there would be no purpose to jc-ing and upthrow). I wish I could try it, but I'm lending my wii out for like and month and a half. (i'm gonna be soo rusty
)Here's a few tips. I see that you're just starting to beat cpu's, so really, you have a long way to go. Reading guides, watching vids, and getting tips helps, but what you really need to do is get practice against real players. I suggest you play some Links as it will help you realize how to use his moveset. But definitely play other characters because it forces you to think and space more because Link is usually at a disadvantage.
Real life is better, but if you don't have anyone to play with do wifi. And play many different people and not just one person so you don't fall into the trap of learning one style of playing.
D
Deleted member
Guest
padalink if you want to be able to send me replays you have to give me your wii # and brawl FC
you can find my FC & wii # under my name
you can find my FC & wii # under my name
SuSa
Banned via Administration
Should I make a topic about the JC reverse, and non-reverse item-holding smashes for the Link boards or no?
Also, please do ignore my part about DAC with bomb from ground... I'm a ****** and forgot c-sticking down would result in a bomb throw >.> .... lmao
Also, please do ignore my part about DAC with bomb from ground... I'm a ****** and forgot c-sticking down would result in a bomb throw >.> .... lmao
O_o no....
My god Havokk, if the tier list still existed, I'd recommend you for the "knowing the most things that people usually overlook or don't pay attention to" award. Yeah, someone else can think of a better/shorter title, I'm too lazy.
ROFLHey ArkiveZero, first off, I just gotta give you props. You (and finns7
Jeez, 4 posts is all he's got and he already knows that. LOL too good
So I was playing with Ritch and i found something very intresting.
HE STAGED SPIKED ME WITH F TILT!!
How to do.
1. We were on PMS1. So i assume you need boxed type of ledges (or similar ledges)
2. I was hanging on the edge
3. He hit with a very specific part of the F-Tilts hitbox. (the one that sends you backwards.)
There must be a hitbox at the bottom somewhere. probably designed so that if Link was on a platform and you are behind him and jumping into his ftilt, you might get sent backwards.
THIS IS ALL SPECULAITION
NEED TESTING!!!!!!
HE STAGED SPIKED ME WITH F TILT!!
How to do.
1. We were on PMS1. So i assume you need boxed type of ledges (or similar ledges)
2. I was hanging on the edge
3. He hit with a very specific part of the F-Tilts hitbox. (the one that sends you backwards.)
There must be a hitbox at the bottom somewhere. probably designed so that if Link was on a platform and you are behind him and jumping into his ftilt, you might get sent backwards.
THIS IS ALL SPECULAITION
NEED TESTING!!!!!!
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