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Official Brawl Tier Discussion (OP Updated)
- Thread starter AlphaZealot
- Start date
- Status
MiraiGen
Smash Ace
- Joined
- Sep 23, 2006
- Messages
- 710
Pokemon Trainer can't be just one character - he is three separate characters used once-per-life. The advantage of having a tier list for each character is a better grasp of knowing which one to use.
I still don't get the problem with Ivysaur. She's got bad recovery but good grabs, and the awesome Bullet Seed, Usmash, Dair, and Uair.
I still don't get the problem with Ivysaur. She's got bad recovery but good grabs, and the awesome Bullet Seed, Usmash, Dair, and Uair.
Yuna-Maria
Smash Ace
I strongly disagree with the placement of Samus in the low tier. She's mid, people. She's good at almost everything EXCEPT outright KOs, so what makes her an inferior character to Link?
Browny
Smash Hater
why is ivysaur always generalised as a 'she'
am i missing something here :/
am i missing something here :/
You're not allowed to Down-B once you've cleared your opponent, to switch to one better suited for the situation?
Maybe Link is placed too high. I think Jiggly keeps getting put too high in many lists as well, tbh.
- Joined
- Aug 31, 2005
- Messages
- 8,189
I agree with corner trap on this one. I main snake and know his strengths. If you just side dodge my grenades I will just have them stop on you instead. If I am using missles your off the stage and in bad shape. Mines roll dodge over them is kinda funny. We mainly stick you and then advance till your in the air. Then your in even worse shape. Upclose our nair out prioritizes almost anything. Air dodge and then run when your in the air. This means that we are on the ground usually utilit, uairing, or bairing. All of which will stay out long enough for us to hit you.
Think again.
I also would back up someone putting pokemon trainer instead of them individually. You have to play them all or pretty much lose.
Think again.
I also would back up someone putting pokemon trainer instead of them individually. You have to play them all or pretty much lose.
Yuna-Maria
Smash Ace
IIRC it's because some internet thing somewhere said that the PKMN Trainer had two males and a female, that female being the Ivysaur.
MiraiGen
Smash Ace
- Joined
- Sep 23, 2006
- Messages
- 710
Well you can pick two out of three, so if you wanted to weed out the one that's inferior (Much like what most of the Youtube Tourney player videos did), you could.
I still think they should be placed separately, if only because they're all three separate in mechanics. It's no different than Shiek/Zelda, honestly, except that you have to switch.
Boolossus
Smash Ace
May as well submit my list.
Top:
Pit
Snake
ROB
High:
Marth
Game and Watch
Toon Link
Pikachu
Peach
Ike
Dedede
Kirby
Metaknight
Middle:
Diddy Kong
Donkey Kong
Bowser
Mario
Luigi
Wario
Fox
Falco
Wolf
Zelda/Sheik
Low:
Pokemon Trainer
Samus
ZSS
Ice Climbers
Ness
Lucas
Olimar
Link
Captain Falcon
Bottom:
Ganondorf
Sonic
Jigglypuff
Lucario
I try to judge each character in 3 catagories; recovery, projectiles, and combat.
Top:
Pit
Snake
ROB
High:
Marth
Game and Watch
Toon Link
Pikachu
Peach
Ike
Dedede
Kirby
Metaknight
Middle:
Diddy Kong
Donkey Kong
Bowser
Mario
Luigi
Wario
Fox
Falco
Wolf
Zelda/Sheik
Low:
Pokemon Trainer
Samus
ZSS
Ice Climbers
Ness
Lucas
Olimar
Link
Captain Falcon
Bottom:
Ganondorf
Sonic
Jigglypuff
Lucario
I try to judge each character in 3 catagories; recovery, projectiles, and combat.
I haven't heard anything on the internet regarding the gender of PT's pokemon but even if there was such a thing there is no real reason to assume Ivysaur is the female. All of PT's pokemon can either be male or female in the games. Squirtles and Charizards can be female too.
Ivysaur is a she because of preconceived notions we have as a society. People associate flowers and plants with femininity.
Ivysaur is a she because of preconceived notions we have as a society. People associate flowers and plants with femininity.
Corner-Trap
Smash Ace
I knew you would say that eventually. Don't worry I plan on moving Samus up, I'm just trying to think of a good place for her.
Zook
Perpetual Lazy Bum
Ivy's voice is too deep for me to call him a she.
rubiksfriend
Smash Apprentice
Why are the top tiers so small? Pit is not top tier. High-mid.
ledhead
Smash Apprentice
And Luigi is definitely high tier. He's above mid for certain.
RazeveX
Smash Ace
hizzlum
Smash Journeyman
Luigi's recovery is so small that it hardly makes a difference to just doing his midair jump. his b side takes him some distance, but there is an fair amount of lag if you want to do his b up(which isnt even as good as his second jump). he becomes extremly helpless after the first frames of it, but the good thing about the move is that it can ko someone. Luigi was insane in melee cuz he had the big wavedash and good aerials, but without those he feels really nerfed
two things
i wouldn't put luigi top but maybe he could introduce the high tier. aerial priority, a good balance of horizontal and vertical recovery, and quick moves which can get combos off an opponents offence make him a pretty good character.
however...in comparison to marth and pit....he doesn't have the good range that can out do them...his traction ( although it helps with his dash up smash) makes him hard to control.
and when it comes to who should be top tier...it should be snake.
for being the 2nd heaviest character in the game his attacks are fast. his ftilt has the knee lock which guarantees the second deadly 10% (or so) hit....utilt is a disjointed hit box and with hi knockback ( can kill a middle weight at 90% which isn't hard to rack damage to with snake)...uair and bair are fast and powerful and his other airs still have high knock back and killing ability by the end of their animations.
also his explosives make him control the field more than any other character. in addition, they are pretty discreet. they make him a happy camper. comboing physical with explosive attacks make him almost unstoppable.
his attacks also seem to have more hitstun than the others
worst thing my brother did to me as a snake main
go up to yur opponent... up smash then utilt.. snake should hit the opponent with the launcher commencing hit stun. follow up with the utilt which should launch yur opponent to the explosive from the up smash.
things like that and putting c4 on characters make him control the field insanely.
snake may run the risk of being banned due to his ability to just take over the stage and seriously **** with his high knockback explosions.
fox and falco didn't have this back in melee...he may be the akuma of ssbb
i wouldn't put luigi top but maybe he could introduce the high tier. aerial priority, a good balance of horizontal and vertical recovery, and quick moves which can get combos off an opponents offence make him a pretty good character.
however...in comparison to marth and pit....he doesn't have the good range that can out do them...his traction ( although it helps with his dash up smash) makes him hard to control.
and when it comes to who should be top tier...it should be snake.
for being the 2nd heaviest character in the game his attacks are fast. his ftilt has the knee lock which guarantees the second deadly 10% (or so) hit....utilt is a disjointed hit box and with hi knockback ( can kill a middle weight at 90% which isn't hard to rack damage to with snake)...uair and bair are fast and powerful and his other airs still have high knock back and killing ability by the end of their animations.
also his explosives make him control the field more than any other character. in addition, they are pretty discreet. they make him a happy camper. comboing physical with explosive attacks make him almost unstoppable.
his attacks also seem to have more hitstun than the others
worst thing my brother did to me as a snake main
go up to yur opponent... up smash then utilt.. snake should hit the opponent with the launcher commencing hit stun. follow up with the utilt which should launch yur opponent to the explosive from the up smash.
things like that and putting c4 on characters make him control the field insanely.
snake may run the risk of being banned due to his ability to just take over the stage and seriously **** with his high knockback explosions.
fox and falco didn't have this back in melee...he may be the akuma of ssbb
PIMPSLAP
Smash Lord
Hey corner trap post my tier list there im intrested in seeing what they say
thanks
Ivysaur is definitely not a girl. As someone said, HIS voice is too ****ing deep
Plus, when you do his side taunt, he jumps up on his feet and goes "LOOOK AT MA BAAAAALLZZZ".I'd like to invoke the Kirby theory, explained in my signature. I'd also like to invoke the "Nintendo censors Link getting tang" theory for good measure.
I thought Luigi's recovery was weak until I saw someone use his down-B. It's easier to use than it was in Melee...you don't have to mash nearly as fast to get results, and it's very easy and effective to use as a recovery (except over wifi =/). Anyone who thinks Luigi's recovery sucks hasn't used his downB to recover.
Also, Luigi has a lot of strength in the air, his dash attack doesn't blow, although you can't really dash-attack through people, his jab combo is really good, and I believe you can jab-jab-upB. His tornado can be used as somewhat of an approach if you're pro
Definitely high tier, but his traction messes up things like shield grabbing and approaching, so I wouldn't put him in top tier.
igotHYRULEbannedatTOYWIZwitmarth
Smash Apprentice
Bowser for top tier! metaknight for bottom tier! w00t anarchy!!
I fixed it. As if Bowser for top tier would be anarchy =/
SwordmasterXXXI
Smash Journeyman
Well, this game is more based on arials. So that alone makes Luigi high tier since he has a very good arial game.
ugh, people -_-
Luigi is still high tier IMO even though it's sort of camping-based. Luigi can pressure with his fireballs, albeit not as well as others, and he's strong in all areas, particularly in the air. However, his lack of traction screws up his ground approach game, which keeps him out of top tier.
EDIT: lol, can I play you on wifi, SwordmasterXXXI? I want to emasculate you with CAPTAIN FALCON, supposedly the worst character in the game
also I just to generally emasculate someone today, I'm in a bad mood.
PIMPSLAP
Smash Lord
wow guy that was messed up to say....
Dark Sonic
Smash Hero
Do you still not realize that online matches do not represent the offline metagame? Seriously.EDIT: lol, can I play you on wifi, SwordmasterXXXI? I want to emasculate you with CAPTAIN FALCON, supposedly the worst character in the game
Do you still not realize that you're opinions don't make a bit of difference? Seriously.
There are a lot of differences between online and offline play, and the magnitude of the differences are determined by the amount of lag experienced. Some characters accel in laggy situations, particularly characters with spammable disruptive projectiles, and Ike with his rough buttsecks ownage. Other characters like Meta Knight that need to chase and space well to be effective, or that have really sensitive recoveries, don't do so well on wifi because the timing is off. On connections that are yellow or worse, the game changes drastically. On green connections, the change is barely noticable.
Rapid_Assassin
Smash Master
WTF @ this list. Lucario isn't the worst character in the game. Why is Olimar and Ice Climbers so low? Zelda and Sheik need separate spots on the tier list. It's not like you have to switch between them. And what do you mean by your "combat" category?
Yuna-Maria
Smash Ace
Yeah...Lucario's mid, almost everyone agrees outside of the Pokeymans fanboys who are twelve years old and insist that Mewtwo was tops in Melee.
Corner-Trap
Smash Ace
PIMPSLAP
Why not just join the forums yourself? Either way you'll have to post your tier list up again if you want me to repost it on SRK.
Why not just join the forums yourself? Either way you'll have to post your tier list up again if you want me to repost it on SRK.
samdaballer
Smash Ace
so when is the first tier list actually going to come out?
SwordmasterXXXI
Smash Journeyman
1. My Wi-Fi isn't working.
2. You do realize that even if you do beat me with captian Falcon it doesn't mean that he's any better, right? -_-
2. You do realize that even if you do beat me with captian Falcon it doesn't mean that he's any better, right? -_-
WhiteWingDemon
Smash Cadet
- Joined
- Mar 30, 2008
- Messages
- 49
Pretty obvious you have no idea what actual anarchy is or the consequences of such a sytem.
Yeah...how bout no? ZSS is definately High Tier material. Light Weight is her only disadvantage. What about her tether recovery you say? Yes, she can be edge hogged but she does have this wonderful third jump that allows a special footstool out of any item or character.
PIMPSLAP
Smash Lord
ok cool i will do it thanks
giving you the list.
PIMPSLAP
Smash Lord
here you go corner trap
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