Official Brawl Tier Discussion (OP Updated)

[philbobjoe]

Sonic should be mid tier because expert sonic users can get around his weaknesses. Also, sonic has good recovery and recovery gimping. He also has an Usmash that can dash cancel.

Anyone expert user of any character can get past that character's weaknesses...

 

[Scarlet Jile]

This is what I'm throwing out there. We'll see what becomes of it. This is based purely from personal experience and reading about/studying each of the characters in their own rights. This is also the first tier list I've made and the first tier thread I've posted in. So, ya'know. Not really biased (except maybe ambitiously putting Yoshi in middle tier).


Top
Snake
Metaknight
G&W
Falco

High
Toon Link
ROB
Marth
Zelda
Mario
Donkey Kong
Pikachu
Ike
Wario

Mid
Wolf
Yoshi
Lucas
Pit
Kirby
King Dedede
Ness
Luigi
Fox
Ice Climbers
Squirtle
Link

Low
Sonic
Diddy kong
Ivysaur
Zamus
Olimar
Lucario
Bowser
Captain Falcon

Bottom
Samus
Shiek
Jigglypuff
Charizard
Peach
Ganondorf

 

[JJR.O.B.]

My brawl tiers

Top
Snake
ROB
Meta Knight
Marth
DDD
High
G&W
Falco
Lucas
Ike
ZSS
Fox
Squirtle
Wolf
Toon Link
Lucario
Middle
Pikachu
Sonic
Zelda
Charizard
Diddy Kong
Luigi
Ness
Kirby
Olimar
Mario
Bowser
Samus
Low
Captain Falcon
Ivysaur
Link
Sheik
Ganodorf
Peach
Ice Climbers[
Bottom
Pit
DK
Jigglypuff
Wario
Yoshi

 

[jinofcoolnes]

I was just playing street fighter:third strike and looking at the tops tier's of that game reminded me of this game.

Marth=Chung lee
Has alot of good match ups but almost no bad match ups.(and wears blue)
MK=Yun
Godly of combos but low def.
Snake=Ken
Good def Good combos a Good amont of Good match ups.

Also PK should be placed in one tier mainly because you will have to use them all.

 

[orintemple]

Top
Snake
ROB
Meta Knight
Marth
DDD
High
G&W
Falco
Lucas
Ike
ZSS
Fox
Squirtle
Wolf
Toon Link
Lucario
Middle
Pikachu
Sonic
Zelda
Charizard
Diddy Kong
Luigi
Ness
Kirby
Olimar
Mario
Bowser
Samus
Low
Captain Falcon
Ivysaur
Link
Sheik
Ganodorf
Peach
Ice Climbers[
Bottom
Pit
DK
Jigglypuff
Wario
Yoshi

lol wat?! Seriously what is this? Pit bottom tier LOL. This is a tier list not a person opinion list.

Yoshi is higher, if only a bit. Ice climbers and Pit are WAYYYYYYYY too low, they are both high tier material. Dk is higher, Wario is higher. Captain Falcon is lower. Samus is lower. Zelda higher, Pikachu too. Sonic is too high. Ike is lower. D3 and ROB are slightly lower too. There are other things I find wrong, but I'm too lazy to point everything out.

Some of this list is outrageous, but I guess some placements are fine.

 

[Frown]

Snake smashes from a DISTANCE. He deserves top tier.

 

[King Fat]

Here's what I think:


TOP:
Toon Link
Meta Knight
Marth
Mr. Game & Watch
Pit
Snake
Falco

HIGH:
Wolf
Olimar
Rob
Pikachu
Zelda
Zero Suit Samus
Ice Climbers

MIDDLE:
Kirby
Wario
Lucas
Lucario
Link
Diddy Kong
Sonic
Shiek
Ivysaur
Fox

LOW:
Squirtle
Luigi
Ness
Samus
Donkey Kong
King Dedede
Mario
Ike
Charizard
Jigglypuff

BOTTOM:
Peach
Bowser
Yoshi
Captain Falcon
Ganondorf

 

[Ripple]

anyone who puts DK in bottom tier because he was low in the other games is ********. DK will at least be top of mid tier. He is way too good to be any lower

 

[Azuro]

Top
Snake
ROB
Meta Knight
Marth
DDD
High
G&W
Falco
Lucas
Ike
ZSS
Fox
Squirtle
Wolf
Toon Link
Lucario
Middle
Pikachu
Sonic
Zelda
Charizard
Diddy Kong
Luigi
Ness
Kirby
Olimar
Mario
Bowser
Samus
Low
Captain Falcon
Ivysaur
Link
Sheik
Ganodorf
Peach
Ice Climbers[
Bottom
Pit
DK
Jigglypuff
Wario
Yoshi

>_>

The entire bottom tier except for Jigglypuff should be higher...Captain Falcon is utter bottom with Ganondorf being second worst...Shiek low tier=WTF...Ike is not high tier...Falco not top is just wth...and a bunch of other screw-ups.

What kinda list is that, seriously?

 

[Conda]

Here you go:
TOP:
Snake
Toon Link
Meta Knight
Marth

HIGH:
Falco
Mr. Game & Watch
Rob
Dedede
Luigi
Pikachu
Pit
Ice Climbers
Wario
ZSSamus
Olimar
Donkey Kong
Diddy Kong
Zelda

MIDDLE:
Wolf
Lucas
Ness
Kirby
Lucario
Fox
Mario
Shiek
Ike

LOW:
Yoshi
Samus
Bowser
Charizard
Squirtle
Peach
Ivysaur
Sonic
Jigglypuff
Link

BOTTOM:
Ganondorf
~large gap~
Captain Falcon

 

[thisismatt]

I can't see Snake being Top Tier because he is UNBELIEVABLY slow. Same with Ganondorf. I fully expect Ganondorf to be Low or even Bottom Tier.

The problem with "Top Tier" this time around is that a lot of potential characters for that list have one major drawback. Snake is slow as molasses. Metaknight lacks a killing move. Olimar's recovery sucks if you don't use is perfectly. Something tells me Marth may be the only true "Top Tier" character.

 

[SaxDude93]

This is what I'm throwing out there. We'll see what becomes of it. This is based purely from personal experience and reading about/studying each of the characters in their own rights. This is also the first tier list I've made and the first tier thread I've posted in. So, ya'know. Not really biased (except maybe ambitiously putting Yoshi in middle tier).


Top
Snake
Metaknight
G&W
Falco

High
Toon Link
ROB
Marth
Zelda
Mario
Donkey Kong
Pikachu
Ike
Wario

Mid
Wolf
Yoshi
Lucas
Pit
Kirby
King Dedede
Ness
Luigi
Fox
Ice Climbers
Squirtle
Link

Low
Sonic
Diddy kong
Ivysaur
Zamus
Olimar
Lucario
Bowser
Captain Falcon

Bottom
Samus
Shiek
Jigglypuff
Charizard
Peach
Ganondorf

IKE IS NOT HIGH. He's slow, big, and predictable. His only two fast moves are his bair and Quick Draw. Quick Draw is easily gimpable. Bair is predictable because you have to jump to use it. His other airs are too slow. Other anti-Ike that is better than mine is in this topic. Olimar is high tier. His only bad point is his recovery. Thats it. He has a good projectile, good range on a bunch of stuff and can rack up damage like crazy. Diddy Kong is also higher. His bananas can mess up a lot of stuff and Diddy has a good recovery. Last but not least, C.Falcon is in bottom. Sadly. He has no approach, no combos, no priorrity, and lack of kill power. G-Dorf is better in all of those things.

Oh, and R.O.B. and Olimar are the best Snake counters.

 

[Conda]

I can't see Snake being Top Tier because he is UNBELIEVABLY slow. Same with Ganondorf. I fully expect Ganondorf to be Low or even Bottom Tier.

The problem with "Top Tier" this time around is that a lot of potential characters for that list have one major drawback. Snake is slow as molasses. Metaknight lacks a killing move. Olimar's recovery sucks if you don't use is perfectly. Something tells me Marth may be the only true "Top Tier" character.

You're wrong. Simply put.
MK has killing moves. Snake is NOT slow. Olimar's great ground combat makes recovery only a minor drawback, like ZSS.

 

[Nigerian Star Storm]

I can't see Snake being Top Tier because he is UNBELIEVABLY slow. Same with Ganondorf. I fully expect Ganondorf to be Low or even Bottom Tier.

The problem with "Top Tier" this time around is that a lot of potential characters for that list have one major drawback. Snake is slow as molasses. Metaknight lacks a killing move. Olimar's recovery sucks if you don't use is perfectly. Something tells me Marth may be the only true "Top Tier" character.

This is so horribly wrong it's not even funny......

 

[SaxDude93]

I can't see Snake being Top Tier because he is UNBELIEVABLY slow. Same with Ganondorf. I fully expect Ganondorf to be Low or even Bottom Tier.

The problem with "Top Tier" this time around is that a lot of potential characters for that list have one major drawback. Snake is slow as molasses. Metaknight lacks a killing move. Olimar's recovery sucks if you don't use is perfectly. Something tells me Marth may be the only true "Top Tier" character.

Brawl =\= Melee. Fast=\= Top tier. Snake's potential is unlimited. He has a **** load of projectiles, mindgames, pressure and stage control, match-ups, and tourney data to back up his Top-Tierness for Brawl. The MK has no kill moves statement is the wrongest statement of Brawl. MK's main buying point is being able to rack up damage and fast. And when he is able to hit 150 in the same time frame as another character getting 100, it doesn't matter if some of his moves have less horizontal knockback. At 150, you can use any number of moves to kill. Also, for Olimar, lrn2notgetnit and lrn2properlyrecoverlikeanexpertolimarplayerdoes.

And G-Dorf has always been bad in Brawl.

 

[Grunt]

Sonic should be mid tier because expert sonic users can get around his weaknesses. Also, sonic has good recovery and recovery gimping. He also has an Usmash that can dash cancel.

Tier lists are situated besed on match ups of characters, provided the players are of equal skill. so even if a Sonic "Expert" were to play another "Expert" he would still fail horribly. unless it was Captain falcon.

 

[SaxDude93]

The fact is Sonic has no priority. That means his moves are slow and are canceled by other moves. Only Falcon has lower priority. (Probably false)

Also, is there a topic that lists the priority for each character and is there a list that ranks the character in terms of priority.

 

[Nigerian Star Storm]

Could you link that please >_>.

Yeah Sonic;s priority is in the dump. I've tried extentsively with him against MK and I don't think he has a single move that can knock MK out of his tornado.


And Tier lists are also based on tourney output. The part I'm not 100% sure of is if they also base it on character ability and presumed metagame potential.

 

[Conda]

Good tier lists do, Nigerian Star Storm.

 

[Nigerian Star Storm]

Good, so I didn't add an outlier to my list when I made it .

 

[Sonic XD]

When you compare the highest of top tiers, which are snake and mk, which is better? Is snake really top tier above all the other characters in this game?

 

[Grunt]

When you compare the highest of top tiers, which are snake and mk, which is better? Is snake really top tier above all the other characters in this game?

He does give trouble to MK and many others, but i see others above him easily.

top tier =/= better than everyone below them.

 

[Conda]

top tier =/= better than everyone below them.

Quoted for emphasis.


Give a look to my tier list on the page before this one. I take a lot of different things into account.

 

[Grunt]

Unless it's SF2 Akuma.
But that's different.

 

[hugglebunny]

This is what I'm throwing out there. We'll see what becomes of it. This is based purely from personal experience and reading about/studying each of the characters in their own rights. This is also the first tier list I've made and the first tier thread I've posted in. So, ya'know. Not really biased (except maybe ambitiously putting Yoshi in middle tier).


Top
Snake
Metaknight
G&W
Falco

High
Toon Link
ROB
Marth
Zelda
Mario
Donkey Kong
Pikachu
Ike
Wario

Mid
Wolf
Yoshi
Lucas
Pit
Kirby
King Dedede
Ness
Luigi
Fox
Ice Climbers
Squirtle
Link

Low
Sonic
Diddy kong
Ivysaur
Zamus
Olimar
Lucario
Bowser
Captain Falcon

Bottom
Samus
Shiek
Jigglypuff
Charizard
Peach
Ganondorf

Face it, DK is not high tier
DIDDY KONG IS HIGH TIER
Don't get those two mixed upped, like u obviously did
Shiek is way higher too

Top
Snake
ROB
Meta Knight
Marth
DDD
High
G&W
Falco
Lucas
Ike
ZSS
Fox
Squirtle
Wolf
Toon Link
Lucario
Middle
Pikachu
Sonic
Zelda
Charizard
Diddy Kong
Luigi
Ness
Kirby
Olimar
Mario
Bowser
Samus
Low
Captain Falcon
Ivysaur
Link
Sheik
Ganodorf
Peach
Ice Climbers[
Bottom
Pit
DK
Jigglypuff
Wario
Yoshi

Diddy Kong needs to be higher
i don't know if Lucas is that high, he probably is mid tier and Pika is definently top




Wow
those r some of the most outragous tiers i have ever seen, Pit and IC need to be way higher on both of those

 

[SwordmasterXXXI]

This is what I'm throwing out there. We'll see what becomes of it. This is based purely from personal experience and reading about/studying each of the characters in their own rights. This is also the first tier list I've made and the first tier thread I've posted in. So, ya'know. Not really biased (except maybe ambitiously putting Yoshi in middle tier).


Top
Snake
Metaknight
G&W
Falco

High
Toon Link
ROB
Marth
Zelda
Mario
Donkey Kong
Pikachu
Ike
Wario

Mid
Wolf
Yoshi
Lucas
Pit
Kirby
King Dedede
Ness
Luigi
Fox
Ice Climbers
Squirtle
Link

Low
Sonic
Diddy kong
Ivysaur
Zamus
Olimar
Lucario
Bowser
Captain Falcon

Bottom
Samus
Shiek
Jigglypuff
Charizard
Peach
Ganondorf

Diddy, Olimar and Lucario in low tier? -_-

 

[Browny]

Tier lists are situated besed on match ups of characters, provided the players are of equal skill. so even if a Sonic "Expert" were to play another "Expert" he would still fail horribly. unless it was Captain falcon.

ugh...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6hb4XIYmUHw
observe

2 very good players, supposed bottom tier vs top tier. doesnt seem to be a world of difference between them does there? i dont think i saw any failing. fact is, everyone sucks at sonic, and whatever sonics you play against theres an extremely high chance they will too since his learning curve is so high, but the few who have to dedication will show you what he can do.

dont state your opinion as if it is a fact

also sonics b-air goes through mach tornado, as does his side b during the hop. his upsmash can to but requires very good timing.

 

[Grunt]

Sethlon side B into a charging smash was kind of dumb, but nonetheless, priceless.

Just C.Falcon is obviously an exaggeration, but most people would do considerably better against sonic. BTW i don't think he is bottom, but yes he fails with priority, and without a projectile isn't quite par.

 

[SaxDude93]

ugh...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6hb4XIYmUHw
observe

2 very good players, supposed bottom tier vs top tier. doesnt seem to be a world of difference between them does there? i dont think i saw any failing. fact is, everyone sucks at sonic, and whatever sonics you play against theres an extremely high chance they will too since his learning curve is so high, but the few who have to dedication will show you what he can do.

dont state your opinion as if it is a fact

also sonics b-air goes through mach tornado, as does his side b during the hop. his upsmash can to but requires very good timing.

You scoured the internet for one example Sonic beating Falco. Ugh. When a character is on low tier it means they can't CONSISTENTLY beat a higher tier character. You have to provide more than one clip. Also, low priority, match-ups and tourney data.

 

[Acid_Wolf]

No way Ganon is on the very bottom... Low mid maybe, but not bottom. Switch him and Bowser and I totally agree with SamusLord's list. And if everyone still thinks Ganon sucks PM me and we'll set up an online match, i'll show you how a good Ganon can destroy.

 

[Grunt]

No way Ganon is on the very bottom... Low mid maybe, but not bottom. Switch him and Bowser and I totally agree with SamusLord's list. And if everyone still thinks Ganon sucks PM me and we'll set up an online match, i'll show you how a good Ganon can destroy.

I love Ganon, but he is too slow, has very long shield lag, and cant approach worth ****.
yes, he is low, no matter how good you may be with him.

 

[SaxDude93]

Tier lists are how a character reflects as a whole. Not as one person does. Also, obligatory, "No priority, no match-ups, no tourney data."

 

[Nigerian Star Storm]

ugh...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6hb4XIYmUHw
observe

2 very good players, supposed bottom tier vs top tier. doesnt seem to be a world of difference between them does there? i dont think i saw any failing. fact is, everyone sucks at sonic, and whatever sonics you play against theres an extremely high chance they will too since his learning curve is so high, but the few who have to dedication will show you what he can do.

dont state your opinion as if it is a fact

also sonics b-air goes through mach tornado, as does his side b during the hop. his upsmash can to but requires very good timing.

One example, wow I'm impressed. Didn't Chu used to play Sonic before he stopped playing smash? Yeah I doubt I'd consider him bad in any way shape or form. Stop your Sonic fanboyism.

Just because a character is Top/High doesn't mean one lower than them can't win, they just cant do it consistently

 

[TehBo49]

Alright, here's my new list. There are a couple areas that I'm still unsure about, but I think my list is reasonably accurate. Feel free to comment.

**TOP TIER**
Snake
Meta Knight
Mr. Game & Watch
Falco

**HIGH TIER**
ROB
Toon Link
Marth
Pikachu
Ice Climbers
Olimar
Wolf
King Dedede

**UPPER MIDDLE TIER**
Zelda
Kirby
Zero Suit Samus
Pit
Diddy Kong
Luigi
Lucario

**LOWER MIDDLE TIER**
Lucas
Donkey Kong
Bowser
Squirtle
Fox
Mario
Charizard

**LOW TIER**
Pokemon Trainer
Ness
Yoshi
Sheik
Samus
Ike
Ivysaur
Sonic
Peach

**BOTTOM TIER**
Link
Jigglypuff
Ganondorf
Captain Falcon

 

[hugglebunny]

No way Ganon is on the very bottom... Low mid maybe, but not bottom. Switch him and Bowser and I totally agree with SamusLord's list. And if everyone still thinks Ganon sucks PM me and we'll set up an online match, i'll show you how a good Ganon can destroy.

When you play a good Ganon, that is when u realize that he is bottom of the mid tier or higher so, true that

 

[Nigerian Star Storm]

Once again, an excellent list that isn't as stupid as some of the ones posted in this thread.


And I'll state again, using the "Well everyone sucks with him so he looks bad but really isn't" Or "You don't know he's good till you've played a good one" Arguement is horrible for trying to justify a character position on the Tier list.

 

[Dark Paladin X]

i believe that Lucario deserves to be at the top tier, since he is quite easy to use.

 

[SaxDude93]

Ease of use =\= being a good character. And Lucario is not easy to use. And easy character is Wolf or Olimar. The fact that Lucario needs damage to use well defies the purpose of being easy.

And for tehbo's tier list, my only qualm is that DK should be up two or three spots.

 

[Dark Paladin X]

Ease of use =\= being a good character. And Lucario is not easy to use. And easy character is Wolf or Olimar. The fact that Lucario needs damage to use well defies the purpose of being easy.

And for tehbo's tier list, my only qualm is that DK should be up two or three spots.

But do you agree the Lucario deserves to be on the top since he have kick *** potentials.

 

[SaxDude93]

But do you agree the Lucario deserves to be on the top since he have kick *** potentials.

I never said he was on top. He has bad match ups against many other top tier characters such as R.O.B., Tink, Marth, and G&W. Lucario deserves mid.