Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[Will]

Why don't we have outright Hilda colors for Zelda?

Because Hilda is obviously going to be a new Echo fighter for Zelda in the next game. She has great distinct qualities like: purple, upside-down triforce, and plotting genocide.

She also fits because Zelda’s current look is attributed to her game

 

[Ivander]

Because Hilda is obviously going to be a new Echo fighter for Zelda in the next game. She has great distinct qualities like: purple, upside-down triforce, and plotting genocide.

She also fits because Zelda’s current look is attributed to her game

I mean, it's possible they did consider a Hilda Echo Fighter, considering Zelda is alot more happy with her new look and maybe her colors wouldn't have fit with Zelda's new happy expressions and Echo Fighter Hilda could've had expressions and animations similar to Twilight Princess Zelda, but maybe they didn't go through with it because compared to Zelda, Hilda outright uses a staff compared to Zelda and more like Palutena.

Still wish they did give Zelda a more Hilda-based color scheme though. And if anything, once again makes me wish Smash Bros. Ultimate had a color editor maker.

 

[Gengar84]

I think Smash could do a lot better in the alt outfit department. So many characters have such great options but are stuck with palate swaps. Here’s a question: Would anyone here be willing to buy DLC outfits for non Mii characters? That seems like a great way for Smash to make some extra money and for us to get more content as long as it’s priced fairly.

Another thought I had that would be interesting but likely way too much work to ever implement are including past builds for each character like in some fighting games. It would just be interesting to see who comes out on top between Melee Fox, Brawl Metaknight, Smash 4 Bayonetta, and Ultimate Steve. Never going to happen but it would be neat.

 

[Mamboo07]

Here’s a question: Would anyone here be willing to buy DLC outfits for non Mii characters?

Yes, a thousand times yes.

 

[Ivander]

I think Smash could do a lot better in the alt outfit department. So many characters have such great options but are stuck with palate swaps. Here’s a question: Would anyone here be willing to buy DLC outfits for non Mii characters? That seems like a great way for Smash to make some extra money and for us to get more content as long as it’s priced fairly.

If priced anywhere near the Mii Costume individual prices, sure, I'd get them. And regardless, I assume some other people would get them for completion and options sake like me.

 

[Will]

I imagine that we don't have shinies because The Pokémon Company wants to keep it as a surprise.
But Smash is not really good at hiding spoilers.

Sakurai added a spoiler to Shulk’s Final Smash.

Spoiler: Rant: Why Didn’t They Just Make Her Playable?

I like Fiora, but there was no reason to add her. The attack is a hard reference to the trio-based battle system. Why spoil 20 hours worth of gameplay for, imo, the weakest amount of fanservice? I would’ve rather had her be her own character or an AT (like Riki!) if they went so far as to use resources to made a new model, new animations, and give it voice lines.

Was she really that hyped back then?

 

[Noipoi]

I imagine that we don't have shinies because The Pokémon Company wants to keep it as a surprise.
But Smash is not really good at hiding spoilers.

Incineroar

 

[Perkilator]

I think Smash could do a lot better in the alt outfit department. So many characters have such great options but are stuck with palate swaps. Here’s a question: Would anyone here be willing to buy DLC outfits for non Mii characters?

Unpopular opinion but no. After hearing horror stories about the way Street Fighter 6 handled DLC costumes, I'd rather the alt costumes just be part of the character by default.

 

[HyperSomari64]

Incineroar

You have a point, man.

 

[Gengar84]

Unpopular opinion but no. After hearing horror stories about the way Street Fighter 6 handled DLC costumes, I'd rather the alt costumes just be part of the character by default.

As a huge TMNT fan, I can totally relate. The TMNT outfit prices in Street Fighter VI were offensive and I think it killed the excitement for many like myself that would have cared otherwise. Smash has been pretty good with its prices for Mii outfits and as long as other outfits are in that range, I’d gladly pay for some additional outfits if I like them enough.

 

[osby]

Unpopular opinion but no. After hearing horror stories about the way Street Fighter 6 handled DLC costumes, I'd rather the alt costumes just be part of the character by default.

Honestly agreed.

Maybe it doesn't make sense but I feel like there's a difference between getting new options to customize Miis and having to pay to pick my favorite characters' costumes for me.

 

[cashregister9]

The worst part about Street fighter VI's costumes on top of them being grossly overpriced is that you can't use them in any mode people actually play.

 

[Will]

Honestly agreed.

Maybe it doesn't make sense but I feel like there's a difference between getting new options to customize Miis and having to pay to pick my favorite characters' costumes for me.

Mii Costumes are always new. It’s a lite-character reveal when costumes like appear.

And then eventually people will just want Echo fighters of preexisting characters instead of DLC costumes for preexisting characters.

 

[Idon]

Please, stop the "new characters in 2024" nonsense, the entire dev team was disbanded. If they're going to go through the effort of bringing back the team YEARS after the fact, it's not going to be to drop 5-6 characters in a game they don't even bother to balance patch.

 

[Gengar84]

Mii Costumes are always new. It’s a lite-character reveal when costumes like appear.

And then eventually people will just want Echo fighters of preexisting characters instead of DLC costumes for preexisting characters.

It looks like they just did that with Yor Forger over Juri Han in Street Fighter VI. Brawlhala does this too. I’m okay with it as long as the moveset makes sense for the character. Obviously I’d rather have a fully unique character but this would pretty much be the same as using mods over characters like I already do.

 

[Hadokeyblade]

Who else wishes Smash in general put more effort into alts for other characters? Sora, Joker, Sephiroth, Hero, Byleth, Kazuya, and Steve’s alts in Ultimate are great steps in the right direction, IMO. I just wish other fighters had similar amounts of love with their alts.

Joker has so many outfits in his home series it's a shame smash decided to give us some pretty plain ones in the actual game aside from his academy uniform of course.

 

[cashregister9]

It looks like they just did that with Yor Forger over Juri Han in Street Fighter VI. Brawlhala does this too. I’m okay with it as long as the moveset makes sense for the character.

That is not what they did, The Yor costume is an Avatar outfit, the avatar they had was just using Juri's moves.

If it was like Brawlhalla or Smite, people would actually like it.

 

[Gengar84]

That is not what they did, The Yor costume is an Avatar outfit, the avatar they had was just using Juri's moves.

If it was like Brawlhalla or Smite, people would actually like it.

Oh, I just saw the reveal trailer and I saw she was using Juri’s moves so I assumed it was an echo, especially the way it was presented in the trailer. That definitely explains why her face looked so off.

 

[Schnee117]

Oh, I just saw the reveal trailer and I saw she was using Juri’s moves so I assumed it was an echo, especially the way it was presented in the trailer.

No, avatar characters in SF6 use moves from the actual characters. You pick a basic fighting style and then you can equip various special moves and supers from anyone so you can have Juri's basic moveset with Gief's 360 input, some of JP's terrorism and Ken's fireball for example.

 

[Perkilator]

No, avatar characters in SF6 use moves from the actual characters. You pick a basic fighting style and then you can equip various special moves and supers from anyone so you can have Juri's basic moveset with Gief's 360 input, some of JP's terrorism and Ken's fireball for example.

That reminds me of my idea for Dragon King, if he ever became on official Smash fighter, being similar to SF6's Avatar in terms of using other fighters' special moves.

 

[Gengar84]

No, avatar characters in SF6 use moves from the actual characters. You pick a basic fighting style and then you can equip various special moves and supers from anyone so you can have Juri's basic moveset with Gief's 360 input, some of JP's terrorism and Ken's fireball for example.

Oh that sounds pretty cool actually. I’ve seen some videos of character creations and that got me interested. From what I could tell, you could only change the head and basic body frame and not the outfit like you can in Soul Calibur or WWE games. Maybe you unlock that feature later or it just wasn’t in the videos I saw. The lack of being able to fully customize the outfit drove me away from picking it up.

 

[Ivander]

One of the reasons why I'm open to DLC alternate costumes is because of the 3rd Party launch characters. Aside from Cloud and Bayonetta, both of whom were originally DLC characters for Smash 4, none of the 3rd Parties at launch were given any alternate costumes. Meanwhile, 6 out of the 8 3rd Parties we got for DLC had alternate costumes, the only 2 not getting any being Banjo & Kazooie and Terry. If counting Ryu's DLC appearance for Smash 4, only 3 DLC 3rd-Parties didn't get any outright different costumes.

Part of that might be because of possible stinginess regarding the 3rd Party launch characters and their owners, since it took Nintendo alot just to get them in the first place, but the owners might be more willing to let alternate costumes be given to those characters if they were given via DLC.

 

[Will]

That reminds me of my idea for Dragon King, if he ever became on official Smash fighter, being similar to SF6's Avatar in terms of using other fighters' special moves.

i equip my epic dragon king oc with 3 reflection attacks (2/3 also being counters) and an abusable recovery with no hurtbox

smash will never recover from my reign of terror

 

[Gengar84]

I’ve always wondered something since I’m just a casual player and not really amazing at the game. Are characters with counters overpowered in high level competitive play? It seems like if a player is really skilled enough they’d basically be able to counter whenever they want and couldn’t get hit outside of grabs. I’m definitely not good enough to be able to counter at will but I would think it would be possible if the player was good enough to get the timing down perfect.

 

[DarthEnderX]

**** it, I'm fully on the "Ultimate is getting more characters in 2024" train now.

The ONLY downside I have with Ultimate Deluxe, is it means we'd probably still be stuck with Falcondorf.

Here’s a question: Would anyone here be willing to buy DLC outfits for non Mii characters?

Probably not. As a rule, I generally don't pay real money for cosmetics, unless I'm trying to send some kind of message.

 

[Will]

I’ve always wondered something since I’m just a casual player and not really amazing at the game. Are characters with counters overpowered in high level competitive play? It seems like if a player is really skilled enough they’d basically be able to counter whenever they want and couldn’t get hit outside of grabs. I’m definitely not good enough to be able to counter at will but I would think it would be possible if the player was good enough to get the timing down perfect.

The consequences for missing a counter are too dangerous to use unless you have a good read on what the other player will do. In that case, countering is great as an edgeguard tool against characters whose recoveries use active hitboxes (Mario, Little Mac, etc). The only counter that can be “broken” is probably Shulk’s, if he combines it with the Smash Art.

 

[WeirdChillFever]

It would be so incredibly cool to have new characters for Ultimate, either through an Ultimate Deluxe or a Fighter’s Pass 3nd it’s gonna be even cooler when the first new character revealed is Alear

 

[Noipoi]

It would be so incredibly cool to have new characters for Ultimate, either through an Ultimate Deluxe or a Fighter’s Pass 3nd it’s gonna be even cooler when the first new character revealed is Alear

I’d actually be fine with that.

I’m not really a big Alear fan, but if they got them out of the way so we could focus on other characters instead of saving them as the “grand finale” I wouldn’t have any complaints.

 

[Guynamednelson]

the entire dev team was disbanded

Sure, you're right about this, but the Booster Course Pass did add its own credits sequence separate from vanilla MK8, and the two credits sequences show there were different people responsible for the BCP vs. vanilla MK8:

Spoiler: Big images

...and for that last one, that's not even the full list of people responsible for planning the BCP.

And those aren't all the differences between their credits, but you should get the picture by now.

 

[Will]

I’d actually be fine with that.

I’m not really a big Alear fan, but if they got them out of the way so we could focus on other characters instead of saving them as the “grand finale” I wouldn’t have any complaints.

Who said the grand finale wasn’t another Fire Emblem character? How else is Nintendo going to sell the Fire Emblem 4 remake without Sigurd and his twink son, the third Marth clone Seliph?

 

[Noipoi]

The only issue I have with the Booster Course Pass comparisons is that the only reason we have it is because of Tour.

Last time I checked there isn’t a mobile Smash game to rip content from.

 

[Guynamednelson]

The only issue I have with the Booster Course Pass comparisons is that the only reason we have it is because of Tour.

Last time I checked there isn’t a movile Smash game to rip content from.

I'm only doing it because of people who use the BCP as proof SSBU can get late DLC. I know there isn't a mobile Smash to rip fighters from.

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

This likely isn't considered financially prudent enough to do, but I'd honestly love a third Smash DLC Pass even if it didn't have outright new fighters. A whole wave based around new (& old) stages, new Mii costumes (perhaps a decent amount of quasi-deluxe variations ala Bomberman & Sans), new modes (boss rush, the various modes from Smash 4), etc.

Essentially one last additional shine on Ultimate before the next console comes out. I'd be down for it, even if its not likely to happen.

 

[Ivander]

Honestly, while I'm okay with a Smash Ultimate Deluxe, my biggest issue is that it will mostly remain the same aside from new characters, stages, items, Spirits and possibly bosses without fixing some of the main gripes I have, like a lack of fighting bosses with any character without World of Light, a lack of being able to use Spirits without the BP/Rarity differences giving a major advantage or disadvantage, and no Smash Run.

I do enjoy Smash UItimate's main modes, but it's really only at it's most fun with friends and World of Light and Spirits are decent the first time around, but they do not feel fun to repeat. Smash Run was really fun for me because of being able to fight against the many different enemies of the different series and I feel like even if you don't bring back Smash Run, adding the different Mooks to Spirits or Classic Mode, as well as a couple platforming levels to World of Light and Classic Mode, would make them much more replayable.
And adding an option to fight Bosses with any character would also add more Single Player replayability as well.

 

[HyperSomari64]

Because Hilda is obviously going to be a new Echo fighter for Zelda in the next game. She has great distinct qualities like: purple, upside-down triforce, and plotting genocide.

She also fits because Zelda’s current look is attributed to her game

Are all You sure her colors fit well for Zelda?
(Sorry, i thought we were talking about Chupead's Hilda Berg)

 

[Perkilator]

Honestly, while I'm okay with a Smash Ultimate Deluxe, my biggest issue is that it will mostly remain the same aside from new characters, stages, items, Spirits and possibly bosses without fixing some of the main gripes I have, like a lack of fighting bosses with any character without World of Light, a lack of being able to use Spirits without the BP/Rarity differences giving a major advantage or disadvantage, and no Smash Run.

I do enjoy Smash UItimate's main modes, but it's really only at it's most fun with friends and World of Light and Spirits are decent the first time around, but they do not feel fun to repeat. Smash Run was really fun for me because of being able to fight against the many different enemies of the different series and I feel like even if you don't bring back Smash Run, adding the different Mooks to Spirits or Classic Mode, as well as a couple platforming levels to World of Light and Classic Mode, would make them much more replayable.
And adding an option to fight Bosses with any character would also add more Single Player replayability as well.

That's mainly the reason I want a Smash Ultimate Deluxe; not just new fighters, but more meaningful single-player content as well.

 

[Noipoi]

One of my problems with Ultimate Deluxe is characters like Shadow who were Mii costume’d or trophy’d still won’t have a chance

 

[fogbadge]

One of my problems with Ultimate Deluxe is characters like Shadow who were Mii costume’d or trophy’d still won’t have a chance

well there goes my three most wanted

 

[CapitaineCrash]

One of my problems with Ultimate Deluxe is characters like Shadow who were Mii costume’d or trophy’d still won’t have a chance

I don't know about that. As early as our second DLC wave we already got characters who got spirits (Min Min and Pyra/Myhtra), so I'm sure popular assist trophies or Mii wouldn't be out of the question.

 

[Gorgonzales]

One of my problems with Ultimate Deluxe is characters like Shadow who were Mii costume’d or trophy’d still won’t have a chance

show me the verse in the Smash Bible where father Masahiro Montgomery Sakurai specifically states characters that are mii costumes or assist trophies cannot become playable within the same title