Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[fogbadge]

Honestly if I had to list 10 Nintendo characters I want in smash majority of them would seem obscure and don’t have new game to promote

sounds good to me

 

[Lenidem]

Honestly if I had to list 10 Nintendo characters I want in smash majority of them would seem obscure and don’t have new game to promote

Let me try.

1. Waluigi
2. (Captain) Toad
3. Professor E. Gadd
4. Skull Kid
5. Tingle
6. Tetra
7. Dixie Kong
8. Cranky Kong
9. Isaac
10. Krystal

Granted, several of them are competing against each other, and some have a few problems like a lack of popularity or of relevancy. But can we really say that they are "obscure"?

 

[Quillion]

I'm starting to wish Smash was still Sakurai's craftsman's project rather than being as policed by Nintendo as it seemingly is now.

To be sure, 64, Melee, and even Brawl (to some extent) gave us stubbornly lingering oddities like Falcondorf and Dr. Mario being in just because of Fever, but we got the Ice Climbers despite that being a one-shot IP, Marth and Roy long before FE came up with Awakening-and-beyond, and Mr. Game and Watch from before the NES. Even the "oddities" Falcondorf and Doc had a great "pleasant surprise" factor to them.

Nowadays, the upper limit of "obscure character" is Duck Hunt, and they already had a lot of notoriety for being bundled with SMB1 back in the day and for memes about the dog.

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

As I've noted before, its a pity we don't have a more modest Smash Bros spin-off that focused on the more off-beat Nintendo characters and franchises. Put all the notions of certain notoriety aside, go nuts with the experimental modes, and just be unabashedly a celebration of the weird and forgotten, complete with Foreman Spike as a prominent character.

 

[Geno Boost]

Let me try.

1. Waluigi
2. (Captain) Toad
3. Professor E. Gadd
4. Skull Kid
5. Tingle
6. Tetra
7. Dixie Kong
8. Cranky Kong
9. Isaac
10. Krystal

Granted, several of them are competing against each other, and some have a few problems like a lack of popularity or of relevancy. But can we really say that they are "obscure"?

mine would be:
1. Isaac
2. Ninten
3. Grovyle (PMD)
4. Sukapon
5. Harry (Teleroboxer)
6. Skull Kid
7. Hakkun
8. Daroach
9. Black Shadow
10. Captain Syrup

sadly only Grovyle, Skull Kid and Daroach are still present in their franchise

 

[Stratos]

As you know Banjo, Kazooie and Steve came as new DLC characters in Super Smash Bros. Ultimate, this proves to us that any video game character whether from a Japanese video game company or not, can come to the Super Smash Bros. series. as a newcomer, though I didn't have to write that.

 

[Master Hero Sock-on-Rye]

1: Muddy Mole (Mole Mania)
2: Geno
3: Captain N
4: Nester
5: Waluigi
6: Skull Kid
7: Captain Rainbow
8: Chorus Kids
9: Takamaru
10: Akira Howard

But in all honesty, Muddy Mole is the only first-party character I would actually want. The other nine slots are just to please others.

 

[Wonder Smash]

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For me:

• Dr. Eggman
• Bandana Waddle Dee
• Ring Fit Trainee
• Raven Beak
• Rayman

(Technically this is 6 characters but I imagine Jimmy as Billy's alt so gameplay-wise, this would be 5 characters).

 

[Quillion]

As I've noted before, its a pity we don't have a more modest Smash Bros spin-off that focused on the more off-beat Nintendo characters and franchises. Put all the notions of certain notoriety aside, go nuts with the experimental modes, and just be unabashedly a celebration of the weird and forgotten, complete with Foreman Spike as a prominent character.

Considering even the Mario spinoffs feel so scrawny nowadays, I'm not sure how that will work out.

 

[Hadokeyblade]

As you know Banjo, Kazooie and Steve came as new DLC characters in Super Smash Bros. Ultimate, this proves to us that any video game character whether from a Japanese video game company or not, can come to the Super Smash Bros. series. as a newcomer, though I didn't have to write that.

The only real rule here is that to be playable you have to have a game in English.

Roy was put in before this was a thing and i'm pretty sure Lucas was put due to an oopsy boingo. But every other character has had releases outside of Japan.

 

[Curious Villager]

how would people feel about a fighter from ni no kuni?

I'd put Oliver in the top three as far as Level-5 characters for Smash go, considering Sakurai's fondness of JRPG characters,
I could see him be included at some point down the road if Level-5 where to ever finally start getting content in Smash...

 

[HyperSomari64]

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For me:

• Dr. Eggman
• Bandana Waddle Dee
• Ring Fit Trainee
• Raven Beak
• Rayman

• Reiji and Xiaoyu
• Elma
• Crash Bandicoot
• Ragna (sorry Sol)
• A Hyperdimension Neptunia character (whatever, anyone from that franchise is on board for me)

 

[DarthEnderX]

Honestly if I had to list 10 Nintendo characters I want in smash

1. Captain Toad/Toadette [Treasure Tracker]
2. King Hippo [Punch-Out]
Uhhhhh...

3. Ninten [Ness echo]
4. Black Shadow [Captain Falcon echo]
5. Impa [Sheik echo]
6. Galacta Knight [Meta Knight echo]
7. Black Knight [Ike echo]
8. Charizard [Pokemon Trainer echo]
9. Dixie Kong [Diddy Kong echo]
10. Octolings [Inklings echo]

 

[Hadokeyblade]

Is it wrong that i really want them to do what they did with Ganondorf and make Blaziken a Captain Falcon echo?

Like, the moveset is perfect for it. with moves like Blaze kick, Fire Punch, sky uppercut. Th most work required would be a final smash, which would undoudably be Mega evolution, it'll never happen but man, i think it could work just fine.

 

[Megadoomer]

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For me:

• Dr. Eggman
• Bandana Waddle Dee
• Ring Fit Trainee
• Raven Beak
• Rayman

• Geno (Super Mario RPG)
• Impa (Zelda - specifically the Age of Calamity version)
• Dante (from the Devil May Cry series)
• Doomguy (DOOM)
• Crash Bandicoot (Crash Bandicoot)

It was a tough call for the fifth spot, though admittedly, Geno, Dante, and Doomguy were 100% bias picks on my end. (though it did seem weird to me that the only newcomer that Capcom got in this game was a single clone character - nothing against Ken, but I figured they'd get something for DLC, whether it was Dante, Phoenix Wright, Morrigan, Amaterasu, a Monster Hunter, etc.)

 

[fogbadge]

I'd put Oliver in the top three as far as Level-5 characters for Smash go, considering Sakurai's fondness of JRPG characters,
I could see him be included at some point down the road if Level-5 where to ever finally start getting content in Smash...

id take it

 

[Troykv]

Shulk in S-tier is surprising to me.
Also Samus/Dark Samus in A-tier is based.

Oh right, I just realized Shulk is in S-Tier, I wonder if it has something to do with his infinite potential or something like that. I don't know how Shulk has performed in tournaments personally.

 

[Sucumbio]

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For me:

• Dr. Eggman
• Bandana Waddle Dee
• Ring Fit Trainee
• Raven Beak
• Rayman

Raven Beak
Bandana Waddle Dee
Master Chief
Bill Rizer
Meowscarda

 

[PeridotGX]

1. Captain Toad/Toadette [Treasure Tracker]
2. King Hippo [Punch-Out]
Uhhhhh...

3. Ninten [Ness echo]
4. Black Shadow [Captain Falcon echo]
5. Impa [Sheik echo]
6. Galacta Knight [Meta Knight echo]
7. Black Knight [Ike echo]
8. Charizard [Pokemon Trainer echo]
9. Dixie Kong [Diddy Kong echo]
10. Octolings [Inklings echo]

Darthender when the character was created after the fall of the USSR

 

[SPEN18]

Is it wrong that i really want them to do what they did with Ganondorf and make Blaziken a Captain Falcon echo?

I also think Blaziken could work really well as a CF clone. I usually wouldn't advocate for something like that but as you say it fits really well in this case.

 

[Ivander]

Is it wrong that i really want them to do what they did with Ganondorf and make Blaziken a Captain Falcon echo?

While I think Captain Falcon would be a great base for Blaziken, including Specials, I sort of wish Blaziken would take from N64 C.Falcon, where Blaziken's Forward Smash is N64 C.Falcon's Smash Kick attack, his Down-Smash would be the spinning leg sweep with an additional Fire Spin-like effect, his regular Up-Attack could be C.Falcon's old Elbow smash, etc. I think bringing some of the original attacks from the first Smash Bros. on newer characters/potential Echo Fighters would be cool to see.

 

[Quillion]

While I think Captain Falcon would be a great base for Blaziken, including Specials, I sort of wish Blaziken would take from N64 C.Falcon, where Blaziken's Forward Smash is N64 C.Falcon's Smash Kick attack, his Down-Smash would be the spinning leg sweep with an additional Fire Spin-like effect, his regular Up-Attack could be C.Falcon's old Elbow smash, etc. I think bringing some of the original attacks from the first Smash Bros. on newer characters/potential Echo Fighters would be cool to see.

Don't forget some from Melee. I'd prefer to see Bowser reverted to the monster he was back then (and give the Smash 4 anims to Dry Bowser), but maybe they can make something else work with them.

 

[MrMcNuts]

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For me:

• Dr. Eggman
• Bandana Waddle Dee
• Ring Fit Trainee
• Raven Beak
• Rayman

Refer to the top 5 on my 18 list

 

[Geno Boost]

8. Charizard [Pokemon Trainer echo]

that can simply just be Mega Charizard on his own
bringing back his rock smash and being able to play as a mega evolution Pokemon again with X having blue flame while Y has regular flame

 

[SPEN18]

seriously tho if solo Zard came back would his FS be

Mega X
Mega Y
GMax

or something else?

 

[Swamp Sensei]

seriously tho if solo Zard came back would his FS be

Mega X
Mega Y
GMax

or something else?

I think they'd go with Mega Charizard X again. Not only have they already done it in the past, but GMax might be a little hard to make.

 

[Hadokeyblade]

I think they'd go with Mega Charizard X again. Not only have they already done it in the past, but GMax might be a little hard to make.

Also Gamefreak seemingly regrets the Max forms.

They arent in the data of current Pokemon while the Mega's still have remnants of their data in games, implying they still think about Megas but just push the Max forms to the side.

 

[PeridotGX]

Also Gamefreak seemingly regrets the Max forms.

They arent in the data of current Pokemon while the Mega's still have remnants of their data in games, implying they still think about Megas but just push the Max forms to the side.

To be fair, the presence of Gigantamax inherently requires dynamax, which is a big can of worms. Bringing back megas is substantially less effort. I wouldn't be surprised that, if and when they reintroduce Mega Evolution, they retcon most Gigantamaxes into Megas to spare the design without needing to bring back the most controversial mechanic in the series.

 

[Isaac: Venus Adept]

Honestly if I had to list 10 Nintendo characters I want in smash majority of them would seem obscure and don’t have new game to promote

It's interesting, first party characters still have a wealth of options to offer in terms of fairly well known characters that are relevant like Waluigi, Toad, Bandana Waddle Dee, Ravenbeak and Dixie Kong for example.

We still have relevant new IPs with breakouts like Astral Chain and RIng Fit Adventures that are on the card to possibly receive fighters.

Even the less relevant Nintendo IP with characters like Isaac from Golden Sun and someone from Rhythm Heaven for example still have merit alone with their very dedicated fanbases and having games that sold fairly well at the peak of their series even sometimes better or on par with IPs that received Smash fighters already.

But yeah niche fighters I'm totally onboard for still, IPs like Dillons Rolling Western and Chibi-Robo despite their less popular status can still offer a lot of potential for fun fighters.

 

[Perkilator]

I just finished my moveset of Estelle Bright from Trails in the Sky.

The main gimmick of this moveset is her Craft Charge. Each special move has a charge that can be stored for later by holding B, but only one special move can be charged at a time. If you use a special move other than the one that’s charged (which is indicated by what color the orb on the HUD is), you use the normal version of that special move. Pressing Shield before the full charge resets the charging process.

Craft Colors:

• Red = Neutral Special
• Blue = Side Special
• Yellow = Up Special
• Green = Down Special

In addition, Estelle’s Bo Rod has different levels of power depending on whether she uses a poke attack or a swing attack, kinda like Sephiroth.

Spoiler: The actual moveset

 

[Hadokeyblade]

It's interesting, first party characters still have a wealth of options to offer in terms of fairly well known characters that are relevant like Waluigi, Toad, Bandana Waddle Dee, Ravenbeak and Dixie Kong for example.

We still have relevant new IPs with breakouts like Astral Chain and RIng Fit Adventures that are on the card to possibly receive fighters.

Even the less relevant Nintendo IP with characters like Isaac from Golden Sun and someone from Rhythm Heaven for example still have merit alone with their very dedicated fanbases and having games that sold fairly well at the peak of their series even sometimes better or on par with IPs that received Smash fighters already.

But yeah niche fighters I'm totally onboard for still, IPs like Dillons Rolling Western and Chibi-Robo despite their less popular status can still offer a lot of potential for fun fighters.

As a Chibi robo fan i can assure you Nintendo does not give a **** about Chibi robo and he will never be playable in smash.

Ive accepted this reality.

 

[DarthEnderX]

that can simply just be Mega Charizard on his own

Mega X is solo-Charizard's Final Smash though.

Also Gamefreak seemingly regrets the Max forms.

They arent in the data of current Pokemon while the Mega's still have remnants of their data in games, implying they still think about Megas but just push the Max forms to the side.

The Max forms just aren't as cool as Megas.

That said, I prefer the way Maxes were implemented. Because at least I can collect Gigantamax forms in my living Pokedex, because Gigantamax is tied to the Pokemon.

Mega Evolutions are tied to items, which you can't store with your Pokemon in Home. So it's impossible to maintain a Megas collection between games.

 

[Arcanir]

I feel the bigger issue with Max forms is that they were tied to Dynamax. In terms of design I don't think they're any worse than Megas, and in some ways I'd argue they're more consistent, but Dynamax was not really that popular of a feature so Max forms were brought down with it. It doesn't help that of the gimmicks it stood out the least of the four, even Terastallization seems to have made more waves with the fans.

 

[Geno Boost]

Mega X is solo-Charizard's Final Smash though.

The Max forms just aren't as cool as Megas.

That said, I prefer the way Maxes were implemented. Because at least I can collect Gigantamax forms in my living Pokedex, because Gigantamax is tied to the Pokemon.

Mega Evolutions are tied to items, which you can't store with your Pokemon in Home. So it's impossible to maintain a Megas collection between games.

Mega Charizard can use Blast Burn as a final smash which is the strongest Fire type attack

i do remember mega charizard being hyped so much in the past i do think it would be great to play as him instead of just regular charizard as an echo

 

[fogbadge]

As a Chibi robo fan i can assure you Nintendo does not give a **** about Chibi robo and he will never be playable in smash.

Ive accepted this reality.

as a chibi-robo fan i came to a very different conclusion

 

[Geno Boost]

if chibi-robo doesnt become playable in the next smash game at least they should just fix up his mii costume head

 

[Lionfranky]

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For me:

• Dr. Eggman
• Bandana Waddle Dee
• Ring Fit Trainee
• Raven Beak
• Rayman

1. Master Chief
2. Agumon
3. Lara Croft
4. Ezio Auditorre
5. Ryza

 

[fogbadge]

if chibi-robo doesnt become playable in the next smash game at least they should just fix up his mii costume head

nah that looks weird

 

[Perkilator]

Source Gaming just put out another video about their hyopthetical Smash roster and hooo boy, we got a lot of unpacking to do.

Spoiler: Roster 1 (Nantenjex)

Spoiler: Roster 2 (AShadowLink)

My biggest two issues with these rosters:

1. Many of the characters are the same ones fans already talk about (which is a shame, because some choices I can totally get behind)
2. The 3rd party series with more than one character just stick to having Echo Fighters as the second character despite Sephiroth happening

Using these rosters as a basis, what would your own look like? They don't have to be realistic in any way.

 

[Master Hero Sock-on-Rye]

I think my own roster would look like this:

1. Mario
2. Luigi
3. Peach
4. Bowser
5. Rosalina and Luma
6. Goomba
7. Donkey Kong
8. King K. Rool
9. Link
10. Zelda
11. Ganondorf
12. Samus
13. Ridley
14. Raven Beak
15. Yoshi
16. Kirby
17. King Dedede
18. Fox
19. Pikachu
20. Mewtwo
21. Charizard
22. Lucario
23. Greninja
24. Incineroar
25. Greavard
26. Ness
27. Marth
28. Ike
29. Robin
30. Corrin
31. Byleth
32. Alear (His gimmick would be based on Shulk and Joker, which is how the likes of Roy and Lucina can still get in.)
33. Pit
34. Wario
35. Olimar
36. Villager
37. Isabelle
38. Tom Nook
39. Wii Fit Trainer
40. Little Mac
41. King Hippo
42. Mii Brawler
43. Mii Swordfighter
44. Mii Gunner
45. Shulk
46. Pyra
47. Mythra
48. Elma
49. Duck Hunt (Because I wanted at least one retro character.)
50. Inkling
51. Min Min
52. Karate Joe (Rhythm Heaven)
53. Isaac (Golden Sun)
54. Sonic
55. Tails
56. Dr. Eggman
57. Mega Man
58. Zero
59. Pac-Man
60. Ryu
61. Ken
62. Cloud
63. Sephiroth
64. Bayonetta
65. Simon Belmont
66. Joker
67. Hero
68. Banjo and Kazooie
69. Terry Bogard
70. Marco Rossi
71. Steve / Alex
72. Kazuya
73. Heihachi
74. Sora
75. Q*Bert

Trimmed some fat here, added some first-party characters there, and even snuck in a Sony-owned character. And yes, Q*Bert is owned by Nintendo's gaming archrival.

Give me your thoughts, if you have any to spare.