Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[Wonder Smash]

Ah, I probably should have said "what is he doing right now in terms of making games". My bad.

He knew what you meant. He was just messing with you.

 

[CannonStreak]

He knew what you meant. He was just messing with you.

I know he was.

I just thought it could have been clearer.

But then again, maybe not.

 

[Guynamednelson]

I wonder what Sakurai is doing right now?

Well he can't be filming new videos for his YouTube channel, he said he's already filmed the finale.

That said I wonder how long those videos spend in post-production?

 

[Wonder Smash]

I know he was.

I just thought it could have been clearer.

But then again, maybe not.

You were clear enough. You already said in that same post if he was making a new game.

 

[CannonStreak]

You were clear enough. The next parts after that made sure of that.

I thought so. Thanks for that.

Anyway, just one more month before September happens when a Direct will come, or perhaps a Switch 2 reveal, maybe?

 

[smashkirby]

However from my own roster, if any of these many characters come in the next Super Smash Bros. game, that's when I'll change my roster and maybe replace them with others. I also know that some of these characters on this roster are unknown to almost anyone.
View attachment 393095

I know I've said it before, but I really am taken with your character choices here, especially the first-party ones. I mean, you don't hear too many folks talking about Pockle or Michael Anderson in the context of being playable in Smash, do you?

If I may say so, the Hornet and the Unicycle... well, if not for Fighters' Megamix, I can't say I would have imagined them being suggestions...

Jesus Christ, almost 35 million copies of Ultimate sold? It's the third best-selling game on Nintendo's most successful console, outselling all of Pokemon's individual releases?

It is very difficult to really express just how successful Ultimate has been. It has likely surpassed even the most optimistically pie-in-the-sky estimates of how well Ultimate could do. I think the most impressive thing is that Ultimate just keeps going. In an era where most games acquire the vast majority of their sales in the first couple of weeks of release, Ultimate continues to sell millions almost 3 years after receiving substantive post-launch support and almost 6 years since launch. That's also not considering Ultimate's DLC sales, which Nintendo stated also surpassed expectations back in 2019.

I think there are two big takeaways from this success:
1. The next Smash is (likely) going to look a lot like Ultimate in terms of content. A lot of focus will be placed on making the core gameplay fast but accessible while having a large cast of veterans and fan requests. Single-player content and new faces designed to promote the late Switch era will take something of a backseat.

2. The next Smash is going to have a lot of resources put into it. Obviously, this will include an astronomical budget, but I wouldn't be surprised if this comes with additional dev time. Furukawa has stated modern games simply take more time to make, Smash has historically struggled to manifest Sakurai's vision in its entirety due to dev time constraints, and there's less pressure to get a new entry out when the previous one continues to hold people's attention. I could see Nintendo's greenlighting a 4-year development period for the next Smash in the interest of, say, doing "Everyone is Here!" again while having the time to develop a handful of additional newcomers and echoes that couldn't have been added previously. That's also not going into post-launch content, which could come at a more consistent rate for a longer period of time if development is structured to support this from the outset.

I've honestly been of this mind ever since that interview regarding Mario Wonder (where the devs confirmed that they WEREN'T given a "hard-set" release date to aim for) and then looking at the likes of things like TotK, Xenoblade 3, and ESPECIALLY Metroid Prime 4.

I'll be honest, Smash getting more dev time is partially why I think the odds of EiH happening again... well, it isn't 0%. The next Smash Bros. being on a stronger console and whatnot? If they wanted to go for it, I can (at the very least) see every first-party character return, now that EVERYONE (even Young Link and Pichu) has 'updated' character data to work with.

As for third-parties, I imagine Ultimate's success has officially convinced them that Smash Bros. is a good investment in the long run.

Oooh, we're doing most wanted lists but visual? Okay, here's mine:

View attachment 393140

Likelihoods may vary, I am open to questions

While I am curious about your choices, I don't mean that in a negative way. No joke, this would be my DREAM roster for Smash 6. Bonus points if the next Smash repeated 'Everyone Is Here... Again'.

I'm especially happy to see Mona and Yuka, as well as Lip, Prince Sable, and Chibi-Robo (the lattermost I feel, really could have used a roster spot in Smash 4).

I guess realistically in my mind it's probably more accurate to call them "Fossil Fighter" or something, but I imagine T-Rex being the main character and having Tricera (though Tricera's a bit more iffy since this trio doesn't have anything like a Team Skill for a Final Smash) and Ptera kind of act as summons for certain moves (for example, Ptera using Great Vortex/Blow Away for recovery) to symbolize the Attack Zone/Support Zone dynamic present in the original and Champions, though I definitely think T-Rex could also just carry the moveset himself if need be.

Fossil Fighters is an underrated DS game. It doesn't really have a shot for playable, but the T-Rex would be amazing as an assist.

Never expected us to seriously look at Fossil Fighters for significant content here. That said, I'd love to have Hunter (the main protagonist of the first Fossil Fighters game) as a playable character, though I'm certainly not opposed Dino and Dina or Jura and Tria.

All of that being said, what would you all think if Nibbles or (for whatever reason) Rosie (from the first game) suddenly got chosen as the playable Fossil Fighters rep?

If we ever get a Pilotwings character, I'm hoping we not only get music from Pilotwings 64, but also a remix of the SNES Hang Glider theme with elements of the 64 Hang Glider theme. And more music from the original game.

I know it's a tinfoil-hat theory, but lately I've been wondering... was Pilotwings 64 dealing with some sort of legal issues at Nintendo? I mean, in addition to PW64 not being acknowledged in Smash (in any meaningful way), the game was never re-released via Virtual Console until the Switch's N64 NSO service.

What's more, PW64 WAS released in Japan, so it doesn't even have the hurdle that StarTropics and Gumshoe have to deal with. Like, aside from the fact that no character from that game has appeared as a Trophy, Spirit, or even Sticker in Brawl... we haven't even gotten MUSIC from that game.

While I'd love for PW64's Gyrocopter theme to be a song, I'd even take 'Birdman' (arguably the most well-known Pilotwings song) as a sort-of "joke" music choice.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Never expected us to seriously look at Fossil Fighters for significant content here. That said, I'd love to have Hunter (the main protagonist of the first Fossil Fighters game) as a playable character, though I'm certainly not opposed Dino and Dina or Jura and Tria.

All of that being said, what would you all think if Nibbles or (for whatever reason) Rosie (from the first game) suddenly got chosen as the playable Fossil Fighters rep?

I think Nibbles could potentially have a shot if we were to ever by some random aligning of the planets get a Fossil Fighters character? It was the only other Fossil Fighters character to get a Spirit aside from T-Rex, I just feel like T-Rex is more immediately recognizable since it's in all three games and features on the box art of all of them. Nibbles also has the issue of being from the weakest game of the three, but that's more of a personal thing lol

Realistically, an Assist Trophy or hell even just more music/collectables from the series would probably satisfy me lmao

 

[Borskaboska]

I think Nibbles could potentially have a shot if we were to ever by some random aligning of the planets get a Fossil Fighters character? It was the only other Fossil Fighters character to get a Spirit aside from T-Rex, I just feel like T-Rex is more immediately recognizable since it's in all three games and features on the box art of all of them. Nibbles also has the issue of being from the weakest game of the three, but that's more of a personal thing lol

Realistically, an Assist Trophy or hell even just more music/collectables from the series would probably satisfy me lmao

If it means anything, I think Nibbles is very cute.

Just look at this lil guy.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

If it means anything, I think Nibbles is very cute.
View attachment 393217
Just look at this lil guy.

Yeah I like Nibbles, I just wish Frontiers was generally better, which isn't his fault but kinda sours him a little for me lol

 

[SPEN18]

Never expected us to seriously look at Fossil Fighters for significant content here. That said, I'd love to have Hunter (the main protagonist of the first Fossil Fighters game) as a playable character, though I'm certainly not opposed Dino and Dina or Jura and Tria.

All of that being said, what would you all think if Nibbles or (for whatever reason) Rosie (from the first game) suddenly got chosen as the playable Fossil Fighters rep?

Yeah it's honestly, again, an underrated game for anyone looking for a "Pokemon but not Pokemon" fix.

Nibbles would honestly not be my pick for FF, because I'd prefer a character from the best-remembered first game. Rosie I would like better, but wouldn't she technically be able to work as an alt for the main protag?

On that note, if they went with the FF1 hero, would you be imagining that as a prop/summoner type character? Or a Pokemon Trainer type concept?

If they could make the size work then the T-Rex would be my choice; it's the most iconic imagery in the series IMO and I think fans would love the concept (sorry but you can't hold a candle to this).

 

[PeridotGX]

I decided to take another shot at a Smash 6 prediction roster

I didn't mean to make something basically the size of Ultimate lol. It's probably not too realistic.

 

[Undella2]

Dang, it's been a while since I've used this site, though I just came to check in and read what others were thinking about Smash 6. While I'm here, I may as well list off who'd I'd like to see, regardless of how realistic they might be.

-Isaac (Golden Sun)
-Vaati
-Scizor
-Saki Amamiya
-KOS-MOS
-Ashley (WarioWare)
-Terra Branford
-Tatsuya Suou (even if only because it'd be very funny for a character voiced by Takehito Koyasu to have a final smash involving stopping time)
-Reimu
-Sol Badguy
-Shovel Knight
-Saber (Artoria) (don't know if Fate/Stay Night'd count, though, as it technically started as a visual novel game but became an anime series...)

As for overall character roster size, I'd guess maybe around, if not a bit higher than, smash 4's character count, though that's based on nothing but my gut feeling really.

 

[Laniv]

I decided to take another shot at a Smash 6 prediction roster
View attachment 393225
I didn't mean to make something basically the size of Ultimate lol. It's probably not too realistic.

Oh thank goodness, someone else who thinks Papyrus has a decent shot at making it

 

[Borskaboska]

Dang, it's been a while since I've used this site, though I just came to check in and read what others were thinking about Smash 6. While I'm here, I may as well list off who'd I'd like to see, regardless of how realistic they might be.

-Isaac (Golden Sun)
-Vaati
-Scizor
-Saki Amamiya
-KOS-MOS
-Ashley (WarioWare)
-Terra Branford
-Tatsuya Suou (even if only because it'd be very funny for a character voiced by Takehito Koyasu to have a final smash involving stopping time)
-Reimu
-Sol Badguy
-Shovel Knight
-Saber (Artoria) (don't know if Fate/Stay Night'd count, though, as it technically started as a visual novel game but became an anime series...)

As for overall character roster size, I'd guess maybe around, if not a bit higher than, smash 4's character count, though that's based on nothing but my gut feeling really.

Scisor and Vaati are some good picks. Vaati used to be one of my top picks, but there are so many other zelda characters that would probably get in first that I dropped him. Glad someone is keeping the hope alive.
As someone who knows nothing about the series, what makes saber different from other swordies?

 

[Diddy Kong]

Oh yeah, Nintendo released a new Echoes of Wisdom trailer earlier today:

I guess the only way I can make this Smash-relevant is…could the Echo mechanic from this game replace the Phantom Slash?

Would hope so yeah. It could basically do the same thing, but more fleshed out. A RNG type of attack, like Hero. It would fit her nicely. The Bind thing as a grab is also a cute idea maybe.

In general, ranged grabs like telekinesis for characters as say, Mewtwo, Ness and Zelda wouldn't be a bad idea.

 

[Undella2]

Scisor and Vaati are some good picks. Vaati used to be one of my top picks, but there are so many other zelda characters that would probably get in first that I dropped him. Glad someone is keeping the hope alive.
As someone who knows nothing about the series, what makes saber different from other swordies?

For Vaati... well, I mainly like him for being a villain (need more of those in Smash), not being an alternate variant in some way of an existing zelda character (Impa would probably be very similar to Sheik, for instance), and being from a Zelda game I have more nostalgia for... for example, while Skull Kid may be much more likely to be added, I've somehow never played Majora's Mask... so I don't really have any feelings regarding the prospect of them being included one way or the other. Also just like Vaati's aesthetics. That's a big part of it too, honestly.

I suppose him sorta being a 2.5 party character in some respects as Capcom helped to make Minish Cap isn't helping his chances any, though...

As for Saber, though she's one of the character's on that list I've thought less about, I'd think she'd be a sort of "swordie with magic", though with the magic tied more to the actual sword attacks themselves than to separate "spell" attacks, if that makes sense. For instance, in Fate's story/lore, she has the ability to both use sword beam type attacks and also make her sword invisible, making it hard for opponents to accurately judge its range. Who knows how an "invisible sword" ability would be translated into a fighting game like smash, though...

I'd like Saber moreso for being visual novel rep, though. Well, visual novel rep that isn't Phoenix Wright. Nothing against him, just haven't played his games and would care about Artoria more. Also, Saber/Artoria would be another female character for what that's worth, too, in addition to being a very out-of-left-field pick.

 

[osby]

-Saber (Artoria) (don't know if Fate/Stay Night'd count, though, as it technically started as a visual novel game but became an anime series...)

So did Pokemon (minus the visual novel part) and it's still in Smash.

As long as Fate keeps getting new games (which it does), I don't see an issue.

 

[Undella2]

So did Pokemon (minus the visual novel part) and it's still in Smash.

As long as Fate keeps getting new games (which it does), I don't see an issue.

Now that I think about it... didn't they add Ash-Greninja (which specifically started as a pokemon anime thing I assume) as a visual reference during Greninja's final smash in ultimate?

for what that's worth, too

 

[osby]

Now that I think about it... didn't they add Ash-Greninja (which specifically started as a pokemon anime thing I assume) as a visual reference during Greninja's final smash in ultimate?

for what that's worth, too

Yeah, Cloud also got his Advent Children costume.

Animated adaptations aren't detriments to characters' chances in Smash.

 

[ninjahmos]

I may or may not have said this before, and I doubt they'd actually do it, but if Snake makes it into the next Smash game, I'm hoping they not only add more music from the Metal Gear series, but maybe some music from Snatcher and Policenauts.

Oh, and maybe some music from the Zone of the Enders series too.

 

[fogbadge]

I decided to take another shot at a Smash 6 prediction roster
View attachment 393225
I didn't mean to make something basically the size of Ultimate lol. It's probably not too realistic.

well you've definitely got some that are more personal wants that actually likely so you're tight it's not realistic

 

[Gengar84]

Yeah, Cloud also got his Advent Children costume.

Animated adaptations aren't a detriment to characters' chances in Smash.

I’m curious if we got Jinx or Vi in Smash how much they’d lean into their Arcane appearance and personality or stick strictly to the mainline League of Legends portrayals. I heard that they’re planning to weave Arcane into the main canon of the games now and they’ve used their Arcane appearances in Fortnite and 2XKO. Vi is almost a completely different person in Arcane than what I’ve seen from the main games.

 

[BritishGuy54]

So, what characters are you all expecting to change their designs for the next game?

• The Triforce usually gets a makeover from game to game, but I could see only getting his TOTK look this time around.
• could take on either her Dread or Prime 4 look.
• will likely receive his Future Connected outfit as an alt.
• I would not rule out getting the Splatoon 3 Inkling design, or even Octoling as alternate costumes.

 

[Gengar84]

So, what characters are you all expecting to change their designs for the next game?

• The Triforce usually gets a makeover from game to game, but I could see only getting his TOTK look this time around.
• could take on either her Dread or Prime 4 look.
• will likely receive his Future Connected outfit as an alt.
• I would not rule out getting the Splatoon 3 Inkling design, or even Octoling as alternate costumes.

I’m really hoping we can at least keep Ganondorf’s Ultimate design as an alt. That’s my favorite design for the character. I want to see more full alt outfit models in place of palate swaps. There’s so much untapped potential for alternate costumes I feel Smash isn’t making enough use of. Shulk and Samus are two big examples of characters with a ton of potential for a full set of unique costumes. I’d love if the Zelda cast could bring back their designs from older titles as alts.

 

[osby]

So, what characters are you all expecting to change their designs for the next game?

• The Triforce usually gets a makeover from game to game, but I could see only getting his TOTK look this time around.
• could take on either her Dread or Prime 4 look.
• will likely receive his Future Connected outfit as an alt.
• I would not rule out getting the Splatoon 3 Inkling design, or even Octoling as alternate costumes.

• I can actually see the entire Zelda and Ganondorf getting their BotW/TotK designs this time to match Link and Sheik
• Ryu might get a SFVI alt
• Bayonetta will probably get her Bayo 3 look as her default costume
• Peach can get a costume from Showtime to match Mario's new ones but who knows

 

[TheLamerGamer]

Dang, it's been a while since I've used this site, though I just came to check in and read what others were thinking about Smash 6. While I'm here, I may as well list off who'd I'd like to see, regardless of how realistic they might be.

-Isaac (Golden Sun)
-Vaati
-Scizor
-Saki Amamiya
-KOS-MOS
-Ashley (WarioWare)
-Terra Branford
-Tatsuya Suou (even if only because it'd be very funny for a character voiced by Takehito Koyasu to have a final smash involving stopping time)
-Reimu
-Sol Badguy
-Shovel Knight
-Saber (Artoria) (don't know if Fate/Stay Night'd count, though, as it technically started as a visual novel game but became an anime series...)

As for overall character roster size, I'd guess maybe around, if not a bit higher than, smash 4's character count, though that's based on nothing but my gut feeling really.

OK why am I seeing multiple people wanting Tatsuya now, that's my gimmick

Genuinely really want him even if he's never happening though, honestly nice to see I'm not the only one.

And that's a good list of characters generally, would be really happy with pretty much any of them

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

So, what characters are you all expecting to change their designs for the next game?

• The Triforce usually gets a makeover from game to game, but I could see only getting his TOTK look this time around.
• could take on either her Dread or Prime 4 look.
• will likely receive his Future Connected outfit as an alt.
• I would not rule out getting the Splatoon 3 Inkling design, or even Octoling as alternate costumes.

Well let's see:

Spoiler: Wall of text incoming!

• will definitely be getting his long hair, archaic tunic, and...prosthetic arm? Is it a prosthetic if it's literally just someone else's arm?
• Either the Metroid Dread or Metroid Prime suit designs could be used, it's just a question of whether they'll go with the most recent mainline title or the most recent title period, since Metroid Prime 4 is technically a spin-off.
• & are also a bit hard to pin down. The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom is the first game in a while that features all three, and it seems to be their most popular versions at that. On the other hand, this version of Zelda has already been passed up on for not fitting the move set, and this version of Ganondorf could easily have the same thing happen. While I believe the new Zelda could easily get in on reevaluation, if either one falls through, I think both will stay as they are.
• WarioWare: Move It! gave him a new design, but I have a feeling it will be ignored.
• Sonic's design fluctuates a lot, so it's possible it will do so here too.
• I highly doubt we'll be getting his Club Penguin design, or even his coat from Kirby and the Forgotten Land. We might get a pallet swap with those colors though...maybe.
• might get their proportions from their new games, but unless there's pressure on Sakurai to do so, it's probably not likely to happen.
• will probably stay the same even though he should definitely change.
• might receive a makeover if they decide they want to change their appearance each game. At the very least, they might change up the faces and hairstyles for each "default" Mii.
• Shulk's design isn't changing, but there's a few different options for new alternate costumes. Perhaps something like 1, 3, and 5 being his original design, 2, 4, and 6 being his Future Connected design, 7 being his Future Redeemed design, and 8 being nakey.
• might receive their new designs as alternate costumes, but due to the focus on Street Fighter 2, neither will be their default costumes.
• might receive her Bayonetta 3 outfit, but how that affects her current alts I dunno.
• may receive new designs on their alternate costumes to update with the new games. Perhaps more hairstyles will be included as well.
• will likely have all of the Steve and Alex variant costumes replaced with some of the new Default Skin characters. Steve and Alex themselves will have updates to their models, adding depth to their sleeves.

Also, I don't think Model Link will be replacing Toon Link because the diorama art style hasn't really been established like the Toon art style had in Super Smash Bros. Brawl's development.

EDIT: Actually, Bayonetta 3's version of the character is completely separate from her Bayonetta and Bayonetta 2 designs (technically those designs are separate characters now as well, but that's a retcon so meh). Would it be possible for them to add the new design as an alternate costume, or would it have to come at the expense of the other two due to differences in ability set?
EDIT EDIT: Never mind. My main concern was Infernal Climax, and it would be super simple to just implement a different cutscene for the new design if need be.

 

[Borskaboska]

Not for her main costume, I really want a samus alt with the cloak she wore in the metroid manga

Spoiler

 

[Diddy Kong]

Honestly am starting to think I much rather want a Ultimate Deluxe than a reboot. A reboot isn't needed, moveset overhauls maybe, but they got the thing right for the most part. Just not for the older characters. True to source material is a very very nice concept for the characters who have it, and it's a bit too stark of a contrast compared to characters in which this approach was almost avoided with intention, as say, Mewtwo, Ganondorf, Samus to some extent, you name it.

 

[Noipoi]

Honestly am starting to think I much rather want a Ultimate Deluxe than a reboot. A reboot isn't needed, moveset overhauls maybe, but they got the thing right for the most part. Just not for the older characters. True to source material is a very very nice concept for the characters who have it, and it's a bit too stark of a contrast compared to characters in which this approach was almost avoided with intention, as say, Mewtwo, Ganondorf, Samus to some extent, you name it.

I talk a lot of **** on Ultimate Deluxe (mostly to annoy Darth) but I honestly wouldn’t mind too much. It’s the only way Incineroar is sticking around.

But my question is if the next console is backwards compatible, why pay another 60$ for a game I already own and can still play on my new Switch? A couple new characters isn’t gonna cut it, I’d need at least one big new feature. Not to mention that existing assist trophies (like Waluigi) would immediately have no shot at being playable, which is a let down.

Point is I’d need a little more than the basics to get really excited about an Ultimate port. I wonder what wacky new thing a Deluxe Edition could do to set it apart.

 

[Undella2]

I talk a lot of **** on Ultimate Deluxe (mostly to annoy Darth) but I honestly wouldn’t mind too much. It’s the only way Incineroar is sticking around.

But my question is if the next console is backwards compatible, why pay another 60$ for a game I already own and can still play on my new Switch? A couple new characters isn’t gonna cut it, I’d need at least one big new feature. Not to mention that existing assist trophies (like Waluigi) would immediately have no shot at being playable, which is a let down.

Point is I’d need a little more than the basics to get really excited about an Ultimate port. I wonder what wacky new thing a Deluxe Edition could do to set it apart.

I mean they could always just... replace Waluigi's assist trophy with a playable character, no? (which would need them to go through all the spirit battles and revise them to account for this change, but I'd imagine that's within the realm of possibility if they needed to do so)

 

[Noipoi]

I mean they could always just... replace Waluigi's assist trophy with a playable character, no? (which would need them to go through all the spirit battles and revise them to account for this change, but I'd imagine that's within the realm of possibility if they needed to do so)

Yeah they could do that. They totally could.

But would they?

 

[Louie G.]

Yeah they could do that. They totally could.

View attachment 393242

But would they?

Honestly, port or not, I think letting decisions that were made nearly 10 years ago now continue to dictate and limit the flexibility of the roster would be ridiculous and I do think they would be willing to lighten up on that. If we stagnated that hard and maintained Ultimate's status quo into the indeterminate future I'm not even sure I'd be that interested in discussing the roster anymore.

Just to make it clear, I don't really want Ultimate Deluxe or think it's going to happen. But if it did, I don't think this would matter. I'd even say if they did add someone like Waluigi, they might just keep the AT in for posterity and simply not have it appear when they are in the match.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Honestly am starting to think I much rather want a Ultimate Deluxe than a reboot

Starting? Because it feels like that's already been the direction you think Smash will go.

Honestly, port or not, I think letting decisions that were made nearly 10 years ago now continue to dictate and limit the flexibility of the roster would be ridiculous and I do think they would be willing to lighten up on that. If we stagnated that hard and maintained Ultimate's status quo into the indeterminate future I'm not even sure I'd be that interested in discussing the roster anymore.

Just to make it clear, I don't really want Ultimate Deluxe or think it's going to happen. But if it did, I don't think this would matter. I'd even say if they did add someone like Waluigi, they might just keep the AT in for posterity and simply not have it appear when they are in the match.

My answer to the question of "how is Smash going to have its own BCP without a mobile game" (which is what I'd rather have than having to pay $60 or even $70 for SSBU again) was pretty much AT promos with attack animations lifted from the playable roster anyway. It's essentially how Wolf was made, but en masse, and instead of editing Fox's model to be edgy they're doubling the polygons on Waluigi's. And hopefully making the specials not just variants of the base fighter's.

I am well aware that this is a long shot. Especially after the June Direct had nothing Smash, so now the damn thing's a longer shot than one end of the known universe to the other.

 

[Gengar84]

I think I want something in between a deluxe version and a complete new game. A straight port or mildly updated deluxe version would be kind of pointless if the Switch 2 is backwards compatible. However, a completely new game would likely result in a lot more cuts than I’d be happy with. If they just used Ultimate as a starting point and added as much new content as a traditional entry would have, that would be perfect. I know that might not be the most likely but I’d love to see as much new content as we can while not losing too much in the process. I feel like it’s actually not as impossible as it sounds since all the classic content was already updated for Ultimate so they shouldn’t have to do that again. We’ll see though.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Honestly am starting to think I much rather want a Ultimate Deluxe than a reboot. A reboot isn't needed, moveset overhauls maybe, but they got the thing right for the most part. Just not for the older characters. True to source material is a very very nice concept for the characters who have it, and it's a bit too stark of a contrast compared to characters in which this approach was almost avoided with intention, as say, Mewtwo, Ganondorf, Samus to some extent, you name it.

Thinking about this gives me a few questions: What game shows off this shift in character design? Are there a few examples of this going too far or are most of the characters past a certain point too wacky in comparison to other members of the cast? In comparison to other fighting games, are Super Smash Bros.'s character designs weirder/gimmckier on average?

I'm very curious as to what everyone thinks.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Thinking about this gives me a few questions: What game shows off this shift in character design? Are there a few examples of this going too far or are most of the characters past a certain point too wacky in comparison to other members of the cast? In comparison to other fighting games, are Super Smash Bros.'s character designs weirder/gimmckier on average?

I'm very curious as to what everyone thinks.

Guilty Gear Strive kinda has "SSBU DLC syndrome" going on, in which all the base game characters and DLC veterans are simplified, but DLC newcomers feel like pre-Strive GG characters, and then there's Asuka.

 

[Louie G.]

I'm exhausted whenever this black or white Ultimate Deluxe vs Reboot conversation comes up time and time again. Like these are our only choices.

The correct answer is somewhere in the middle. There's no reason for a reboot, but Ultimate post-DLC has an unsustainable amount of content, copyright webs and character balance. Like many other fighting games and like Smash had done in every game before Ultimate, cuts are necessary to preserve development time for new content. After Ultimate banked so hard on celebrating nostalgia and the series' 20 year history, the most sensible step forward is to prioritize the new content that Ultimate had to sacrifice in order to achieve this.

If / when we see cuts, they will be more substantial than they've ever been. It makes sense by nature of what Ultimate was and how massive this roster has become after two DLC passes. But even 20 or 30 cuts does not mean the series is rebooting. That's quite literally the amount of characters you would need to cut in order to make room for a normal amount of newcomers and reach a total equivalent to Ultimate's base roster. Which Sakurai has already stated was a pretty remarkable amount of characters to be able to work with in the first place. But that's not a "reboot" - it's making space. Every fighting game does this!

On a personal level, yet another Smash game with the same sterile movesets and superfluous legacy content over fresh new ideas will begin to reach a breaking point. Ultimate is a celebration of everything the series stands for, and it's great. Now that we did that, we can move forward. "Everyone is Here again" is not going to cut it for me over updating 20 year old veteran movesets, providing a fun and varied spread of NEW stages and introducing an amount of newcomers that allows us wiggle room for some of the wackier, inspired first party choices that we've been missing for a little while now.

If this is neglected in favor of pacifying everyone and avoiding meaningful progress then I'd be concerned about where Smash is heading.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Guilty Gear Strive kinda has "SSBU DLC syndrome" going on, in which all the base game characters and DLC veterans are simplified, but DLC newcomers feel like pre-Strive GG characters, and then there's Asuka.

Do you think the new moves for the base roster helped in that regard?

 

[Gengar84]

I'm exhausted whenever this black or white Ultimate Deluxe vs Reboot conversation comes up time and time again. Like these are our only choices.

The correct answer is somewhere in the middle. There's no reason for a reboot, but Ultimate post-DLC has an unsustainable amount of content, copyright webs and character balance. Like many other fighting games and like Smash had done in every game before Ultimate, cuts are necessary to preserve development time for new content. After Ultimate banked so hard on celebrating nostalgia and the series' 20 year history, the most sensible step forward is to prioritize the new content that Ultimate had to sacrifice in order to achieve this.

If / when we see cuts, they will be more substantial than they've ever been. It makes sense by nature of what Ultimate was and how massive this roster has become after two DLC passes. But even 20 or 30 cuts does not mean the series is rebooting. That's quite literally the amount of characters you would need to cut in order to make room for a normal amount of newcomers and reach a total equivalent to Ultimate's base roster. Which Sakurai has already stated was a pretty remarkable amount of characters to be able to work with in the first place. But that's not a "reboot" - it's making space. Every fighting game does this!

On a personal level, yet another Smash game with the same sterile movesets and superfluous legacy content over fresh new ideas will begin to reach a breaking point. Ultimate is a celebration of everything the series stands for, and it's great. Now that we did that, we can move forward. "Everyone is Here again" is not going to cut it for me over updating 20 year old veteran movesets, providing a fun and varied spread of NEW stages and introducing an amount of newcomers that allows us wiggle room for some of the wackier, inspired first party choices that we've been missing for a little while now.

If this is neglected in favor of pacifying everyone and avoiding meaningful progress then I'd be concerned about where Smash is heading.

Yeah, that’s basically exactly what I was trying to say but you said it better. I think it’s possible that we could get something closer to a best of both worlds with the next game. I’m expecting some number of cuts but as long as we get around that same number of newcomers to make up for them I think I’d be happy. Though that does partially depend on who is cut and who we get specifically.