Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[pupNapoleon]

So I'm guessing if Nintendo is part of the Summer Fest's later phases, they will only show their 1st party titles with the future 3rd party games coming to Switch being announced in the other streams, which would line up with the Insider's words.

It's four months long- if games arent revealed in that general time frame, it's probably unlikely to happen this year.

 

[Garteam]

All I can think when reading about Joker's ponytail bones are those boneless pizza videos from a few years ago.

 

[King Sonnn DeDeDoo]

All I can think when reading about Joker's ponytail bones are those boneless pizza videos from a few years ago.

Let me get that Joker hair

B O N E L E S S

 

[TheCJBrine]

I think the Jane thing was likely just a scrapped Kasumi alt. or even a girl-outfit Joker, since it really was just part of Joker’s datamined costume data that got removed from the data soon afterwards (it may have even been in Plant’s release before Joker, I mean Brave was found early on before Hero was even announced; actually yeah it was found before Joker released and wasn’t there when he was, I remember some people wondering about it after his release as, before then, they thought he may get a girl alt./Kasumi herself).

We could get a Kasumi echo (though that sounds like it wouldn’t fit too well with what some people have said (sorry I don’t know about Persona well at all, I just like Jack Frost)) but personally I’m not expecting anymore echos even if Gooigi and such would be very cool.

The Jane data is also from before Pass 2, and potentially more echoes, were even planned.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

While we can speculate forever on what the hell Jane meant, I DO find it interesting that Yodasumi's only significant differences are a shotgun/rifle instead of a pistol, which works for an echo, and a rapier instead of a knife, which needs significantly more work around it to the point of being less Echo-y than Ken

 

[Hinata]

The most interesting part about Jane Hairbones is that the art director for Persona 5 has stated in an interview that Kasumi's Phantom Thief outfit was deliberately designed to look like a female version of Joker's.

 

[kirbsmash]

The most interesting part about Jane Hairbones is that the art director for Persona 5 has stated in an interview that Kasumi's Phantom Thief outfit was deliberately designed to look like a female version of Joker's.

Yeah, they explained WHY ingame; in short, she likes his idea of rebellion.

 

[SnowClaws]

Only a month left until the ARMS character reveal in June. So, was there any discussion on the ARMS character being a duo instead of solo something akin to Ice Climbers? Remember ARMS is not just a 1 vs 1 fighting game, it can also be a 2 vs 2 fighting game. If not here is my idea:

In ARMS, there is a game mode called Team Fight in which two ARMS characters are tethered to each other by either a green or orange thread. These two characters are limited in their movement and attacks depending on who their partner is. As such there is always conflicts in which the player have to worked with their partner in order to defeat the other team. Now, this game mode is hated in the ARMS community, but it can a another way for a potential gimmick for a ARMS character in Smash. A ARMS duo comes with six ARMS (three ARMS for each pair), their own special ability, and double the amount of attack distance. The disadvantage of the ARMS duo gimmick is they are tethered together and is restricted by their partner movement and/or maybe their partner attack interrupt the player's attack or grab animation, etc.

The reason for why a ARMS duo can happened is because last week, there was a Trails of Mana Spirit Event in which two characters can be treated as one Spirit. A ARMS duo can do the same thing as the Trails of Mana Spirits by being treating as one Spirit. Also, since Rex & Pyra is a possible Smash candidate, and they too are a another characters that could tethered to one or another. For context, in Xenoblade Chronicles 2, there is a concept called Driver & Blade. Basically, a Blade is a weapon-like being that share their ability/weapon toward their Driver, and the Driver is the only person that allows the Blade to manifest their ability/weapon. A Driver & Blade are tethered together, so when they fight together, they share the same fate. If Rex & Pyra could be tethered to one or another, then it isn't strange for a ARMS duo doing something similar.

Lastly, who are the ARMS duo:

Spoiler: From the Team Fight menu

Spoiler: From the official Nintendo ARMS page

The two ARMS screenshots

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

the jane wars are over

Noipoi chill

Noipoi chill the jane wars are over

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Only a month left until the ARMS character reveal in June. So, was there any discussion on the ARMS character being a duo instead of solo something akin to Ice Climbers? Remember ARMS is not just a 1 vs 1 fighting game, it can also be a 2 vs 2 fighting game. If not here is my idea:

In ARMS, there is a game mode called Team Fight in which two ARMS characters are tethered to each other by either a green or orange thread. These two characters are limited in their movement and attacks depending on who their partner is. As such there is always conflicts in which the player have to worked with their partner in order to defeat the other team. Now, this game mode is hated in the ARMS community, but it can a another way for a potential gimmick for a ARMS character in Smash. A ARMS duo comes with six ARMS (three ARMS for each pair), their own special ability, and double the amount of attack distance. The disadvantage of the ARMS duo gimmick is they are tethered together and is restricted by their partner movement and/or maybe their partner attack interrupt the player's attack or grab animation, etc.

The reason for why a ARMS duo can happened is because last week, there was a Trails of Mana Spirit Event in which two characters can be treated as one Spirit. A ARMS duo can do the same thing as the Trails of Mana Spirits by being treating as one Spirit. Also, since Rex & Pyra is a possible Smash candidate, and they too are a another characters that could tethered to one or another. For context, in Xenoblade Chronicles 2, there is a concept called Driver & Blade. Basically, a Blade is a weapon-like being that share their ability/weapon toward their Driver, and the Driver is the only person that allows the Blade to manifest their ability/weapon. A Driver & Blade are tethered together, so when they fight together, they share the same fate. If Rex & Pyra could be tethered to one or another, then it isn't strange for a ARMS duo doing something similar.

You don't control two characters at once in the game tho-

...Shut up! That's not what I meant!

 

[Ben Holt]

I don't really care too much but I made a roster of characters I think have a good chance for DLC I guess

Some of the picks may be surprising, others not really
View attachment 270783

Top- First parties
Middle- Third-parties
Bottom- Echoes (Probably won't happen lol)

Note: Spring-Man is just there as a general ARMS character cause I was too lazy to add a generic icon I guess idk

Please go nice on me

Don't you DARE put Dixie with the Echoes.
But you missed Proto Man, Ms. Pac-Man, Dry Bowser, Jeanne, Shadow, and Funky Kong in the easy Echo Fighters.

 

[DarthEnderX]

Oh, I didn't know I didn't play games at all. Thanks for the update.

Now, see, you completely misunderstood.

When I say, "those are either people who don't play games at all, or are basically doing a hyperbolic "Literal, WHO?!" with extra steps." I'm not trying to say you aren't a gamer.

I'm saying I. don't. BELIEVE. you. if you say you haven't heard of Dragon Quest or Yakuza. And you aren't going to convince me otherwise. If someone on a video game message board says that they've never heard of one of those franchises, I will think they are a liar, forever.

I like all of this gatekeeping we do to make sure that only the people who follow multiple games and their genres are eligible to like characters, whereas the rest of us are just brainless yokels.

That's people who are trying to gatekeep THEMSELVES, by feigning ignorance. And I deny their gatekeeping by disbelieving their crap.

Itegaki was a wild guy. From some of the things I read about him, he pretty much has a rockstar persona and isn't afraid to speak what's on his mind.

Thing about that is...the rockstar persona is pretty insufferable. And it's doubly insufferable from someone who isn't actually a rockstar.

Honestly, if there was an Echo Pass, Kasumi is the only one even remotely on my radar for it.

I can think of, like, a dozen characters more likely to get an Echo than Joker. Like:

10e. Ninten [Ness]
11e. Black Shadow [Captain Falcon]
16e. Impa [Sheik]
27e. Galacta Knight or Dark Meta Knight[Meta Knight]
31e. Liquid Snake [Snake]
32e. Black Knight [Ike]
36e. Dixie Kong [Diddy Kong]
38e. Shadow [Sonic]
46e. Bass or Protoman [Megaman]
61e. Zack [Cloud]
63e. Jeanne [Bayonetta]
64e. Octolings [Inklings]

 

[Ben Holt]

From now on, everyone who suggests that Dixie should be an echo of Diddy is going straight to the Gulags.

 

[Fedesgraz]

Monokuma for smash!

 

[7NATOR]

From now on, everyone who suggests that Dixie should be an echo of Diddy is going straight to the Gulags.

Hey if you suggest Shadow can be an Echo, then Dixie can Fit right in.

 

[Nikkaicon]

I expect Reimu to participate in the 7th installment. Because there is this tweet.
https://twitter.com/ReimuForSmash/status/1254952050854592514?s=19

 

[Ben Holt]

Hey if you suggest Shadow can be an Echo, then Dixie can Fit right in.

No. Shadow in every canon Sonic game is literally a clone of Sonic from his conception in Sonic Adventure 2 to his most recent appearance in Sonic Forces.
Clone in Adventure 2. Clone in Heroes. Clone of his Heroes moveset in Shadow the Hedgehog. Clone in 06. Clone in Rivals. Didn't exist in Unleashed, Colors, or Lost World. And his boss fight in Generations was a copy of his Adventure 2 fight.
Dixie has had a different moveset from Diddy in DKC2, DKC3, and Tropical Freeze.
I think the most practical Echo Fighters are characters like Shadow that were literally clones in their source games. Ironically, Luigi fits this definition, but this fits for Cranky Kong, Proto Man, Ms. Pac-Man, Jeanne, Zack Fair, Gooigi, Dry Bowser, Coco Bandicoot, etc.

Though if it makes you feel better, my ideal Shadow moveset is a Chrom-style Echo where Shadow's Up-B is Mewtwo's teleport and his Down-B is Bayonetta's Witch Time (but it's Chaos Control).

 

[osby]

No. Shadow in every canon Sonic game is literally a clone of Sonic from his conception in Sonic Adventure 2 to his most recent appearance in Sonic Forces.
Clone in Adventure 2. Clone in Heroes. Clone of his Heroes moveset in Shadow the Hedgehog. Clone in 06. Clone in Rivals. Didn't exist in Unleashed, Colors, or Lost World. And his boss fight in Generations was a copy of his Adventure 2 fight.
Dixie has had a different moveset from Diddy in DKC2, DKC3, and Tropical Freeze.
I think the most practical Echo Fighters are characters like Shadow that were literally clones in their source games. Ironically, Luigi fits this definition, but this fits for Cranky Kong, Proto Man, Ms. Pac-Man, Jeanne, Zack Fair, Gooigi, Dry Bowser, Coco Bandicoot, etc.

Though if it makes you feel better, my ideal Shadow moveset is a Chrom-style Echo where Shadow's Up-B is Mewtwo's teleport and his Down-B is Bayonetta's Witch Time (but it's Chaos Control).

We have plenty of clone characters in Smash that are not clones in their home games so I'm not sure how you get to arbitrarily decide which characters can and cannot be echoes. Dixie can (not should or must) be an echo of Diddy because of the similarity between their designs and frames.

Similarly, Shadow has plenty of abilities Sonic does not have (which can be seen from some of the examples you listed), so he can be a semi-unique character similar to Wolf or Lucas.

You have every right to support a fully unique Dixie but why tell people off for thinking otherwise? It's not like what we talk about here will actually affect the outcome.

 

[Jerry98]

From now on, everyone who suggests that Dixie should be an echo of Diddy is going straight to the Gulags.

I don't understand why people say she should be Diddy's echo... Dixie really deserves to be a full character!

 

[7NATOR]

No. Shadow in every canon Sonic game is literally a clone of Sonic from his conception in Sonic Adventure 2 to his most recent appearance in Sonic Forces.
Clone in Adventure 2. Clone in Heroes. Clone of his Heroes moveset in Shadow the Hedgehog. Clone in 06. Clone in Rivals. Didn't exist in Unleashed, Colors, or Lost World. And his boss fight in Generations was a copy of his Adventure 2 fight.
Dixie has had a different moveset from Diddy in DKC2, DKC3, and Tropical Freeze.
I think the most practical Echo Fighters are characters like Shadow that were literally clones in their source games. Ironically, Luigi fits this definition, but this fits for Cranky Kong, Proto Man, Ms. Pac-Man, Jeanne, Zack Fair, Gooigi, Dry Bowser, Coco Bandicoot, etc.

Though if it makes you feel better, my ideal Shadow moveset is a Chrom-style Echo where Shadow's Up-B is Mewtwo's teleport and his Down-B is Bayonetta's Witch Time (but it's Chaos Control).

Wrong about 06 first of all, and he had more of an arsenal in Shadow the Hedgehog than Heroes. Every Character was a clone of Sonic in the Rivals games

Sonic alot of the time has a tendency to have Characters copy each other. SA2 is the same game that had Chaos, Rouge, Knuckles, and Tikal all play the exact same. same with stuff like Metal, Amy, Shadow, and Sonic.

I think people also disregard the outside gameplay factors. Stuff that may not be used in gameplay all the time are still used in Smash movesets. Joker never used a tether to my knowledge in game, and he's a 3rd party character. We're representing characters in the game, so all aspects of the character need to be represented. even if Shadow doesn't always use his Chaos powers, he usually uses them in Bosses or Cutscenes and he's the only character that uses some form of Chaos Control in the Series. he's associated with that

Sonic's movements in Smash don't fit Shadow too much. Some could be re-used but others would have to be changed more dramatically. that's for his normals

if you want Chaos Control to be Accurate to how it is in home game, It would need to be changed from Mewtwo's teleport. Shadow uses his Teleport more offensively, kind of like a DBZ Character.

Dixie may have different moveset from Diddy, but how much of that difference translates to Smash. I don't think Donkey Kong has that large of a moveset pool. you see DK and Diddy have to have made up moves. I could see Dixie using her hair for normals, but if you're willing to disregard differences in other characters and call them easy to implement, Dixie could that way too. She could just have her Hair up B and call it a day

I do acknowledge Shadow could be echo, but so could Dixie. I don't think both would end up as echoes, otherwise i think they would be added already, but that's just me

 

[osby]

Joker never used a tether to my knowledge in game, and he's a 3rd party character. We're representing characters in the game, so all aspects of the character need to be represented. even if Shadow doesn't always use his Chaos powers, he usually uses them in Bosses or Cutscenes and he's the only character that uses some form of Chaos Control in the Series. he's associated with that

I agree with your overall point but Joker uses his grappling hook extensively during gameplay in Persona 5 Royal. A more accurate example would be his other up special.

 

[Captain Shwampy]

No. Shadow in every canon Sonic game is literally a clone of Sonic from his conception

Wrong

 

[AEMehr]

I don't really care too much but I made a roster of characters I think have a good chance for DLC I guess

Some of the picks may be surprising, others not really
View attachment 270783

Top- First parties
Middle- Third-parties
Bottom- Echoes (Probably won't happen lol)

Note: Spring-Man is just there as a general ARMS character cause I was too lazy to add a generic icon I guess idk

Please go nice on me

Sakura and Gunvolt? Really? Interesting pulls, any reasons specifically for Sakura? I saw a little bit on Gunvolt a couple pages, so I'm curious for the thought process behind her.

 

[Ben Holt]

Wrong

Shadow in every canon Sonic game is literally a clone of Sonic from his conception in Sonic Adventure 2 to his most recent appearance in Sonic Forces.
Clone in Adventure 2.

 

[Captain Shwampy]

Sonic Battle is canon

Takes place directly after Shadow the Hedgehog and follows with the plot of Advance 3 and Rush games.
Sonic Rush directly references SA2 with Blaze sneaking through a G.U.N Base.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Just remember that the term spin-off refers to a genre change. It has nothing to do with whether it's canon or not.

And the Sonic Advance games are not just canon, but they aren't a genre change either(unlike Sonic Battle). They literally cannot work without Emerl from Sonic Battle existing, and well, see above for the rest. There's quite a few Sonic games, and a good chunk of them are canon. There's actually few that don't outright fit into the storyline(Spinball has nothing to do with the regular games, same with Mean Bean Machine, as both are based upon the cartoon stuff in general, and not even the same shows).

 

[Captain Shwampy]

All games from the Dreamcast Era are pretty clear in that they all take place in the same universe.
Adventure 1 even has kid tell you the events that happen in S3&K and CD.
Battle talks about alien Gizoids technology Gerald Robotnik found which had a hand in creating Shadow. Also Chaos actually comes back when the world is in danger and you can fight him to calm him down.
Rush Adventure hints Sky Babylon is Blazes World version of Sky Santuary.

It wasnt until Unleashed were they began to just stop caring about the canon probably cause they got gaslit by the media into thinking its "cringe" for SONIC THE HEDGEHOG to try anything and now we deal with *Sigh *

"THE SONIC FROM ANOTHER WORLD/DIMENSION"
"CLASSIC SONIC MODERN SONIC"

 

[Curious Villager]

Didn't Sonic get some moves from Sonic Battle anyway? Or was it that other Sonic fighting game?

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Didn't Sonic get some moves from Sonic Battle anyway? Or was it that other Sonic fighting game?

His Down Air is pretty much Shadow's own aerial move from Sonic Battle. Some of his normals otherwise are taken from Sonic The Fighters. Among other stuff.

 

[Captain Shwampy]

Didn't Sonic get some moves from Sonic Battle anyway? Or was it that other Sonic fighting game?

From Sonic The Fighters.

Understandable since Sakurai's history with arcade games probably made him more aware of that as reference point than Battle.

 

[Shroob]

Now, see, you completely misunderstood.

When I say, "those are either people who don't play games at all, or are basically doing a hyperbolic "Literal, WHO?!" with extra steps." I'm not trying to say you aren't a gamer.

I'm saying I. don't. BELIEVE. you. if you say you haven't heard of Dragon Quest or Yakuza. And you aren't going to convince me otherwise. If someone on a video game message board says that they've never heard of one of those franchises, I will think they are a liar, forever.


That's people who are trying to gatekeep THEMSELVES, by feigning ignorance. And I deny their gatekeeping by disbelieving their crap.

Thing about that is...the rockstar persona is pretty insufferable. And it's doubly insufferable from someone who isn't actually a rockstar.

I can think of, like, a dozen characters more likely to get an Echo than Joker. Like:

10e. Ninten [Ness]
11e. Black Shadow [Captain Falcon]
16e. Impa [Sheik]
27e. Galacta Knight or Dark Meta Knight[Meta Knight]
31e. Liquid Snake [Snake]
32e. Black Knight [Ike]
36e. Dixie Kong [Diddy Kong]
38e. Shadow [Sonic]
46e. Bass or Protoman [Megaman]
61e. Zack [Cloud]
63e. Jeanne [Bayonetta]
64e. Octolings [Inklings]

Dragon Quest is a bit more forgivable.

I wouldn't know **** about Yakuza were it not for a friend of mine who adores the series.



And hell, I'd honestly forgive people for Dragon Quest too. There's no denying it's one of the biggest RPG franchises period.... but it's never really caught on in the west until the last decade and a half or so, and even then it really only got kicking due to DQ8 and DQ11.

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

The main reason I personally don’t think Dixie Kong being an Echo Fighter is likely is because her ponytail is such a focal part of her character. In fact every single one of her Smash Bros. trophy descriptions references her ponytail, and what she can do with it, and it mentions more than just flying.

The way I see it, having Dixie only use her ponytail for her up special and nothing else (like a lot of people suggest) is like having Bayonetta only using her guns for one special move. Sure it works, but for a character to use what is essentially their signature weapon for only one move is a bad representation of the character, and not something I see Sakurai doing.

also if sakurai thought dixie would work as an echo fighter he would have put her in the game already.

At the bare minimum I believe along with a new up special she would grab with her ponytail and have her ponytail spin for her dash attack. Donkey and Diddy’s dash attacks and grabs were ripped straight from their original games, and I’d imagine Sakurai would want Dixie to follow suit. There’s also a good chance she would use her ponytail for her ledge attack since Diddy uses his tail for his, which Dixie doesn’t have.

I personally would want her to have more than that, but I think they could get away with just the things I mentioned. And hey, maybe she could have all those changes along with slight stat differences and a unique final smash, and still be considered an Echo Fighter. It’s never been clear what the line between Echo Fighter and “unique” fighter is.

 

[SNEKeater]

That's one thing that sort of annoys me with the Smash fanbase. A lot of people have forgotten what it's like to be a casual gamer.

I knew who Joker and Terry were before they were revealed. Granted, I knew virtually nothing about them, but I still recognized them. If someone were to tell me that they had absolutely no idea what Persona was or what game this weird Joker fellow came from, I could understand why. Same with Banjo, Terry, or any of the characters in the first pass really.

The Smash fanbase on the other hand expects you to match the knowledge of a teenager who stops by Gamestop every day after school so he can exchange old games for new ones. You've clearly been living under a rock your whole life if you didn't know about Bayonetta and her two games prior to her reveal. Who DIDN'T play Persona 5 when it came out? The whole world was talking about it nonstop, so there's no excuses for not knowing him. Oh, and everyone had an SNK console growing up, so Terry is pretty much the most iconic thing in existence.

What we define as iconic is completely different from what an average Joe defines as iconic. I'm sure several people in this thread could make a list with over 100, maybe 200 characters who qualify as "iconic". Other people might only be able to get half of that.

I get your point and I completely agree with your first line, but I don't know, I'd think that at least most of the Smash fanbase who participates in speculation (Smashboards, GameFAQS, Twitter...), which means they are usually informed about everything surrounding Smash Bros, are people that couldn't be really considered casual gamers.

Maybe we have different definitions for being a casual gamer, but in my personal experience the casual folks who plays Smash usually don't care about who gets in, if anything they're usually more open to any newcomer, even if they don't know about the character. At least this is the experience I have when I play with people who aren't really that dedicated as us.
The people I met just wants to play the game and have fun, they pick the character they like or the cooler one for them and that's it. Maybe they would like to see certain characters in the game, but those people aren't actively participating in discussions and supporting their most wanted on the internet just like we do.

About the rest of your post, well, maybe there's some people who acts like that but I'd never expect everyone to know Persona or Bayonetta, even if both franchises are in it's peak of popularity. It's not okay to be mean to anyone who doesn't know about the upcoming DLC. I'd say that I was really surprised to see some people saying that they never heard of Dragon Quest, when DQ is usually featured in Directs, but that's another discussion I guess.

For example: if for some reason FP7 ends being Sol Badguy from Guilty Gear, I'm not expecting everyone in Smashboards being familiar with him or his series, the same would apply, of course, to casual gamers, because Guilty Gear (and most of franchises out there) isn't really mainstream. That doesn't mean it's not popular in it's own way, but I wouldn't act like a jerk because people aren't aware of Sol. That's just unnecessary.
When I talk about this subject I always meant that what I'd like to see from the Smash community in general is more respect. Even if you don't know the character or you didn't like the choice, I don't think it's cool to be angry with the new character and his fans or spam "literal who". This applies to any caracter, no matter if it's super popular or an unpopular one.

Just like I don't think it's fine to act as an elitist and an arrogant because people doesn't know about your character, I don't believe that being disrespectful or obnoxious with characters or franchises you aren't really familiar with is the way to go. Both things are equally bad in my eyes.
I just think people should be more nice in general.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

That's one thing that sort of annoys me with the Smash fanbase. A lot of people have forgotten what it's like to be a casual gamer.

I knew who Joker and Terry were before they were revealed. Granted, I knew virtually nothing about them, but I still recognized them. If someone were to tell me that they had absolutely no idea what Persona was or what game this weird Joker fellow came from, I could understand why. Same with Banjo, Terry, or any of the characters in the first pass really.

The Smash fanbase on the other hand expects you to match the knowledge of a teenager who stops by Gamestop every day after school so he can exchange old games for new ones. You've clearly been living under a rock your whole life if you didn't know about Bayonetta and her two games prior to her reveal. Who DIDN'T play Persona 5 when it came out? The whole world was talking about it nonstop, so there's no excuses for not knowing him. Oh, and everyone had an SNK console growing up, so Terry is pretty much the most iconic thing in existence.

What we define as iconic is completely different from what an average Joe defines as iconic. I'm sure several people in this thread could make a list with over 100, maybe 200 characters who qualify as "iconic". Other people might only be able to get half of that.

You do realize when we talk about more recognizable characters and icons, those are for different groups of people who either already play Smash or may be interested in Smash. You're appealing to almost 20 million people across Smash's entire install base and further millions by trying to attract them to the game. Nobody except the straw man you're creating is saying we expect everybody to know every single character. Characters can absolutely just be iconic to different populations (See Dragoon Quest in Japan and SNK in general in Latin America as examples just in this Fighter's Pass). With Smash, on average you are trying to engage in greater outreach and pick some notable names so as to appeal to lots of potential players and customers. Something like Persona 5 may not reach every single person in the world, but in the context of the gaming community it was a major title that garnered a ton of coverage and praise. I don't expect every person to know Persona 5, but I'm also not assigning universal recognition to it which seems to be the standard of iconic you're trying to retroactively apply here to those conversations when it was always more of "Hey, this thing is more popular and relevant to certain groups than you're making it out to be. It may not be what you want, but it does have significant popularity."

And if you engage with Smash specific forums with some regularity, you're not a casual Smash fan and I don't think it's unreasonable to expect more of those fans in terms of common knowledge. Especially in a thread like this where the entire point is wide spread speculation that allows for real discussion on the chances of basically any character in existence. This is the one place where discussions necessitate broader engagement with the material of video games as a whole. It's also the whole "well I didn't know about it so I don't think they are" thing that some people use when their pissed off at a character's inclusion that make people respond more sharply to lack of knowledge. The popularity of characters and franchises exists independently outside of your personal experience and can mean more or less to different communities and those with different experiences.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

Well I certainly thought about a few characters who I have no real knowledge of that'll stray from the talk of companies for now.

The other day, I was thinking about the MLP for Smash twitter for some reason, and then I saw that Them's Fightin Herds came out of Early Access on Steam yesterday. I only know about this game from Deezus and Weegee playing it on FWOB, and I also learned that this game was created by a group of people that made an unofficial MLP fighting game until Hasbro gave them a cease and desist. Lauren Faust was also involved in the game as well, so that's pretty cool.

Yeah it'd definitely be so out there for a character from Them's Fightin Herds to be in Smash, but you know what? I'll be down for it. I may not know anything about this game currently, but I would be super open into seeing it somehow get represented in Smash.

if Thems Fightin Herds came on switch, I would be so happy

 

[chocolatejr9]

Monokuma for smash!

This guy gets it.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Uwu I'm just a casual gamer please don't include non Nintendo characters as I never heard of popular non Nintendo IPs. Also I think Joy Mech Fight should be revived, only a casual gamer would know of Joy Mech Fight, Ayumi Tachibana, Takamaru, Yuyuki and more

 

[chocolatejr9]

Uwu I'm just a casual gamer please don't include non Nintendo characters as I never heard of popular non Nintendo IPs. Also I think Joy Mech Fight should be revived, only a casual gamer would know of Joy Mech Fight, Ayumi Tachibana, Takamaru, Yuyuki and more

I'm guessing you got into a debate with someone?

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I'm guessing you got into a debate with someone?

Nah, Eric's post reminded me of something that really bugged me, a lot of people scoff at having to look up mainstream franchises but can tell you about some obscure ass Japan exlcusive Nintendo games, which to me, seems pretty hypocritical

 

[chocolatejr9]

Nah, Eric's post reminded me of something that really bugged me, a lot of people scoff at having to look up mainstream franchises but can tell you about some obscure ass Japan exlcusive Nintendo games, which to me, seems pretty hypocritical

Yeah. It'd be nice if people could try and find a balance. Though I know that can be a bit hard...