Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[NonSpecificGuy]

We do? Has Sakurai specifically said something negative about Sony?
Sakurai plays games on Sony owned platforms.

Sony has a history working with Nintendo and other companies.
Sony allowed Master Chief to appear on Sony owned platforms. Sony worked with Microsoft for their network infrastructure. Sony worked with Nintendo and Microsoft against Trump. Sony published games on the SNES, Game Boy Color, and the Nintendo Switch. They support Cross Platform games like Phantasy Star Online 2 released for the Nintendo Switch, which said game has characters they own like Kat and Raven from Gravity Rush in it.

https://www.gamespot.com/articles/halos-master-chief-now-on-nintendo-switch-thanks-t/1100-6456435/
http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/...r-chief-skins-appear-in-minecraft-switch.aspx
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Q*bert
https://www.gravityrushcentral.com/2017/08/20/overview-gravity-rushs-crossovers-game-franchises/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_video_games_that_support_cross-platform_play
https://www.destructoid.com/master-...ole-via-official-minecraft-skins-462079.phtml
https://www.polygon.com/2017/10/17/16488326/sony-nintendo-switch-game-tiny-metal-unties-label
https://www.theverge.com/2019/5/20/18632374/microsoft-sony-cloud-gaming-partnership-amazon-google
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/n...p-withdraw-china-tariffs-joint-letter-1221108
https://www.gameinformer.com/2019/0...letter-discouraging-trump-administration-from
https://mynintendonews.com/2017/01/08/a-look-at-sakurais-incredible-game-collection/

Sony and Nintendo CEO's own third-party consoles.

They came together in the same room at the Game Awards without them throttling the other.

Third-parties are allegedly "easy to work with" according to Masahiro Sakurai:
https://www.sourcegaming.info/2016/02/23/nintendo-dream-interview-with-sakurai-part-2/



Has something happened between Sony and Sakurai?

Sony has gotten a new president.

Has said that the Video Game side of their business is "niche" and has pulled then out of big conferences like E3 because "it's a waste of resources" dude looks at gaming like it's a useless part of their company despite the Video Games side of the market is what's basically been keepu ngf them afloat for YEARS now... since the PS2. Which means that Sony's history of being pretty cool? It means jack ****. This new Sony is incredibly stubborn and unbearably cocky.

Playstation, no matter how much they want to do cross play or give themselves a better public image has to fight tooth and nail with Sony itself to get approval for those things. It sucks but that's how it is with corporations.

 

[SvartWolf]

Hot topic:

I would totally pay full price for a shadow echo or a dixie echo if they come with a list of sonic adventure 2 remixes and a stage like radical highway for shadow, and a list of tropical freezee/ DKC2 remixes and a tropical freeze DKC2 stage for dixie...

 

[Deleted member]

You know, I'm glad I got to discuss the "lack of female DLC" debate with the people of Smashboards. If this was reddit, I'd get downvoted to hell and there wouldn't be the same level of discussion compared here.

If any one reading this thread right now would say "Oh, Kazooie? Am I a joke to you?", well sorry. Almost everyone refers to BK and Banjo and leave her out. It's who's the completely playable character, and what I'm debating right now is a 100% fully female playable fighter. Your argument is invalid.

 

[Aetheri]

You know, I'm glad I got to discuss the "lack of female DLC" debate with the people of Smashboards. If this was reddit, I'd get downvoted to hell and there wouldn't be the same level of discussion compared here.

If any one reading this thread right now would say "Oh, Kazooie? Am I a joke to you?", well sorry. Almost everyone refers to BK and Banjo and leave her out. It's who's the completely playable character, and what I'm debating right now is a 100% fully female playable fighter. Your argument is invalid.

To be fair there is no 'Dislike' button.

 

[Deleted member]

You know, I'm glad I got to discuss the "lack of female DLC" debate with the people of Smashboards. If this was reddit, I'd get downvoted to hell and there wouldn't be the same level of discussion compared here.

If any one reading this thread right now would say "Oh, Kazooie? Am I a joke to you?", well sorry. Almost everyone refers to BK and Banjo and leave her out. It's who's the completely playable character, and what I'm debating right now is a 100% fully female playable fighter. Your argument is invalid.

BK situation is funny as hell given that Kazooie does most of the work. Agree that is a stupid rebuttal regarding lack of female characters.

Like I said before, a lot of the fan rosters are very lacking given that very few consider characters like Terry who are popular on certain regions. I feel that we are getting more female picks, overall Sakurai makes a good job at balancing in regards to appealing different groups of fans.

 

[andree123]

Shoutout to Evil Trapezium for making this for me.
I think this is an ideal realistic set of Fighter's Passes to fill the 16 World of Light slots.

We currently have 12 placeholder slots in the WOL, so that makes 18 DLC fighter slots in total as of 5.0.0.

 

[Sigman]

Sony has gotten a new president.

Has said that the Video Game side of their business is "niche" and has pulled then out of big conferences like E3 because "it's a waste of resources" dude looks at gaming like it's a useless part of their company despite the Video Games side of the market is what's basically been keepu ngf them afloat for YEARS now... since the PS2. Which means that Sony's history of being pretty cool? It means jack ****. This new Sony is incredibly stubborn and unbearably cocky.

Playstation, no matter how much they want to do cross play or give themselves a better public image has to fight tooth and nail with Sony itself to get approval for those things. It sucks but that's how it is with corporations.

This sounds similar to what people say about Capcom or Konami and how they doubt they would "never add Megaman in Smash with how they treated him" or "Konami quit making video games in favor of Pachinko machines".

 

[Wunderwaft]

He's barely a character.

He's as much of a character as Villager, R.O.B, and Wii-Fit Trainer are. Hell we have the Miis as playable characters, and their entire purpose is to be avatars for players. If they're eligible as playable fighters then so is Steve.

 

[Deleted member]

I'm happy people still have faith in female DLC...

 

[YoshiandToad]

I can think of a handful of female characters that are both Japan centric, "new worlds", third party and the lead/obvious choice for their franchise, but I'm not sure how many have a chance:

Lara Croft is literally THE iconic female video game character, although the Square owned reboot has made her look a ton more generic. Personally I'd prefer they'd give her the mint green tanktop and brown shorts combo even though it'd inevitably be Square's redesign if she got in.

Jill Valentine is arguably the most popular Resident Evil character and whilst she shares the 'lead protagonist' role with Chris and Leon, her blue beret outfit is pretty recognisable.

2B is possible if they lean more Joker's way with a more modern female character of a very popular game.

Amaterasu is about the only non human-oid female lead I can think of that could possibly make it, but I'm not very confident in.

Morrigan from Darkstalkers is the mascot of the series, but I wonder if she's too sexualised and will require a redesign tweak or two to make it. Also Darkstalkers is arguably pretty niche even amongst fighting game fans.

Kasumi from Dead or Alive is pretty much Koei Tecmo's joint mascot character at this point alongside Ryu Hayabusa. She seems to cameo in all kinds of KT's other franchises from Ninja Gaiden to the Warriors series to Monster Hunter of all things.

After that I hit a brick wall...Cooking Mama perhaps?

 

[Abade]

If this was the full DLC lineup. I'm done with Smash.

To be honest, I've never truly moved on from my debate. No seriously. Everyday just bugs me because of the thought that out of every single fighting game out there, we're the ones who don't let new girls join the party. I mean, Street Fighter gave us Poison and Lucia, Tekken brought back Zafina and who knows who's coming next, and freaking Blazblue Cross Tag Battle gave us a couple of new ladies. And Smash? Nothing, just hot men and no women. This has got to be the worst gender respresentation of guest characters in a fighting game. Whoever made this didn't even think of the possibility of females being added.

I personally I think i want to start up a new forum thread for this issue.

If they add a entirely 100% female newcomer to Super Smash Bros Ultimate then it would at least be on par with Soulcalibur VI, which added YoRHa No. 2 Type B for a newcomer.

 

[AntagonisticGalaxyCetacea]

There's a bit of irony in my eyes, in saying the DLC wishlists are tiresome because of how often certain characters appear; but the female characters people bring up are typically the same ones (2B, Dixie Kong, Jill Valentine, etc)

Not that I disagree we should get more female representation, but stuff like this is probably why we haven't seen very many newcomers.

 

[TheCJBrine]

We currently have 12 placeholder slots in the WOL, so that makes 18 DLC fighter slots in total as of 5.0.0.

I’m surprised this hasn’t gotten more attention.

So either we’re gonna get more than two additional passes, just two, or still we may get less.

 

[Ben Holt]

I think that any Nintendo character is fair game.
But it's clear that third parties have some sort of vetting process that blocks most female fighters.
Leon is more popular than Jill, and Sakurai goes with popularity over female quotas. Terry is a prime example.
Shantae is an indie character, and Shovel Knight would most likely be the first Indie rep.
2B simply isn't iconic enough.

So if we get a female third party character, it's 90% likely Lara Croft unless it's a random "Sakurai Pick".

 

[NoOtherPersona]

Shoutout to Evil Trapezium for making this for me.
I think this is an ideal realistic set of Fighter's Passes to fill the 16 World of Light slots.
View attachment 239827

we really don't need Crash and Spyro and geno should be free not paid for

 

[Ben Holt]

we really don't need Crash and Spyro and geno should be free not paid for

Someone didn't grow up in the 90s.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

So if we get a female third party character, it's 90% likely Lara Croft unless it's a random "Sakurai Pick".

The only question is which Lara? Classic or Reboot?

 

[Evil Trapezium]

I’m surprised this hasn’t gotten more attention.

So either we’re gonna get more than two additional passes, just two, or still we may get less.

Or it could be a case like the smash website where the boxes duplicate. You never know with Nintendo.

 

[Impa4Smash]

But it's clear that third parties have some sort of vetting process that blocks most female fighters.
Leon is more popular than Jill, and Sakurai goes with popularity over female quotas. Terry is a prime example.

Choosing Leon over Jill is not really comparable to choosing Terry over female Terry.

 

[Deleted member]

I think that any Nintendo character is fair game.
But it's clear that third parties have some sort of vetting process that blocks most female fighters.
Leon is more popular than Jill, and Sakurai goes with popularity over female quotas. Terry is a prime example.
Shantae is an indie character, and Shovel Knight would most likely be the first Indie rep.
2B simply isn't iconic enough.

So if we get a female third party character, it's 90% likely Lara Croft unless it's a random "Sakurai Pick".

For some reason I actually like these "Sakurai Picks" because it allows me to get introduced to new franchises.

 

[Ben Holt]

The only question is which Lara? Classic or Reboot?

Both. Costumes are a magical thing.
But modern would be the default.

 

[YoshiandToad]

The only question is which Lara? Classic or Reboot?

I'd pray classic personally. The reboot has made her less distinctive looking than the braid, the tank top, the shorts and the occasional tinted sunglasses. Unlikely though since that look was from pre-Square buyout and I can't see them prioritising that over modern Lara.

 

[Wunderwaft]

Choosing Leon over Jill is not really comparable to choosing Terry over female Terry.

I think he was talking about Nakoruru.

 

[3BitSaurus]

I’m surprised this hasn’t gotten more attention.

So either we’re gonna get more than two additional passes, just two, or still we may get less.

It reminds me of how supposedly they supposedly added an extra slot in Smash 4 after a certain update. So yeah, we could get two more. Instead of 10 remaining slots, we'd have 12, so 2 more seasons like this one.

I just hope they explain how the next batch of DLC will work soon.

 

[Impa4Smash]

I think he was talking about Nakoruru.

Ah that makes more sense, my b

 

[SKX31]

There's a bit of irony in my eyes, in saying the DLC wishlists are tiresome because of how often certain characters appear; but the female characters people bring up are typically the same ones (2B, Dixie Kong, Jill Valentine, etc)

Not that I disagree we should get more female representation, but stuff like this is probably why we haven't seen very many newcomers.

As a general rule, characters from outside of Nintendo's wheelhouse (like Blizzard's ensemble, from StarCraft's main character Sarah Kerrigan to Tracer. I'd argue both those are iconic.) are not that well known here. Doubly so if it's anything that's never been on Nintendo platforms - The only exception to that rule is GlaDOS and Chell IIRC. Chell is talked about here on occassion.

It reminds me of how supposedly they supposedly added an extra slot in Smash 4 after a certain update. So yeah, we could get two more. Instead of 10 remaining slots, we'd have 12, so 2 more seasons like this one.

I just hope they explain how the next batch of DLC will work soon.

I'm getting the impression that Sakurai and Sora Ltd. is still keeping flexibility in mind. If they feel like they can keep going they might add more, but there's gonna be some negotiating and making sure before committing to that.

 

[Deleted member]

There's a good amount of female characters would usually give me the "oh hey that's nice" impression if they were to be in Smash. They wouldn't really make me really hyped about their inclusions nor would they make me hate it. I'll be happy for those wanting the character but they'd have to win me over moveset wise like how Hero did with how stupidly fun he was. The only characters that would go above that impression would be Cooking Mama because she's goddamn Cooking Mama, Cadence because Crypt of the NecroDancer is great, Katrielle because she looks cute, any female Warriors character because I'd gladly take anyone from a Musou game, and an Atelier girl like Sophie or Ryza because the Atelier series is pretty niche for an over 2 decade old franchise and would be wild to see get a spotlight in Smash.

 

[andree123]

It reminds me of how supposedly they supposedly added an extra slot in Smash 4 after a certain update. So yeah, we could get two more. Instead of 10 remaining slots, we'd have 12, so 2 more seasons like this one.

I just hope they explain how the next batch of DLC will work soon.

Reminder that in a certain version of smash 4 before was out we had a lot of placeholder slots in ssb4's CSS data.

 

[Just a random scrub]

we really don't need Crash and Spyro and geno should be free not paid for

Dude, they're never going to release a character for ****ing free. They don't poof outta thin air.

 

[Deleted member]

There's a bit of irony in my eyes, in saying the DLC wishlists are tiresome because of how often certain characters appear; but the female characters people bring up are typically the same ones (2B, Dixie Kong, Jill Valentine, etc)

Not that I disagree we should get more female representation, but stuff like this is probably why we haven't seen very many newcomers.

Last time someone mentioned someone more obscure like KOS-MOS, there was an argument regarding the character being too niche.

 

[GoodGrief741]

The only question is which Lara? Classic or Reboot?

Probably classic Lara or maybe an amalgamation of designs. Sakurai tends to go for classic looks for third parties (Simon, Mega Man, Pac-Man, Sonic post 4), though I could see him doing something like with Snake where he distills different designs into a unified version.

Though for Lara, the latter option would likely still be mostly tanktop, braids and double guns, maybe with facial features and voice from the new trilogy (her VA is really great).

 

[3BitSaurus]

Reminder that in a certain version of smash 4 before was out we had a lot of placeholder slots in ssb4's CSS data.

Yeah, the user in the post I linked to makes that point. All of them were used, plus one was added later (Corrin, who we now know was added a bit after Bayo).

 

[Aetheri]

geno should be free not paid for

That's not really how DLC has worked for Smash. If you don't want to pay for him tgen don't buy him.

 

[Ben Holt]

Choosing Leon over Jill is not really comparable to choosing Terry over female Terry.

I was referring to Terry over Mai or Nakoruru.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Everyday just bugs me because of the thought that out of every single fighting game out there, we're the ones who don't let new girls join the party. I mean, Street Fighter gave us Poison and Lucia, Tekken brought back Zafina and who knows who's coming next, and freaking Blazblue Cross Tag Battle gave us a couple of new ladies. And Smash? Nothing, just hot men and no women. This has got to be the worst gender respresentation of guest characters in a fighting game. Whoever made this didn't even think of the possibility of females being added.

Tekken and Street Fighter are not really comparable to Smash Bros.
Tekken and Street Fighter can literally just create brand new female fighters if they want more gender diversity.
Smash has to pick from existing characters in video gaming, and iconic ones at that.
While I support Dixie Kong and Impa as two of my absolutely most wanted newcomers from Nintendo, when it comes to third party picks, there simply are not that many female icons to pick from unless you are intentionally forcing gender diversity.
As I stated before, Lara Croft is the only female character I can think of off the top of my head that is on par with the current third party fighters.

I'd also like to add that Blazblue Cross Tag Battle's series has a more female-dominant character pool, with franchises like RWBY, Senren Kagura, and Arcana Heart being either female dominant or female exclusive. And the franchises that aren't female dominant do have their fair share of popular women. Smash on the other hand only has a handful of female characters to chose from that wouldn't underwhelming beyond their small, dedicated audiences. This doesn't mean that we won't or shouldn't get any women, it just means that the ratio from male to female will always be overwhelmingly male due to the fact that most of gaming's best is male. (Which is in turn due to the fact that most of gaming's best are older characters that were created at a time when it wasn't believed that women even played video games. My mom remembers a time where people were so pumped that a girl was playing WoW that they would give them free stuff.)

 

[DarthEnderX]

According to a translation shown by Gamexplain, Sakurai considered adding 8 Heroes, but it wasn't considered to be a realistic goal. That's too bad. I'd have liked to see what the other four would have been (perhaps the female counterparts to the four that were added?).

My guess is, we'd have gotten 1, 2, 5 and 6.

Main reasons for the others being left out are:
7. Is way shorter than the others, so he doesn't give the character model.
9 and 10. Are both Create-a-characters. So while they do have a "default" appearance, those characters could technically look however the player wanted.

Solo is the face of DQ4 in promotional media; he consistently shows up as the lead representative of the game whenever the series calls for all the Heroes to show up together as a group while Sofia’s only credited appearance post-DQ4 to my knowledge is in Battle Road Victory.

There’s also the fact that his face is used for the app image of the game on iOS, which further emphasizes this.

I would argue against this, as she was on the box art for the original Famicom game. But she's not on the box art for the DS remake. So it's almost as if SE is phasing her OUT rather than pushing her into the spotlight...

Surely you can think of popular/iconic women in gaming who aren't in Smash who can surpass the likes of Geno and Lloyd lol.

Jill Valentine [Resident Evil]
Amaterasu [Okami]
Nakoruru [Samurai Shodown]
Morrigan [Darkstalkers]
Toadette/Captain Toad [Treasure Tracker]
Shantae [Shantae]

When it comes to Female Characters, there are a few they could Add that i could see happening

Reimu
KOS-MOS
Arle Nardija

Also I guess Jill, and Lara, But i don't see them happening

I see Jill happening WAY before any of the 3 you mentioned.

Playstation, no matter how much they want to do cross play or give themselves a better public image has to fight tooth and nail with Sony itself to get approval for those things. It sucks but that's how it is with corporations.

It's my experience that how easy Sony is to work with is based entirely only how well they're doing. When they're on top, they always act like stingy a-holes. And when they're losing, they try and act like they're cool.

Unfortunately, right now the PS4 is handily beating the XB1. So I don't expect Sony to be very cooperative right now.

 

[Ben Holt]

My mom remembers a time where people were so pumped that a girl was playing WoW that they would give them free stuff.)

Boys still do that to gamer girls.
That's more primal nature than culture shock.

 

[Deleted member]

I'd also like to add that Blazblue Cross Tag Battle's series has a more female-dominant character pool, with franchises like RWBY, Senren Kagura, and Arcana Heart being either female dominant or female exclusive. And the franchises that aren't female dominant do have their fair share of popular women. Smash on the other hand only has a handful of female characters to chose from that wouldn't underwhelming beyond their small, dedicated audiences. This doesn't mean that we won't or shouldn't get any women, it just means that the ratio from male to female will always be overwhelmingly male due to the fact that most of gaming's best is male. (Which is in turn due to the fact that most of gaming's best are older characters that were created at a time when it wasn't believed that women even played video games. My mom remembers a time where people were so pumped that a girl was playing WoW that they would give them free stuff.)

I wasn't complaining about the female-male ratio. I'll be happy for one. Just one. One. It's so damn easy.

 

[OrpheusTelos]

Not to call out anyone in particular, but I'm not really a fan of how a lot of recent predictions/wishlists basically boil down to "here's a bunch of male action heroes and platformer mascots I think are cool." Even ignoring the female character debate, I'd like to see at least some male characters that don't fall under the "badass action hero" umbrella like Phoenix Wright or Professor Layton get talked about more. Idk, I like a lot of the macho men and cereal mascots, but I don't want those to be the only options for DLC.

 

[Deleted member]

Not to call out anyone in particular, but I'm not really a fan of how a lot of recent predictions/wishlists basically boil down to "here's a bunch of male action heroes and platformer mascots I think are cool." Even ignoring the female character debate, I'd like to see at least some male characters that don't fall under the "badass action hero" umbrella like Phoenix Wright or Professor Layton get talked about more. Idk, I like a lot of the macho men and cereal mascots, but I don't want those to be the only options for DLC.

Well, come to think of it, yeah. I am getting tired of this trend. I swear that all these stuff about Doomguy/Hayabusa/Master Chief is so alarmingly too much it's c*****. I swear if I see one more Doomabusa "leak" then may the gods have mercy on my soul.