Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Eldrake]

i have no context for this

I think he's talking about the moon Eggman pisses on blows up in one of the Sonic games.

 

[Þe 1 → Way]

I think he's talking about the moon Eggman pisses on blows up in one of the Sonic games.

Its all fun and games till the guy on the TV screams “IVE COME TO MAKE AN ANNOUNCEMENT”

 

[Momotsuki]

Galeem is definitely one of my favorite character designs out there. No doubt he's taking a lot of notes from the Seraphim - the seemingly firey nature of his wings along with the wings themselves, but even still. Dharkon is super nice too, clearly looking like he was inspired by the work of that racist coot. But I don't think he packs the same punch as Galeem. Galeem is also a lot harder that Dharkon, fighting them individually, so I found Galeem more memorable from a boss fight perspective too. He's a cool guy, I'd love to have a coffee with him.

 

[GoodGrief741]

you are thinking as a fan, not as a business. You are listing fan favorites not who would bring in the most attention and money. plus you arent looking at the pattern present in ultimate. everyone got villains added: dk, samus, kirby, megaman and more.
and no characters like black mage and terra dont compare to sephiroth. Tifa is closer but she's arguably not even the most influential female character in FF7.

We got Min Min bro get outta here with your backseat executive talk

All of the realistic Final Fantasy characters would still make bank because they're Final Fantasy characters. Hell, most people will buy whoever the fighter is because it's Smash and that's what people do.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

I think any Final Fantasy 7 character would bring in money, but I do think Sephiroth specifically is one of the best choices.

Tifa is another close one.

 

[JamesDNaux]

Crash talk ended a few pages ago but can someone explain where the "Activision is too stingy" thing came from?

We literally had Bowser and DK in Skylanders, I doubt they wouldn't jump to return the favor with Crash in Smash.

 

[Þe 1 → Way]

Galeem is definitely one of my favorite character designs out there. No doubt he's taking a lot of notes from the Seraphim, but even still. Dharkon is super nice too, clearly looking like he was inspired by the work of that racist coot. But I don't think he packs the same punch as Galeem. Galeem is also a lot harder that Dharkon, fighting them individually, so I found Galeem more memorable from a boss fight perspective too. He's a cool guy, I'd love to have a coffee with him.

I never even realized the similarities between Dharkon and some of Lovecrafts Gods.
I also enjoyed Galeem a lot more, not just because I found him more interesting visually and gameplay wise, but also because Dharkons appearance was basically “We replaced this guy you don’t know, with ANOTHER guy you don’t know!” At least Galeem was established as being Ultra powerful.

 

[Dinoman96]

Crash talk ended a few pages ago but can someone explain where the "Activision is too stingy" thing came from?

We literally had Bowser and DK in Skylanders, I doubt they wouldn't jump to return the favor with Crash in Smash.

Maximillion has heard horror stories from the PSABR dev team in regards to Activision.

 

[Momotsuki]

I think if you're trying to present a baddie who'll preside over such a broad crossover, the unfamiliar, super-abstract designs we've been seeing like Tabuu or Galeem are the way to go, putting aside the fact that they look superb in their own right.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Crash talk ended a few pages ago but can someone explain where the "Activision is too stingy" thing came from?

We literally had Bowser and DK in Skylanders, I doubt they wouldn't jump to return the favor with Crash in Smash.

There's the possibility they'll want Nintendo to go with a Call of Duty rep as someone mentioned.

 

[XorahnGaia]

Crash talk ended a few pages ago but can someone explain where the "Activision is too stingy" thing came from?

We literally had Bowser and DK in Skylanders, I doubt they wouldn't jump to return the favor with Crash in Smash.

It mostly comes from the rumor that the asking price for Crash in PSASBR was incredibly steep. Maximillian Dood straight described the negotiations between Superbot and Activision as something from a horror story.

Then again, it was a very different time for the Crash IP and PSASBR had the budget of a cup of coffee and none of the prestige of the Smash series, so maybe things went different for Nintendo. Time will tell I guess...

EDIT: Aaaand Ninja'd.

 

[JamesDNaux]

Maximillion has heard horror stories from the PSABR dev team in regards to Activision.

We're talking Masahiro "Two Final Fantasy characters" Sakurai vs a brand new dev team (at the time) with zero connections and a shoe string budget.

Of course they couldn't get Crash, they couldn't get anyone they wanted.

 

[Momotsuki]

I think people are forgetting how hard Activision has pushed Crash lately. Following a decade of dormancy he seems to be one of their mainstays once again. However the odds of negotiating for him looked prior to the N. Sane Trilogy, they look much nicer now. Call of Duty? Really? Sounds like more Jonesy-esque fearmongering.

 

[PacificFun]

People like this cause me physical pain

https://twitter.com/Windsweep/status/1338581193965518848?s=09

 

[Þe 1 → Way]

People like this make me feel physical pain

https://twitter.com/Windsweep/status/1338581193965518848?s=09

I have a feeling that Smash 6 is gonna leave its FE characters looking like a Shakespear story.

 

[Momotsuki]

I have a feeling that Smash 6 is gonna leave its FE characters looking like a Shakespear story.

They're going to get gutted. Like much of the roster, by whichever stooge Nintendo found to direct the next installment. I'm not looking forward to it.
Post-Sakurai Smash installments will happen, that's inevitable. But I've already decided I won't be recognizing them as legitimate entries. The series is done after this, as far as I care, and I think this is a good time for Mr. Sakurai to close up shop, when Ultimate's DLC is all done.

 

[TheBeastHimself]

I think people are forgetting how hard Activision has pushed Crash lately. Following a decade of dormancy he seems to be one of their mainstays once again. However the odds of negotiating for him looked prior to the N. Sane Trilogy, they look much nicer now. Call of Duty? Really? Sounds like more Jonesy-esque fearmongering.

Well Call of Duty shouldn't be easily ruled out either. It's been one of Activision's biggest franchises since 2003. Gets a new game every year with a strong community to this day. Activision loves to promote it, especially with Call of Duty Warzone and their mobile version.

Call of Duty is seen as the traditional FPS. Games like Doom, Duke Nukem, Wolfenstein, Halo etc., are all pioneers of the FPS genre, but Call of Duty definitely evolved the genre greatly.

Comparing COD to "Jonesy-esque fearmongering" doesn't seem right, at least to me. Fortnite is a game that blew up out of nowhere and hit mainstream success overnight. COD has been around for almost two decades now, and has gradually built up a dedicated fanbase over years. While COD doesn't have the best reputation, I wouldn't compare it to Fortnite in that regard. Activision is still a shady as hell company with the way they market loot boxes in COD Mobile and other COD games.

What I'm trying to say is, Call of Duty should absolutely not be overlooked if we're going to speculate about an Activision rep. I personally think Crash is more likely than a COD character, but COD is too huge of a franchise to glance over.

 

[Þe 1 → Way]

They're going to get gutted. Like much of the roster, by whichever stooge Nintendo found to direct the next installment. I'm not looking forward to it.

Yeah if Nintendo does go the route of cutting half the roster I have a feeling the community will split again and we’ll be stuck with three different disjointed communities instead of our current two.

 

[PacificFun]

They're going to get gutted. Like much of the roster, by whichever stooge Nintendo found to direct the next installment. I'm not looking forward to it.

Eh, if its a reboot of sorts, I don't really mind a smaller roster. Especially if they make Smash more of a traditional fighter next game. If not, I would like for a lot of veterans to get a completely revamped moveset.

 

[Momotsuki]

Yeah if Nintendo does go the route of cutting half the roster I have a feeling the community will split again and we’ll be stuck with three different disjointed communities instead of our current two.

That's exactly what will happen. I won't be recognizing post-Sakurai Smash titles and will continue to play Ultimate for the forseeable future. At least assuming he does in fact step down when Ultimate is done. I hope he does, for his own sake, retiring undefeated.

 

[TheBeastHimself]

Yeah if Nintendo does go the route of cutting half the roster I have a feeling the community will split again and we’ll be stuck with three different disjointed communities instead of our current two.

I'll only be upset if Lucas ever gets cut.

 

[PacificFun]

The next Smash could gut the roster in favor of a more fleshed out premise, better online, better single player and revamped characters.
I also wouldn't mind third-parties biting the dust if there are actually character interactions within the game.

Ultimate feels like the end of traditional Smash to me.

 

[TheShiningAbsol]

racist coot

Sugiyama? He’s just the composer

 

[kylexv]

I've been doing some thinking as to why Sephiroth's inclusion in Smash is not too surprising in retrospect (much like every other character) and why I thought Sephiroth actually had a chance of happening, and here was my train of thought that made me think that way.

Exhibit 1: Erdrick. Many of us surmise that Sakurai originally intended Erdrick to be Hero's default costume instead of Luminary. Mainly, this is because:
1. Erdrick was the one being rumored constantly prior to Hero's reveal
2. Hero's spot in All Star Smash is Erdrick's debut date in 1988, not Luminary's debut date in 2017.
Exhibit 2: Luminary as a promotional pick. With everything pointing to Sakurai wanting Erdrick to be the default costume for Hero, it is likely that Luminary became the default costume instead because Square Enix wanted to promote Dragon Quest 11S on Switch. This is further corroborated by an unusual amount of promotion of the game by Nintendo in directs and in the Sakurai Presents showcase.
Exhibit 3: Square Enix characters are promotional picks? The idea of Hero seemed to be asked for directly by Sakurai and Nintendo, but the decision to make Luminary the default outfit may have been influenced by Square wanting to promote a game.
Exhibit 4: Final Fantasy 7 Remake came out this year. It could have been possible that the idea of Sephiroth being in Smash Ultimate was asked for directly by Sakurai and Nintendo, and Square gave the OK because it allowed them to further promote Final Fantasy 7 Remake.

I've had this train of thought a couple of times before Sephiroth's reveal, but always ignored it because I thought it wouldn't happen. Lo and behold, it did.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Super Smash Bros. Reboot's roster, colorized:

Spoiler

 

[PacificFun]

Do you guys think the likes of Wii Fit Trainer, ROB and Mr. Game & Watch (the "console" device characters) would survive a roster gutting?

 

[Þe 1 → Way]

The next Smash could gut the roster in favor of a more fleshed out premise, better online, better single player and revamped characters.
I also wouldn't mind third-parties biting the dust if there are actually character interactions within the game.

Ultimate feels like the end of traditional Smash to me.

I don’t really see how all those can’t happen with a big roster.
We’ve got a decent single player mode in WoL, it just needs some polishing before it can be considered great.
Smash 4 managed to give each character 4 different custom moves, I don’t see how updating veterans is out of the question.
The only reason Ultimates online sucks so bad is because it uses delay netcode instead of rollback. Fix that and Online is good.
Character interaction could be achieved by hiring more writers and making more stuff like Palutenas Guidance and Snakes Codecs.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Sugiyama? He’s just the composer

They were referring to H.P. Lovecraft.

Let's just say that there are some...interesting tidbits about the existence of black people in his works.

Do you guys think the likes of Wii Fit Trainer, ROB and Mr. Game & Watch (the "console" device characters) would survive a roster gutting?

Mr. Game & Watch? Absolutely. The others? Eeeeeeeh...

 

[TheShiningAbsol]

They were referring to H.P. Lovecraft.

Let's just say that there are some...interesting tidbits about the existence of black people in his works.

Oh man I feel dumb, I was just thinking about Sephiroth and Hero’s trailers lol

 

[Eldrake]

Super Smash Bros. Reboot's roster, colorized:

Spoiler

Ah, at long last. A Smash roster with no imbalance.

 

[PacificFun]

I don’t really see how all those can’t happen with a big roster.
We’ve got a decent single player mode in WoL, it just needs some polishing before it can be considered great.
Smash 4 managed to give each character 4 different custom moves, I don’t see how updating veterans is out of the question.
The only reason Ultimates online sucks so bad is because it uses delay netcode instead of rollback. Fix that and Online is good.
Character interaction could be achieved by hiring more writers and making more stuff like Palutenas Guidance and Snakes Codecs.

WOL got too grindy and boring after a while for me.
Smash 4 did have custom moves but I want complete overhauls for a lot of characters. Basically, everyone would be a newcomer. And Ultimate's online issues are far greater than just the net code. Quickplay is a terrible and addictive (for some) mode because of the limitations and GSP. Its a very toxic mode. Battle Arenas aren't much better because of the mediocre UI and lack of features.

They should have took some cues from ARMS' online (which is superb for the most part).

 

[Garteam]

Can someone explain to me why Shueisha would be involved in the ownership of Chrono Trigger? I don't see any involvement Shueisha had in the development or any release of Chrono Trigger looking at Wikipedia and googling "Chrono Trigger Shueisha" didn't give me anything except guides published in V Jump.

 

[Dalek_Kolt]

I'd be fine with a reboot if the remaining cast from 64/Melee got updated movesets and characters that could be entirely decloned were.
Plus it'd make story mode easier to implement.

 

[DarthEnderX]

What lighter, faster villain characters would you all like to see?

I'd only want to see them as Echoes, but: Shadow, Bass, Galacta Knight.

...

cough*Firebrand+Vergil*cough

So I’ve been studying the Bible recently and came across this image. Aside from Angles in the Bible being terrifying. Am I the only one who gets massive Galeem vibes from this image?

Not even the first person in this thread.

I think it has to do with the fact SNK has basically none of the resources it needs in order to create a console and support it.

It might just be some kinda Neo Geo Mini.

Gotta deal with the Square and Enix part of Square Enix. AND Blue bird studio AND SHUEISHA.

Why would you need to deal with Shueisha? CT wasn't a manga...

I think if you're trying to present a baddie who'll preside over such a broad crossover, the unfamiliar, super-abstract designs we've been seeing like Tabuu or Galeem are the way to go, putting aside the fact that they look superb in their own right.

I'm sorry but...Tabuu is one of the most boring designs ever.

He's just a featureless human model. Which itself is already a cliche in fighting game bosses.

 

[Þe 1 → Way]

WOL got too grindy and boring after a while for me.
Smash 4 did have custom moves but I want complete overhauls for a lot of characters. Basically, everyone would be a newcomer. And Ultimate's online issues are far greater than just the net code. Quickplay is a terrible and addictive (for some) mode because of the limitations and GSP. Its a very toxic mode. Battle Arenas aren't much better because of the mediocre UI and lack of features.

They should have took some cues from ARMS' online (which is superb for the most part).

Well, WoL could definitely be improved, I also found it a bit to grindy. But now the team could refine and improve it to make it more stomachable, keep in mind it wasn’t the games priority and was rushed.
I definitely think some characters could be updated, but completely overhauling movests is unnecessary imo.
Online issues seem more like a problem with its design than anything to do with the roster. I do agree that ARMS hit the nail on the head in terms of online.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I've been doing some thinking as to why Sephiroth's inclusion in Smash is not too surprising in retrospect (much like every other character) and why I thought Sephiroth actually had a chance of happening, and here was my train of thought that made me think that way.

Exhibit 1: Erdrick. Many of us surmise that Sakurai originally intended Erdrick to be Hero's default costume instead of Luminary. Mainly, this is because:
1. Erdrick was the one being rumored constantly prior to Hero's reveal
2. Hero's spot in All Star Smash is Erdrick's debut date in 1988, not Luminary's debut date in 2017.
Exhibit 2: Luminary as a promotional pick. With everything pointing to Sakurai wanting Erdrick to be the default costume for Hero, it is likely that Luminary became the default costume instead because Square Enix wanted to promote Dragon Quest 11S on Switch. This is further corroborated by an unusual amount of promotion of the game by Nintendo in directs and in the Sakurai Presents showcase.
Exhibit 3: Square Enix characters are promotional picks? The idea of Hero seemed to be asked for directly by Sakurai and Nintendo, but the decision to make Luminary the default outfit may have been influenced by Square wanting to promote a game.
Exhibit 4: Final Fantasy 7 Remake came out this year. It could have been possible that the idea of Sephiroth being in Smash Ultimate was asked for directly by Sakurai and Nintendo, and Square gave the OK because it allowed them to further promote Final Fantasy 7 Remake.

I've had this train of thought a couple of times before Sephiroth's reveal, but always ignored it because I thought it wouldn't happen. Lo and behold, it did.

To note, Hero actually used Luminary's debut for the character's All-Star spot at first. Later on it got updated, which being it's not so much Erdrick as the Hero Class itself, it made sense to based it upon that debut. And since Erdrick is the earliest Hero, it's the logical one to choose. It's not a good point in its favor, since there's more than one reason. It's not impossible that's part of why, but I wouldn't put much stock into it. Since Hero is intended to be a Class-character, not a specific Hero in general(thoguh obviously Luminary and Erdrick get the most focus in different ways).

The rest makes sense, though. We definitely see a little evidence with Sakurai now promoting Erdrick as much as possible he likely wanted him as the default. Though to be fair, a lot of people mistake some stuff as related; for instance, it's common people think the Boxing Ring Titles are special. They're not. Every single one of them are accurate titles to the specific Hero. Erdrick always had a very notable title on its own, so it looks more important than intended. The other is the Kirby Hat. It's easily mistaken to be based upon Edrick, but it all comes from Erdrwin, who is directly meant to reference Erdrick, wearing a very similar coronet, and have a similar enough sword and shield(both of which Luminary carries too. He just doesn't have Erdrwin's coronet on). The one notable thing is Kirby's Coronet is not blue like Erdrwin's, but it's a greenish blue, which looks like a cross between Erdrick's and Erdwin's. It's possible Sakurai was able to sneak the color change in to show Erdrick slightly more love, but it's still overall the same shape as the one from XI only.

Sephiroth is an interesting case. There's rumors out there make it sound like Sora couldn't get in, so Sephiroth was overall somebody they decided to go for instead. But I do think part of why SE said yes was how easy Sephiroth is to promote. Him being a notable icon along with Sakurai, who is a high-profile developer asking, would obviously have helped too. Speaking of Hero, my guess is that SE easily wanted to promote DQ in the West moreso, so having multiple Heroes allowed them to promote more games, which also means they can negotiate with Nintendo to also get more game releases easier. So it's a win-win for all. There's also the fact we got Eight and Solo alts, which is even more notable because SE suggested that.

 

[Momotsuki]

World of Light's one big issue is being such a slog every playthrough after the first. Going in blind for the first time, it's an absolute blast. After that, unless you decided to spice it up with your own rules, i.e. a Nuzlocke, you're just gonna groan. A proper boss rush is desperately needed, also maybe an unlockable Mob Smash mode, Master Smash.

 

[Aerospherology]

They were referring to H.P. Lovecraft.

Let's just say that there are some...interesting tidbits about the existence of black people in his works.

And his cat.

I have a feeling that Smash 6 is gonna leave its FE characters looking like a Shakespear story.

Pray thee, thine eyes keep watch.

 

[Þe 1 → Way]

And his cat.


Pray thee, thine eyes keep watch.

We don’t talk about the cat...We just don’t...

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

World of Light's one big issue is being such a slog every playthrough after the first. Going in blind for the first time, it's an absolute blast. After that, unless you decided to spice it up with your own rules, i.e. a Nuzlocke, you're just gonna groan. A proper boss rush is desperately needed, also maybe an unlockable Mob Smash mode, Master Smash.

Not even going into a second playthrough, there was at least one overly convoluted section, where you got the brunt of the Zelda characters. Like, jeez. I was able to find every secret in Zelda 1 easier, cause it felt less trial-and-errory. And the sad part is? I wish I was exaggerating. That got just plain confusing at times.

WoL is cool, though~